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fthnluv Offline OP
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Hello all,

My H and I have been married almost 19 years, together 23 years. We were high school sweethearts who married at 21. We are always the couple everyone wanted to be like and, from my point of view, never fought. As far as I was concerned, our marriage was a close to perfect as one could be. We had our first S8 after 11 years of marriage, then had D4 and S3. We are now both aged 40.

In Nov 2012 H left the home "for 30 days" for work reasons after the recent failure of his business here. This 30 days has continued to today. We were considering moving to the other side of the country (where he is working) up until last summer. We were not having luck getting a family home there and decided to put the move on hold.

My "bomb drop" was June 2013. At that point H told me that he felt our marriage was on the rocks which completely blindsided me. The separation had not been easy on our marriage but I considered all that went with that (more arguments than normal about where our life was headed) completely normal. He told me he had been unhappy for a while and that I treated him badly and talked down to him. I was shocked by this, apparently what I thought was amazing compatibility was actually him silently protesting and stuffing it and holding it against me. This conversation then resulted in about 5 months of not-so-nice behavior between both of us that resulted in him telling me in Nov 2013 that he was unsure if wanted to live with me again (he didn't say ever but he did say he was not sure how long that would be for). When I mentioned that that will not work in the context of a family he seemed to be ok with me leaving rather than bending on his end. Also around this time he became very food and gym obsessed and changed his entire wardrobe. He was also spending time with a male roommate who was going through a bitter D and was a real jerk in general.

In Dec 2013 I asked him and he confirmed that ILYBINILWY anymore. On 1/1/2014 I asked him to give our relationship a full year of work before deciding on a divorce. He reluctantly agreed. We have done some sessions with our Pastor (we are both Christians) and a marriage coach but didn't make much progress because he was always holding back and unwilling to commit to our marriage, even though he agrees it is what is best for our family and what God would want.

In July 2014 he gave me 10 pages of notes about what is going through his head. In his words he is a "hot mess" in his head. These notes indicated that it would not work to live together as a family due to his work schedule (he has been coming home about 5-6 days a month), that he thinks that the kids will be fine with that amount of contact with the kids (it's about quality not quantity to him), that he really likes being independant and making all his own daily decisions every day, that he thinks I am amazing but he can't be the man I need him to be, that he's not ever had an affair but he recounted many women in his life in the past that all "made me feel good about myself". I, of course reacted out of hurt and anger and pushed him away further.

Shortly thereafter I came to the conclusion that I was dealing with a man in MLC, who may or may not actually want a D. I immediately backed off and took away all responsibility and accountability and he reacted really well to that, even asking "why are you being so nice to me?". All was going well until 8/27 when he told me (by phone!) that he "doesn't want to be in a relationship" with me. I asked if that meant he wanted a D and he confirmed that he does. I begged, cried, reasoned, shamed and no change.

His "picture" of our D will go like this according to him: He will still pay all bills and support me as well or better than he does now & we will remain the best of friends and do holidays and vacation with the kids together. I asked him what is changing then? Is our M just all about sex? (which he hasn't since May 2014) He claims no and that there still is no OW and he is unsure if he is completely done with me or if he has interest in having interest in an OW. He still tells me he loves me and is fine with me telling him I love him. He still initiates contact most every day and our conversations are polite. He has advised that he will never move back full time to the state where we (the kids and I) live.

As we are Christians I have asked him to have faith that God can take this even little bit of love he still has for me and turn it into the love we once had or even better but he says he is unsure if he can believe God can or will do that and he's simply tired of waiting and trying.

At this point I have told him that I still have hope and faith and I am praying that he reconsiders his decision, maybe not making the opposite decision yet but simply even reconsiders making any decision at all. I have also told him that I will not file for D and that I will not have conversations about ending our M over the phone any longer, he has agreed to talk face to face next time he is in town (in about 3 weeks). I have told him that until God or the courts tell me otherwise, I am his wife and I will behave accordingly. I believe I am a stander, but I'm not sure I'm making the right "moves" to increase my odds that this marriage can be saved. I am trying to hold on to hope but also trying to protect my heart.

Thanks for reading. Any advice is truly appreciated.


Me- 40 H- 41
S8, D5, S4
M 19 y T 23
Bomb drop 6/2013
H asked for/filed for D 9/2014
22 yo OW discovered 9/19/14 they're engaged and living together
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I'm so sorry. It's amazing the lies even Christians will tell themselves and believe.

Anyway, sounds like you need to detach according to the DR approach of last resort. Example:

"At this point I have told him that I still have hope and faith and I am praying that he reconsiders his decision"

-- Maybe something like "It's not what I want but I'm not going to stand in your way" would be less clingy.

The GAL and PMA approaches work. I've been using them for a month. Dr. Dobson has a book called "LOVE MUST BE TOUGH" That's really good and takes the same approach as the DR.

Don't give up faith that God can work in this situations. Be sure to find and appreciate the silvers linings too. :-)

FunDad


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M:Dec 95
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W Filed: 9/16/14
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Welcome to this board.

The first thing you should do is be sure to read the Divorce Remedy book by MWD,
Divorce Busting is also an excellent book.

Sorry you are here but you will meet some wonderful people here and get some great advice.

You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts (for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support)

I have read a good deal of books on the subject and can give you some suggestions when you are ready.

Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.

I will give you a bunch of homework assignments to read.

However due to the board PURGE this POST is under construction and many links do not work,
we will be working on this as time goes by, sorry for the confusion.


I would start with the going dark link.
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=50956#Post50956

The link for the resources:
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...rue#Post1539436
(Most do not work)

Stages of the LBS
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1964990&page=1

Validation
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=191764#Post191764

Doormat tactics
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...444#Post1942444

Standing vs leaving
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1966340&page=1

Why they run:
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2484259#Post2484259

Pursuit and Distance
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2483574#Post2483574

Musings from AmyC
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2253741#Post2253741

MLC Signs
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2177869#Post2177869

The Final Stages Withdrawal to Acceptance
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2074403&page=1

Now you have all the tools to read. Let us know how your doing and if you have any questions.

I suggest that you read the entire thread in the resources.
You can also pick out some people and read their whole story.

This post has been edited. Divorce Busting does not recommend this author.

Depression is the key to the whole thing and it is always present!

Believe none of what he says and 50% of what he does.

I would not ask him anything unless you can have no expectations.
Sometimes asking them questions will be thought of as pressure.
You do not want to do anything that can be thought of by your H as controlling or pressure.

Lets not worry about him. Lets work on you!
Start your homework assignments.
Something to DO while you are on moderation.
GAL.
Eat, sleep and take a deep breath.
In general take care of your self first.

Detach the single most important thing to DO.

Your H has given you a gift
THE GIFT OF TIME
use it wisely

Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon

Last edited by Cristy; 09/08/14 05:54 PM.

Me-70, D37,S36
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I'm definitely not a vet on here, but I can relate to what you are going through. My H has said and done many of the same things - the constant working out, the new clothes, the selfishness, the disrespect, and at times even a disregard for the kids. I also got the ILYBNILWY speech. I also found out that there was in fact an EA going on. Sounds to me like that might be a possibility with your H.

I believe both of our Hs are going through MLCs. You should definitely read DR and go through and read all of the materials Cadet has posted above. I plan to do the same. After you've gotten through some of these materials I would think about setting up a coaching session with one of the DB coaches. They are super nice and will help you get a handle on things. I would stop any kind of pursuing behavior or R talks immediately (that would include asking about the D).

I hope this stuff helps. We can get through this together! Will keep you in my prayers!


M:48 H:42
M:15 T:18
S:(his)18 D:(his)22
Bomb(EA):Feb. 2014
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Welcome!

I'm sad you are now a member of our club, but you will find good support here. You sound like a very strong person. Use this strength to focus on you and your children. The best thing to do is GAL (get a life). Go do things for YOU and try not to read into anything your H says or does. Follow Cadet's advice. Those links were good and until they are restored, find out anything you can about MLC.

It will be a roller coaster ride, so hold on tight!


Atsbaby
M:36 H:35
T: 19 M:12
S:11
D:9
BD: 5/4/14
Proof of OW 8/13/14-love note from her
8/19 admits OW
8/22/14 files D w/o telling me
9/20/14 Says he wants to reconcile
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Me-70, D37,S36
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Hi sweetie. Sorry you are here but you are among some amazing people.

So, the things your h is saying have been said to everyone here is one form or another. It is called the script.

If you believe him to be in crisis, then understand that there isnt anything you can do to help him through it.

Your job is to get out of the way of him walking it.

The way you do that is to begin to detach. That means not allowing his words or actions to effect yours.

It means that you hear what he is saying...he doesnt want to be married right now. You dont have to agree, but, you do have to hear it.

You may have to take this one moment at a time sometimes. But you will be ok.

Put the focus on you and your children. Leave him to his stuff.

Keep posting here and to others. It gets you off moderation more quickly.

Start to look at what he wrote. Determine what has merit and what doesnt. Then begin to make those changes....for you.

Hang in there.

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I hate to bring this up, but I feel you deserve to know. When he says there's no OW? In a man who was depressed, had to move to another state to work, lives with a newly divorced guy, lost weight, worked out, stopped sleeping with you, was religious but hasn't tried marriage counseling with you..........I've been here a very long time and I'll tell you, the odds that he DOESN'T have an OW (or OM?)are very very slim to none.

It all follows the script. Why do they lie? They tell themselves all kinds of things, I suppose:
- "I'm not leaving my wife BECAUSE of the OW,so she shouldn't be blamed" (except, of course, it's impossible to repair a marriage with an unknown third party involved - ask Princess Diana)

- "If I keep OW a secret until after the divorce, then I can claim she and I just met and my family and kids will accept her

- "I still want to keep my wife as a fall-back position in case I change my mind, and if I told her about my affair she might not take me back"

- "OW is an internet flame in _______ (South Africa, Russia, China - fill in the blank, I've seen them all here) and I haven't actually slept with her yet so I'm not technically lying"

- "OW is my old high school girlfriend that I reconnected with on Facebook but we haven't gotten together in real life yet so I'm not technically lying"

- "I'm sleeping with a different woman every weekend so technically there's no specific "OW"

- "I'm sleeping with an OM but I'm not ready to come out of the closet yet so easier to let SAW think it's all her fault" (Yes, seen that one here too!)


Snooping is not generally advised (because it interferes with our ability to do the things we need to do to work on ourselves and our behaviors) but I think in cases like this it is important for you to know whether an OW/OM is being hidden from you. You may or may not choose to tell him what you know if you find out (sometimes it's a better strategy not to let on you know at first) but you do need to know.

So check his cell phone records if you can (hundreds of texts to the same number, especially late at night? Multiple calls to the same number starting back around when things started to go south?) Check his credit card bills (lots of dinners for two at nice restaurants on Friday or Saturday nights? Unexplained weekend hotel bills at swanky resorts?). New female friends on Facebook that seem suspicious, around the time things started to change? DON'T ask him to "explain" charges - be discreet, he'll be mad about you snooping and he'll continue to deny but he'll block your access. I'm betting, though, if you bother to take a look, you'll see a pattern.

I hope I'm wrong, but I'd bet good money on it. And knowing may significantly change your approach, especially in so far as decisions about support, moving etc. JUST DON'T confront him yet if you find stuff.......be strategic. Give yourself time to calm down and strategize. Don't share it with your kids or family members - come here first and let us talk you through it.

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Exactly what KML said.

My xH denied denied denied but he is with the woman I suspected from D1. Maybe yours like mine believed that since he wasn't sleeping with her when he dropped the bomb it doesn't count. (See #1 on KML list)

Thanks KML for reminding me of Princess Diana's ordeal. I am always amazed at the great company I am in. Maria Shriver is one of my biggest inspirations and the grace and dignity she has continued to display after her H public betrayal (not to mention that she was the reason he was elected governor to begin with) Check out her web site its really nice


----
M 39
H 35
D5,D4
M 4
T 9
ILYBNILWY 5/18/11
Left 7/11/11
Divorced 12/1/13

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fthnluv Offline OP
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Thank you all so much for your replies. I missed them because I don't have notifications turned on and I didn't even know you all could see them yet!

A few things have happened since I posted, I will copy them from my journal to here for you to advise me on:

From a few days ago: I haven't told many people that H is wanting a divorce, I guess because I am hoping he changes his mind before that all goes down and I can spare him (and me) from having to explain and talk about it afterwards. He doesn't care what anyone thinks, he says.

I spoke to him last night and told him that God had laid it on my heart that I needed to truly apologize for the part I've played in his hurt heart. Now I'm wondering if that was another desperate attempt at begging/pleading or trying to see that I am willing to take responsibility or repair things between us. I know that I was hoping that he would say "don't worry about it, I forgive you and I am reconsidering my decision to D" but he didn't. He did say he has already forgiven me for anything I have said to hurt him. I'm not sure there is much to forgive but we all make mistakes and say things out of hurt, desperation and anger that we regret. I find myself beating myself up for some of the few things I've said that I believe may have pushed him further away.


Then, from this past Thursday: Had a little better (and worse) day today. I spoke to H about his upcoming trip back "home" in a couple of weeks. The last time we discussed it he said he wanted to "act" like a family and all (we and the kids) be here together. I asked him if he still wanted that today and he said that, no, he wanted to spend the time with just the kids at my MIL's house. I knew that would be a good possibility so I had a backup plan and when he said he did not want to spend the time together I informed him of the dates I needed him to be home and that I have booked a last minute cruise with other women who support me in my family. He seemed a little shocked that that might not work as well as the "plans" he had in his head (I think he was thinking he would come in the following weekend but I want to leave it the weekend of the 20th because we had already discussed it in addition to the fact that it is our 23y T and 19y M anniversary and I need to be having fun on it), I ignored that as he said he would "make it work".

I had to laugh a little inside as I informed him that he could not be spending the whole time at his MIL's because he would be responsible for getting 2 of our 3 kids to school on the Friday and Monday I will be cruising. Ha! That will be interesting, he hasn't done that EVER. Welcome to the world you are choosing, H. A world where I do not have to consider what you want or need and where I get to call the shots when it comes to our kids. I would NEVER use them as a weapon but I think the reality of raising these kids, even for only the 5-7 days a month that he's "home", will show him something he needs to see.


And Friday: No sobbing today. Actually had a decent day much of the day. Did not hear from H at all. I guess this will be my new normal. It seems that the possiblity of "going dark" might be something I need to look into. How does that even work with kids and a mostly amicable relationship anyway? We only ever get tense if I bring up our M.

I do have a new concern today: It occurred to me that H has been known in the past 20+ years to cut someone completely off when he feels they have wronged him in some way. This can go on forever. There are people that he was very close to that he, literally, will never speak to again. This has me wondering if the chances of a reconciliation once he is done with MLC are lower. Do they really see the light and realize they were wrong all along? Am I wasting my time in working on trying to stay standing until he comes to his senses? I know much of this needs to be done for me anyway but I guess I want to let go with no wishing that he will come back if that is the likely way it will go.

Also, I am reconsidering our agreement to talk in person when he comes back "home" in 2 weeks. Of course my desire is for him to tell me exactly what he wants and envisions this to look like and, though I have no hope he will change his mind yet, I just wonder if that talk should happen at all or if it will just push him further away. Of course, since we share 3 young kids, we will always have contact so we must work some of the issues in regards to their support (and mine) so maybe I should just keep it to that.

From later Friday: Not sure what to take of my convo today with H. We have some tax issues that need to be resolved and I texted him to ask how he wants to handle it. He called and asked me to do some paperwork to which I replied that I will, acting as his W, but it's not really fair to me to do all this work for him. I asked him if he would reconsider filing for D and putting that whole decision on hold for a while longer to handle this and all the other logistical stuff that comes along with it. I told him it is best for everyone to give this some more time before making a decision or filing. He told me that I gave him a lot to "wrap his head" around which I count as a possible win, it's much better than "no" so I'll take it but I'm also trying not to put much stock into it because I know he could still be full-steam ahead with a D.

My faith has been shaken in the last 24 hours too because he has been known to stay hard-hearted to someone in the past and I fear that is me now. I'm still deciding on how deep our face to face convo in 2 weeks will be too.


Sorry so long. Any advice, input and tips are greatly appreciated.





Last edited by Cristy; 09/08/14 06:02 PM.

Me- 40 H- 41
S8, D5, S4
M 19 y T 23
Bomb drop 6/2013
H asked for/filed for D 9/2014
22 yo OW discovered 9/19/14 they're engaged and living together
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