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Previous threads. My Second Thread: http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...203#Post2470203

My Third Thread:
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2481792#Post2481792
(The first post here gives a summary of my situation.)

My W continues to actively date younger men, and as of today there is no progress in working on our marriage.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

“The strongest of all warriors are these two — Time and Patience.” War and Peace
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I went out last night with d19 and her bf that she has been seeing over the last 6 months. I had never met him before, and so HE invited me and d19 out as an early birthday celebration for d19 at her favorite restaurant.

I told them both that d19 is the most special young woman in the world. She is smart, beautiful, hard working, with a kind heart. He will never be good enough for her. But it says a lot about him that d19 thinks he is someone special.

I made sure he understood that my faith is important to me.

I also made sure that he understood that there is no decade of music like the 1980's. He had never heard of U2 before, and owned nothing by Stevie Wonder. I encouraged him to fix these "problems".

But it was a really good night together. I was able to draw him out and get him to talk about things he enjoyed doing. And bf's could be a good thing - it's fun to have another person around to talk about football and fantasy football with, and not have their eyes glaze over like my daughters do.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

“The strongest of all warriors are these two — Time and Patience.” War and Peace
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Quote:
I also made sure that he understood that there is no decade of music like the 1980's. He had never heard of U2 before, and owned nothing by Stevie Wonder. I encouraged him to fix these "problems".
I smiled when I read that smile


AJ


"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter" MLK
Put the glass down...
"Yesterday I was clever so I wanted to change the world
Today I am wise, so I am changing myself."
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Originally Posted By: Wet
I also made sure that he understood that there is no decade of music like the 1980's. He had never heard of U2 before, and owned nothing by Stevie Wonder. I encouraged him to fix these "problems".


I laughed when I read this. I just introduced my 7- year old daughter to Stevie Wonder's Superstition. She loves funk and wanted to hear a quintessential funk example and how can that song not be it?!

Anyway, it seems we have similar taste in music and that's ALWAYS awesome. smile


M: 37 H: 36
M: 13 T: 18
D: 7
Bomb: 6/30/14
Separation: 8/11/14

Be strong enough to let go and wise enough to wait for what you deserve.
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Yes, if you want to get me passionately talking about a subject, just bring up 1980's music. I have over 5,000 songs on my IPod, most of which is 80's music. What can I say, the MTV video revolution had an impact on me.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

“The strongest of all warriors are these two — Time and Patience.” War and Peace
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So a weird exchange with W. S13 left everything he had (his playstation, his phone, his football equipment) in my car. W was "too busy" (taking kids to gym, to coffee shop for kid's internet access for homework, out for dinner) to pick up yesterday.

So she comes to my office to pick up s13's stuff this morning. She calls me when she's here, and she stays in her car. She's come up to my office many times before. We've met in the lobby of the building before. Today, she sits in her car. We get the piles of stuff into her car, we chat a bit thru her car window (Me: how was the weekend wedding (of her niece)? W: we all just cried the whole time. The bride has serious health issues. She can never have kids. They just are that devoted to each other.)

I tell her about my dinner out with d20, and meeting her boyfriend. Then, poof! W's gone, staying busy with a "consultation", assuming her dating site photograph business. But she was dressed caually in jeans.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

“The strongest of all warriors are these two — Time and Patience.” War and Peace
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I remember it being odd, Wet. My ex and I were very close and very connected. I could feel a lot of things even if I didn't understand them.

It seemed that every time I got used to the new Dr Jekyll, a new variant would start up. i.e. I would just get level footing for the way ex was acting and then - bang - a new change again.

It would send me into an analysis frenzy and I would try to understand the implications. i.e. read the future from the tea leaves.

Looking back, I knew I was way too attached instead of detached. How do I know? When the mailman opens the mailbox door with his left hand instead of his usual right-hand, I notice, but I don't stop to think he may have a new girlfriend or be going through a tough time.

I notice a lot of things, but I have no idea what they mean in other people's lives and I'm not attached to them so it really doesn't matter.



AJ


"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter" MLK
Put the glass down...
"Yesterday I was clever so I wanted to change the world
Today I am wise, so I am changing myself."
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Well, my W has expanded her search for other young men. She took d20 to celebrate her birthday (and s13 and d17) to the most popular sports bar in town last night. Yes, right in the middle of Monday Night Football. You guessed it, W never watched a football game with me during our marriage. W chose the place which confused d20 (it was to celebrate her birthday), as its not the type of food she enjoys. It's good that W's horizons are expanding.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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I'm more disturbed by her trolling for men under the guise of "celebrating D20's birthday". That's atrocious. It's one thing to men scout but entirely a different thing when you're doing it with your 3 kids in tow.

WTH??


M: 37 H: 36
M: 13 T: 18
D: 7
Bomb: 6/30/14
Separation: 8/11/14

Be strong enough to let go and wise enough to wait for what you deserve.
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Describe to us how you 'know' that she went there to troll for younger men vs. as a place that's different than what she would have done, please.

A person on this board that does something so totally opposite of what they used to do is not unheard of as you can imagine... smile

AJ


"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter" MLK
Put the glass down...
"Yesterday I was clever so I wanted to change the world
Today I am wise, so I am changing myself."
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Here's what I "know". After the week 1 football games, she called me up (weird thing #1, she doesn't do this anymore) and asked me about the week's games (weird #2). At the time I thought she was reaching out to connect with something I enjoy (I am gullible Wet). But now seeing W's choice of this place for a family celebration, I see this now is a place she is going to. She was trying to get information from me to use in speaking with other guys.

Bad thing is, s13 was sick yesterday, and did not go to school - from auto email report sent to me. Yet healthy enough to go to late night sports bar celebration.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

“The strongest of all warriors are these two — Time and Patience.” War and Peace
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Originally Posted By: Wet
Here's what I "know". After the week 1 football games, she called me up (weird thing #1, she doesn't do this anymore) and asked me about the week's games (weird #2). At the time I thought she was reaching out to connect with something I enjoy (I am gullible Wet). But now seeing W's choice of this place for a family celebration, I see this now is a place she is going to. She was trying to get information from me to use in speaking with other guys.

Bad thing is, s13 was sick yesterday, and did not go to school - from auto email report sent to me. Yet healthy enough to go to late night sports bar celebration.


Ughhh that would chap me on so many levels


M: 48
W: 47
M16 T26-S8
BD Sept13



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Why is my brain so messed up? W texted me late last night, and it was 5 long texts, ranging from child support, to a photography client who is a high school kid with cancer, needing me to bring s13 to Thursday football practice, then speaking of d17 spending a Saturday night at my place, etc.

So instead of trying to text a response, I called W. It has been so long since I've called her, that W answered with "Wet, did you mean to call me, or is this a butt dial?" We spoke for a while, it was a nice conversation. Old, nice Wet was back - yes, of course I'll take s13 to football practice. And she describes the photo shoot for this poor kid with brain cancer on Thursday. She asks if we can go out together to discuss counseling needed for s13, and other things. It sounds like to me she is not so obsessed with her dates and her dating web sites. So my delusional thinking is that "Gee, maybe W is coming out of her MLC. She wants to go out with me. Maybe she likes me again!"

But after a cup of coffee this morning, I remember reality. This is going to be a long haul, whatever the outcome. I tell myself to calm down, take it easy, and be patient. But the delusional thoughts hit us LBS' pretty hard too, right?


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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Wet

Absolutely .... I find this MLC experience to be one of brutal self control issues for us LBS, sometimes ya see a flash/sign of that person you know .. the one you loved, its like any Zombie movie you have ever seen, the shell of the person is there but you have to guard yourself and take it slow, wait for the cure, and realize they have to stay in that MLC Zombie Tunnel and feel safe enough to come out into the sunlight with the rest of society ... I see mine struggling now with owning her share, owning what she has done, conflicted with wanting to run from it and dealing with it at the same time ... all the while us LBS have to be that beacon... the rock.. the light house ... safe place .. whatever we can do to not scare them off, in the same token, remain focused on the long term goal and do what we can to not backslide and allow our emotions to get the best of us.

How can you love a Zombie? I am still learning myself.


M: 48
W: 47
M16 T26-S8
BD Sept13



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Not to scare you guys, but I want to remind you that the work won't be done when/if they become themselves again. There will be quite a bit of resentment built up on the LBS part and that will need to be addressed.

This is a very long and hard road. You get to find out what you are made of for sure. I didn't like who I had become during the seperation/divorce. I was clingly and sad and so very lost. Not at all who I had ever been before. I am getting closer to my true self every day but my kids love to throw boulders in my path!

Blessings, kat


Me-53(and learning!)
S24, S21, D18, D17
Just keep swimming, Just keep swimming. Dory
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Hi CaliGuy, the Zombie movie I think this may be like is 'Warm Bodies' (2013). A romantic zombie movie, where the zombies are loved and come back to life. The trailer for the movie says: "He was dead inside until he met her…" OK, I haven't seen a zombie, a zombie come back to life, or an MLC'er come back to life, but I keep hoping.

And yes, thanks Kat for splashing cold water on my face ;-) My W as far as I know is still hitting the dating websites, and perhaps less frequently, still dating other men. I get it, it's a long road, a long, long, road, even after W comes back to life. But can't I hope a little?


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

“The strongest of all warriors are these two — Time and Patience.” War and Peace
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Sure you can. smile I do know of marriages that were saved. Not many but a few. Those that I know of, the LBS was really moving on. One had even put his house up for sale and gotten a new job out of state.

Maybe that wakes the WS up. The thing was though that the LBS wasn't "trying" anything, they really were just getting on with their lives.

I am rooting for you.

kat


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Hi Kat,
I really think you hit the nail on the head there (or the zombie in the head?). Until the LBS has totally given up on the MLC. Until whatever it is that the LBS does is solely for him/herself and him/herself alone without any thought of "maybe this will wake him/her up", the MLC will somehow 'feel" this and it will have no effect or worse the opposite effect! Until they really feel in their gut that the LBS has moved on without them, they will never come back around. I truly believe this.

Whenever you see a post where the person is saying they think the MLCer is coming around or wants to "talk" etc.before the LBS has totally detached, it usually seems that it backfires. They aren't done "baking" and it just goes back to the way it was or even worse!

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It usually causes the crazy cycle of hope and hurt. So many people just starting to go through this just don't want to let go and yet that is the best thing for them in the end.

Wet, I liked that zombie movie. Having them actually talk was kind of cool. My kids love watching the Walking Dead and now my parents are hooked. I don't watch it all the time but know enough that I get what is going on.

kat


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No one can fully let go until they are truly done. You're either done or you're still holding on to some degree, and that's OK! Letting go is not something you can fake and get away with just for effect. The WAS/MLC'er knows us well enough to tell the difference.

Don't even concern yourself about where you are on the "Letting Go" scale. You are where you are.

Best to accept your sitch for what it is and simply enjoy your new life. Make it what you want it to be. Confident people who are truly content with their life and themselves are highly attractive.


Last edited by ForeverYoung; 09/18/14 12:06 AM.

M: A really long time.
Crisis: 5 years.
She's still worth it.

Life is never made unbearable by circumstances, but only by lack of meaning and purpose. -Viktor Frankl
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What ^^^ he said. And while you're at it, be grateful that she cares enough about your son to want to talk to you about his well-being. Even if it's self-serving, and I'm not saying it is, it's far better than those that walk away or withhold their love for their kids. Far better.

Get it out of your head that she's coming back or that there is such a thing as closure. It's an old old story, my friend.

Best bet? Live your life and be a father. Life won't come back around for those opportunities, my friend.

AJ


"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter" MLK
Put the glass down...
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OK, how bad of a mess up did I do? I text my W on Sunday and ask how her photoshoot of the brain cancer senior at high school went. She tells me "horrible" because it rained. And she tells me they will re-shoot it Sunday evening. I tell her I am praying for this photo shoot for her. Anyway, we start texting about our children, and go back and forth for 15 minutes, we joke around, and its nice.

We end up texting about d19 who is going to an out-of-state college. And she is making mistakes, and won't listen to us. Which leads me to text the following, which is a double-barrel shot at both our d19 and my W:

"she's and adult now, and sometimes the only way for them to learn is for us to back off and let them fall. And then be there if they want our help down the road."

W's response? Crickets. She has no response, which is very unlike her. Was my telling my W my gameplan, where I am my backing off, and letting her make mistakes, and only coming to help if she asks me, was this revealing too much? It felt good to me, but let's see.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

“The strongest of all warriors are these two — Time and Patience.” War and Peace
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Wet

Not sure if that is reall a mess up... I would see it as a truth dart directed at your D19 that may have stung your W just a little bit, but I would not say you opened up and shared your DB playbook either.

One of those wait and see things I think.


M: 48
W: 47
M16 T26-S8
BD Sept13



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Anniversary time! Thursday is our 22nd anniversary. W continues to post on FB and refers to me as her "ex-husband" (why is she even mentioning me?) on mutual friend's posts.

I am going to my 2nd cooking class on Thursday night, so there is no temptation to invite W out. I did buy a 'Happy Anniversary' card for her - it was tough finding one that does not have Love, Love, Love all over it. On advice from the Board my message in the card will be short and mention the one thing we have done well together, our 4 children.

BUT if I was going to add something to remind W that we are still married, and that she is not "single", I might write:

- Happy Anniversary (yes, we are still married. Separated is NOT divorced);
- Sometimes people use their time of separation to work on their marriage - something to think about?
- How can I be your "ex-husband" when there isn't even a pending divorce case/suit?
- and for the religious minded out there, what about: Fornication is just as bad as Adultery.

OK,ok, I'm venting. Let's see if I can shake this frustration about W failing to acknowledge our marriage as the anniversary date approaches.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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Anniversary cards are not an appropriate place to remind your WAW that you are still married. Honor the anniversary and celebrate the good that came out of that day 22 years ago. Thank her for the good things.

I bet this anniversary is weighing on her mind too. I bet she is dwelling on all the bad things, and all the negative things. Get or make her a simple card with a few sentences. Remain positive and upbeat and dont persue or push. Maybe she will read the card and for just that one instant she will allow herself to remember what was good, and maybe even go so far as to think back to why she married you!


M42 W40
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M15
S13 S11
BD 7-14
A discovered 7-14
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D final 2-23-15
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Wet, anniversaries are very tough. I hope this lifts you up a little. smile

I've seen your humor, and I enjoy when you post jokes. I saw this on a card:


"I will always cherish the initial misconceptions I had about you."






Well, I'm using it.... wink

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Originally Posted By: Wet

"she's and adult now, and sometimes the only way for them to learn is for us to back off and let them fall. And then be there if they want our help down the road."

W's response? Crickets. She has no response, which is very unlike her. Was my telling my W my gameplan, where I am my backing off, and letting her make mistakes, and only coming to help if she asks me, was this revealing too much? It felt good to me, but let's see.




As much as this was directed at your Daughter...

The judgement that she probably felt, was enormous...

Easy with the truth darts...

An MLCer can smell judgement like Oprah smells a twinkie...

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Thanks bdub, Shining and Mach1. Y'all make me smile. "like Oprah smells a twinkie", I love it. As much as I enjoy Shining's suggested line to add to the Anniversary card, it is both smart and funny, and might make W pause for a moment, I will take Mach1's advice to go "easy on the truth darts".

Though W still thinks that I believe she is the "perfect wife", as stated on her dating profile, I am tempted to use Shining's line - it does fit perfectly. Hmmm, let's see how I feel tomorrow as I sign and send the card.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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"Thank You for 22 Years" (along with a smilie face instead of hearts or kisses)

Signed with your real name. (no "pet" names or anything like "husband")


M: A really long time.
Crisis: 5 years.
She's still worth it.

Life is never made unbearable by circumstances, but only by lack of meaning and purpose. -Viktor Frankl
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Hey Wet. I like your sense of humor. It will serve you well throughout all of this.

No one thing can make or break this because it is a long haul. I know you think that maybe something will spark a thought in her head about this, but, truthfully, as this point, she aint gonna hear it. So, dont sweat the text...but, yea, she isnt ready for truth darts right now.

I know people have different opinions about sending a card on anniversaries. Do it if you feel you should, without any expectations. The truth is that she says she doesnt want to be married at this time. I have found that they want to be heard. It angers them when they feel they arent.

It is hard stuff, this. Really hard. But I think there is always hope until you say there isnt.

This really is an amazing opportunity. I always say that while I wish I could have learned what I did in a different way, I am forever grateful for the journey.

So, the key to detaching is to learn to stop allowing her words or actions to effect yours. I know it's hard not to read into any kind of contact, but, it really doesnt serve you well to do it.

She is on her own journey. One that you dont really want to be involved in. Trust me on that. smile. Your job is this. Take care of you and your kids. Leave her to her crazy so you dont get any on you. It is on her to forge a relationship with the children. It is on you to cause no harm to it.

This has to play out. You get to decide how you want your part to look.

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Wet !!!

NOOOO!!!!

Don't REALLY USE IT!!!! It's a joke, not a real truth dart.... eek

Sorry... It was supposed to be for YOU just to laugh.....oh, dear. I'm causing trouble, now...

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Thanks FY and uRworthy, great stuff.

Any Dream Interpreters out there? W posted on FB today she's had a dream where all her teeth fall out. Some particulars that may have an effect on this - our 22nd anniversary is on Thursday. She is 48 years old, and she told me at s13's football game this past Saturday, "I'm really cold." 30 seconds later "I'm really boiling." Perhaps she is dating other men less frequently.

Anyone want to take a swing at interpreting this teeth falling out dream?


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

“The strongest of all warriors are these two — Time and Patience.” War and Peace
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She let something out of her mouth that she shouldn't have:

http://www.doctoroz.com/article/5-most-common-recurring-dreams


M:54, H:55
T:33, M:27
12/13 BD: EA
01/14 BD: PA, H leaves
03/14 H & OW break up
05/14 H says he will file for D
08/14 H initiates D
09/14 H wants to R
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Wet, my D13 just told me she was reading about this type of dream!! I hadn't heard of that before, but apparently it's not uncommon.

She read that it can mean "inner turmoil of being judged by others based on physical appearance." FWIW......

It's someone's theory, anyway.

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W, forgive me for not going back through all your posts, but, can you tell me how you know about when and whom your wife is seeing?

About the teeth dream...time for you to get out of her head, ya know? wink

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Hi uRworthy,

My W told me in February 2014 that she was on a big dating website, and by March she was going out every night (as reported by d18 (resulting in her fleeing the sitch by going to college out-of-state), and s13's failing grades). This led to our 3 month "trial divorce". I used to have access to W's email account, and so I know that as of this past mid-August, W was still on at least 2 dating sites.

I know, I know, dream interpretation will only lead me deeper into her crazy world. But I think its kind of interesting, the power of the brain is amazing. I found one site which suggests that a dream of teeth falling out might be related to a time of transition like menopause (which is why I brought up her 'hot flash' episode). http://www.dreamdictionarynow.com/teeth-falling-out-dreams/

But I like Nitty and Shining's analysis as well.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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I had the craziest dream last night. There is a new business moving into our building once the renovation on their space is done. Everything is quiet in my office until the new boss guy comes over and tells me it is time to come over there. Everything turns to chaos as the power goes out over there. All of these cubicles show up in my current office, Christmas decorations are everywhere. All of their employees are flowing in and then tons of my current clients but my current boss is gone. I am the only one that can help but someone has taken down my computer. It has all the programs I need. I am running around like a chicken with her head cut off.

I am sure that is an easy dream to figure out. I woke up exhausted from all the noise and chaos. smile I hope your day is nothing like my dream.

kat

Last edited by kat727; 09/24/14 01:01 PM.

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Kat it is great to see you back. Your stressful dream makes me stressed out. But even in the dream you are the one who has to fix everything, even without the tools (here, your computer) to do the work. Seems like there is a lot on your shoulders.

So I sent out the bland, boring Anniversary card today. No worries, Shining, I did not include your funny line in the card.

W has gone darker than normal on me, and I am not reaching out to her. S13 had a football game last night, but I chose to go church/Divorce Care instead. I go to every one of son's football games but this was on W's night, so I just decided time with other hurting people and some great praise and worship was what I needed last night.

But W didn't update me about the score of the game, which she normally does. I texted s13 after the game, and not surprisingly he did not respond. I'm feeling left out, but I will not reach out to W this week especially with the anniversary tomorrow.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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Quote:
No worries, Shining, I did not include your funny line in the card.


WHEW. Thank goodness.

Cuz that was giving ME nightmares. wink

Thinking about you this week, Wet. Feeling left out is not a fun way to feel. I hope the anniversary and the rest of the week go smoothly for you.

Zero expectations. Do something great for yourself tomorrow. Maybe go and get some new clothes for that trimmed-down physique of yours. smile

Think of all you're doing well.

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Thinking of you today. Hope you can find a way to make today a good one.

kat


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Thanks Kat and Shining. I had a fun night. Went to cooking class, and they taught us how to make breakfast meals and the craft beers that go with them - funny, I generally do not worry about which beer should go with my breakfast, but ok. I did find a new favorite stout beer - Nitro Milk Stout, made by Left Handed brewing. It's really tasty.

They also taught us how to make a couple kinds of biscuits. And a delicious Andouille sausage gravy. I can do this!
------------
So I felt kinda weird all day. No contact from W, and its our 22nd anniversary. Another badge of stupidity for me - W and I got married on my parent's 40th anniversary. So I went over to my parent's for lunch, gave them hugs on their 62nd anniversary, but while everyone in the family is happy for my parents, but there is a cloud of what is going on in my marriage which puts a shadow on the whole day.

So W called me after my cooking class. And progress, she called me her "soon to be ex-husband"! She admitted that we are still married! W sounded nervous, and she wanted to get off the phone as soon as she called me. But I had to talk to her about details of dealing with s13 and d17, that I needed to talk to her about.

So I was upbeat, and calmly talked to her about pick up time for s13 tomorrow, and whether d17 was still coming over to stay on Saturday and Saturday night. It was like a game, W wanted to go, but I would find another subject to talk to her about, mostly dealing with our kids. Finally, I allowed her to leave the torture of speaking to her husband, and ended the call. It was weird, I don't know what is going on with W, but something was up. Only time will tell.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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So I am thinking further about when W last night called me her "soon to be ex-husband", which she has never called me before. It is not something she would normally say (remember, she refused to say the "d" word when we were together) and I am guessing that she is on a support board for separated/divorced women similar to what DB is for me. I am hoping she has some support system to help her in getting through the day, and making the many tough choices she is facing. Or it could be something one of her dates said - that's the thing, who knows?

Before I receive a 2x4, I know, stay out of my W's head and stop trying to guess what she is thinking about. Keep the focus on me and my kids.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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Originally Posted By: Wet
A-So I am thinking further about when W last night called me her "soon to be ex-husband", which she has never called me before. It is not something she would normally say (remember, she refused to say the "d" word when we were together) and I am guessing that she is on a support board for separated/divorced women similar to what DB is for me. I am hoping she has some support system to help her in getting through the day, and making the many tough choices she is facing. Or it could be something one of her dates said - that's the thing, who knows?

B-Before I receive a 2x4, I know, stay out of my W's head and stop trying to guess what she is thinking about. Keep the focus on me and my kids.


I choose....

Paragraph "B"....

You learn well Grasshopper...

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Lol, thanks Mach1. I can't wait until I am to the point of being able to snatch the pebble from your hand.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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Owwww! Another punch in the gut from W. I spoke to W last night and she told me d17 would come stay at my place on Saturday and Saturday night (s13 comes with me for the weekend on Friday after school.) When I got to W's place, W does a flip and says to d17 that she has to go tonight instead. W's mantra is always "I need some time to myself!"

Here's the uncomfortable part - d17 responds to W "You know that you're not going to be alone tonight." W looks at me and I give her a sad shake of my head and I walked out.

As we were all going to my car W shouts out from the upstairs window that her best friend was about to become a first time grandmother, the water just broke. And then she added "that's what I have planned for tonight."

D17 gets in the car with me and says "how stupid does she think we are?" This is a tough encounter to take, because now it is so clear to even my sweet, pure d17 what my W is doing with her life. I know my feelings are strong enough right now that I want to end this pain. But feelings are deceptive, aren't they?


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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What hurts me the most by my W's actions is what it has done and is doing to our children. D20 stays with me, and has little contact with W. D18 was so upset by W's being on dates every night last spring with younger men, that she fled to school in another state. D17 told me last night that W continues to be out on most nights, and that she is upset.

And now our sweet d17, who as a youngin' would come out of the bath with a hooded towel and tell us "I'm Mother Theresa, I'm Mother Theresa", is being torn apart because of W's lifestyle. She has strong faith, and she lets W know that she disapproves. S13 was having nightmares all night, and screamed "Mom what are you doing?", and "Daddy don't!" It's too much to take. I see my family being torn apart from me one-by-one.

After a poor night's sleep, I am of a mind to find out from W if she is seeing someone special, or merely continuing to play around. I will serve divorce papers on her if she has found an OM. But if she is continuing to play around, then I will confront her and tell her she is acting crazy and discuss with her what her actions are doing to our kids. I want our youngest two children to be with their mother, but if she cannot see that they are more important than her catching up on what she feels like that she has missed out on life, then I will explore other options for our kids. Including taking them away from her.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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W was supposed to pick up d17 from my place before dinner time today. W calls me up and tells me she thinks either d17 or s13 took her car keys . The keys are lost again, 2nd time this week, and 3rd time in the past couple of weeks (this includes her having to retrieve her keys from a dumpster). After I had the kids check their keys to see if they accidentally took W's keys, they did not, and so I had d17 call W about this, and then d17 told me W was sobbing at the end of their conversation.

So I spoke with d17 on the ride back and told her she should be gentle with W because of what she is going thru, meaning she should not pick fights. And if she ever needs a break, I told her to please call me and I would love to spend more time with her and have her over. She told me she appreciated it.

So a nice moment this morning at my place. I made caramel rolls for breakfast, and d20, d17 and s13 were eating, and d18 called from Boston, and we each got to speak with her. It was nice to have all 4 kids be around, to laugh, and help me remember what our family is about.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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OK, I'm feeling like I need a chuckle today, and I hope that you will share it with me. I have put together a list of the craziest things I have encountered with my W's MLC. I hope that what I share will not only give you a smile, but also help you in facing whatever craziness you are facing with your MLC spouse. Here is Number 4 on my craziest things I have faced in my W's MLC:

4. W Encouraging Crazy Rich Old Guy on FB and with her telephone conversations. 2nd guy that gave me sleepless nights – he was so disrespectful to her by posting on her FB page saying “I paid for her”, speaking of a photo shoot. W hits it off with this guy with telephone conversations as he likes cats, and is also a photographer. Crazy Rich Old Guy eventually surprises W by flying in from California unannounced and stalks her for a few hours at her photo studio (she was not there). W responds by fleeing to another bf’s house to spend the night.

W doesn't even let me know what's going on, other than to ask me to take care of driving responsibilities for d17's orthodontist appointment and s13's practice. Crazy Old Rich Guy offered to give W her choice of anything at the local nice jewelry store, if she just had lunch with him, which she declined. When she told him that he was too old for her, she thinks he got a facelift for her. After this event, W tells me she broke off all contact with him, and he apologized for scaring her.

Last edited by Wet; 09/28/14 07:30 PM.

Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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number 5 on my list of the Craziest Things I've Experienced Through My W's MLC (yes, these are true stories). This one is about me, and my one attempt to date a young woman:

The date started with me predictably, I got lost on the way there (you should know I get lost all the time, but really this time it was Google Maps fault!) So I was 35 minutes late for the date, I know how to impress the ladies don't I?

So the date starts out with her bringing her dog, a Doberman Pinscher, and she tells me that he is coming along with us?! He is a good guard dog, and she wuvs him so much! So she puts him in the back of my car, and while we're driving he is whining the whole time.... It only gets worse!

So instead of being the funny, flirty woman I had a few emails and chats with, she clams right up. She says she's nervous at the restaurant, so I hold her hand and try to assure her we are going to have a fun night. She didn't even hold my hand back, she just kept it flat, kinda odd? But then I tried talking to her, and I am a trained Discussion leader, I know how to get someone else talking. But I found her to be the insurmountable Mt. Rushmore. Here is an example - Me: Oh, you saw the movie 'Gravity', I haven't seen it. Did you like it? Her: Yes. Me: Oh, what did you like about it? Her: Everything. I liked all of it.

After three more of her responses of liking "all" of something rather than giving me any discussion, or asking me any questions, things got worse, Then she started complaining about the people in her life. Aye!!! I then decided I was going to have fun with this. We had the most polite server ever. Every time I would say 'thank you', she politely would say "your welcome", but I would say three thank you's as she took away three plates, she would say "your welcome" each time. So I clued my date on what I was doing, and I thought I could find a way to break our server. I said, "thank you, thank you so much", a double thank you, there is no way she could defeat that. But the server easily got past my feeble attempt by saying, "your welcome. You are so welcome." I finally got a smile out of Miss Date.

So for some reason Miss Date brings up the topic of Russia, and that we should leave Russia alone until Russia invades America. Well, at least she's talking now??? Then she calls President Obama a Muslim, after I told her I'm not really into discussing politics. So I decided to egg her on, asking her "so you must really appreciate President Obama being our leader right now, because he will never stand up to Russia, right?" She just about leapt out of her chair, she got so mad at my question. I laughed and told her I was "egging" her on, but she then went on a tirade about how she can't wait until our President leaves office.

Now she also ordered King Crab legs. Not a big deal. But what made this unbearable, is that she wouldn't use the leg cracker the restaurant provided to open the legs. So every crab leg was torn apart, which made it take sooooooo much longer, and without good conversation, I was looking for the camera filming this because it had to be a prank. I hope that you all are laughing with me at this.

So the best laid plans of mice and men, no I wouldn't even escort her back to her door because of the darn dog! Not even a hug or a kiss. She did email me later that night saying that she thought the date went well. Lord, I am not ready for a dating life. Sigh...


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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My W called me today, and called me "hun". It's her first use of a pet name for me in over 2 months. She must really like me!

I'm sorry for the sarcasm. She said she can't pay her rent and so was out looking to find some money from people who owed her. She told me a couple of week's ago that her only paying client for her photography business was the boy with brain cancer, and his senior photo shoot. So her new business idea of dating website photos does not seem to be taking off.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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Does she think she is above getting a regular job and doing her photography on the side? It must be terrible being 48 and having to work.

I just don't get it. I have worked since I was 15 and sometimes 2 or 3 jobs at a time with 1 job always being full time. I get that I may not be the norm, but I don't think she is either.

kat


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I think the memory thing is a side effect of the MLC crazy .... my W can not get our schedule with the S down yet .. 10 months later, I have him the exact same 3 nights a week, she also seems to be having $$ issues ... had me transfer some over as she "didnt have time, next day I got to buy lunch, and also we should take my car up north because she is worried about miles on her, (plus the empty gas tank) ... I just played along.


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Hi Kat, you have the gift of Wisdom and Common Sense. My W separated from me over 15 months ago. The MLC makes her only think of what she has been missing out on life. Reality is here - I thought her parent's were helping her with the rent. I guess I was wrong.

She mentioned getting a "2nd job" in today's conversation. One where she really has to work, get a real paycheck, which she hasn't had during the past 20 years of our marriage.

CaiGuy, the focus on $$$ and things like gas money is noticeable with my W. When she lost her car keys last weekend, she told me how sorry she was for me having to drive our d17 and the expense of the gas. I live 10 minutes away from her and it's all highway miles. It seemed like an odd comment to me at the time, but it does show where her focus is now.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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I was hit with W's ball of confusion this morning. She is leaving for an overnight stay to help a female friend who is having health issues, a couple of hours away. So she asked me to take s13, and make sure he gets to school tomorrow. I agree.

W has been calling me lately, so I call her this morning and ask when I can pick up s13 this afternoon. She's leaving at 2 pm, so it doesn't matter, anytime after he gets home from school. End of conversation.

I remember a 2nd question, and call W right back. She chuckles. What time does school start? She had no idea. Look it up on the website. Seems kind of odd that since she has him during the school week that she doesn't know when the school starts, but ok.

I check the school website, and sure enough school is canceled both tomorrow and Friday. I call W for a third time, I ask if she missed me, and she jokes right back that she must have since I keep calling her. And I let her know that there is no school the next two days, and that I can't take s13 tomorrow as I will be in the hospital myself. So s13 and 17 will be by themselves until she comes back sometime tomorrow. Not ideal, but it is what it is.

How does W not know that the kids don't have school the next two days. I just don't understand having that kind of confusion over her and our kid's schedule. Glad I was there to clear away the confusion before it was too late though. Crazy.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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Originally Posted By: Wet
I remember a 2nd question, and call W right back. She chuckles. What time does school start? She had no idea. Look it up on the website. Seems kind of odd that since she has him during the school week that she doesn't know when the school starts, but ok.

I check the school website, and sure enough school is canceled both tomorrow and Friday. I call W for a third time, I ask if she missed me, and she jokes right back that she must have since I keep calling her. And I let her know that there is no school the next two days, and that I can't take s13 tomorrow as I will be in the hospital myself. So s13 and 17 will be by themselves until she comes back sometime tomorrow. Not ideal, but it is what it is.

How does W not know that the kids don't have school the next two days. I just don't understand having that kind of confusion over her and our kid's schedule. Glad I was there to clear away the confusion before it was too late though. Crazy.


Wait.....you didn't know either.....

This goes back to that judgement thing I was talking about the other day....

If it comes across in your thoughts, it will come through in your words, and will come through in your actions eventually...


As far as what time school starts ???

I have two teenagers too, and I have 50% custody, and I couldn't tell you what time their school starts either....

The oldest gets the bus at 6:50 , and gets home at 2:40.

My Son gets on the bus at 7:36, and gets home at 3:35...

What time does school start ?

I don't have a clue. Prolly somewhere in the middle ??

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I will admit .. my memory is worse now than before too. And Wet .... totally get it .. I often have to ask the schedule, where to go for certain things concerning S and his school, just because now I am more involved and have never done these things .. they were in her domain for as long as we have had a child. I do not mind doing it .. and I think sometimes they resent us for this.

The memory thing ... yeah .. I think its worse for the MLCrs but us LBS's are not immune either, just last week I rode my Harley to work, left the keys in it and on .... why ... my mind was preoccupied with WAW and a curve she threw me. I can not imagine all the things and ideas bouncing around in theirs .... probably why we smack each other around with 2x4's for attempting the impossible mind read with em eh? laugh


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I just wonder why it is a problem for your kids to stay home together during the day. Does she live in a bad neighborhood? I mean they are 13 and 17. They won't be alone. Heck, I was babysitting when I was 13.

Is tomorrow your surgery?

Also I would get in the habit of printing off the school calendar month by month. Just good to stay connected. Hang in there.

kat


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Another thing that causes memory loss? Stress. Seems fairly normal to me that both you and your W would not remember things that previously, together, you did. Stress is biatch.

When I was believing my ex's junk (i.e. still on the train) I forgot things. There were also things, like Caliguy, I had to learn because in the past we were a team. As a member of a team, I did things regularly to the point of not thinking about it. Others, she did. When she left, there was a learning curve for us both.

It's not all nefarious smile

The mind reading? Yeah, it's easy to fall into that judgemental trap. Try to avoid that and stop expecting things you use to expect. The less you expect from her, the less you'll be disappointed.


AJ


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The other shoe has dropped. I sat down and talked with d20, who saw W yesterday. W is no longer dating lotsa other men. W told d20 that she has now narrowed it down to one other man.

I don't know why this hurts more than when my W was dating with many other guys. I guess it is now real, that W may move forward, get a divorce, and marry this other guy that makes this a bit more real.

Some bits about the OM. He has multiple sclerosis, and one leg is shorter than the other. He is funny. He is an accountant. He has the same first name as I do. When will she sign the d papers? W needs to get her own lawyer first, to make sure she gets more.

It's a new day, and I know I don't like the direction.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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Now more than ever put that focus back on you and your kids. If what your daughter said floored you, imagine what it is doing to her. With your two youngest living with her (why are they living with her again?) imagine how it is tearing them up watching their mother act like a lost, crazy person.

I know you keep trying to figure her out but she doesn't make sense. None of them do. You need to stop looking there for answers. Look inside yourself, stay strong for your kids and help get the 5 of you on a healthy track.

Your wife chose her path and she needs to get through it herself. There is no speeding it up or talking sense to her.

Hang in there.

kat


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Quote:
I know you keep trying to figure her out but she doesn't make sense. None of them do. You need to stop looking there for answers. Look inside yourself, stay strong for your kids and help get the 5 of you on a healthy track.



^^^^^^ TRUE DAT. ^^^^^

Remember their emotions are everywhere....she could change her mind tomorrow, or in 10 minutes.

Take one day at a time, and let her bounce like a racquetball. She'll do whatever she does.

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Thanks Kat and Shining. I was in the hospital today. I had two sedated MRI's, and they took good care of me. This should be the last step before I have my neuro-surgeries on my spine to fix my neuropathy in my lower legs (lack of feeling) and the weakness in my left side.

W is giving me some homemade chicken noodle soup, a nice gesture by her. I have not told her about the upcoming surgeries. I'm sorting out my feelings of why it is that I am not telling her...


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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Because she isn't acting like someone that has your best interests at heart. Do you have someone to help you after the surgery?

kat


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It seems to me that we all go through "good" times and "difficult" times in our lives. What doesn't kill you, makes you stronger, right? Such is life. Since we know that is the case, how you handle both of those times in your life is important.

It also seems to me that you're lacking a "finality" from your W when it comes to the relationship. The thing is, you obviously won't get that from her. If she's interviewing potential mates, while still married to you, it's not likely you'll get that closure. From her anyway.

At what point do you stand up and decide you've had enough? I'm not suggesting you should. Things could change quickly. But you will need to ask and answer that question, my friend.

I hope your MRI's come back and they find an easy solution. I'm sure you'll be fine either way. I do know it could be much worse, but hopefully it's minor work to get you healthy, physically.

As for your emotions... That's waiting on you. No pill. No magic bullet. No quick fix. Just hard work. A lot like rehab where you need to take one small step at a time to get back to health.

If you think of your life as a start and end point, this is all stuff along the way, Wet. Keep perspective. What seems good or bad may not seem that way in the bigger picture. I know it's not what you wanted, but that doesn't mean things are not going to be good or better than you imagined. Remember that.

In my case, I spent a lot of time first upset about W's behavior and how it affected her, me, the kids. After a while, I wasn't worried about me. Then not about her. I'll always be vigilant about the kids. I let her club me like a baby seal when it came to the separation etc. I helped her pack. Twice smile

Looking back? I could have done all kinds of things differently. I wouldn't change a thing though. Unlike a MLCr, we don't need anger to let go. We have the tools, or we are capable of making the tools, to deal with what comes and be better for it. We're able to see the reality without getting depressed, angry, etc.

The reality is your W is not the person you know and you're still catching up to that. Your human. You care.

Now how do you deal with it and everything else sliding around in your life right now? Because it won't stay this way. You already know that. Things will continue to change and evolve whether you participate or instigate or do nothing.

My suggestion? Focus on you and your health and your kids, and let the rest take care of itself. It will. You don't need to hurry anything or even think about it to make that happen, my friend. But you do need to focus on you and your health. And part of that is your healthy outlook (which is already pretty good).

Let us know how the MRI's turn out.

AJ


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Hi Kat, yes my parents will take care of me and my father is still able to drive. I saw my best friend (and 5 other guys from my high school days) at lunch today. He offered to take a day off of work to drive me, sit with me on my day for surgery, which was nice. My brother and sister would help if I ask them, so I have a good group of support around me.

But the group at lunch all made fun of me today for still being married, but I explained why - that today I'm not ready to start the divorce, but I'm closer to being ready. That I meant it when I vowed on our wedding day even in "good times or in bad" "until death do us part". And one of my other friends emailed me after saying he respected me for that. Nice seeing the old group.

And Kat I only have a 2 bedroom apartment right now, so it is too small to take all three kids here with me. After I deal with my surgeries, I hope to go full bore on getting a new, better paying job, which may let me get a bigger place. It's not the right time for that, but all in its right time. I need to get the feeling back in my feet first. Priorities are my health right now.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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Why am I so petty? I had a bickering match with W as I picked up s13 tonight. My mindset as I headed to W's place was that I was ready for battle. I thought W would bring her OM to see our children, which was against our initial rules - wait until after the divorce to expose our kids to anyone. So I went in expecting OM to be there, because I know my W isn't thinking clearly right now.

I go to her place, and sure enough there is a guy in her place. It turns out to be her landlord. I shake hands with him, but my mind is still ready for a battle. W introduces me to LL as "her ex-husband". We have to go thru this again? I correct her by saying that I am "her husband". LL says he sees where s13 gets his looks, and he says that this is a complement. "Thank you", and LL flees W's place, seeing our emerging battle. W says again "he is my ex-husband".

Is she provoking me? Is she just trying to p*ss me off? I let her get under my skin, but I quickly put my game face back on and spoke with d17 for a bit. I was all smiles after this, W complemented how nicely I was dressed (I came straight from work). But I know the day is coming where W will bring up the OM, and I don't know how I will respond.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
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I think she is trying to convince herself that she isn't married. Because if she isn't married, she can keep on behaving badly. She doesn't like to be reminded that she isn't a free woman.

My ex told me we weren't married just because a piece of paper in some courthouse said that we were. Go figure. My ex still hasn't come out of lala land. Still thinks the kids should love his wife since he does. He doesn't think that she was his affair partner should have anything to do with anything. They aren't thinking of anyone but themselves during this time.

It isn't easy.

kat


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Hi Kat, thank you for sharing your story about your ex. I keep wanting to say to W "we're married in the eyes of God and the state of Minnesota." But I won't. She can't hear me, and tells herself things to help her get through her day. I think I get it.

Journaling - So I had a nice weekend with s13. We went shopping, got some food to get through the weekend, and he loves playing Madden football right now. We keep having good-natured arguments over things like who would be the best running back for his team - he likes Lesean McCoy, and I tell him to get Arian Foster, and then a good cornerback. It's fun. He made it to the division finals, which got him really revved up. I think he has more fun crafting and assembling the best team, than actually playing the game.

I made s13 stop playing Madden long enough to watch 'Ride Along' with d20 and I. It was not appropriate for a child his age, but my standard on things and what I let slide has long since passed.

I got a text this morning from W asking me to keep s13 until after dinner bc she was at a local waterfalls, which we used to go to as a family. She didn't take any of the kids, perhaps she took her new OM, or maybe a photo shoot with the beautiful scenery. I have tried to keep my mind occupied so that I do not think about it, and I don't know anything anyways. The imagination is a powerful thing, isn't it?

So as I was getting ready to take s13 back to W's place, W calls and asks me to keep him until after 8 pm. She has a flat tire, AAA is on the way, and her cell phone is dying, so she can't buzz s13 in to the building when he arrives. I call d17 who is at W's place, and she tells me she can let s13 in. I get burgers for everyone including W, in case she is hungry when she gets back to her place. I have not heard back from her since.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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A quick update. W's flat tire, she finally got a tow at 8:45 pm tonight. She's texting me for some reason, and I (stupidly) ask her why she joined AAA when our insurance coverage covered this. I canceled her car from the insurance coverage back on July 10th (long story, but it was posted on the board at the time).

She was mad at me. She said our insurance agent told her last Friday that her car insurance was canceled by me, and she is driving without insurance. This was not exactly true, I transferred the insurance to my W, and she was to pay it. No, I did not explain the niceties to my W. But for the insurance agent to take 3 months to tell her is not right.

Then d20 tells me W has a ticket that is unpaid from the time W drove d20's truck (again, going back to the July 10th event.) The ticket was left in d20's glove compartment. If W hasn't paid her ticket, her license may be pulled. W may have no license, no insurance, something bad is going to happen.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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She's a big girl. Time for her to grow up and deal with her problems. Not your job to save her from her mess. The only chance she has to come out of this is for her to feel her choices.

Kind of like my s19. I can't fix his situation. I can just be here and love him and know that I support him. Trainwreck is coming.

kat


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Why do you say that's "bad" Wet? Is see it as it is what it is. Events happened, consequences are required.

Good or bad don't seem to be something we can see at this point. Who knows? She may look back on that moment as the best thing that ever happened to her. Later. smile

Hers to deal with. She wanted freedom and autonomy etc? This is your chance to show you listened and don't think of her as a child.

AJ


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Last night I went to s13's football game. I went fearing the worst. Because of W's flat tire, I expected W to be with new OM. Game was late 8 pm kickoff. It looked like she was alone, so I made my way over to where she was sitting. And I sat near W.

It turns out W's sister and bil came to the game also. They are prayer partners with me for W to be healed of whatever it is that is causing her to seek the attention of other men, and for protection of our children. It was chilly, and W had a down sleeping bag she was wrapped up in. She asked if I wanted to share it with her. I declined, saying I wanted to give her some space. I thought I was funny with my double-meaning.

It was a good game, s13's team crushed the other team, with lotsa big plays. I was chatting mostly with bil about the game, and the top players, and the Timberwolves. W was considerate, there was no texting. W chatted with her sister. We talked a bit about the kids. It was pleasant.

Somehow the sister got W to talk about her snoring and her sleep apnea machine, and I was asked what I preferred W to sleep with. I told her I liked the snoring, because I could then gently roll her over and massage her back as I did so. W liked that, and gave me a smile and a wink.

After the game we walked a ways to our cars. W asked me about my "ankles", (my neuropathy) and I told her I was seeing a doctor today to give me my gameplan for dealing with it. (I actually am seeing a neuro-surgeon, but I've decided not to tell W about this.) W asked me to call her after my appointment to give her the details, but I tried talking to s13 and change the subject, but she kept pressing, and I eventually told her "probably not".

She told me to stop being like that, and kept pressing me to make sure to tell her what the doctor says. I waved goodbye, and drove home. It is nice that she is showing concern, but I won't let her try and be there while she is seeing OM. It's too painful.

Any suggestions for deflecting W's attempts to get information from me on my upcoming surgeries?


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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I saw my surgeon today, and I guess this is good news. He scheduled me for an "urgent" surgery this Friday. He's moving quickly bc of the seriousness of my neck/spinal column issues. But its never really a good doctor's appointment when my doctor uses the phrase "life threatening".

I have not told W yet, and I probably will keep the information as bland as possible. I will talk to d20 and d18 to let them know of the seriousness of what is taking place on Friday. But I have to tell W something as I was scheduled to have s13 and d17 this weekend.

I could be laid up as much as 6 weeks, but for the self-employed, this won't work. Let's see what is in store with this new turn in my life. Hopefully, working legs and better health.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
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Wet, you'll be in my thoughts and prayers for Friday.

(((((Wet)))))

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I understand why you don't want to tell her but with it being pretty serious I think you do need to tell her something. I know you don't want her back because you have health issues but at the same time it could go towards waking her up a bit.

All of this stress isn't good for anyone. Thoughts and prayers are with you.

kat


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Oh man, Wet. You have a lot going on. I'm sorry you have to go for surgery, but hopefully it is the fast-track for healing and feeling great.

That's a tough one with telling w. I don't know what to say...

But I will keep you in my thoughts and prayers! Hang tough, Wet!

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Nice to hear there is a gameplan. I assume there's a second opinion in there somewhere as well right?

As for the W? What's the difference what you tell her? She wanted to be gone, so it's just business really. You can share as much or as little as YOU are comfortable with and that's going to have to do. But you will have to tell her something since you won't be able to take the kids for a little while.

Be realistic, Wet. It'll suck for a bit and then you'll get better. But there is the business of the kids and you will need help in that department. Either from W or from others.

What would you tell business associates about what's going on? That might be a similar approach to the W and what you tell her.

Personally, I find direct honesty a good policy. How much detail or how little is based on my comfort with sharing personal details.

Be well and I hope it goes better than expected.

AJ


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Thanks everyone. I'm feeling much stronger this morning. Kat and AJ, I respect you both and your advice so much, I will talk to W today. I'm not sure what I'll say, but I will let her know about the seriousness of Friday's surgery. "Direct honesty" is a good policy, and she deserves that right now as the mother of our 4 children.

But I have removed her as my health care agent. I'm not a fool.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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Hope all goes well for you Wet ... we go through all this and then life has a funny way of letting us know there is still room on the plate for more issues!! Just not fair sometimes.


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I spoke to the W today. My emotions are running wild, and she's annoying me today. So I spoke with W and let her know that I cannot take the kids for the weekend as I am having surgery, and that it is serious. W made me mad by saying that she never knew that I've had neuorpathy in both legs (which I guess I have now had for 3 years), and I have told her repeatedly that this was something I've had an ongoing battle with. She asked where the surgery was going to be at, and I made a joke out of it, and I rattled off 4 different hospitals, and then confessed my mind was confused, I didn't know where the surgery would be at. W got upset.

Then W texts me saying its unfair to d17 and s13, so they should be there, that it was unfair to make d20 (who is driving me to the hospital) go thru this alone. D20 will not go thru this alone as my Mom and Dad, brother, his wife, and sister will be there at the hospital. I don't respond.

I let her know that I would like to be at her place Thursday to give d17 and s13 to give them hugs. She tells when I can come over, which was nice.

The next text from W is what set me off. W texts:

I will always care for you, and I will always love you. I left you because I can't be married to you. Not because I don't care for you.

I shot off a text response:

Love and marriage takes a lot of work, which neither of us were able to do. So all I hear from you is blah, blah, blah, blah.

My physical today went well, it looks like it's all engines go for Friday's surgery.

Last edited by Wet; 10/08/14 09:29 PM.

Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
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Wet. You wanted honesty from your W right? Isn't that what you got right there?

She cares. She loves you. She can't be married to you. i.e. it's not about you. Her actions seem to back that up if you think about it.

She's messed up and she knows it. But it's not that she doesn't respect you nor love you (in her way, vs. what you would expect).

Is there more to the story?

Glad you have the support you are going to need. Hope it goes well and you recover twice as fast as they expect you to smile

AJ


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Originally Posted By: Wet
The next text from W is what set me off. W texts:

I will always care for you, and I will always love you. I left you because I can't be married to you. Not because I don't care for you.

I shot off a text response:

Love and marriage takes a lot of work, which neither of us were able to do. So all I hear from you is blah, blah, blah, blah.

My physical today went well, it looks like it's all engines go for Friday's surgery.



I'm glad that you at least recognized that your emotions were high...

Cause you sure did act on them here....

Your response to her was pretty guilt laden, and pretty disrespectful towards how she feels...

I know that you don't really feel that way, or you wouldn't be posting here to save your Marriage...

So why show her something that isn't true ? And filled with guilt, and judgement once again (what is up with that anyway ? )

I hope that your surgery goes well buddy....

And really think about who you are inside, and the message that you send when you are interacting with her....

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Ow. That did not go at all as I expected. I just met W, and after I confronted W about her "adulterous" affair, she told me she will see her attorney next week to file our divorce.

I have my scary surgery tomorrow morning. So I went to W's place to give s13 and d17 a hug and tell them I love them. I did not want my last words to W to be my last text where I told her "blah, blah, blah". So I was realllly trying to say nothing but comforting and uplifting words.

So the issue is why I would not tell W which hospital I was having my surgery. We both agreed d17 should be at the hospital with my family. I suggested d17 stay overnight at my parents and they could all drive together. W snapped, no, d17 will be here, and she would drive d17 to hospital. And then W's deadly question came:

"Why don't you want me to be at the hospital with you?"

I told her the truth - that because W was in an adulterous relationship, I did not want her there. Then I came down on her that she even told our d20 about this, which was not right.

W countered but you've been on dates. I calmly explained that we had agreed to a 3 month trial divorce, but that is now over. Then I made sure that she keeps OM away from our children, and she agreed.

Then I asked W why she has not signed the divorce agreement I prepared and gave to her in March. She says she would not sign that, and that she is seeing her attorney next week. The divorce papers will be coming.

The weird thing about this was that there was no emotion, no yelling, just stone cold attitudes from both of us.

I have never confronted my W about her behavior at any time during our separation. So I felt good that I finally told her that what she was doing was wrong. I still have no emotion about this, but instead a feeling of resignation that our 22 year marriage finally is coming to an end.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
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I had two thoughts reading your last couple of posts. The first was maybe it is time to let her go. Really let her go. Not the I am hoping this all works my way kind of let her go, but the ok, I am letting you go and do whatever it is you have to do and I am going to be doing the same, for me.

The second thing was that for every strong and sturdy building there is a strong foundation. The old is all torn down and the new is built up. Let go of what was. You can't go back there, to where you used to be. Anything that comes now will be new.

You will go into surgery tomorrow and come out with a new lease on your life. You will be given a fresh start. Make the most of it.

kat


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Sage advice as always Kat. Thank you. Yes, as you can see from my interactions with W this week, I no longer am caring to just back off and let W be. And W is showing that she is done as well, and so you are correct. I need to drop the proverbial rope, and let the divorce move forward. I feel I am in a much better place to accept this now as compared to when I first joined the board.

Thanks Mach1 for pointing out my being judgmental toward my W. You are correct. What I tolerated before, and acted "as if" it didn't matter to me, I am no longer tolerating. I also am making sure the first priority is that our kids are protected from W and her actions. Wish me well tomorrow!


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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Good luck Wet with the operation. You will come thru in flying colors with a new beginning waiting for you. You will make the right decisions. Just make sure they are for you and your children and not out of anger. I am at the same place as you are. I have to accept how ill my wife is and let her go as well. I expect to see my divorce finished this year in time for the new year. New year and a new beginning.


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Wishing you a speedy recovery!

kat


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Thank you everyone for your support and prayers. I am doing well.

So the surgeon placed three spacers in my neck spine. And this immediately provided the spinal fluid to the rest of my spine, which was missing. I already feel strength increasing in my left arm. The doctor told me that I should feel 5 years younger, and that I probably was worn down in the afternoons (yes) and that I should have new amounts of energy to help with this.

I was up walking about shortly after the surgery. Even though the surgeon put a plate to connect the three spine parts in the back of my throat, I've been able to eat soft foods. I've also been to my 1st physical therapy, and all is going better than expected or could have been hoped for.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

“The strongest of all warriors are these two — Time and Patience.” War and Peace
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So glad to hear things went well with the surgery, Wet! I hope your doc is right, and you have more energy than before. smile

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Very nice to hear!


AJ


"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter" MLK
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Today I am wise, so I am changing myself."
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So glad everything went well. So you should have more energy and better movement. That is great! It should also help you deal with things better since you will feel better.

Now start living for you!

kat


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Nice to hear it all went well!!


M: 48
W: 47
M16 T26-S8
BD Sept13



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Just checking in. Hope things are still on the upside.

kat


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I am back at my apartment now, and I love my parents so much, but I had to get out of there.

Weird communication with W. She visited me on Sunday and said she would bring over d17 and s13 to visit on Thursday/today. So I spoke to W earlier and I asked if she could drop the kids off for a bit today. She said she would later in the day, and everything was fine.

Then in the late afternoon I receive a text from d17 asking if we could reschedule the visit until tomorrow, "because Mom's not feeling well." I reply "of course".

Then 10 minutes later d17 texts me saying they are on their way. Huh? OK, we watched a movie together. But half way through the movie, W calls up and asks if she can take the kids back to her place. I let W know we still had an hour left in the movie, and she tells me that she got her haircut and then said she had nothing to do, I invited her over to my place. And she accepted.

W ends up taking a bath at my place, because her condo only has showers. Kinda weird, but ok. We got to watch the movie and the kids liked it, and I appreciated having the extra time with them. W gave me a hug, offers to bring over food (I politely decline, I am well stocked with food), and there was no after-effect from last week's convo where she told me she was seeing her divorce attorney. She was physically hurting, but otherwise she was nice.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

“The strongest of all warriors are these two — Time and Patience.” War and Peace
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Over a week from my surgery. I’m lonely and bored. I have been praying ‘Nitty’s prayer’ over W to turn her over to God and praying that she return to God. I rarely pray for our marriage.

I am in pain for most of the day and I cannot get to sleep at night. Wearing the neck collar 24x7 is annoying. And there is not much progress in having feeling return to my legs. My left arm is really slow in returning any strength. I’m getting frustrated.

And W called me today telling me that she has no money. She has $3300 in repairs for her Jaguar, and that is all the money she has from the sale of the last of her cats/kittens. And d18 (out-of-state) needs help, she doesn’t have any money to pay rent.

W asked me to deal with college's financial aid person to find out where the d18's loans are at, especially the Perkins loan which can be used to help pay for housing expenses. I agreed.

I want to pay d18’s rent, but I don't have any money to pay my own bills. And now being out of work for 2 weeks is only going to put me farther behind. I feel handcuffed, and not in a good way - grin.

One really positive thing though – I weighed myself after the surgery and I lost another 10 pounds. I’ve now lost a total of 86 pounds. Amazing, this is not from me. I haven't exercised in a few weeks.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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Kind of like kinetic energy - your body will continue to burn calories once you build muscle mass. Additionally, while it tries to heal, it needs more calories. Your weight loss isn't a surprise considering all of that and your new soft diet.

Don't worry - it bounces back quickly. smile

You need to find a hobby before you go stir crazy. And realize frustration is not always a bad thing. It can be motivating..

AJ


"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter" MLK
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Today I am wise, so I am changing myself."
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Thanks for stopping by Tom. It means a lot to me. I suppose we all have to ride out the rough waves now and then.

Can you do some work on line while you are home? Just thinking out loud. Jobs seem to be on my mind.

kat


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An update with my dealings with W. My W's last words to me before my surgery were that she was seeing an attorney to move forward with the divorce.

Today, she "tagged" me on a family photo on FB - well she tried, all of us in the family were listed, but it was a photo of just d20 with her Bible life verse. A nice photo, I am assuming it was a nice idea. W is doing a fall photograph special and showing off some of her nice photographs from previous fall photoshoots. She's talented.

I happened to check her FB status, and she no longer lists herself as "single", but she's in a "relationship". Who is the relationship with? It's with ME!? This caught me off guard, as we hardly speak anymore. But I'm OK with it.

So she called me today to see how I'm doing with my post-surgery recovery. It was very nice of her to call, so I tell her I'm doing well. She tells me about her hopes of getting some money in thru her photography special, and I told her that I bet she will get lots of clients from this "special rate". Nice conversation.

I ask about the youngest two kids and how they are doing (I've sent texts and an email, with no response) and I miss them. W tells me s13 missed the bus, and so she drove him to school today. She ended up going the wrong way on a 1-way and a police officer was there. She explained the confusion to the officer, and this is the first year at this school, but the officer still gave her a ticket. I flirt a little and say, even with your "pretty smile"? She laughs and said she should have shown a little more cleavage. We both laugh, she was going to talk some more, but I gently end the our talk and say I had to run. Very nice, but I understand the inevitable paperwork is still on its way.


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

“The strongest of all warriors are these two — Time and Patience.” War and Peace
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Keep watching her actions, not her words. She said she is going to the lawyer but what she does is reconnect herself to you on Facebook. Keep being how you are with just that smidge of distance. See if she continues to connect.

Hope you are feeling better.

kat


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Hey Wet. I'm glad things went well with the surgery. It must be a relief to have it over. I am hoping your recovery is going well and you are finding yourself stronger with each day.

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Thanks everyone for your encouraging words post-surgery. Today is make fun of lawyers day (yes, I'm a lawyer which allows me to make fun of myself). Two quips today:

-from Movie Law:

A lawyer with a briefcase can steal more than 100 men with guns.
-Don Corleone, The Godfather.

************************************************************
-from TV Law:

As your lawyer, I can’t stop you from lying, I can’t even be in the same room, but I would be remiss if I didn’t prep you to lie better.
-Stacy Warner, House M.D.

Enjoy your day!


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

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"As your lawyer, I can’t stop you from lying, I can’t even be in the same room, but I would be remiss if I didn’t prep you to lie better.
-Stacy Warner, House M.D."

Love it. House used to be one of the W and I's favorite shows.


Me 47 - W 35
M 9 - T 10
2 Daughters - 7 & 9
Discovery of EA- 8/4/14
S - 8/5/15
D mentioned - 9/11/14
R & Piecing - 3/17/15
Regard one another as more important than yourselves.
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Love the humor, Wet. Always have.

As for the other advice to watch and just be you? To not anticipate (that's hard isn't it?). I highly suggest doing that. Focus on getting you healed and better. Worry about the rest if/when it happens wink

AJ


"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter" MLK
Put the glass down...
"Yesterday I was clever so I wanted to change the world
Today I am wise, so I am changing myself."
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Jefe and AJ, I am glad to have made you smiled. My new thread at: http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2500440&#Post2500440


Me-54 yrs; W: 50 yrs
4 kids- D: 22,20,19; S:15
"Trial" Divorce: 04/14 - 6/14
Separated: 06/2013- divorced 08/2016

“The strongest of all warriors are these two — Time and Patience.” War and Peace
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