So I received the book yesterday in the mail and immediately dove head first to try to get everything I could from it.
I wrote down my Short term goals:
Have the W willingly text me and communicate with me..
I further broke that down:
Open lines of communication that do not involve our marriage. Allow her to freely express herself and simply LISTEN Be sure not to fire back questions about our R problems
2. Have the W call me and want to talk to me about her day
Once again I cannot smother her, or beg bribe or anything else to push her away Keep the conversation calm, and know that I do not have to act the same way I am feeling Allow her to express herself, and allow her to lead the conversation in the direction she wants.
3. Work up to a point where we can go on a date
This I believe is going to take some time I know that she is nervous about confrontation and considering how mad she has been i don't want to add fuel to that fire. Things need to be calm, and easy once again I cannot smother her.
The worst part and the best part about this book was my "ah-ha" moment.
I realize the problem all along...
She always said, "This all goes back to the same problem; YOU DON'T LISTEN TO ME"
And ironically enough, even though I heard her tell me I wasn't listening, i actually WASN'T!!!
Even though I heard everything my W was telling me I realize now that I wasn't actually listening.
I always had issues with her being intimate, and when I think back she always said that it is hard to be intimate when at times I am such an emotional roller coaster. And in fact I responded that my emotional roll coaster was because of her, always seeming like i was waking up next to a person with diff attitudes (can you imagine how that went?) I heard what she was saying all along but I didn't listen enough to put the pieces together.
My W and I have been separated almost a week now and while she is much less angry there still hasn't been much communication other than talk about the animals and simple chores.
She says please and thank you and says she appreciates the small things I do which I suppose is a good sign.
Which leads me to my next problem.
I truly did fail to recognize our small steps forward, I always wanted everything, and I wanted it now.
I didn't understand why she was still mad, why she didn't want to make love, I DIDN'T LISTEN.
Common Theme?
Anyhow, I am just trying to figure out how to start all of this, but as the book reads, I just have to sit and wait.
Since we aren't living together I have to do some changes and work on myself, and prove to her that I can be the man she wanted, the man she married.
I am just confused and worried that she will never call, never open up lines of communication, never give me a chance =/.
Thanks for reading, and as always thanks for all the support
Cadet is right - you'll get a lot more traffic if you move this over.
I don't hang out on the board much, but when I do, it's usually down in Surviving. But for some reason this one caught my eye.
You might want to rethink your goals, because those are goals you set for your W. I can promise you that whenever you attempt to control the process and outcome by projecting your wants on to your W, it's going to end badly.
But it's not very helpful to you if I come here to point this out and then walk away, is it? I was actually pretty good at this stuff, so I'll share some ideas with you. Yeah, I've been D for a long time now, but I am one of the lucky people who DB'd my a$$ off and wound up with a truly wonderful parenting relationship with my XH. He was my friend before we dated, and we're back to being friends. I give this process a lot of credit in helping me focus on the small successes.
I can guess why your W said some of the stuff she's said. I also get that you're a little panicky and not liking the loss of control. There is no magic bullet to get you back to where you want to be. The barn door opened, the animals have fled and there is NO returning to the place you were before. You can choose success regardless of the outcome.
That being said...
Short Term Goal #1 - Communicating with your W
Rather than you set the expectation that she change and do things your way, what happens when you communicate with her? Do your conversations tend to veer into forbidden territory? Do you focus on steering the conversation so that you either hear what you want to hear or avoid hearing what you don't?
I'd much rather have you reframe that goal into improving communications with your W. If you have the tendency to end your communications on a frustrated note (both you and her), I'd set THAT as a short term goal: End each conversation positively so that she doesn't feel she's living groundhog day with you every doggone time you talk or text.
I read loud and clear that she says you don't listen to her. So focus on doing that, and that alone. Do twice as much active listening as you do speaking. And if it's a serious discussion and the content bothers you? Rephrase what she said back to her. Show her you ARE listening. Got it?
Goals #2 and 3 are completely unreasonable and totally focused on what YOU want. I'm not saying that they aren't something you can hope for or shoot for in the long run. But you aren't going to cross the finish line if you can't learn how to participate in this race. It didn't deteriorate overnight, and it isn't going to magically improve overnight either.
Brannon, other than the communications what are the things that she has said that drove her away from you?
Listen, she may not give you a second chance. But the only way you're going to really get that shot is if you DO the work. She may have a hidden agenda. She may not. Her mind may be made up, but it may not be either.
What are you doing in the self care department? You don't want to be a spineless dolt and walk away with your masculinity between your legs, do ya? So definitely make sure you prioritize some fun and meaningful things for yourself.
And I'd love to read some better goals that focus on YOUR behaviors and thoughts.
In order to change the process, you have to change what's in your heart first. You have to change what you do and don't do, say and don't say.
One of the things that helped me the absolute most was keeping a solutions journal. That came from one of my sessions with Laurie, a DB coach (hopefully she's still there - she's awesome). I tracked our communications, took the temperature, jotted down anything noticeable and then used the journal to help drive my goals. It really helped me focus more on the behaviors that improved communications and helped me stop the ones that set us back. I got so good at it that I could see what buttons I pushed that set us back, and how long it would take to regain ground I lost as a result of my backslide. (Typically 2 weeks)
So just ask yourself if you continue to engage in those button pushing dances that get you nowhere, "Am I willing to give up 2 weeks of progress to do or say this?"
Personally, I'm not in the camp of becoming the person our spouse married. We all change with age. Hopefully, we grow. What is more useful is that she is open to the idea that you *can* change, you put your money where your mouth is, and she is open to entertaining the kind of man you could become. Of having the kind of marriage that sounds appealing instead of appalling. And in order to showcase those possibilities, you have to begin with YOU. Otherwise, she'll see this as an attempt to manipulate her into getting your way. Right now, she's not going to give you the benefit of the doubt, so just get to work.
And just so you know this, in case you haven't been willing to see it just yet, there is 100% certainty that she has behaviors that need to change too. You're not the total cause of this, Brannon. But until she has some sort of light bulb moment on her own, you're just going to have to carry on with a plan that takes care of your side of the street.
Does this make sense?
Good luck!
Betsey
"There are only 2 ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle."
What confuses me is why some say to "keep the lines of communication open" with the WAW...others say to ignore her. That's polar opposites and it's oonfusing. My STBXW is just about moved out. I am trying to avoid her and not be here when she's here so we can go days without seeing each other. Yesterday was the last time I wanted to see her for awhile as she is officially living at her parent's house. So I feel like now I let days go by without her seeing me or talking to me. We have no kids, our divorce is a no-fault, we have no assets...so it's a simple divorce. Even though some advice here is saying to leave the lines of communication open...I am not. I am staying in total NC for as long as I can.
ME: 43 W:44 M 13 years on 5-5-01 T 18 years BD 4/27/14 D papers served 5/5/14 (how appropriate a date) WAW moved out 5/12/14 Papers filed 6/27/14 Divorce granted 07/17/14 Our marriage ends 11/17/14
In my case I had to modify the communications a bit. Because my tendency before BD was not to be in touch all day, and he was more the check-in type, I quickly realized that in MY sitch going dim backfired. He assumed I was angry, hated him, and he avoided contacting me at all.
For us, it worked better when touched base occasionally about simple things, very upbeat, no pressure, low key and NO EXPECTATIONS.
Just "I'll be ready to clean stalls whenever you get here. See you then!" sort of thing. It never requires a response, nor anything about the R. Just like a neighbor who was dropping off a cup of sugar...
Other people have had more success with being more dark/dim.
It's all about monitoring and doing what works best for you.
Me 54 Him 63 M 23 T 29 0 Kids Funny Farm of Rescues 12/12 OW-- 5/13 ILYBINILWY: A denied 9/13 Proof OW: ENDED 2/14 Got D papers on my BD I kicked him out for my sanity 9/14 He wants to "talk"?
Well I do know my WAW wants to keep in contact and I know she wants to talk to me but I am avoiding it whenever possible. We need time apart so she can now freely go and hook up with someone she fell in love with through an EA. At least she had the class to dump me beforehand, but that was only because of a promise we made together when we first got married, that if either of us was ever faced with temptation, we would talk about it. She held up her end as far no PE, but there's been a plan in place for her clearly, for a long time now. I just feel like I don't know everything and that uncertainty makes me dislike her more and more. Someone you trusted with everything, your life even, and they do this "planning" behind your back. I guess that's a good thing, the anger and hatred towards her seems to overshadow the love I was feeling for her a week ago.
ME: 43 W:44 M 13 years on 5-5-01 T 18 years BD 4/27/14 D papers served 5/5/14 (how appropriate a date) WAW moved out 5/12/14 Papers filed 6/27/14 Divorce granted 07/17/14 Our marriage ends 11/17/14
Goat Gal has the right idea with the breezy/no response conversations. That being said...
Quote:
I know she wants to talk to me but I am avoiding it whenever possible
Can you elaborate why you're avoiding it?
What was your M.O. when you were married? When you or she were angry, how did you communicate? Or did you both retreat and do the silent treatment thing?
The point of DR is to do something different and monitor results. If you're not interested in doing that, what is your goal?
"There are only 2 ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle."
No actually it was totally and completely different when we were together. I would take her every call right away or respond to every e-mail right away. SO no, it wasn't like that until now...in NC, because she's only calling to see if I'm still Plan B while she sorts out what to do about her feelings for OM. When we were married we would talk...it's just she never came out and said what the problem was, she's a self-admitted co-dependent and she always puts everyone else's needs before her own...not just me in our marriage, but with everyone...her parents, sister, friends, etc. So when I say I don't want to talk to her, it means I want to maintain NC, she's too confused to talk to me right now...she still needs to "find herself." Any communication with her now would be counterproductive because both of us are very uncomfortable in each others' presence right now...that was clear the last time she popped in her 10 days ago. It's too soon to talk I think as it's only been a month since the "bomb" and less than a month since she moved out with parents.
ME: 43 W:44 M 13 years on 5-5-01 T 18 years BD 4/27/14 D papers served 5/5/14 (how appropriate a date) WAW moved out 5/12/14 Papers filed 6/27/14 Divorce granted 07/17/14 Our marriage ends 11/17/14
