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Sotto #2519724 12/22/14 09:10 PM
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Agreed, Toots. I will say that I wasn't a miserable person pre-BD. I was thankful for lots of things in my life. Since I was a kid I wanted the M life, and most of the time during my M, I was content with it. There were just always those times, especially early in snowboard season and early in golf/lake season when I wished I was more free. I don't know if there was ever an extended period when I wanted to snowboard or play golf more than I wanted to be married to W. Early after BD, I was in my own fog and thought I remembered wanting out of the M for 3 or 4 years. I think there were three or four years when I had fleeting thoughts of wanting out, but more often than not, I was thankful to have W.

But post BD, the urge to want my M when I can't have it at the moment has been incredibly strong, stronger than anything I've ever felt. I read through my journal (which I started the 1st of Sept) for the first time today. I forgot about how many good days I really did have early in the fall. Some of that was buoyed by hope with WAW being so early in the process, and I don't want to rely on that same type of hope (living in hope, as uR puts it) again. But after reading it I know I can get back there again.

I'll make a thankful list:

- Thankful for a happy, healthy D2
- Thankful I have family in town, even though there is some dysfunction right now
- Thankful for a free place to stay until I get my finances a little more stable. I would be fine on my own in an apt right now, but I'm saving at least $1500 a month at the moment.
- Thankful for the wood-burning fireplace/stove that is in my guest suite. It has really cheered me up at night. It took me a couple nights of practice, but I had my first really good fire last night.


Me 38, WAW 30
D11 (former marriage)
S2
T 8 years
M 3 years
BD 8/20/23
S 8/20/23
Card29 #2519761 12/22/14 10:25 PM
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Hey Card...still thinking on a nickname for you. Yea, I know, Im weird that way. LOL!

You sound better. Im glad.

Funny how much we want something when we cant have it, right?

Not saying you dont love your wife and really want your marriage, just an observation.

So, I like your thankful list. Its a good thing to do often.

I would try to let your w live with her choices. She wants to feel heard. She needs to see what she wants her life to look like.

I love a good fire...:)

uRworthy #2519829 12/23/14 12:48 AM
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I'll embrace the nickname, whatever it is

I've been tempted a couple of times to text WAW today, but I've been able to resist. Felt like texting that I had a good time at the mall (I did, and she warmed up, too). Wanted to ask if she found the rest of her gifts. And now something else has come up...BIL (my SIL's H) has a gravely ill father. They all live three hours away. WAW is supposed to go there for Christmas on Christmas day, then they are trekking to Nashville to meet extended family. I think BIL's father throws a wrench into the whole thing, and Im curious of WAW's thoughts. Whenever he passes, I will definitely go to the services. Assuming WAW isn't already out of town for Christmas, I imagine we would carpool together. We'll see how that all plays out. I'm more concerned about BIL as he is very close to his dad. I lost mine two years ago and know how hard it is. I'm not going to play the "I know how you feel" card.

Now, Christmas morning...last week, the same night WAW told me she wanted D, she said she wanted me to bring D2 to her apt first thing in the morning so she could have early morning Christmas with her parents. She said D2 deserves to have it with her parents (of course...she deserves it every year. She deserves to have every morning with her parents. But I digress...and no, I didn't say that). At the time, I was reluctant. I don't think I want to do it now. I don't think I'm playing a game when I say that this is a natural consequence of S/D. And it wouldn't be fair for D2 to wake up to a room full of presents around a Christmas tree and have to get immediately packed into a car and lugged across town. I'm not sure when or how, but I'm going to tell WAW we'll be over there after we do Christmas at my mom's house.


Me 38, WAW 30
D11 (former marriage)
S2
T 8 years
M 3 years
BD 8/20/23
S 8/20/23
Card29 #2519840 12/23/14 01:38 AM
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Im glad you didnt text her, C. You had a nice time...leave her with that thought.

As far as Christmas, do what is best for your daughter and for you.

uRworthy #2520036 12/23/14 05:57 PM
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We still have some loose ends financially. Accounts are now split, but all of the money is still in here. We tried to transfer some to mjne but have had difficulties.

I've also been thinking about other financial issues: she put down the down payment and bought her bed and D2's bed back when we were sharing finances. In fact, I cut back to the bare essentials due to her apt and extra expenses. When I go to move into my apt, I will have to spend all of that on my own. Shouldn't she owe me some money, especially with her $2,000 deposit being half mine? On top of that, we recently finished paying off her $36,000 car, but I still have $10,000 of debt on my car, which apparently she is expecting me to pay the rest by myself. I haven't brought any of this up to her because I didn't want to rock the boat any closer to D than I had to. If it actually gets to that point, I will need to address it. Neither of us want to go the lawyer route, because we don't enough enough assets to squabble over and don't want to waste that money on lawyers.


Me 38, WAW 30
D11 (former marriage)
S2
T 8 years
M 3 years
BD 8/20/23
S 8/20/23
Card29 #2520062 12/23/14 07:00 PM
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Yes, it would be fair that she pays back that kind of stuff, but let's put it back into the bigger picture. Would it help your sitch? If so, can you afford that she doesn't pay bac? Do you do it as a matter of principle or because you truly need the money? Any way in which it could help you to ask for a pay back, like making her face the reality of her choices or showing some fairness and self-respect? Have you checked if there's anything about this in DR? I can't recall on top of my head.

I guess you could put it in writing in some separation agreement for instance and see how she reacts? You could be the one that's surprised that she wouldn't want to pay back, as if it were the most natural thing in the world, which it is.

By the way, there are always financial losses and inequity in separations, as far as I can tell. I know that my W left a lot behind, almost everything that we paid together. Her parents paid for her move and new furniture and appliances, so it didn't matter to her. She just wanted out ASAP and to protect the cordiality, for the sake of the kids. Think of the state of mind of your WAW and remember that we have a natural tendencies to see unfairness as victims more than as perpetrators.


M39 D6 D3 (at S)
S 2014-09
D 2016-09

"You can't start a fire sitting around, crying over a broken heart" - Bruce Springsteen.
Mozza #2520071 12/23/14 07:27 PM
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Not saying what you should do with this in particular. That's up to you.

You need to act from a place of strength, C, not fear. You cannot base your actions on worrying if she will get upset.

But you should also try to do what is right and fair. Because that's who you want to be, right?

Card29 #2520079 12/23/14 08:12 PM
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Originally Posted By: Card29


I've also been thinking about other financial issues: she put down the down payment and bought her bed and D2's bed back when we were sharing finances. In fact, I cut back to the bare essentials due to her apt and extra expenses. When I go to move into my apt, I will have to spend all of that on my own. Shouldn't she owe me some money, especially with her $2,000 deposit being half mine? On top of that, we recently finished paying off her $36,000 car, but I still have $10,000 of debt on my car, which apparently she is expecting me to pay the rest by myself. I haven't brought any of this up to her because I didn't want to rock the boat any closer to D than I had to. If it actually gets to that point, I will need to address it. Neither of us want to go the lawyer route, because we don't enough enough assets to squabble over and don't want to waste that money on lawyers.


Hi Card - I always feel like I have to weigh on on the practical stuff. I'm not sure what state you live in but if you haven't already you should read up on the divorce law there.

For example, I live in California, and they basically add up all the marital assets and add up all the marital debts and split them equally (if it gets adversarial and ends up with a judge). So, in your example - regardless of the fact that you are the one taking your car - she would still be responsible for $5000 of the debt. You don't have to go down the route of going to court - but having a good idea of what might happen if you did is a good bargaining chip to settle things between the two of you. As to the deposit money- it depends on how nitpicky you want to get. Right now, as long as you are living comfortably - I would keep very good financial records (and make sure you archive any records you have from prior to the separation).


2 Ds: 7 and 4
BD and Sep: 7/14
Divorce Final 2/16
raliced #2520081 12/23/14 08:16 PM
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Also Card- your daughter is two, it is highly unlikely she will remember this Christmas, including if her parents are together when she opens presents, so don't get too angst ridden over the arrangements. Do whatever will give you the most joy that day - because that's what D2 will pick up on.


2 Ds: 7 and 4
BD and Sep: 7/14
Divorce Final 2/16
raliced #2520087 12/23/14 08:41 PM
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Thanks for weighing in. I'll probably let go of the deposit and beds, etc. I don't plan on spending much on any furniture I'll need, and you get your deposit back. But I don't think it's fair for me to be stuck with $10,000 of car debt, with everything else fairly equal, especially since she already makes 10K more per year than me, and about to be a lot more when she finishes her MBA (paid by work).

I'll cross the bridge if it gets there, though.


Me 38, WAW 30
D11 (former marriage)
S2
T 8 years
M 3 years
BD 8/20/23
S 8/20/23
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