Just got off the phone with my DB coach. She thinks the situation so far has had some encouraging progress, but some notable setbacks.
I have to stop getting myself involved in arguments with her, especially about the affair or our past. I have to control my anger. I have to stop contacting the OMW.
Approach pursuit tactics very carefully. If I can get a full week of "good days" (no arguments or conflicts), then I can build on that. I haven't had more than two or three consecutive "good days" since D-day, four weeks ago.
I have to keep my good attitude and detach. Give her the freedom she so desires without stepping over any boundaries that we've both established.
M: 15 years BD: 6/25/14 EA/PA: starts 5/14/14 11/30/14 - A ends 5/15/15 - D is finalized. 11/28/15 - Start of new LTR with a wonderful woman (and still going strong)!
"I confronted her and asked if she had no shame. "
Who made you the moral authority especially after the things you had done?
I mean at least she was honest with you and said that she wants to be with the OM. And you continually minimize your role in all of this and choose to concentrate on what YOU think she is doing wrong. It's controlling. You didn't give a damn about her before. Why do you think that what she's doing is wrong and you were right? Just because you had an "epiphany" about your situation with the MULTIPLE affairs you had, doesn't mean that she has to suddenly fall in love with you again.
If her ONE affair is driving you crazy, how do you think your MULTIPLE ones affected her?
You still sweep things under the rug.
M-43 W-40 2D - 9 and 5
Emotion, yet peace. Ignorance, yet knowledge. Passion, yet serenity. Chaos, yet harmony. Death, yet a new life.
The things I've done were done years ago. A lot has changed since then. The things I've done had everything to do with the addictive lifestyle I led, and nothing to do with my wife or my love for her. I've come to terms with that back in 2011.
It is absolutely sweeping it under the rug, and there is nothing wrong with that. Why would I continually bring myself back to a time when I was selfish and destructive? I want to leave that life behind. I want to be able to forgive myself for what I did. That can never happen if I keep beating myself down over and over again. That can never happen if I can never let go of the guilt. That can never happen if I keep excusing my wife's infidelity. I could never respect myself if I keep doing that. And I certainly couldn't expect respect from others.
Last edited by mindsin; 07/24/1401:32 PM.
M: 15 years BD: 6/25/14 EA/PA: starts 5/14/14 11/30/14 - A ends 5/15/15 - D is finalized. 11/28/15 - Start of new LTR with a wonderful woman (and still going strong)!
Mindin, I am no vet at all, but you are getting GREAT advice and questions from vets (MrBond, and 25yrs), and it doesn't sound like you are really listening to them.
Originally Posted By: mindsin
MrBond -
The things I've done were done years ago. A lot has changed since then. The things I've done had everything to do with the addictive lifestyle I led, and nothing to do with my wife or my love for her. I've come to terms with that back in 2011.
2011 is "Years" ago?? Sorry, not really. And maybe you've "come to terms" with it, but what about your W? You seem to quite easily excuse your behavior (it was an "addictive lifestyle"), without really addressing the hurt you inflicted on your W and family.
Quote:
It is absolutely sweeping it under the rug, and there is nothing wrong with that. Why would I continually bring myself back to a time when I was selfish and destructive? I want to leave that life behind. I want to be able to forgive myself for what I did. That can never happen if I keep beating myself down over and over again. That can never happen if I can never let go of the guilt. That can never happen if I keep excusing my wife's infidelity. I could never respect myself if I keep doing that. And I certainly couldn't expect respect from others.
Yes, there is something wrong with sweeping YOUR mistakes under the rug if you are now vilifying your W for doing what you had done to her, repeatedly, for years.
She asked you what you love/miss about her-- and your answers were pretty much physical. That would be a huge turn off for me, personally. I would want to know what my H loved about me AS A PERSON, not as a physical object.
What is the OM giving her that you have not? How are you working on YOU?
2011 is "Years" ago?? Sorry, not really. And maybe you've "come to terms" with it, but what about your W? You seem to quite easily excuse your behavior (it was an "addictive lifestyle"), without really addressing the hurt you inflicted on your W and family.
Three years ago, to be exact. My wife said she blamed herself for a long time. But we both understand that it had nothing to do with her, and everything to do with me.
When did I excuse my behavior? I am simply stating a fact. It was going through a time in my life where I was addicted to it. It's not an excuse. It's a reason. There is a difference.
I have addressed the hurt I caused. I felt it first-hand with the situation I'm going through now, and then some. At the same time, it doesn't excuse her affair either.
Originally Posted By: claire7
Yes, there is something wrong with sweeping YOUR mistakes under the rug if you are now vilifying your W for doing what you had done to her, repeatedly, for years.
She asked you what you love/miss about her-- and your answers were pretty much physical. That would be a huge turn off for me, personally. I would want to know what my H loved about me AS A PERSON, not as a physical object.
What is the OM giving her that you have not? How are you working on YOU?
I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree then. You seem to believe in a philosophy that two wrongs make a right. I don't believe in such.
M: 15 years BD: 6/25/14 EA/PA: starts 5/14/14 11/30/14 - A ends 5/15/15 - D is finalized. 11/28/15 - Start of new LTR with a wonderful woman (and still going strong)!
2011 is "Years" ago?? Sorry, not really. And maybe you've "come to terms" with it, but what about your W? You seem to quite easily excuse your behavior (it was an "addictive lifestyle"), without really addressing the hurt you inflicted on your W and family.
Three years ago, to be exact. My wife said she blamed herself for a long time. But we both understand that it had nothing to do with her, and everything to do with me.
When did I excuse my behavior? I am simply stating a fact. It was going through a time in my life where I was addicted to it. It's not an excuse. It's a reason. There is a difference.
I have addressed the hurt I caused. I felt it first-hand with the situation I'm going through now, and then some. At the same time, it doesn't excuse her affair either.
Originally Posted By: claire7
Yes, there is something wrong with sweeping YOUR mistakes under the rug if you are now vilifying your W for doing what you had done to her, repeatedly, for years.
She asked you what you love/miss about her-- and your answers were pretty much physical. That would be a huge turn off for me, personally. I would want to know what my H loved about me AS A PERSON, not as a physical object.
What is the OM giving her that you have not? How are you working on YOU?
I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree then. You seem to believe in a philosophy that two wrongs make a right. I don't believe in such.
No, I don't believe that two wrongs make a right.
But I'm not sure how being so angry at your W for having an A (which is something you've done to her as well) will help save your M.
There are vets with far more expertise than me spending valuable time on your thread. I will defer to them. Good luck to you.
So? Ask anyone who has been on the receiving end of being betrayed by an A. They will tell you that the scars and mind movies last alot longer than that. You just don't choose to see that.
"A lot has changed since then. The things I've done had everything to do with the addictive lifestyle I led, and nothing to do with my wife or my love for her. I've come to terms with that back in 2011."
Great for YOU. And again, you seem to concentrate alot just on you and how YOU feel. Yet you condemn your W 10x's harder than it seems she did to you.
"It is absolutely sweeping it under the rug, and there is nothing wrong with that."
That's what you think. That's what landed you here. You don't seem to get it.
"Why would I continually bring myself back to a time when I was selfish and destructive?"
Again you talk only of yourself. We are saying that the underlying problems that your W had with the A are still there. You just don't want to acknowledge her feelings because YOU are suddenly at peace with what you did. She is not.
"I want to leave that life behind. I want to be able to forgive myself for what I did."
All self-centered. You're not thinking about your W. We aren't saying to bring up the past to beat yourself with it. We are saying that you need to understand the impact it had on your W and deal with it from her POV.
"That can never happen if I keep beating myself down over and over again. That can never happen if I can never let go of the guilt. That can never happen if I keep excusing my wife's infidelity. I could never respect myself if I keep doing that. And I certainly couldn't expect respect from others."
Wow, how much more selfish can you be? And again, who made YOU the moral authority of your relationship?
Bottom line is that if you want to save your M, you're going to have to stop getting defensive about your past and start listening and understanding. You're not being attacked. We are trying to get you to understand but you don't seem to want to.
Why don't you go ahead and just file for D already? It would save your W alot of heartache in the future since you won't change.
M-43 W-40 2D - 9 and 5
Emotion, yet peace. Ignorance, yet knowledge. Passion, yet serenity. Chaos, yet harmony. Death, yet a new life.
What exactly do I need to understand about my W that I already don't? I already understand how much I've hurt her over the years -- not just with the infidelity, but with the other faults I've listed.
She is using those things as justification for this A. Even without the OM, she would find it very difficult to reconcile with me. With the OM, it's almost impossible.
What else am I missing?
I absolutely condemn my wife's A harder.
- I never threatened to break apart my family. - I never said "I love you" to another woman. - I never called another woman my "soulmate". - I never brought my CHILDREN to meet any of my "lovers" behind my wife's back. - I never said to her, "Hey, honey, I'm coming home from work, then I'm going to spend the night with an escort. Make sure you drop the kids off at school in the morning".
I don't need to be a moral authority to know what's morally wrong about what is CURRENTLY going on.
M: 15 years BD: 6/25/14 EA/PA: starts 5/14/14 11/30/14 - A ends 5/15/15 - D is finalized. 11/28/15 - Start of new LTR with a wonderful woman (and still going strong)!
"I absolutely condemn my wife's A harder." wow. just wow. I wonder if she has her own list of reasons why HER affair is more justified than yours were?
If her having an A (or the kind of A she is having) is a deal breaker for you (which it sounds like it may be), then you should file for D and let her be.
If you would like to attempt to save your M, then you should read DR and get off your high horse.
You can set a boundary-- you can say that as long as she is seeing OM, you can't be 'friends' with her or have a relationship with her outside of co-parenting. That is a choice YOU can make. But you cannot control what she does or how she feels.
Looking forward to seeing some self-reflection and introspection from you.
Why do I need to get off my high horse? Part of my GAL and 180 is improving my self esteem and self confidence. I've been the spouse who always yielded to my wife. "Yes dear". I never stood up for myself.
I'm not trying to control her or make/tell her how she feels. I'm only trying to change myself.
I am reading DR, btw. (still in the early part of the book)
M: 15 years BD: 6/25/14 EA/PA: starts 5/14/14 11/30/14 - A ends 5/15/15 - D is finalized. 11/28/15 - Start of new LTR with a wonderful woman (and still going strong)!
