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#2499033 10/21/14 01:21 PM
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essjay Offline OP
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Second Thread

First one here
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2480640&page=1

So after around two weeks away W returned home last night.
As I reported on previous thread I don't know where she went or who she was with apart from the this last weekend where I know she went to see her M and family.

Only development to report is that on her return she has moved to sleep in the spare bedroom from now on, in an effort to help me she said.
Things are pretty much the same between us, still pretty cold towards me.


Ages: Me 58 Wife 50
Together: 27 years M25
D24 D21
Bomb Droppped 21 June 2014
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Yea man,

Tough times, tough times...hang in there - you will get through it.


W-43 H-41 M-19 T-21
Kids S-15 D-13 S-11
OM/EA/PA suspected 7/4/14
Talk of Seperation 7/5/14
Slept in same bed, held each other nightly until 2/1/15
W moved out 2/1/15
I am moving on
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Jay,

The WAS act cold for two-fold reasons:

-Not to give you any false hope
-As a way of distancing themselves emotionally from the LBS

It is all on them. Try not to take it personally....I know, I know. Easier said than done.

How are you doing? Your daughters?

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Jay, I also agree with Wonka's comments on your last topic page. It doesn't matter whether you W was with a woman or a man. She is having an affair.
This is something that I made myself aware of way back in the beginning of my sitch.
My W was/is having an affair, and the family are the ones who make the choice to either accept it or condone it.
If the family want to accept what the W is/was doing, then that is there call. They can live with it.
I bet the family is struggling dealing with the W when at family events, but I am sure it would be the same if she turned up with a man instead of a woman.
Two years down the track my W is still acting cold. She didn't want to work together for our son's 21st party, and when his fiancee walked away from him, the W chose not to tell me at all.
I don't or try not to in most cases, accept it personally. Sometimes I simply feel she is embarrassed with what she has done, simply cannot face up to it, or accept what she has done.
Like all LBS's, I hope things turn out the best for you, but you have to do the work, DB work.


ME:51 W:46
M:25
S:22, S:20
Divorced 16/9/15
BD 10/12
W left 12/12 with OW, affair confirmed Nov/12.
Dark since 6/13
I"m in a new relationship since Feb 14.
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Originally Posted By: Wonka
YAT....I don't get why you keep referring this woman as W's "lesbian lover" as if that's the acceptable thing??! This is the AP. No ambiguity about this!!

Why do you say that W is "coming out"??! I've stated here many, many times that I've seen women go out with other women which DOES NOT necessarily mean they're lesbians. In fact, many of them do get married to men or return to their husbands. A one-time dalliance with a woman does not mean that a woman is a lesbian....


Originally Posted By: Wonka
....For the record, Young at Heart, I am a gay woman here. Just so you know that I know what I am talking about here and am fully aware of PFLAG...


In case anyone ever reads this in 5 years, let me clarify a few points.

(1) The OP, essjay, refers to his W as "lesbian." I was using the term that he was using and that by his posts she (his W) used. My hope for essjay is that she is not a lesbian, as if she is, there is little hope (in my opinion) to save the marriage. In the mean time, I agree with Wonka that essjay should treat it as a PA and use all the DB skills he has, but he should also educate himself so he can better understand her and what she and her family (which includes essjay, his two daughters, and his MIL) may be going through. I am sure essjay's MIL must have some issues no matter what kind of PA is going on and what it might do to her relationship with her two grandchildren. If I were essjay, I would want my two daughters to have a woman they feel they could talk to. For me it would not be a wife in a PA, it would be my two daughters grandmother, assuming she had her head on straight. If I were essjay, I would want to do things to make sure my daughters had a good female role model in their life, their grandmother.

(2) As to PFLAG. I have a gay son. He "came out" about 2 years after a break up with a very nice young lady he had "dated" for about 9 months. My W & I thought she was going to be our DIL. My S has purchased a house with a very nice young man he has been seeing for a long time and they are a couple for all purposes. We invite them both to all of our family gathering and treat them as a couple, which they are. We have a gay marriage law in our state, but they have chosen not to do that, even though for legal reasons they probably should. It came as a complete surprise to our entire family, and our family had a lot of questions and learning to do.

I am sure you know everything there is to know.

I was just trying to provide essjay with a source of information that HE might want to have handy in case questions came up, as he has two daughters age 24 and 21. I would wager they might have a few questions. After all PFLAG is for "Parents, Friends & Family" and local chapters have support group meetings for parents, friends and family. Again, if you go back and look, you should see that my comment was not directed at you. It was a resource offered to essjay. ITS NOT ABOUT YOU, this thread is about essjay and his struggles.

Rather than getting in a flame war with you, I will just sign off and let you have the last word. You might want to carefully choose your "last word."

Good luck essjay! I hope that things work out well for you and your two daughters. The MWD DB approach can do wonders, but you have to be strong and stay the course. I won't be checking this thread again.


>43 years of marriage--My wife and I are now closer than we have been in decades. I believe that my SSM is over.
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Young At Heart,

I missed this one. Thanks for taking the time to post your point of view and experiences.

My entire point was that what Jay's W is doing is engaging in an affair. It so happens to be with a woman instead of a man. Therefore W's affair partner is OW.

Unlike your son's situation where he realized who he was and did not get married, Jay's wife and Jay have been married for a long time and have a family together. Lord knows how many situations I've seen IRL that a married woman gets into an affair with another woman thinking that it means they're lesbians. After that fling/affair fizzles, the very same women realizes that they still do like men and are still straight. They go on to marry another man. Gosh, another broken family in their wake because of one stupid, momentary lapse...all dopamine!!

It has been reported by other posters here as well. Especially from Ellie (aka kml) and Bug (aka labug) who have witnessed the same phenom in IRL as well and have shared that over time here in the forums as the two examples that I know of. In other words, I am really leery of people labeling a person "gay" or "lesbian" just because they're with the same gender person especially being in a long-term marriage.

For me, FLAG is a great organization to support gay, lesbians, bisexual, and transgendered people. To me, I can see your good intentions by providing information to Jay about PFLAG. It just comes across as if it's okay for Jay's Wife to have an affair with a woman and make it acceptable by saying it's her 'lover' thereby giving this so-called relationship some legitimacy. This is a point where I disagree very strongly.

For a moment, let's switch out W's OW to OM. Say that W is involved with OM, would you say 'oh, that's W's lover. Better figure out a way for your daughters to accept OM. Better talk with your daughters on how to accept the OM.' What's the difference??

This does not make me a Ms. Know It All as you allege here. I have been out as a gay woman from the age of 15 and I am approaching 50. I've lived this life and seen many, many things that you wouldn't imagine at all. It is my life experience.

I know your comments were not directed to me. Please remember that this is a PUBLIC forum where members read and offer their thoughts/opinions/views. If one disagrees or thinks differently, then it is their prerogative to voice their views. That is the utter beauty of DB forums.


Last edited by Wonka; 10/29/14 11:21 PM.
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FTR, out of many so-called lesbian women who engaged in affairs/flings with women I've witnessed firsthand, all but ONE have gone on to marry men (some second time). Several had children with their first or second husbands. That particular one woman occurred after a 25-year marriage with her ex-husband had broken up and was divorced. Shortly after her divorce, she had her first gay relationship. That one ended about 2 years and this woman went on to find her life partner who is a woman. They're still going strong 15 years on.

For me that was 1 out of 12 women IRL. Do the math. Now you can see why I have very strong feelings/views on this. An affair is an affair.

No matter how much lipstick you put on a pig. It is still a pig. (yeah...not too refined analogy)

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Now back to the program...Jay. Oy vey! Did I just say THAT??! What 'program' ??? wink

How are you holding up? Your babies? Any plans for Halloween?

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essjay Offline OP
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Hi Wonka & All,
It's been a few days since I've checked in here, time for a quick update.

We're at full in house seperation now. Sleeping in a different room. Showering in a different bathroom etc. W spends a lot of her time in 'her' bedroom now on her phone and I pad with the door closed.

I feel that I've done well in respecting her wishes for space and time. I've not done any pursuing at all, no phone calls or messaging.
My D's say that this is the best I've looked that they can ever remember!
New wardrobe, hairstyle and glasses! The PMA to go with it is coming along slowly as well.
W seems to be ignoring it all though. Hardly any comments - it's as if she's blocking my entire existence out of her life now. She's 'moved on' as she told our youngest D...

I'm so thankful that I have our D's to help me. My relationship with them is the best it's ever been. We are spending more time together now than we have ever done and having great times. Just wish that W would see it and join in and become part of it again because she's not at the moment.
Her choice though.

The three of us are all hurt and 'feeling it' but taking each day at a time and keeping on keeping on!

Appreciate all your advice.

Jay


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essjay, it is hard, but you are doing good. It is nice when someone comments on your new outlook/attire, when you have put that work into it.
Wonka is right, having an affair with the same sex and being a lesbian are two different things. For most of us, it is hard to separate the two.
I can only look at my own sitch, to understand what Wonka is saying.
I can understand what you are going through. My W moved into the separate bedroom the night of BD. She used the other bathroom, I never saw her naked again, or even in pj's. It was though I hard become a person she didn't know/trust or comfortable around anymore. She also locked herself in the room to play texting with the OW. Up to all hours of the night doing the texting.
You are so right about "blocking out your entire existence", that is exactly how it felt with me.
Advice? Not much more that can be added at this stage. Keep going with the PMA, that being recognised is fantastic. Keep going with the relationship with your D's, again that is fantastic. These things are what helps you get through all this, whatever the outcome.
Have you started thinking about the legal side of things? Changing accounts, names on accounts, and covering you for the future?
I came home to a text one day saying she has taken half of the money out of the account. Yes she is entitled to half the money, but that was the slush fund for our investment property, which I ended up paying by myself for the next 18 months.


ME:51 W:46
M:25
S:22, S:20
Divorced 16/9/15
BD 10/12
W left 12/12 with OW, affair confirmed Nov/12.
Dark since 6/13
I"m in a new relationship since Feb 14.
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