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nit84 Offline OP
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Well my W came to me last night and wanted to talk about property division.

It was a calm discussion and I sat quietly listened then answered when she asked for an answer.

I thought this the best time to bring up the refinance issue since I had her attention. More on this later.

All in all the talk went along with no problems. There were a couple times when we had disagreements but we muddled on through and came to agreement on most things.

Through listening to her it has become apparent that W is treating this as some sort of money making arrangement more than a dissolving of our M.

We went back and forth she I would like this, I agreed, I said I would like this W agreed. When we both wanted something we either figured it out or set it aside for further discussions.

The conflict in my mind came in when W said things like I don't have room for this or that so we will assign a value to it and work it out in other ways. I countered with I don't really want it but if you are leaving it here that fine. I don't think a money value needs to be assigned because you want something but have no place for it so I get by default and you want compensated for it monetarily.

I understand how rough this must be moving out of a house and into a smaller place or even an apartment and I respect your decision but I cannot be expected to "buy" things from you because you don't have room or don't want to rent a storage unit.

Then it went on further when she wanted something really bad. She keep making statements like I am allowing you to take 3/4 of the stuff and you don't want to let me have a mattress that I sleep on? I said that is a mattress that I slepted on also so take something else that you were "letting" me have in barter.

I relented on the mattress without too much problems but I got a feel for my W motives and didn't like it but thought Ok if I give a little on the property may be she will sign the refinance papers. I will continue that subject later but just wanted to put this out there.

I have chance to rediscuss what we talked about last night any suggestions on how I can handle it better?


Me 47/W 34
T 16 M 13
No kids
BD 6/2013
W asked that I move out 6/2013
I moved back and W is upset with this 12/2013
separate beds not much talking
Served D Complaint 5/2014
W moved out 9/27/2014
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 511
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nit84 Offline OP
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Continue now to a post about my part of the discussion. The refinance of the house to loan that will be in my name only but W will still be on the deed of the house.

She finished talking about the property settlement by saying this will make it a smooth transition when she moves out. I said do you know when that will happen she said no but when all this is done. I said ok.

She asked what I had for her. I told her I was advised by my L to propose it to you this way. I had everything written down and went line by line.

She said I think you are jumping the gun a little. I asked why? because she told me back in June that I was roadblocking her not finding how much money I was eligible for and if I wanted to keep the house.

I explained that I was honoring her request and had been working on this for almost 2 months to make it happen.

The long and short of it is. If she signs the papers I will assume all her debt as well as mine and she will only have to pay 30% of a reduced mortgage amount and utilities while she is living here for however long.

Basically, she will be paying 350.00/ month and have a house not an apartment and she will still be part owner. If she moves out I told her I would pay it all.

She said well I do I get my half of the house, I said you basically are getting that by me assuming all your debts. My L seems to think I explained it correctly but W doesn't get it or is mad because the house isn't worth what she had in head that it was worth. I went a bit further and had a private appraisal performed and it came in 10,000.00 lower just like I suspected so this is the best deal we are going to get. She believes the house is worth more I said well you are a free to get an appraisal yourself. She is thinking about it. She doesn't know I did one.

She is under the impression that if she moves out she wont be paying any bills anyway I told her she is still responsible for her portion of the mortgage, the 2nd mortgage and the credit cards.

She said if that is the case she isn't not moving out and will live in every damn bit of her half of the house. I said that is your right.

I told W I get it I know you want out, It breaks my Heart but I understand and wont stop you from going and that is why I went ahead and set this loan up for myself to relieve you of any debt so you can have a fresh start.

She started saying I told you a couple years ago to refinance but you wouldn't. I said we tried but got denied because of loan to value and the amount of debt we had. I explained back then that we have to hit a threshold then all will be good. That threshold would have happened last year had it not been for S but we have now hit it and the money is there for us to take. She is refusing because it seems too easy for me to get the house.

I told I am not getting the house right now we are still married and this is just me taking out a loan on our house myself that just happens to pay off my debt and your debt.

Then she started getting upset and saying "I will take my debt with me I don't care." I said well that is your right so think about it and let me know, we have till the no of the month.


One of the things that has bothered my W for about 5 years is the amount of debt we had and she thought we were destitute. I told her we are fine and just need to pay down debt and not use Credit cards. That is what has happened over the last 5 yrs. She said back then that she understood what "our" plan was and it was exciting to see the light at the end of the tunnel.

Somewhere between then and last year she jumped off the plan without my knowledge or my lack of listening skills back then and started to get it in her head that I didn't want kids.

I honestly thought I explained to her that this plan was pretty flexible and if a baby came along things would still be ok it would just delay things and a new plan would need to be considered together to our new family's best interest.

This financial plan was in effect a couple years before, If you are familiar with my thread,I really knew that we needed to start having kids but couldn't tell this to my W.

I wish I recognized the signs. I talked with my W about this probably twice a month and never picked up on her unhappiness.

I think part of the reason she is balking at signing is because she is no longer included in my future plans. Don't get me wrong if she wants to work on things, even though a lot has happened, I would be willing. She knows this so I am not saying that to her. I am moving on with things that I think will help me but honestly by default she is benefitting also.

It is possible that me doing this for myself but she gets help from me is making her feel like I still am rescuing her in a sense?

Does she maybe feel like if she is going to fail as long as she does it independently of me that that is better then accepting help from me which is not my intent at all.

I understand it is all emotional for the most part on her side and I am trying to be more logical about things. It is just hard to make sense of why she wouldn't want to be debt free and away from me and she has said many times that is her desire.

If anybody can help me understand a bit better please do.


Me 47/W 34
T 16 M 13
No kids
BD 6/2013
W asked that I move out 6/2013
I moved back and W is upset with this 12/2013
separate beds not much talking
Served D Complaint 5/2014
W moved out 9/27/2014
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 511
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nit84 Offline OP
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Posts: 511
I need some help with this.

I don't know if it is wise to do or not, but it may be the best thing for ME.

My W says she intends on moving out of the house. I think it is with OM but even if she lives alone she still intends to move out.

I ask her when and she says when this is done referring to the division of property.

MY issue is and has been for the last few weeks is W is staying out till 1:00 most nights not coming home on a weekend night at all or very late around 4:00 am.

I suspect that OM has been asked to leave or has been kicked out of his GF, W or whatever she is place and has his own joint now.

That is why W is out so late now.

Or she has rented a place and he is living there till she can move out from our home to be with him.

Or she has rented a place and is fixing it up in anticipation of moving in.

All things I have no control over or maybe don't even care to know.

I am thinking about in a calm manner, because I have resigned myself to the fact that this is happening and not much I can do about it except continue to be a person only a fool would leave, suggesting to the W that why doesn't she just move into the place she will be going to eventually anyway now instead of later.

During our Sunday conversation, she asked for an air conditioner that is in the garage, I said sure why doesn't your new place have air? she said no.

I believe she has a place in mind or it is one of the above suggested scenarios.

Without accusing her of wrong doing just empathizing with her by saying "This has to be tough on you coming home late every night because you feel like you don't want to be here any longer, Which I understand, wouldn't it be better to just get it over with and move now?"

Or something to that effect.

I'm not sure how I will feel when she moves out so I might as well feel the emotions sooner than later.

Is this a wise thing to do or am I not thinking clearly.

I have had patience and can continue to have patience but maybe I am looking to find a new way of dealing with this mess while still practicing DB.

Help appreciated


Me 47/W 34
T 16 M 13
No kids
BD 6/2013
W asked that I move out 6/2013
I moved back and W is upset with this 12/2013
separate beds not much talking
Served D Complaint 5/2014
W moved out 9/27/2014
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 511
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nit84 Offline OP
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Posts: 511
Bumping this up


Me 47/W 34
T 16 M 13
No kids
BD 6/2013
W asked that I move out 6/2013
I moved back and W is upset with this 12/2013
separate beds not much talking
Served D Complaint 5/2014
W moved out 9/27/2014
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 511
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nit84 Offline OP
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Posts: 511
My W has copies of my Proposals in her hands now, Refinance option, two home appraisals and a partial property division sheet.

I guess it is just a waiting game now till hopefully she agrees to the refinance after seeing the private appraisal I had done.

When I put this appraisal on the counter for her. I wrote a quick note.

W here is a copy of the private appraisal I had done to back up the bank one. I wanted to give it to you personally but I have not seen since Sunday night( I have been sleeping when she gets home). The reason I didn't mention it during our Sunday discussion is because you were getting upset with what I proposing about the refinance and didn't want to upset you further at that point.

All the figures are what I thought they would be when we talked about different options in Apr, May, Jun. I did this research because you asked me too. We finally have hit the threshold of debt to equity to make this possible. This what we had been working towards for about 3 years now and talking about for longer then that. I wish we could enjoy this moment together but things change and I understand that.

Take Care, Nit

She is upset the house is not worth more and is blaming me for not keeping up with it. She has a valid point but over the last year I have tried to do things that don't cost a lot of money but make our home a better place to live. I would love to do more but my L has advised me against at this point.

W keeps saying I told you to refinance 3 years ago. I said I tried but we had too much debt and WE agreed to start a program to reduce it and WE have.

I believe the W was in disbelief that this could or would ever happen and now that it is doable,she is upset because she is walking away.

This refinance would allow for many option for the both of us if we were still together and not S. I am careful not to tell W what these things are but I think she sees what could be and is stewing about it.

Did I do the right thing by including the note or should I have just left the Appraisal and no note?


Me 47/W 34
T 16 M 13
No kids
BD 6/2013
W asked that I move out 6/2013
I moved back and W is upset with this 12/2013
separate beds not much talking
Served D Complaint 5/2014
W moved out 9/27/2014
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 511
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nit84 Offline OP
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Posts: 511
Quick Update,

L's talked and W L said he was unwilling to consider refinance option without settling Retirement money also.

They have a "global settlement proposal" he is working on but can't promise it will be done before the end of the month in order to meet the deadline for my loan.

W L said he would talk to my W and get her feeling on the situation then get back to my L.

Extremely Frustrated at the moment because W and I live under the same roof but can't communicate. She has totally shut down unless she has to discuss her needs/wants with me. At that same time I explain to her what my desires are to move the process forward(trying not to stonewall) and get nothing but grief.

W has a number in her head that she wants/needs to walk away with. She isn't telling me. The shame of this is if I knew this number I might actually be able to agree with it and chalk this up as a "I gave my best effort" situation. Something is holding her back from completely being independent of me and I don't know what it is and don't care. If she would talk about it I would certainly listen but the communication is not and has not been there.

By no means am I giving up but even when I feel I am trying to fulfill my W desire to dissolve our M by doing things she has requested I get stopped in my tracks.

My W has seems to be surprised by things I am doing that she requested. This puzzles me a great deal.

Should I try to ask W if we can talk about One subject and one subject only? Then tell her the subject and ask her to explain why she feels as she does about this subject?

Not R issues but things that could move the process forward.

I would allow her an arbitrary time limit where I would do nothing but listen to what she says then I would agree to the same amount to give my feelings.

No trying to persuade W to understand and agree to my thoughts, just airing out both our feelings on a single topic to simplify things.

After the initial talk then we could ask questions of each to make sure we both understand each others side but again no "selling" of our ideas to one another.

Maybe this would open up the lines of communication a bit.

She knows D is not a solution for me and I know that D is what she wants. No need to bring that up while discussing other things.

I could really use some feedback on this and honestly other stuff from earlier in my threads.

I want to save my M still but feeling lost and losing site of that goal a bit. I think I need some help getting back on the DB track if it is even possible.

Thanks in advance!!


Me 47/W 34
T 16 M 13
No kids
BD 6/2013
W asked that I move out 6/2013
I moved back and W is upset with this 12/2013
separate beds not much talking
Served D Complaint 5/2014
W moved out 9/27/2014
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 273
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Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 273
Any advice? I am working on R with a WAW and settlement looms. I feel I have been where you are. I do not think talking to her about R and then her talk about D will make her dig her heals in. I would suggest reading DB again to help you focus on GAL and LRT. This is now about you. She will have to deal with her D later.
I hope my WAW sees what she is doing before the judge signs. We are at the settlement part too.
Best of luck. Hang in there.


Me43/WAW43..M 4y..S1 11/S2 4..Bomb2/2014..Dfile 5/2014..Settlement signed 8/20/14..D final 8/29/14
I moved out 10/10/14..WAW got D she wanted. I wanted R. No waiting,just no boundaries in her way.
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nit84 Offline OP
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Thanks for responding NewB3,

I am good on the GAL stuff but there is always room for more.

I will go back and reread DB again regarding the LRT.

I have the LRT letter written just not inclined to give it to my W just yet.

I feel I have moved on with my life in almost every facet except dating which I find very difficult to do while still being M, you know being an adulterer.

In other words, I am not actively looking to date but if an angel fell out of the sky I may tread lightly into that scene but probably not since it wouldn't be fair to the other party till I am D.

I do the GAL dance somewhat with a air of mystery concerning what I am doing and with who but there is no romantic interest on the horizon but my W doesn't need to know what I do.

Even if I was wanting to date not sure it would change W mind so I don't want to compromise my values for something that will have no bearing on my W feelings nor should I ever compromise beliefs for anything for anybody.

I thought about being firm with my W and in conjunction with the letter telling her that if she leaves there is no turning back but I know in my Heart I can't say that and mean it right now.

I am out of ideas to try and it may be too late anyways but I am a very hopeful person by nature and will have that till the Papers are signed.

I have failed miserably when attempting to set boundaries and W wouldn't abide by them anyhow in her current emotional state.

If you or anybody else has something to try I am ready and willing to listen and possibly implement it. I have asked if she would talk to my DB coach. At first she thought about it then went cold on the idea so I haven't asked in about 6 weeks.

Stay Strong!!


Me 47/W 34
T 16 M 13
No kids
BD 6/2013
W asked that I move out 6/2013
I moved back and W is upset with this 12/2013
separate beds not much talking
Served D Complaint 5/2014
W moved out 9/27/2014
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 511
N
nit84 Offline OP
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Posts: 511
Ok, just throwing it out there.

Should I ignore the fact that it is my W Birthday today?

If I acknowledge it should it only be in the form of a verbal "Happy Birthday" alone or maybe a Card?

If I don't see her should I just chalk it up to I didn't see you to wish you a "Happy Birthday" and let it go or would a little note on the counter be in order?

She doesn't talk to me much but I still feel like I want to be nice because that is type of person I am.

If we didn't live together I wouldn't be asking this question and would not wish her a "Happy Birthday" probably but since she is still here I feel a little obligated. She did call me for my Birthday back in November and we weren't living together then.

Thoughts?


Me 47/W 34
T 16 M 13
No kids
BD 6/2013
W asked that I move out 6/2013
I moved back and W is upset with this 12/2013
separate beds not much talking
Served D Complaint 5/2014
W moved out 9/27/2014
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 273
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Member
Offline
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Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 273
how did it go? I failed to get a valentines/anniversary/fathers day card from my WAW. Her birthday was in June. I did birthday week since we still live together. Little gifts each day....on from S3.5, one from S10. cards the first two days from them. I gave her a heartfelt card with ILU at beginning of that week and that was the last time I said it. and as her birthday week ended, she got flowers day before bday and final day was something I found prior to BD. a VERY nice piece of jewelry...sans stones. that last gift she has gotten too. I did not let her lack of love negate mine. DB made me a better person, either way.


Me43/WAW43..M 4y..S1 11/S2 4..Bomb2/2014..Dfile 5/2014..Settlement signed 8/20/14..D final 8/29/14
I moved out 10/10/14..WAW got D she wanted. I wanted R. No waiting,just no boundaries in her way.
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