The Amoeba Whisperer: "It's All Dog Training!"

[Cadet]

I agree with Wonka, my only suggestion is to remember that less is more.

Try to keep R talks to a minimum, set your boundaries, stick to them, and also know that it is highly unlikely that his crisis is magically over.

He is taking your temperature, testing you, that is my observation.

Good luck with your day.

[Maybell]

Good luck today GGG.

[GoatGal]

Thanks, Everyone, for your support.
Could be that nothing happens, but I want all those little duckies in a row.

Here's the speech:

1. "Gubu, I was at the doc the other day and he had concerns about my overall health; that I am run down and too isolated from other people.

2. There are some things I need to change in order to be healthier and I was hoping you could help me with that."

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3. "I need to be less overwhelmed with my responsibilities here, it's too much to continue as I have been."

4. "I am open to whatever thoughts you have about we can accomplish that."

(This is very succinct for me! )
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Then wait to see what he says....

Comebacks:

H: "Well, what do YOU want to do?"
Me: "We could hire someone, you could agree to help out more, we could re-home some of the animals....do you have any ideas? "

Listen and Validate!

H: Complains about him "needing a social life too!!!"
Me: "I agree, having a social life IS important. How can we both get our needs met while taking some of the load off?"

H: "Do you want me to move into the basement?" (Likely how he'd phrase it if he mentioned it.)
Me: "I have thought about that a lot and it is a possible solution. If that's something we want to consider, we should talk about it more another time after we think about what that might look like."

H:"But I want to start dating and that means I have to be gone more"
Me: "Dating. Hmmm... I don't think it would be appropriate for me to date anyone now, but I can see why you might feel that way. This is a lonely time for us both. If it's important to you, we can work that in." (Ugh. But OK...)

H: " What is it that you really need from me?"
Me:
1. "Maybe one night a week be available longer to do some bathing, trim nails, grooming, feed the dogs, do medications."

2. "Do some chores around the house/property during the week, or work on some projects to make the space more livable and safer for all of us."

3. "Coordinate socials plans with me ahead of time because it's hard for me to get out to be around people."

(Right now he's here about 20 minutes on 3 weeknights, and a few hours each Sat/Sun. So far. He stays here if I am out very late or overnight. Other than that, I'm going it alone the rest of the time.
I think it's reasonable to ask that he stays for an hour one night a week.
He runs here, does the bare minimum, and then I guess goes back to his friend's house, drinks and does stuff online. I get left here to do everything else. None of my business, other than he is dumping too much on me. This is just a little perspective....)


I hesitate to say "Think about this and get back to me..." because, historically, he'd say "Sure." and then never mention it again.

So I'll ask: "Do you want to think about this more and talk another time?"
And then AGREE on a TIME and PLACE to finish the discussion.
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I'm going to try to keep it short and sweet.

Speak softly. Really listen to him.
Use less words.

Allow him the freedom to feel what he feels... validate, validate....
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If I get stuck somewhere, I'll just use the old standbys:

"Hmmmm... I really need to think about that some more...."

"Sounds like we both have some decisions to make...."

"I hadn't thought of it that way. Can we discuss it more at another time?"

"I didn't realize..."

And I am going to write down some validations from the handy cheat sheet provided here...


Wish me luck!

I'll be back on later...

(I have this picture in my head: Me saying "Hold that thought, GUBU, I have to consult my DBing pals!!! )


---GGG

[Shining]

Hi, GGG,

I get you, and it can easily follow your thought process. I'm impressed by your preparedness, and I hope you are able to access the right words at the right time today.

These talks rarely end with the thought "wow, I said everything perfectly" and that's ok.

I like the "speak softly, really listen to him, and use less words", personally. That was my hardest 180 in the beginning, but it was the most effective in my sitch.

I'm cheering for you, and wishing the best possible outcome for this day.

((((Hugs))))

[Wonka]

GGG,

You can do this! The only problem I have with your list is this:

H:"But I want to start dating and that means I have to be gone more"
Me: "Dating. Hmmm... I don't think it would be appropriate for me to date anyone now, but I can see why you might feel that way. This is a lonely time for us both. If it's important to you, we can work that in." (Ugh. But OK...)

Knowing you from here, I think you really don't want to be in an open M. It doesn't line up with your core values. Why would you even say that ^^??!

H: "Do you want me to move into the basement?" (Likely how he'd phrase it if he mentioned it.)
Me: "I have thought about that a lot and it is a possible solution. If that's something we want to consider, we should talk about it more another time after we think about what that might look like."

Why put it off for another time? This would be a good opportunity to put it on the table and discuss this option together. Doncha think so?

Good luck!! We're all rooting for you, dear friend.

[GoatGal]

Wonka, I'll respond to you in a sec.

Meanwhile--can you all say--all together now: "KER-FLOOEY!!!"?????

What the heck is happening now?

Here's how it went down.

H texts me about 8 AM, says "Be there 9:30" Ok. so far, so good.

I didn't see it because I was out doing chores, feeding dogs, etc.

So he calls around 9--says: "Hey, did you get my text?'

Me: "Yeah, that you'd be here at 9:30, just saw it."

H: "Well, I wanted to make sure that you left the basement door open, (I always do--forgot ONCE), and I got a new lock for it." (Something I'd asked him if he thought was a good idea yesterday. Guess he did.)

Me: "OK, see you then."
---------------

He actually got here around ten.
I heard him down there messing with the lock.
I am resting, per doctor's orders, took a hot bath, had some breakfast.

It is SUNDAY, after all, and he's here to HELP, RIGHT???

He is usually here for at least three hours, and lets me know when he's about to leave in case I need him to take the recycling, etc. Just basic stuff.
We have been communicating about those things very amicably.

Until today!
__________________________________

He was here about an hour and half... I figured, plenty of time here, right?

I get a text a few minutes ago:

H: "Wanna come up see the guys get trash and then go get animal food." He means: NOW.

Me: "I'm still resting, can you give me 30 minutes?"

H: "Then go in the bedroom and I'll leave you alone."

(I almost called my DBing lifeline, thinking "WTF????")

Me: "Sorry, I really need 30 minutes"

H: "No."
H: "C U tomorrow."

Me: "That's up to you."

So--no danger of any R talk today!

And I really wanted to add: "No. You're 'not a bully'..."

---------------------------------------------

Clearly, GUBU is back in full force, and that glimmer of my formerly caring H I saw last night has gone into the dark place again.

Probably the lock was a bust---he gets really angry at his inability to do things he once did effortlessly.
I'll check that out later.
(What is really needed is a new door, not a new expensive lock put on an old broken door, but I STFU about that when I realized that was his plan.)

I REALLY felt like he was bullying me, because he was. Being very bossy and disrespectful.
He basically got angry when he heard the word "NO".

Even if it was unspoken. Just like a child!
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He has done this before, with the "I WANT, I WANT, ME-ME-ME....NOW-NOW-NOW!!!!"
Gets angry if I don't give him what he wants when he wants it.
Not all the time, but sometimes. This comes and goes.
And I always respond the same. I set limits and stick to them.

I make him wait, ask.. I will not be told what to do by a GUBU nut.
He is doing the same thing again that he's been doing recently, trying to pull the "Big Boss Man" card and treat me like an employee.
Well, it ain't happening!!!!!
Which of course, p*ssed him off further.
No doubt solidifies how awful I am in his mind.
I don't cave in to every whim and desire, not like OW did. SHE made him HAPPY!!!!
At his beck and call. Of course she was--HE was HER BOSS!!!

Guess he likes it like that:
"Who's your Boss-Man Daddy??"

Not you, GUBU. Definitely NOT you...

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I have asked before that he only need give me a head's up, that he is welcome to see the dogs any time...
He has been doing this consistently, but today...

I wonder if he's afraid? Afraid that my "problem" will be something that he fears...?
Like maybe I want to speed up the D, that I have a boyfriend, that I know one of his secrets, that I am really sick and that will put a monkey wrench into his fantastic fun times...who knows?

But anyhow.
No. He can't come up THIS VERY MOMENT.
I'm in a towel, putting on lotion...

But I don't need to spend one word defending myself from craziness!!!

A "Roller-Coaster" doesn't begin to cover it!
--------------------------------

Here I am preparing for what might be some type of connection, and he is furious and clearly trying to push my buttons and control me, maybe sabotage the discussion he'd offered to have.
Who knows?
He came off as pretty angry though, drove off in a huff.
Whatever.

On the up-side. I find I'm feeling pretty detached about it.
Relieved that I don't have to do it today and I get to prep more.

I still have the same issues which need to be addressed, still need to ask/get additional support so I can stay well and move through this journey in one piece.

Any discussion with him will have to wait until another time, if ever.

---------------------------------------------------

Since I am NOT a mind-reader, (although I do like to play one on TV from time to time), all I know for sure is that something is making him uncomfortable, and lashing out at me seemed like a solution to him.

He may have made a mess of the lock, was angry at himself, and wanted to leave to go be miserable.
Oh well. Not my problem!

I do know--it's nothing I did. It's ALL HIM.
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In the past, sometimes he would apologize for behaving like this, lately, he doesn't do that.

He was trying to get X by doing Y.

Don't think it worked for him though.

I have learned not to take the bait.

He may have an arsenal of weapons at his disposal, but I have all the ammunition!



And so it goes, DBing pals.

Another day, another crazy scene at the Triple GGG Ranch!


----GGG

[GoatGal]

Wonka: "The only problem I have with your list is this:"

Originally Posted By: LoopyGGG
THEORETICAL CONVO COMEBACKS:
If H says:"But I want to start dating and that means I have to be gone more"
I Might Say: "Dating. Hmmm... I don't think it would be appropriate for me to date anyone now, but I can see why you might feel that way. This is a lonely time for us both. If it's important to you, we can work that in." (Ugh. But OK...)

Wonka: "Knowing you from here, I think you really don't want to be in an open M. It doesn't line up with your core values. Why would you even say that ^^??!"

Ahhhh!!! There's the rub.
I don't want him dating, I think it's disrespectful, even ridiculous.
He has nothing to offer anyone emotionally, he has Hep-C, not to mention a wife who is supposed to take care of things while he goes on these "dates".
But it's not for me to say, is it?

He believes he is "single" in the sense that we are "separated" and he has filed for divorce.
He can tell any prospective date/victim that I am holding things up, that he should have been divorced already...
He can paint me as a shrew.

Because, if he told the truth--as in:
I cheated on my wife and treated her like dirt.
I have a lot of issues you might want to know about so you can avoid me, but I'll just omit these little facts...
No one would come near him!

But I thought I was supposed to "validate", etc. and not give him reason to dig his feet in deeper on the issue.
Me trying to put my foot down is likely to have the opposite effect.

If I say--"Heck yeah! Get out there and grab all the gusto you can! ENJOY!!!" That kind of takes a bit of the fun out of doing it to get at me anyway.

After all, if he feels he is ready to "date" while he doesn't live here, there is not much I can do about it.
In his mind, our M is OVER. I guess.
All I can do is be the better fish (MERMAID???) than whatever surfaces in the shallow end of his tiny, stagnant, algae-clogged dating pool.
After all, isn't that where one-celled organisms thrive???
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I was only thinking about trying to work out a compromise and removing resistance to his helping around here more.

If he says the reason he can't be around more to help is because he wants to "date", then who am I to say otherwise?

Now--if he wants to live under the same roof, that's a totally different story.

Absolutely no third parties--EA or PA. Nada. Zip. Deal-breaker and he's out.

Does that make sense? I don't know if it's right or not, but I don't think I can enforce "no dating" can I?

Maybe I can amend that statement to:
"I disagree that dating is a good thing to be doing right now, but you are free to make your own (stupid, selfish), decisions."
Something more like that.

I really want to say:
"Just don't dump more work on ME so you can go out and try and find my replacement!!!"

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Originally Posted By: GGG
If H Says: "Do you want me to move into the basement?" (Likely how he'd phrase it if he mentioned it.)
I Might Say: "I have thought about that a lot and it is a possible solution. If that's something we want to consider, we should talk about it more another time after we think about what that might look like."

Wonka: "Why put it off for another time? This would be a good opportunity to put it on the table and discuss this option together. Doncha think so?"

I agree on the one hand that perhaps it's best to strike when the iron is hot.

But I was also thinking about what you and Cadet said about "less is more" and don't overload him with too much at once.

Plus, it will lead into a very delicate discussion that IS about the R, and I don't know if I could carry all that off in one convo.

But to amend it, I could say something like:
"I've thought about that too as a possible solution, but I have to make sure that it would be a healthy situation for me to be in.
It's easier to tolerate what you are doing if you are not living here.
I don't think I would be comfortable with you behaving as though you were single while we are still married."

How's that?

Clearly, I'm going to have more time to prepare for this talk, so...

---GGG

[Wonka]

GGG,

You don't have to validate EVERYTHING that GUBU says...or even those that you don't necessarily agree with.

But I thought I was supposed to "validate", etc. and not give him reason to dig his feet in deeper on the issue.
Me trying to put my foot down is likely to have the opposite effect.

If H says:"But I want to start dating and that means I have to be gone more"

You can simply say, "I think differently. I don't think it is respectful when married couples date others outside of the marriage."

If GUBU gets upset or annoyed, it is all on him. It is for him to own completely.

After all, if he feels he is ready to "date" while he doesn't live here, there is not much I can do about it.
In his mind, our M is OVER. I guess.

Irregardless of what GUBU thinks or feels, you own your core values and you can communicate them to him. How he reacts to your comments is all on him. Shrug your shoulders and try not to take it personally.

I was only thinking about trying to work out a compromise and removing resistance to his helping around here more.

If he says the reason he can't be around more to help is because he wants to "date", then who am I to say otherwise?


That is a fine line between diffusing the situation and placating GUBU. Careful there, honey.

As for GUBU moving in----

But to amend it, I could say something like:
"I've thought about that too as a possible solution, but I have to make sure that it would be a healthy situation for me to be in. It's easier to tolerate what you are doing if you are not living here. I don't think I would be comfortable with you behaving as though you were single while we are still married."

Here's a suggested, modified response:

"I've thought about that too as a possible solution, but I have to make sure that it would be a healthy situation for me to be in. In order for that to happen, I need more support from you around the house in terms of doing chores. It's a lot for a person to take on alone and I will need you to be able to do this on a reliable, consistent basis.

You're not guilt tripping H with hot buttons like behaving like a mopey, selfish singleton. To do so will just inflame and enrage GUBU unnecessarily. Do you see the difference between the two responses?

Plus you still want the squirrel to be able to eat out of your hand...right?

Food for thought.

[GoatGal]

Yes, Wonka,

Right as always.

Meanwhile, I just got this text from him:

"Please expect to talk in person tomorrow. --Gubu"

I was the one who had concerns, but clearly since he is unwilling to wait 30 minutes for me to dry off, I doubt he will be willing to actually HELP me more!


HELP!!! Now HE wants to talk about something. I don't think it's going to be good.
I don't have to discuss anything with him.

After the way he just disrespected me, I don't really feel that it will be productive.

---GGG

[GoatGal]

Meanwhile, I just got this text from him:

"Please expect to talk in person tomorrow. --Gubu"

Can I respond:

"If this last exchange is any indicator ^^^ I think I'll pass, thanks."

I also want to say:
"If this is about your divorce, or anything additional you want from me, I am not willing to have that conversation at this time. I've made my position clear and there is nothing more to discuss right now."

I really need a head's up before I commit to anything, because I can't be prepared for everything!!!

---GGG