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I think the second thread is sort of a rite of passage on this forum frown

Anyway, link to first thread Part 1


M:36 W:37
T: 15 M:11
S6 D5
BD: 8/10/14
IDLY: 8/12/14
S: 8/13/14 (she left, I stayed w/ kids)
D Mentioned: 10/15/14
Confronted about OM: 10/15/14
EA: ~4/13 PA: ~10/13
She filed: 8/15 (not final)
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 545
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Well, nothing too groundbreaking this weekend.

Got some intel that W's two BFFs are 'done' with helping her in her sitch. The one BFF was guiding her through the S, but neither had any idea of OM initially. After I confronted W about OM, she talked to BFFs about the R. Not sure how much she told them, though. I guess both of them told her to drop contact with the OM, but she's not listening or talking with them about the sitch anymore. I see that W has dropped contact with almost all of her 'old' friends. These folks have been in our lives for ~15 years, so its a pretty big leap.

I guess she makes settlement on the house this week. I've asked her when she was going to come get her stuff and she seemed to deflect and said; I'll be moving things a little at a time. I said I think its best to move all at once. She said she would see when she could come. That was two weeks ago, no contact about it since.


M:36 W:37
T: 15 M:11
S6 D5
BD: 8/10/14
IDLY: 8/12/14
S: 8/13/14 (she left, I stayed w/ kids)
D Mentioned: 10/15/14
Confronted about OM: 10/15/14
EA: ~4/13 PA: ~10/13
She filed: 8/15 (not final)
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 545
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MCS Offline OP
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Posts: 545
Well, just got an email from the wife. She wants to come and get her stuff tomorrow. Now, its still just limited amount of things. Her clothes, some keepsakes and some household stuff. However, she said that she wanted to make it clear that she didn't want me there.

So, I've had enough of catering to her on these things. She's bought a house, switch finances, separated joint accounts, etc. with no input or consideration to me or the kids. Most everything has been on her terms and informs me after she has done it.

I sent an email back and said that I would be there and if she would like to come with someone to accompany her, than that was fine. I tried calling to discuss, but she won't (and hasn't) answer my calls, even though we have talked about increasing our communication at counseling. It seems like she just says 'yes' to everyone and then does whatever she wants anyway. That's one of the things she's done to alienate herself from a good portion of friends.


M:36 W:37
T: 15 M:11
S6 D5
BD: 8/10/14
IDLY: 8/12/14
S: 8/13/14 (she left, I stayed w/ kids)
D Mentioned: 10/15/14
Confronted about OM: 10/15/14
EA: ~4/13 PA: ~10/13
She filed: 8/15 (not final)
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 545
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MCS Offline OP
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Posts: 545
So, this email exchange has spun up a couple exchanges back and forth. Wow, there's some tension. I've been pretty collected on my replies, but I'm starting to get sick of her making out like I'm the one that isn't trying to work through this. She has stuff in there that tries to make me look like a bad guy in all of this.
I can see some of the stuff I reply back in there shows my frustration. I need to work on that.

She has said that she doesn't feel comfortable around me. I'm still unsure where all of that has come from. It never was an issue that she told me in the M, its just been since she has left it seems. Weird thing is its pretty much been NC after BD week. I guess hiding an A for 9 months may do that; but other than that I just don't know.

Anyway, some back and forth on finances. I can tell that there's a lot of stress in both of our conversation. She keeps doing things and gets mad when I explain that it affects both of us....like the house. I really hope that we can improve our communication, counseling is not really helping because she's doing her own thing outside of what we agree to do there anyway.

S5 told me that they went out for Ice Cream with OM, his GF and their son. Yeah, there's another boundary that she has not even given a thought of. Man my stomach turns when I here that she's around his GF and I so want to let the GF know, I feel so bad for her that this is happening under her nose. I know that would not be productive at all. Mind-reading, but I guess the chase is still on for W to prove to OM to leave his GF.

Last edited by MCS; 12/01/14 11:31 PM.

M:36 W:37
T: 15 M:11
S6 D5
BD: 8/10/14
IDLY: 8/12/14
S: 8/13/14 (she left, I stayed w/ kids)
D Mentioned: 10/15/14
Confronted about OM: 10/15/14
EA: ~4/13 PA: ~10/13
She filed: 8/15 (not final)
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 545
M
MCS Offline OP
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 545
Went to MC today. Main goal was to go through a prelim separation agreement that I drafted up. Broke some rules of DB, because I was stuck in the moment. However, it seems like we made a lot of progress on our interactions.

Arrangements w/kids has been an issue for some time. I am struggling trusting her with the kids about things she's done, especially walking out the door. This led to discussion of R and how I feel. It got heated, then the MC took us one at a time for about 15 minutes. When we got back together, she told me that the issues in our M were not just me and she betrayed me and broke my trust for me and the kids, then she apologized. I said I'm trying to allow the trust come back to me, but its going to take some time. I thanked her for sharing those things with me. I could see that she was crying with the MC while I was not there. This is the first time that there was any remorse or apologized for what she has done in the M.

After that, we had the best conversation we've had since BD. Nothing more on the R, but arrangements for the agreement. It was so nice to have a talk that seemed like the person I've known was back.

No expectations, but feeling better about the future of our interactions whether we reconcile or not.

Last edited by MCS; 12/02/14 06:46 PM.

M:36 W:37
T: 15 M:11
S6 D5
BD: 8/10/14
IDLY: 8/12/14
S: 8/13/14 (she left, I stayed w/ kids)
D Mentioned: 10/15/14
Confronted about OM: 10/15/14
EA: ~4/13 PA: ~10/13
She filed: 8/15 (not final)
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 545
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MCS Offline OP
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OP Offline
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 545
So still having a good PMA about our exchange today. I'm not sure of the next step. I sent her some follow up on the items that we talked about in the agreement. She didn't reply back at all, but I guess I assumed that would happen.

Anyway, I think its time to go dark again until counseling next week. The MC said that we need to become friendly with each other first before anything else would happen. It was a tough thing to go through today, but I'm encouraged by our interaction in the end. I'm still not sure if its a lie and she knows what to do to get me to soften up (she's done that before) but I think I just need to resist the urge to keep pushing it.

Mind reading (really just venting), but I'm also pretty sure she'll go back and talk to OM, he'll give her some bad advice, she'll believe that if she follows the advice it will get him closer to leaving his R and she will back down the friendly tone of communication.


M:36 W:37
T: 15 M:11
S6 D5
BD: 8/10/14
IDLY: 8/12/14
S: 8/13/14 (she left, I stayed w/ kids)
D Mentioned: 10/15/14
Confronted about OM: 10/15/14
EA: ~4/13 PA: ~10/13
She filed: 8/15 (not final)
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 545
M
MCS Offline OP
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 545
So, if anyone can help me out. I'm looking for the next step...I think I'm just getting impatient because I saw the first glimpse of better interaction. Should I just hold tight or try to expand on some of the things in our weekly counseling (mediation) sessions?


So as I stated above, W had a fairly emotional apology to me @ counseling. Now, I told the counselor that this would be the first thing I needed to start to trust her, so I'm sure he clued her in on that. However, it seemed as if she hit the things that I thought it should. She accepted (some) blame on M issues, told me she betrayed me, needed to earn my trust, etc.


-------------------
She did let me in on a couple things before the apology while she was defensive it was all my fault, that I need to figure out. Some of this is I know is re-writing history (especially most of this was during A, not before,) but its how she feels right now. No. 1 here I can say I agree with her right now, especially because I'm having trouble trusting her.

1) She felt I had requirements on her in our M and now that we're separated; I'm still putting req'ts on her as a mom (I've been openly concerned in situations she's put the kids in)

2) She was overwhelmed Fall '13 and didn't feel like I helped her @ home at all. I do remember I was busy at work and kids were younger. I started do what she asked. (home earlier from work, help more w/kids.) I got confirmation from her directly and also a friend that W said I was better after that conversation and I was much better since then. However, This was also around the time when OM R started to take hold according to W.

2) Told me she 'shut down' after she told me she was unhappy last Nov. and I told her she was acting like a martyr (I did say this, I was mad at the time) I apologized later because it was too harsh and I had thought it was a 'bad day' thing at the time. Nothing much before or after that day about that argument or any other unhappiness.

3) She thought I was 'tracking' her cell phone. We had it turned on our phones for years and she started to not want to keep it on. I remember asking her why a couple times, but didn't think anything of it. I found out she told friends I was yelling at her about it (I never even was mad that I can remember, I was just confused why she was so adamant to keep it off and asked her a couple times.) This was during A time period.

Last edited by MCS; 12/05/14 02:48 AM.

M:36 W:37
T: 15 M:11
S6 D5
BD: 8/10/14
IDLY: 8/12/14
S: 8/13/14 (she left, I stayed w/ kids)
D Mentioned: 10/15/14
Confronted about OM: 10/15/14
EA: ~4/13 PA: ~10/13
She filed: 8/15 (not final)
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 545
M
MCS Offline OP
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 545
So I talked to a friend today who had a thought on what W is currently doing with OM.

W has been spending time with OM and his GF since BD. If I believe W, he broke up the R right before she BD's in our M. So, I've thought my W is still pursuing him, trying to make him reconsider. She did tell me she tried 'anything' in July to get him to reconsider. So I'm sure there still an emotional attachment on her part still.

However my friend had a good point, maybe OM and GF are the only ones that aren't judgjng Her right now. OM knows the sitch and GF is clueless about it and see's W as a D victim right now. No one in our circle of friends knew of OM, when she left. However she was looked down upon by most people because of how she left the M, she walked out and left kids behind and went totally NC with almost everyone.

Anyway, I'm thinking my next step would be to try and walked the careful line of not judging, but still enforcing my boundaries. Not sure how to do that, but I know I need to stop the commentary on how I don't think she's putting the kids first in her life right now. I just don't know how to balance that and still protect them the way I think i need to at the moment.


M:36 W:37
T: 15 M:11
S6 D5
BD: 8/10/14
IDLY: 8/12/14
S: 8/13/14 (she left, I stayed w/ kids)
D Mentioned: 10/15/14
Confronted about OM: 10/15/14
EA: ~4/13 PA: ~10/13
She filed: 8/15 (not final)
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 8,855
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Posts: 8,855
MCS

If you can detach then judgement will cease. Judgement of others is a hard one because often we think we have the right and some actions are so wicked that it is in our nature to be repelled.

I have always been told to love the sinner but to hate the sin. In general judgement of others is a cancer to our soul whether that is to apply the Halo effect or to condemn.

Your W has and may still be behaving in a very wayward way, how wayward is hard to decide and truly you may never know. This is very hard but please take the higher ground with this. The resentment may hurt you more than anything, you seek to understand, to rationalise what is not to be understood or rationalised. None of the parties W, OM And OMGf are understandable. This is their business and ultimately one way or another they will resolve it. Then their actions will show it.

Trust has to be earned, love and trust are not mutually exclusive. You can chose to love and not trust, just as I don't nor probably ever will trust my H with money. You can trust her for other things, as a mum, with money, to drive to the moon, but not with your heart at this time. Trust can be fragmented and allowed in pieces. Hence when the time comes piecing.

MCS, you are a shing example of perseverance and understanding, losing judgement seems to be an excellent next step in your growth.

Vanilla


Last edited by Vanilla; 12/06/14 04:50 PM.

Freedom is just another word for nothing left to loose.
V 64, WAW


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Vanilla,

Thanks for the kind wordS, I really do appreciate them.

I look back on the sitch and refuse to believe that this is the person that I love. When I finally was able to have a conversation this week, it renewed my hope.

I can understand how bad decisions and lies can begin to compound until it consumes and overwhelms the true person inside. I think that's where she is right now and I pray that she and her faith can get her out of this sitch. I think she can if she changes her mind that this is what is going to make her happy, I just need to have more patience than I'm comfortable that I have in me right now. I know I'll be all right in the end, I just need to work on my patience. That's where my growth will come. While I want W back for me, the kids are what is really allowing me to not get too frustrated right now. I said to someone, what's the harm in being patient 3,6,12 months to see if W can work this out for herself when it can affect the rest of your kids lives? I'm in a state with a one year wait period to file.

However, I still need to work on myself. I'm still struggling with her saying she feels emotionally unsafe around me. I partially attribute that to her pulling away for the last year as she has concealed her A. She was struggling with it, but since I was clueless, I had know way of empathizing with her. I remember when she would say things about her struggles generically, we would talk about her job, kids, house, etc. We would resolve the issues, or so I thought. I'm sure it was tough watching me 'tell her' about these things while she was struggling inside with something much more difficult. We always leaned on each other for emotional support throughout our M, so she/we didn't have the tools to deal with an emotional struggle that she couldn't tell me about. I just wish I had found out sooner so we could have addressed it while together.

For me, I know that I'm a pretty understanding guy, but I always revert to moderation and logic when dealing with issues. As you said, I need to let go of the logic and really concentrate on how she is very sensitive to my criticism right now. It's going to be tough..

Last edited by MCS; 12/07/14 03:37 AM.

M:36 W:37
T: 15 M:11
S6 D5
BD: 8/10/14
IDLY: 8/12/14
S: 8/13/14 (she left, I stayed w/ kids)
D Mentioned: 10/15/14
Confronted about OM: 10/15/14
EA: ~4/13 PA: ~10/13
She filed: 8/15 (not final)
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