Busting this Divorce - Separating

[Starsky309]

Texting from W continued a little. She texted where she is in the city she's working in today in case of emergency she said. She has never done that before.

Almost immediately after she texts... "I hope you are feeling OK. I know this is a really awful time. I am so sorry."

. . . I do not respond to either.

I know how to act living with W while she's in her A. Friendly neighbor. Polite. Upbeat. . . .

So you would really just completely ignore a polite, even positive text message from a neighbor? That's being "polite?" Really??


Starsky

[HPoirot]

Do you and W each have your own car or share only one family car?

Here's a question that I want you to ponder and take time in answering.

-What kind of person do you want be to W when she returns? (And how does that line up with your own core values?)

We share a family car. It's needed because we drive an hour round trip to pick up S11 in the afternoon. We split that duty depending on work schedules. I usually drive her to work when schedule requires it but she can also easily take the bus or walk. We live in the North East so winter.

What kind of person do I want to be when she gets here? A happy, alive, self-respecting, centered man with interesting things to do and a sunny life to look forward to. That's the man I really want to be in general. Some of my core values are to be fun-loving, passionate, respectful, fit, loving, and respected.

[HPoirot]

Just so I'm clear on the GOAL here, why are you ignoring her texts (which not replying to them, is)?

Remember to act in accordance with your goals, and NOT in accordance with how you feel at a given moment.

Okay?

Texting from W continued a little. She texted where she is in the city she's working in today in case of emergency she said. She has never done that before.

Almost immediately after she texts... "I hope you are feeling OK. I know this is a really awful time. I am so sorry."

. . . I do not respond to either.

I know how to act living with W while she's in her A. Friendly neighbor. Polite. Upbeat. . . .

So you would really just completely ignore a polite, even positive text message from a neighbor? That's being "polite?" Really??


Starsky

Hello 25 and Starsky. Today's ignoring texts was a holdover from the text I sent yesterday saying "let's hold off on anymore texting until you get back home." (from her trip). She said she would send no more texts. The initial ignoring texts was after I told her my OM boundary b/c she was peppering me with questions and to make sure I didn't say anything stupid b/c I was angry and a little drunk GALing.

Even so, yes I see it's not polite to ignore her especially if she is reaching out. But, after the last 3 days, shouldn't I be communicating with her less? I just told her I'm not going to last long nor go to MC in an open marriage and her response was to say she's sorry for being disrespectful and lying to me, saying again she thinks we should separate, and then to move out of our bedroom to the couch. (And then suggest we could still go to counseling while separated.)

I really do not want to punish her and I am aware my first reaction is to do just that. I just want to do what works in regards to interactions with her.

[Starsky309]

Today's ignoring texts was a holdover from the text I sent yesterday saying "let's hold off on anymore texting until you get back home." (from her trip). She said she would send no more texts. The initial ignoring texts was after I told her my OM boundary b/c she was peppering me with questions and to make sure I didn't say anything stupid b/c I was angry and a little drunk GALing.

Oh, OK -- fair enough.

[HPoirot]

And thank you so much Wonka for this excellent rundown of the last 3 days. It is very educational for me to see and I hope it helps others. This is my life now.

Ok. Time to prepare for the next step in your journey.

First of all, keep the LL's in your back pocket for the time being. Now is not the time to use them while W is in a full-blown A with the OM.

Let's review what transpired over the last few days.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
W: Now she texts... "Would you still like to go to counseling?"

HP: Ok sent this text... "W... I have decided there will be no counseling as long as you're still in contact with OM. As I said before, I'm not willing to continue to live in an open marriage. I am willing to go to counseling with you if you've broken ALL ties with OM. We have some decisions to make here."

HP & W Exchange: Then she came upstairs into our room where I was working. She asks... "Can you give me a ride to the airport or should I call a cab."

I say politely, "Better call a cab." I always drive her to the airport.

W: So she texts me... "This is not about him. I think you know that. At any rate, I think separating is best... as I have said all along. So yes we have decisions to make. When I get back maybe we can sit down and talk?"

HP: If you want to separate, I will not stand in your way. Sure, we can talk when you get back here.


W: Now I'm here with her text response... "Separating doesn't mean we don't work together or go to counseling."

HP: Thank you for sharing your thoughts. I think it's best to hold off on texting until you get back and then we can discuss some of the issues you raised. You are correct that our focus needs to be on our son. Again, thanks.

HP & W Exchange: She called earlier. I did not answer. She texted me to have S11 call her. I did.

Now, she just texted me "how is S11?" I didn't answer immediately.

She texts "Can you please just let me know?"

I say ... "Good. Eating stew. Subdued but not sad."

She texts back a note about his meds and "Thanks for replying. I will not text again."

HP & W Exchange: Texting from W continued a little. She texted where she is in the city she's working in today in case of emergency she said. She has never done that before.

Almost immediately after she texts... "I hope you are feeling OK. I know this is a really awful time. I am so sorry."

Noted my very negative feelings on that last text.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
What were the negative feelings on the last text? Could you please post it here so we can help you better?

[Wonka]

Do you and W each have your own car or share only one family car?

Here's a question that I want you to ponder and take time in answering.

-What kind of person do you want be to W when she returns? (And how does that line up with your own core values?)

We share a family car. It's needed because we drive an hour round trip to pick up S11 in the afternoon. We split that duty depending on work schedules. I usually drive her to work when schedule requires it but she can also easily take the bus or walk. We live in the North East so winter.

What kind of person do I want to be when she gets here? A happy, alive, self-respecting, centered man with interesting things to do and a sunny life to look forward to. That's the man I really want to be in general. Some of my core values are to be fun-loving, passionate, respectful, fit, loving, and respected.

I think I was not clear what I really meant by asking you that question. What I really meant was what will your actions be once W returns back after the latest string of texts? What I am referring to is the immediacy of your interactions once W touches down for she WILL bring up the counseling issue and separation as the "better" option in her mind.

In other words, what are your plans?

[HPoirot]

I think I was not clear what I really meant by asking you that question. What I really meant was what will your actions be once W returns back after the latest string of texts? What I am referring to is the immediacy of your interactions once W touches down for she WILL bring up the counseling issue and separation as the "better" option in her mind.

In other words, what are your plans?

I plan on being calm, friendly, and welcoming like a polite neighbor. I plan on being open to when W wants to say what she needs to say. I plan on validating what she says without agreeing. I plan on saying "thank you for sharing. you've given me a lot to think about. Let me get back to you on that." On any questions that she wants answered.

Is there anything I can add or change?

[HPoirot]

I saw Rzrback had an epiphany today. Maybe I had one too...

I came here to save my marriage. Reading a lot of the sitches here, I saw many talking about fog and PEAs and addiction when talking about the A. I first thought this was a convenient way to frame this... like your WAS is ill so that makes your pain easier... easier to feel compassion for your WAS. I rejected that... I felt my W is to blame for her wrongness. She is killing me and I took it personally. And then everything I've done since happened. Now I have to climb out of a hole to get back to re-connecting with her again.

But, I had an affair. I know what it's like to feel trapped and depressed and cold and lonely and sad in your life. And then, the next minute, like a bolt of lightning hits you and the world completely changes. Words on your mobile phone make your head swim. To hear someone's voice is the only thing you can think about. And then to see the person.

My W spent everyday for the last 8 years stressed out about bills, her son's ADD, expensive tuition, expensive rent, no money, back taxes, her mother's illness, her stepfather's strokes, her larger family problems, her job, her student loans, a dying and smelly cat, a house constantly in need of cleaning, her growing dependence on alcohol, her failing back and legs, her age, her fading dreams, self centered friends... and a depressed good man of a husband who seemed to settle for status quo. Trapped and depressed and cold and lonely and sad in her life.

I have not really tried to look at this from W's point of view. With all the above burdens and more crushing her spirit... another man came and gave her attention. She can leave behind all of the above through him. To her, I am all of the above that she runs from. I'm making that view of me worse by fighting, avoiding, and being angry.

So, framing is a good thing. It can make something impossible look possible by just trying to understand and changing your attitude. When I first thought of this in the car... I felt at peace for a few minutes. Maybe, when my W gets back, I can be the better me who understands the above and can be sympathetic and patient. My W is going through a hard hard time. She is sick with all the pressure on her. At the same time, there is joy that she can't deny. Can I put aside my needs for months if needed to smooth the road home whenever she's ready to take it if ever? Because, for almost 20 years this woman has been my best friend. She has carried me in my sadness for 8 years. She sent me to see another woman to help me feel better and I came back. Can I be strong enough now, to step back and let her find her way back too?

I've taken this all so personally so far. This is not about me. This is about her. I can love and support her by being a strong enough man to put his needs aside for a while and just make a better place for her (and me) to land.

This is what I learned.

[Wonka]

Alrighty, HP. Here is the thing. I don't think you've really thought out some potential scenarios after W returns back home so I am going to ask you some questions to get you to think some more.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

W: So she texts me... "This is not about him. I think you know that. At any rate, I think separating is best... as I have said all along. So yes we have decisions to make. When I get back maybe we can sit down and talk?"

Let's say that she brings this up again and says that the OM has nothing to do with the separation. Separation is the route to go. What would you say to this?


HP: If you want to separate, I will not stand in your way. Sure, we can talk when you get back here.

W: Now I'm here with her text response... "Separating doesn't mean we don't work together or go to counseling."

Trust me. She will push this HARD. What would be your response to this?

HP: Thank you for sharing your thoughts. I think it's best to hold off on texting until you get back and then we can discuss some of the issues you raised. You are correct that our focus needs to be on our son. Again, thanks.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I would caution you to be very aware that W might throw in EVERYTHING in the discussion to distract you from the real issue at hand: There's the OM in the living room as a pgymy pink-spotted elephant.

What are your lines in the sand, HP? What are some of your non-negotiables?

[HPoirot]

Alrighty, HP. Here is the thing. I don't think you've really thought out some potential scenarios after W returns back home so I am going to ask you some questions to get you to think some more.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

W: So she texts me... "This is not about him. I think you know that. At any rate, I think separating is best... as I have said all along. So yes we have decisions to make. When I get back maybe we can sit down and talk?"

Let's say that she brings this up again and says that the OM has nothing to do with the separation. Separation is the route to go. What would you say to this?


HP: If you want to separate, I will not stand in your way. Sure, we can talk when you get back here.

W: Now I'm here with her text response... "Separating doesn't mean we don't work together or go to counseling."

Trust me. She will push this HARD. What would be your response to this?

HP: Thank you for sharing your thoughts. I think it's best to hold off on texting until you get back and then we can discuss some of the issues you raised. You are correct that our focus needs to be on our son. Again, thanks.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I would caution you to be very aware that W might throw in EVERYTHING in the discussion to distract you from the real issue at hand: There's the OM in the living room as a pgymy pink-spotted elephant.

What are your lines in the sand, HP? What are some of your non-negotiables?

I've told her...

I don't want a separation but won't stand in her way.
I won't last long in an open marriage.
Our friendship is over and I will divorce her if she continues in an A.
I will co-parent and be civil but not a friend if she continues in an A.
If she cuts off all contact I will go to MC.

So I do what I say. Fine if she separates... but she understands if she continues the A I'm only communicating on finances and S11. There will be no working together on her project and no counseling. We will not be friends. There will be no R talks or nice get togethers. She will pay for her own stuff and have no access to my paycheck. And, for me, I will file for divorce on my schedule when I'm financially set and done trying.

I also see that what I just said doesn't quite match with the flowery love letter I wrote in my last post.