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I think the answer is there in the above exercise, once I thought it all through. That, and I feel like I reached my tipping point this morning. I had brought some stuff in from my car to put away, and later realized H had put it away for me. I pictured myself saying to him (don't worry, didn't actually do it!) "Please don't put things away for me. When you do that, I start to believe you care about me, but then when it's clear later that you don't, it really hurts." And then I burst into tears and sobbed like I haven't in weeks. I wish I could be strong enough to just detach while staying here, but I don't think it's realistic for me at this point. No matter what I do it will be hard, but at least once I get over the initial moving/packing/splitting up stuff, just being able to take care of myself without these daily micro-hurts has to be better. And I know it's not an automatic "death sentence" for getting back together. I'm still not filing. He has my number, he knows he can contact me.

labug - you posted something earlier about what I think he's planning. Honestly, I don't think he's planning anything... and that makes me very sad/frustrated. He's just sitting in limbo. He says he's pretty sure about what he wants, but then also says he needs to figure out if it's really the best thing to do.. and then doesn't seem to take any action. He has told me previously that he's been "trying not to think about it" and avoiding the issue. It makes no sense to me (does he think an answer will fall from the sky or divine intervention or something if he just doesn't think about it?) but whatever. Not my issue. Just have to take care of myself. If he's not putting effort into thinking about it or working on our M, makes no sense for me to continue to expend so much energy or emotion on it... I'll just divert it all to myself.


Me:30 H:29, no kids
T:12, M:4 (when D was final)
12/13: "Don't think I want to be M anymore"
6/14: Separated (I move)
1/15: H filed for D
5/15: D final
KGirl #2445224 04/12/14 05:11 PM
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I think you said he was "pulling something" and I asked you what you thought he was pulling. I think he's been very clear.


Me 57/H 58
M36 S 2.5yrs R 12/13

Let me give up the need to know why things happen as they do.
I will never know and constant wondering is constant suffering.
Caroline Myss
labug #2445227 04/12/14 05:16 PM
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Yes, absolutely. I realize/recognize now that he's not pulling anything behind the scenes or secretly planning something. It just is what it is, even though it makes no sense to me.


Me:30 H:29, no kids
T:12, M:4 (when D was final)
12/13: "Don't think I want to be M anymore"
6/14: Separated (I move)
1/15: H filed for D
5/15: D final
KGirl #2445351 04/13/14 02:09 PM
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even though it makes no sense to me.

That's where we get stuck. Our expectation is that people will act as we do, that what makes sense for us makes sense for others. I lived in a very black/white world for much of my life, lots of rules, rights, wrongs,judgments. I had trouble accepting anything in the gray zone. smile

I think this is where your fear comes in the most, you don't know how to live life without certainty, the certainty we thought we had with M, our Hs, the future we had planned. Without things being black or white, we feel lost, out of control, afraid.

Life is uncertain and learning to live it while accepting the uncertainty makes it so much better.

What do you think?


Me 57/H 58
M36 S 2.5yrs R 12/13

Let me give up the need to know why things happen as they do.
I will never know and constant wondering is constant suffering.
Caroline Myss
labug #2445355 04/13/14 02:37 PM
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Yes, I hear that. I'm definitely afraid of the unknown, especially an unknown that I have ZERO effect on. So, what do I do with that? Do I challenge myself to sit in the uncertainty and live with it on a daily basis? Or do I take control of what I can (in this case, leaving and making my own life), which may mean not fully accepting the uncertainty? Rhetorical, I guess, since it's really whatever is going to be right for me, right? smile


Me:30 H:29, no kids
T:12, M:4 (when D was final)
12/13: "Don't think I want to be M anymore"
6/14: Separated (I move)
1/15: H filed for D
5/15: D final
labug #2445359 04/13/14 02:57 PM
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How did you reach that point Labug? What did you do to have that way of thinking?


When the student its ready, the teacher will appear...
Even after all this time the sun never says to the Earth, "You owe me."
Look what happens with a love like that,It lights the whole sky.
KGirl #2445543 04/14/14 02:32 PM
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Originally Posted By: KGirl
Yes, I hear that. I'm definitely afraid of the unknown, especially an unknown that I have ZERO effect on. So, what do I do with that? Do I challenge myself to sit in the uncertainty and live with it on a daily basis? Or do I take control of what I can (in this case, leaving and making my own life), which may mean not fully accepting the uncertainty? Rhetorical, I guess, since it's really whatever is going to be right for me, right? smile


Why do you say zero effect? You have much opportunity to change you, which is the only thing you can change.

I see the stuck-ness being around you wanting to control the outcomes. I so understand that, I had my whole life planned, down to the last penny because that made me feel safe. I needed to control to remove all the unknowns from my life. If I could control for all that, I could keep "bad things" from happening.

Guess what, didn't work.

What I didn't understand was that the control I was exerting on others in order to make my plan work was the very thing that was undermining my outcome. I was also very unhappy most of the time because others weren't falling in line with me, marching to my drumbeat. Being a controller is exhausting.

You want answers and no one has those in the specificity you seek. But in changing how you view the world, your place in it, and your relationships with others, I think the answers will come.

Yes, you do have to sit with anxiety and that's a good first step. The world around us is constantly changing, minute by minute, the bus is late, meetings run overtime, co-workers are sick and we have to deal with their load, it rains when we have an outside even planned, our spouses feel controlled and unheard when we're only trying to help them, on and on.

Being able to put these things in perspective and take them in stride as just life, is a beginning. Accepting these everyday things gives us a grounding that helps us also accept the bigger things. Realizing that there is often not a right or a wrong, sometimes things just "are" and we can do nothing about that.


Me 57/H 58
M36 S 2.5yrs R 12/13

Let me give up the need to know why things happen as they do.
I will never know and constant wondering is constant suffering.
Caroline Myss
ye21 #2445545 04/14/14 02:35 PM
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Originally Posted By: ye21
How did you reach that point Labug? What did you do to have that way of thinking?


Reach which point?


Me 57/H 58
M36 S 2.5yrs R 12/13

Let me give up the need to know why things happen as they do.
I will never know and constant wondering is constant suffering.
Caroline Myss
labug #2445745 04/14/14 11:59 PM
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labug, I like what you posted today. I kinda want to read it daily to remind myself of all those ideas smile

What I meant was, I have zero effect on my H. There is nothing I can do or say right now to make him reconsider his stance. I have to accept that, let him go, and focus on myself, instead of wanting to influence people and outcomes beyond my "reach" (I picture myself spinning in a circle with my arms outstretched and it's just me in that circle.. in that circle is all I can really worry about and improve upon). Yes, I do want answers, but I know no one can give me them. I want someone or a book or an article to tell me "Yes, moving will help, then he'll see what he's missing!" or "No, don't move, he can't see your changes!" or something of the sort, but there is no right or best answer.

Reading your post, I was first thinking "is labug saying I should con't to live with H so I can face the anxiety??" But I don't think that's what you're saying. When I reflect back on your past posts, your advice has always been to do what I need to do for me, and that regardless of what I'm going to do, it's not going to push him any further away. I found an apartment today that meets almost all my criteria (well, my last apartment would be ideal, but there are no openings there currently!). Free underground parking, a storage unit, lots of closets, a kitchen pantry, in-unit washer/dryer, right by a bus stop, a nice patio that doesn't face the freeway. I just keeping thing, though, that it's not the same as living in my house that I saved and dreamed for, and never will be. It's tough. Right now it's the hardest decision I've ever had to make. I feel like I'm giving up on our M even though I know in my heart and brain it isn't true. Who knows what may or may not happen in the future. All I know is the current situation and how I'm feeling, and that is that I don't want to be this person's roommate anymore.


Me:30 H:29, no kids
T:12, M:4 (when D was final)
12/13: "Don't think I want to be M anymore"
6/14: Separated (I move)
1/15: H filed for D
5/15: D final
KGirl #2445750 04/15/14 12:13 AM
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I think this is where your fear comes in the most, you don't know how to live life without certainty, the certainty we thought we had with M, our Hs, the future we had planned. Without things being black or white, we feel lost, out of control, afraid.

Life is uncertain and learning to live it while accepting the uncertainty makes it so much better.

That point where you accept uncertain


When the student its ready, the teacher will appear...
Even after all this time the sun never says to the Earth, "You owe me."
Look what happens with a love like that,It lights the whole sky.
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