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ho2mh #2529357 01/21/15 01:00 AM
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Good that you are in counseling and making progress. Don't stop working on it.

I understand what you mean about having to live without her would mean that you would need to stop loving her. I told you what I did b/c sometimes a newcomer feels that to stop loving their spouse is just too much to even consider. I wanted you to know you were not being asked or suggested to stop loving her.

I know this must feel unbearable, but many people have come here and learned how to cope. Your life can get much better, even if that's hard to visualize at the moment.



It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
MrBond #2529362 01/21/15 01:07 AM
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"This doesn't sound like much to be considered a problem. Be honest."

I would raise my voice but not to the point I would consider it as yelling.

"How are your interactions with your W currently? What other issues were there besides your anger and job? How was your intimacy? How did you treat her on a day to day basis?"

She will only text or email me. She sent me an email last Thursday, telling me I had some mail at the house. I replied by thanking her for letting me know about the mail.
We haven't seen or spoken to each other in 2 months.

I haven't done anything with her family for 2 years. She said this was one of the reasons why she left and not going to church in years. She has also said, "She does everything." Meaning I didn't work, and pay the bills. I did laundry, dishes, mopping, vacuuming, worked on the cars when needed.

I felt like our intimacy was lacking (I'm not referring to sex). Most women would want to be held or cuddle on the couch. She didn't seem to want this.

On a day to day basis I should have done more things to make her feel appreciated and special.

ho2mh #2529543 01/21/15 06:14 PM
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"I would raise my voice but not to the point I would consider it as yelling."

It doesn't matter how YOU consider it. It matters how SHE perceived it. Do you like it when someone raises their voice to you? If not, then why do you think your W liked it when you did it to her? What you say and the TONE in which you say it is what matters. Have you changed this?

"She will only text or email me. She sent me an email last Thursday, telling me I had some mail at the house. I replied by thanking her for letting me know about the mail. We haven't seen or spoken to each other in 2 months."

What was your last face to face like when she moved out? Were you angry at her and raised your voice then?

"I haven't done anything with her family for 2 years. She said this was one of the reasons why she left and not going to church in years."

Is this something you're willing to change? If not, then why should she want to come back?

"She has also said, "She does everything." Meaning I didn't work, and pay the bills. I did laundry, dishes, mopping, vacuuming, worked on the cars when needed."

How active were you in finding a job? Not necessarily in your field but just employment in general? Did she ever talk to you about how she wished she had more help rather than being the primary breadwinner?

"I felt like our intimacy was lacking (I'm not referring to sex). Most women would want to be held or cuddle on the couch. She didn't seem to want this."

Be honest here. Did you only hold her or cuddle her when you wanted sex? Or when you felt insecure? Women want to be held and cuddled by men in a position of strength. What else have you changed besides your anger? How do you look physically? What about your self-confidence?


M-43 W-40
2D - 9 and 5

Emotion, yet peace.
Ignorance, yet knowledge.
Passion, yet serenity.
Chaos, yet harmony.
Death, yet a new life.

RECONCILED AND WISER
MrBond #2530099 01/23/15 03:09 AM
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"It doesn't matter how YOU consider it. It matters how SHE perceived it. Do you like it when someone raises their voice to you? If not, then why do you think your W liked it when you did it to her? What you say and the TONE in which you say it is what matters. Have you changed this?"

I agree my tone was bad. I am working on changing my tone.


"What was your last face to face like when she moved out? Were you angry at her and raised your voice then?"

The last time we spoke was 2 months ago. My tone was quite somber. The conversation was very brief.

"I haven't done anything with her family for 2 years. She said this was one of the reasons why she left and not going to church in years."

Is this something you're willing to change? If not, then why should she want to come back?

Yes, but at this point she says it doesn't matter to her.

"How active were you in finding a job? Not necessarily in "your field but just employment in general? Did she ever talk to you about how she wished she had more help rather than being the primary breadwinner?"

Outside of my field I was somewhat active. Not active enough. She did talk about wanting more help financially and for me to find work somewhere. That is when my pride and anger would get in the way.

Be honest here. Did you only hold her or cuddle her when you wanted sex? Or when you felt insecure? Women want to be held and cuddled by men in a position of strength. What else have you changed besides your anger? How do you look physically? What about your self-confidence?

Sometimes I did, sometimes I didn't. I am trying be the person I was 10 - 20 years ago. Going to church regularly, being more understanding, loving and listening. Physically I'm 5 to 10 pounds overweight. Self confidence is shot.

ho2mh #2530828 01/25/15 06:18 PM
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When you asked your W to go to MC and you would change, she said no. What is the plan now?


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
sandi2 #2530843 01/25/15 07:31 PM
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I continue to go to counseling. I am changing how I look at things and how I deal with them. I am improving myself and this will benefit me regardless of how things turn out with my W. I can't control what she does or what she thinks.

ho2mh #2531757 01/28/15 05:00 AM
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Originally Posted By: ho2mh
[quote=Gerda]

Thanks for the encouraging words. Your story is inspiring
I was a different person back in the 90's and early 2000's. That's the person my W fell in love with.
I am trying to rebuild my relationship with God. I have been praying. When I do pray sometimes I think, "why would God want anything to do with me at this point?"
My W is so angry, bitter and cold hearted toward me but I also know she is hurting and in pain. I am ridden with guilt that I caused this.
Sorry to hear about your cancer. Can't imagine what that's like.
I will check out the book you recommended.


Thank you for this note, I am so happy if something I said affected you. And oh my goodness, OF COURSE God wants everything to do with you! It's the broken ones, the ones who feel worthless -- that's you and me -- that God wants the most! And then I often think that we may be going through this in order to help others have the strength to go through it.

About your wife's rage and anger -- yes, indeed, that is so many of our stories. It is so painful to live with that day after day after day. But you can do it. Let it change you. Being kind WHEN she is not is extremely liberating, much more liberating than being angry back, and somehow even more liberating that being kind just because she is kind.

Have you watched the film, "Fireproof"? That one really got me started on this, the first time I realized that one of us had to break the cycle of fury and rage, and that it might mean that I had to be kind even if he was not. And boy has that been the case -- I mean, CANCER did not soften him except for one day. He even contacted the OW while I was on the operating table, I found this out a couple days later and it still hurts me so much. Now I try to see the fact that I am standing for this marriage through that pain as what I offer to God -- to bear that pain and not do what would make me feel "better" -- get angry, kick him out, move on. Being able to offer it to God has really helped me make daily meaning out of it while I wait for better days to come. You and your wife will be in my prayers tonight! I have faith in you, not only to get through this suffering but to restore your marriage.


I believe I will see the bounty of the Lord in the land of the living.
Wait for the Lord with courage.
Be stouthearted, and wait for the Lord.
Gerda #2532412 01/29/15 10:27 PM
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I watched "Fireproof" about 3 weeks ago. Some of the things in that movie seemed uncomfortably familiar. For instance when Caleb yelled at his W. I did that and it was almost exactly the same way. I was able to see how I was acting toward my W. It brought tears to my eyes.
My W is so shutdown and has closed her spirit to me. I am afraid she will never open her spirit back up.
The D will be final next week. It is hard to accept.
I appreciate you praying for my W and me. I will do the same for you.

ho2mh #2532460 01/29/15 11:53 PM
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God bless you ho2mh.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

“The strongest of all warriors are these two — Time and Patience.” War and Peace
ho2mh #2532552 01/30/15 06:13 AM
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Originally Posted By: ho2mh
I watched "Fireproof" about 3 weeks ago. Some of the things in that movie seemed uncomfortably familiar. For instance when Caleb yelled at his W. I did that and it was almost exactly the same way. I was able to see how I was acting toward my W. It brought tears to my eyes.
My W is so shutdown and has closed her spirit to me. I am afraid she will never open her spirit back up.
The D will be final next week. It is hard to accept.
I appreciate you praying for my W and me. I will do the same for you.


Oh, thank you, please do pray for us! That's great that you saw Fireproof -- that's what started me on my journey, it revealed to me all I did wrong and also how I could give myself over to forgiveness and love even if I was rejected again and again.

A divorce is not the final word! Many many people go through that fire in order to realize that it was the wrong choice. Listen to the testimonies that just were posted here --

http://www.rejoiceministries.org/listen-online/god-heals-hurting-marriages/

And she posts A LOT of testimonies that relate to divorces that later resulted in restoration. I know that many people on this site advise folks to move on; I am one for total commitment to standing. You can work on yourself and keep your vows even if she is not ready to come back. Believe me, I am on my knees DAILY. Sometimes I have to run down to the church four times in one day when I am especially haunted or when my H is being especially bad to me. I pour my heart out and cry and cry. God always gives me what I need to stay clear on what my path is, and always shows me that he is working to soften my husband's heart.

I also have listened about nine million times to the sermon called, "Don't Give Up" which you can find here --

http://christianlifecenterftl.org/sermons/acts-restored/

There have been days when I just listened to that over and over, all day.

I know what you are suffering, I am so sorry for your pain. Just remember we are there with you, we are all suffering for a higher purpose, and our suffering is building us into something better. Your wife is suffering too, and she will until she forgives you! I know from experience that carrying anger is very painful. I actually think that my really uncontrolled anger toward my husband, that constant resentment and blame and fury, caused my tumor -- that tumor even LOOKED like anger on the sonogram.

You can be the light to her even if it takes a much longer time that you ever thought you could bear!

Last edited by Gerda; 01/30/15 06:14 AM.

I believe I will see the bounty of the Lord in the land of the living.
Wait for the Lord with courage.
Be stouthearted, and wait for the Lord.
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