Alpha - the future is now!

[alpha99]

Sage advice toots.

I suppose I am changing. Not so long ago I would not have withstood such a tongue lashing from her without resorting to being verbally nasty back at her. I didn't do that this time and now I think about that, that's a massive 180 on my part.

I understand wiping out gains through last minute backsliding. In the face of intense anger and bitterness from W I am getting better - but until I cut out the tears and reasoning with her then it's not good enough. Next encounter should be tomorrow morning and should be brief. No chance of R talk, and no desire from me to do so anyway.

[twinmom]

Suggestion.......
Every time your wife says something that tempts you to cry/defend/rationalize with her jump up and go to the bathroom.
Wash your hands for a full minute squeezing the soap between your hands to release tension.

Then go back to her, apologize for having a bladder the size of a pea and go on with whatever you were doing with a renewed sense of calm.

[alpha99]

Good tip twinmom.

I think now I'm at a point where realisation has set in. It really has to be LRT fully implemented through through short, upbeat exchanges. As soon as a kids timetable gets sorted (hopefully the next day or so) I can work on this. Any extended time with her now is toxic. She is no longer the women I married. I think time and distance for a while are the best things.

[alpha99]

A quick question to those following my sitch here:

In all your time and experience here on these boards have you ever known a H and W reconcile (or get to piecing at least) after being in such a position as I am now?

Please answer honestly (I know you all would). I guess I'm just looking for a breadcrumb of hope. As I wrote earlier, the penny has dropped and things seem grim right now. I have strength to carry on but knowing others (not just further on towards divorce, having filed etc, but rather facing the toxicity of my W right now, her anger, mistrust, and bitterness) had overcome such a sitch would provide a ray of sunshine.

[alpha99]

Just to add: W mentioned at one point yesterday how her and OM are 'best friends'. She said A wasn't planned, friendship turned PA. He showed interest when she felt low due to our R. After her recent proclamations they don't speak and he's a user, this would seem to be closer to the truth.

I texted to confirm child plans for today a few minutes ago. W called back. We agreed to get on and be friendlier to each other. I am having the kids all day today and overnight. She mentioned how a separated friend at school went to court and the father got 4 hours visitation every other Saturday. Deep down she can still understand I am and have always been a great father to our children. She tried to bring up trust issues but I squashed them and said that's in the past, let's focus on getting on from now on. She still dragged out the BS but ultimately agreed.

One other thing she mentioned was taking the kids on holiday. She says she hasn't got much money now (there's a surprise) and so needs to sell the house ASAP. I acknowledged that and said that going on a 'normal' holiday is up to her of course but if she wanted to take the kids on a once in a lifetime holiday (we've always talked about Disneyland, Florida) then I'd like to go as a family. She said things are too raw now. I agreed. But I said you ain't planning on going this year though are you? She said no, so in the future when things settle down, yes, I (she) understands why I'd want to and agrees.

It seems after every horrible day follows a slightly better one. I shall continue DBing. I've read most of 5LLs now. I think (from what I've read so far) that words of affirmation and quality time are her main two love languages. So that leaves me in a pickle right now as we haven't been getting on and we haven't been spending time with each other much hahaha. I guess that's something for later down the line.

[Sotto]

Hi Alpha, yes people reconcile from worse places than you are now - but normally before people get there, things can get pretty dire seeming.

MWD helpfully sets out the things to definitely avoid - R talks, crying, begging, pleading - which all can lead to D.

So, the wrong things to do are pretty clear. The right things are harder to gauge.

Have you read about the Stockdale Paradox? Mozza posted about that and it has helped me. The concept is to have faith that things will ultimately work out well, and engage in the brutal reality of now. And that's the paradox.

[DaddyLongShanks]

Just to add: W mentioned at one point yesterday how her and OM are 'best friends'. She said A wasn't planned, friendship turned PA. He showed interest when she felt low due to our R. After her recent proclamations they don't speak and he's a user, this would seem to be closer to the truth.

I texted to confirm child plans for today a few minutes ago. W called back. We agreed to get on and be friendlier to each other. I am having the kids all day today and overnight. She mentioned how a separated friend at school went to court and the father got 4 hours visitation every other Saturday. Deep down she can still understand I am and have always been a great father to our children. She tried to bring up trust issues but I squashed them and said that's in the past, let's focus on getting on from now on. She still dragged out the BS but ultimately agreed.

One other thing she mentioned was taking the kids on holiday. She says she hasn't got much money now (there's a surprise) and so needs to sell the house ASAP. I acknowledged that and said that going on a 'normal' holiday is up to her of course but if she wanted to take the kids on a once in a lifetime holiday (we've always talked about Disneyland, Florida) then I'd like to go as a family. She said things are too raw now. I agreed. But I said you ain't planning on going this year though are you? She said no, so in the future when things settle down, yes, I (she) understands why I'd want to and agrees.

It seems after every horrible day follows a slightly better one. I shall continue DBing and 'connecting through yes'. I've read most of 5LLs now. I think (from what I've read so far) that words of affirmation and quality time are her main two love languages. So that leaves me in a pickle right now as we haven't been getting on and we haven't been spending time with each other much hahaha. I guess that's something for later down the line.

You are not a family. Your former wife is "best friends" with another male. What room does that leave you? She sleeps with him. Betrays you with him, priorities him over you.

[T384]

Alpha -


Please Excuse me if this has already been brought up but why are you talking about OM with your W??

My H never talked about OW. It was as if she didn'texist. However when he showed up to our boys basketball practice driving a car that wasn't his (I knew it was hers). I said who's car is that... He started mumbling that it was a car that belonged to a guy at the shop. I cut him off raised my hand in the air and said - H we both know that's not true. Don't insult my intelligence I made the boys get in the car and told them to say bye to their dad and we left.

That never happened again...

I think you're engaging her too much.. She knows she has you on the hook. Where's the Alpha that's independent? Confident? Won't take his W talking to him about another man she's sleeping with??

And yes - I personally had an H that was terrible during S. And here we are. So it is possible but you need to work on yourself before you can have a healthy R.

Youve got to look at yourself and ask yourself what you really want?

[alpha99]

Toots) Thanks for giving me a new perspective. Sometimes seeing things written down concisely helps them sink in. I have researched the Stockdale paradox after your post. I see it in my case as having faith things will ultimately work out even if that means in the meantime that W continues with OM, we sell our house, and things continue to look grim. Instead of sitting around waiting for something to happen I am working on myself - clothes, gym, unfavourable personality traits, GAL - and having no expectations.

T0324). Thanks for the insight. I have tried to gleam info from your thread since things appear to have worked out for you. My W hasn't ever spoken in the sense of 'OM and I went to the cinema last night' or 'we are doing X tonight.' She speaks in the past tense regarding the affair but as I noted in a recent post she did use the present tense to describe 'their friendship.'

However I believe you're right, I am engaging in conversation too much with her, particularly regarding OM...

What a difference a day makes! I had the children yesterday and overnight and now I feel a million times better. If I get them a few times a week it is going to change my mood and viewpoint completely. In one day with them I realised something: I don't need my wife but I do NEED my children.

They had a FANTASTIC day with me. We went to the cinema, the park, played games at the house, and then went out for tea, and then played more games. I gave them my FULL attention. My wife appears to be spoiling them with treats and presents at the moment whereas I spoil them with attention.

I believe I am now truly in a position to detach. That may seem a quick turnaround from recent days of crying and doing the wrong things, but those negative things won't happen again. The reason? My children.

For the best part of 2 months I haven't spent a full day or night with them. Now that I have I see that they are more.important than anything. I would like to work things out with my wife but now the feeling of having my family stolen from me is fading as I spend time with the kids, my desperation, and therefore the habit of getting things wrong, the inability to control emotions, is also going to fade. I am in a much better place to pull back, get on with my life, and see what happens. I've read so many times that this is THE ONLY thing you can do at this point.

Again and again I've read I can't control my W, only myself. Although intellectually I've understood that, now I GET IT at a gut level. I have a tinge of sadness still that our family is split now but it's no longer the all conquering thought in my mind. Rather I know I am a great dad, a good person (who plans on becoming a great person), and I will make someone happy in the future. I do hope that's my wife but if not, since I can't make her love me, then I know now I could live with that.

oh, as I've been writing this from my mobile my W has texted saying 'thanks for dropping the kids off on time. Hope they had a good time'

Should I reply saying 'they did' or something similarly short, or just ignore it. My heart says reply but my head is saying just leave it. At this point I'm going to leave it. What do you think?

[Sotto]

I would say leave it...

Good for you with the perspective. BTW - your W still sounds pretty enmeshed with OM. I would treat it as very much an ongoing R on her part if she's talking about 'friendship' in the present sense...

Glad you had a great day with your kids!