So, Wonka. What was the key to resolving things with Ms Wonka? Just time and GAL?
Nothing has been "resolved" with Ms. Wonka per se. She left me in August 2004 and moved right in with the OW. Got everything thrown at me by Ms. Wonka except the kitchen sink. Has been gone ever since.
Of course, I was devastated and did all the wrong things before finding DB as you can see from my screenname. Over time, I was able to detach and got on with my life. Dated, moved a lot (nature of my work), and seeking out new outlets such as picking up golf.
I suspect that our "story" is still being written as of now. Please keep in mind that I was a former kitty kitten MLCer who most probably acted wonky and hurt Ms. Wonka with my crazy-making MLC antics. Then she got involved with the OW out of her pain...I think. Then I became a LBS. Sounds like a bad Days of Our Lives show rip-off.
Wacky, isn't it??!
Originally Posted By: DBinSF
There's not an hour that goes by that I'm not thinking about her and missing her. Unpacking my crazy behavior and coming out of denial about my "issues" has been really hard. And it only makes me more certain that I want to work things out with her come hell or high water.
Like you, I thought constantly about Ms. Wonka early in my sitch. I had a very, very severe case of PTSD. Rapid weight loss in a month, couldn't sleep to save my own life, loss of appetite, and horrible nightly flashbacks. I tell you this because many newbies get the false impression of vets around here that DBing was a breeze for us. Oh my! No. Not true at all.
Use the gift of time to WORK on you. Because if you don't and you reconcile with W, then your issues will all come and bite you hard in the BUTT.
It'll make Bruce the Great White Shark look like a guppy fish.
Ignore your issues at your own peril.
Get crackin' with IC on your own emotional intimacy issues for it will be a looong road for you.
I don't know where to begin. YES YOU DO KNOW. You just don't "feel like it". That ^^^ is the addict in you talking again. Stop it. Take & FACE life on life's terms, you know?
This happened and you caused it. So far, your actions (other than when you act a tad healthy) make it worse. Like a drug you KNOW won't make you feel good yet you itch to take it again. DB, think it out. You call her and then what?
She won't answer the phone and say "thank God you called!" Okay? Get real.
She'll either hang up, or listen to you in a way that reeks of pity and NOT of attraction or mystery. She will NOT invite you over "Like it never happened."
You want to un-do any and all growth and insights you CLAIM to have been doing? B/c you will - if you do not STFU, GAL/DETACH.
Stop THIS endless cycling thru. Stop circling the freeway. Take the exit ramp.
AND knock OFF this crazy spiraling NOW. (Am I being clear enough?)
I've tried through Alanon, Let Go and Let God, turning it over, Serenity Prayer, but nothing seems to work. You've "tried"??? Don't "try". DO IT.
Oh, but "nothing seems to work" ?? Why? b/c you are so different than all the other people in the world who have suffered??.
YOUR misery is way worse than everyone else's. YOU caused this all....
but I'm sure your pain is much deeper... and sadly, somehow you lack ALL the skills the rest of us were just handed at birth...
BS. I've done a 12 step program...Not a picnic for anyone.
I am not in the mood to hear another young person tell the "group" that HIS/HER SITUATION is so much harder than everyone else's. It's NOT.
If anything, you have it easier. There are NO kids to deal with, no financial ruin, no decades of building a life that is now all undone, No mountains of memories to suppress b/c every single holiday for the past 3 decades of your life were shared with ONE person whom you did NOT betray, you have NO confrontations to deal with and NO OMs....No assets to fight about and squander with legal bills, and NO fertility time lost...
All you have to do is learn to live on your own...well, gee, that IS horrible. Snap out of this.
I get SUPER obsessed and don't know how to stop. It's part of an OLD pattern.
Why don't you "know how to stop"? You have done a 12 step program.
There are steps you take and TOOLS to use. The program only works, when you work the program. Work it. For real this time.
AND please, Stop making this about YOUR PAIN. It's Incredibly self indulgent.
Don't you see how that is still all about YOU?
DB, you are better than this. IF not, she deserves better than how you are now.
Don't bother calling her with all YOUR pain and all YOUR needs again and again. So NOT appealing.
Here is one tool I used many years ago when I had to deal with my problem -- which was a BIG one. I thought it out for 3 minutes.
Sometimes that meant calling my sponsor, but eventually I could usually do this on my own. I'd think out realistic outcomes of using again.
"hmm, So I could feel good --probably--for "awhile" and THEN...."
then $h1t hits the fan.
You think it out DB. 3 minutes!
Tell us how great you calling her now would be...with your bucket of need
-the bucket that still has a hole in it, so she can never fill it for long before you go...elsewhere, b/c you have NOT fixed yourself.
Tell us how you will tell her - that you are NOW so different...so different from a few months ago when you were Not the "disciplined man" in control of his urges"....... (Oh, wait...) Has it even been a week since you wrote her back?
Tell us about all that stuff you wrote (to US) the other day, about your changes, and how you want to commit to her now, whereas "before" you were not in the right place but NOW...now that you have CHANGED & GROWN and are so different.... but you "don't know where to begin"??
Well DB, I would hope you'd WANT to be better & improve more, BEFORE calling her. But you say you "can't wait".
Well - what does that say about you and all that changing and growth?
All the new found self restraint and discipline (long term fidelity requires both) and respect for her, and the way you are working on UN LEARNING your "old pattern"
Are you going to call her and talk about THAT?? Think it out.
Dig Deeper. When you SAY the Serenity Prayer, MEAN IT and DO It.
TURN IT OVER TO GOD,
AND DO NOT GO TAKE IT BACK THE NEXT DAY/HOUR/MINUTE.
Back off. You can do this. You have to.
If you don't pull yourself out of this spiral, your life will NOT improve.
If you call her before you are better, and stronger, you risk losing her forever.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
Yep, that's some tough love right there. I am turning it over every minute of every day. I come here to bitch about it because my friends are all done hearing about it. I hope this remains a safe place to vent and learn without getting beat up TOO much.
I'd also love to hear more from men who have repaired their R after an affair like this. I'm beginning to wonder if it's even possible.
Me: 39 - W: 35 Together: 2 years, no kids My Affair: 1.5 years Affair ended: 4/9/14 Affair revealed: 5/19/14 Last Contact: 8/2/14
I'd also love to hear more from men who have repaired their R after an affair like this. I'm beginning to wonder if it's even possible.
^^ Yes, all of this is possible if you continue working on your issues and take full ownership of your affairs. That includes empathy and making sincere amends. That will come later. You must turn yourself inside out to understand your motivations, fears, habits and patterns.
I'm beginning to understand where these issues come from. Everyone in my family is addicted to something. Food, booze, work, kids, etc. I'm addicted to attention and affirmation. Literally. I have extremely low self esteem (illogically so given I'm a smart guy with a lot going for him), and I get caught up in fantasies a and most recently affairs. I over value sex in relationships and under value integrity and commitment. When the M word (marriage) comes up, I literally panic.
I'm working through this systematically. I'm proud that these last three months are the LONGEST period of "no coping behaviors" in 20 years. So, while it might not seem like I'm making any progress, this whole thing has been pretty amazing.
Me: 39 - W: 35 Together: 2 years, no kids My Affair: 1.5 years Affair ended: 4/9/14 Affair revealed: 5/19/14 Last Contact: 8/2/14
Yes, our FOO issues do influence and shape who we are today. However, we can break those patterns. It isn't a life sentence, ya know.
I'm addicted to attention and affirmation.
In what ways are you addicted to attention and affirmation? What does that look like to you? Did you receive any of them from either one of your parents?
I get caught up in fantasies and most recently affairs.
If you don't mind, I'd like to help you by probing a bit here. What types of fantasties do you engage in? What form and shape do they take in your head? What do you get out of those fantasties?
I over value sex in relationships and under value integrity and commitment.
How and where did you learn those traits? This is a learned behavior.
When the M word (marriage) comes up, I literally panic.
Panic is an outward manifestation of one's internal fear(s).
What is it about "marriage" that strikes the fear in your heart and head?
I'm addicted to affirmation and attention in that I've always been the class clown, I'm mildly narcissistic, I'm very concerned about appearances. I have fame fantasies. My parents were both emotionally unavailable growing up. I've learned I need to "reparent" myself as part of my recovery process.
The fantasies I indulge in are normally about strangers or people I meet briefly. I idealize them and tell myself that I'd be "happier" with them. That they are aomehow perfect. These are normally baseless fantasies as these people are total strangers or even people who would be really bad for me (party girls, bar tenders, etc)
I over value axe because it's something I can control. You can't hurt me if I'm just having sex with you. But if I fall for YOU AS A PERSON I might get hurt. And the commitment to marrow he fear is all about not being a good provider and husband. It's about fear if failure.
Me: 39 - W: 35 Together: 2 years, no kids My Affair: 1.5 years Affair ended: 4/9/14 Affair revealed: 5/19/14 Last Contact: 8/2/14
^^ That is a good start. I do hope that you're sincerely and truly working with your IC on those issues. I would comment more here but I think I'll hand this off to my WWE tag team, 25. Dang, you're stuck with us!!
Believe me...it isn't yucky stuff. We've seen some pretty graphic stuff around here. You're not alone here.
I do want to make a comment on your previous comments about your addictions.
If I recall correctly, you've been engaged to 3 different women and they've all been called off/broken off. I am guess it is all because of your learned behaviors and panic about marriage.
All of that shows me a man who is low on emotional intelligence. I believe this is the key area that ties together all of your patterns, habits, attitudes, values, and learned behaviors. On top of it, you're seeking out the ideal Mother Mary/Madonna woman. FYI...she doesn't exist at all.
A person with a healthy set of emotional IQ tends to have happier and healthier marriages. Research backs this up through the works of Gottman.
I'm curious to know what "marriage" model your parents showed you in the house.
-Were they affectionate toward each other? -Have any couple time together? -Did they fight fair? -Did they bicker? -Demonstrate any conflict resolution skills? -Did any one of your parents have an affair (or multiple affairs)?
