I'm still here, GALing like crazy, reading up on all you DBers at bedtime.
Nothing new to report, other than despite two major pronouncements of wanting to "talk about our future", GUBU has not said a peep about anything.
We've been working together on splitting and stacking wood, two days in a row, so I was right there if he wanted to say anything.
Guess he didn't! Our interactions were pleasant enough, he seemed pretty upbeat. Nothing weird.
I'm starting to get the distinct impression that he wants ME to bring it up. Which I will not.
Next time he mentions this, I'll suggest that since he's into writing these days, perhaps he should write his thoughts in a letter. That way I could digest what he has to say without a lot of emotion. I think this is the only way he's going to be able to spit it out.
We had a bit of a weird text exchange on Sunday evening after he left. Nothing bad, just some emotional things about how he feels his roommate situation is dysfunctional since she is a caretaker and he's like her (really messed up) father.
Hey--HE said it, I didn't!
Then some rambling on my part, guess I let my guard down. I said something about his "comfort zone" and he said:
"You have no idea what my comfort zone is."
To which I responded, "I know it's SMALL. And finding people who will fit neatly into it doesn't change that fact. If you want to live confined by your fears, that's up to you. But I choose not to."
And-- TRUTH GRENADE: "I have no doubt that now your "comfort zone" embraces all kinds of (WEIRD KINKY PORN STUFF) that you are interested in having other people do for you." "The problem arises when you are unwilling to meet the needs of your partner because it requires you extend yourself in ways that make you uncomfortable, where you risk rejection or failure."
In our marriage, he rarely did anything he "wasn't comfortable with" and that included a LOT. He knows this, he knows I'm right about everything I said.
Perhaps I should have kept my texting mouth shut, no doubt I should have. But I am getting sick of this song and dance and just felt I had to say something.
I even said, "I apologize for the medium, but these things weigh on me and sometimes I just have to speak my mind."
And "Like my mother always said, I might not like what you're doing, but I will always love you."
(Oops! Later I realized what I said, but at the time I was thinking--like love from a relative--not "romantic love." Oh well.)
I went on to say I think I was just collateral damage from when he was unhappy and trying to do things to make himself feel better. That I didn't believe he was the kind of man who didn't care who he hurt. How I believed his inherently good qualities outweigh his questionable actions.
How I was sorry that I didn't realize how unhappy he had been and how I was sorry that I was not enough, or couldn't do/say/be enough so that wasn't the case. That I have wracked my brain and couldn't find anything I could have done that would have changed much of anything in the end.
How I didn't believe he ever meant to hurt me, I was just in the path of destruction, and that I believe he has hurt himself as much as, if not more, than me.
I also said that I have forgiven him.
Not for him, but for myself, so I could move forward and let go of that pain.
And I apologized again for venting, that I expected him to tell me to go f*ck myself, and that I was probably the last person who's opinion he wanted to hear.
To all this, he replied.
"No harm. Be well. We'll talk tomorrow. Goodnight...."
But I felt like I need to give him a bit of input--something to work with here. He has been taking MY temperature off and on, and I've been pretty vague.
I guess this was my way of throwing some stuff out there. Give him something to chew on a bit, without expectation from him.
Nothing I said required a response, I just shared my thoughts. I also did not say anything which would come off as pursuit, or would indicate I am willing to take him back without major changes.
I just tried to own my part in things, let him know I still cared, and say I was sorry for not seeing things more clearly.
(This is on the tails of an exchange last week where I talked about my healing, how being alone has been very good, how I'm getting into my own rhythm, no distractions... in other words---I'm in NO HURRY FOR HIM TO COME HOME.)
That's all for now, dear readers.
More to come....
Your Pal,
The Goat Gal
---(G)GGG
Me 54 Him 63 M 23 T 29 0 Kids Funny Farm of Rescues 12/12 OW-- 5/13 ILYBINILWY: A denied 9/13 Proof OW: ENDED 2/14 Got D papers on my BD I kicked him out for my sanity 9/14 He wants to "talk"?
Sometimes one just has to unleash true, uncensored, and unvarnished thoughts to the MLCer and one's feeling about the problem/situation. We cannot just tip toe around all over the place all the time like Tinkerbell. It is very tiring to keep all of that up constantly.
Sometimes we all feel like turning the STFU juice bottle upside down and just let it empty onto the ground.
I do have those moments. Especially tonight when I am feeling particularly overwhelmed, cranky, stressed, and confused. Received a response from Ms. Wonka this morning. To top it off, me and my hot girl are no more. Talk about massive confusion! I digress...
Back to you...
You're doing really good, GGG. It is all on GUBU to finish up with his naval gazing and make a DECISION either way. Yep, I think he is massively afraid of rejection. I suspect it's because he KNOWS how much damage he's done to you, himself and the marriage.
It's hellva way to climb down and own up to your chit. Heck, it took me a while to do this as well after coming on the boards and seeing the MLC forums. Seeing the massive damage caused a seismic shift in my perspective and perception on Ms. Wonka and our relationship.
Yes, I agree that sometimes you just have to throw something out there. I suppose I could have done it better, time-wise, or with less emotion (which I don't think he picked up on, but I was teary while I was writing.)
I find myself back on the roller-coaster again. GUBU has been vague and manipulative again, just little piddly things.
Some things are starting to affect my PMA...
His immediate superior just quit, leaving him unprotected from the corporate sharks, he's feeling a bit vulnerable. He did call to talk to me about it, that his schedule would change due to this. I was very supportive about anything he needed.
He mentioned--TWICE--about taking some oddball job that would be a lot like the work he did back when we first met. (No glory, no power, no money, no bennies, crazy hours, okay....)
I guess this is part of the process. He has defined himself in recent years by being Mr. Big Shot. But clearly there is a big part of him that just wants things to be the way they were.
Totally understandable. Of course, the reality is that back then we lived in dumpy apartments and struggled every day to make ends meet, had no health insurance, no retirement benefits. I don't think he's thinking this way at all... just wanting to recapture his care-free days. I guess "no wife" figures into that picture as well.
He has continued with his therapy, seems less depressed, but some things still get my knickers in a twist:
I saw our joint credit card bill and there was a restaurant charge for $97.00 at a new place that is not by work, and for a day when he was vague about not being here that evening. It was not the kind of place/location where he would treat his employees to a beer after work. So I jumped to the conclusion that he was on a "date" And that it must have been a really GREAT date with someone he's known for A LONG TIME, because you don't spend that much money on a "meet and greet to see who we are" type date.
Of course, it could have been a lunch/dinner with his friend who just quit, taking a few staff members out to lunch at a satellite location... who knows.
But it bothered me. Still does. I think of the last few years when he didn't even mention my birthday, forget taking me out for dinner! I can't remember the last time he took ME out for a nice meal. The last affection/attention/money he has spent has been on his OW and now whoever this might be. I on the other hand, have had nothing from anyone. And yet he feels the need to point out how I should thank him for all the great times I'm having. Gosh, that stings...
The idea that he might be doing this for some woman he is trying to woo really hurts. I am trying not to think about it. It might not be the case. And if it is, there is nothing I can do about it, other than to feel like crap. So--change the thoughts, change the feelings.
I could use some guidance about is how to draw this boundary without letting him think I am snooping or trying to control him:
I am willing to cover for work and dr. appointments. I am NOT willing to pick up the slack so he can go on "dates". If that is what he is doing, then he is taking advantage of me. (Spending money on other women that he harps on me for spending on my Farm Boy Toy for helping with work that he won't help me to do.)
How do I set this down?
And the other one is, he keeps trying to pin me down on when I'm leaving and when I'm returning if he is going to spend the night here--on the couch.
It is really starting to tick me off big time and I feel I'm ready to explode the next time he does it.
He doesn't ask where/who I'll be with, which is fine, but he clearly wants to know FOR SURE that I WILL NOT BE AROUND on these evenings.
I can't think of one healthy reason WHY he would need to know what time I will return. He is fine being around me doing all sorts of things, so whatever it is that he is doing in the evenings in my absence is something he doesn't want me "interrupting".
I know he will not have anyone here because it's such a pit. It certainly wouldn't impress anyone if that's what he was trying to do. It looks like HIS WIFE lives here in chaos because he hasn't fixed anything.
Yet, I feel this is NOT just hanging out with the dogs and watching TV. On the same credit card statement, I see he has been using the card to buy what looks like a bottle of hard liquor every 2-3 days, in addition to beer which I do see him drink . In addition to having drinks at a few bars close to where he works.
This is so unhealthy and has me concerned, but what can I do or say? Not a whole heck of a lot.
I feel I might be enabling him to do things in MY HOUSE which are hurtful to me, and I do not want to allow that.
What "things"? Accessing porn, drinking to excess, texting/online chatting with OWs, sexting, setting up dates, talking about me behind my back to them as he did with his OW...and all the while being secretive about it, like I'm the bad guy for not being "okay" with it.
Well, I'm NOT OK with it. If that's what he wants to do, he can do it somewhere else.
I don't know how to broach this one, either without putting him on the defensive and setting us back.
I want him to NOT do any of these things because he DOESN'T WANT TO. Because he would do it willingly FOR ME. Because it hurts me.
I am sure this is asking way, way too much....
---GGG
Me 54 Him 63 M 23 T 29 0 Kids Funny Farm of Rescues 12/12 OW-- 5/13 ILYBINILWY: A denied 9/13 Proof OW: ENDED 2/14 Got D papers on my BD I kicked him out for my sanity 9/14 He wants to "talk"?
Yes.. I'm still alive, still kicking a** and taking names.
I'm definitely doing better, can't say that much progress has been made on my M, but at least nothing has gotten worse.
Some notes for the Laboratory Report:
1. GUBU has only appeared a few times since my last posting, and even then, just very subtly via text. Just some snarky responses to very benign things I said, clearly misinterpreting general statements to be an attack on his character.
I'm not sure why this is, he is just SO DEFENSIVE. I have to be very careful not to make any jokes or use sarcasm, as I might with anyone else on the planet, because he takes things very literally and thinks I'm lashing out at him.
But that's been about it for anything negative. Just passive aggression, as always, and I count myself lucky that it's all he's flung my way.
Still, I have yet to see any real concern for me or my well-being, as well as anything other than the most minimal concern for the animals.
He is still very much all about himself and what he wants. He is still telling me how great he is at work, how much his staff loves him (yeah, he takes them out for $100 rounds of drinks about every week) Yet, if I'm having fun, this definitely annoys him.
He still has no social life other than work, and his codependent employee/free room-providing friend.
2. It is very easy for me to hurt his feelings or disappoint him. He will never admit this, but when I look back over our interactions trying to figure out what caused him to get snippy with me, it's always that I have inadvertently hurt him in some way.
Like being out GALing and not telling him, not asking him to hang out, not going out to see him when he's here, not responding with the same or greater degree of connection.
If he responds rudely via text with a "K" or "Later", blowing me off, and I just don't engage at all for a day or so, this bothers him. I guess I'm just supposed to pursue. Which I refuse to do. And this bothers him too. I am using Zues' (?) rule of 80%. I give back 80% of the warmth he puts out. It seems he wants more, and he's not getting it.
I am not going to do all the heavy emotional lifting and it seems as though he is still trying to take his cues from me. He is still unwilling to risk anything that might lead to rejection. Sheesh, he seems to feel rejected if I walk away from him too quickly. But do you think he'd actually seek ME out or ask ME to do anything? Not on your life!
How do I know this? Because he very pointedly does not contact me at all for 24 hours or more, and will show up here unannounced if I do something that upsets him. He will talk to the dogs as if I'm not there, he'll refrain from telling me his plans, deliberately leading me to believe that he's out living it up. (He's not, sadly.) Generally, he will behave in a subtly rude manner towards me.
The fact that anything I do has the power to set him off balance tells me he is NOT as "done" as he has said.
3. We have continued to work alongside each other, doing hard manual labor. I swear, the guy loves to see me break my back. It earns his respect. Seems there could be a better way, but for now--okay.
As we work, he talks. He talked a lot about HIMSELF (as usual) his work, his career, his staff... more and more about the old college girlfriend who is sounding more and more like me. That whole thing is weird.
I guess he is Googling her, because he sent me pictures of some jewelry she's made, nice beadwork, things she has for sale. I also said that from the picture I saw, she doesn't exactly look "100 years old" as he described, that maybe he embellished that just a teensy bit? He said, "No. I'll be happy to show you a recent pic." Still waiting on that one.
Supposedly she stopped contacting him; either way, I'm not concerned about it. Being in touch with her was something he was doing earlier on in his MLC, before he got involved with OW. It may be a re-visitation of that period in his life, as he figures things out.
Anyhow, I said I'd love to have one of her pieces if it wouldn't be too creepy to have something from my husband's ex-girlfriend who could pretty much be my older sister. It's really a bit weird. But we both actually laughed about that.
4. I have given him open-ended opportunities to do something nice for me, like pick up a bottle of wine, stop at the Farmer's Market. So far, he hasn't done anything for me except for fixing my bike several weeks ago (probably mad that I didn't ask HIM to go biking, after he said he prefers to ride alone anyway) and put up a security light two weeks ago, so it's not scary dark up here in the boonies when I get home alone late at night. Both nice things which I did not request. To his credit, he will do just about anything I ASK him to do; he just doesn't seem to think of my needs at all. Am I surprised? No. Sometimes, I'm a bit disappointed because I see more and more of my H these days. I try to keep my expectations as low as possible. -------------------------------------------------------------------
New development!
We agreed on a schedule for the rest of the year, just me traveling to different events and to see my mother for an extended period of time.
He does have to take time off from work to accommodate this, but it's not a hardship because the fact is, he loves to be here if I am gone. Always has.
But here's the NEW THING.
He was going to come up Friday before I left...then mysteriously said he'd rather come up and stay over Thursday night because "it would just be easier."
Why it "would be easier" I have no idea. But the point here is: I WILL BE HOME THE ENTIRE TIME.
This is the first time he has wanted to stay here knowing that I would not be going out. That's a biggie!
But it's not bad. H just called me--a real pretense, if you ask me--to tell me about a radio show he just heard on NPR about Stick Insects.
He just regaled me with two solid minutes of the life cycle of Stick Insects and their importance in the Ecosystem.,,
(Yeah. Good luck finding another woman who really cares about that stuff!)
Oh yeah, and he's going to go for a bike ride Friday morning and then come up rather than staying Thursday night.... *sigh*
Really, just as well because I'm going to be preoccupied with packing to get out of here and it won't be the most relaxing time.
I'm not surprised he backed out, but the thought was definitely there... I'm sure it will come up again at some point.
The Stick Insect conversation was quite pleasant just now. We were laughing.... so all is good. -------------------------------------------------------------
This weekend I'm going to a dance event, have plans to meet up with friends, I'll be GALing like crazy. Also looking at an area where I might move if I do indeed end up divorced.
I'm still not posting much because I'm trying to keep my mind off D and all negative R stuff, including the existence of GUBU.
My emotions are still all over the place. Still some nightmares, bad thoughts, some fears about the future, some hurt, some ego bruising, some anger. But all in all, nothing I can't handle or get under control so I don't broadcast that to H.
Some days I find myself with too much time alone and I realized I'm ranting out loud about stuff GUBU has done to me. Having conversations with him out loud.... this does not help my PMA. Sometimes I don't even realize I'm doing it! I'm so used to being alone that I caught myself doing it in the supermarket. No wonder people were staring. (Nope. No Bluetooth. Just nutty!)
I felt hurt thinking he'd taken some online date woman out for a fancy dinner, now I think it was just another freebie for his staff. I try not to read too much into that.
I mostly feel angry now, sort of indignant, at the way he has treated me and how I did nothing to deserve it. I was not a perfect wife, but there is no way I am responsible for the choices he made and his treatment of me. I never had a choice. I still don't have a choice. He will do whatever he wants to me, and I will just have to handle it.
That's reality. It stinks, but there is no avoiding it. If he wants to divorce me, he will. I will live the rest of my life thinking he's the World's Biggest A**crack, but it will be his loss in the end.
But sometimes I get my hackles up about what a dope he's been. However, in true DBing fashion, I keep this to myself. I am doing a really good job with my STFU and, to a lesser degree, my CTHD.
I am eating better, sleeping better, taking better care of myself. Making the most of every opportunity that comes my way, trying to ignore him as much as possible.
One perk of this situation is that it is forcing me to "work what my momma gave me" and I'm learning more girly skills that I never had before. I now know how to curl my hair, put on that push-up eyeliner, and do "natural" makeup that looks like I just woke up that way...
And I can really rock those "skinny jeans" these days! I'm getting myself some nice cowboy boots because: 1. I loved them when I was a little girl (I was all about cowboys and riding western) and 2. I think they would be appropriate for continued a**kicking, which is definitely my plan!
Keep Calm and Carry On, DBers!
---(G)GGG
Me 54 Him 63 M 23 T 29 0 Kids Funny Farm of Rescues 12/12 OW-- 5/13 ILYBINILWY: A denied 9/13 Proof OW: ENDED 2/14 Got D papers on my BD I kicked him out for my sanity 9/14 He wants to "talk"?
1. I also get middle-of-the-night texts and emails from H.
He told me that his pattern is to fall asleep (pass out, I suspect) fairly early, then wake up at 1-3 AM, then toss and turn until he gets up around six. He says he never sleeps well anymore. (Not even in his nice little quiet, peaceful guest room? Hmmm....)
No doubt the alcohol plays into this, and whatever conscience he has left!
2. He also hardly eats anything while he's here, just chips, salsa, beer... it's not healthy.
I have decided not to say anything. If I make him something to eat, he will usually eat it.
However--- He has lost the bloated belly, and this eating pattern is more like his old self.
We always joked that I was the one eating all the food, he'd survive on virtually nothing. Eat nothing all day but two hard boiled eggs and a salad. I kid you not. He's an easy keeper, that one!
---(G)GGG
Me 54 Him 63 M 23 T 29 0 Kids Funny Farm of Rescues 12/12 OW-- 5/13 ILYBINILWY: A denied 9/13 Proof OW: ENDED 2/14 Got D papers on my BD I kicked him out for my sanity 9/14 He wants to "talk"?
He just texted me an APOLOGY about the phone call we just had. (Which wasn't a problem at all, it was enjoyable....Hello???)
He said sorry he wasn't clear his phone was blowing up from work, and the situation with his superior who just quit--as though he had sounded rushed or short with me.
He was 100% clear. Staying at his friends' house Thursday night to pack for staying here four days, then riding his bike Friday morning before coming up here to cover for me being gone. Crystal clear.
Guess he doesn't remember going on about the Stick Insects? MLC sieve-brain.
Anyhow.
NOW he says he might stay here Thursday night after all!
Why? Why not? Why? Why not? He loves me... he loves me not... He loves me... he loves me not...
Yes, they are pretty mixed up all right.
This is a step in the right direction. And it allowed me to say: "Sure, not a problem at all... Don't stress it. Whatever you'd like to do is fine by me..."
This is my tactic now. Just be calm, soothing, sweet, and accommodating. UNLESS he crossed my boundaries and then I give him a Truth Dart/Bomb/Nuke, when appropriate.
Seems to be working well!
---(G)GGG
Me 54 Him 63 M 23 T 29 0 Kids Funny Farm of Rescues 12/12 OW-- 5/13 ILYBINILWY: A denied 9/13 Proof OW: ENDED 2/14 Got D papers on my BD I kicked him out for my sanity 9/14 He wants to "talk"?
Nope. He did text me last night with his various commitments, so I know he does have something to do for work that means he'd have to stay later than usual.
He's back to giving me his "reasons" and whereabouts again. For now.
He'll be here in the morning so I can leave for the weekend.
I still see small improvements, like hanging around more, saying he misses things about being here... just little things.
Like just about everyone else on here, when you start seeing these small things, there is a desire to want to move things ahead...and I have to stop myself from expecting anything but a continued ride on the roller coaster.
I notice the ride is slowing down; it's not nearly as bumpy, but it still is nowhere near being over.
I find now that things are calmer, I am angrier. I haven't allowed myself to feel this very much lately, but now that he's getting friendlier--I find it irritating.
As if it should all just be hunky-dory, that he has no clue of the devastation he has caused, and that he may never.
It's still very much about him and whatever he wants.
I think it's pretty clear by now that he is extremely sensitive to perceived criticism or rejection, and his comments about wanting to "talk" I believe are his way of trying to get me to say something that will give him a direction.
I am not inclined to do this for many reasons.
I think the biggest one is that if he is is unwilling/unable to make the smallest step towards me because he is afraid, then me taking it for him just perpetuates his problem.
As they say around here, "he's got to put on his Big Boy Pants" and take a bit of a risk, either way. Maybe I'll be upset, maybe not. Maybe I'll say something he doesn't like.
That's life. If I have survived these last two years, he can certainly man up enough to say what's on his mind without Mommy promising him everything will be okay if he says how he feels.
I think he is well aware of how I feel and what I need. And what I don't want, and will not accept from him.
No need to rehash it. Either he can offer to make changes of his own free will to see where it leads us, or he won't.
I am not asking him to come back, or accepting certain behaviors if he is living under this roof. I think it is reasonable that, as his wife, I would not be comfortable with him engaging in certain activities, and therefore, I will not allow them in my house. (As long as it is my house.)
He knows what those things are. He knows what he needs to do. I will not repeat myself.
I will not ask him to do anything. He will only resent me later, and also try to hide things from me if he never wanted to quit doing them in the first place.
The days for that sort of thing are OVER.
As for him wanting to know "my plans", (all nice and laid out for him so he can avoid putting anything on the line himself), that also will not happen.
I don't yet know what my plans are, other than it will not look very much as he has described in his fantasy version of what our respective lives will look like after divorce. I only know that once I'm gone, I'll be gone, and he will be out of my life.
He still has no clue as to the reality of the situation, or as to my personal heartache and concerns about the future.
He thinks I can just move out, take a "bunch of dogs", go live with my mother, find an apartment somewhere that allows me to have eight dogs, while I work full-time... and that he'll still have all his money, this house, time and money to complete the remodel, eventually finding his "soul-mate", since he'll have plenty of free time to date all the woman who seem so interested in him in the virtual world, while he retires comfortably at age 65 with his IRA/401K intact.
Riiiiggghhhttt. La-La Land!
At least, this is what he used to think and I have no indication that he has realized that this will not be the case.
So I find myself more and more annoyed with him, the more I see the man I knew.
I'm not sure why that is, but it seems to be the case.
Today, I pretty much hate his guts for what he's done.
Tomorrow is a different day, and thank goodness I will be away from here, away from him, doing what I love with people who actually care about me.
It also drives one point home every time:
That he is the ONLY person in my life who would prefer to avoid me on every level, and he has for some time. As he has said: 'I just have never LIKED spending time with you".
Nice.
And what am I going to be losing, exactly?
Not a whole heck of a lot.
At least that's how I feel about it today.
GoatGoal needs GUBU like.... like.... arrrgh.
Loss for words.
THAT NEVER HAPPENS!
--(G)GGG
Me 54 Him 63 M 23 T 29 0 Kids Funny Farm of Rescues 12/12 OW-- 5/13 ILYBINILWY: A denied 9/13 Proof OW: ENDED 2/14 Got D papers on my BD I kicked him out for my sanity 9/14 He wants to "talk"?
Mine just whines. Then demands unreasonable stuff, which he know damn well I've said wont happen.
Sigh what are we losing exactly, I'm feeling these days like not much.
So now your a makeup diva we can be twins! Lol <<< consider that a kiss and a whistle. My make up tackle box and hot rollers a bargain at $30 is worth a small mint. So I don't have to wear the same thing twice in a few weeks.
M 46 h54 Both married before T 11y Bd 2/14 I must see where ow leads! Ms 18 hs 26
<<< consider that a kiss and a whistle. My make up tackle box and hot rollers a bargain at $30 is worth a small mint.