I'm just utterly gutted right now :(

[25yearsmlc]

I think the hardest part is keeping hope alive while equally steeling yourself for the semi constant lies and deception. Currently I keep realising lies I've been told and believed unquestionably at the time were so obvious!

I - I keep going back and forth in my head about whether she's being honest or just using it as a way to calm me down and get me out. Could go either way but i'm trying to be more optimistic these days so we'll see what happens.



Worst case scenario, it eased me into single life without being so mentally and emotionally torturous.

Then it has value that you can hold onto, regardless of outcome.

Just know you WILL be alright without her. If you don't know that,

If you don't KNOW that you can be a happy strong man with or without this woman in your life,

then how could you really attract her back, and hold onto her anyhow?

do you get that?


Also, did you consult a lawyer before moving out? What is the risk you face by leaving? I'm asking b/c in some areas, you would lose the ability to claim the home as your place of occupation, and if there were children there could be claims of abandonment.

I hope you sought legal counsel about this...



She has promised to help me move, drive me to the airport, hang out after i move, IM/EMail etc.

Frank, must you get a ride from her to the airport? There are no cabs? As for her promising to "hang out with" you and keep in touch,

what is that all about?

Do you see any problems with this obvious need of yours? Reminds me of when my ex bil divorced my younger sister and just after the divorce was granted, my younger sister asked her ex h for "a hug"....

(I just cringed.)


If someone filed to divorce me, I don't believe I'd be very interested in their scraps OR their promises. I'd think they "said" what they really felt about the marriage by filing to end it.

So if I were served paperwork for a divorce, THAT would more or less say it all.

Sure, maybe SHE will change her mind, (I have 2 family members who divorced, and years later, remarried their former spouses).

But meanwhile, what are YOU Doing with your life? Are you actually waiting to see what happens, with her? B/C that is the feeling I get.

I'm concerned that you may be missing the big picture here.

Remember the oft repeated adage around here,

"Believe nothing they say and only half of what they DO."

Frank, She has filed for divorce. That is what you KNOW.

[Karma12]

Great advice and insights coming from 25yrs. I echo her " know no matter what the outcome you will be alright".

[Frank75]

Just one comment - DR/DB is intended for us alone. But you have already mentioned it to your W, so you are where you are.[/b] But the thing is I would leave it there. Don't push or mention that any further now - leave it well along. If your W is interested enough, she'll sort herself out with the book and read it...

I was torn about it but i was pretty sure she knew about it ahead of time since we still share an amazon account and she would have seen the orders. The last thing I wanted was to lie about anything

THIS^^ is you trying to control her and the outcome of the situation.

THIS^^ is you having expectations, regardless of what you tell yourself.

THIS^^ is not helping you. The books and the advice here about NOT recommending the books, are said for very good reasons.

You have to start believing that the author has some insight and experience in this area, and accepting that your needs and wants are not unheard of or all that unusual. We get it. Don't pooh pooh it.

In the years I've been here, I've still never advised my h to read the books.

I agree, it's a steep learning curve and i'm trying to identify my behavior that led me to this point and change.

I wish I knew about keeping the books quiet ahead of time, in my few weeks here i didn't see that mentioned anywhere

See above comments re: expectations and controlling outcome, for more of the same. "I just want her to realize"...and "people come back from it and ...." is exactly wanting HER to...blah blah blah

(so, back to YOU)

Frank, "more of the same" is NOT what you need.

I'm really glad you got some meds so that you can refrain from this type of "raised expectation/control the outcome" mindset, and learn to face this as it comes,

trusting that you are indeed strong enough and open enough to learn new things and get new tools. I recall not sleeping well, for weeks, and sort of constantly feeling on the verge of having the flu. So when I got some sleep aids and then anti anxiety meds, the whole circular nature of this (and endlessly asking "WHY??")
& poor sleep, abated.

Just those ^^ two things really helped.

Did you check out EE, or is that what you meant by getting plane tickets? I'm a little unclear.

Finally, keep on keeping on. Soon I hope, your screen name will change and evolve, as you are.

Maybe "I WAS gutted, but now I'm growing" or something new, and or a lot more hopeful...

B/C as you grow from this (and growing from this is kind of the big "silver lining" to this whole ordeal),

you will gain a peace and strength within, that you may not have known for a long time.

That's worth sharing.[/color]

These meds definitely have helped me so much already. I attribute that "good" phone call yesterday to these meds. I was a complete mess before these and now i can actually think/breathe/sleep pretty decently. The constant onslaught of panic and anxiety is gone too. I'm making flight plans on monday after I talk to my boss too. I know you said before my life was ruled by fear and it was. I haven't been home in years because i'm petrified of flying but these pills are helping with that also, i'm actually reallllly looking forward to getting home and seeing my parents/grandmother/2 new nephews i've never met and the rest of my family. I think it will really help me out.

I won't have a car while i'm there so as for EE i'm going to see what my parents/brother are up to and if i can borrow a car or a ride to the train station. I'm hoping i'll be able to swing something though.

I am trying to identify those negative behaviors and i appreciate you pointing it out. I've lived almost 40 years like this and it's a challenge to change in a few weeks but i'm trying.

Once again, thanks for the help you're awesome.

[25yearsmlc]

Just one comment - DR/DB is intended for us alone. But you have already mentioned it to your W, so you are where you are.[/b] But the thing is I would leave it there. Don't push or mention that any further now - leave it well along. If your W is interested enough, she'll sort herself out with the book and read it...

I was torn about it but i was pretty sure she knew about it ahead of time since we still share an amazon account and she would have seen the orders. The last thing I wanted was to lie about anything

THIS^^ is you trying to control her and the outcome of the situation.

THIS^^ is you having expectations, regardless of what you tell yourself.

THIS^^ is not helping you. The books and the advice here about NOT recommending the books, are said for very good reasons.

You have to start believing that the author has some insight and experience in this area, and accepting that your needs and wants are not unheard of or all that unusual. We get it. Don't pooh pooh it.

In the years I've been here, I've still never advised my h to read the books.

I agree, it's a steep learning curve and i'm trying to identify my behavior that led me to this point and change.

I wish I knew about keeping the books quiet ahead of time, in my few weeks here i didn't see that mentioned anywhere

See above comments re: expectations and controlling outcome, for more of the same. "I just want her to realize"...and "people come back from it and ...." is exactly wanting HER to...blah blah blah

(so, back to YOU)

Frank, "more of the same" is NOT what you need.

I'm really glad you got some meds so that you can refrain from this type of "raised expectation/control the outcome" mindset, and learn to face this as it comes,

trusting that you are indeed strong enough and open enough to learn new things and get new tools. I recall not sleeping well, for weeks, and sort of constantly feeling on the verge of having the flu. So when I got some sleep aids and then anti anxiety meds, the whole circular nature of this (and endlessly asking "WHY??")
& poor sleep, abated.

Just those ^^ two things really helped.

Did you check out EE, or is that what you meant by getting plane tickets? I'm a little unclear.

Finally, keep on keeping on. Soon I hope, your screen name will change and evolve, as you are.

Maybe "I WAS gutted, but now I'm growing" or something new, and or a lot more hopeful...

B/C as you grow from this (and growing from this is kind of the big "silver lining" to this whole ordeal),

you will gain a peace and strength within, that you may not have known for a long time.

That's worth sharing.[/color]

These meds definitely have helped me so much already. I attribute that "good" phone call yesterday to these meds. I was a complete mess before these and now i can actually think/breathe/sleep pretty decently. The constant onslaught of panic and anxiety is gone too. I'm making flight plans on monday after I talk to my boss too. I know you said before my life was ruled by fear and it was. I haven't been home in years because i'm petrified of flying but these pills are helping with that also, i'm actually reallllly looking forward to getting home and seeing my parents/grandmother/2 new nephews i've never met and the rest of my family. I think it will really help me out.


While you are feeling calmer, you might also benefit from getting some cognitive tools so that in time, you'll do more than merely stay calm. You'll come up with new strategies for living your life more fully. Make sense?

I won't have a car while i'm there so as for EE i'm going to see what my parents/brother are up to and if i can borrow a car or a ride to the train station. I'm hoping i'll be able to swing something though.


Well, do what you will. I mean, I'm not getting a kickback or anything and I don't mean to pressure you.

But you cannot just "swing something through" a personal growth workshop. You actually have to plan. Besides, you rarely go back there anyhow and they only offer this a few times a year.

They require you to commit and invest yourself in it -b/c it's your life-- and that makes sense b/c it's about you taking charge of your life.

Spending four days on ridding yourself of baggage and fears and developing, then implementing - a new way of living and being.

For me, it was about living a life of intention and clarity.

MAKING something happen, not hoping it might.

(Sorry Frank, I Don't mean to hassle you about this. But that statement is so...revealing. It sounds like haphazardly careening thru life. I think If you ever do manage to make it to EE, that comment of yours might make you laugh (or wince) b/c it might just be emblematic of...a lot.


I am trying to identify those negative behaviors and i appreciate you pointing it out. I've lived almost 40 years like this and it's a challenge to change in a few weeks but i'm trying.

Once again, thanks for the help you're awesome.

You're very welcome, and thanks.

Okay yes, getting new tools for living well,

does take work. It rarely (if ever) just "happens".


But please realize it's not exactly digging a ditch in a field of dung and hot tar. I mean, a lot of this "work" is about living well, living fully and being in the present. Learning from good times and learning from our mistakes.

But even then it is not all about pain. A lot of it is about feeling JOY as fully as we have felt anger or pain or grief or fear....without interference or pollutants.

((Ever notice that we can get REALLY angry about something -- and nothing else gets our attention for awhile? OTOH, we can feel happy about something, but allow other factors in that interfere or lessen our joy?))

THAT^^ has to be reversed, and there are ways to do that. For ME, Essential Experience (the 4 day workshop) was how I learned how to do that, and for ME, it was a lot faster than messing up and hoping to glean the lesson, and then figuring out a plan of attack,

but hey, whatever works is what we all need to determine.

Good luck Frank, I hope you have a great time with your family.
And while you are there, I hope you will really BE there.
.

[susana4]

Frank, I'm really glad to hear the medicine's helping so much; not just in the interactions with your wife and your overall outlook but also helping you move forward and do other things in your life, like with flying. That's great! Hope you have a great time with your family.

And hope you get a chance to attend EE. From everything I've heard it's amazing, I read up on it and wish I could attend but right now the airfare is just too much (I'm in Europe) so I'm trying to find something similar locally but haven't. So take the opportunity if you get it!