Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 6 of 11 1 2 4 5 6 7 8 10 11
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 350
S
Member
Offline
Member
S
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 350
Jefe

Like you would tell me, pull back. Detach. Don't try to read into it. I do the same and it just gets me spinning. It could be she is confused and rethinking her decision. It could be that she sees you pulling away and just wants to keep you in play. It could be to assuage her guilt...by asking about your grandmother, she shows herself that she is a nice person and not the "evil" person who is having an A.

Pray, detach and let God take over.


Me: 40, W: 40
M: 15, T: 18
D - 10, S - 7
D announcement 6/7/2014
A discovered 7/20/2014 (but denied by W)
Still living together and sharing same bed
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,104
J
Jefe Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
J
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,104
Hope, you're officially off moderation now so your stuff will show up in real time moving forward. Lots to digest but let me touch on it briefly.

Quote:


Jefe,

Let me ask you something…

When she told you that “you were not together anymore and would not be together anymore”

…was this really the FIRST time she said something like this? Really?

If not, then I tend to think these words were thrown at you more for effect. “NOTICE ME!” More than “I want a divorce.”

You said she is a lasher and this text was sent after an argument. I’ll bet you yelled before she lashed. And she lashed very effectively. She sent you a really mean text and unfriended you on FB. Ouch. This is why I take the words less seriously than if it was said during a counseling session.

However make no mistake. I still take her threats seriously. The #1 problem with lashers is they don’t know when to stop and they don’t know how to “let it go.” So you have to shut it down. And by “shut it down” I mean you have to take control and stop the escalation.

Tonight is a good example of how you took control of the marriage by not allowing escalation. You were put in a situation perfect for escalation but you didn’t escalate. Instead of quizzing her about the job—you congratulated her.


No, not the first time at all. This is about the 3rd or 4th time and almost always in response to something I've said or done to call her out or question her. And no, she has no clue when to stop and will usually go for scorched earth before she lets up. I have tears streaming down my face for her because I fell so bad that I know she wishes she could take some things back and simply can't or doesn't know how. I also have not built a save haven for her to be able to confess or speak freely. My sponsor just said this morning that she probabally feels trapt. If she comes and tells me the truth about OM she thinks I am going to beat her up and if she just walks away and continues the cover-up, I am going to beat her up.

She sent me a text a few days before this separation took a darker tone about 5 weeks ago that said "you know I love you" and I responded no, I didn't know that. I think this speaks volumes for both of us.

Quote:

Translation:

"I am completely aware that I am not displaying love the way my wife needs it. This is not because I do not love my wife. I do love my wife very much. I love her more than she will ever know. I guarantee this because I will not express it in a forum that she is comfortable in. However, this is not as important to me as continuing to display love in a manner that suits my comfort. It is my hope that someday my wife will understand me and my needs to the point that she can be fulfilled by the type of loving expressions that make me comfortable. In the meantime, I will be surprised when other men meet her emotional needs."

Re-translation, the old me would do just that, I am completely ready and willing to change. I just need a little guideance so I can measure up.

Quote:
Would she mind if you tried to fight for her job? By that I mean is this something she would appreciate you doing for her? Because this might be something in your control...if she wants it.

You could go to the Church and ask them to reconsider keeping your wife. You can be completely honest about the status of your marriage. She is estranged and you want to reconcile. You can tell them that you believe your marriage has a stronger chance of success if your wife works in a Christian environment with like-minded believers than in a secular environment where divorce is a normal behavior.


She would mind very much. She would view this as controlling and it's part of what's pushing her farther away. I have been secretly fight for her job. But she is choosing to quit and my gut right now says honor that and put up zero fight and she will respect that more. She is expecting me to fight for it. And it always works against me.


Me 47 - W 35
M 9 - T 10
2 Daughters - 7 & 9
Discovery of EA- 8/4/14
S - 8/5/15
D mentioned - 9/11/14
R & Piecing - 3/17/15
Regard one another as more important than yourselves.
- Philippians 2:3
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 5,301
S
Member
Offline
Member
S
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 5,301
Jefe, I have just been reading DR for the first time...very helpful. Someone said they learned to treat their spouse much as they would a neighbour - during 180/LRT. So if a neighbour asked me how my Gran was doing, I'd briefly tell them, think no more about it and carry on with my day.

Perhaps you could see these texts as small signs of progress - but remain pleasant, brief and distant....


T 13 M 7
Me 48 H 46
SS 15
BD 7.14 PA
D final 5.16 (H filed)

We receive & we lose, and must try to achieve gratitude & embrace with whole hearts whatever of life that remains after the losses - Dubus
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,104
J
Jefe Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
J
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,104
I do see them as progress. I'm in a fog too so it makes my mind do funny things sometimes.


Me 47 - W 35
M 9 - T 10
2 Daughters - 7 & 9
Discovery of EA- 8/4/14
S - 8/5/15
D mentioned - 9/11/14
R & Piecing - 3/17/15
Regard one another as more important than yourselves.
- Philippians 2:3
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,104
J
Jefe Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
J
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,104
Quote:
…was this really the FIRST time she said something like this? Really?

If not, then I tend to think these words were thrown at you more for effect. “NOTICE ME!” More than “I want a divorce.”

You said she is a lasher and this text was sent after an argument. I’ll bet you yelled before she lashed. And she lashed very effectively. She sent you a really mean text and unfriended you on FB. Ouch. This is why I take the words less seriously than if it was said during a counseling session.

However make no mistake. I still take her threats seriously. The #1 problem with lashers is they don’t know when to stop and they don’t know how to “let it go.” So you have to shut it down. And by “shut it down” I mean you have to take control and stop the escalation.


Hope, I have done much more thinking about this since I first answered.

With the exception of one particular instance I have been met with something like this after each negative interaction.
When she moved out back in Aug, she was still wearing her wedding ring until our first big fight about the "incident" a week or two later. The next time I saw her, no ring. Another 2 weeks later the next big argument about the "incident" she pulled completely away and stopped talking about reconciliation and stopped letting me physically touch her. Another week later, another dumb a$$ comment by me got the first hateful divorce threat. By this time tensions are high and the relationship is getting very strained. She changed her relationship status on FB about 3 weeks after the threat. I don't recall a specific incident that sparked it, but at this point she is in full fog and anything I do have become hostile. That was Oct 2 or 3, the last divorce threat was made last weekend after a huge mistake on my part of opening my stupid mouth, again. So yes, they are all tied.

Your description of her (lashers) is uncanny. I just kind of made the word/description up but you have it pegged. The only other thing you didn't mention was that they tend to find it difficult if not impossible to say they're sorry or make amends.

Then here we are today and shes calling about the job she got and we're talking more during the day in the last couple of weeks than we were before the separation.


Me 47 - W 35
M 9 - T 10
2 Daughters - 7 & 9
Discovery of EA- 8/4/14
S - 8/5/15
D mentioned - 9/11/14
R & Piecing - 3/17/15
Regard one another as more important than yourselves.
- Philippians 2:3
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,104
J
Jefe Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
J
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,104
Originally Posted By: Hope414
Now, learn how to take it another step. Celebrate with her. Even if she doesn’t get the job—celebrate how wonderful she is. Send an e-card (funny-not romantic), or flowers, but something uniquely you and her—that says:

“Hey, you are amazing! Every company in America should hire you!” You should consider making it a family affair.

Have a “mommy is amazing” dinner and everyone gets to say why mommy is amazing.

Whether she gets the job or doesn’t get the job…she will remember the support she gets from you during this time. And while you are giving her this support…maybe you can throw in a little romance.


And sending flowers is not pursuit? I will do it first thing tomorrow but it seems counter DB/DR practices.



My mind is in a bad place tonight. I know I'm not supposed to be watching FB but I can't help it sometimes. I see where she just friend-ed suspected OM2. Admittedly I have zero intel other than the first part of Sept's phone logs. I hate my foggy LBS imagination. Yes Shodan, I'm not emotionally detached AT ALL and I'm paying the price for it now.

Hope, do we know each other? I seriously feel like either you have a very good intuition, you are well trained in the subject matter, or you have some specific inside knowledge.LOL


Me 47 - W 35
M 9 - T 10
2 Daughters - 7 & 9
Discovery of EA- 8/4/14
S - 8/5/15
D mentioned - 9/11/14
R & Piecing - 3/17/15
Regard one another as more important than yourselves.
- Philippians 2:3
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,104
J
Jefe Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
J
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,104
Originally Posted By: Jefe
Well, wife just informed me that she gave her 2 weeks notice at the church where she works part time. presumably because they are putting pressure on her to reconcile the marriage and she's not going to have ANYONE tell her what to do right now.

I replied: OK, whatever you think is best.
She replied back: Right now it seems best. I can't tell the future I wish I could.

Whatever that means.

She fought so hard to get that job and for the first time in many years she was actually happy with her job. Makes me sad and concerned. Nobody left in her circle now that in OUR corner.


On a positive note, the wife texted to say she was going to go opposite service times at church and was just ensuring that I was going to remain in the class I'm at now.

She's drawing back toward God. That's got to be better.


Me 47 - W 35
M 9 - T 10
2 Daughters - 7 & 9
Discovery of EA- 8/4/14
S - 8/5/15
D mentioned - 9/11/14
R & Piecing - 3/17/15
Regard one another as more important than yourselves.
- Philippians 2:3
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 176
H
Member
Offline
Member
H
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 176
Hi Jefe,

Nope. We don't know each other but your wife isn't very different than many of the women who come to the counseling center.

As a note, I didn't tell you to send her flowers. I used flowers as an example of the difference between romance and pursuit. Bringing a woman flowers is pursuit but making the effort to learn what that woman's favorite flower is...well..that is romance.

Pursuit is about getting what you want. Pursuit is a means to an end. Pursuit can be impatient and desperate. Pursuit can get angry when it doesn't have immediate results. Pursuit usually has an expectation.

Romance is selfless. Romance doesn't have any expectations. Romance is patient and tolerant.

Romance doesn't benefit you it benefits the person you are romancing. When you romance someone your goal is to make the person you are romancing feel loved, valued and cherished whether you gain or not.

Romancing your wife would not be counterproductive to the DB/DR principles because you are becoming the husband that any wife would be crazy to divorce.


M: 62
H: 67
Bomb dropped: October 2012
R: 4-2014

I've never regretted saying "I'm sorry"
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 6,810
S
Member
Offline
Member
S
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 6,810
Originally Posted By: Jefe
[quote=Hope414]
And sending flowers is not pursuit? I will do it first thing tomorrow but it seems counter DB/DR practices.



I believe it's absolutely pursuit, as MWD defines it and cautions against. I think this would be far more appropriate if you two ever get to the "piecing" stage.


Starsky


M57 W 57; D30 D28 S24 S20 GD7 GD2 GD1 GD5m GD1m
BD 5/07; W's affair 5/07-8/07

At the end of every hard-earned day, people gotta find some reason to believe. (Bruce Springsteen)
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 6,810
S
Member
Offline
Member
S
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 6,810
Even "romancing" isn't appropriate right now if Jefe's wife is contacting other men.

It's a typical DB mistake that many men make: cards, letters, flowers, PURSUIT.


M57 W 57; D30 D28 S24 S20 GD7 GD2 GD1 GD5m GD1m
BD 5/07; W's affair 5/07-8/07

At the end of every hard-earned day, people gotta find some reason to believe. (Bruce Springsteen)
Page 6 of 11 1 2 4 5 6 7 8 10 11

Moderated by  Michele Weiner-Davis 

Link Copied to Clipboard