I"ve been reading other's posts for several weeks. Have read good advice and have been impressed by the support given to each other. Here's my story: about the end of 2012, H's company had financial setbacks and there was threat of layoffs. He was in a managerial position and had been there for almost 5 years. His boss told him that she couldn't guarantee his position in the future. He had worked very hard at this job and was expecting a promotion that didn't happen. He looked hard for another position. In the past, he had no trouble landing another job but at age 47 and changing economic conditions, it took longer than he expected. Finally, after 3+ months, multiple interviews, anxiety on both our parts, he was offered a good position at a large company. It was in a new industry but was not the managerial position he originally wanted. A younger man in his 30's got that position and he got the non-managerial position. He promptly resigned from the old job feeling great that his boss didn't have to lay him off. Within a few weeks, he knew this new job was problematic. They had a retreat and people didn't get along. By August 2013, he told me his apprehensions but I thought that since it had only been 4 months working there, he should give it more time. In the ensuing two months, it was clear to me that he hated this job. He talked about going to a short 2 months educational program in another state, also talked about starting a business. At first I was not very supportive of this but by October 2013, it was clear that he was miserable. He would be on the verge of tears when talking about going back to work after a weekend. I had never seen him like this before so I agreed he should try. Well, he stayed at the job. In November 2013, when his father visited, he described his job in exceptional terms, that it was a great opportunity to do terrific work...a complete 180 from what he had been telling me. I didn't ask him about this, just figured that things had improved. Later that month, I noticed that he acted differently towards me. He seemed more detached, did not keep eye contact with me when we talked. If one of the kids was around, he would turn his attention to the child. He was not as affectionate as he was before. I started to wonder...perhaps there may be someone else. This would be so uncharacteristic for him. Around Xmas 2013, I found a pretty card from a female coworker thanking him for joining the group and for being an 'amazing thought partner'. I reluctantly looked at his phone and saw text messages between them where it appeared that she had talked to him about her divorce and how difficult it was for her and how her faith/religion helped her. She had bought a religious book for him which I found at home. My H is not religious, yet he bought a bible and I found that book. I asked him about it and he did not tell me about her or where he got the book from. He writes in a journal which I don't look at; but, I finally had to look. This was Jan, 2014, what I saw just floored me. There was no doubt he had a crush on her. I confronted him and he said that the 'love' was only a religious type of love; as in love thy neighbor (it clearly was not). He said that they were just friends, that he thought if he made a connection and tried to help her at work, that it would help him do his job better. He said that he thought I wouldn't care because I didn't love him. I made it clear that I did and that I wanted to continue the marriage and he said he wanted the same. In the first few months of 2014, I told him that he had to be an open book, make all texts/emails/journal available to me because I needed to know that things have stopped between them, that he needed to keep everything professional. By the way, there is nothing physical, she does not know he has these feelings for her, it is all one sided in his head. We had frequent talks, tried to go out just the two of us etc. Over that time, he has told me that he has given everything to me, that he has no more to give, that he gave me the best years of his life, that he felt trapped in this life, that he hated his life, that the last 15 years (our married life) had been a waste and that he has nothing to look forward to in the future. He said that he will no longer compromise his career/job for his family. He feels that he has not reached his goals, the most important of which is achievement. When I start to pull away, he becomes more affectionate, at one point telling me that his children and wife were the best things that ever happened in his life. Once I calm down, he is detached again. By summer 2014, he was still infatuated with coworker, very much so as I saw in the journal entries. Coworker still does not know. He would keep texts with her for a few days, then erase them ultimately telling me he did so because he didn't want me to be angry at him. By fall 2014, I told him that with all of this, I find that I can't trust him. He asked me to give him time, please be his friend. We just continued as is. As much as he hates this job and warns me about leaving the job, he has not done so. In November 2014, the office moved to another location 1.5 hours away. He sat down and told me that he thought he would get an apartment there for the week, then come home on the weekend. Then said that maybe we should buy a second home there. At first I went along with this due to the commute but then I realized that this was absurd. Why would one buy a property close to a job one hates and has been trying to leave for over a year? I knew he still had the crush on coworker but I was pretty certain that she still did not know...just a fantasy. At this point, I told him that we should consider separating because I couldn't trust what he says to me and because one expects to be loved exclusively in a marriage. I gave him the cold shoulder for a couple of weeks. I suggested that he get coworker on the phone and I talk to her to throw cold water on this once and for all. He said he couldn't tolerate this humiliation (and I don't have the heart to do this to him). He did not want a divorce/separation. I was pretty sure he was going thru MLC and read as much as I could. What I learned made me so sad for him and so I took a look at the situation from a different perspective. MLC is a serious issue especially for men. H had told me once that he was in such pain and that when you're in pain, you do stupid things. He has said that he gets nothing out of being in his home and every interaction with his family brings him pain. He said that we have a perspective of him that is not who he wants to be. He said he felt the same way when he was living at home with his parents (when he was young) and that he felt better when he left home and lived on his own. Finally, I said perhaps that is what he needs. Sometimes you do need to take time for yourself alone, "in the wilderness", away. He hasn't moved out but stays at a hotel about a couple of nights a week near his work. As for now, there is no talk or intention of divorce/separation. I'm trying to take the long view and believe that this is a phase that will pass with time...how much time is the big question. When one considers a marriage of 40-50 years, 1, 2 or maybe 5 years of grief over that time is a drop in the bucket. Although I'm trying to stay busy with 2 kids and work, this is very stressful, very hard. Most difficult is when I see the parents of my kids' friends who are happy and I remember a time when that was us....
Amy, I haven't been here for long ('years'). I see that you posted yesterday & understand the need for feedback & support. Eventually someone more experienced than myself will get back to you.
When I first came here - Cadet posted links for newbies. Also GAL and reading the DB books help.
I think you need to do some 'kid - free' things for yourself as well, to not always be reminded of those parents who are not faced with an ordeal like this. Continue here - in that, I mean post on the forums to vent/journal. You may need to start in 'newcomers'. That was the mistake I made when I first came on.
I am sorry I coudln't be of more help - but keep coming back. The others will soon respond.
p.
pbetra ---- M: 15 yrs (in 2014) BD: 6/03/2014 Infidelity ('known' from July 2014) Denied PA Feb 2015 2 leave Mar 2015 (left early Summer). Some contact. Back briefly 2017 (after family death) Separated 2017
You will not find a more compassionate group of people anywhere. Cadet should stop by with your homework soon.
Keep posting if you are still on moderation as will will take some time till you are off and post show up immediately. Get out, Get a Life, and don't push on him.
Twisting on Life's Rope Me53 W53 M20 D21 D19 D16 BD 2-2013 D final 1-2015 _________________________ "Dream about tomorrow, Live for today, Learn from yesterday"
The first thing you should do is be sure to read the Divorce Remedy book by MWD, Divorce Busting is also an excellent book.
Sorry you are here but you will meet some wonderful people here and get some great advice.
You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts (for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support)
I have read a good deal of books on the subject and can give you some suggestions when you are ready.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
I will give you a bunch of homework assignments to read. However due to the board PURGE this POST is under reconstruction and we will be working on this as time goes by, this is the most current version, sorry for the confusion.
Now you have all the tools to read. Let us know how your doing and if you have any questions.
I suggest that you read the entire thread in the resources. You can also pick out some people and read their whole story.
Depression is the key to the whole thing and it is always present!
Believe none of what he says and 50% of what he does.
I would not ask him anything unless you can have no expectations. Sometimes asking them questions will be thought of as pressure. You do not want to do anything that can be thought of by your H as controlling or pressure.
Lets not worry about her. Lets work on you! Start your homework assignments. Something to DO while you are on moderation. GAL. Eat, sleep and take a deep breath. In general take care of your self first. Detach the single most important thing to DO.
Your H has given you a gift THE GIFT OF TIME use it wisely
So sorry you are here in this situation but just knowing We are not the only ones dealing with MLC is a comfort. I wish I had some insight but almost 8 months in and I am just as bewildered.
Please try to focus on yourself and your kids. It sounds odd but it is the best advice. Hang in there.
M:25 years at BD w/ 2 daughters BD: 5/14 Separated 6/14 - H moved cross country w/OW D Final 9/17
“I can be changed by what happens to me. But I refuse to be reduced by it.” ― Maya Angelou
The piece on 'why they run' was very informative and it helped me understand the motivations behind the desire to run/leave. When he raised the idea of living away from us, I could not help but feel rejected. Could not understand why he would want to be away from those people who loved him the most in his life. Sure, we've had those R talks that didn't go well, but all in all, we are family.
I don't know much about what it was like for him growing up but he was rather shy unlike his older brother. I get the sense that he feels he always fell short of his brother's achievements. H had said that the most important thing to him is achievement and I wonder if he blames us for having held him back. What does everyone think?
When explaining why he wanted to leave, he told me that we had a perception of who he is that's not who he really is....much like when he was living at home with his parents. His solution then, was to move out and live on his own like what he wants to do now.
I suppose that being with us is a reminder of what he has not been able to accomplish in his career and he feels a like a failure. Thus the fantasies about life with another woman.
The hardest part about all this is not knowing what the ultimate outcome is going to be. I keep thinking that this is a phase and that given enough time, he would just 'wake up' and realize that it is not the external things that give you happiness. I wish I can make him see that. Any thoughts would be appreciated.
Amy, You need to understand that his crisis is not about YOU, but about HIM. It wouldn't have mattered if you were a beautiful model, have maids and butlers, etc., he would still run. His crisis is about his being stunted emotionally as a child/teenager and he needs to go back to that time and figure things out, face his issues, accept those things that he can't change and grow up.
If he had married someone else and/or remained single, the crisis would still have happened.
As for his comment about your perception of who he is and that it's not really him...he's telling you that he truly doesn't know who he is at the moment. He needs to find himself and he will do that, but it's going to take time. During the crisis, they will try on different "masks" and/or personalities to see which one fits the best. They are going to do things that are the exact opposite of the person you once knew, i.e., hence the mirror image comes into play. You will need to learn to accept him for who he is today because the man you knew is now in the mirror and will not return for a long time.
Bottom line, you didn't break him, therefore you can't fix him. Wish him well and pray for him. You can be there as a friend, but you can't and won't get him to listen to what you have to say. Why? Because he has to learn these things on his own in order to grow up. He needs to experience life, make his mistakes and learn from them. Just remember, the more you attempt to "reason" with him or try to "make" him see things, the more he's going to pull away and use those talks as a excuse as to why he left. Don't given him the justifications. N
o more relationship talks. When he contacts you, be friendly and upbeat and keep your discussions light. Only contact him in the case of emergencies.
The only thing you can do is make sure that your finances are in order, i.e., separate checking accounts, continue to monitor all expenditures, i.e., credit cards, etc. Listen to what he has to say and do not offer up advice and/or your opinions...unless he asks for them.
His journey has begun and now your journey has to. It's time to turn the focus on to you, what can you do to keep yourself busy? Do you have any hobbies or projects that you've not done in a while? Then make a list of what you would like to accomplish while his is on the Mother Ship. If there are things that you would like to improve on, then do them...but don't do them w/the idea of winning him back. Whatever changes you make, they must become permanent and not just as a tool to woo him. He will sense whether they are real or just a con.
MLC takes a very long time. The more you leave him alone, i.e., give him space, the more he will focus on himself and what he needs to do to get through the crisis. Dig deep for patience because you are going to need it. There is no way to predict the outcome of your marriage right now. Just remember, you do have control over your life and how you live it.
Take care.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
Thank you so much for your insight and wisdom. Thank you for taking the time to answer my post. Even though I don't know you, I can sense your deep kindness and sincerity in your words and I am comforted by them.
When this all began, I was angry at his behavior and what it was doing to me. I was angry that he didn't show concern for my feelings and my welfare and that he would jeopardize the children's security by damaging the marriage. After a year of repeated talks that went nowhere, I understand now that he is suffering such intense inner pain that he is in no shape to take care of me emotionally. I'm on my own.
I hope that you will write more about your insights regarding men going through MLC based on the interactions you've had with them. Knowledge is power. Knowing what to expect as time goes on gives me a sense of control over a situation that I really have no control over.
Hardest part of this is trying to take care of myself and the kids and keeping my spirits up day after day. Yesterday he left to stay at the hotel again and will be there the weekend. I try to tell myself that this is what he needs to do to help clear his head but the uncertainty of it all is what really gets to me.
How can I think about this in a positive way? Some days I'm optimistic and upbeat but other days I just have this feeling of dread and desperation that just permeate through my head. I don't feel like doing anything when I feel that way.
My H had always been very affectionate and loving. I had never doubted his devotion to me. I think that is one of the reasons why his detachment and distance has been so hard for me. I'm grieving over this loss; but unlike death, I can't put it behind me and move on. Would it help to look at my M now in a different way - like a business partnership between two people?
____________________________________ Me 48; H49 M16 D13 D15
Amy, What you are experiencing is very normal when dealing w/mlc. You will have highs and lows quite often at first and as you travel your own path, they will slowly become few and far between, but they will also be shorter in length. Each time you have a low, you will come back stronger than before. Feel the pain, allow it to wash over you and then release it.
Try to think of one positive thing to smile about each day. Keep warm thoughts of something fun that you've done in your head. Pull that memory out when you start to feel sad. It really does help to have some of those "happy" memories to reflect on.
You are grieving for the old marriage. It has died and you've had no closure. It's difficult accept that the old marriage is dead because you still look at your h and see the "old" h there. He's not the same man and won't be ever again. If he survives the crisis, he should be a more settled, mature man that accepts his responsibilities and truly wants to be your partner in every way.
You are still very new at this game, so be kind to yourself. You have to remember that this is a marathon, not a sprint and it takes a while to learn the true art of detachment. If it helps you, think of your h as a robot or the paper boy. I thought of my xh as either dead and a zombie had returned or he was visiting Mars and came back as a Pod Person. If it helps to you think of him as a business partner who has broken the terms of the contract, then by all means use that analogy to help you.
Keep focusing on you and your children. It's okay if you don't feel like doing anything when you are feeling down. It's normal. You will get to the other side a step at a time.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
Hi Amy. I am reading your posts and was there about this time last year. We truly understand and can relate to the emotions you are feeling. The only thing that helped me was to detach and Let go. I had to let go of my Husband and my marriage because the grief and pain of what was happening was taking its toll on me. I got down to 93 pounds, was constantly distracted and I knew I had to be the one in control here, for my son.
This is no easy process, it takes time. You will have your good days and bad days, but I promise you, it gets better. And as you see the strength inside of you come out, you will get stronger and stronger.
The first step is accepting this for what it is. You have no control over your husband and this is not about you, as much as it feels like it is based on things he says. MLC is much deeper than marriage problems and only he can work through this. The best thing you can do is step back and let him go, so his work can begin.
Keep reading up on MLC and depression. What also helped me was looking up information and inspirational quotes on letting go. Aside from this, spend time with supportive friends, do things you enjoy and pamper yourself. This is a long bumpy road and there is no quick fix. There are amazing people on this board who have been through it and can offer great advise. So keep posting, vent here, cry here and know we are all here to support you!
Me 48 H 46 S 11 M 2004 BD 8/13 H moved out 2/15 -live in the present, enjoy the beauty around and within you, explore your new future-
Thank you, mleigh. We are going through very similar emotions. I am down to 98 lbs and the stress is taking its toll on me. I was doing OK all of last year but within the last couple of weeks, have not been sleeping or eating well and don't have the energy to go out and live life.
For me, the most difficult thing to deal with is not knowing when this will all end. I am in limbo and I am suffering because of it. What I need the most now is closure. I see one of three things happening: 1. he snaps out of it now and wakes up and reattaches to me and the family (not likely) 2. he remains in this 'fog' working on his own issues but unknown when it will end 3. we end it by calling it quits
Option 1 is out, I'm left with options 2 & 3. Regards to options 2, we've been at this for the last year + and if I saw signs of improvement or signs that he is heading in the right direction, then I think I can wait it out. But that hasn't happened. To the contrary, it's gotten worse week by week such that he is living in a hotel on the weekends and leaving his family alone at home. That leaves option 3.
I feel sad for my children. I had considered separating a couple of months ago and I talked with h about it. He said he didn't want to but in the last couple of months, I think he's warmed up to the idea. I'm afraid of separation because of my children and my fear of being alone. But I"m the only responsible parent left for my kids and I've got to stay healthy mentally and physically for them. Being in limbo is taking its toll on me...this cannot be good for the kids? Need advice....
Amy, You need to start eating, even if it's just some milk shakes. Get some high calories foods into your system so that you don't get sick. Yes, the stress of his mlc will create all kinds of issues for you. Have you considered going on a mild AD? Talk to your doctor and see what he/she will suggest. You can't continue down this particular path. Your kids need you.
Now about the 3 things you listed:
1. If he snaps out of the mlc, which is highly unlikely or you find a way to do so, I can promise you he will go back into crisis again. It may not be right away, but he will and it will be far worse the next time around and more harm will be done to you and your children because of the coming home and then leaving again.
2. He remains in his fog and works on his issues. Yes, the future is unknown. He could be this way for quite some time. You do realize that he had begun to detach from his family about 18-24 months prior to you being told how he felt? His crisis will last as long as he needs to face things. What do you do in the meantime? You go on w/your life as if he's died. You make a like for you and your children. Let me ask you this...what would you do if he had died? I know that's a harsh question...but I want you to think about it. Your old marriage has died...so what are you going to do about it? You are going to get yourself healthy, seek some medical advice and start planning your immediate future and what you need to do to protect you and your children. It's time to seek some professional advice and you need to call around and get some free consults from lawyers. This is not to say that you are filing, but you need to know how to protect yourself and get your ducks in a row as to your finances, child support and spousal support (if that's possible).
3. You and only you can decide when you've had enough...but you are very new to this mlc and one year is nothing when you look at the broader scheme of things. MLC can last years. Some will have a shorter crisis, others will have longer ones and some remain stuck forever. Do we know where your h will fall? Absolutely not.
Leave yesterday behind, it's the past and it's history, focus on today, as it is a present/gift. Use the present wisely and for the future, it's not ours to foresee. It's the unknown and many fear the unknown. You absolutely nothing to fear because you are a strong woman who's going to figure things out and get back on your feet.
You are going to be okay no matter what happens...but first...you need to get healthy.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
Two weekends ago, I couldn't take it anymore. He was staying at a hotel for the weekend by himself away from us. I had thought it would be a good thing for him to be away temporarily, to clear his head, to have some space away from the family. I figured that I'll just do my own thing with the kids and life.
I didin't anticipate how hard it would be on me not having him at home. I called him on Sunday and told him that we were all suffering without him here, that we need him. He seemed surprised that we would miss him. Said that he had thought we would be fine without him, he thought we no longer needed him.
The next day, I told him that I couldn't take this any more, that if he was going to live a a hotel, we may as well not be married any longer. Told him that I've become sick over the whole situation. At first he said that he never gets to take a vacation just for him, that all the vacations we take were for the family. I said of course, because we are a family and that if he wanted a vacation by himself before, he should have said something. He said no one cared about him. Later he said that he never wanted to leave me.
The following weekend, had another talk (I know, no R talks but this was more about him). He said that for the last 5 years, he knew that the type of work he was doing was not right for him and that he needed a new path, new direction. He didn't know what it was but that he kept at the job trying to convince himself to stay on. At one point when he was leaving the previous job, he wanted to strike out in a business on his own. I wasn't supportive of that because he made good money and had never been in business before. I was afraid. He continued on to the next job that he hated but didn't feel he could quit and face me, the kids and the rest of the family. He thought that befriending the female coworker and helping her would make the job more tolerable. He tried meditation and self help books to try to cope with this job but eventually, knew that if he continued, it was going to kill his soul.
Because he felt I was unsupportive, he thought his only option was to split finances with me and live somewhere else to find another path for himself. The alternative was to suffer a stroke or a heart attack continuing to do this job. Thus the feeling of being trapped and blaming his family.
Well, I guess I have to let go of the fear of the unknown and give him the support he needs. Either we do this together or he will go it alone. Does any of what he said make sense??
