Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 4
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 28
B
B-V2 Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
B
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 28
Please note: English is not my native but my 2nd language, so grammar and other spelling mistakes will happen by me.

I live in Scandinavia, and laws including divorce laws are completely and utterly different in the country that I live in, when compared with U.S.A. and most other countries in Europe (example: applying for divorce can be done by one spouse or both by filling in an electronic form and emailing it - which takes maximum 5 minutes to do and is never contested nor read hence always accepted. To finalize a divorce the same "procedure" is done by one spouse or both after 6 months and before 12 months are up. No lawyers need to be involved at all at any stage, if all is agreed amicably between the spouses).

Before starting opening up my story, I want to thank all of you that have taken the time to post your stories on this online community and genuinely write about your flaws, faults, problems, progress and learning insights: that takes real courage and maturity to do so.
And a special thanks to the very active vets here, as in: 25yearsmlc, MrBond, sandi2 and Wonka: I have read many of your thread comments/feedback/insights/2*4 over the past weeks and thereby learned tons already (even though I know that each and every relationship and situation is different from another). Please keep them coming!

My story:
As I am here, I am DB-ing and busy with Becoming-V2 of myself and when/by reaching that being a man only a fool would leave. Hence I do not want to become divorced, and would like my soul-mate + lover + best friend of my life and current WAW also becoming-V2 of herself and starting in what I know can become a fantastic fulfilling relationship in due time if both our hearts are in it. I do have some work to do on myself, still, in the meantime...

My wife left me at the start of August to live in a rented apartment about 1.5km/1 mile away, taking of course half of the furniture and her belongings with her (it was a very tough day, but I helped and I held up till she had moved out). During mid June she gave the "IDNLYA" speech and also told me that that she was going to divorce me and live on her own, all of which for me at the time came completely "out of the blue".
During mid-June and mid-July we divided up our assets on paper and she filed for divorce, so all was done in what felt as "warp speed" to me during those weeks.

Background and why:
We have been living together for 18+ years and married for 14 of those, while living and working in a few countries during all that time (the last 15 years in her native country). I am 47 years and she is 45 years, and we have no children.
In several discussions we have had after the breakup at least the first 16 of those 18 years have been very good to good (her words). Those first 16 years were full of happiness, joy, joint quality time and good communications and...no real major problems nor fights between us. And yes: we are both conflict avoiding, as we now know and have acknowledged between us.

About 2 1/2 years ago my wife was so unhappy in her job that after long talks between us she decided to quit her job. Financially all was more than fine, and we had been living before on only my salary for a while when earlier on she had the opportunity to study abroad and later on she had also taken a 1/2 year sabbatical from her work (we have always agreed to live life to the fullest, meaning that when interesting opportunities arrive to take them up when we both agree. As "coulda/woulda/shoulda" regrets when looking back on life is no way to live).
She was happy for about the first half year while at home and taking up all kind of new courses, but then became more and more unhappy. I did not really noticed that, and all the time encouraged her to find her true work passion in live - which I now know put a lot of stress on her as she felt she was not able to find/figure such out. At the same time I became fully occupied with my work (the usual excuses like: major reorganization, possible promotion opportunities and having to jump in when others moved, etc. etc.) and a new hobby passion of mine, and additionally we bought a summer place that needed a lot of fixing up which I worked on like a madman (so to make it nice for us both and once done to be able to relax there) which used up any free time that I had left over in weekends.

So all the time I was thinking that I simply gave her more and more time and space while trying to find her passions in life, and what a good husband I was to provide for her and us and doing all I was doing. I was actually jealous every now and then on her, because she had "all the time in the world" which was a luxury I had not had for the past 20+ years. However in reality I thereby did not continue to make her my #1 priority in life anymore, and totally ignored her "nagging" (like: "can you please for once leave work on time so to have that nice home cooked dinner together that I make, can you please come to bed together at the same time for a good joint night sleep, can you please stop surfing the internet as you do all the time as it feels that you are trying to learn like a madmen and do 10K hours of knowledge in 3 years for your new hobby").
She in turn stopped "nagging" in due time and I was thinking that all was OK, but it was of course the opposite because she had given up on me to change/turn around my bad behaviors and started with making herself emotional distance from me during the last year. I still did not noticed anything (because she kept up speaking my love languages and thereby kept my love tank full, as I only now realize when reading the 5LL book during the last few weeks).

The breakup:
On that particular day in mid June I was actually very happy when coming home, because I had finally realized during that working day that I was my own worse work enemy and had trained everybody around me to always count on me almost no matter what the hour of the day or day of the week it was. So I had finally decided to re-train myself and all around me on work, so get a normal life - work balance (rather than work and not much life = totally wrong balance). I told my wife of my work actions and had brought her some flowers, and was very proud and happy with myself. I felt 10 out of 10 at that moment as life was perfect.
Hours later she sat me down and gave me the "I Do Not Love You Anymore" speech, and also told me that that she was going to divorce me and would live on her own. I felt 0 out of 10. I was totally emotionally devastated and pleaded and begged and cried etc. etc. I walked out a few hours later and had a talk over the phone with her sister while I was crying all the time, who told me to ask her the why and really listen to her and ask more questions. So I did.

I realized the next day while walking to work that I needed professional help from a shrink, as I obviously had totally missed/misjudged the status of what is THE most important in my life: being the relationship between me and my wife. I also realized at the same time that I would not be able to function well on my work for some immediate working days, as I was completely emotionally devastated and in the worse pain ever of my life. My work provides excellent private medical health care and I have bosses and an HR department who understand such situations, hence some days off and access to a shrink was arranged accordingly.

While being emotionally devastated, the logical part of my brain fully understood that my wife had made up her mind and was not going change it no matter what I would say or do in the days and weeks to come. So I made it very clear that I did not agreed and that I did/do not want to divorce, while being nice and not being in her way at all. And in essence I implemented and acted as per LRT, even though I did not knew anything about Divorce Busting or Divorce Remedy at that time yet.

The why:
My actions, or actual lack of them, towards my wife for the last 2 years made her feel that she was not my #1 priority in life anymore. I was no longer the man she had fallen in love with and had been for the first 16 years of our relationship. More specifically/detailed:
- I did not pay her nor our home any enough attention, and took most of what she did for us for granted.
- I did not give her by far enough quality time, including really listening to her.
- I totally underestimated the importance of not being in paid work job place and what that does for anybody who is used to such (even though I know it so well), let alone for my wife.
- I paid all the bills etc., and that made her feel completely financial dependent on me. We have never made any problems nor fights about our finances and money in general, and I have always adhered to the simple principle of he/she who earns more, pays more. Additionally she has always had full access to all bank accounts, so I never saw money as any problem between us. But it actually was.
- As she acknowledge to me afterwards: her love for me was slowly killed over time by 100+ disappointments, and she should not have to threaten with a divorce for me to "wake up" (alas: so it was!), "too little too late".

OM:
There is no OM.

MLC
Perhaps, but I do not know nor am I any expert in any of this.

My 180's:
- I had already put my work down to normal hours on the day/evening of the Bomb Drop, and have kept that up ever since.
- I immediately cleaned up our home of junk and stuff I had not filled away. I was rather ashamed of it, because it felt like the "broken window syndrome" in one sense when I started to look around me: how could I have missed that/just let it go! Obviously it has been kept totally clean ever since by me.
- I am learning to really listen again.
- I have minimized my internet surfing time drastically, and almost never watch TV anymore (and do not miss it one bit).
- I have started to home cook and make nice dinners every day (I used to cook only every now and then, even though I have always enjoyed doing nice cooking).
- I have started to exercise again and now daily for the past months, as I had not done for many years (and only then once or twice a week). I'm starting to be in a really good shape, and being proud of it.
- Rather than planning and pre-planning a lot, I am more "in the moment" and relaxed now.
- Getting more in touch again with my emotions and feelings, and letting others know about those in a positive way.
- I have bought and read a lot of books on relationships, including Divorce Remedy which I received on 7th August 2014 and have re-read many times since (if only I had known about it years ago...).

GAL:
- Reconnected with old friends and made some new friends.
- Making sure that most week days and each weekend days I go out and see and do things, thereby not staying home.
- Started with salsa dancing lessons.
- Having a permanent PMA on everything. Smile, smile and smile!

Detachment:
This is indeed hard to do, also as I have been in the worse pain ever of my life - like all LBS's as I have read here - so the feeling/need to want to reach out/contact the WAW is there often. But so far I have been able to control it well, and ~95% of the first contacts has come from WAW with my other contacts been due to mostly logistical reasons (like postal items or things to do with our summer place).

Positive signs:
- After many weeks of absolute no to minimal contact, while she was picking up some remaining items we ended up having a 4+ hour listen and talk about why we ended up in this situation. It was very frank, open and honest and the best listen and talk about our feelings and behaviors we had for a long time.
- After that the contacts has been a bit more frequent, albeit mostly texts.
- Several weeks ago we had to take care of the summer house garden, and although agreed on only 1 1/2 days we ended up 2 1/2 days together. We were both very relaxed, enjoyed each other company while not bringing up the R and sleeping next to each other (there are enough beds and a couch in our summer place so to sleep separately, and we talked about it).
- A week ago she asked if I wanted to go to the summer place with her + her sister & dog. Again we agreed on 1 1/2 days while we ended up 2 1/2 days. Same pattern as several weeks ago.

Do I still experience the "roller-coaster ride" for myself: yes. Not so big up's & down's as in the first few weeks and months, but definitely yes.

Another key thing what I have re-learned from DR: do more of what works, and stop what does not work!

Some initial questions:
1. Next week is another major milestone, as in that I will buy her out from our main home/apartment as we have agreed upon earlier. That will provide her the financial freedom for a very long time (well, of course depends on how she will spend it. She has planned to sooner or later buy an apartment, but anything can happen of course).
On the one hand I know (my logical brain) that this is purely a business transaction as part of her started divorce process, on the other hand I feel that I would like to tell/remind her (my emotional side) that this is absolutely not what I want (as the only true winners here are the bank and the tax man). In the end I really do not care about money, and only about our relationship: so let my urge to tell/remind her go, as it will achieve nothing but negative feelings for her and she already knows what I want?

2. I feel like writing a letter to her in the weeks to come, so to tell more about feelings etc. But is this wise and/or pursuing or...?


Me:47 W:45
T:18 M:14
No children
BD: Jun 2014 INILWY and want to divorce
W filed Divorce: Jul 2014
W moved out: Aug 2014
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 28
B
B-V2 Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
B
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 28
W called early in the evening today with some info around our summer place (as it is for sale).

I asked how she was feeling and doing and if next weeks bank appointment is still on, and she said she was doing fine (and sounded OK) and yes it is on.
We then still talked a bit, but this time I was not good in taking the lead of bringing the conversation to a finish as I was obviously too happy to listen and talk. We wished each other a good weekend at the end.

So my own above question 1. answered, as in: I better keep that purely business during next week.

Any vets or experienced DB'ers wanting to give me further insights/questions/help on my question 2. and/or other questions for self improvement: I'm all ears so to Becoming-V2.


Me:47 W:45
T:18 M:14
No children
BD: Jun 2014 INILWY and want to divorce
W filed Divorce: Jul 2014
W moved out: Aug 2014
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 13,533
Likes: 78
C
Member
Offline
Member
C
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 13,533
Likes: 78
Welcome to the board

Get out and GAL.

DETACH.


Believe none of what she says and half of what she does.

Have NO EXPECTATIONS.

Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.

You are on moderation right now on the forum.
SO post in small frequent posts until you get off of it.

Your W is giving you a GIFT.
THE GIFT OF TIME.

USE it wisely.

Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon


Me-70, D37,S36
Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 3,500
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 3,500
Hello, B-V2. I'm sorry you're here, but it sounds like you're making pretty good progress.

You can write the letter if you want, but absolutely do NOT give it to her. I've only been on the boards a few months, but I've seen bunches of letters handed to estranged spouses but never, ever, ever seen them do any good whatsoever.

Of course if one of the vets you named above disagrees, go with their opinion.

I don't want to comment on the financial transaction because that's beyond my scope. But I would like to say I recognize how painful and final that must feel. Just remember that our feelings are very changeable and only reflect the truth of how we react to the situation, not the truth in total. There's a reason for the saying "nothing is sure but death and taxes."


Me42, H40
D12, S8, S7
A revealed: 7/13
Sep 4/14; Agreed to D 1/15

She believed she could, so she did.
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 28
B
B-V2 Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
B
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 28
Originally Posted By: Cadet
Welcome to the board

Get out and GAL.

DETACH.


Believe none of what she says and half of what she does.

Have NO EXPECTATIONS.

Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.

You are on moderation right now on the forum.
SO post in small frequent posts until you get off of it.

Your W is giving you a GIFT.
THE GIFT OF TIME.

USE it wisely.

Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon


Thank you for your welcome, Cadet, this forum is a life and divorce saver.


Me:47 W:45
T:18 M:14
No children
BD: Jun 2014 INILWY and want to divorce
W filed Divorce: Jul 2014
W moved out: Aug 2014
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 28
B
B-V2 Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
B
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 28
Originally Posted By: Maybell
Hello, B-V2. I'm sorry you're here, but it sounds like you're making pretty good progress.

You can write the letter if you want, but absolutely do NOT give it to her. I've only been on the boards a few months, but I've seen bunches of letters handed to estranged spouses but never, ever, ever seen them do any good whatsoever.

Of course if one of the vets you named above disagrees, go with their opinion.

I don't want to comment on the financial transaction because that's beyond my scope. But I would like to say I recognize how painful and final that must feel. Just remember that our feelings are very changeable and only reflect the truth of how we react to the situation, not the truth in total. There's a reason for the saying "nothing is sure but death and taxes."


Maybell: thank you very much for taking the time of posting in my thread and providing your opinions to my questions.

I am not familiar with your particular situation yet (I will read up), however being a total "noob" at the moment I doubt that I will be able to advice anybody yet in the weeks/months to come (apart from providing a general man's point of view, in case somebody request such for particular questions).

I'll take you up on not giving the letter even if I write one, as I was already doubting myself if such is a good idea at this stage.


Me:47 W:45
T:18 M:14
No children
BD: Jun 2014 INILWY and want to divorce
W filed Divorce: Jul 2014
W moved out: Aug 2014
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 28
B
B-V2 Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
B
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 28

Yesterday Sunday 28th September, she contacted me per text in the early afternoon, asking if I had fun with my salsa lesson (as those are on Sunday from 12-13) and if I wanted to join her for a walk as she was in my neighborhood (the area that she stated she was going to walk is exactly where the salsa dancing lessons are held).

As I was GAL at that moment and sitting at a restaurant outside enjoying a beautiful sea view with stunning blue sky and having some coffee and cake, I answered her with:
- Thanking for asking (being polite and nice)
- stating that the salsa lesson was fun (as it was)
- and if she would like to join me where I was.
Mmm: lets check the above for proper DB'ing: me too eager in answering semi immediately (2x4 myself), validating OKis, and too perusing for asking to join me (2x4 myself again)?

She replied with "I'll pas this time..." and that she actually want to talk with me as somebody was potentially interested in buying our summer place, and if she perhaps would call me in the evening and tell me about it?
I replied that with "Call me in the evening, bye."

When called later in the evening, it became clear that she was already contacted during Friday evening. I thereby got the feeling that she actually contacted me only on this Sunday to check up on me (like: is he really going to salsa dancing? What else is he up to?), but hee: I guess that now I am mindreading and that is not good either!

Any tips/insight on the above and/or 2x4's: I'm here to learn and improve myself, so let me know and give it to me straight.


Me:47 W:45
T:18 M:14
No children
BD: Jun 2014 INILWY and want to divorce
W filed Divorce: Jul 2014
W moved out: Aug 2014
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 28
B
B-V2 Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
B
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 28
It has been very inspirational to read MrBond (aka Stuck808 in the beginning) original thread, among others, with so much insights provided from vets like sandi2, 25yearsmlc, Coach & Mrs. Couch. Lots to learn.

For my upcoming tomorrow's banking business of buying her out from our main home/apartment, I will have to be as cool as a cucumber and therefore will practice upfront during today to STFU and just let it be the purely business transaction that it is. All the while while being relaxed, confident, secure and being attractive.

Any thoughts by anybody on this and my earlier writings?


Me:47 W:45
T:18 M:14
No children
BD: Jun 2014 INILWY and want to divorce
W filed Divorce: Jul 2014
W moved out: Aug 2014
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 13,533
Likes: 78
C
Member
Offline
Member
C
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 13,533
Likes: 78
Originally Posted By: B-V2
Any thoughts by anybody on this and my earlier writings?

Reading quickly what you wrote, and I may have missed something.

Do you think you can FIX this?|
Cause the two of you are now on separate journeys.
You can FIX YOU but not HER.

25mlc like to say make yourself into a person that only a FOOL would leave, those are the changes that you need to make.
There are no guarantees that your marriage will be restored.

The only thing I can say is the LBS gets to choose in the end, and if you have not yet choosen then it is not yet the end.

Keep reading and posting


Me-70, D37,S36
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 28
B
B-V2 Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
B
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 28
Originally Posted By: Cadet
Originally Posted By: B-V2
Any thoughts by anybody on this and my earlier writings?

Reading quickly what you wrote, and I may have missed something.

Do you think you can FIX this?|
Cause the two of you are now on separate journeys.
You can FIX YOU but not HER.

25mlc like to say make yourself into a person that only a FOOL would leave, those are the changes that you need to make.
There are no guarantees that your marriage will be restored.

The only thing I can say is the LBS gets to choose in the end, and if you have not yet choosen then it is not yet the end.

Keep reading and posting


Thank you for your follow up reply Cadet, much appreciated. And yes: I will keep reading and posting.

I knew and know that I can only fix and improve myself and thereby Becoming-V2, and that is what I am working on (I had actually just realize one part that I needed to change on the day of the BD, see my 1st posting). My changes are structural for me and for the rest of my life, not just so to win her back.

Our marriage as it was is now over and there is no looking back on restoring that as it had become: only going forward. In the past months I have been asked the real tough question: if I would not have changed for the next 5 years would I have still liked myself as I slowly had become. And my answer was: no. So from that point of view I'm guessing that I was myself in some sort of fog too for the past 1 to 2 years.

And so I am here for the reason as I have not yet choosen to give up on a potential future relationship between us, and I still need to do more work on me so to become a person that only a fool would leave. And the future will unfold itself, and I will be OK no matter what.


Me:47 W:45
T:18 M:14
No children
BD: Jun 2014 INILWY and want to divorce
W filed Divorce: Jul 2014
W moved out: Aug 2014
Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 4

Moderated by  Cadet, DnJ, job, Michele Weiner-Davis 

Link Copied to Clipboard