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Originally Posted By: FaultyH
Mr Young at Heart

Thanks for your response.

...You have described my W without even knowing the rest of the story. I am impressed! I believe this is where experience kicks in.

...Back to your post, you are right. Two days ago she came to take the dog and give it to her brother....So she walks in my apt and gives me a hug. She then started to brag about a "singles party" she did at her place couple days ago. She said it was "wild".

...She then noticed I was getting big (I am a skinny guy but I've been going to the gym for the past 3 months, and now Im 15 lbs heavier). Then she started saying that she doesn't even feel like we were married. She thinks is probably her coping mechanism .... But, as the conversation went by, she started accusing me again for ruining everything.


I had to stop her (I never did this before) and tell her that I am done listening to the same complaints over and over. ...I told her that I am willing to listen to her, but not to listen to things that she had repeated so many times in her past.

But she kept talking and began to cry. She said she believed on us, on our future together. And that she put all the effort in this relationship.

...And when I start giving her examples on how much I also contributed in this relationship, she cuts me off saying "Alright, alright, fine..."

So we talked for like an hour and a half. Then she hugged me and said "I really love you, but not like before...I believe we should have been friends in the first place before becoming lovers..." Then she added "lets work on our friendship now." She was very emotional.

But then she asked me if I can help her pay her phone bill....I told her that:

1. she makes almost double the amount that I make, plus commissions.
2. She decided to leave and erase me from her life for ever (she deleted me from FB, talked trash and lies about me to others, etc.)
3. We are not together anymore.
4. The reason why your phone bill is so high is because you wanted the iPhone 6 plus an iPad.


...Then she hugged me again before getting in her car. At this point she was crying a lot.

I told her "you know my position, you know that I apologized to you and asked for forgiveness so many times. And I know you said you forgive me, but you did not want to fix anything. You moved out suddenly without even letting me know...But still I believe we can fix this together..." She didn't say anything and got in her car. I kissed her and left.


Where to start. You are seeing the patern, which is a great step in understanding the dynamics of your relationship. That will allow you to do a DB 180 and force her to interact with you in a different way. Your standing up to her rants and you saying no to her financial demands may have be inadvertant 180's which will force her to interact differently.

One of the keys to a sucessful 180, is that it will be challenged. You might want to do some real thinking about that and figure out how she might challenge your "new" you position and how you will respond.

Now for the bad news. It is hard to tell if you handled the last part well or not. Let me repeat something I said earlier so you can reflect on it and the last part of what you did.

Quote:
One of the hard lessions I learned was not to be baited into arguing with my W no matter what she said. I also needed to not knuckle under to her in a "MR NICE GUY fashion." If you have read No more Mr. Nice Guy, you will know what I mean. I had to learn to be an integrated, strong, polite MAN, who when she yelled at me, didn't respond with anger but assumed the adult/leader role and asked her civil questions that she could hear. I couldn't tell her what to do, only she could decide what she was doing, but I could guide her thinking.

I remember one event where we were out at dinner in a restaurant and she did yell at me (it does happen, but not often). I just looked at her with a question on my face and said I was sorry she felt so upset, but what was it I had just done that caused her to get so angry in a public place. She thought for a moment and then apologized and said she had no idea why she did what she did.


Only you know the tone of your voice when you told her you had apoligized and she had accepted and she had not tried to fix the marriage. From my seat that sound like if not getting into an argument, at least getting into a heavy debate. Hopefully there was no anger in your voice.

Don't get drawn into an argument with her no matter how hard she tries to draw you into one. You can be firm with her. You can point out the mature approach to handling a situation. Assume the Alpha-role in the relationship, be the mature adult or leader that she wants to instinctively follow (you said she was acting like a young girl, maybe that really is how she is feeling). Don't be what Dr. Glover refers to as the "Nice Guy" she wants to walk all over and manipulate.

To close on a positive note of what you did. She offered to be friends with you and work on your friendship. That was a great offer and hopefully you accepted or agreed to at least part of it. Working on friendship will keep her around so she can notice the changes you are making in your life and become again attracted to you. If you keep up with your GAL and your firm 180's she will have to see that you are a different person and one she needs to treat differently, which maybe why she wants to remain friends even when she knows she has treated you so badly.

Good luck.


>43 years of marriage--My wife and I are now closer than we have been in decades. I believe that my SSM is over.
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FaultyH Offline OP
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Hello everybody!

I see that I havent received too much attention on tjis matter. I am not sure if I have to post regularly. But anyways, Its time for some updates.

2 days after the last encounter, she called me at around 10:40pm. She asked me if I wanted to come over her apartment to pick up a CD/DVD drive that belongs to me. I felt tempted to go overthere, but after reading DB this was actually a bad idea. I have to act 'busy' and not too desperate. So I declined her offer and told her that I was going to call her at a later time so I can pick up the item. She said no problem and I wish her a blessed night.

A week later (halloween weekend) I received some pictures from a mutual friend. In the pictures, she was dressed up on a cat-woman suit posing next to her ex-BF. This made me upset and very disappointed at the same time. She told me that this guy was an alcoholic, an abuser and that she thought he was gay. Now apparently shes back with him and we are still married. The worst part is that she made this picture public, so now many people knows about this. At this point i dont know what to think. We have no kids and tomorrow I am moving to a new apartment with my cousin.

In the picture she looked clearly drunk, and he looked like he wasn't really too into her. I haven't go out with anybodyand im not pplanning to date anybody any time soon.

Thats all for now. The second part of the story is completed but I will not post it until I see that there is enough traffic in this post. Its a long story but I managed to keep it short.

I would like some advice on this matter. Have a blessed day everyone!

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It's hard to stay interested when you don't post very often. I mean, you haven't even given the second part yet? What are we suppose to respond to, if you give us something to read? Why are you dragging your feet around? You need to lite a case of dynamite and get on top of it.

Tell the story and get to DBing!


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
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FaultyH Offline OP
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You are right about that, sandi2. The main reason why I havent post the second story is because I had the story saved in my computer (i am using my phone now) and now the computer decided to not turn on. It has been like this for weeks. So then I decided to keep posting using my phone, which is annoying due to the thumb-texting. But I guess I need to get used to it. I also work all day, so I barely have time to sit and spend time in the computer. I have the second story on my phone now, and I will post it today.

Thanks for your response:-) .

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Here is the story for the second incident. It took me hours to gather all the important information. Let me know what you think, friends.

My cousin was having her wedding two weeks after our formal wedding. Due to the previous drama with my brother and SIL, the whole family was there except my wife and I. We went to the beach instead in order to clear our minds from all the drama, but I must confess that I wasn't very happy because my dad was in town (haven't seen him in over a year) and I couldn't spend enough time with him. Anyways, that morning she made breakfast for me, then I picked up the stuff to go to the beach (umbrella, chairs, etc). On our way to the beach she was enjoying a nice cocktail that she made, while talking about the way she was feeling, and also mentioned how she was still hesitant to fully open her heart and be vulnerable to me because she feared I was going to take her for granted and hurt her feelings. We finally arrived to the beach and it was very crowded. But then we had a very bad argument. That day she was being very emotional and vulnerable with things that she was expressing to me. I listened to her carefully and with all my attention. She cried while she was talking about deep-rooted issues from her past. As time passed by, she decided to continue the conversation on the shore. But as we walked towards the shore, she asked me to go first and sit on the chair while she takes a minute in the water. I asked her "are you sure?", and she said "its ok" and smiled at me. So I told her "I will keep an eye on you then".

5..10..15 minutes has passed and she is still in the water. So I go to her and ask her how is she doing, but she was crying and saying "You abandoned me!!..You left me all by myself...now I know what kind of man u really are!!!"
I was very confused so I started reasoning with her. She kept saying that I abandoned her, and kept pushing me away. So I decided to go back to the shore and start packing our stuff. She then walked to the shore and I met her half way with a dry towel (it was breezy and late..7pm). She then kept arguing and said "Now I know we should never been together!" At that point I was very upset, but tried to reason with her. There was ppl around us watching us, and when I kept trying to reason with her, she kept talking over me and turning her back at me. So I told her that I was going to sit down and wait for her at the chairs, and she said "Go, and prove to me that I am right about you...you are just like your f..ing family...just like your f..ing brother.." At that point I said to her "f..you!" and walked away. Now, I realized how wrong I was for saying such a horrible word to my beloved wife. So, at that point the argument turned against me because I said to her "f..you". Now things were getting very loud. My W asked me to leave and not to touch her stuff. So I grabbed my ID and CC (We went to the beach in her car) and walked away towards the parking lot. I called my pastor and told him about the situation, but while I was on the middle of the story, my W's best friend called me. She actually told my W to stop talking so much about herself and to "try to understand your husband's position of being detached from his immediate family" that came from 600 miles away just to see us getting "married again" and now I can't even share a moment with them. So her best friend called my W and then my W called me "Come and pick up the stuff and bring it to the car!".
So I went and picked up the stuff, except her personal bag. I asked her if she would meet me at the car, but she said nothing. She was staring at the water. So I told her that I will pick up the stuff and bring it to the car as she asked me to. She never came to the car. Her best friend called again and we spoke for 40 mins and she said she tried to call her but my W didnt answer. So I hid the chairs and umbrella under the front of the car (remember that she had the keys) and went to the beach to look for her. I found her standing on the shallow water and looking at the horizon. I apologized again to her about the FU word, but she started arguing. We kept arguing and then she walked away along the shore. I followed her and tried to reason with her, but she would not listen, then walked away again. So I stopped following her. At that point I called my cousin. I called him earlier to let him know about the situation, but I asked him to please not to tell anybody in the family. I also told him to wait to see if I can fix the situation with my W first. Throughout the whole argument my W said to me "do not touch my stuff...get away from me...etc." I asked him if he could pick me up, and he said "off course". Then my W called me and said "Come and find me in the beach!". I had no idea where she was. So I went and found her, but she was even more pissed off than before. It turns out that my mother texted her the following message; "Why do you insist on hurting my son, whose only desire is to love you?". At that point I knew that my family found out about this mess. I explained my W that I never called my mother, but that I called my cousin so he can pick me up because she (my W) didn't wanted me to be near her or to touch her stuff. Then she yelled at me and said "You stupid! now you gave your family even more weapons against me!". I apologized to her and I said that I really didn't wanted this to happen. At that point my mother called me and asked me what was going on. According to my mother, she thought that my W hit me and drove away and left me stranded. I clarified to her that that was not the case. So I went back to my W and she was so upset with me, crying and saying "why did you do this to me!...why would you put your family against me?". I again asked for forgiveness for telling her "f..u" and for the fact that the family knew what was going on with us at the beach.

At that point she started saying things like "it is not worth it anymore, I would like to end this here and now!...There is no purpose for me to live anymore!". I started getting worried, but it got worse when she said "I don't want to live anymore..there is no point of being alive!". Then she started to walk towards the water. Keep in mind that now it is 11:00pm and we are at the beach, completely dark! I kept her from going to the water, then she said "Stop acting like you care about me!...you only cared about you and your f..ing family!." But I still made sure she wasn't going to hurt herself. She also said "if I dont do it now, I will do it later at home!." Then she sat on the shore and handed me her car keys and told me to leave. Off course, I stayed right next to her. But it was now 12:30 am and she was sitting down with her head down without saying anything. The only thing she said was "I will end this tonight, just go away and dont worry about me!...I always loved to die in the ocean..." Now, I have no idea what else to do or to say, because she was not listening to me at all. I was talking and she was silent, or she talked over me. It was like I wasn't there! So I warned her; "Baby, please lets go home. Lets talk about this in the car and/or at home. Is late and we both need to rest. We can talk on our way home..." But she didn't replied. After 30 minutes I told her "Listen, you are talking about suicide, and I wont let that happen. So if you do not respond to me, I will call 911 and let them know of your thoughts." She said "I dont care anymore". So after several minutes trying to reason with her, I called 911; "Yes, my W has made suicidal expressions...we are at the beach..." Then they asked for her description and name, but I declined to give that information. Then my W stands up and says; "You dumb f..ck!...you are gonna get me in trouble at work!...they are very picky with the employees' mental health!..." So she snatched the phone from my hand and spoke with the dispatcher; "Im his W, and I apologize for everything. I am ok, but my husband has been drinking and is being emotional..." So now I am supposedly drunk (I only had one beer the whole day!) but I let her do it and I spoke with the lady and admitted that I was being emotional (but not drunk). At that moment, my W raises her hand like she was going to hit me, so I said "(W'S NAME)..NO!..." So now 911 has her name, what a mess!! After that, the dispatcher told my W to go to the cops in the parking lot so they can debrief her and me, so we can close the case. At first she agreed but as we walked towards the parking lot she had second thoughts and preferred not to talk to the cops. She kept cursing at me all the way to the parking lot; "You dumb f..ck! Wtf is wrong with you?...are u stupid?...Now you have built a case against me, and they will find out at work!..." We then started to drive home. We were 1.5 hours away from home. She kept arguing and telling me not to yell at her and not to use curse words. So I stopped the car at a parking lot and I told her how I felt. I told her that I am tired of her irrational behavior in public, because it happened before even in front of the family, at church, at restaurants, etc. So she then said "I'm sorry for everything that happened". She was still very upset tho. So I kept driving home, but she didn't said a word at all. Once we got home I told her that I still wanted to leave for just that night. It was 2:30am. We entered the apt and headed to the bathroom. She then said "I dont want to change your mind, but please dont leave...". She referred to an incident that happened a week earlier in which she wanted to leave me forever but I convinced her to stay and work things out. It took me 2 hours to convince her, and around 40 minutes staying under the rain (while she was in her car) in order to convince her. Then she asked me to get in my knees or else she will leave, and I did.

But back to the story, I asked her two questions: "Do you love me?" She said "yes", and "Do you respect me?", she replied "yes", then I said "Then please let me go for tonight, and I will be back tomorrow. I promise!". So I grabbed some clothes and left. It was 2:30 am, and I headed to my aunt's house, where my parents were staying for the night. I texted her before going to sleep, but she never replied. That morning I woke up at 9am and texted her again, but no response either. So I spoke with my aunt and uncle and my parents about the incident. They all thought that my W hit me and drove away. I clarified this with them because she never hit me nor left me stranded at the beach. After this I called my W (it was 12pm'ish) and she didn't replied. Then I called again and she finally picked up the phone. I asked how was she doing, she replied "Sup? I'm doing fine...". I asked her if she wanted to talk, but she said she wasn't home. So I told her that I will be home during the afternoon or probably later. So later that day I received a call from a mutual friend (he still communicates with me) because he wanted to talk to me. I told him my side of the story but not the full version of it. We spoke for an hour and a half. He basically told me to man up and put my family on their place, and not to let them dictate my life. I kind off agreed with him, knowing that it wasn't all my family's fault. I then went in the apartment and she was laying in bed. I said hi to her and asked how she was doing, she said "fine". I asked if we could talk, but she declined the offer. So I went sleep in the sofa that night (and stayed there for almost 2 months!). She didn't said anything during that day or the next day. Then the next day she came from work and started packing her stuff. I then stopped her and asked her if she could please talk to me. She finally broke the silent and started talking. She said that I abandoned her and ran to my family, and that I preferred my family knowing how they felt about her (my W). She also said that I left her after she begged me to stay, and that I keep involving my family in our business. She said that I left everybody in my family to enter our marriage and "abuse" her over and over while I was watching and doing nothing about it. The finally she said that she wanted a divorce and that she has a petition of Dissolution of Marriage. I cried so hard because she seemed so convinced on finishing our marriage. According to her that was the only way out because "there is too much damage done". I told her that my family knows that what happened at the beach wasn't as bad as they thought, and that they may still upset because of what happened at the wedding rehearsal night and not because of the incident at the beach. But she said that there is no more hope. She said "I love you, but I love me more." From that day on, hell fell upon our lives.

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Good morning everyone!

I first apologize for the long long novel. It was a 7-hour long argument and I tried to keep it as short as possible. And still, there were many facts left out of the story. But I kept the most important facts on the story.

To this day, she still does not acknowledge that she asked me to give her a minute in the water. Also, she recently said that she deserved to "vent out" to me in that way because of all that happened at the wedding rehearsal (refer to the first page).

I know I shouldn't tell her the FU word. I know it was insensitive and immature. But before all that happened, she was already cursing my family by saying "ypu are just like your f...ing family, like you f...ing brother..." I feel like we both disrespected each other that day. But she never fully apologized for what she did to me.

What do you think about this. Thank you in advance.

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Quote:
The finally she said that she wanted a divorce and that she has a petition of Dissolution of Marriage. I cried so hard because she seemed so convinced on finishing our marriage. According to her that was the only way out because "there is too much damage done". I told her that my family knows that what happened at the beach wasn't as bad as they thought, and that they may still upset because of what happened at the wedding rehearsal night and not because of the incident at the beach. But she said that there is no more hope. She said "I love you, but I love me more." From that day on, hell fell upon our lives.


First of all, remember that "actions" and words are not the same thing.

Second understand that when she picks a fight with you, she is picking a fight with you. You have the option to get sucked into a fight or to not get sucked into a fight with her. Yes she knows all your hot buttons, but now you know how she is trying to manipulate you into fighting with her.

You need to learn how to let her say hurtful things and do hurtful things and let that bounce off you. When you accomplish that, you will have done a heck of a 180 and shown her you are a different man with greater skills who will not be playing the same old game. That should force her to treat you differently.

Again, she may have divorce papers read or she may not, let her actions speak not her words.

Read DB and don't let her get to you. Often times a spouse will know all your hot buttons and will do something so you lash out. Then they can play victim, which sounds like what your W was doing.

Good luck.


>43 years of marriage--My wife and I are now closer than we have been in decades. I believe that my SSM is over.
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You are right, Young At Heart. I recently spoke with her and she still wanted me to help her pay for the phone bill. She insisted so much that I agreed to help her only for this month. To this day, she hasn't paid her part and now my phone is going to be disconnected (we are sharing a line under my name).

But anyways, that day I spoke with her and she brought up the same old topic again. She said that I abandoned her, that I preferred my family over her, etc etc. Then she got very agitated, and hung up the phone on me. I didn't call her back, I didnt text her. 5 minutes later she texted me "I dont want to argue."
Then she called to apologize:

W: "I am sorry for hanging up the phone on you...I dont want to argue."

Me: "ok, I dont like arguing either. I will help you for this month."

W: "Thank you!"

Me: "Enjoy your TV show"
W: "Ok thank you. Have a restful night"
Me: "You too. God bless you."

I must admit that this situation didn't really hurt me at all. This happened before and I used to get very emotional. My heart is either stronger or dried up. I still have love for her, but my constant attempts to save the relationship failed greatly, which caused me to step back and do a 180. I am not an expert but I try not to let her get to me.

Since the past 5 months I have been going to the gym, cooking healthy food and dressing up better. I was very skinny and now I reached a healthy weight (mostly muscle). I moved out from my old apartment (it was too expensive for just a 1/1) into a cheaper one on a different location. I feel more at peace, almost no stress at all, more focused and happy than when we were together. I feel like Im myself again. I wasn't 100% happy with her (maybe 80%), but I wanted our relationship to reach that "happy level". I was willing to work hard at it. I will keep praying and doing my thing. No more games. No more the same'ol thing!

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Originally Posted By: FaultyH
...she got very agitated, and hung up the phone on me. I didn't call her back, I didnt text her. 5 minutes later she texted me "I dont want to argue."
Then she called to apologize:

...I must admit that this situation didn't really hurt me at all. This happened before and I used to get very emotional. My heart is either stronger or dried up. I still have love for her, but my constant attempts to save the relationship failed greatly, which caused me to step back and do a 180. I am not an expert but I try not to let her get to me.

Since the past 5 months I have been ... I feel more at peace, almost no stress at all, more focused and happy than when we were together. I feel like Im myself again.

... I will keep praying and doing my thing. No more games. No more the same'ol thing!


WAY TO GO!!!!

As MWD advises you have disengaged, done a 180, and are working on GAL and you are seeing and feeling the difference it is making.

Let me tell you she will be noticing the differences as well and if you keep it up, she will have to treat you differently. Hopefully, the difference will be a way that you like and a way that can be used to rebuild your relationship and marriage.

One of the things that happened when I lost weight got in better shape and strated dressing better was that women friends of my wife commented on how good I looked and how lucky my wife was to have me. That forced her to not take me for granted. She knew other women were checking me out and that if she walked away, one of them might walk in. It created a competition situation where she needed to compete, which was something she hadn't done in decades.

Way to go. Take yourself out, and do something to congratulate yourself on an initial step well done. Keep it up and you will get the love/relationship you want and deserve.


>43 years of marriage--My wife and I are now closer than we have been in decades. I believe that my SSM is over.
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I have just read thru your thread and I am very sorry for your situation. The way you have described everything that has happened - plus your wife's history of abuse - I am wondering has she ever had Individual Counseling - for the mental flotsam (PTSD possibly) that all childhood abuse leaves?

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