Mind reading dear one, H may have nothing in his head but cotton wool, on the other hand he may be a secret Russian agent. Even if you asked the answer could be different tomorrow. H may hold no cards, he may prefer tennis!
Let H be H, struggle to be H. No labels, as otherwise your thinking will set in stone that which is lava and flowing. Sitches change, H changes, Msd changes. Deal with today Msd, not yesterday or tomorrow. The volcano erupted and now there is the beautiful flowing glowing lava, go near and it will destroy you. Let the lava flow and make its own beautiful forms, lave makes rich fertile soil for growth. It will cool and be warming and will go down hill to the sea.
Msd all you need to know is what Msd wants.
Creepy choir guy can be a practise, I would like to bet this is a repeatable creepiness.
GAL, please Msd I enjoy hearing about your GAL. So more.......
V
Thank you V. You are SO RIGHT. I am always trying to mind-read and it always puts me back in a really bad place. I read H's horoscope every day and my opinion of him changes based on what that random blurb of info tells me he should be going through today. I am deleting the APP right NOW!! Giving it up for lent at least.
I had a fun weekend away. The place we went is a place H and I used to take the kids when they were little. When we used to go the place was pretty new and no one really knew about it. It was always a spur of the moment decision and we have a lot of good memories. It has been at least 5 years since we have been back (I think closer to 7 but I can't really remember). During those 5-7 years we have been planning on going back. Had a gift certificate even. But the place had gotten popular and more expensive and it was impossible to get a room without a reservation--and since we had messed up our credit so bad we didn't have a way to reserve a room. So this time I went back because my sister has a contact who sets up a group rate trip once a year. H never wanted to do it, but this year I figured WTH and my parents were also wanted to go. I am glad I did.
It was fun, but I have to admit it brought back so many good memories, and while I sat in the hot tub alone while my kids--who are now old enough to be on their own in a place like this--did their thing I have to admit I got a little emotional.
I think H might have been feeling the same way because he has been asking the kids a lot more questions than he normally does and has pretty much blown me off. I did invite him to come along since this trip was planned when we were still in that place where I thought we were piecing, but he couldn't--same excuse as always but I know he also didn't want to since my family was involved. (oops, mind reading)
Anyway, I was the only non-coupled adult--it is a very family oriented place and geared for kids. I had some adult time in the 21 and over hot tub, but took advantage of when my kids stopped by to ask me to go on a water slide with them and really didn't spend too much time with the other couples when they were coupled (except my parents). Still, it made me miss him.
But when I thought about it, it wouldn't have been much different if he was there. He likes going off alone even when it was just the four of us. I realized that he really is who he is--I just believed he was someone else. Even when he loved me he wasn't really the "let's just sit here together and enjoy the moment" kind of person. I would have still been alone--but probably not feeling quite so lonely because I still had a connection to him even if I didn't have his presence. I think, back then I would always assume it was because the kids needed so much so we would give each other breaks by taking turns. And when we vacationed with my family my parents would usually give us a night to just go off on our own which we usually took advantage of. But then I got to thinking that even before the kids (which wasn't that much time for us) he always liked to go off on his own every morning and evening when we were away.
He likes his own space. I get that. He also hates waiting around for people or following an itinerary. I am kind of the same way, but somewhere along the line I started taking it personally. And started missing having some sort of frame work in which to plan my day. I think we are a lot a like in all of the wrong ways, and very different in a lot of the right ways. I think I also started getting used to it to the point where I just started making my own plans with or without him because I never knew if he would be around or not and hated having to wait for him to decide or to let me know what his decision was.
He really didn't change much. But I think I did a two-fold mistake of resenting him for doing his own thing without including me in his plans--but expecting me to go along when he was ready, and giving him total distance by no longer making my own attempts to spend time with him or asking him what his plans were. The truth is that I think he wanted me to be their for him, but he wanted me to know exactly when and how to do that without telling me. It is too exhausting. I don't want to be lonely anymore. And maybe I need to just not be married in order to stop feeling that way. I can deal with alone. But I want it to stop feeling so lonely.
So I think--at least for today--that I am ready to move on. I think that I can truly say that I love him, but we just aren't right for each other. I think that I am in a place--at least in this moment--where I can accept that this is over. We are attracted to each other for the same reasons that makes this an impossible situation.
So it is time to move on. I need to learn to be alone. Before meeting him I tended to jump into relationships--not on purpose. Before him I was only 3 months out of a 4 year relationship with someone I knew I never wanted to be with long term. And before that person it was a couple of months single from another person who I always knew was better as a friend but he wanted more and I gave it a shot. I think I really need to learn to be by myself, and to be friends with men. I realized I don't really know how to be friends with men, every time I try it ends up in a relationship. And when I am in a relationship I don't make any attempts to be friends with other men. This is a major flaw that I think I need to overcome. How can I expect my husband to think of me as his best friend when I have no idea how to be friends with a man.
When I think of how crazy jealous I get about this "very good friend" of his I realize it is not because I think he is attracted to her in any way, but because he knows how to be a friend to him and I guess I never really got into that zone with him. It hurts more than if they actually had sex. I'd much rather it be that superficial.
40s 2teens M14Y BD-10/12/13 rec-1/14 BD2-5/14 rec2-9/14 EA disc-10/14 4/15-BD 3 and triangulation ensues Served with D6/15 MS forced to leave7/15 D agreement signed 8/16 final 5/17
So I really just suck at this. Another blow up yesterday when he gave me the stuff I need to finish filling out the paper work. I couldn't just let things be, I had to push buttons. Honestly, I feel satisfied by it--and that just shows how little I have grown. But I actually got some information and that feels like a breath of fresh air. I found out that he had found a bunch of old journals I kept from my teens and early 20s, leading up to not long before I met him. I loved exploring my dark side back then, and for the couple of years before I met him I was really caught up in emotional turmoil. I had no direction and acted impulsively and really just went on this path where I decided to break all the rules.
It led me to make lots of mistakes that I finally said "enough". I cut ties with toxic people, and made some conscious choices to get back on track. Once I made the decision it was like everything started to magically fall into place. I finished school. I ended up getting my first real job. And I met him. And for the most part, I grew up. Our relationship was a whirlwind that moved very fast, from meeting to moving in together within three months time. Married a year from that first meeting date with a baby on the way. Last night he decided to use that information as his new weapon to prove how crazy I am and I haven't changed. Interesting how I never kept any of that stuff from him--it wasn't like I was hiding the fact that I went through a wild phase and the only real red flag that should have sent up was that YES it was very recent to the time that we met--but he knew that at the time he met me. However, if that was who I really was and not just going through a phase, then don't you think he would have realized that withing the past 15 years of living with me? Why now--15 years later--is that at all relevant? Apparently those journals (which I thought we tossed when we moved out of our first place together) had made it through 3 moves without me knowing they were still around. But SOMEONE must have. And what a well-kept secret that was. He really must have been searching for ammo. It must have been driving him crazy that I was so positive and confident while he was in so much turmoil that he had to go digging up old dirt. It is interesting because our first big fight was right after we moved in together because he found that stuff. I thought we moved passed it then--before we even got married. Apparently for him it was just a matter of waiting for the right moment to pull that dirt out again.
I am so done. I am done with him acting like a victim because he had to contribute 1/2 his salary to supporting his household--and then somehow claiming the fact that he always funded Christmas. Yeah, but does going over board on Christmas mean anything when you are going to spend the next three months worrying about keeping the heat turned on? No, I never splurged on Christmas because I was taught that bills get paid before fun stuff.
Once again the kids heard us fighting. I hate this. For most of their lives my kids never had to overhear us fighting--minor disagreements yes, but this kind of nasty fighting never ever happened around them and rarely happened at all. Now within the past 5 months they have had to hear it 3 times. I think it really is time to just say, enough. I don't like him at all. I still love him, but in a "you will always have a place in my heart" sort of way. I still love the man I thought I was married too. Now I am not so sure he was ever real.
He finally said that he will leave. Let's see if it actually happens. He wants me to give him the money for the rent since it automatically comes out of his pay. I can totally swing it--however, I know that the law doesn't work that way. So this will just light a fire under my ass to file the papers.
I will not be writing him a check for the full amount because 1) he still has to support the kids so 1/3 of that is still his responsibility. 2) his car ins and cell phone are still being paid by me because they are under my contracts so I will be deducting that from the amount I get. The kids cell phones probably should also be split between us, so maybe instead of just subtracting his portion I should split that bill 50/50--although I won't make a huge deal out of that. 3) I should probably also subtract 1/3 from the utility bill. I'll be calling my lawyer today to hammer out the logistics on how to handle this until we get the agreement written up.
I don't plan on this being a permanent situation and still plan to move in with my parents to get my debts paid off and save money. But I will wait until school is over. I'm just relieved he is finally leaving so I don't have to make all of the major changes thanks to his impulses.
40s 2teens M14Y BD-10/12/13 rec-1/14 BD2-5/14 rec2-9/14 EA disc-10/14 4/15-BD 3 and triangulation ensues Served with D6/15 MS forced to leave7/15 D agreement signed 8/16 final 5/17
Definitely time to find a family counselor to help the kids, and me navigate through this. I realize how many mixed messages those poor kids are getting. Hearing us fight last night. H announcing he will be leaving. Then this morning--life goes on as usual as if last night never happened. Pleasant to each other and parenting well. I think it is a good thing that we can be this peaceful for their sake, but I can also see how confusing this might be for them. I downloaded a book about parenting through divorce a few weeks ago but I haven't had the chance to read it. I have so much going on at work that has me overwhelmed but I need to make sure I do this parenting piece as well as I can. That has to be my top priority.
40s 2teens M14Y BD-10/12/13 rec-1/14 BD2-5/14 rec2-9/14 EA disc-10/14 4/15-BD 3 and triangulation ensues Served with D6/15 MS forced to leave7/15 D agreement signed 8/16 final 5/17
If V were Starsky and you were a new guy on the board then I would be saying that your H sounds like he is in at minimum an EA or PA with the 'friend', or she may be a POW in the wings. This may explain a few things. I say this to be kind Msd as I believe in Intel.
From my sitch you will see that I tackled this aspect of an infidelity head on with POW (a 'friend' of H) and H directly. Msd you need Intel, and under normal circumstances the 'if you snoop, you will get poop' rule applies, but in this circumstance I believe you should know. Can you check phone or email? Pink followed her H to uncover the waywardness. OD found documents. V made direct challenges to H and POWs.
Starsky, Wonka if you are about can you help a little as V may not be putting across properly, but I think this may be the case and worth checking out. H may be gaslighting Msd.
82% of affairs start with friendship Msd. Friendships between opposite sexes are difficult territory and often the other person is a trade down. The key research paper is by Shirley Glass (sadly died of cancer and her site is now a memorial to her wonderful work) and I have her research paper but can not find it on the internet.
Her book arising from it is often quoted.
If this is infidelity then you can lance this sore. The main link I can find is:
Vanilla, I hear what you are saying. He's been friends with many women before and it never bothered me because I felt secure in my relationship and in my attractiveness, and because the other women always included me. This particular woman has never made an effort to connect to me beyond having daughters who are friendly and in the same grade. I knew they were friendly and worked closely together, but I wouldn't have considered them friends because they never got together outside of work unless it was a work sanctioned event.
Usually with my kids' friends' mother's who were also H's coworkers we would get together and have a connection separate from H or kids. This one never made much of an attempt which is why it surprised me that she considered herself his "very good friend for a very long time" (her words). It probably is an EA and if it is a PA than I find it hilarious and surprised he could even get the deed done with someone who looks like that (catty--I know--but true).
It is made so much worse by the fact that she is s13's teacher and D11's friends mother. That I just got a text from D11 telling me that this woman's daughter asked if she was free friday. That yesterday H had OW tell my daughter where to meet him because D11 and friend were haning out in OW's classroom. I can't detach as hard as I try. And if nothing is going on--which maybe there isn't--then I know that he is still trying to use that because he knows that is the one area where I crumble into an emotional wreck and stop taking the higher road.
I don't think finding out will help me much at this point. Because if nothing is going on I don't think I will believe it until his entire attitude me changes anyway. And if something is going on it is still going to make me want to be an Evil By-otch to both of them. And I have to think about my kids. I have to stop obsessing over it. I just don't know how to right now.
I want her gone from my life. But H made it clear that I can't dictate who he is friends with (which is true) and the reality is I know it is wrong for me to try to draw a wedge between my D's friendship. And she is still teaching my son and will have my d next year if they continue to go to this school. I can't let my own jealousy determine their schooling. He put me in a really bad position and he knows it. i think that is why (if nothing is going on) he wants to keep playing that card because it gives him leverage. I gave that to him. The only way to get it back is to stop caring and move past it.
I just don't know how to do that right now.
Last edited by mustardseed; 03/10/1508:50 PM.
40s 2teens M14Y BD-10/12/13 rec-1/14 BD2-5/14 rec2-9/14 EA disc-10/14 4/15-BD 3 and triangulation ensues Served with D6/15 MS forced to leave7/15 D agreement signed 8/16 final 5/17
I have to just stop trying to have conversations with him. Every time I think I am being rational and stating a boundary it ends up disintegrating to low blows and tirades (from me mostly because he is so good at just being annoyingly silent). This time I just had to tell him that I don't like D hanging out in OW's classroom after school. I probably shouldn't have even brought it up. I should probably just let it go and allow things to happen whether I like it or not. I didn't like his reaction and I took the bait.
I want to leave. But I want to take the kids with me. I don't want to live here anymore, but I don't want to leave the kids behind. I couldn't get in touch with the lawyer yesterday, hopefully today I will be able to. I have to get this done as fast as possible because the longer we are living in the same house the harder it is to not react based on my emotions.
ETA and after this conversation I am starting to think that OW isn't really an OW, but a tool he is using to make me feel insecure. I think his fear is that I will confront her again because it will make work more uncomfortable for him. He should have thought about that before he started using her to hurt me.
Last edited by mustardseed; 03/11/1510:45 AM.
40s 2teens M14Y BD-10/12/13 rec-1/14 BD2-5/14 rec2-9/14 EA disc-10/14 4/15-BD 3 and triangulation ensues Served with D6/15 MS forced to leave7/15 D agreement signed 8/16 final 5/17
Work has been crazy stressful. I am so distracted and I don't know which way is up. I have wanted this job for so long and now that I have it I am regretting it. The parts of my job that I am very good at is not enough, and the other pieces are just too much for me to handle. There aren't enough hours in the day, and when I was devoting all of my time to getting it in order, my kids were suffering. When I started focusing more on my family the job suffered.
I was given the heads up that when my contract is up I will probably be let go. It gives me a few months to try and turn things around, but frankly I don't know if I have it in me. Part of me was relieved to hear that, the other part is devastated and completely panicked. Now what? I devoted so much time and money into this career path and now that I finally made it I am feeling like it is the completely wrong fit. Or maybe just the wrong time. I don't know. I am feeling old to be starting over. And right now I am starting over in every way possible.
I am so distracted by everything going on in my life that I am not handling anything well anymore. I thought I was going to have a stroke this week with all of the stress. I ended up talking to H, just to unload a bit. The first time was when I was panicking about deadlines, we both shared some of our work stress with each other and it was kind of a nice bonding moment. Maybe not quite bonding, but a little bit of an open door. But then I made the mistake yesterday of telling him that I will probably lose my job in a few months. He has been having a stressful week, too. He feels more stuck in his job then I do in mine. I think that me losing my job makes him feel like everything is falling back onto his shoulders--whether we are married or not. I plan on finding another job ASAP--probably in a different field or maybe just go back to doing what I do well even though it doesn't pay well, but at the same time, I am not going to quit. I will go down with the ship. Part of the frustrating part is that I don't know if it is just the timing of this position was wrong. In some ways it was so right--I needed the distraction and the financial support. In other ways it was so wrong--there is no way to be successful in this field your first year without devoting 100% of your time to it, but my family also needed that time. I also think that for a first year position it was wrought with unusual circumstances--there was little planning in how it was all going to work out. I was hired because they thought I could get things off the ground with little direction, and apparently I did not take as much initiative as was expected. There were so many pieces that I was not prepared to handle, and it made other things that should have been no-brainers fall to the wayside.
I am dreading the next few months. I hate that everything in my life is falling apart. I hate that right now I feel like there is nothing I can count on. I know there are lessons to be learned in all of this. I just don't know what they are right now. And I don't know where to put what little energy I have left at the moment. Do I throw everything into trying to save this sinking ship of a job, of a marriage, of a family? How do I know where my focus needs to be? I still don't know what to do about my living situation. I don't know if I should go forward with the D or if I should continue to wait for H to do it. I don't know if I should move out or wait until I have to. I haven't been able to eat and I am tired all of the time.
I was always a pretty optimistic person and lately I feel like I am just so defeated all of the time.
Last edited by mustardseed; 03/28/1512:29 PM.
40s 2teens M14Y BD-10/12/13 rec-1/14 BD2-5/14 rec2-9/14 EA disc-10/14 4/15-BD 3 and triangulation ensues Served with D6/15 MS forced to leave7/15 D agreement signed 8/16 final 5/17
My anxiety right now is beyond anything I have ever experienced in my life. Part of me is saying I should just quit my job. I am on vacation right now but I have a lot of work to do and feel absolutely paralyzed about getting it done. Every time I sit down to start my heart starts racing. Knowing that I am failing, and knowing that I don't have what it takes to make it work the way it needs to work makes me just want to throw up my hands and give up.
How do I get myself to muddle through? At first I keep telling myself, just do what you know how to do. Accept that it isn't what they want, but at least it will get your through the first few weeks back. Talking myself down of the cliff this way helps me to to get started, but as soon as I get started the anxieties start creeping back and I end up procrastinating. Finding other things to do, like cleaning the fridge or taking my dog for a walk. H has been in and out and I feel so judged by him.
I'm just full of shame and panic. And even the easy things are getting to be really hard for me. I can't tell if part of this is because I am not at work, so the problems feel bigger than they would if I was at least busy and in the throws of it rather than planning for it. Planning has never been a strong suit of mine. Part of why I am struggling so hard in this position. Planning is a huge piece. And in this particular position it is even bigger than in a typical situation. I know now I was really the wrong person for this job, and not only that it was probably the worse time.
I keep saying, I should just quit. That will ease my stress immediately. However, there are a ton of reasons why I need to stick it out. Financial reasons being only one of them. The other being that even if I am not doing a good job, they will be in an even bigger lurch if I leave now. I can't do that to them. They were good to me. I really wish they would just let me go, but I don't think they can because I am contracted until June. If I can stick it out until June I will be able to save enough to feel ok for a few months. I will be able to collect unemployment when it is done. And I will know that I have insurance at least until then.
Every logical solution requires me to stay, but this illogical and paralyzing feeling of anxiety is telling me to just end it now, and deal with the problems it causes when they come.
What can I do to help me survive these feelings? They are so new to me. I feel on the verge of a stroke or a heart attack. It is odd because I remember H feeling this way in the past. I never quite got it. I have a new sense of respect and understanding for him right now.
Last edited by mustardseed; 03/31/1505:21 PM.
40s 2teens M14Y BD-10/12/13 rec-1/14 BD2-5/14 rec2-9/14 EA disc-10/14 4/15-BD 3 and triangulation ensues Served with D6/15 MS forced to leave7/15 D agreement signed 8/16 final 5/17
Sorry to hear you are experiencing waves of panic and anxiet - not fun but NORMAL.
You need to find a way to express your panic - jumping jacks, running, walking around the block, etc... This offsets the anxiety. Also working out really helps. I have recently joined a gym and work out way more than ever, it does tire me out and leave me less suspectible to anxiety.
I also see a physician to help me manage, my anxiety was such that I was almost paralyzed. I have a prescription which is amazing and got me through the worst of it. It flares up from time to time but I can manage it better now and function.
Do not quit your job. Anxiety feeds on inactivity. Focus really hard on your job, can you do that? Be really productive and that will help. Plus you need the financial stability in your life right now. This is an area of your life that is not in turmoil. Try to focus on that.
