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Links to previous threads:

First post: DENIAL was my HAPPY PLACE!!!
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...100#Post2473100

For better or for worse, for richer or for PORES?
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...846#Post2475846

Carry on, My Wayward Son (of a Beeeeaaaaach!!!)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2480267#Post2480267

Well, enough about me, what do YOU think of me???
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2483967#Post2483967

PERSEVERANCE is Stubbornness....with a Purpose.
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2487201#Post2487201

Welp, he's gone. Wait-- Do I smell....BACON??!!!?!!!?
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2488871#Post2488871

_________________________
M44, H44, both M before
M4 yrs, T6
BD 7/13 ILYB something isn't right with me
H att suicide 2/14
S 4/14
OW disc 5/14
No D filed

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I was about to post an update....then D13 game ended early!!

Eeeks... Sorry for the teaser. smile

More soon....

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Journaling
Aaaaaannnnddd I waffled. Yup. (Shaking my head). I met him. Tried to stay angry. Nope.

But I wasn't a gushing mess. Non-emotional.

I met H in the parking lot in front of the main building. H texted after work that he wanted to talk to me about something..... eek

Although, it isn't a constant focus, the thought of D does cross my mind. I thought, now that house is closed....the next step in his path of destruction maybe??

We never mention the word.
We don't have R talks.
We don't argue.

Deep breath.

So, I walked out to him as he sat in his car, and got the kids' cards through his window. He asked if I have a minute, and I got in the passenger side.

He looked right into my eyes. Cr@p.

He told me he was sorry for the text earlier, asking about my job search, that he didn't want me to think he was hounding me.

He told me that he remembered that right after we got married, we cashed in 20k of one of my retirements to put down on the house. One of his (equivalent) retirements is in a new account, which is now joint (50-50).

So he said he wants to give me more of the house money, out of his proceeds, to give me "half" of my original down payment back....which legally, he does not have to do.

They are just words, I know. We'll see what he does. But for some reason, he has not been a spender.....yet, at least.

Here's what's so weird....He kept repeating over and over and over....like a machine...."l want to do the right thing. I want you to have this because its the right thing to do. I want to make sure I keep my integrity. No one can say I took your money. It's the right thing to do. No matter how mad you ever get at me, or what anyone ever says about me, I'll know I did the right thing."

What is that all about? As always, I just let him talk. I only said thank you.

Then he told me he's selling some of his prized possession instruments. He said he's buying different ones...maybe. But he's getting rid of stuff.....and that dang suicide thing has me freaking scared. My antennas went up.

Idk, it may be nothing. But I'm forever aware, and forever changed because of it.

He looked great, although his eyes were watery at times. He looked really, really great. >sigh<

Then....
We talked a little about my sons moving, and that led to a talk about my xh. One of my S18 is possibly going to live in the basement of xh house, with xh and xhgf. It's near S18 college....more space than my apartment....I don't blame him.

There is a lot of bad history with xh, that I haven't shared here. He was not a good man. But, that was a decade ago. He had a few years where he got very aggressive...I think he was secretly taking some meds.... He is in a different place now, and has been for 5-6 years. I think he grew up. He's had years and years of professional help. He isn't dangerous, for sure.

My H has been really upset and bothered by S18 moving there, and asked if that makes what we told him untrue.....I said "No, but a lot has changed in the past years with S18 and xh R (I don't talk about xh improvements to h...it wasn't ever relevant). S is 18. I don't get to decide his life, or anyone's. You're the one who taught me this when your D19 started doing (x,y,z), and you said you don't agree with all her choices, but she's 18. They have to learn and sometimes fall on their own."

Ok.....Why should he suddenly ask or pretend to care? Btw, this is the same S18 that found H at suicide attempt, and the same one who was H target of blame when the spewing started and I didn't know what it was..... H chucked us all into the trash anyway so he would not have these responsibilities. Why ask or have input, then? I don't understand his sudden concern about my sons, who haven't spoken to him since S.

I shrugged it off for the most part. I didn't argue, or take any bait. I calmly made a comment about the fact that none of us really has any say over what someone else decides to do, good or bad, do we, H......

Crickets.

Then I told him I had to go. I was quick to exit. No hug. I simply skeet-daddled outa there.

So, in summary, what all this means?....nothing. We will either get D or we won't. We will either reconcile, or we won't. Who the f knows.

I got more work to do. smile

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He's a spinnin...quick - get out the way!~!!


Originally Posted By: Shining

So, in summary, what all this means?....nothing. We will either get D or we won't. We will either reconcile, or we won't. Who the f knows.


Ayep ^^^^. smile

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Quote:
He's a spinnin...quick - get out the way!~!!


Ayep ^^^^.



Smiling.



....and running. Gettin' out the way!!!

Plus, I have 2 interviews this week, one tomorrow, one Thursday. smile. I meant to write that first.... Before the journal.

Oops. I'll do better next time. <<<< look who's NOT beating herself up. Yeah. That's right. (Nodding, trying to look tough).

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Hi Shining,
I just wanted to stop by and say you sound like you are doing great. Funny how seeing the other fellow LBS's on here doing better makes ME feel good for you! It's almost like we're all part of the same tribe and want the others to succeed. It's 4:00 AM here and I couldn't sleep so I just popped on and saw your last few posts.

Keep moving forward, Shining! You will be great and you will have the life you deserve because you have what it takes to MAKE that life.

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Shining,

Something we need to realize during this...

WE feel like they are doing horrible things and that they are trying to hurt us.

THEY feel like they are trying to fix something in their lives.

The spewing...is how they push is away. The more we resist, the more they have to spew. To push harder, until we stop resisting.

It doesnt mean they dont care. It doesnt mean they dont worry about us or our kids. It doesnt mean they are unfeeling monsters and whether we want to believe it or not...this process hurts them just as much as it hurts us.

They believe they tried, during the time we thought things were ok.

That is why we feel blindsided. That is why they push us away. When it becomes safer for them to be nice, they usually do.

I am curious though, how was the communication between the two of you really? I would think that anything regarding the kids would be conversation relevant even if he wasnt a part of the decision making process.

I try very hard with BF to discuss everything regarding children. Sometimes it means nothing more than having a conversation, but he is included in that part of my life like any other and the same with his children.

Anyway...just thinking out loud here.



"Acceptance doesn't mean resignation. It means understanding that something is what it is and there's got to be a way through it."--Michael J. Fox
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Cat -
Quote:
The more we resist, the more they have to spew. To push harder, until we stop resisting.

It doesnt mean they dont care. It doesnt mean they dont worry about us or our kids. It doesnt mean they are unfeeling monsters and whether we want to believe it or not...this process hurts them just as much as it hurts us.


not my experience: I have detached, and moved on with my life, and am pretty happy smile my xh still spews if he gets any chance. He also shows (nearly nine years on) virtually no concern for his children, and certainly not for me. I would say he was angry, more than anything else, possibly at himself, but certainly projecting it on to those who were once closest to him.

I still think it is MLC, but I think they pretty much stop caring about anything and everyone. As to whether they hurt or not I do not know. I am sorry if they do: I wouldn't want anyone to feel the hurt I initially experienced.

But he is married to someone else, and I would hope he is happy!!

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Matt, thank you for the support.

We are all on the same tribe, for sure. There is no one outside of here, that I know of, that could understand all we go through.

I hope you were able to get back to sleep, Matt!

Thanks for stopping by smile


Cat,

Quote:
I am curious though, how was the communication between the two of you really? I would think that anything regarding the kids would be conversation relevant even if he wasnt a part of the decision making process.


Our communication was fairly good, overall (or so I thought)....until the last 2 years. It cold have been better, for sure.

We weren't expert communicators, but we always discussed money, kids, plans, things that were bothering us. Everything that was day to day involving the kids, school, medical, schedule, money... was all discussed and agreed upon. We rarely disagreed.

What we didn't discuss together was my kids relationship with their dad, and we rarely talked about xh at all. Only logistics....if he was going to see them etc.

It took me a long time to get past some things that happened in my first M, and H and I didn't want to waste energy on xh or the past. I thought I had dealt with everything in counseling, separate from our M.

H never bad-mouthed my xh. But he knew what happened, and talking about it would make him upset. So we left the topic of xh alone as much as possible.

I went back and read emails and there is a huge difference in our communication from before and after MLC

I can remember a specific event that I first realized something was way off....

I brought up an issue regarding the kids, and H reaction just didn't make sense. Not only that, but he just couldn't get past it. And we ended up turning the car around and skipping a barbecue because of the argument. This was not us at all.

bea,

Thank you for your perspective. I can't imagine being spewed at any chance possible.

My hope is they do feel something. Who knows.....

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In regards to cat's thoughts about how the MLCer/WAS "feels' and thinks....I'm certain that in many cases that is true. I know I can't imagine ANYONE in crisis or not, not feeling some kind of remorse or hurt or even concern for the person they have spent most of their lives M to. At the same time, in my case and in many others on the board, it seems the darker and more "detached" I/they become, the worse my W seems to get. As I go darker and in my case I couldn't get much darker at all (I haven't initiated a single interaction unless it was about the kids in at least 6-8 weeks. I do respond to her when she texts or calls but that happens almost never) the more withdrawn and less caring she becomes.

I do believe totally that they see what they are doing as trying to "fix" something in their lives that they feel they must fix, I know that is the case with my W. But at the same time they ARE doing horrible things TO the LBS, even if it isn't the "main" reason, a part of them must see that what they are doing hurts the LBS badly, worse than almost anything that has happened to them before in their entire lives. In my W's case she said she needed to "find my joy", to me, if finding joy means hurting so many, their S, their kids, family, etc. how in the world can you expect to find and enjoy any joy you may find? There would have to be guilt as well. When my W was depressed, one of the things that she had to work on in IC was "inappropriate feelings of guilt". She would talk about how she felt guilty about all kind of things but could never say exactly what. Her IC would give her exercises on how to overcome this. How would doing things that guilt may be an appropriate response help? And why would the fact that the LBS is leaving them alone cause them to be even more selfish and uncaring?

I see in shining's case, her H DOES seem to feel badly about what he is doing, even see's how he is hurting her but just is unable to stop or feels that he must move forward to 'fix" his life. Their latest talk shows that he somewhat see's what he is doing is hurtful and feels some remorse. In many other cases (including my own) there is none of that. In fact as the LBS goes darker or detaches the worse they become. There doesn't seem to be ANY understanding that what they have/are doing is at all hurtful. And in my case I know that in the past my W was very aware of how her actions affected other people and she was always careful not to do or say things to hurt others and if she did, was very remorseful. Like Wonka says, the empathy chip seems to be broken, if only when it comes to me.

Sorry to hijack, shining. This is just a subject that has been on my mind. I think if my W sent me a "game request" I'd have a heart attack! It's just hard for me to see her at all thinking/feeling anything close to hurt or guilt over what she is doing and I also see that in many other sitchs. Not to take anything away from cat. She is right in what she says in many cases. But I also think in many others there is none of that.

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