Please anyone who can help. My wife of 20 years has decided to leave me and our four boys. She called and said that she has panic attacks on the way home and needed to leave. After doing all of the wrong things like beg and trying to make her reconsider I helped her find a place to stay. We had problems with my mother overstaying her welcome and the house being clean with four boys and a dog, and the dog. I put all my efforts into fixing these things and she then told me that she loved me but was not in love with me anymore. So I started to work on myself and improve the house and the kids. She then agreed to come home and stay four out of seven days of the weeks she says for the kids. We now spend more time together then when she was in the house all the time. After talking to her one day she said she felt alone again. I put a lot of time into the kids and their activities and she was left home alone a lot and unable to do what she wanted to do. It has been a little over a month and she will still not talk about us but we go out on dates “which I can not call dates” regularly and she enjoyed herself. Due to her behavior I did something that I am not proud of and went through her phone to see if it was someone else which there is not but I did find some disturbing texts where she is untruthful with friends about the things she is doing while at home. The lies seem unnecessary and a little crazy to me. I have prayed to God for guidance and all I can think of is to keep showing my wife that things have changed and that she is the most important woman in the world to me.
The actual separation has been going on for about a month. I know the things that I did wrong that have hurt her was to discount her feelings on the things going on in our life. She works full time and I left my job when we had our third child. She is a women in a house surrounded by five different versions of me. The kids are very active in sports and I think she feels that I pushed her aside for them. I have cut back on the kids activities so we can spend more time as a family together . I have asked her if she wanted to spend time alone with the kids and at first she said that she wanted to have the kids on some days and for me to have them some days. She has never done this but has asked me to go out with them. One of the reasons she said she needed to move was she need here on place that she could keep clean the way she wanted and peaceful surroundings. As far as the lies as I said I looked through her phone and read her messages. I have never done this before because I trusted her but this behavior came out of nowhere so I thought it maybe someone else. She has friends at her job who she confides in and she has been omitting me from what she does on her off days, things that she does with the kids ie. she lied about going to a pool party with them, and her status for moving her things out. She still has most of her things here. The thing is she talks about doing things I the house like decorticating and painting. One of the things that suffered was our communication skills we just stopped talking and trying to understand each other. So I told her that I would be as honest as possible with her. The problem is that the only things I can get from her are ok and I understand. I have no clue what she is thinking, I asked her yesterday was I making her happy and she said she didn't understand the question and then changed the subject. When she is at home we now spend more time together then when she was here full time. I told her that I wanted to build a new better relationship with her and to find out who she is now. I got ok and I understand and I don't want to date you or anybody right now. She said that she would be open to us trying to be friends again like we use to be because she is my best friend. So we go out, I take her to places we have never been to before an she smiles and laughs and we have fun. I have also been working on touching her again which is hard because she does not like contact. I would be really hurt bug it's the same with the kids. So I treat her like a lady and place my hand on her back and steal touches on her arms and legs.for the most part it's fine until she realizes that she is being touched. So to sum it up since she left the house stays in immaculate condition. I try to include her in as many decisions as I can. I don't tell her every second that I love her but I do tell her once a day and she responds that she loves me too. Robert I think it's working but I have no clue, it's an uphill battle but I can't give up on her or our family.
Thanks that's what I have been doing. I lost about 25 pounds and I feel great physically. I had to start taking sleep aids when she is not home or I start going crazy thinking about what to do. She said she wants her space but she is home more than she is not and always wants to spend time with me. I am just taking it one day at a time.
My mom called and talked to me. She said she talked to my wife and she said she still loved me and enjoyed spending time with me. She also told her that the earliest she could see moving back home was the second week in the new school year. That would be September , she also said that something's have to change.she called and wanted to know our plans for the weekend. She travels for work so she stayed at home went to Philly and will come back home and leave for London. So we as a family are going to an Art Festival Friday and her and I are going on a brewery tour. When I Tolbert about the tour she said she was happy to go. What kind of separation is the kind where she is only gone two to three days and she does nothing while gone.is she playing some kind of game?
So I tran into a few of her friends and they asked how I was doing. I told them I was doing fine and the things I had started doing. They then started to tell me the things my W told them she was doing and when which confused me because she was with me when she did those things. I don't understand the lies.
I think I have finally started to detach. I have been working on it for a few weeks I don't call W anymore. She still wants to come over she said to spend time with the kids but asked what we were going to do this weekend.
Just read DB and DR so now I know why she is lying to her friends. Does anybody think she put herself into a box thinking I would react one way and did the complete opposite? She clearly enjoys being at home, does she have some timetable in her head?
I had a hard night that's why I am up. Wife came home and we got along fine took the kids out for dinner. When we came home I gave her space until I was ready to go to bed. In bed we ended up sleeping pretty close to each other until later that night she asked me to move over. She was the one that was moving closer to me what is she doing?
So she called to finalize plans for the weekend it's clear that she wants to spend time with me and the boys. I asked her if she wanted to do things alone with the boys and she said no I want you to come. She said to me the other day when I said she was being cold that she didn't mean to but she was emotionally burned out. I am going to work on my R and myself day by day.
She called to see if I wanted to go to the gym with her and I met her down there. After we went to the mall and she did some shopping. We had dinner it was a good day she seems to be going back to her old self but I have to keep the changes I made in place one day at a time.
Get out of the house and do something man. You need to not always be there when she is. Go out and GAL, not just lose weight. Go find some fun things to do for yourself here. Read the post Cadet made on your thread and use it. You have not started to detach, its pretty evident from your posts. You are worried about her every move.
If she likes spending so much time with you, then maybe you should make your time a little more rare. If youre always around when she wants to see you then there is no reason why she would change anything. She can continue on this way forever with you running around like a lost puppy chasing after her.
Im not trying to be overly rude to you here, but you need to understand the situation that you are in right now as it really is.
What are your other 180s besides cleaning the house? What kind of complaints does she have about you that you have ignored? What is the sex life like? Give us some more info here.
M:33 W:30 T:10 M:2 B/D: 5/27/14 S: 5/28/14 Wife moved back in 7/18/14
The biggest changes have been including her in plans and decisions. I am spending time with her because it had gotten to the point we only went out once a month. You have to understand we have two sons who are active in a lot of sports. So during the weekends we had three to five games each day. I know she felt alone because we were out of the house when she was home.
I spend a lot of time with the kids and go out with friends and family. I don't call her and let her contact me. From what I have been reading I need to reconnect with her and she wants that. There were a lot of stressors in our house that have been taken care of. We needed a change and I think she did the only thing she thought would make a change one way or the other.
As far as our sex life it was pretty bad for awhile passive aggressive attitudes. Her biggest problem was the condition of the house which the boys and I have been on top of.
So I see one of two things happening here. Either you get friendzoned by your W and you dont know it or you smother her and she leaves for good anyway. Either one is a death sentence for you.
I strongly suggest that you read DR and start applying it to your situation. If you insist on doing it "your" way here, at least read 5LL if you havent already. Very valuable info in that book for people that still have physical contact with their spouse. Best of luck to you either way.
M:33 W:30 T:10 M:2 B/D: 5/27/14 S: 5/28/14 Wife moved back in 7/18/14
Thanks Ben I have told her that I love her and that I want to make her happy. She said let's work on being friends again and I told her that being her friend is fine only if we are a married couple. She said ok and I told her that if she ever wanted me to stop all she has to do is say so.
All good, but leave out that talk about I love you and want to make you happy. That all comes off as pursuing and desperate. You really cant give in to everything she wants. I dunno how I feel about the friend thing if youre a married couple either. I would have worded that differently. You have right idea, but dont let her control everything. You dont need to control her, but that makes it sound like you will do whatever she wants as long as you all are married.
She said ok and I told her that if she ever wanted me to stop all she has to do is say so
This I would not have said at all either. I would have told her "I would like to work on the R with you, I understand that it will take some time". Dont throw the negatives in there at all.
M:33 W:30 T:10 M:2 B/D: 5/27/14 S: 5/28/14 Wife moved back in 7/18/14
So she called to finalize plans for the weekend it's clear that she wants to spend time with me and the boys. I asked her if she wanted to do things alone with the boys and she said no I want you to come. She said to me the other day when I said she was being cold that she didn't mean to but she was emotionally burned out. I am going to work on my R and myself day by day.
THIS is a clue Go...and it's one of several. I think you need to "gather intel" from your posts and your memory and dig deep. Your wife has been the sole breadwinner for how long now? That is a lot for anyone and though it may seem unfair in modern times, most women would feel unduly burdened by that, AND four kids. Plus most women, right or wrong, do look at men to be providers and protectors...not just nanny's. And finally, most women also feel guilty for not being home enough... and if she's also feeling burdened by having to do a lot of housework despite working full time (OR if it's not up to her standards if she doesn't do it, which means she DOES do it...) then it's a recipe for dissatisfaction.
And if she feels burned out emotionally, that is very significant. Have you read the "Five Love Languages"? It's a simple but yet very helpful book to read and my guess is her "love tank" has been running on empty for some time now. It's rare for a woman to want to leave her h AND kids...and I think you need to really hear what she is telling you.
When you are not sure of her meaning, ASK. Maybe you could ask her what she meant by that comment "emotionally burned out". Explore what she is telling you and LISTEN to her carefully...making full eye contact to let her know she is being heard.
Do not ask her for any decisions. Just ask for clarifications of what she tells you --the "emotionally burned out" was a great example of something that needed more details.
Gotan, What do you think SHE would say was wrong with the marriage, if she were here?
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
I had a hard night that's why I am up. Wife came home and we got along fine took the kids out for dinner. When we came home I gave her space until I was ready to go to bed. In bed we ended up sleeping pretty close to each other until later that night she asked me to move over. She was the one that was moving closer to me what is she doing?
She's not "Doing" anything and I don't believe this is a game to her.
She is obviously very confused and in pain, and thus she is behaving accordingly, (which means inconsistently.) Don't pressure her, don't press for clarity when there is no clarity, and don't get next to her. Give her space, especially in bed.
How else is your intimacy level going?
When you said you thought she felt you put the kids ahead of her, what did YOU mean?
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
The biggest changes have been including her in plans and decisions. I am spending time with her because it had gotten to the point we only went out once a month. You have to understand we have two sons who are active in a lot of sports. So during the weekends we had three to five games each day.
Let me be blunt. I had an athletic scholarship for college, my h was an athlete, and 2 of our 3 kids are athletes - so I understand the need and love for sports. But 3-5 games a day is too much. Yes, it is too much.
Even if your sons are qualified for the Olympics (which is literally the only thing I can see as justifying that much of a FAMILY commitment,) it would require everyone in the family to support it. Clearly they all don't.
This insanely busy and sports only focus on weekends, REALLY needs to change in a big way. At the very least, someone else needs to start driving them... If you ignore this, you do so at your peril.
What are your daughters doing when their brothers are being watched and driven everywhere?
And so, to sum up your wife's lifestyle as of 2 months ago...
your wife works full time at a job that I assume is somewhat, or very demanding? And she does some or a lot of the housework (or was), b/c otherwise she feels it's too messy and stinks for her to come home to a messy house after working all day....and for her free time, she is supposed to shuttle her kids from game to game, and or watch them, and that was her life?
Yeah I can see how her needs were not met by a long shot. I sense the feeling of being trapped. Especially since she was not a part of the decisions that dictated her life. That alone would be very alienating..
I know she felt alone because we were out of the house when she was home. Then she felt a reflection of reality, Because she was actually either all alone, or surrounded by everyone, right?
I spend a lot of time with the kids and go out with friends and family. I don't call her and let her contact me. From what I have been reading I need to reconnect with her and she wants that. There were a lot of stressors in our house that have been taken care of. We needed a change and I think she did the only thing she thought would make a change one way or the other.
This^^ might well be true. But what stressors were there that are now "all taken care of" other than a messy house?
See, if you don't make sure that you are making the NEEDED changes and getting NEW TOOLS for handling things, then you'll be back here soon enough.
Don't think a few months of keeping the house cleaner and making date nights is going to suffice. There is a lot going on under the surface and I really think you ought to go to Retrovaille, or some other marriage workshop and "efficiently" get some help for the marriage.
(I say workshops are more 'efficient" than some MC, b/c even though weekly sessions can lead to breakthroughs, then you have to go pick up the kids or go back to work and start all over the next week.
The progress is very fragmented, and that's when you have a good marriage counselor. God forbid you don't. So for my h and I, we found weekend workshops to be much faster and more productive in terms of tools and implementing changes we wanted...and making new action plans for our marriage.)
Retrovaile is a long weekend retreat for marriages in crisis (and yours is in crisis). There are couples there on "team" and they tell you all their stories and their problems and how they worked thru them using tools they got at Retrovaille.
They'll give you some tools that you presently lack and it's pretty inspiring to hear their stories and tribulations, and yet seem them together now. No, You do NOT have to be Catholic or even Christian to attend (my h is not), but the word "God" is used there, so if that's a problem, ask them for another version for you to attend.
They have a very impressive success record, especially since MANY of the couples attending, were planning on a divorce when they first came. But 5 years later, 20 of the 25 couples are still together. If you can get her to go, you won't regret it.
As far as our sex life it was pretty bad for awhile passive aggressive attitudes. Her biggest problem was the condition of the house which the boys and I have been on top of.
What does "passive aggressive" mean in terms of your sex life and on whose part? Also, a lot of women find laundry on the floor to be a turn off, especially if they know THEY are going to be the ones who end up dealing with it...it's not a mood enhancer.
If you feel that you and the boys are going to be on top of it from now on, I guess it's "all fixed" but what about hiring a housecleaner a few times a month?
I am asking b/c I'm not sure how long you will keep this up. I assume she mentioned it many times before but only when she wanted out of the house, did you bother to make the changes.
She may feel "too little too late" and is trying to feel "in love" again. That is when a little mystery on your end could help. Be confident and attractive and get those tools so you know a lot more about how SHE Is feeling. NO more guessing.
And do get the Five Love Languges book. And read Db or DR again b/c they are really helpful to know and take in. Many people here skim parts of it and glom on only to the "easy" parts where things get magically better really fast.
In truth this is a marathon, not a sprint. If you think a wife and mother of 4 would move out of her house even part time, lightly, you'd be mistaken. Something very deep is troubling her. Don't worry about the weird lies; they make sense to me. She wants people to see her as less confused than she is, and probably needs that.
Don't confront her in front of others if you feel the need to ask, then do it in private and come from a place of "how can I support you" rather than judgement.
Do you understand what I'm suggesting?
I think there are lots of positives in your situation but it's a fragile situation and you could blow it. Ease up and do some digging deep and bravely and own what you should own.
Also are there any financial problems you could help with by going back to work or working part time at least? Could you switch places with her and offer her the chance to be a Sahm?
I think the more she feels she has a choice in things, the less trapped she'll feel. That feeling of choice and freedom definitely eases the underlying stress in our lives.
Food for thought.
Last edited by 25yearsmlc; 07/18/1405:16 AM.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
I went back to work last year from Christmas until earlier this year. She asked me to stop working because between the job and the kids I was never home and the money I made just went to after school care. She gets overwhelmed when dealing with the boys. She doesn't drive so it's just me when it comes to the kids and her. I know a large part of the problems arouse out of poor communication between the two of us. When she wanted to take the kids to the parks he felt she couldn't because I didn't want to but the reason would be the kids didn't want to go and I was exhausted. I am working with her to communicate better and I do ask for clarification but try not to put pressure on her and let her go at her own pace. We had become a splintered family and that is what I am trying to repair now. I know it's going to take forever but she is worth it.
I would love to go to some type of therapy with her but she doesn't want to talk to anyone
So she met me and the kids at a big art festival she likes to go to every year. We had fun but then the kids started to be kids. Their behavior wasn't really bad but she started to get irritated by them and the noise so we left. She said that she was tired and just wanted to go home and sleep. It's still too early for her to try to discuss our R and I agree with you she is just confused to what it is she wants.
So she met me and the kids at a big art festival she likes to go to every year. We had fun but then the kids started to be kids. Their behavior wasn't really bad but she started to get irritated by them and the noise so we left. She said that she was tired and just wanted to go home and sleep. It's still too early for her to try to discuss our R and I agree with you she is just confused to what it is she wants.
To me, she sounds clinically depressed. Before dismissing therapy or a workshop, b/c "she doesn't want to talk" inform her that at least at Retrovaille, she need say nothing in public.. It's not a touchy feely share all your emotions with strangers type of retreat. it's more contemplative and helpful and structured.
Plus it provides tools you need to work on your m better. I think you are glossing over things about "how she's confused". I mean she is deeply troubled and unhappy.
You need an engine overhaul, not a tune up. That begins with the diagnostic tests to know what to work on, so I would encourage you to explore pro marriage marriage counseling or Retrovaille (b/c that is very pro marriage, and some counselors are more like 'amicable divorce counselors" than marriage counselors).
Don't give up on the professional help so fast. I know it's risky b/c some of them rehash the past and enable people to leave their families, but if you don't get any professional help, I can't see this working for long.
I am concerned that you're sweeping the problems under the carpet by "cleaning the house", plus, she's very ripe for an affair, or a full blown MLC. Why doesn't she drive btw? Do you live in NYC? I wonder if her getting a driver's license would help her feelings of being trapped. I am serious. It's amazing b/c I had surgery in November on my right leg (driving leg) and hip and could not drive for 3 months. I got depressed even though I had drivers around
But I was trapped and at other people's mercy. Just a thought...and yes a very small "bandaid" for you to ponder.
What do you think SHE would say if she were asked to comment on your flaws, and if she didn't think you'd hear or argue with her?
I know this ^^is mind reading but I want to know what your best guess is AND what it is based on...
Ideas?
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
I wan to go to therapy any kind to get her to talk to anyone about me her or the kids she will not go. I also agree that I think she is depressed but I can't make her do anything. At this point I am just trying to get her to the point where she is willing to talk. She doesn't drive because she just does not like to she has a license that was one of the problems I had with taking the kids to places with no help. Also the cleaning of the house was one of the things she had a problem with, I am very slowly learning of other problems that she had. I have made it a point of including her in a lot of decisions in the house, even if I get an I don't know I involve her more in the day to day running of the house. I know that she is deeply troubled and unhappy and I understand she needs help but she is intractable when it comes to talking to anyone about this. I told her that she didn't even have to talk about us but to talk about her and the kids.
As for my flaws the more she withdrew from the family the more responsibility I had to take. So she would say that I am controlling and dismissive of her feelings and opinions. I have raised 3 of our 4 boys as a stay at home dad and we talk a lot about their likes and dislikes. The boys will tell me things that they don't want to tell their mother. So when she asks me if they would like to do what she wants to do I would say probably not but you should ask them. She never does and thinks I am discounting her needs with the kids. So one of the changes I have started is when she asks what they want to do I say I don't know let's ask them.
I also got into the habit of telling lies just to avoid an argument. It was a juvenile way of handling our R but I did it. So I told her that I am going to be as honest with her as possible to earn back her trust. She said that she believes me and I am working very hard not to even have any statements I make be misunderstood or construed incorrectly. I more than understand my faults and what I did to lead my wife to these actions. I also understand it's going to take a long time for us to work through this. Right now I am just working for her to trust me enough to just tell me what is going on inside of her and to integrate her back into the family.
Had another good day with the W , we went on a tour of a brewery and had fun. Then we went to several different places . Now we are at home and talking and having fun. w has to go on a business trip for the week tomorrow but she wanted to know what we were going to do when she got back. That is a definite improvement. She smiled and laughed and was a positive experience today. Still can not talk about her feelings but she is talking a lot more.
deal with it slowly and one day at a time. let the good times keep coming for a while. once your relationship is strong enough, then you can start working on some of the negatives.
Me: 42 W: 32 Married 7 years together 8.5 S1: 7 S2:7 Bomb #1: 09-16-13 Recon #1: 11/13 A discovered 04-03-2014 W filed D 05-19-14 but never served me I filed D 12-02-2014 S 05-31-14 Divorced 5-19-16
Thanks I tried to go to sleep it had been such a great day. I feel as though we are working through this. She knows how I feel and she keeps making time for us to be together. I know this is going to take time but it's hard not talking about anything that matters with her. I should just be happy with any and all progress it's just hard not being able to talk and touch my W like I could two months ago.
Thanks I tried to go to sleep it had been such a great day. I feel as though we are working through this. She knows how I feel and she keeps making time for us to be together. IF so, then keep doing what you are doing and NOT pushing for more. Unless you mean digging deep within yourself, which I don't hear that much of...can you elaborate on what YOU believe you must work on, specifically?
I know this is going to take time but it's hard not talking about anything that matters with her. Time together without conflict, is a great gift. Enjoy it and build on it.
Let her learn to feel relaxed around you. - To enjoy your company and not feel as if she must give you something. Let her just BE for now.
I should just be happy with any and all progress it's just hard not being able to talk and touch my W like I could two months ago.
Yes you should be happy with any and all progress. Most people here would be.
She's not ready to talk. That means one thing, & one thing only-- you have to STFU.
Sorry, but it's true. The ability to NOT always ask of someone (which is you making a demand of her) is mandatory. In a way, it seems like a really small thing she is "asking" for, which is just peace and to be left alone.
What are her love languages? Have you read the 5 LL"s? I can't recall if you discussed it here or if it was another thread. But it's very important to realize how empty her love bank was/is and how you can better fill it.
Though she sounds very depressed -- she also sounds as if she's perking up a bit, SO back off and let her keep opening up.
Also, the reference to her "lies" seems a bit too much to me. Her lies seem innocuous. Why must you press her on them?
If I read them correctly, it's not like she's covering up anything but her sadness and inertia, right? She wants to look okay In "public"--- she wants to seem more functional than she has been lately.
So what good would it do to point out that she has not been so functional?
Seems to me that pointing it out would be humiliating for her, and shame inducing. Why would you want to do that?
Also, For the record (not saying You are doing this...) guilt and shame never bring a spouse home permanently.
I mean, I have never seen it.
I HAVE seen guilt get converted into blaming the source of the guilt, like a betrayed spouse who keeps throwing an affair into the face of the adulterer, does NOT get to keep doing it for long. The wayward spouse will begin to feel as if they were justified to cheat b/c their spouse is so unkind to them, so judgmental, so unforgiving and angry, etc. They will blame the spouse they cheated on.
I see that a lot. Plus, most people can only handle feeling guilt or shame for so long.
sure I like to think a conscience motivates one to change, and ideally that is true. But when another person SHOVES the cause of guilt in their faces, it backfires.
I'm just saying, pick your battles wisely, and decide how important this really is. And be ready for blowback that could push you backwards in your progress, a lot more than you expect.
I hope you will look in your area for Retrovaille, as I believe you'd get a LOT out of it.
Also I'm convinced that without some new tools and deeper analysis, you'll be here again in awhile, b/c I don't believe keeping on top of a clean house is the main problem.
GOOD LUCK!!
Last edited by 25yearsmlc; 07/20/1410:44 PM.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
I was just reading some of your thread. It looks promising. 25 was asking if you read 5LL if not do it!!
I have and it has really given me some perspective and hope for the future.
Hang in there!!
25 could you take a look at my thread and maybe share some more of your wisdom?
Me 47/W 34 T 16 M 13 No kids BD 6/2013 W asked that I move out 6/2013 I moved back and W is upset with this 12/2013 separate beds not much talking Served D Complaint 5/2014 W moved out 9/27/2014
I have it and am going to read it tonight. 25 I have not said anything to her about the lies, it is just bothering me. I am trying to help her and give her space this was a really good weekend for us and that's what I'm trying to do. Not push her and to see what she needs and wants. My problem is that she will go and do anything I suggest but I don't know if I am helping her. I just try to make each day better then the next. She is going to be in London this week so we will have some distance and space. She emailed me when she landed and said she will call once she is settled in the hotel. I know I have to be patient it's just hard trying to understand this woman who I have been with longer than I haven't. I know she is giving me and our family a chance I am just very scared I am going to blow it.
I also and a daily basis think about the things that I have done wrong in our M. All the petty things that I did or caused believe me there is plenty of self reflection going on here.
Started to read the 5ll and I think to fill her love tank is definitely acts of service,and acts of gifts. I think that's what I have been doing. From making sure she has fresh flowers in the room when she comes home to making sure that the house is clean and trying to incorporate her back into the family. I am seeing small changes day by day.
I have it and am going to read it tonight. 25 I have not said anything to her about the lies, it is just bothering me. I am trying to help her and give her space this was a really good weekend for us and that's what I'm trying to do. Not push her and to see what she needs and wants. My problem is that she will go and do anything I suggest but I don't know if I am helping her.
I THINK You said you thought she wanted to be included more in decision making, correct? And if all the fun things are done while she's at work, maybe delay some so she's not given the cold shoulder when she wants to take the kids to the park, for instance.
You could ask her for her input more. And then you don't have to keep guessing if she wants/needs what you are putting out there. That would talking about something important without specifically making it R talk; just ask her for how she feels about THAT day's plans. Make sense?
I just try to make each day better then the next. ^^ a tall order if taken literally. Let her go at her own pace. You know you've made mistakes, and she's not nagging you to work on them. I get the feeling that she has been feeling undue pressure by being the sole breadwinner, especially b/c it's without much of an outlet or time for her to GAL. Just a guess but a strong one based on things you say she has said.
She is going to be in London this week so we will have some distance and space. She emailed me when she landed and said she will call once she is settled in the hotel.
I know I have to be patient it's just hard trying to understand this woman A tough lesson I learned is that I had to accept things my h had done, which I do not understand. I still cannot understand his choice to live, alone, in Alaska. But he did that. Then he came back. I accept that it happened and that I do not understand it. So, it's possible you may have to do the same.
Of course, knowing what YOU can do to best support her and express your love for her, is key. You have to understand her, to a point, to do that. And that will require some communications. But don't assume you can or will or must understand her fully.
Plus, we all change and evolve anyhow. What is true for us today, may not be tomorrow. It's an ebb and a flow kind of thing; much like marriage can be.
who I have been with longer than I haven't. I know she is giving me and our family a chance I am just very scared I am going to blow it.
If you are afraid you are going to blow it, tell me HOW that might happen.
Detail your fears here. See if we can help you avoid some of the pratfalls you fear.
And keep this simple. You do what works or at least does not hurt anything. And you do NOT do what has harmed the R in the past; including pressing her for information.
I also think white lies or lies that don't matter and that she says b/c she doesn't want the world to know how dysfunctional she was being for awhile, is not something you ought to press.
I'd leave that alone, big time. Ask yourself why you are so insistent on getting her to admit it. Do you think you might have the need to over talk things and or, to "win" arguments?
I'm being sincere. It's just that you keep saying you "know you shouldn't care BUT" and then you repeat that it bothers you. As if bothering you means that you must DO something. A lot of things can bother you that you can still leave alone.
Maybe That's part of the patience trait you want to work on, yes?
Sometimes the most loving to say, is nothing.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
I think the lies bother me because she excludes me and the time we spend together. I know it's pride on my part but it makes the separation and the exclusion from her life fresh each time. I also realize that I should just ignore that and look at her actions. By Sandi's rules even if I don't believe what she is saying and half of what I see the half I see is that she wants to be at home as a family and she wants to spend time with me. Her actions are also different, for example when I went to the grocery store she never use to come. I asked her the other day if she wanted to go with me and she said sure. I'm trying to understand her needs
Tried some of the advice in the 5ll after she sent me an email. The first email I told her that the boys and I appreciate all her hard work for us. She responded by saying she didn't thank me enough for all that I' did for them. I than went into a longer email telling her how I felt about her. Nothing negative and nothing to put pressure on her. She didn't respond to that one but called to just say hi and that she would call me later after she was done her work. She didn't ask to speak to the kids which she does, so maybe it worked a little.
So she facetimed me instead of calling and she asked to speak with the kids. She spoke with them about their day and told them goodbye. She then talked to for about ten minutes until I told her to go to sleep I could see that she was tired. I feel very positive about the improvements in our communication.
I have a lot of anxiety going on right now. If I'm doing the right things to help her come back home. She said that she was worried about my expectations, which I told her I have none. I told her that I'm only hoping for the best and she told me thank you. What does this mean if anything. I want her to come home but what does she think my expectations are. I was too afraid to ask.
So she called me twice today to see how the boys and I were doing. When I told her goodbye she told me she loved me. Earlier I had made a mistake and told her that I missed her and she said she would be home soon. I'm hoping things are better in her mind but I don't know.
I don't know if it's because I have not seen her in awhile or that our conversations are short but I am feeling down. Went out with some friends and had fun but then I came home. I hate going to bed it seems so empty.
She had issues with the condition of the house was a big thing for her. She also had a problem with how much time she spent with the kids doing things she wanted to do. With keepingt the house up that's almost a full time job with four boys and a dog. I have also started to make time for the boys to do stuff with therir mother. My goals are to keep this up so she can see the changes and not discount her opinion.
Sandi one more question. In my stitch my wife was close to a mental breakdown and she had separated herself from the family slowly. She felt alone and probably thought she had no choice but to leave me and our 4 kids. She says that she doesn't want to date anyone just be alone but she spends 4 days a week at home. She doesn't ask for anything but changes have been made. We go out once and sometimes twice a week. Is this ok or am I chasing and pursuing?
Here's some of my thoughts based on what you've posted. Your W is depressed and suffering burn-out. I mean suffering! I've been there. It is horrible! It is not a condition one can snap out of. Is she taking any medication?
I see how many things tie in together. I see how she needs a sense or "order" in her life, I can only imagine how 5 males under the same roof could disrupt her world of order. The women in my family were fanatic housekeepers. If their homes were not perfectly in order, they would become very difficult to live with! I do not go to the extent they did, but it works on my nerves when things are badly topsy-turvy b/c my home is a reflection on me. If my home is disorderly, I feel my life is out of order when i come in and see it. It simply affects me that way, and i can get quite b'tchy about it when it's my H's mess i see everywhere. I wonder if this has played a part in your W's feelings.
There are too many sports activities. I have seen couples with just one child become slaves to sport activities. It consumes their lives. The couple has no quality private time between them, b/c there is no time available. When you multiply this times four.....what does it equal?
She is away working all day. She comes home to what is suppose to be her safe place and to relax.....but instead she sees what looks like tornado alley (in her opinion). She feels overwhelmed at the work left undone. Then her family is running in different directions to the next "event". She sees her H giving his time, energy, and attention to the kids, which is fine.....but when does she get her part? Her emotional needs have not been met for years and the emotional connection and meaningful communication is almost nonexistent between her and H. She begins to wonder if she even fits into this family any longer. They seem to not need her or have time for her. Even the boys turn to their dad for everything, and she feels left out of their lives. She begins to feel disvalued, unwanted, unneeded, and unloved. Her world is out of order and her feelings are confused. She needs to escape to have peace and order b/c she can't deal with it any longer.
The only way she sees getting order is to get her a place to stay that does not include those who cause the disorder in her life. She still loves and wants them in her life, but she is so totally burned out that she can't cope. At least in her own space, she can keep things from getting messy. So in the meantime, she splits her time with the family and staying by herself. She needs the time and space alone to get a sense of stability and control of her own self. You said she almost had a mental breakdown. Was anything done for her? It is very scary to feel yourself losing control and slipping over the edge.
So, yes I can see why she has made this move. At this point in your postings, I am not seeing the typical wayward wife symptoms. You have seen no signs of another man. I don't see a rebellion here. I see a woman who is trying to save herself the only way she knows how. I don't know that she sees it as removing herself from her kids and H's lives......as much as her feeling they removed her. Her survival instincts is about all she has to keep her going right now.
I do see positive reactions from your times spent together. If you are relating it correctly and she's not just trying to be "nice". But being nice is not bad. It's a good starting point. These times you spend the day out going somewhere, are the boys along too? I think the two of you need to go and do fun things together. Nothing serious at this point. Just time together having fun, and letting her have a glimpse of the man she feel in love with years ago. Can you be that guy again? Not romantically.......at this point, but being the man you were. Oh, and do not get that male attitude about her in bed. Just forget about any moves in that area, and don't be trying to sneak in touches while in bed. The M was near sexually starved before she moved, and that is usually due to EN or PN not being fulfilled. But another subject for later. I just know many men see having sex as their triumph. As though they have conquered her again. This is not the challenge here. And, if physical touch is not her LL, be careful cause you are Not stealing those touches during the daytimes with her. She may tolerate a little, but don't push your luck, or think it's building up to try it in bed. She's not there!
The main goal is to not apply emotional pressure. Every LBH'S post I read in newcomers, the guy applies pressure.....and doesn't even realize it. It's part of his pirsuing nature, I suppose. You may see your objective as getting her back home. But that will cause you to press her. Pressing her will cause bad results. Let your objective be to establish a new relationship. As long as there is no OM involved and she is not rebellious, you should never consider going dark or some of the more extreme methods. Every stitch is different.
Please read Divorce Remedy ASAP, or you will just get tidbits here on the board and not apply the correct response to your stitch. The advice given to another poster may not work in your stitch.
My heart goes out to all of you. Remember, this is painful for her too. You may see the problem being easily resolved, but she can't. Your patience and stability in your changes will tried like never before. Look through all the problems and see if love is still there. If so, you can make it.
Show her your manly, inner strength and confidence. Let her take part in decisions regarding her children. And, you make sure those boys show upmost respect for their mother at all times. Lead your family with honor and integrity. These are qualities that all women admire. Don't lose sight of who you are and what you stand for. Your boys are watching. You are teaching them how to deal with their own future relationships with women.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
This was my thinking also. So I am making sure that home is more pleasant for her as well as clean. I have been on top of everything and made it as relaxing as I can. I keep fresh flowers in the room for her, and I try to go the extra mile. I act as gentlemanly as possible opening doors and try to let her see how much she means to me. We do go out alone a lot now and I try to find interesting things I think she would like. I don't push and always ask for her opinion when feasible. I still get a lot of I don't knows but she is slowly making suggestions. If I don't agree with something I make sure to talk it thorough so we can at least see each other's point of view. I know the romance will come later and I am still trying to come to terms with that but I count myself as lucky. She wants to be here I just have to help her see that she is needed.
As far as any medication she refuses to see or talk with anyone, belie me I have tried. I have tried to get her to talk about her problems with me, the kids, herself all with a resounding no so I am not pushing this.
W came home from her business trip and has not stopped talking yet. She seems very happy to be home. We are going to the gym together and she wants to do some shopping. We still are not talking about M but we are talking like we use to. She is talking a lot to the point where even if I leave the room she yells out things from the room. It's a rainy day here so we are going to play some games later with the kids.
I don't know what to do. I let her know if she needs to talk that I am here, I don't push. When she seems to get frustrated about something I work through it with her, I don't let her give up and tell her to take her time and we can work through the problem. This seems to be helping with issues with the kids. The house was clean and she seemed happy.
So W and I went to the gym this morning and worked out together. We then went to the mall and got there before the stores opened so she said let's go to Starbucks for coffee. We sat and talked while we drank coffee. Then she went to a few stores and brought some clothes. We left the mall and she suggested a place to eat. We had lunch and talked some more. We then went home and picked the kids up and took them to the pool. We sat next to each other and talked some more. We got home and I fixed dinner for the family and came upstairs and she suggested we order a movie. We have been talking to each other much more she leaves tomorrow after dinner and will be back Friday. I want to tell her not to go but I know that will not help. I miss her very much.
Talked with my mother and she was very helpful this morning. She told me to be patient and look around at what I see. Your wife takes a overnight bag to where she is staying but leaves all her things here. She still calls this place home and is here most of the time.
So she is packing to leave for her place and I am trying to not appear sad. I know I can't ask her to leave but it really hurts. She is talking to me the entire time she is packing and I keep up appearances but I want to ask her to stay. I have no clue what is going on she asked if I was going to the gym Wednesday and I told her no I have CrossFit in the morning so probably not. I just have to stay positive and keep things up until she is ready to talk. She wanted to know what we are doing this weekend and i asked if she wanted to go to a ball game which she loves. No expectations!
Gotan, I'm at a similar juncture in my sitch. I'm determined to turn this pain and confusion into progress and change.
Don't ask her to stay. She needs this from you as hard as it is. It seems contrary to everything you believe but this time she is away is good for you. Use it! Don't waste this pain. You are rocking things right now, just back off from showing her she's needed. Show her your changes by letting them radiate from within you. Don't talk R. Let her make that move. Keep working out and cross fit is a great way to get this stress out! PR in something tomorrow! You got this!
I find that being patient is turning out to be the hardest part of this journey. The self exploration, the work? Bring it! It's about time I did this kind of introspective work for me let alone for my relationships but patience? Man, that's a toughie! I'm trying to do a 180 on myself and look at this time as opportunity for more change, more time to make my emotional case to myself.
Thanks for the input, I didn't ask her to stay but drove her to her palace with an upbeat attitude. She was no talkative on the ride but I think she was just tired. I helped her take bags into her place and she said she would call and said thank you as I was walking out. She then said bye with a question inflection and I responded in same. Usually I would tell her that I love her but I have stopped saying it.
She called to say she would come over tomorrow because she left all her outfits here. She spent a hour ironing them and didn't carry anything to the car.
Just curious why did you feel the need to go over to her place and carry her stuff in for her?
Me 47/W 34 T 16 M 13 No kids BD 6/2013 W asked that I move out 6/2013 I moved back and W is upset with this 12/2013 separate beds not much talking Served D Complaint 5/2014 W moved out 9/27/2014
So W is here and she said that she was very exhausted and I responded sorry you should try to get some rest. I wanted to tell her when we got home to get in the bed but I didn't. She came home and told me to hang a painting that she brought because it didn't fit in my car. You have to understand that she was really happy about this painting and the frame and she wants me to hang it here not take it to her place. I fixed her something to eat and went to the living room and watched Tv and left her with the kids. I hope I did the right thing in giving her space on her off day. I spoke with my mother about this and she thinks that she left her clothes at home on purpose for a reason to come home, I hope so. So I am going to keep at it and try not to put any pressure on the W.
One of the things that degraded in our M is I stopped treating my W like a lady. So I open doors and carry her bags. It's one of the changes that I think she is noticing and also it is a small way to keep me out of the friend zone. It also shows a little respect and compassion she was sore from the gym and had trouble walking.
W has started to call right after I finish CrossFit in the morning. She knows that I usually stop for coffee or a snack with the people I work out with. She also wanted to know if I was going to the gym and I told her no.
Went to dinner with the W last night. We talked and she seemed a little distant. The resturant was recommended by a friend and the meal was bad. Told her I was sorry about the meal and she said it's not your fault we would of ended up going here one day now we can mark it off the list. She has been talking more about us doing things in the future I hope it's a good sign.
My W spent the night and was receiving a lot of text. So this morning I know I shouldn't have looked but it was worrying me about OM. When I went through her text a friend from work was talking about her talking with a married man. I increasingly became angrier about this as I kept reading I wondered when she had time to do anything with this guy. Her friend then told her to have a good time at the game tonight. I then thought wait we're going to the baseball game tonight. I then read through her text with him and all the things she did with this OM was things we did together. This is very strange.
Went out with the wife in a better mood because of there being no OM. Went climbing which she loved and then to lunch. Came home and went to the baseball game. Was able to touch her a few times today, which was an improvement. On the bad side the kids wreaked the house while we were gone and W was not happy. I am concrete about her lies to friends but happy she is spending time with me. One day at a time.
Looks like you have alot of nice positives Gotan... and I understand but try not to snoop, if she knew you went through her phone the set back would be tremendous, does you no good either way .. you can not do anything about a OM ... I know I have the same issue but its something we all must work with.
Talked to W about her conversation about S. She told me that he was angry with her. I told her I understand and said I would speak to him. We then talked a little about us and she said that she was still in shock. She also said she could see the changes I was making.
This morning I went to the gym with the W. On the way home we spoke about her conversation with son. I then asked if she would be willing to therapy. She said maybe to what end. I told her you know what I want and how I feel. I then then told her that my focus at this time was our M and hers was on the kids as it should be. I told her the boys and I are fine. The conversation was done reasonably well. I then brought up how she had cut of her feelings for me. She said that she could see why I would feel that way. She then stated that she did not do it on purpose but that it what happened. This was our first real conversation in a while and I think it was positive.
Just had a major blow up with my wife I told her that I was sick of this and she was moving back home. That she does not care about me through this whole process. I took a major step backwards told her I was leaving and she could deal with the kids.
^^^^ bad move. Try not to let your emotions dictate your actions. Right now you are upset, but in a short while you will see the error of this reaction.
Keep your focus and remember, it is a marathon. Nothing happens as fast as you want.
Me: 42 W: 32 Married 7 years together 8.5 S1: 7 S2:7 Bomb #1: 09-16-13 Recon #1: 11/13 A discovered 04-03-2014 W filed D 05-19-14 but never served me I filed D 12-02-2014 S 05-31-14 Divorced 5-19-16
I immediately apologized and let her know my feeling. She refuses to see what this is doing to the kids and it bothers me. All the anger at this situation just poured out.
Of course she refuses. She is in a fog. She is being very selfish. And she does not care what you think. All our WAS think this way. You should have already been prepared for this line of thinking. Which is why they say believe none of what you hear and only half of what you see.
This is also why detaching is so important. It allows you to avoid these types of emotional blow ups that set you back. Think about it.
Keep doing what DB says to do and you will find yourself in a much better place. Even if it is without your W.
Me: 42 W: 32 Married 7 years together 8.5 S1: 7 S2:7 Bomb #1: 09-16-13 Recon #1: 11/13 A discovered 04-03-2014 W filed D 05-19-14 but never served me I filed D 12-02-2014 S 05-31-14 Divorced 5-19-16
I understand. But that is why they warn LBS from reading too much into the actions of a WAS. She was being nice, relatively speaking, and you took it to mean more than it was. Then your expectations got crushed, and you got emotional and angry. Now she retreated. Does not mean you are done, it just means you have to work a little harder. She needs to see a person she would want to spend her life with, not be told you are that person. So think about what kind of guy she would want to be with and be that person.
Me: 42 W: 32 Married 7 years together 8.5 S1: 7 S2:7 Bomb #1: 09-16-13 Recon #1: 11/13 A discovered 04-03-2014 W filed D 05-19-14 but never served me I filed D 12-02-2014 S 05-31-14 Divorced 5-19-16
We talked about my outburst and she said she accepted my apology and then she started to cry. It's the first emotions I have seen out of her in a while.
Meet W at the gym and took her to Ikea. Asked her what she was feeling and she said she couldn't put it into words. Was able to get from her what her problem was and we talked a little. I explained that my outburst was not over anger at her but the situation. She said she understood and we talked quite a bit.
We are communicating a little better. W said that she was having a hard time putting her feelings into words. I am starting to get out of her the problems she is having. She also says that she cares about me that's why she spends so much time with me. Have to follow Sandi's advice and be very patient with her. I am not trying to put any pressure on her and I asked her to let me know if I was.
W called to wish me a happy birthday. Tried to sound happy and upbeat but I felt pretty bad. She said that we should do cake and gifts Saturday and I said that was fine. She then asked me to meet her at the gym later tonight. I am doing a lot of things without her but I really miss her and have no clue if what I am doing is working. She has not spoken to the kids since Monday and was in the neighborhood yesterday and did not come to see them.
Sandi W and I had an argument but at least talked to each other about it after. She said that she cares that's why she spends time with me. From what I see she does need time alone not to date just to be herself. We talk and she is still shopping for the house and wants to do a project in the powder room together. I got my copy of DR and I am reading it. I am afraid that with the start of football season this would be a setback. I coach one of our S team. I told the other coaches that I would not always be available. So I don't know if W is testing the waters but she knows tonight is practice and asked if I would go to the gym with her. She has a set schedule in her head about how much time she wants to spend with us and tries not to deviate from it. I'm trying my best to follow your rules except for going dark and making myself available. I am following your advice and she is letting me touch her again not romantically but she does not shy away from my touch. I am having a hard time today because while I do detach and am GAL her being so emotionless is causing some anxiety on my part.
25yearmic we have moved from no I don't want to talk to anyone to it depends on what you want to get out of counseling. I told her that I have not changed what I told her from day one that I want our family whole and to be stronger and we needed help. She still seemed hesitant almost afraid and I saw concern in her eyes so I backed off. I will ask again in a month while I keep showing her the changes that I am making.
25yearmic we have moved from no I don't want to talk to anyone to it depends on what you want to get out of counseling. I told her that I have not changed what I told her from day one that line^^ struck me as NOT very desirable. It's you sort of stressing "I have NOT changed"... and I wonder if that is something you ought to be saying at the moment...Do you see why I say that?
that I want our family whole and to be stronger and we needed help. She still seemed hesitant almost afraid and I saw concern in her eyes so I backed off.
Well She feels pressured, clearly. Back off.
I will ask again in a month while I keep showing her the changes that I am making.
Goal #1 is changing you, and #2 is doing those changes in an open overt way....
& FAR DOWN the list is your desire for counseling - b/c it's clearly something she sees as you manipulating her, again, or trying to control the outcome of this....again
and b/c it is a rare person who gets much out of C, when they do NOT want to go. Usually it cements their reasons for wanting to leave, more than anything else.
Do not pressure a reluctant spouse to go to MC. Bad idea.
I hope you can get help BUT without it coming off as pressure to change HER. Which is the impression I'm getting.
Make sense?
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
I see what you are saying, she does tell me she sees the changes that I have made and that I am trying very hard. She has also been telling me what problems she has when I ask. I let her know that I am not trying to fix the problems but help her work through them. I took you advice and have been listening to her and she seems to be happier. I still have problems with her contradictions between actions and statements.
I also asked her if she felt like I was smothering her and she said no. I also asked if she wanted me to continue making plans for us on the weekends and she said yes she enjoys going out with me. I have also let her know how much I appreciate her and the time she spends with me.
We started climbing this past weekend and she loves it. I asked if she wanted to do this together because you need two people to climb. She said yes so it's an activity we can do together .
Son 14 talked with W. He told her how he felt and why he was mad at her. She responded things just happen. How do I deal with this?
Not yours to deal with. Be glad she didn't blast you b/c although she seems very depressed, in her heart/mind she does blame you for neglect and casting her needs aside, and never asking HER of preferences or input for decisions.
She's the main bread winner, which means there is pressure for her to perform AND keep the money coming in, and she has been in that position for some time. She feels she is working to put food on the table AND is the nurturing parent for the others, the intimacy needs were NOT met by a long shot, and she's very unhappy --has been for awhile. She sounds Depressed to me.
If she really won't get help, so be it. SHE is the one who is miserably sad. Stay in your sandbox and become the man you wanted to become, for her, for the m and for Yourself.
I think she will, but I'm not sure when.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
Just had a major blow up with my wife I told her that I was sick of this and she was moving back home. That she does not care about me through this whole process. I took a major step backwards told her I was leaving and she could deal with the kids.
Wow, that's a major backslide for you. SHE MAY NOT CARE ABOUT YOU right now.
She's clinically depressed and wants to flee. Blowing up at her is so NOT a good idea. I don't get your reaction to all this.
You WERE all about fixing things and working on YOU and showing her how you care, etc.
You WERE admitting she was pulling a lot of the heavy stuff...if she wants to check out of the family b/c she is "emotionally burnt out" (Like she told you) why choose now for YOU to "lose it"?
B U M M E R
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
Of course she refuses. She is in a fog. She is being very selfish.
Pilot did you read THEIR marital history? Her needs have not been met by a long shot for a long time. This was recognized by him before but has been "forgotten" b/c of hurt feelings in the h.
IF she is clinically depressed, which I suspect, I would not call it "selfish". But regardless, HE is supposedly working on HIMSELF and in a very short time -- wants to quit b/c the pay off isn't certain.
That's how I (mostly) see it.
And she does not care what you think. All our WAS think this way. I am very uncomfortable with such sweeping generalizations like this, applied to "ALL" people and ALL couples. Frankly, I don't believe it anyhow.
Too simplistic...not at all a customized approach for a specific couple.
Just my .02
You should have already been prepared for this line of thinking. Which is why they say believe none of what you hear and only half of what you see.
This is also why detaching is so important. It allows you to avoid these types of emotional blow ups that set you back. Think about it.
Keep doing what DB says to do and you will find yourself in a much better place. Even if it is without your W.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
I take my kids very seriously she has not been there for them and meet their needs since shortly after the second S was born. Her treatment towards their emotions built up? I do everything for them.
I take my kids very seriously she has not been there for them and meet their needs since shortly after the second S was born. Her treatment towards their emotions built up? I do everything for them.
I know. She felt shut out. Remember? She's one of the few women around here who is willing to leave ALL of her family, not just the marriage. That tells me she is damn lonely and alienated and SAD.
(OR she's a sociopath. Which do you think applies the most?)
I'm glad she has noticed your changes as much as you say. It means some of what you are doing IS working.
Of course, that does tend to support your need to make those changes, correct? And you were not the WAS; she was. It's HER needs Not being filled, that got you here, correct?
Okay....okay? I may seem super harsh right now and if so, I apologize. I just want to remind you of your words when you were FIRST here, so you don't lose sight of what is working and how you got here.
Make sense?
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
It does and I appreciate the advice. I am trying as hard as I can to meet her needs. We just went to the gym and had dinner. We talked and enjoyed each others company and she gave me my birthday presents. I just have to remind myself several times a day that this is going to be a long process. We also made plans for the weekend and she is coming home early to stay with the kids while I go to a football game tomorrow. She is starting to make herself available to watch the kids. I am learning to let her help.
Wife came home a day early to watch the kids while I went to a football game. We emailed each other a couple of times during the game. She didn't responded to one email in which I asked how she was doing and another where I asked if she was happy some shoes fit. Just have to take this day by day.
So sports have begun for the kids again I couldn't go to the gym with W. Starting reading my copy of DB. Going to pick her up after I take her suggestions as far as picking up the kids. Trying to stay strong very anxious still know it's too early for M talk just work on R and things should be ok. Maybe go to a movie tonight.
In DB chapter 4 changing your behavior, I think I am doing this but I have no clue if it is working. My W seems to be a little sad and hard to reach. I try to engage her in conversation but only get ok and I understand.
Took two of our four kids to the park today with W. When we were about to leave she said that she was going to re-watch a TV series that she liked. I said oh then I will stay at home and you can have fun with the kids. She then wanted to know why I was staying home. I told her that she could have some time with the kids and if she was going to watch a TV then we could not ralk. She said oh and left her headphones at home. She has seemed a little depressed and irritable. I think she is starting to see what she has done to her family. The kids also did not want to go to the pool with her and that also made her a little sad. One of the things she said that she wanted to do is do the things she wanted to do with the kids. What she never really understand is the kids didn't want to do the things she wanted to do. She has yet to come up with a new activity for them to do.
My mom called and talked to me. She said she talked to my wife and she said she still loved me and enjoyed spending time with me. She also told her that the earliest she could see moving back home was the second week in the new school year. That would be September , she also said that something's have to change.she called and wanted to know our plans for the weekend. She travels for work so she stayed at home went to Philly and will come back home and leave for London. So we as a family are going to an Art Festival Friday and her and I are going on a brewery tour. When I Tolbert about the tour she said she was happy to go. What kind of separation is the kind where she is only gone two to three days and she does nothing while gone.is she playing some kind of game?
Sorry to go so far back but who ^^^said what here???
Is your MOM saying "Somethings have to change" or your wife or both? And is your mom coming to live with you again?
and how does your wife feel about THAT?
What, if anything, will be done to address your mom living with you?
Do you ever think your wife might feel less alienated from family, and more like "the woman of the house" if your mom stepped back more?
Or anything along any NEW lines?
In other words, can you change some of the dynamic at all?
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
Took two of our four kids to the park today with W. When we were about to leave she said that she was going to re-watch a TV series that she liked. I said oh then I will stay at home and you can have fun with the kids. She then wanted to know why I was staying home. Seemed to me she wanted some alone time. Do you see something else in her request?
Or were you simply offering her an alternative to what she just said she intended to do? I told her that she could have some time with the kids and if she was going to watch a TV then we could not ralk. She said oh and left her headphones at home. She has seemed a little depressed and irritable. Is it possible she felt controlled by you here? Seems as if You basically told her she was not "allowed" to watch her shows, b/c "then you could not talk".
Had she asked to talk to you?
I think she is starting to see what she has done to her family. In general, you mean?
The kids also did not want to go to the pool with her and that also made her a little sad. One of the things she said that she wanted to do is do the things she wanted to do with the kids. ^^^which are what?
And have you backed off enough to let her take the lead and initiate with them? And how is she doing with a counselor?
What she never really understand is the kids didn't want to do the things she wanted to do. She has yet to come up with a new activity for them to do.
Can you privately help her with the kids activities? OR ask the kids for their ideas.
So you know, I DO see a lot of positives in your recent interactions. Some of what you are doing IS working.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
Sorry for the misunderstanding, No my W wanted to go to the pool with the kids. One of the kids didn't want to go and the other didn't want to go alone. They then said they would like to go to the park. While we were getting ready to leave my W said that she was going to rewatch a tv show that she had seen at the park on her iPad. I said oh then you don't need me to go I will stay home and you can have fun with the kids.
I was not trying to stop her I thought she just wanted to be with the kids alone, she said she didn't I don't even think she considered that I wanted to talk with her.
After the park we went to a few places she wanted to go and then had the lunch she suggested. We then went out to the mall and then we went and saw a movie. She laughed and enjoyed the movie and then we came home. I would call today a positive day, we were able to resolve a misunderstanding without assuming what the other was thinking.
Should I confront OM and let him know what's going on or leave it alone. We are making progress and they are not having a pa but I don't think OM wants to cause problems for my family.
C'mon Gotan, you know better. Stop trying to control your W, and the OM. What do you think might come out of your confronting the OM? And how do you think your W will react?
Is there anything positive that could possibly come out of this? Accept that your life is no longer fully within in your control. Keep working on yourself, and detach.
One the other male is also know to me. Two I am not trying to control my W I think he should know what's going on. I have given up all control in this situation and let my wife dictate what's going to happen and the pace.
