Thought I would start a new thread before my old one locks up.
Little darling, I feel that ice is slowly melting Little darling, it seems like years since it's been clear Here comes the sun Here comes the sun, and I say It's all right
-The Beatles
M: 8 yrs T:14 Twins:7 S:5 BD:'NLILWY': Feb/2013 Mar/Apr/May: MC June: "living in limbo" Sept 12: H moves out Oct 20: reconciling Jan-Feb 2014:MC Feb 2014: separating, and H moved out.
LEARN from yesterday. LIVE for today. HOPE for tomorrow.
~The minute you think of giving up, think of the reason you held on so long.
~With the new day comes new strength and new thoughts. Eleanor Roosevelt
Good things come to those who Believe, Better things come to those who are Patient and the best Things come to those who Don't Give Up
M: 8 yrs T:14 Twins:7 S:5 BD:'NLILWY': Feb/2013 Mar/Apr/May: MC June: "living in limbo" Sept 12: H moves out Oct 20: reconciling Jan-Feb 2014:MC Feb 2014: separating, and H moved out.
M: 8 yrs T:14 Twins:7 S:5 BD:'NLILWY': Feb/2013 Mar/Apr/May: MC June: "living in limbo" Sept 12: H moves out Oct 20: reconciling Jan-Feb 2014:MC Feb 2014: separating, and H moved out.
-no nagging/reminders/checking up on him to see if he is ready/organized about things -positive mindset, putting a stop to the negative thought patterns -keep things light -no pressuring/requesting status updates, etc. -STFU! -tell him when something is bothering me, bring it up nicely at a good time and tell him how I feel and why something is important to me! -let him have some free time rather than expecting him to be around/help all the time, give him some space -make the most of our time together, have fun!! -try some new, exciting things together -do some of his LL 'Acts of Service', let him have rest if needed, fold his laundry, bring coffee, buy him an unexpected treat once in a while -try not to overanalyze things and our situation!!!!! -be grateful for what I have and try not to rush things
M: 8 yrs T:14 Twins:7 S:5 BD:'NLILWY': Feb/2013 Mar/Apr/May: MC June: "living in limbo" Sept 12: H moves out Oct 20: reconciling Jan-Feb 2014:MC Feb 2014: separating, and H moved out.
That's not a bad idea. How many days has he stayed over in the past? What if you did Christmas Eve, Christmas and the day after? Then made a date for a couple of days later, and go from there? New Years?
When you guys dated prior to marriage, how often did you two spend time with each other? Were you two weekend daters, and talked during the week, or were you guys inseparable? Combination?
Ambiv, I like your idea! For sure I would like him to stay over for a few nights, it would help me feel better, more secure, and happy. Christmas Eve is my favourite day of the year, it always has been, I just love everything about it. It's even better now with 3 little ones that I can share my excitement with!! smile
When we first met we would go out for a few nights in a row then take a few days off. We were never inseparable, lol. Similar to what we are doing now, I guess! And lately it feels the same as back when we were dating! smile
Our first Christmas together I got him a nice watch as a present.. and he got me a Toronto Maple Leafs jersey,when I was a Detroit fan at the time!! haha. I was not impressed! It was funny smile Perhaps through our dating we can bring back some of the carefree dynamic we used to have.
[quoute=labug] Why would you be sad if he wasn't here by Christmas? You could still spend time together, right?
Don't let emotion rule, this is too important. [/quote] I don't know how to explain how I feel.. I am a very emotional person. It doesn't take much for me to get upset. The little everyday things I notice make me sad sometimes, like when I notice his empty closet and when I notice his car is parked on the road because he will be leaving to go to his brother's. In the morning I wake up and feel sad that he is not next to me. That kind of thing I guess.
Labug, you are right to not let emotion rule. In fact, one of the important things H's counselor told him right off the bat was that we shouldn't be making decisions at times when we are feeling strong emotions. That makes sense.
M: 8 yrs T:14 Twins:7 S:5 BD:'NLILWY': Feb/2013 Mar/Apr/May: MC June: "living in limbo" Sept 12: H moves out Oct 20: reconciling Jan-Feb 2014:MC Feb 2014: separating, and H moved out.
Had a fun weekend with H. We headed out to the OHL hockey game on Friday night with all of his brothers and their wives and his sister and her boyfriend. I would say it went well. H had his work holiday party early afternoon so by the time we left for the game he was already pretty drunk. I am not too crazy about that but he doesn't do it all that often so I guess it's fine.
This is really the first time we have gone out socially as a group without the kids since before BD. Things seemed different and better this time, just because he was taking the time to include me and talk to me and involve me in conversation, rather than in the past where I feel he would ignore me for the most part.
We had a talk this morning. He wanted to tell me some things that he has been discussing in counseling. He said what he has come to realize is that he has had some MAJOR resentments of me since about 10 years ago when we moved to the city. We had been dating a couple of years and he moved to a city and hour and a half away due to a job. We were both only around 20 years old. He felt I had pressured him to have me move in with him and he felt like it took away from his freedom. He said he felt major resentment, and that is when our fighting starting between us. At the time we had totally different mindsets. I was thinking along the lines of marriage and starting a family and he was more interested in having a few years of freedom and drinking with his friends. He believes that every argument we had back then and also now stems back to that. I had no idea how to respond to him. I was young and perhaps foolish at the time, and definitely not the same person I am today. I can't go back in time and change how I acted. I don't resent my feelings of wanting to settle down but I do regret pressuring him into anything.
He also resents that when my mom passed away I grieved and became depressed and a lot of the family burden rested on him while I was grieving. It was the worst time of my life and remember the numbness my body felt like I could not move or function. A constant heavy feeling. I told him some things that he could do that I thought would help me feel better and he didn't do them, which I resented. He resented that I did not do counseling. I went to a counselor once and left feeling more depressed so I did not go back. Me being depressed and him having the burden really made him resent me even more. He had a work trip in Finland for 9 days and I cried so hard and asked him not to go. I thought I could not handle being alone in the city without help watching 3 very young children. He resents me acting this way. He does not understand how I felt, I feel he will never understand. I am so frustrated!
I don't know what to do moving forward. I feel like he is always going to resent me no matter what happens. I feel like I can't win. I want to have a magic answer that takes away all of the resentment. He has carried around all of this anger toward me for years and I had no idea. I am scared that he will always hate me for something. I feel like we can say sorry to each other and that still the anger will be buried. Is there a way we can once and for all let everything go and move forward?
M: 8 yrs T:14 Twins:7 S:5 BD:'NLILWY': Feb/2013 Mar/Apr/May: MC June: "living in limbo" Sept 12: H moves out Oct 20: reconciling Jan-Feb 2014:MC Feb 2014: separating, and H moved out.
We are total polar opposites, H and I. What we need in order to be happy is on opposite sides of the spectrum. I think we are expecting that the other person should feel exactly the same way as we do in any given circumstance. And we also assume that whatever it takes for us to be happy will be what the other person needs in order to be happy. We are both acting in our own ways and not hitting the mark.
I am more driven by emotions. I tend to rely on others for a sense of safety and sense of belonging. I feel I would be happy with someone that would nurture me, day in and day out. Someone that would hold my hand and take care of me and just be there for me and spend time with me.
He is driven by a lot of things, money, success, freedom. He is a hard worker, and his LL is acts of service. He loves taking care of the kids. He enjoys his job and being a supervisor. He is independent.
I think what we long for in life are different things. If we could understand each other's point of view once in a while it might help, rather than writing off each other's feelings.
What I long for is someone to spend time with, who will make me feel special and include me. That I can laugh with and share my everyday life with. In a way what I would like is someone that will pamper me sometimes. Spoiled, I know!
What he longs for is freedom. He is also a quiet guy so he needs a lot of alone time/quiet time.
So it feels as though what I need from him is the opposite of what he wants to give me. I want him to be affectionate, and compassionate and I would like him to care about and consider my well-being. He tends to not take notice of what my core needs are, although I have tried telling him. He is more looking for freedom and independance and the more I need/rely on him, the more he resents me. How do we get past that??? Sounds like the pursuer-distancer... I run after him and he runs!! I want him to be affectionate and he wants space and freedom. I want to be taken care of and he wants me to be independant.
M: 8 yrs T:14 Twins:7 S:5 BD:'NLILWY': Feb/2013 Mar/Apr/May: MC June: "living in limbo" Sept 12: H moves out Oct 20: reconciling Jan-Feb 2014:MC Feb 2014: separating, and H moved out.
I guess it is a good thing that he is opening up to me.. he certainly is doing that! lol. On the other hand I feel just awful that he has a laundry list of things he felt resentful of about me, things that I didn't know about for years. I am starting to feel guilt and shame for having made someone else feel like that for years.
What I intend on doing is living day to day and being the best person that I can be, as a wife and mother. We can try to address some of these resentment issues over counseling. For some reason I am feeling scared.
Scared that he has these feelings.
Scared that for 10 years he was unable to communicate with me to let me know his feelings.
Scared that it will happen again in 5 years, he will hate me again for something I didn't know about.
His counselor gave him some homework to come up with some rules for himself so that this will never happen again, him coming to this point with his feelings.
M: 8 yrs T:14 Twins:7 S:5 BD:'NLILWY': Feb/2013 Mar/Apr/May: MC June: "living in limbo" Sept 12: H moves out Oct 20: reconciling Jan-Feb 2014:MC Feb 2014: separating, and H moved out.
I am more driven by emotions. I tend to rely on others for a sense of safety and sense of belonging. I feel I would be happy with someone that would nurture me, day in and day out. Someone that would hold my hand and take care of me and just be there for me and spend time with me
This sounds like dependency. There will be times when we need support, but nurturing day in and day out? This can be suffocating and is relying on someone to meet needs that you can meet!
Quote:
who will make me feel special and include me.
Nobody can make you feel special , or make you feel anything. They may reinforce feelings you already have, or fears, insecurities that are within. This is something you may wish to explore.
Quote:
That I can laugh with and share my everyday life with.
Now this is something that can be achieved, but be more specific. Setting time aside to discuss the day is important to any relationship. Laughing with someone is very healthy, perhaps comedy clubs, or schedule time to have a super soaker war, laser tag, learn something fun?
Quote:
. I want him to be affectionate, and compassionate and I would like him to care about and consider my well-being. He tends to not take notice of what my core needs are, although I have tried telling him. He is more looking for freedom and independance and
What is the exact type of affection you desire? Have you said I would like...xyz, and then let it go? I'm feeling I want a hug, I want a kiss? I'm feeling randy, I want to make love or give you a ....? Are you expecting him to read your desires, needs, your mind? This is where you need to be specific! Men like to fix, remember? This is something that can be fixed! For if you are vague and expect him to "know", you will always be disappointed. He will never feel he can win with you, and this will lead to him not trying. It leads to shutting down and frustration.
Quote:
He is more looking for freedom and independance and the more I need/rely on him, the more he resents me. How do we get past that???
What type of freedom? What type of independence? What do they look like to him? How does he define this?
I was reading about how some men, after connecting and being intimate need to have alone time. They need to get some distance. It isn't about the woman, it is just how they are wired. When they have their down time, this is when the woman should take the opportunity to do something with friends, pamper themselves, or do something that their men don't like to do.
Quote:
...compassionate and I would like him to care about and consider my well-being...
What leads you to believe that he doesn't feel compassion for you? Why do you feel he is not considering your well-being?
What are you thinking about when you say he longs for independence? How can you ask what he wants? What can you do to meet his needs here? What is the space he needs? Why do you feel the need to cling tighter?
When you say you want to be " taken care of ", it sounds like you want a daddy. Was your father there for you? Did he neglect or stay emotionally distant? Was he and enabler? Did he give you everything you wanted? Did he shower you with love, or did he withhold it?
It seems as if you are looking to another to make you whole. That you are looking for happiness in another, rather than seeking happiness from within and sharing it with another.
Resentment comes when one feels dismissed, not heard. When they think they have accommodated and not gotten what they need. When they stuff down what should be spoken to avoid conflict or fear expressing anger.
When this happens it is difficult for the one resenting to feel empathy for the other. They are overwhelmed with the feeling of resentment . They do not feel validated.
This can lead to withdrawal or behavior that is covert and damaging.
Formerly Workinprogress H :55 M :over 29 yrs. Together : 33 D : college D : adult BD and left : May 2013 Separated Experimenting/Replay
I am more driven by emotions. I tend to rely on others for a sense of safety and sense of belonging. I feel I would be happy with someone that would nurture me, day in and day out. Someone that would hold my hand and take care of me and just be there for me and spend time with me
This sounds like dependency. There will be times when we need support, but nurturing day in and day out? This can be suffocating and is relying on someone to meet needs that you can meet!
I have this notion in my head of how I would like to be treated. I know sometimes I can be too dependant and it turns him off. I had a boyfriend once that just made me feel very special and I guess ever since then I felt I deserved to be treated the same way as I was back then. He held my hand wherever we went and was very chivalrous. He would hold doors open for me and I could just feel how important I was to him. He made a point of introducing me to his friends and including me and also made a point of getting to know my family. I guess it was young love!
I just like that when a man is chivalrous and just wish I had that feeling that he cared about my well-being.
Originally Posted By: Ambivalent
Quote:
who will make me feel special and include me.
Nobody can make you feel special , or make you feel anything. They may reinforce feelings you already have, or fears, insecurities that are within. This is something you may wish to explore.
You are right. There are certain emotions and feelings that must come within and should not expect him to meet all of my needs. There are, however, some things he COULD do that would help with my insecurities and feeling special. I suppose my problem is that I don't let him know what I need as a core need. Perhaps if I gave him that chance and let him know how I feel, now that we are on better grounds and working on things.
Originally Posted By: Ambivalent
Quote:
That I can laugh with and share my everyday life with.
Now this is something that can be achieved, but be more specific. Setting time aside to discuss the day is important to any relationship. Laughing with someone is very healthy, perhaps comedy clubs, or schedule time to have a super soaker war, laser tag, learn something fun?
Yes! I yearn for doing something fun. Something to shake things up a bit!!
Originally Posted By: Ambivalent
Quote:
. I want him to be affectionate, and compassionate and I would like him to care about and consider my well-being. He tends to not take notice of what my core needs are, although I have tried telling him. He is more looking for freedom and independance and
What is the exact type of affection you desire? Have you said I would like...xyz, and then let it go? I'm feeling I want a hug, I want a kiss? I'm feeling randy, I want to make love or give you a ....? Are you expecting him to read your desires, needs, your mind? This is where you need to be specific! Men like to fix, remember? This is something that can be fixed! For if you are vague and expect him to "know", you will always be disappointed. He will never feel he can win with you, and this will lead to him not trying. It leads to shutting down and frustration.
Ha, funny I told him today that I would like more affection but then, like you mentioned, never told him what I meant by it. I would like to be hugged upon meeting and leaving. I would like random kisses/hugs throughout the day. I would LOVE to hold hands once in a while, although not sure if that is ever gonna happen! He is not a hand holder. He is 14 inches taller than me and says it's awkward for him, although I think he just doesn't like it! I would like to cuddle w/o it having to lead to anything!
Originally Posted By: Ambivalent
Quote:
He is more looking for freedom and independance and the more I need/rely on him, the more he resents me. How do we get past that???
What type of freedom? What type of independence? What do they look like to him? How does he define this? I asked him today to clarify that and he didn't really know the answer, I will have to explore that farther. Because how can I work on helping if I don't know what he is referring to? I feel that he has lots of independance while he has a family with 3 kids and he is living somewhere else, but he must be referring to something.
Quote:
...compassionate and I would like him to care about and consider my well-being...
What leads you to believe that he doesn't feel compassion for you? Why do you feel he is not considering your well-being?
I feel that he constantly shuts down my ideas and opinions. To me this means that he does not care about my feelings and well-being. He doesn't quite understand what in life makes me happy, because it is not the same things as him, and he writes it off. Or tells me I shouldn't feel a certain way, that I am wrong to have certain feelings. To me, decorating is my passion, and working with my hands to create art, and painting. When I mention getting a job to do something I enjoy, he shuts down my ideas or when I mention painting my girls bedroom he immediately dismisses it. He doesn't understand that my being able to express my creative side in that way brings me so much joy and passion in my life. Because, if he DID see that, why would he shut my ideas down?
That's how I see it anyhow. I know that a part of it is that he worries about money.
Originally Posted By: Ambivalent
When you say you want to be " taken care of ", it sounds like you want a daddy. Was your father there for you? Did he neglect or stay emotionally distant? Was he and enabler? Did he give you everything you wanted? Did he shower you with love, or did he withhold it?
My parents were always there for me. They were both there at every soccer game when I was a kid and every dance recitle. My dad I was not very close with but I was very close with my mother. They gave me a lot of things, but I wouldn't say I was spoiled. I had a pretty good childhood. I would say that my parents were a lot more involved in my life than my H's parents were involved in his. In my family it was just me and my brother so we got a lot of attention. My H came from a larger family and I think he was given a lot less attention, no doubt that is why he is a lot more independant than I am.
Originally Posted By: Ambivalent
Resentment comes when one feels dismissed, not heard. When they think they have accommodated and not gotten what they need. When they stuff down what should be spoken to avoid conflict or fear expressing anger.
When this happens it is difficult for the one resenting to feel empathy for the other. They are overwhelmed with the feeling of resentment . They do not feel validated.
This can lead to withdrawal or behavior that is covert and damaging.
That is spot on. He felt not heard for years and just completely shut down. Then I wondered why he wasn't there anymore and seemingly didn't care. That makes sense to me that he was not able to feel empathy, due to all of those feelings of resentment. And it just ended up making me feel empty and alone. We both ended up withdrawing from each other and wondering what the heck happened. It is starting to make more sense now that we have all of the missing pieces of the puzzle..
M: 8 yrs T:14 Twins:7 S:5 BD:'NLILWY': Feb/2013 Mar/Apr/May: MC June: "living in limbo" Sept 12: H moves out Oct 20: reconciling Jan-Feb 2014:MC Feb 2014: separating, and H moved out.
