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I kept trying to think of a catchy new thread title. Then I saw my last thread had 99 posts and it just came to me. I've been in the anger, hurt, crazy phase these last few months and I need to stop focusing on H. He ain't my problem right now!!!

Here's the links to thread 1, 2 and 3

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2445162#Post2445162

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2489637&page=1

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2490178&page=1


Brief synopsis of my sitch:

Me 41, H 40, 4 kids: s19, s16, d13, s8

High school sweethearts, married 20 years
Since about 2010 knew " something wasn't right" with H. Became moody and very different personality. Started buying lots of motorized toys, having an EA with our friend/neighbor. In late 2012 told me he wasn't sure our marriage was going to work- said he was " deprioritized" and I wasn't meeting his needs. I do have a very demanding job and was building a new practice during all this so I tried to change as much as I could and work on things that I knew were issues ( including a somewhat SSM for years). Nothing I did seemed to be enough. Then in Sept 2013 he told me he was seeking out a divorce. I was shocked. Despite all our issues- I didn't expect him to do that. Found DB/DR 3 days later and realized this is MLC.
He moved out Oct 1 and filed Oct 10. Hasn't done anything more with it but who knows. Said recently he thinks we will be divorced before end of year.
Moved back in Jan 17 because he was suicidal. Got on AD, going to IC but still not sure about relationship. Moved back out early May saying he just felt he needed to move forward with the divorce in order to get through everything he needs to deal with.

I have been dim since Oct, needed to for my own sanity as I'm hitting a different phase in my journey that can only best be described as volatile. It's weird- in the beginning I hit the books and started working on me and was calm and compassionate and forgiving with H. Since his last announcement that he needs to D ( late Sept) I am angry and emotional and sometimes crazy in my thinking! I don't show that to him basically because I keep my distance. But it makes me feel like I'm going backwards sometimes. I continue to work on myself, and I'm digging into some pretty deep and longstanding wounds so maybe that's it. I'm just ready for some peace that lasts more than a few hours or days.

Last edited by daring; 11/20/14 06:38 PM.

Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
Life is about daring greatly, about being in the arena- Brene Brown
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Love the title ... Hit me !! Lol

I think this journey the MLC is on ... creates a journey for us LBS that is necessary, granted .. not wanted .. hence our reluctance at first. Like you said .. at first we are all compassionate and forgiving, labeling them with MLC does alot to take away the responsibility for them IMHO, eliminating us from demonizing them to much. And being compassionate and forgiving is a TON easier than looking at ourselves in the mirror and admitting .. "Well crap .. looks like I have some serious chit to work on myself ... I thought I was the one with it all together" .... the cycles of all the emotions, its normal, and healthy ... keeps us working, what we have to watch is being stuck on one emotion for to long .... stagnation is the enemy.


M: 48
W: 47
M16 T26-S8
BD Sept13



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Nobody has it "all together" but I consider MLC more of an explanation for their extreme response to this time in life rather than an excuse. Most of the population deals with this transition in ways that are not as destructive. The reality of watching somebody "flip that switch" is jarring and the LBS needs to have some sort of narrative to deal with all of this. DBing is a coping mechanism but even Michelle says MLC behavior is fairly extreme.

Aren't we all on a journey all the time anyway? No disrespect Cali but that word is bandied about like the word dysfunctional. yes we can get stuck but even being stuck is still a journey.


M:25 years at BD w/ 2 daughters
BD: 5/14
Separated 6/14 - H moved cross country w/OW
D Final 9/17

“I can be changed by what happens to me. But I refuse to be reduced by it.”
― Maya Angelou



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Quick update- been off the board for a few days- busy with work and been at a scrapbooking weekend away with my daughter. It's one of my favorite hobbies but don't get to do it too often.

Had a couple of good interactions with H last week. He seems less " foggy", I'm just trying to get over the anger stage and stay positive in front of him. He even offered for me to borrow his truck for the trip since it has more room to carry all our stuff.

So had great PMA most of weekend but woke up this morning feeling a little sad. Had vivid dreams last night and some emotions from those lingered.
So I prayed for a Bible passage to read.
What I received floored me- Hosea 3. I have to admit I've never read that book. But the passage is specifically about God's instructions to Hosea to reconcile with his wife. Ummmm ok wow. I'm not taking this as a sign that H is going to do that any time soon, he still has lots of work to do. But I am seeing it as God's message to me to just keep hanging in there. And so I will.

I'll catch up on everyone's sitch later today. Hope everyone's doing well!


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
Life is about daring greatly, about being in the arena- Brene Brown
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I totally believe that we receive lots of signs that help validate something or warn us.

Have a great week.


M:25 years at BD w/ 2 daughters
BD: 5/14
Separated 6/14 - H moved cross country w/OW
D Final 9/17

“I can be changed by what happens to me. But I refuse to be reduced by it.”
― Maya Angelou



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Hi daring!

I'm leery of "signs". Here's why:

We can see anything as a sign, based on what we are looking for.

W often told me (early on) about "signs from the universe" that told her she was right to bolt from the M.

Anything can be a sign, of whatever we want, if we want it to be.

Better to use long term reason and logic to guide your course, not fleeting "signs".

Bust On, girl!

Last edited by ForeverYoung; 11/24/14 08:51 PM.

M: A really long time.
Crisis: 5 years.
She's still worth it.

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Early in my sitch my WAW took to astrology. She thought her astrologist was wonderful because "almost half of what she predicted came true." W scrambled to read her horoscope in the newspaper each morning. She would comb the internet for compatibility of her sign with OM's sign. I used to read my W's horoscope too and was just amazed at how contradictory they were from day to day. I felt that if our M was being left to astrology, we were truly doomed.

My W has now dug herself into a deep hole. A D is in progress. She will lose her family, house and financial security. I am now indifferent at best; she has taught me that I cannot rescue her.

My W was surrounded by signs. She saw the ones she liked, and was blind to many, many more.

I'm with FY on this one -- seeing signs is highly selective. Stick to consistent observations.

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I will just agree to disagree with above. I mean I get it ... sure we can see what ever we would like to see, but there are some things .. like reading the Book for instance that you just know to your core it was meant for you to read. If this gives you the strength, patience, faith and hope to continue doing what you know in your heart is the right thing to do ... regardless of how hard ... then let that fuel you for a bit. I think we all need a nudge here and there letting us know that we are not crazy, even though it may be easier to just drop it and walk ..... I have had a good number of signs in my sitch .... I do feel if my M was meant to be destroyed it would have been by now, yet ... here I am .. still here .. still standing.
Keep at it daring ... you have this.


M: 48
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M16 T26-S8
BD Sept13



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I just had to post on this thread as I'm a huge believer in being able to "see" signs. I respect everyone's opinion and this is simply my own.

I do believe very much we are given signs. Sometimes we choose not to see them or we have *too much interference " that prevents us from being able to process or really see something. Sometimes, it's a matter of not liking what we see. However, the interesting thing about signs is that what we see may make us uncomfortable. My xh who believed in no such thing allegedly, told me after BD, that "signs" kept telling him to leave. Did I agree? No, and it didn't matter. That was what he *saw* and felt, and honestly, it's not my place to judge or determine whether he is right or wrong. His choice. My choice on how to respond and live my life. And for the record, I operate almost entirely on logic.

I shared before that on my way to work one day I asked G-d or the universe to please give me a sign that I would be okay. At that moment, a construction vehicle carrying an actual sign passed me. It made me smile. Signs can be literal or figurative. However, their actual message is subject to interpretation by the recipient. And the reality is that is something that cannot be controlled.

Last edited by Georgiabelle; 11/24/14 10:31 PM.


3 kids
BD 12/15/13 (IDKIILY. )
Rope dropped Cirque du Soleil style
D final 9-9-14
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Goodnes I got a lot of traffic on that one! smile
I'm not being frivolous and looking for signs or something to confirm my thoughts. But sometimes I get tired and sad and just wonder whether I should throw in the towel and move on.
Originally Posted By: CaliGuy
If this gives you the strength, patience, faith and hope to continue doing what you know in your heart is the right thing to do ... regardless of how hard ... then let that fuel you for a bit.


^^^^^ This captures the essence of what I felt when I read that passage.
But I certainly don't discount logic and direct observations either.

Feeling a little nervous about Thanksgiving as we are having it together at my house ( H's request). I've been quite dim and only interacted with him for 20-30 min at a time when exchanging kids. Have to keep up my PMA and confidence for several hours this time.
I've got this- even have a cute outfit ready!!


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
Life is about daring greatly, about being in the arena- Brene Brown
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Having a sad day today- not sure why. At least it's " functional" sad and not overwhelming.
I think I'm going to do some Christmas shopping for decorations and the kids Advent calendar. Hoping that will help my mood.


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
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Originally Posted By: daring
Having a sad day today- not sure why. At least it's " functional" sad and not overwhelming.
I think I'm going to do some Christmas shopping for decorations and the kids Advent calendar. Hoping that will help my mood.


Yeah Holidays are tough ... I was newly separated last year and it was horrible. This year I am in a better place, stronger ... but I was thinking today that Holidays as I knew them may forever be a memory and I may possibly never have them the same. But ya know what.... this was not our choice, its out of our hands and we can do 2 things ... let it ruin our celebration, or take it for what it is and make the best out of it.


M: 48
W: 47
M16 T26-S8
BD Sept13



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Well said Cali- this is not our choice but we can choose to make the best of it.
I was also relatively newly separated last year (Oct) and Holidays felt much more difficult even though H was over all the time.
This year I'm having twinges of sadness but not like last year. I went shopping for some decorations and Advent calendar gifts and had a good time! I'm excited to decorate and celebrate which is good.
H has had the kids the last 3 days since I'm on call so tomorrow will be great to see them! Also S 19 is coming home from college tonight. H is cooking the turkey and stuffing and bringing it over. He asked me what time I want them to come over and they'll be here whenever. Hoping I can stay nonchalant in front of him. Wish me luck!


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
Life is about daring greatly, about being in the arena- Brene Brown
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Happy Thanksgiving all!
So I'm not so sure I can get through today with a poker face. H dropped of the kids early and is heading to pick up S19 b/c he blew a tire on his way last night. ( it's only 1 1/2 hrs away so not too bad- I can't go b/c I'm on call). H even called me at 3am to let me know as I was expecting him home- so that was nice.
He brought the Turkey this morning and chit chatted a little with me. I went back in my bathroom to finish getting ready as I had to round. D13 was being snotty which irritated me but I handled well.
H came in the bathroom to see if I needed anything before I left. Also said looks like we made need butter- which I did forget. I kept getting ready ( make up, hair etc) while talking and told him I'd pick some up on way back from rounding.
He seemed bothered- just was staring at me- then said ok well if there's anything else you need just text me.
I don't know if it's that I'm distant that's bothering him or what.
I don't want to be closed off and self protective- that's part of what I didn't do well in our martiage some of the time- although his behavior toward me and EA contributed greatly to that. I wasn't closed off shortly after BD, but now I seem to need that space. It's just too painful not to have the walls up right now. I don't want to make things worse- but this is where I'm at.
Off to round and hopefully regroup my brain before dinner.


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
Life is about daring greatly, about being in the arena- Brene Brown
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Well I made it for the most part. At one point we realized one of the hot water heaters was broken. H was talking about how expensive they are to replace. Then we went in the garage to look at it. He says " I didn't mean to stress you". I said, with some tears " I know but I'm about to go to an IRS hearing next week to see how much I have to pay them and now the expense of this- it's just stressing me out."
He made a gesture not to stress it and then I said I'll figure it out. He asked if I wanted him to leave. I responded no ( probably a little too desperately). Then he just reached over and hugged me- first time in a couple of months with any contact. It was very nice.
We had a great meal and prepared things together. I made a sweet potato casserole for the first time ever, and he said it was good ( in a surprised tone- but that's fair- he's the cook between the two of us).
He played outside for awhile with S7. Then came inside. Demeanor seemed to change a bit- more contemplative. Our older kids decided to go to a movie and a few min later he said he was going to go home and go to sleep. I said really this early? And he said he hadn't been feeling well last couple of days. I said ok- both thanked each other for nice meal and off he went.
Of course my brain starts wondering...... Is he going to spend some time with someone else? I even thought about driving by his place.
Then thought about it- not going to help- doesn't really matter right now. He's a lost little boy that still has some work to do before he potentially finds his way home.


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
Life is about daring greatly, about being in the arena- Brene Brown
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H did something really nice this morning. He called me around 8 to let me know had already set up for someone to bring me a loaner hot water heater and then in two weeks will install new one. He negotiated a decent price to replace both of them as if one broke I'm sure the other one is soon.
It was really, really helpful- took some stress off and I made sure to thank him.
He's taking D13 and friend out 4 wheeling today. It's my day to hang with S8- I see Christmas decorating in our future!


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
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I'm glad he arranged for some assistance w/your hot water heater. It's definitely not something you can live without for very long. He's smart in getting both of them replaced.

Enjoy the decorating this afternoon!


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
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Thanks Job- it was very helpful. S8 and I had a blast picking out decorations and he even put a mini tree in his room and put ornaments on it. I'm glad that despite everything I have some Christmas spirit!

So new stressor today- my mom was visiting family out of state over the holiday and apparently started having headaches and weird symptoms. Then this afternoon she apparently fell when getting up from a chair and they rushed her to hospital. I just talked to doc and she has bleeding in the brain and is not coherent. He is worried about aneurysm.
The first person I called was H. I just needed to at least talk it out. He was very kind and concerned.
I want to fly out there but I have the IRS hearing on Tuesday and I don't know if they would allow me to reschedule. If I don't go they could start takings wages which would be devastating since I'm the only one with income right now. I can't let my kids be affected by the dumb decisions H made with taxes.
H said he would go for me but I think it has to be me since I'm the one negotiating a pay back schedule.
In any case if things get worse with my mom I'll go and try and figure it out. Otherwise will fly out Tues evening.
H said he will help me with whatever I need.
Please say some prayers for her.


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
Life is about daring greatly, about being in the arena- Brene Brown
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Prayers for your Mom Daring.


M:25 years at BD w/ 2 daughters
BD: 5/14
Separated 6/14 - H moved cross country w/OW
D Final 9/17

“I can be changed by what happens to me. But I refuse to be reduced by it.”
― Maya Angelou



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Sending prayers for your Mum, You and family your way Daring.

Hugs

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Oh, daring, sending prayers for you, your mom, and everyone in your family.

((((Hugs))))

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I'm sorry about your mom, Daring. Sending you positive thoughts!



3 kids
BD 12/15/13 (IDKIILY. )
Rope dropped Cirque du Soleil style
D final 9-9-14
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I am keeping your mother in my thoughts and prayers.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
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Hi Daring,

My father suffered the same thing a couple years ago. They kept trying to treat him for a sinus infection because of the headaches. We finally disregarded the regular doctor and went to emergency room. They took CAT scans and found blood on both sides of the brain and transferred him to a hospital that was better prepared to deal with it. Even there they were unwilling to do what was needed. They even contemplated sending him home hoping it would go away. My father continued to become more delusional. He could not even hold himself up in bed, but would slip and slide all over the hospital bed. We finally got the doctors to insert drains in his head. He has come back a lot, but there are still things that may never recover.

What we learned is that as you age you brain actually shrinks. When you are elderly, sometimes even sitting down in a chair hard can cause bleeding. You may never actually know the cause of this. We never did.

Make sure your family stays on top of the doctors and don't hesitate to push them if you think they are not being aggressive enough in treating your mother.

I will be think of you and your mother as you go through this. Have hope. Ask me questions about my experience dealing with this if you need to.


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D final 1-2015
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Being in the medical field, I'm certain you will see that Mom is cared for properly. I'm thinking of you and sending positive thoughts your way...


M: A really long time.
Crisis: 5 years.
She's still worth it.

Life is never made unbearable by circumstances, but only by lack of meaning and purpose. -Viktor Frankl
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Prayers going out to your Mother daring


M: 48
W: 47
M16 T26-S8
BD Sept13



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Thanks everyone for your thoughts and prayers- and LT thanks for sharing your experience. I'm definitely monitoring her status even though it's from afar right now. No dilation in the ventricles so she doesn't need a shunt at this point. They are doing daily imaging.

So H checked in this morning to see if I needed anything from store ( hasn't done that in months) and to ask how my mom is. I asked if he was coming by after store and he said- I'd like to. I said that's fine. ( again hadn't done in months- lately it's just been a brief exchange of kids). He may be having a hard time as the weekends he doesn't have the kids he's usually traveling. Prob hard to be home and no kids.
So he came over and we were talking a little about how I might have to get my mom in to rehab and/or move her in with me for a bit with home nursing care. We talked about converting S8s room ( I had already thought about all of this). He said we could put S8 in S19s room. I said what about when he comes home on breaks? H said " he can stay with me".
Not that I'm not expecting this situation to go on for awhile or even forever, but for some reason that statement made me very sad. I feel like I just can't deal with anymore loss or responsibility. I got up and walked in the kitchen and cried a bit. H followed me and said- I didn't mean to overstep my bounds. I said you didn't at all, I've already thought through it, it's just too much right now.

So then he got to working on moving my old dining set out into the garage ( had to be taken apart so was a bit of work). I didn't ask him to at all- he just did. Also seemed to withdraw some and the when the Christmas tree was delivered he seemed bothered ( wistful- maybe??? I know- no mind reading Daring!). He was very impressed with my job on putting the lights up- which is usually his job.
After finishing up table he was moody. I asked if he was ok- said yes thinks he's just tired and grumpy, needs to go take a nap. He's still spinning, but I think maybe he is starting to think.


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
Life is about daring greatly, about being in the arena- Brene Brown
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Daring, so sorry about your Mom. I’m sending positive thoughts your way.

I’ve got a lot on your plate right now. Your H seems to be one of these nicer, but slower MLCers. I can relate. Take care of yourself.


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Thanks Bright- I do feel like I have a lot on my plate. Trying to take one day at a time.
My lawyer changed my tax hearing to next week without my even asking, once I told him about my mom. So helpful!
I'm off to see her now a day earlier than I would have been. H offered to take me to the airport ( at the crack of dawn no less!). I get the feeling that he wants to be helpful and be a friend for me in this so I'm letting him in a little bit. I accepted the ride as well as chatted with him when he called last night to check on me.
I don't even have the energy right now to worry about status with our M, which is probably good.
Will catch up on everyone's sitch soon- I'm sure I'll have lots of down time in the hospital room.....


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
Life is about daring greatly, about being in the arena- Brene Brown
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Hi all in DB land- I haven't posted much but have been keeping up with everyone.

Mom is doing better than anyone expected- she has no motor deficits- just cognitive. Her short term memory is poor right now and she keeps going back to old memories ( such as asking where her mom is- she passed away over 20 years ago). I'm able to redirect her memories though and she retains some.
Hoping to get her back to TX where we live ( this happened in MD while visiting family) in the next few days. Will go to rehab for several weeks and then might even be able to resume independent living. God is good!

H has been very supportive- checks in on me and tries to keep me positive when I'm worried. I asked him to send me more of my blood pressure medicine since I might have to stay a few extra days and he said no problem will Fedex.
He said today I sounded good and positive- I told him I snuck out at lunch for a massage as I was feeling stressed and irritable. He said good- massage or sex- whatever works. ( he hasnt joked or flirted with me in a couple of months but has been more recently). I said I don't have the sex option right now- he said you're a girl you always have that option. I said ok yes but I'm choosing not to exercise it.
He laughed. His voice and communication seems different- more like old H. He also has a few job interviews next week.
I'm not making any assumptions about him- just enjoying the more relaxed communication.


Me 41 H 40
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S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
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I'm very glad to hear that your mother is improving. Her memory may be impaired for quite some time, but w/family and loving care around her, she may recover more of her memory than what the doctors hope for.

I'm also glad to see that your h is being supportive and is checking on you. Do whatever you need to do to relieve the stress. At least he was joking w/you and definitely enjoy the relaxed communication.

Here's hoping that you'll be able to move your mom back to TX in a few days and she continues to recover nicely.

Don't forget to take care of yourself!


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
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Thanks Job- I hope she continues to recover her memory as well. She's definitely improving in her mobility and I'm able to get her back to TX and rehab tomorrow! Yay! She does get a little " sundowner" affect in the evenings though and gets combative. She pulled the IV out of her neck last night apparently. At least she's feisty!

As for me I'm trying to take care of myself as best I can. I'm worried about making extra money for the tax repayment- but I decided to take Monday off just to rest and regroup as I'm exhausted!
I'm also thinking about my sitch and feeling sad today- maybe just all the things going on and the holidays. Will work on getting back into my GAL as soon as I get back- boot camp, massages and maybe even a few social events! Looking forward to seeing my kiddos too!!


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
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Daring, I'm glad to read that your mom is improving! That's great news.

Sooo... If you're planning some GAL stuff...and, say, want to do day-trip northbound, I could do a day-trip southbound.....and WE COULD KNOCK OUT OUR GAL THINGYS TOGETHER!!!

Because I got nothin'. whistle

....yet.


Meaning nothin' yet.

"Yet" being the operative word.... (Working on it, uR and Eric wink )

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Oh yeah Shining- I'm up for a day trip fo sho!!!

Kids have stuff going on this weekend but how's Sat the 20th looking?


Me 41 H 40
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S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
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Ok, daring! The 20th it is!! Let's do this!!

Do you know what the kik app is? If not, ask the kiddos... Lmk smile.

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Daring,

So glad to hear the encouraging news about your mom. It is also good to hear H is being supportive. Sending you good wishes and hugs for healing vibes all the way around.

Wish I still lived in Austin. I'd love to crash the meetup. smile


M:25 years at BD w/ 2 daughters
BD: 5/14
Separated 6/14 - H moved cross country w/OW
D Final 9/17

“I can be changed by what happens to me. But I refuse to be reduced by it.”
― Maya Angelou



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Gwen, I wish you were in Austin, too! Feel free to crash anytime:)

Are you far from here?

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Gwen- agreed! We can find a place to meet-up near all of us if you're still in the vicinity.

Shining I downloaded the app- should I search for you?

So this was my journaling today. I know I'm feeling exhausted so I'm sure that's some of the ho hum.....

Ugggh this feeling $uck$! H picked us up from airport- brought s8 and d13 which was awesome. He was nice and helpful with mom. Ruffled my hair at airport asking if I was ok. Stepped outside and helped me put stuff together once we got to the rehab. Asked what else I needed. He asked what's next for my mom? I said depends- he said what if this is best she gets? I said assisted living. He thought insurance covers some- I said no I will have to pay for it.
I said do you want to go to lunch with kids and swing back for me or I can take a cab once I'm done settling mom in. He said either way- but clearly didn't really want to wait or pick me up.
Made me feel very sad. I know he's tired from carting kids around this weekend and he was nice enough to help me this much but it just leaves me feeling so alone. I'm tired of all this- I just want someone to share my life with and hold me when I'm down.


Me 41 H 40
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S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
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How is mom doing now that she's back in TX? I'm sure you are glad to be home and that your mother is not far away. Check around about assisted living and see what is offered for the elderly. There may be some programs you can apply to for assistance for her.

Please take some time to recharge your batteries. You've had a lot of stuff and stress on your plate the last few weeks. I do hope that everything will settle down and you can find a bit of time to rest.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
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Uggh some more. I got back to my house in the cab and H was there as he was dropping off the kids. I walk in and he says " the dogs shattered the salt flavor test tubes- there was glass all over and the cats peed in D13s room." I hadn't even taken a breath. I said " ok- anything else?" He must have sensed the frustration in my voice and said " we took care of everything already".
He said kids had been very good, told me what kiddos each needed to work on. Then said " you seem overwhelmed" and told S8 to give me a minute.
S8 was all excited to decorate tree and H mentioned he had been waiting to do it.

Then he sat down for a few min- asked me if mom was still angry acting. I said not really but she said something g this morning that it would have been nice if i had called and checked on her ( she had forgotten I was there all day). I said I know she just forgot but it hit something for me. He said " hit what"? I didn't get to answer b/c the kids interrupted us. I was going to say that basically I feel like nothing I do is ever enough for anyone. Prob better that I didn't get to say it.
Then he said S16 has been sick for 4 days, strep test was neg but he thinks might be wrong. I said I can put him on an antibiotic.... He said well look at his throat first. I said if it's going on this long might as well try.
I was writing the prescription and he put his arm on my shoulder to say he was leaving and was I going to be ok. He seemed uncomfortable. I was a bit teary and said- I'll be fine.
He said ok I'll leave you alone- seemed maybe a bit annoyed? I said I wasn't trying to be ugly, I don't know how else to answer- what were you looking for?
He said " nothing" and seemed like he couldn't get out of there fast enough.

Of course my mind is spinning- oh he prob feels bad or uncomfortable b/c he's about to dump the D papers on me, or b/c he doesn't really care about me, or b/c we are doing Christmas decorating tonight ( though the kids tell me he has a tree too).
As I write this I'm thinking it could also be guilt at how overwhelmed and sad and alone I obviously feel. Who the F knows?!

I texted an hour or so after he left " Thank you for your help today. I apologize if I made you upset- I don't know what other answer to give when you ask if I'll be ok- fine is pretty much the only choice I have. "

I know I probably shouldn't have- but I just couldn't leave it alone. He hasn't responded. Prob won't.

I just feel like I'm hitting my emotional breaking point.
I know I need to get through tax hearing on Wed and then see how mom will do and plan as best I can.


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
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daring,
You are doing the best you can. You can't be super mom and balance all of the balls at once. Your mother's memory isn't good and she's going to say things like that. Some of the things she may say may hurt you, but don't take them personally because she really doesn't know what she's saying. Time for her is lost in so many ways. I do hope the "sundowners" will be better now that she's a bit better. My father developed that while in the hospital and it's something to deal with.

Your h sounds like the sitter ticking off everything that he and the kids did, right or wrong. As for the dog and cat, your h and the kids took care of cleaning up the mess. If you don't feel like decorating the tree, then let the kids do it while you sit on the couch w/your feet propped up. You don't have to go over board this year w/decorating. Keep things as simple as possible because you do have a lot of stuff going on.

Your h was uncomfortable and feeling guilty. He can't stand to be around people who are upset or ill. He doesn't know how to deal w/emotions such as comforting you because that old empathy chip is broken. It makes him uncomfortable to see the strong daring having some teary moments. I'm actually surprised he stayed as long as he did.

I do hope your son is feeling better soon. I do think that once you've had the IRS meeting, you'll feel a bit better.

If the tree doesn't have lights, so what. Try not to sweat the small stuff. Hang in there.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
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Thanks Job- I missed your post until after my last one.
I am considering assisted living- will see how her recovery hoes but definitely better to have her nearby.

I definitely need to recharge my batteries- I am an emotional mess right now!


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
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And I must have been posting at the same time as your second post Job- thank you so much for the support. I'm trying not to take it personally and cognitively I understand that but I'm just emotionally exhausted. I'll try to take good care of myself and regroup.

If he's feeling guilty- that actually makes me feel better than thinking he doesn't care at all. And again, cognitively I know better but I'm just hurt.

That IRS hearing behind me will be a relief!!

And as for decorating the tree- I'm hanging the ornaments with the kids now. I actually enjoy this- just needed to regroup. Luckily I had already done lights and tinsel before I left!!

Thanks again for the support Job- it really means a lot.


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
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Originally Posted By: daring

Of course my mind is spinning- oh he prob feels bad or uncomfortable b/c he's about to dump the D papers on me, or b/c he doesn't really care about me, or b/c we are doing Christmas decorating tonight ( though the kids tell me he has a tree too).


I highly doubt he is about to dump papers on you. But so what if he is? You already know you'll be ok, right?

Quote:
I texted an hour or so after he left " Thank you for your help today. I apologize if I made you upset- I don't know what other answer to give when you ask if I'll be ok- fine is pretty much the only choice I have. "

I know I probably shouldn't have- but I just couldn't leave it alone. He hasn't responded. Prob won't.


I don't think this was a mistake at all. You spoke from your heart, just like your husband has been doing. Besides, no one incident is going to make or break your marriage anyway.

Continue to be strong, daring. You got this.


M: A really long time.
Crisis: 5 years.
She's still worth it.

Life is never made unbearable by circumstances, but only by lack of meaning and purpose. -Viktor Frankl
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Thanks FY- you are right- I will be fine no matter what.

Feeling much better today- I slept in and caught up on much needed sleep. Then went to pay moms rent and get her mail. Came to check on her at rehab and she's hanging in there. Memory still terrible but the therapists and docs are awesome. If she's going to get better they will make it happen.
Doesn't hurt for me to be a doc in this health system either- the CEO for the rehab was at my hospital for awhile so I know him well and he's checking in on her. Makes me feel good to have caring admin to work with.

As far as H- I called this morning b/c I'm about to renew benefits and he's been on my insurance. I asked if he'd likd me to keep him in until he gets a job. ( he interviewed this morning with a good prospect, also said at this point he might just work at Home Depot- he has to figure something out). He said no- he thinks he'll have a job by Jan 1st. I asked if he was sure since it can't be renewed once enrollment closes and he said yes he will figure it out. He's trying very hard to be independent in a good way I think- part of his growing up process I guess.
I asked if he could be at my house Thurs when they install the new hot water heaters since I will be at work and he said yes.
Sometimes I feel bad that I'm asking him to do some of these things, like I'm using him and should just figure it out, but I really need the help and he seems to feel good when he can help so I'll just monitor.

One day at a time.....


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
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Daring you are dealing with so much and adding the holidays to the mix is emotionally draining. Happy to hear Mom is back and settling in to rehab. Being a physician you are used to stress and multi-tasking and making sure everyone else is fine. Remember you can't help anyone else if you are not feeling strong.

Hope your week is smooth sailing and Mom continues to improve.


M:25 years at BD w/ 2 daughters
BD: 5/14
Separated 6/14 - H moved cross country w/OW
D Final 9/17

“I can be changed by what happens to me. But I refuse to be reduced by it.”
― Maya Angelou



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Thanks 123Gwen- I definitely need to make sure I'm taking care of myself. Trying to eat well, sleep and exercise though I slip up some.

So this is going to be Merry F'ing Christmas. It appears the D papers are coming my way. H came by tonight so we could discuss schedule with kids next week. He asked about my mom. He seemed very bothered, like he needed to talk about something.
I was good- I let the silence sit. He eventually said he heard from the lawyer today that he would be getting a draft of the agreement. He gave all the info to them already apparently. We had discussed that we would determine the terms and just have lawyers review. He was VERY down appearing, like it wasn't something he really wanted. Said he would be probably filing for bankruptcy afterwords b/c he can't afford his portion of the debt.
Then he said- ok I'll get out of your way. I said " I didn't say anything". He said " yes but I see your face and I'm trying to respect you're hurt". I said it doesn't matter if you leave or not- the situation is the same.

We chatted a little more about kids Christmas presents. I asked if he wanted to do Christmas together b/c his finances are poor and he said no- I believe him as he was very sincere.
Then he said " do you need anything- other than to not have anymore chit dumped on you" I said " pretty much, yeah". And then I said " would be nice to have someone to help with the chit too". He said if you need more help with anything you need to speak up. I responded yes I could use more help but I don't think it's appropriate to ask. He said ok, well if you need help or need to talk to someone I'm here.
I said I don't think that's very healthy. He seemed very bothered again and said- " For who?" I said not healthy for me. That gave him quite a bit of pause.
Then I said- I can't reconcile the two situations in my head- D but still going to you for support. He said ok, again bothered. I said I'll figure it out on my own and if my thoughts on it change I appreciate your offer.
He then chatted more about kids. This is obviously a very tortured decision for him. I was teary but maintained my composure. I even stayed in living room afterwords while he was helping D13 with homework.

So as FY pointed out the other day- I will be ok. This is not my fault nor would the things I could have done better prevented his crisis. He clearly still wants a relationship with me but isn't capable right now. Maybe I'll still be around after D if and when he gets to the point of wanting an R, or maybe not. I'll take care of me however I need too.

Big ole GAL week coming up!!


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
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Daring, I am in same boat as you. My lawyer called with the news last night that the divorce agreement has been worked out. He is only working on the agreement for me since he fell flat on follow up. Long and short is that he asked if I would be good with finalizing things in court next week.

My thoughts on things go like this right now. They say on this board time after time that the old marriage is dead and that what comes out will be a new marriage. So, I am seeing the D as a final closure on the old marriage. If we both want something in the future it will be a new marriage.

My hopes are my wife will have to face reality for herself and maybe find out that happiness comes from within. Right now she is still fixated on me being her problem and happiness will be there once she gets rid of me. The funny thing is that she has left so many openings in the divorce agreement to have contact with me. makes me wonder what will happen on her end down the road.

So, try to look at this as the closing off of the old marriage opening the way to new possibilities.


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daring,
I'm very sorry to hear that the papers are coming your way at this time while you are dealing w/so much stuff. Hopefully they won't come before the holidays, but the mlcer tends to have stuff sent around the times that are suppose to be special such as holidays, etc.

Please, please take care of yourself. You are under a lot of stress and need to find some time to recharge your batteries.


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Daring ... just caught up on your sitch

Yeah .. thats a boat load, and especially during this time its just ... well .. Chitty!

Does seem there is some struggle there, along with guilt. Does not make things easier for you but I do sense some feelings still there, and yeah the more I am in this MLC sitch the more I have come to realize that old M we all had prior to BD .. has been Hiroshima'd to oblivion. And we are all just trying to get our ears to stop ringing and figure out how to rebuild. I am slowly learning to change my focus, aim it on me and my S and let the MLC'r be and get through that journey alone.

What will be will be ... we can no longer help them. You are a very strong individual ... you have handled this all with such grace and class ... that's what you can hang your hat on.

Thoughts and prayers going to you


M: 48
W: 47
M16 T26-S8
BD Sept13



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LT- yes you are right about the old marriage being dead. I get that part. I just don't understand destroying the whole family unit if you're not really wanting to let it go. But then again I haven't been kidnapped by the MLC mother ship either! I hope both our spouses figure it out before we have decided to move on. Either way we will be ok!

Job- thank you for your concern. Your words always make me feel like I have a big sister wrapping her arms around me in a big hug! smile
I am trying to be very cognizant of taking care of myself. I've been going to bed early to get good sleep, and even though I have to cut some visits short with mom I've made getting to boot camp a priority as it really helps me with my stress.
I also have two Christmas parties and a meetup with a fellow DBer next week so I'm GALing my arse off!

Cali- you made me laugh with the Hiroshima comment- so true!! And thank you for saying I've handjed this with grace and class- that makes me feel good. I try but some days I would just like to shout F you at him for all this crap!
Keep working on me, focus on me- we are learning Cali.

So little update- tonight was D13 band concert. H went early to get her from school and pick up food for her. I had to get S16 and S8 and bring them. When I showed up there was standing room only. H offered me his seat but I said no thanks. I noticed he kept stealing glances at me. Then one of the songs the kids played was the one with the line " only know you love her when you let her go". I noticed he looked down at his phone through that song when he had been engaged in all the others.
After the concert he took D13 and S8 to pick up food and I dropped off S16 at a party. He asked if I wanted anything since they were taking it to go. He brought kids back to my house and came in to hang out and eat for few min. Was chatting with me about kids stuff, especially D13 who had bad attitude tonight. He asked about my mom and some schedule things. I told him I would be back on Sat in time for him to go to a Christmas party. He asked where I was going, I told him I'm meeting a friend halfway between our two cities. ( it's a DB friend,!but I kept it mysterious!) Then as he was leaving he asked me to lock door behind him. Stood on porch talking for a few min and all the sudden he starts telling me about a couple of job offers he has. Wanted to share some of the details with me. I was very happy for him and gave him kudos on the opportunities. Then he asked if I was going to S8 karate belt test tomorrow and I said yes. He said ok I'll come by and pick you both up and we can all go.

I'm keeping my expectations sub zero- in fact- I'm not thinking these actions mean he will change his course at all and I'm still expecting D papers. But I see some desire for connection, and maybe a little fear about losing me?? I'm still going to keep doing my own things- next Fri is our 21st anniversary and I have plans. It's my boot camp Christmas dance party. H already knows I'm going and will have the kids that night. Me treating our anniversary like any other day is a statement I know he is noticing.

Ok novel done for now. I'm doing pretty good today. Will keep giving it to God.


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
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So interesting conversation today- not sure what to think.
H had younger kids last night after we did a celebration dinner for S8 karate belt test. S16 decided to stay with me. He went out with friends and around 1100 texted asking if he could stay as the mom offered. It is s girl's house ( not his girlfriend) but there was a group of them staying. I said fine but need to be back next day early enough to get ready to go to musical we were seeing.
Mid morning H came over to bring kids. S8 wanted to hang out a little and D13 needed to get ready for musical.
S16 hadn't shown up yet despite me calling him. H asked where he was and I told him. He said do you want me to go get him? I said yes that would be great. We both know the house as he hangs out there a lot.
When they got back H said he wished he had known he was staying night. Said he thinks we should let each other know those things.

Before I relay the rest of the conversation- in general H is more strict than I am about being out etc.
I said I'm not so sure about letting know those minor things. He said we should b/c if they are elsewhere and might need both of our support or help we should know. I said I'll have to think about it. He asked what the issue was- I said " we are coparenting, we aren't a family. As we go forward when I have them or when you have them we will be doing our own thing and I think social stuff like that is not necessary info to communicate all the time. Plus we won't be talking that often". He sat there for second and then said " I'm asking for you to let me know". I said I would think about it. Then he said " I'm not saying you're doing anything wrong or making bad decisions". I said " I don't think that, well maybe I do somewhat but that's not the whole issue". The conversation pretty much ended there.

I probably do feel he is judging me some- during his mean times he harped on my parenting and made me feel horrible. But it's not just that. It's also that I do t think those are details necessary to share if we are living separate lives. If they're going out of town with someone sure- but otherwise no.

Thoughts??


Me 41 H 40
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S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
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I am mixed on this one. My wife does not tell me anything. Problem has come up a few times that kids were with wife and I was free to GAL stuff. Things came up where the kids needed someone, or even had to go to emergency room, and wife was not answering her phone because she was on a date. I pretty much asked her to do the same as your H has. She still won't so it does put a crimp on how far I feel safe going away.


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Daring,

I'm sorry you are in a difficult place. It's stressful enough during the holidays and dealing with these zany MLC peeps can add to the stress. I just have an observation and take it for what it is.

I get the impression that you are trying to *remind* your h that you aren't a family and are only co-parenting as a means to get him to rethink his decision. I understand you are hurt ( it sukks!!!!),however your h has to *feel* the difference. And honestly, maybe he will and maybe he won't.

I know you don't want a D and so does your h. I think bringing up the fact that you are no longer a *family* might actually be counter productive. Say nothing. Answer questions and move on. No assessment of the situation necessary because your h is the one who has to see it. It's like you are trying to keep reminding him things will be different. Not sure if I articulated that well.

In regards to the activities, you don't remind him you won't be talking much. Actions speak much, much louder than words. I don't think it's necessary to fill him in on everything, but illness, ER visits or anything like that is fair for discussion. Your h is a grown up. He can ask the kids their plans also.

Pull back. Focus on you and your kids. Don't worry about trying to "convince" your h this is s big deal and a mistake. You will be just fine.

Hang in there:-)

Last edited by Georgiabelle; 12/15/14 03:18 AM.


3 kids
BD 12/15/13 (IDKIILY. )
Rope dropped Cirque du Soleil style
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LT thanks for your feedback. I understand what you are saying, however, whichever parent is " on duty" is expected to be available and answer phone if needed. In addition I would absolutely call H if an emergency came up or I needed his help. I guess it feels to me more like a control issue, like he's trying to keep tabs on things and/or interject his opinion in my decisions when I have the kids. I might not be looking at this right- I don't know. I feel like if we D and eventually have separate relationships with other people, I'm not going to be letting him know that level of detail on a daily basis. If he wants to separate our family- that's the reality.


Me 41 H 40
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S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
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Georgiabelle you are absolutely right- I am trying to get him to see how it will be different. Thank you for calling that what it is.
I don't bring it up by itself, but if he wonders why something is happening the way it is and asks- I respond with that.
I guess instead of just saying " I don't feel that's necessary" I think I have to justify my decisions and plans. He used to think I was this amazing, wonderful person and mother. But since onset of MLC he has raked me over the coals- and I have let him take away my self esteem in the partner/mother dept. Lately he seems to backtracking from that and telling me again that I'm a good mom- but I still feel the sting of before. And I do want him to realize the consequences of his decision- we aren't in a partnership anymore!
I will pull back and let the actions speak what they need to.


Me 41 H 40
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S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
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Hi daring, I'm glad to hear you have been doing well.

Originally Posted By: daring
He sat there for second and then said " I'm asking for you to let me know". I said I would think about it.


You know my wife and I don't have kids, but my question would be why would you not comply with this seemingly simple request? How would it hurt if you did? How may it help?





Last edited by ForeverYoung; 12/15/14 06:53 AM.

M: A really long time.
Crisis: 5 years.
She's still worth it.

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FY- I guess I feel the underlying impetus isn't simple. I feel he is trying to control things and that he would argue or give me a hard time about some things. Maybe I'm mind reading but that's how I feel.
I also feel like if and when I moveon to a new relationship, I won't be texting my exH everytime one of our kids goes somewhere.

So to answer your question- it hurts b/c I think it helps him maintain contact and control.
It may help b/c he's asking me to and I would like to have a cooperative coparenting relationship.
Maybe I'm trying to be punitive b/c I feel I've asked for a lot of things that I haven't gotten ( like commitment to marriage vows).

I'll have to think on this a bit more....


Me 41 H 40
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S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
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So today was IRS hearing day, we at least got an installment agreement though it's steep.

I journaled the following a few minutes ago:

IRS hearing today. H came too.
Went as well as it could. He seemed more calm- said it will work out- before we went in. Noticed my redness that I get when upset.
Lawyer kept pointing out what a great job I had done on all of this. That it went well b/c I had done so much prep and gathered documentation.
Afterwords lawyer said H did a good job not being aggressive he says he knows it's husbands instincts to protect their wives. Hmmmmm.
As we walked out I was about to go into parking garage. H seemed deep in thought, with his hand over mouth. H stopped and said- thank you for putting so much work into this. I said thank you for coming. He was looking deep into my eyes. Not the " foggy" look. Then he said we can sit down and figure out how much we will both pay- I don't want you to feel this is all on you. I said we will see once you get a job offer.
He hugged me and left.

I'm sure he will revert back to MLC ways but it was like for a brief moment he recognized all he was putting me through ( tax issue is b/c he was irresponsible and didn't file a couple of years or protect our interests when he started a company. I did 95% of the work for the hearing preparing extensive documents and going to lawyer meetings).

At least that piece is done and I have a plan- now back to regularly scheduled program of GAL for the week.


Me 41 H 40
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S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
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daring,
I'm sure you are very glad to have the IRS hearing behind you. At least now, you've got a good idea of what to expect and, i.e., installments, etc. I do hope that your h will step up to the plate and assist w/the payments once he's found another job.

How is your mother doing? What about you? Are you getting taking care of yourself?


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
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Daring,

I'm glad you made it through as that could not have been fun. Hopefully you can relax a bit and enjoy the holidays with the kids.



3 kids
BD 12/15/13 (IDKIILY. )
Rope dropped Cirque du Soleil style
D final 9-9-14
"Some people are born on 3rd base and go through life thinking they hit a triple." Barry Switzer
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Job and Georgiabelle- thanks for the support!

Mom is hanging in there. Memory is still quite poor and she struggle for the right words to use. But the nurses and therapists say they see some slow improvement which is good. It's hard for me to fully gauge as I visit in the evening when she's tired out and not as sharp.

I'm trying to take care of myself. I made myself go to boot camp today even though I felt tired after the IRS hearing. I'm glad I did. I continue to try and sleep and eat well. My IC reminds me weekly to keep the focus on self care. Im feeling emotionally " down" right now but it's not overwhelming and I feel like it will pass soon.
I've got some fun activities planned this week so hoping for some relaxation!

Last edited by daring; 12/16/14 02:16 AM.

Me 41 H 40
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S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
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Interesting thing happened a couple evenings ago after tax hearing. I was looking through my accounts to see how much was in there and what was left to be paid. I see a ton of PayPal withdrawals that added up to a little over $1000. I called H to check on it b/c I don't have a Paypal, only him and the kids. He looked and it turns out it was his travel tickets for upcoming interview and consulting trip.
First he said it will be reimbursed. I said you need to tell me when you do these things I'm keeping a tight budget with IRS payback in front of us. He said you're right, I didn't realize my paypal wasinked to that account I'll change it. I said thank you. He asked if I felt better after IRS hearing and I said a little but still have to come up with a chit ton of money every month. He said I know I will help. Then he asked about my mom. After filling him in I ended the call.

He started traveling yesterday and I haven't spoken with him. But last night and this morning I'm in a weird place. One I have somewhat been in before but much more definitive. Maybe I am hitting a better phase of detachment, I don't know. I certainly have had incredibly emotional months recently.

So to elaborate- I felt this morning that I really need to get this crap with H over and done with. I imagine saying to him that I don't want a D, I don't agree with a D, but if he's having papers drawn up that's what he wants at the moment and if so lets get it done and move on. I'm not thinking I wouldn't consider an R in the future with him, but I just feel like between the IRS stuff, and my moms situation ( probably long term skilled nursing facility), I feel like this D is hanging over my head. And we haven't separated our accounts or bills or anything else yet. He rarely does something like he did with the PayPal thing so I haven't been in a rush to do it. But I just feel like Im being dragged down by this looming process.

I won't say or do anything yet- I'll sit with it a but first. I can always start working on transferring some bills and automatic payments into another account.

GAL tonight- office Christmas party- hope it will help my mood!!!


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
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Won't you be in a better position if you wait to do the divorce until he has a job? Would hate to see you stuck with paying him alimony on top of everything else.

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kml I hear you on that! This far he is not asking for alimony. He had said all along that he doesn't want it and the plan is to have his lawyer draw up the papers based on the terms we decide on.
Of course that could change at some point but I don't think he will go after it. He feels guilty and seems to want to prove he can make it without me. ( I think is job issues are big contributor to the MLC).

I haven't seen the papers yet so will see what it looks like....


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
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Soooo- apparently I am about to get into an epic D battle.
H sent me papers via email last night. He did request spousal support and said it was a result of " division of assets". It also has in there that we can't have alcohol when we have the kids ( me since he doesnt and has an issue when I do).
I lost my chit. I texted him that I'm sorry that he has an issue with alcohol and the kids seeing it and that his BJs, emotional affairs and financial irresponsibility are conveniently hidden from the kids.
He texted me back saying he wasn't trying to destroy me ( I mentioned that about the money he put on there for me to pay him plus the IRS chit) and that we will work it all out.
We will see- I told him if he goes down the road he has thus far- which is about the furthest from the " collaborative D" he said he wanted- than this is going to get ugly and expensive b/c I will fight him.


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
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daring,
I'm very sorry to hear this. Divorce from crisis people is never easy and it can be down right ugly. I'm not surprised he came back and wanted spousal support. Why should you be paying all of the IRS bs as well? Can I assume he was in the middle of that mess too? Then he's responsible for half of that if his name was on the tax papers.

I hope that you have a good lawyer who will fight for you and your kids because this man has been talking to someone and they've filled his head with sugar plums full of bs.

daring, divorce is ugly and you can't be friends w/them when you are discussing assets and division of property. Unfortunately, he is now the enemy and you will need to stand your ground and get tough. Get angry, let it out and keep your business hat on.

Good luck! Again, I am sorry to hear that he's going down this road.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
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Sorry to hear Daring,

As they say don't believe anything you hear in regards to MLCer.

Clearly he has a Lawyer who is advising him to go this route. It is amazing how easy a Lawyer can direct a MLCer to do just as your H is doing. They seem to need to be lead by anyone but you.

I would not email him anymore in regards to the divorce. I hope you have a lawyer and that he/she filed a counter claim with the court. If not, then do so now. Then I would have them file for temporary orders for child support, spousal support, etc. Go for broke. These need to be strong and in his face at this point to push him back on his a** and make him realize either work this out the reasonable way or the hard way. You have the upper hand if you respond immediately with a hard response. With 3 children at home you will have a commanding edge in this and his lawyer will line his pockets with your H's money while H looses.


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Job- thanks for the support. My business hat is most definitely on- I did push back hard on the financial pieces. As far as the IRS- he is responsible for half ( he created the d@mn mess!) but unfortunately if he can't pay it I'm still responsible for it. The D doesn't erase half of the debt for me. I don't want to risk defaulting on the payback so I'm making sure that I have it set aside.
I consulted a lawyer early on in this process but she was more for collaborative approaches. I'm going to retain a more aggressive one at this point.

LT- you are so right about these lawyers " leading" the MLCer. And since his empathy chip is currently broken he can't see the impact.
This is actually a draft that he was supposed to review and send back with his changes but he shared it with me for us to review.

He is backing up a bit now- he sent an email apologizing and the plan is to sit down this weekend and go through it and make changes.
I'm on guard though- as you said Job he is now the enemy and I am definitely angry. He can't afford to fight this out in court but I will not hesitate to go there if necessary.


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
Life is about daring greatly, about being in the arena- Brene Brown
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Job- thanks for the support. My business hat is most definitely on- I did push back hard on the financial pieces. As far as the IRS- he is responsible for half ( he created the d@mn mess!) but unfortunately if he can't pay it I'm still responsible for it. The D doesn't erase half of the debt for me. I don't want to risk defaulting on the payback so I'm making sure that I have it set aside.
I consulted a lawyer early on in this process but she was more for collaborative approaches. I'm going to retain a more aggressive one at this point.

LT- you are so right about these lawyers " leading" the MLCer. And since his empathy chip is currently broken he can't see the impact.
This is actually a draft that he was supposed to review and send back with his changes but he shared it with me for us to review.

He is backing up a bit now- he sent an email apologizing and the plan is to sit down this weekend and go through it and make changes.
I'm on guard though- as you said Job he is now the enemy and I am definitely angry. He can't afford to fight this out in court but I will not hesitate to go there if necessary.


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
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Daring, I’m so sorry it came to this. I can’t believe these MLCers. You have 3 kids at home and he is asking for spousal support. Is he not a capable man and cannot work to support himself? This is ridiculous, but not surprising with MLCer.

Find a good lawyer and don’t let your H take advantage of you. Good luck.


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Daring

I guess in the end we just never know what our MLC will do in the process of D or anything else.

Job wanted me to read your latest posts since Im thinking very seriously about filing for D myself, and to prepare me to not be naive and belive H will just go along with the D.

Thanks for sharing and it seems like you got you business hat on tight.

I guess I better get mine on if I do file.


Me 43 ring off Oct 2014 (my ring back on Feb 2015)
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Daring- I am so sorry you have to deal with H's erratic behavior. I agree that MLC breaks that empathy chip and lawyers can be ineffective because the MLCer iis so easily led. I am seeing that firsthand in my sitch.

I think you are right to stand firm. Stay strong and know many of us are sending you our support.


M:25 years at BD w/ 2 daughters
BD: 5/14
Separated 6/14 - H moved cross country w/OW
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“I can be changed by what happens to me. But I refuse to be reduced by it.”
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Thank you Bright, 2B and 123Gwen. I so much appreciate all of your support.
The man who is doing this is not the H I know- maybe he will come back eventually but I can't focus on that hope right now. Need to take care of me and kids.
I'm at lawyers office right now waiting to meet. Highly recommended firm by many people. I plan to draft a counter to his terms. And I'm prepared to go to court if I have to. H is freaking out a bit. He doesn't know I'm meeting with a lawyer but he definitely senses the shift in my interactions.

He sent me a 2 page text today which I will share because it shows just how messed up these MLCers are. He really is all over the place.

" I wanted to take a moment away from all of the mess and pain and focus on something important. You and I have accomplished an amazing amount of wonderful things in our lives. Looking backwards over time and focusing on the positives is something I wish I had done more of along the way because there are so many to think about.

Kids are an easy win. We spent most of our lives focused on them and it was worth it in so many ways. They are amazing. So intelligent, independent and caring - all of them (yes even Sean - watching him with Haley makes me so proud). The kids have a great model in us on how to treat people with respect, love, understanding. They will all go on and have successful deep relationships.

You have had the most incredible career imaginable. I am so in awe of everything you have accomplished. I respect the effort you have put it at every stage, every sacrifice, every bit of yourself you have poured into all of it. I am so thankful for the support you’ve given me over the years to allow me to try and find a career that is worthwhile. I’m not sure that I have found it yet but I am very appreciative of how amazing you have always been to all of us.

I am so proud of you and how many people’s lives you have touched. You have created something for everyone to strive towards, your kids, me, our friends, our family all the people you work with and all your patients and their families - we all see you giving all of yourself to help others. You are the perfect example of giving your heart to help other people.

Our relationship hasn’t always been “perfect” in whatever fantasy world people imagine love being perfect. It has been us figuring things out through incredible struggles along the way. You never “broke” you just keep fighting and figuring out new ways to get better, healthier and move forward. We’ve been through some darkness and have experienced some amazing highs together. Everything from the beginning of our relationship forward was the world pointed against us - being broke, in debt, stupid long hours, leaving us with crappy ways to communicate at times but you stuck through it all.

You deserve a love that you have offered at every step. I’m happy that we’ve been able to accomplish so much in very meaningful ways in our lives thus far. yes our relationship has evolved over time into something different but I am very much still in awe of the woman and the person that you are. I very much appreciate what you have brought into my life.

Thank you for being you."

He is clearly an alien!!


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
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Wow, that was from someone who has filed for D? Heck, it sounds like a Hallmark greeting card for happy anniversary. Believe me when I tell you, do not trust anything he agrees to until it's in writing and done. I made the mistake of giving in after W made promises and she just "forgot" what she had promised or "changed (her) mind" and, of course, she "can't help that she changed (her) mind" (yes, that was what she said. Like her mind is some separate thing that she has no control over!).

From what he wrote it sounds to me like he should be taking you on a trip around the world, not dumping his M! Use this as proof that he is just not in his right mind and remember that as your D progresses. Don't give an inch! Oh, by the way, in TX unless the S CAN'T make a living because of disability or illness or such, there is no S support. Doesn't matter if they have a job yet or not. If they are able to work, no support!

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daring,
That was a beautiful text and I agree w/Matt...he should be taking you around the world on a wonderful trip, not a divorce. He doesn't feel that he deserves you and he knows that he may not have been supportive 100% of the time, etc., and right now, he's depressed and feels the need to get this message out there and he does realize that you are a great person and deserve better than him. In a way, it reminds me of a good bye letter.

Stand firm, do not fold as he is not the man you married. Make sure that whatever he agrees to is signed and dated. They will say and/or promise one thing today and tomorrow it's a different story.

Take care.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
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Matt and Job- it really all is unbelievable!

Matt- thanks for your advice- as much as I love him and don't want a D, I can't let him walk all over me and I know that. I will make sure all is in writing. I have a good, strong lawyer who has worked with his many times- so he knows her. He already have me a counter proposal in the hour I met with him. I learned about the spousal support yesterday- thank God b/c I can't afford that even with my decent salary if I'm paying a huge chunk to the IRS and 90% of kids expenses.
And strangely it was our anniversary yesterday- 21 years-maybe he got hit in the head and remembered good stuff for a bit wink

Job- you are so right. He as always felt a little bit that he didn't deserve me. And I think he is feeling very guilty. It was hard because I think those words are sincere but it makes no sense to feel that way and not want to try and work it out. He is not the man I married.
I won't fold- I have a very fair counter offer and if he doesn't want to accept it we will leave it to the lawyers to battle it out. I know he wanted to do this without too much lawyer involvement so he doesn't want that- but he went down that road and he has to face his own consequences....

I'm trying to take care of me as best I can- this just really, really hurts.


Me 41 H 40
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S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
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Well 3 1/2 hrs later we have an agreement that we are both ok with.
H pushed a little on a few things and I stood firm. It seemed to be more related to his concern about the amount he still owed to creditors. One of our debts turned out to be much larger than expected and that freaked him out a bit- but I wouldn't let him shift the assignment of the debt. So in the end I took 2/3 of the debt but I am also keeping the house and all that's in it. I also am giving him a portion of my 401K. We splt the kids expenses in a fair manner based on ability to pay them. No spousal support. There were some tense moments and there were some funny moments.
He apologized extensively for how everything came across and admitted that he hadn't really combed through the agreement before sending. He asked if I had questions about the clauses that were initially upsetting and said he wanted us to talk it through now because he doesn't want any negativity between us going forward. I found that to be interesting- it's like he is trying to wipe the slate clean.
He acknowledged the many mistakes he had made in the relationship. He talked about seeking attention elsewhere when he shouldn't have, pulling back when he should have reached out, and how it's humbling to have to go back and work for someone and acknowledge he can't do his own thing right now. He said he's ready to grow in that way though. When I mentioned he seemed to focus in on my flaws and mistakes, he said that was one reason he wanted to send that text yesterday- to get back to focusing on the positives about me.
He said I know you may hate me or not want to, but I still am here and willing to listen and help you. He wants the opportunity to be close going forward. I told him I have no idea what I can do going forward.

Today I saw the H I know in many ways. We hugged at the end of it- a very emotional hug. Then he was cradling my face and started to say something but didn't. I saw love in his eyes like in the beginning of our relationship. I also saw raw pain. I told him thank you for meeting with me. Then he left.

Assessment:
1. I stayed strong and didn't give in on any of my major issues. We were both flexible where it made sense.
2. There is still a lot of love there but he is a broken man right now. There may or may not be a future for us. I will move forward with my life but will not close the door completely.
3. This hurts like he!! but I will be ok.

Thanks to all of you for all of your support, sharing of advice and for being a part of this amazing forum!


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
Life is about daring greatly, about being in the arena- Brene Brown
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Daring,

Glad you were able to come to an agreement. Stay focused on you and your kids. You will be even better than you are now:-)



3 kids
BD 12/15/13 (IDKIILY. )
Rope dropped Cirque du Soleil style
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I'm glad you were able to come to a reasonable agreement. I just hope he sticks to it and doesn't allow a lawyer to change his mind.

How are you doing now that you've gotten this under control, so to speak? I know it's difficult to look at them and see the person you once knew and yet they aren't the same people because they are truly broken. Maybe he'll grow up and be a far better man, more mature and responsible than before. At least we can hope for that, can't we?

Please find some time to take care of yourself this weekend. I know you are worried about your mother and have a lot on your plate, but please, be pamper yourself just a wee bit. Okay?


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
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Daring, I’m glad that this part of the process is over, for now. I think this would be the most difficult part for me. You did great. It does seem like he is confused and thinks that the D will make him feel better. He will be surprised that this is not the case. Look at Mighty’s sitch and how the things turned around.

Don’t be discouraged. I have a lot of hope for you. Yes, there is still a lot of love there, you just need to be patient and let your H to figure himself out.

I can feel that hurt. Hang in there.


M:50
H:52
S28 (my S from previous marriage)
M:17 + 3
BD: 06/12
S: 06/12 - H works in another state
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Georgiabelle- thanks- I sure hope I will be better!

Job- I'm glad too. He seems more worried that I'm going to change my mind about the agreement. I think my initial response freaked him out and his response demonstrated it's very important to him to move forward without negativity. I was very clear though- I told him I didn't trust him one bit right now and everything needs to be in writing and very clear.
I hope he can become that man too- I'm a glass half full kind of person, sometimes to a fault- but there is still a lot of potential in him.

How do I feel- hmmmm. It's a mixture of relief, numbness, sadness, disbelief, and still with some hope but for a new chapter that may or may not include him.

I do need to take some me time for sure! Right now I am in the pedicure chair smile


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
Life is about daring greatly, about being in the arena- Brene Brown
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Bright I missed your post- thank you for the encouragement! This part is definitely hard- I wasn't sure if I could get through it and I had some angry moments. He would say " ok, what's inportant is we both go forth from this without resentment or anger as much as possible. Let's stop and regroup".
You are stronger than you think you are Bright- we all are!


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
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Daring,

Classy and gracious are the top two words that come to mind. It's good to hear that in the end you are able to see the bigger picture. Not shutting the door completely but moving forward on your own is so much easier said than done. You are doing it and that is huge! I hope I can be you someday.


M:25 years at BD w/ 2 daughters
BD: 5/14
Separated 6/14 - H moved cross country w/OW
D Final 9/17

“I can be changed by what happens to me. But I refuse to be reduced by it.”
― Maya Angelou



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123Gwen thank you for your words. I'm glad I can provide some inspiration as I'm not feeling very inspirational!
It's still not what I want, but it's not my choice. So I'm trying to make the best of it.
Today we all went to see S19's girlfriend in the Nutcracker. She is a ballet dancer and very talented. H drove and things were cordial. But I found myself being annoyed that I was around him. He wasn't doing anything at all I was just grumpy. I tried to keep it in check and make the best of it.

One other interesting tidbit- I think I mentioned on here that H's siblings and mom are renting cabins in NC right after Christmas for a family get together and ski trip. After some back and forth a few months ago H decided he wanted me to go.
Well..... Now he's not going. Says he can't deal with his family. I asked if it was because he thought they were upset about our situation or if it was because he was trying to work through old wounds. He said " I don't know, I just can't deal
With them right now, I have nothing left".
So I am going with the 3 younger kids. I'm looking forward to it- I love all of them and they are excited to see me and kids too.


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
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Originally Posted By: daring

So I am going with the 3 younger kids. I'm looking forward to it- I love all of them and they are excited to see me and kids too.


Good for you! I'm so happy to hear this. Let H spin and figure his stuff out. Continue to enjoy your life and your family!

Originally Posted By: daring
It's still not what I want, but it's not my choice. So I'm trying to make the best of it.


^^^THIS! You got this, daring.


M: A really long time.
Crisis: 5 years.
She's still worth it.

Life is never made unbearable by circumstances, but only by lack of meaning and purpose. -Viktor Frankl
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I agree w/FY....go and have some fun and leave your h at home spinning. It' his loss.

I think you've got a very good attitude about your situation and you are right...it's not what you want, but it's a choice he's made and you are making the best of it. Daring, you will be okay once things settle down. I know that right now w/your mom, the IRS hearing, the divorce papers and the holidays everything feels like it's piling up on you, but come January, things will settle down a bit and you'll feel a little better and you will find your footing once again.

Hang in there!


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
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Job is always there with great advice. smile The new year does have a way of stabilizing one's foothold. Enjoy your holiday! It sounds as if you've got some great plans.


M:25 years at BD w/ 2 daughters
BD: 5/14
Separated 6/14 - H moved cross country w/OW
D Final 9/17

“I can be changed by what happens to me. But I refuse to be reduced by it.”
― Maya Angelou



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I am obviously not getting any work done today but WTH.

I feel like my WAW wife wants me to play nice and carry on like it was before. She wants me to call her when I am sick, make pick up's and delivery's (kid things), just carry on like we are one big happy family.

Am I wrong for not wanting to play along? I am doing my best to ignore her and GAL without her. When she calls, o speak to the kids it's all happiness and light cheerios.

I can't even talk to her, I just give the phone to the S9 or D6 and let them talk. When we do pick up or drop off, I can barely look at her. Should I make an effort to talk to her when she calls? I honestly don't feel like it but is it in the best intersts of my kids? Am I short changing them if I cut my WAW out like a cancer?

I tell you, it hurts my friends. I seriously don't think I will ever get over being betrayed like this. If I only knew this is what marriage was, I would not have done it. Seriously blows. I will STFU now.


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Originally Posted By: NAJ1964
I tell you, it hurts my friends. I seriously don't think I will ever get over being betrayed like this. If I only knew this is what marriage was, I would not have done it. Seriously blows. I will STFU now.


((((NAJ1964))))

first up, we know we really do. over the last few months i've felt a level of emptiness and pain that i didnt even know existed. I've always been someone who cant focus but right now i cant think of anything else. So I/we understand your pain - I wish i could make it go away for you

Yes, you will get over the betrayal beacuse you'll decide you will and because not do so is going to keep you in your pain. people overcome pretty much anything they jsut have to decided thats what they are going to do and then put in the hard graft to make it happen. Not easy, not quick but worth it

This isnt what marriage is.

this is what betrayal and hurt and heartbreak is. Marriage is two people who love each other, who want to share their lives with each other, who make each other happy and work together to overcome lifes obstacles and challenges. Marriage is what you get when both people make their promises to each other, work at those promises and always honour those promises - when both people do that marriage is a beautiful and amazing thing, but its also a big risk and both people need to take that risk together in order to make it succeed. If you dont take the risk you'll never experience the joy. Me, I hate this, but it makes me value real marriage more than i ever realised.

You'll be ok, and when you dont feel it act like it anyway

((((NAJ1964))))

On the more practical side I think there is definitely some scope for defining your boundaries but there are people way wiser than I on that one


Both mid 30s, 2 young kids
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Jan, Jan...JAN,

It's confusing when you start so many threads that it is hard to follow you or keep up with your storyline. Your other thread only has 30 posts...it hasn't reached its 100 threshold mark. Can you please stick to that other thread of yours?

I am going to bring your comments over to your OTHER thread so we can continue there.


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Wonka - thanks for the reminder about the threads...... learning this thread thing slowly......yikes!


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To find your thread, you need to go to the Newcomers forum and scroll down the list until you locate your own thread. Then you can hit the 'reply' push button to compose your posts/responses.

I'm going to top replying here. Will do in your other thread. cool

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I feel for you, it's crazy how many people are out there that actually know what marriage means and how many hearts get broken every single day.
I actually started to wonder if it's even worth fighting for someone who completely ripped your heart apart after promising you to work through everything that will be in the way.
I'm not religious but nothing is more holy than a marriage and the things that grow out of it (even if it fails) seem to be tremendous. Marriage gets you to a different level of understanding and wisdom.
But when sht goes wrong the pain is indescribably big. Why can't people just be honest with another, communicate, open their hearts and let gods love in...I'm
Not even religious but experiencing true love, commitment and marriage triggered something inside of me frown


Me 32 (German) Wife 28
T 3yrs M 2yrs
Moved to US for W
No kids
BD 6/2014
In house separation
Confirmed EA 1/2015
(ongoing since BD)
OM not ready
Real D talk started 1/27/15


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Thanks FY- I've missed you! Hope the holidays are good to you and W.

Job- you are so right, I feel like the weight of the world is on me sometimes. But I can only do so much so I'm taking one day at a time.
The moving out of my mom's apt is stressing me but I'm just going to have to hire people and stick it in storage as I don't have time to go through it right now.
Stuff isn't important- just people!

123Gwen- I so agree. Not sure if you saw my comment several posts back but whenever Job posts I feel like my big sister just picked me up in a warm hug and I know all will be ok eventually 😊

I'm off to do some praying- not for a specific outcome- just for strength. Some moments hit me that I must be in the Twilight Zone as my H would never, ever do all of this. Yet here I am. So I'm focusing on the fact that there must be a bigger purpose.


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
Life is about daring greatly, about being in the arena- Brene Brown
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So today my lawyer called as he reviewed our proposed agreement and thinks I am taking on too much of the debt still. One is a foreclosure from a home we had several years back that we tried to do a short sale and it fell through. H had hired a lawyer and was working on it but somewhere in the midst of him starting into MLC he let it lapse. And I wasn't paying close enough attention as I was working so much- it was already foreclosed before I could do something.
The interesting piece is that it's in his name only b/c I had too many school loans to be on the mortgage. My lawyer thinks I should give him the majority if not all of the debt. He's also worried if some is assigned to me they could come after me while I'm still paying IRS ( 2yrs).
So here's my issue- I'm taking the whole IRS debt- but mainly b/c I know I will pay it and that way it's under my control and gets done right. The mortgage I split 50/50 with him as far as liability. No my name wasn't on it but we bought it as a couple. Part of me gets really pi$&ed off about taking on such a large portion of the debt and then part of me thinks it's the tight thing to do as we bought it together and he doesn't gave the means to pay it back but I will after IRS.
I texted him to let him know the concerns and at first he said we should leave it as is, then said lets work on whatever is the best to be sure we can take care of kids and try to rebuild our own finances. I told him once I got more info from a foreclosure attorney in that state ( FL) we could talk more.
I contacted an attorney to see if there is any way to reduce the debt as they are holding us responsible for the full paid price plus interest and the house isn't even worth half that ( we bought during bubble and were moving during the real estate crash).
So I'm still not sure what I thinkif it all. He could have called an attorney like I did today and started working on this month's ago. But he is also an MLCer with the responsibility and concentration level of a 12 yr old. So I'm trying to just take care of it and if I can reduce the debt than we can talk about how we will split it.

So one little funny- H has the kids and posted on his FB that he was calling a Santa line where one could put people on naughty or nice list. He had it on speaker and pressed naughty list ( teasing the kids) and the second they asked for a name S8 shouts out his name. Haha he has no idea- thankfully!


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
Life is about daring greatly, about being in the arena- Brene Brown
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daring,
I have to agree w/your lawyer, i.e., you are taking on entirely too much of the debt. I realize that you and your h bought the foreclosed home as a couple, but because it's in h's name, he should be responsible for it. You do not need to have your good name and financial reputation put in jeopardy, i.e., w/additional debt and not knowing what will come next.

So, the house is foreclosed, have they set a date yet to auction it off?

Daring, I commend you for trying to take on all of this debt, including the IRS repayment, but your salary will only go so far. Your h, even in MLC, needs to be responsible for that house. It's a good lesson for him to learn and face the consequences of his actions. BTW, of course, he wants things to stay the same...he wants no responsibility right now...but you've got to think about yourself and your children. Listen to your lawyer w/your business hat on and not w/your heart.

Merry Christmas! I hope that you and your family have a nice holiday.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
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Thanks Job- I'm very torn but I think my lawyer and you are right.
There was a date set for auction but it's confusing- seems like another mortgage company purchased it rather than being auctioned. And once I called and made H call to inquire the data we received is very different than what H was saying ( he already changed the amount owed twice by looking at his credit report but not calling anyone).
So what I have decided is I'm not signing chit as far as a D agreement until I understand better what this debt means. I know that will make him mad but he didn't even have the due diligence to be sure what he's putting on the spreadsheet is correct. So this D may just sit until we have the info.

The attorney I contacted will be calling me Monday and will be able to look all the documents up. If I am at risk in any way I'll take some on and pay it but if not I won't b/c I am essentially the sole provider for the children. ( he's contributing what he is able but tuitions and activities he can't afford so I'm doing that).

What I may offer depending on what it looks like is to contract with a lawyer and pay the legal fees to get it reduced or erased based on the bank and mortgage companies' shady practices ( he can't afford a lawyer so that's why I would do it). And then whatever it's negotiated down to is his to pay. I think that's a very fair way to do it.

He seems to be spinning even more. Grumpy, impatient, stressed out. He hates dealing with money stuff- prefers to pretend it will go away. So it could be partially that or who knows what else.
I'll keep taking care of me!


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
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Listen to the legal eagles when it comes to debt, etc. They know what to look for in the documents and make sure he speaks in plain English so that you understand.

I know you want to help him out of this jam and get things paid down, but, again, listen to your lawyer...you do not want to take on all of debt. After all, if you take it on, what will your h do? There comes a time that he needs to face the consequences of his actions and w/a divorce pending, you do not need to be his mother or rescuer in all things. True, he's not working, but he needs to step it up and find something, whether it's a clerk at Home Depot or flipping burgers at McDonalds. He needs to be contributing to some of this debt.

Of course he's spinning...he didn't get what he wanted and you are questioning things. He was hoping you would continue on being the responsible daring and do what he suggested, i.e., just go with what he suggested. The holidays have him in a dither too, but that's not your problem. Remember, you didn't break him, therefore you can't fix him.

Protect yourself and definitely ask your lawyer to explain things to you so that you can truly understand what he's saying. Ask questions if you don't understand.

Now, it's time for you and your family to have a nice Christmas. I hope your mother is doing better and you can visit w/her and enjoy a little special time w/her.

Merry Christmas!


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Well I declare Christmas a win. We did it all together at my house as planned. H came over last night for dinner and to help get presents ready. We had split the buying and it worked out well.
H came over this morning for present opening. He was truly enjoying watching the kids and their joy- especially S8 as he still believes in Santa wink We had decided not to give gifts to each other but he got me a couple really nice things " from the kids". I felt bad as I didn't do that- just helped the kids pick out their presents for him but didn't get extra.
I have the darn flu ( probably more susceptible b/c of all the stress), so H cooked dinner today and helped clean everything up. He wasn't irritated about it or moody. I even passed out after dinner for a nap and he helped kids pack for our trip.

I texted him when I woke up to say thanks for all his help, Merry Christmas, and that I would send pics of our trip. He texted about an hour later saying thank you for letting him be a part of it.

It's really sad he's not going on this trip- he is the oldest of 5 and they are all going along with their kids. His mom and grandma will also be there. I know he is really messed up b/c he adores his siblings and would never do this when not an MLC alien.

So as for me, I'm doing pretty well. I had a couple sad moments, almost nostalgic, when opening presents. But I know that all of this is out of my control and I'm not the cause of his crisis. And I'm not having the desperate, sad feelings I used to have when I see him. We are in the middle of a D that looks like it's going through- and I will be fine no matter what. His loss!
Merry Christmas everyone!


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
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I'm happy to read that Christmas was a winner, but I'm sorry to read that you have the flu. The stress you've been under compromised your immune system and bam! That old flu bug moved right in. I do hope you are feeling better soon.

Daring, your h took away many wonderful memories to reflect back on in the days to come. He does miss his family, but he's just not ready to face his issues and deal w/them.

Travel safely and enjoy your time away.


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Merry Christmas Daring. As a newbie I wish I could offer you more than a hug. It does sound like wise Job is spot on. H has come a long way but until he faces some of his internal issues he can't bring you and the kids 100%. I think that is part of why he can't spend vacation with his FOO. You can't completely hide yourself from siblings. He does seem to have made great progress trying to reflect on things so he can move forward. It sounds to me like he is working on trying to rebuild himself right now and that is really admirable. It will also take some time.

I think is a lot of progress to move from indignation and hopelessness to a place of calmness and hopefulness. I think you are all poised for a new year full of positive possibilities. I hope you feel better soon.


M:25 years at BD w/ 2 daughters
BD: 5/14
Separated 6/14 - H moved cross country w/OW
D Final 9/17

“I can be changed by what happens to me. But I refuse to be reduced by it.”
― Maya Angelou



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Daring .. honestly I see where you are coming from .. you are fair .. beyond fair. However I do think your H needs to hold his end of the bag regardless .. I do think there is a line that the lawyers draw and what we wo0uld draw .. maybe find some middle ground there .. you really could hose the guy over .. but I get you not wanting to be that person .. I am the same .. I pay much more right now than I know the state would have me pay, however if the D is going to go through .. then I will have to protect myself and my S's best interest ... just as you will have to do. Sometimes its tough when what your heart says conflicts with the pocketbook/lawyers.


M: 48
W: 47
M16 T26-S8
BD Sept13



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Job, 123Gwen and CaliGuy- thanks for your well wishes and support.

I just got back from my trip and took a break from the boards or reading any self help or relationship books while on it. I read some romance novels by Danielle Steele whom I used to love but haven't read in 15 years! I focused on family and " being in the moment" and had a wonderful time!! I love all my in laws and all of H's four siblings and their kids/spouses plus mom and stepdad were all there. We went snow tubing and did family style meals in the cabins, played with all our kids and did a family gift exchange. It was so fun and I felt fully included- of course I've grown up with all of them so they really are my family too. All the cousins played together and even my S17 ( b-day yesterday) decided to forgo snowboarding in order to spend more time with family. I was very proud of him.
I posted lots of pics on my FB and H " liked" them all ( he liked his siblings' pics too). I wonder if he started to realize how much he was missing.

As far as me- I'm feeling pretty ok. This trip actually lifted my spirits and my father-in-law ( H's stepdad) even pulled me aside to say he understands what H is dealing with but eventually he can't run away from himself and he will have to realize that he can't " fill the hole" he's looking to fill with anything other than facing his issues. Spoken from experience it sounds like- I know my FIL has had lots of emotional issues in his life and has come to a place of peace.

So H texted a few times while we were away and I only answered things that were logistics for kids. S8 face timed him a few times and would try to hand me the phone and I would hand it off to my other kids. I was in " no H " mode. Weird since I was with his family but even they just went along without mentioning him. I think they were hurt he didn't come.
So today he texted and called to see if we made it in. I was distant but cordial- maybe it's my imagination but the more I'm getting to the point where I'm letting go the more he seems to " check in" with me.
Who knows- I'm not looking for those positive signs anymore, in fact, I'm more expecting the worst and if it's not as bad I'll be in a position to decide what I want.

Will catch up on everyone over the next couple of days. I'm sure I've missed a lot.

Here's to a Happy New Year and a marvelous 2015 for all of us!!


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
Life is about daring greatly, about being in the arena- Brene Brown
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Posts: 28,295
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job Offline
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I'm so glad to read that you had a nice time away. Danielle Steele is one of my favorites as well. She writes about what is happening in the real world and I often wonder if she or someone she knows has gone through many of the experiences she writes about.

Sounds like your FIL may have either experienced a MLC or knew someone who had. He is a wise man. Your h can't keep running and trying to find a cure to repair the hole within himself.

As for your h, yes, he senses you are distant and will check in more. But, I'm glad he texted to see if you made it in okay.

The new year is right around the corner and I hope that it will bring you much peace this year.

Happy New Year!


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 394
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Thanks Job- when someone asked me what I wanted for the New Year that's exactly what I said- peace!!

H came by earlier today to switch back cars ( he had let me borrow his to and from airport since it has more room). He hung out and chatted for a little bit. We decided the schedule for kids over next week and a half since I start call soon. Then he left. I think he noticed I was a little distant.

I took D13 to her NYE sleepover and S17 is going to one also. I'm hanging with S8 and we have been playing board games and watching Times Square coverage.
As I'm hanging out with him I get an out of the blue text from H " happy new year Daring", he only uses my name in texts when he's trying to convey emotion. Weird.
So I waited an hour and kept playing with S8 ( yay me! Usually I would respond right away). And I sent " happy new year to you too".
Maybe he's realizing I am the prize... Hope he catches up with me before I leave him in the dust!! wink


Me 41 H 40
M 20 T 23
S 19,16, 8 D 13
BD1 dec 2012 not sure going to work
BD2 sep 2013 seeking a D
Filed oct 2013, D Feb 2015
Life is about daring greatly, about being in the arena- Brene Brown
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