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HP

The advice here is solid and you can rehearse.

What would I like to hear or say if I were Mrs HP

Breathing Space
Not to be dealing with this as I walk through the door
Ordinariness until I get myself together
A cup of tea or coffee
Clatter, chatter and happy kids
A rest after my journey
Some pleasantries

Then if I were Mrs HP in my time (not Mr HPs)

Mrs: We have things to discuss
Mr: Can we discuss this ......... (HP choosing) I can see you are tired/busy/etc and its Friday.

Recommend a time location- whatever suits YOU and you are ready

Later

HP breathe, project love to Mrs HP (but don't say the words)

"W let me start by repeating my text to you "reads text" I meant this, I would like to repair our marriage but I know that at this stage this isn't what you say you want. I won't stand in your way if you wish to separate but I am not going to help you"

My M and my children are very important to me. In the last (period) I have come to realise that my family is my world and I am putting our children at the centre of it.

Please work out what you want to do but there is plenty of time for you to decide please take all the time you require.

Now HP if you feel uncomfortable at any time make a graceful exit.

No need discuss OM, you can choose to save that for another time when you are stronger, no need to discuss boundaries unless you want to. Make a graceful exit.

Mr: We can discuss practicalities later. I am very clear that I want my M and my family together.

Mr: Would you like a cup of coffee etc

HP leaves to go wash the dishes, make coffee, take a P, play with kids, go for a drink, etc

Universal support flooding to you

Vanilla


Freedom is just another word for nothing left to loose.
V 64, WAW


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HP, refresh my memory: what is this trip your wife is on? She's not with OM, is she?

Sorry, couldn't remember and didn't see it for last 2 pages of your thread . . .

thanks,

Starsky


M57 W 57; D30 D28 S24 S20 GD7 GD2 GD1 GD5m GD1m
BD 5/07; W's affair 5/07-8/07

At the end of every hard-earned day, people gotta find some reason to believe. (Bruce Springsteen)
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Airport for work I believe page 3 of this thread

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Freedom is just another word for nothing left to loose.
V 64, WAW


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Hey HP,

For a real chatterbox like you, it's been awfully quiet today. I hope you're okay. Please do check in and let us know how things went since W returned back home.

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Thank you LisaB, Wonka, Starsky, Vanilla, and all of you for checking in on me. I am exhausted like I fought a battle today.

But I did it.

Today, while W and I talked, I was better me.

I'm too tired to do my usual book length post, so I will try to summarize and fill in more tomorrow.

Funny thing... she showed up early today... soon after I wrote my last post. I did not get a chance to see all your great advice for the talk.

She looked tired and miserable. She asked to talk immediately. I said OK. I was not feeling friendly yet as I was not ready.

Our first talk was tense and logistical. She wanted to talk about moving to a new apartment together to save money this year. She wanted to talk about the email where she laid out her ideas for the next few months until summer when she thinks she may get her own apartment (depending on money).

I basically calmly said, you're making these choices, it's up to you. I got up and walked away. She stayed sitting and didn't say anything.

I went upstairs and got centered. I remembered the enpathy post I wrote. I really tried to see things from her point of view. I didn't plan to go back downstairs... but after a few minutes I did.

She was still sitting in the kitchen, her arms folded on the kitchen table and her head down on them. I walked over to the other side of the table. I do not remember what I said. Something about "I don't understand."

Then we had a second talk. It was both wonderful and horrible. We actually connected a little at the end.

She said a lot of things about how she's feeling. Lots of information to work with.

But mainly, she came at getting MC from every possible way. You were right Wonka.

She wished someone was there with us to mediate. Someone to help her say everything she wants to say without hurting me. She wanted to make the appointment today.

She wanted...
Someone to tell her if she should work on our M.
Someone to find out how we could be better people and maybe then work on the M.
Someone to help us learn to co-parent.
Someone to help us be friends again.
Someone to help her explain her thing with OM.
And other things.

She came at it in so many ways trying to get around my boundary. Like she wanted me to allow the A go on and go to MC to talk about it.

Even so, every time I say something like... You're absolutely right W. We need MC. And it's non-negotiable for me... your A must end. I said it directly, calmly, even lovingly. I was that way the whole time. I felt great.

I used her words... "like you said W... your heart is in another place... distracted. And in MC we should be both in there with no distractions."

On our second talk, she cried a lot. She started crying when she said she was deeply hurt when I did not answer her texts and phone calls.

When I talked about how we're not friends anymore, she talked at length and passionately about how important our friendship is to her and how she can't lose it.

I managed to praise her for being brave enough to tell me she didn't love me. That I was grateful for this time to grow and that I've learned a lot. She asked if I was still in my on-line support group. I said yes... I've made some amazing friends there and they pulled be back from the brink because I immediately wanted to "divorce your ass" (exact words I used). She really smiled and said she was so happy I made good friends (thank you everyone).

She said, even if she packed up her bags tomorrow, she loves me. She said me and our S11 are her #1 priority. When I said don't worry about me, she cries all I worry about is you.

At one point she said "I should just stay and fix the M." She said that 4 times in a row. Of course she said it in a resigned voice.

She also said things like she can't give me what I want. I asked her what she thinks I want. She said to say I want to fix the M. I admitted... of course I would love you to say that. But I know you don't feel that way. You are your own person. I know I cannot change your mind and I do not want to. All I can do is make a place you may want to come back to one day I said.

She said some very interesting things. She said, if she made the decision to walk away, that she did not expect to be happy. She expected to be miserable for years. When I said, I know you don't want to be with me, she said she didn't want to be with anyone. She mentioned a previous EA that was just for conversation with a friend from high school. She mentioned that she doesn't know OM... he's just a stranger and she just wants to feel like a woman and get her needs met. She cried how I'm a good man. She asked how we could live together?. How she was disrespecting me and how doing so could she sleep in bed with me?

Not much about OM... but I had an opportunity to ask if OM is married. She said no. (I do know he at least was married with 3 kids.) She said it's hard because now she cares for him. She said he offered to back off because he didn't know what was happening. Most awful, she said OM texted her he had a dream about me. That, if he were me, he might do something that would put him in jail over this. I did show a little irritation but let it go. She will find out that will be the last talk of OM I will tolerate.

So basically a lot of the thoughts swirling around in her mind. She did almost all of the talking. She did not get angry at all. She was nice and even loving to me. She also shook the whole time. Sometimes tapping and even hitting her head. She looked terribly unhappy.

Then I said... let's stop here. I have a lot to do today. Thank you for talking And I got up to walk away.

Then I turned and said as terrible as this has been, I have enjoyed some of the talks we've had since BD. She brightened and agreed. I said we've haven't been close like this in years. I said this is intimacy you know... talking like this. If we didn't care about each other... this wouldn't be so hard. She really smiled then and said yes you're right. I felt some nice connection then.

And I got stupid.

I said, "and you're invited back to the bed."

And immediately regretted that. I may take that one back with "I thought about what you said about disrespecting me and I decided you were right about not sleeping in the bed as long as you are" if she does climb in bed next to me. I doubt that she will though.

Nothing was decided in our talk.

While she said multiple times she really really wants MC and she really wants to be friends no matter what, I did lovingly make clear multiple times...

While she is in A there will be no MC.
While she is in A we are not friends.
If she ends our M in this A we will never be friends again.
(I remember lovingly saying after she talked about why we need MC... "Yes your right... first we should be friends again. Right now, we are not friends.")
Now she will see me back my words up with actions actions actions.

She never said anything about divorce. She was never definitive about not being able to fix our M. In fact, once she corrected a definite "I can't get it back" with a "I don't know if I can get it back." She also said, in her soul she thinks it's too late for us. W always said she thinks.

Doesn't matter though... I don't believe 100% of what she says.

Then she left to go to work. She said "thank you for talking" and smiled her tired smile.

I said "yeah, " and walked away.

So I wrote a book again. I am so tired.

What a day. I feel good about it. Would love to know what you think. If you're where I am, I hope you learned something. You don't have to play your WAS's game. Listen to the advice here.

And guess what? I still have GAL tonight. Champagne Party! Tango and Salsa lessons! I really don't feel like going but I'm going!

Wish me luck.

Onward.

Last edited by HPoirot; 11/22/14 12:02 AM.

Me: 44
W: 45
S: 11
Married: 15
Together: 18
BD: 9/29/2014
OM discovered: 10/16/2014
I left her behind: 12/14/2014
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One last thing... she also mentioned she's now afraid to go back to her IC. W told IC that she drinks in the evening and then takes a sleeping pill. IC said women who do that to dull the pain in their lives can become alcoholic. W is afraid she is alcoholic. She still drinks even though she's should be on a liver regimen that prohibits her from drinking. She didn't like hearing that and now she won't go back to IC.

I can't fix her though. But there that is.

Oh, and at on point I suggested she pause (word I and her IC used) with OM to do MC. She said she could do that. She was all over the place.

Last edited by HPoirot; 11/22/14 12:11 AM.

Me: 44
W: 45
S: 11
Married: 15
Together: 18
BD: 9/29/2014
OM discovered: 10/16/2014
I left her behind: 12/14/2014
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So, call me crazy here. But going to counseling to work on communication is necessary no matter what the outcome. No matter what you are co-parents of S11.

Who knows, being able to communicate and partner around that may give your W the courage to end the A.


Me: 35
Her: 33
D : 16
S : 9
Together: 14 years
Married: 12
She left 4/14/2014
Separated: 5/25/2014
OM Confirmed 7/2014
She filed 8/7/2014
I Filed 10/21/2014
Divorce final 2/12/2015
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"While she is in A there will be no MC.
While she is in A we are not friends."


Your WORDS may say that, but you are providing all of the kindness, empathy and support that a really GOOD friend would offer.

I highly suggest you pull back. WAY back. You are way too available to her.


Starsky


M57 W 57; D30 D28 S24 S20 GD7 GD2 GD1 GD5m GD1m
BD 5/07; W's affair 5/07-8/07

At the end of every hard-earned day, people gotta find some reason to believe. (Bruce Springsteen)
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Originally Posted By: BigMac
So, call me crazy here. But going to counseling to work on communication is necessary no matter what the outcome. No matter what you are co-parents of S11.

Who knows, being able to communicate and partner around that may give your W the courage to end the A.



MCing while a spouse is still in an affair is a complete waste of time, energy and money.


M57 W 57; D30 D28 S24 S20 GD7 GD2 GD1 GD5m GD1m
BD 5/07; W's affair 5/07-8/07

At the end of every hard-earned day, people gotta find some reason to believe. (Bruce Springsteen)
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(On champagne glass #5)

Thank you starsky. I agree that I did get very into good friend land with our talk. I noted how much again I enjoyed her attention. So yes... The rest of today was back to pull back mode. I got ready for this party away from her. I did not speak to her unless she came to me which she did. She asked me where I was going. I answered generally. When I was leaving, I considered leaving without a word as she has done many times since BD. Decided that would be classless and said good night as I walked out the door. She said have fun. I don't like this but I am doing this. I just saw a cute girl walk in. I'm introducing myself and talking with everyone I meet. Champagne #6. Music is great too. Scheduling next GAL. Crazy life. But yes agree starsky. That you for staying with me. Toast to all of you. Looking for cute girl now. Wondering if I'll find W in my bed when I get home. I really hate this.

Champagne #7.


Last edited by HPoirot; 11/22/14 03:09 AM.

Me: 44
W: 45
S: 11
Married: 15
Together: 18
BD: 9/29/2014
OM discovered: 10/16/2014
I left her behind: 12/14/2014
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