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o Sandi, could it be that it is for him, she just does not want to admit it or actually realize it?


I would say no, b/c it's not usually the mindset of a WW. It is, however, the way some LBH'S want to believe. There could be some variation in some stitches, but my first thought would be "no".

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My MC said that even though my WW returned home and said it was for S16 and Finances, that she tells the MC she likes to spend time with me, she enjoys being with me etc.


May be true, or the MC could have asked her if she enjoyed spending time with you.....in which she may, but she still wouldn't be ready to be your W in every sense. IDK how she was approached by the MC, etc. Is it posted in your thread?

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The MC said I should not ever point out to the WW that its also for me, but I should know that it is, that the ww returned to the home not only for the kids.


The WW will often want the kids, home, finances, position, lifestyle, etc., but not necessarily the H. If the MC was not extremely plain, miscommunication was very possible here.

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I am just asking how can you tell the real reason, as they say believe nothing that you hear.


Mostly time will tell, if she has other motives for really returning home. If she refuses to work on the problems and make changes, that's a pretty big flag. Some are not interested in being intimate, or even being in the same bedroom again.

I would have a thorough agreement and plan in place. Do not take for granted she feels what this MC is telling you. I'll have to continue this on your thread.


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
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I do think I need to take a harder stance similar to Dev. Not only for any chance of MR, but also because I'm not going to continue to live in an open marriage.


But you tell her this and then you consider dating her while she's dating OM. That really weakens your position.

Be honest, when she started to leave and you announced you would not continue to live in an open marriage, weren't you hoping it would cause her to finally end it with OM?

It's like when parents tell the kid if they do such & such he will get a particular consequence. So kid does it and the parent doesn't carry through and decides to give him another chance. The child learns not to pay attention to the words, only the action.

You react out of emotions and say something...then later you back down. Or you say something to add some pressure, hoping she'll think harder about R.

Forget your time limit you've set on W coming back to you. All it's doing is pushing you into pushing her....and she's clearly not ready yet. You will know when you are done, but it won't be according to a calendar date.

Personally, I feel if you start dating her while OM is still in the picture, then all these months would have been for nothing. Better to hold out a little longer than to void what you've been saying all this time. It just seems to cheapen it someway, like you're giving up part of your dignity. But that's JMHO.


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
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Originally Posted By: sandi2
Be honest, when she started to leave and you announced you would not continue to live in an open marriage, weren't you hoping it would cause her to finally end it with OM?

You betcha and I would warn everyone reading this that you can't take actions or say things with the intent of receiving your desired result. Everytime I've backed down from my words, I end up looking weaker and desperate.

Originally Posted By: sandi2
Personally, I feel if you start dating her while OM is still in the picture, then all these months would have been for nothing. Better to hold out a little longer than to void what you've been saying all this time. It just seems to cheapen it someway, like you're giving up part of your dignity. But that's JMHO.

I made it clear to W that if we did decide to date, she would have to agree to no OM contact. I will not subject myself to 'dating' my W while she continues to date another man. I suppose if we were to date, I would have to take her word that she is not contacting OM until a time would come that we both decide to R. At that time, I would address the full transparency plan, correct?

Of course, all this dating talk could be for nothing as I've yet to hear back from W. She told me she would call on Sun to talk more in depth, but she had the kids, so valid excuse in my mind as her place has no privacy. Did not hear from her last night either- she and her girlfriends usually get together on Mon nights for a tv show. She has no excuse not to call tonight, unless she's having 2nd thoughts. From our talk on Sat, I got the feeling that her calling me was only a formality to confirm it, as it sounded like we were on the same page with giving it a shot. Maybe I was just mindreading?

How long do I excuse her not calling before I enforce the 'OM contact= no friendship between us' stance?? I don't want to risk ruining the possibility of dating by sending that email while she's in the middle of dialing my number....



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Originally Posted By: sandi2
Forget your time limit you've set on W coming back to you. All it's doing is pushing you into pushing her....and she's clearly not ready yet. You will know when you are done, but it won't be according to a calendar date.

Sandi, this part didn't really sink in until the 2nd time I read your feedback. Something to really think about.

W picked up kids earlier for the night so I'm not expecting her call tonight either. She actually came into the house, which usually doesn't happen, and was nice and friendly to me. I just happened to be cleaning up from dinner and sweeping the floors, so maybe that gained me some bonus points grin She also went upstairs and possibly saw that I'm reading a book on how to build an A proof marriage. Actually I hope she did- shows that 10 mos later and I'm still trying to learn better R skills.

Last edited by Tarheel; 07/23/14 12:49 AM.


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You betcha and I would warn everyone reading this that you can't take actions or say things with the intent of receiving your desired result. Everytime I've backed down from my words, I end up looking weaker and desperate.


I think one can most certainly take actions or say things with the intent of receiving a desired result. IF you back up your statement (I will not be in an open marriage) with your actions, how can you not get your desired result? You either will NOT be in a marriage because she wants an open one, OR she will drop the OM. There, you got your desired result, just as your statement said.

However, I still think that statement in and of itself still communicates from a position of weakness. To me it says, I will still take you back if you drop other man. Maybe it's just me, but I believe women are attracted to strong, confident, decisive men... It seems that a statement like " We can date when the OM is out of the picture", still gives her the option of waiting it out with the OM. It seems stronger to leave her with the impression of... "I'm not really sure how I feel right now. I'm not sure that even if OM is out of the picture that I would want to date again."

I believe THAT attitude is the one that causes them to begin to wake up and start to ask the right questions. They have to FEEL they may have lost you. Trying to be strong on one hand while showing weakness on the other doesn't seem to work too well from what I have read and seen. This also automatically takes any and all pressure off of her. Once the pressure is gone it is amazing what can happen.

You can still treat her nicely, but your whole demeanor changes. As Michelle says, you let them believe you have had an awakening. I have seen it again and again, that once the betrayed starts to really show they have let go, is when the wayward suddenly shows signs of coming back and WANTING to try again. As I read your thread it is quite apparent that you are really allowing this to be your wife's decision. You DO realize that you also really really do get a say in this don't you? It isn't coming across to me like that.

Just my opinion.... Good luck


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Tarheel Offline OP
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I do worry that I'm giving W the impression that this is all her decision. I'm fully aware that I have a decision to make too and I've told W that. What I want most is just the chance. I know that after a few dates, I could realize that W has not made any changes and we're not going to work.

Still no call from W regarding our conversation last week. I can imagine she's still not sure she wants to take the dating step. She did pick up the kids earlier and came in the house again to get them. She asked me how work was- I couldn't tell you the last time she asked me that. Although it might of been her way of getting me to ask her the same, because she then had no problem telling me about hers laugh Just weird how we can have a conversation like nothing's different, but then she'll walk out the door without saying bye.



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Tarheel,

I do worry that I'm giving W the impression that this is all her decision.


It is the choice for the WAS to end the A. You cannot do it for her, right?

What I want most is just the chance.

Just the chance for what? Could you please elaborate on this a bit more so we can understand better your thought process here?

She asked me how work was- I couldn't tell you the last time she asked me that. Although it might of been her way of getting me to ask her the same, because she then had no problem telling me about hers laugh Just weird how we can have a conversation like nothing's different, but then she'll walk out the door without saying bye.

I hope you're keeping the convos short for you are not her best friend. Try to keep your answers short and those interactions brief because she's still with the OM.

That is the boundary you need to enforce on a consistent basis so she'll get the message loud and clear that you're not "Plan B".

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Originally Posted By: Wonka
It is the choice for the WAS to end the A. You cannot do it for her, right?

I meant that I worry I give her the impression that I'm just waiting around for her to come back and that I'm the one that will do anything to make it work. I have a decision to make as well.

Originally Posted By: Wonka
Just the chance for what? Could you please elaborate on this a bit more so we can understand better your thought process here?

The chance to work together on things. I'm fully aware that if W hasn't made changes on her end, I may realize that we're not going to work. I just don't want to look back in 10 years and regret not doing everything I could have- including a chance at MR via dating

So after picking up the kids from W and being frustrated that she didn't at least come out and acknowledge I was there, I text her...
M: You never called me last week....
W: I know. Been thinking a lot. Why don't we plan a 'date' this week?

So we're planning on a 'date' on Wed. In a way, I feel like the pressure is on to plan a date that demonstrates some of my changes- more outgoing, adventurous and willing to try new things. I have a couple ideas, but open to suggestions.

My thought process is that I'm willing to go on a couple dates before addressing OM contact. I made it clear last week that I wouldn't 'date' her while they were in contact, so I don't feel I need to restate my boundary if she's proposing this. After a couple dates (if we make it that far), I would want to ensure she's holding to it, so may need to revisit. Thoughts??



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Tarheel,

I'm gonna cut right to the point here:

Are you okay with being in a triangle with the OM if you elect to "date" W while she's involved with the OM?

Another thing is that it makes your boundary all moot. Then what's the incentive for W to end her A with the OM right now?

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Originally Posted By: Wonka
Are you okay with being in a triangle with the OM if you elect to "date" W while she's involved with the OM?

No, but how do I insure that's not happening unless she would come back saying 'I'll do whatever it takes'? My W is too proud for that- after 10mos she'd have to admit she was wrong. Right or wrong, I simply do not see her ever saying that. This is her 'I'm going to date Tarheel and see if he's changed' approach. Which I'm fine with, knowing that OM contact will need to be re-addressed should we continue to 'date' more than say, 2-3 times.

Maybe I'm wrong (and vets would obviously know better than me) but I imagine the WAS either comes back saying 'I'll do anything' or they test the water before jumping in. And to be honest, I would like to see W's changes before I'm ready to jump back in myself.



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