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#2288316 10/11/12 05:10 AM
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Hey there. What a perfect time for a brand new thread. My previous thread can be found here:

Is She Done?

Two years ago on 10/10/10, I was having a great day. I was watering the lawn while my wife was trimming the rose bushes. I finished watering and lit a cigarette. My wife sits down and puts her hands together and looks at the ground. She finally looks up and says to me: “I think I may want to separate after the first of the year.” I couldn’t believe what I was hearing. I was dumbfounded. We had just celebrated our 25th anniversary, were making plans to paint the house and were putting things in place to go to Disneyland one more time before our boys were much older. Her statement was followed by what many people call THE BOMB….the “I love you but I’m not in love with you” speech. This came right out of the blue and hit me like a freight train. Everything was going great or so I thought. At that moment, my marriage was over. I just didn’t know it at the time.
That day changed my life forever. I later found out that she had been talking to someone that she met online and I didn’t have a snowball’s chance in Hell. Of course, she said I did, but I really didn’t. Her mind was made up and this was something that she had to do for her. I tried everything…begging, pleading, crying, promising……you name it, I tried it.
The demonizing of me began shortly after that. I was called every name in the book and accused of some very strange stuff….extorting money, not taking her to the right grocery store, cheating on her, not getting a vasectomy, holding her back, still having feelings for my girlfriend from the sixth grade….blah blah blah. If you are new here, I’ll say this: DO NOT EVEN TRY. THERE IS NOTHING YOU CAN DO TO TALK SENSE INTO YOUR SPOUSE. Unfortunately, I did not know this at the time.
Why am I writing this? Two reasons:
1) For me……as therapy.
2) For anyone that can be helped.
If you’ve been on this board any length of time, you surely know my story. If you’re new here, just know that I am one of the slow ones. I’ve been stuck longer than most, but I have learned a few things and hopefully someone can benefit from what I am about to write.
Things to remember:
A – Come here often. Read, read and read some more. Post, post and post some more.
B – The people here are amazing. They have all been where you are and are full of advice. Believe them when they tell you things do get better because it does.
C- Whatever you do, do not stay stuck. It has been 2 years for me and I am still stuck to an extent. I still ask why or if there is anything I could have done. DON’T DO IT. You won’t find an answer. You’ll waste precious time asking the questions.
D- The only thing that you can really do is move on with your life. Yes, it sounds harsh, but it is the only way. You can’t do anything about your spouse’s crisis. If you try to make them “see the light”, there is a good chance that he/she will run even faster.
E- You will probably get sick of hearing a certain word. That word is DETACH. There really is no other way. It has helped me to think that the woman I married is actually dead and in a way, she is. She is not the same person….not even close.
F- You will have some bad days and some really bad days, but they do become less frequent over time. It is okay to have them. Don’t let them rule your life though.
G – There is nothing wrong with getting outside help. If you think you need it, get it. I’ve been to two counselors and have been on anti-depressants for two years. Yes, this is tough. It may be the hardest thing you’ll ever have to experience. Get the help if you think you need it. Get it even if you don’t .
H – Take advantage of the time you have been given. You may not think so now, but if you work on yourself and live your life, you may find that you don’t even want your spouse back. Sure, I would love for things to be the way they were, but it isn’t going to happen. If she came back today, I don’t even know if I could take her back. If I did, it would never be the same anyway. The marriage that you once had is done. Gone. It isn’t coming back. Your spouse might, but the marriage that you knew is not.
I – Educate yourself. Come to this board and read as much as you can. It helps.
J – You will find that the more posts on this board that you read, you’ll notice a common theme. They all seem to say the same thing and give the same speeches. Why? Because they are sick and the alien has taken over. The alien may stay for a year or never leave. That is why it is important to live your life.
K – It is okay to want to save your marriage, but don’t expect it.
L – This is heavy duty stuff. Get ready for one Hell of a ride. It will drain you emotionally, physically and financially if you let it. Protect you and your children. Your spouse will run a bulldozer over anyone or anything that gets in the way. Stay clear and detach. (There’s that word again.)
M – I am going to be 45 at the end of this month. I’ve known my ex-wife since I was 16. She is no longer a part of my life and that hurts like Hell. It is what it is though. Can I do anything about that? Nope. The choice was hers. Let your spouse go. Why would you want to be with someone that doesn’t want to be with you?
N – Be prepared to find out about a third party. I know it is hard to believe, but there is almost always a third party involved. My wife was a virgin when we got together. The thought of her with someone else never crossed my mind until……I found an email. This came just weeks after hearing her say things like: “I value what we have. I couldn’t even IMAGINE being with anyone else.” Go with your gut. If you think there might be someone else, there probably is.
O – Do not snoop. You’ll only find something that hurts you even more.
P – Get used to being lied to. They lie as easily as they breathe. Sometimes, I think they lie without even realizing it. You are the enemy right now. They’ll do anything they can to hide something from you. A wise poster once told me to believe nothing they say and only half of what they do.
Q – Your spouse may “wake up” someday or he/she may not. There is no predicting how this will turn out. That is why it is important for you to live as if they are not coming back.
R – Take it one day at a time. Don’t try to look too far into the future. Live for today and tell yourself that it will be better than yesterday.
S – Don’t be mad at the third party. (I know. Easier said than done.) Your spouse is in full blown crisis mode. If he/she didn’t start fooling around with that person, it would have just been somebody else. The third party is just a symptom.
T – Don’t put a timeframe on the crisis. Sure there are averages, but that is all they are. AVERAGES. Some stay in crisis for 2,5,7 or even 10 years. Some remain there.
U – Face the fact that your marriage may not be saved. When I came here two years ago, I thought that XW would never go through with it. I thought that I could come here and find the magic formula to end the craziness and make her have feelings for me again. The fact is, your spouse is on a mission and if the mission includes a stop in divorce court, there isn’t anything you can do or say to stop it. If you get in the way, they’ll run you over.
V – Your marriage might also BE SAVED. Just don’t expect it. Something else you will hear around here is NO EXPECTATIONS.
W – Don’t give in to the temptation to call your spouse. No contact means NO CONTACT. Chances are, if you did call your spouse, they would either say something to give you false hope or say something that hurts you. It is best to have no contact with them unless necessary.
X - You may also struggle with the things your spouse has accused you of. You may actually start to believe that you were a bad spouse or you are a terrible person. Stop right there. This is about your spouse and not about you. If you get a chance, read some of the articles here on projection.
Y – Believe it. This was a hard one for me and still is sometimes. Yes, believe that this has happened. If you thought that something like this could never happen to you, think again. It can, it does and it did….to you. You’ll be surprised at the amount of people this happens to. Even if your marriage WAS perfect, there is no stopping the train. The seeds for this mess were planted long ago and probably even as far back as childhood. Again, it has nothing to do with you.
Z-Z is for zebra.
Take care.
Tad

***** HOT OFF THE PRESSES *****

I just got a text from XW:

W: "KISS is on Letterman tonight."

M: "Cool. Thanks."

Confusing as Hell.


Currently:
M 56 XW 57
Sons 38,33,31,29

The Sitch:
Married 26 years
EA w/ OM 9/10
Bomb 10/10 (5 weeks after 25th anniversary)
Sep 12/10
She wants D 1/11
W files 5/11
D final 10/11
XW marries OM 6/13
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Wow! Quite the trip you had there, TP1025. The ABC breakdown is interesting in that it showed me that I have gone through all that for the past 7 years, and now, at last, divorce is imminent. Your Y is what I have come to believe at last. Although, I think I knew it all along. I did the detachment, the GAL, the no contact-ish, but there was always that teeny-tiny bit of hope. He helped me keep that hope by being nice, always coming home, calling me, etc. But, that hope is just dust now. I know he's not coming back to the marriage, and I'm not certain I would want him now. He's living his own secretive life on his business trips. Who knows what he's up to ... it's another H, away from us, his family.

As my new thread says, it's no longer my business what he does. Except where the children and our finances are concerned. laugh Isn't it sad that it comes down to that. He was my best friend, and now he's my co-parent, and "business" partner.

They are confusing, but also confused, I think.


Me:57 H:52 M:28 Got another lawyer last year and filed.
D35,S/D twins28,D22
EA4/04 End? Who knows?
"Life is like a mirror. Smile at it and it smiles back at you." — Peace Pilgrim
BeingMe #2288325 10/11/12 07:05 AM
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Yep. The belief for me was the hardest part.

I've got an update from tonight's text from X. About an hour before David Lettermasn came on, I got a text from her.

X: KISS is on tonight...

M: Cool. Thanks.

That was the end of the conversation. I watched it because they are my favorite band. She must have watched it too because a few minutes after they were on, I get the following:

X: Cool album cover...

M: Yeah.

X: How are you?

M: I'm okay.

X: That's good.

I ended it there with no response. Why does she do this? It is confusing. Maybe I shouldn't have even responded, but I did. I also wonder if OM would appreciate her texting me.

It's all very weird.

Tad


Currently:
M 56 XW 57
Sons 38,33,31,29

The Sitch:
Married 26 years
EA w/ OM 9/10
Bomb 10/10 (5 weeks after 25th anniversary)
Sep 12/10
She wants D 1/11
W files 5/11
D final 10/11
XW marries OM 6/13
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Tad, quit asking why.

There is no answer for why they do these things.

Will it help you to know my XH who I haven't seen or spoken to or heard from for a year now did the very same thing?

He was living with OW all comfy in his new life and emailed to tell me that a very obscure writer he knew I liked had a new book out that I might want and that she'd be giving an interview on NPR.

I got hopeful after I read that email from him for about a week or so till I realized it was like some sort of flare from his la-la land and meant absolutely nothing.


M45
Bomb 6/09; EA 6/10; Divorced 1/11
Proud single mom of 7 little feline girls and one little feline boy
"Fall down 53 times. Get up 54." -- Zen saying
AntoniaB #2288367 10/11/12 01:33 PM
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Your question…
Quote:
Why does she do this?


My answer
Quote:
M: Cool. Thanks.

Quote:
M: I'm okay.


As you can see…you ALWAYS send her some sort of answer – hence she will continue to contact you.

Quote:
Maybe I shouldn't have even responded, but I did.

Ya think…


Quote:
It's all very weird.

Actually know it is NOT…..it really is quite simple. FTR, this is my opinion as I am not in HER head..

She feels guilty for her actions, so she reaches out to you to “gauge” where you are at. She also need “something” from you to let her know that you are okay. Why? Chances are it helps her sooth the guilt. If you are “okay”…then she did the right thing. If you were not okay…well then YOU were the one with a problem.

She will continue to touch and feel ……UNTIL YOU STOP RESPONDING…but then again, you really want to do that. Right?

Your next question then is probably….what about OM? Here is the thing, 1 – you probably should not give a chit but since I know you do, I’ll take another stab at mind reading…. I suspect that she has painted you as a sad, lonely, still in love with her man, who is also the father of her children – so just may explain to OM, that she needs to check on the father of her children to make sure you are not depressed and suicidal.

I would say that you fall for it everytime Tad.

Why not try this…..STOP RESPONDING to ANY TEXT from her. Only respond if the kids are sick.

Oh…..you never answered my questions on my last post. Then again that has been the pattern, you respond briefly and then your post get right back to what SHE is doing.


"The difficulties of Life are intended to make us BETTER,not bitter".
"Fear is a prison, where you are the jailer. FREE YOURSELF!"
"Life is usually all about how you handle Plan B." - Jack3Beans
ericmsant2 #2288443 10/11/12 04:29 PM
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I think it's simply that they DO think of us LBS's. They were married to us for a long time, so things that we were interested in will remind them of us. And, just like us, they just have to respond to that reminder and contact us. Means nothing. Respond, don't respond ... it's all the same to them. I would say, for your own sanity, don't respond.


Me:57 H:52 M:28 Got another lawyer last year and filed.
D35,S/D twins28,D22
EA4/04 End? Who knows?
"Life is like a mirror. Smile at it and it smiles back at you." — Peace Pilgrim
BeingMe #2288449 10/11/12 04:51 PM
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Z - is for Zebra.

That got me smiling.

The next time you start wondering "WHY" she is doing something...
I really want yout to try and think...

Instead of WHY...or Y

Instead think:

Z is for Zebra.

It makes as much sense as does wasting your time wondering 'why'.




I think (MOST) of them reach out, especially the women, not as a sign of wanting to come back but as a gauge to see if we 'hate' them. To make a simple offering of...something nice so we can all be that fairy tale "friends" they wanted us all to be; where we all including the OM/OW sit together on a bright sunny day and have a picnic and share pie and crap like that while we feed ducks and laugh at how everything is wonderful now, and how the MLCer knew best and it all worked out and unicorns cook us filet mignon...

My wife, when we were seperated would email me crap too.

Didn't matter that I told her I would only talk to her if it was about our mutual bills or our boys.

Later when she asked if I had gotten those emails, I tol dher very frankly that I deleted anything from her that wasn't about the bills or our boys.

She got quiet, but she couldn't argue, I had set down a boundary, she was testing it so she could feel better about herself? I dunno...I also more importantly DID NOT CARE 'WHY'. All I knew was that I was living up to my end of my boundary.

Not sure if thats going to help Tad, I hope it does.



Experience is a brutal teacher, but you learn. My God, do you learn. - C.S. Lewis

Life is usually all about how you handle Plan B. - Jack3Beans

Listen without defending; Speak without offending - FaithinAK

TRUST THE PROCESS - Cadet

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Quote:
and unicorns cook us filet mignon

What? You mean they dont? Damn that would explain why my Google search for "unicorns that cook filet mignon" didn't return any results. smile


"The difficulties of Life are intended to make us BETTER,not bitter".
"Fear is a prison, where you are the jailer. FREE YOURSELF!"
"Life is usually all about how you handle Plan B." - Jack3Beans
ericmsant2 #2288512 10/11/12 06:26 PM
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You guys have clearly led sheltered lives. Unicorns are real amd scary.


Me 57 XH 58 Sons age 32 & 27 M:32
D final 9/12
Bought 10 Acres and Living the Dream!
WenikiTiki #2288537 10/11/12 07:31 PM
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Yes, but very specialised tastes! Not likely to worry anyone here.

beatrice #2288583 10/11/12 10:05 PM
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Thanks for the responses.

Eric, I am not very good with words, but will try to answer your questions. I believe they were:

Quote:
Why are YOU SO dependent on HER?
What are you really afraid of?
Why TAD do YOU THINK YOU ARE WORTH LESS than HER?
Why TAD do YOU FEEL the need to FIX HER?
Why TAD do you feel the need to hold yourself back from telling her to go F*ck herself?
Why TAD are YOU continuing to stay on this MERRY GO ROUND OF CRAZINESS? It is Low self worth, fear, WTF is it?


Dependent on her? I was very dependent on her for a long time. She was my rock. Now it is me. I have to be here for myself and my boys.

I do not think that I am worth less than her. Although, I was the one that was sh!t on and am holding down the fort as best as I can. Honestly, there are days when I feel like a piece of dog sh!t, but I do not feel less than her.

The merry go round is a b!tch, but it is slowing down.

As far as fixing her, I thought I could for a long time. It is my personality I guess. I now know that only she can FIX herself while I FIX me and work on me.

I also cannot tell her to go f*ck herself. That is not who I am.

Working on me - this is the hardest. I know now that I am a much better father than I have ever been. I am grateful for that. The relationships that I have with my sons (with exception of oldest) is better than ever. My oldest son and I are a little distant, but he has always been closer to his mother. I also know that I am not the devil that she has made me out to be even though I have struggled with that from time to time.

The hardest thing for me now is deciding what I want out of life. More work to do.....

As for me asking the question about responding to her text: I am just confused about being the "lighthouse" if I choose to be. How can I be that "lighthouse" if I ignore everything from her? How will she know that she can talk to me and come to me if I don't even respond to a text about my favorite band that has nothing to do with this mess? It is just very confusing. Will I be that lighthouse? I don't know but......if she DOES need to talk, I want her to that I am here. Atleast for now.....

Tad


Currently:
M 56 XW 57
Sons 38,33,31,29

The Sitch:
Married 26 years
EA w/ OM 9/10
Bomb 10/10 (5 weeks after 25th anniversary)
Sep 12/10
She wants D 1/11
W files 5/11
D final 10/11
XW marries OM 6/13
beatrice #2288636 10/12/12 03:17 AM
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Why is this "place" called divorce busting when mostly it is divorcing / divorced and stuck / bitter and stuck?

I am read, read, reading but it just seems to me that I need to go ahead and get divorced since there is no hope...

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Tad

Quote:
Honestly, there are days when I feel like a piece of dog sh!t

Poodle or Pit chit? Just kidding….Seriously though, what exactly makes you feel like a piece of canine excrement?

Quote:
I also cannot tell her to go f*ck herself. That is not who I am.

Why? I mean really Tad..why not? Being angry is totally okay dude. You have continued to try and take the high road, you have continue to try being nice – it has not worked.

I’m gonna go out on a limb here…I think you are still standing dude. I applaud you for that.

I think you need to figure out if YOU want to stand or not. You really cannot do both. YOU stand or YOU don’t.

I’m gonna assume you still want to and FTR, I totally support that!

So if you are still standing…we need to go back to DB basics i.e. doing what works, not going down cheese less tunnels,etc.

Not being angry at her HAS NOT worked. I’m not saying to pulled up in the driveway and scream obscenities at her (although if you desire to do this…I have this one neighbor who is a pain in the arse ). What I am saying is that maybe Tad….SHE WANTS to see a little fire in ya.

Quote:
I also know that I am not the devil that she has made me out to be even though I have struggled with that from time to time.

Forgiving ourselves is probably the hardest thing to do. I know. You play back every interaction, every mistake you made…you play it back over and over and over again. It is a process. As I mentioned DB basics…..the ole…”Stop Sign” approach. The minute you begin to think about a time when you f*cked something up, IMMEDIATELY think of something else. Something more positive.

Quote:
The hardest thing for me now is deciding what I want out of life.

Funny…my GF is dealing with this as we speak. SO Tad, what is life to you? I mean really…can you write down 10 things that make you happy. They could be anything…anything…just 10 thinks that make you happy. Then write down, what your ideal life looks like..get specific dude. Can you post those? If not, you know how to reach me.

Quote:
I am just confused about being the "lighthouse" if I choose to be. How can I be that "lighthouse" if I ignore everything from her?

First…this is why I believe that you are still standing. Second….how are you the lighthouse? Hmmm….you are the lighthouse based on how YOU live YOUR life. You are the lighthouse, when you are HAPPY and living in PEACE. Trust me, she will know (you guys have kids together). You are also the lighthouse by allowing her the space and time to make her mistakes, miss you, and come to the conclusion on HER OWN…that she wants the life that you are NOW or in the FUTURE going to…LIVE.


Quote:
if she DOES need to talk, I want her to that I am here.

Don’t fool yourself…SHE KNOWS you are there for her. IMO, right now, being there is hurting YOU GOAL more than you think. DB is counterintuitive.

Finally, I am sorry for pushing you to move forward…I just realized that you really do want to stand and I want you to know that I am here to support you in any way I can.

Eric


"The difficulties of Life are intended to make us BETTER,not bitter".
"Fear is a prison, where you are the jailer. FREE YOURSELF!"
"Life is usually all about how you handle Plan B." - Jack3Beans
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Originally Posted By: NotSureWhatToDo
Why is this "place" called divorce busting when mostly it is divorcing / divorced and stuck / bitter and stuck?

I am read, read, reading but it just seems to me that I need to go ahead and get divorced since there is no hope...


NSWTD,

What's your story? You post it here and I'll likely authorize it.

Your definition of success is a saved marriage right?

Because you didn't type into google:
"Ways to grow while my wife wants a divorce."

OR

"MLC and how to become a better person"


For guys off the tope of my head:

Denver
Starsky
Me

There are others,

some posters fix their marriages and don't post anymore.


Those seem like long odds regardless don't they?



If you were in Vegas, I wouldn't put money down...

However, and this is a big however...

This isn't Vegas.


This is your marriage.

If you had a 1 in 2 chance of being married you would this.
(no brainer)
If you have a 1 in 10 chance you would od this.

What if it was 1 in a 1,000,000,000 chance?
Would you still try?

Isn't your marriage worth it? Isn't she?

She should be, so should your marriage.

Never look at the last number, becuase you are always aiming to the 1 no matter what.

Post your story please so people can identify with you start talking with you and try to help you.

You came here for a reason, willing to bet, hopefully it wasn't to make snide comments. ; )



Experience is a brutal teacher, but you learn. My God, do you learn. - C.S. Lewis

Life is usually all about how you handle Plan B. - Jack3Beans

Listen without defending; Speak without offending - FaithinAK

TRUST THE PROCESS - Cadet

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NSWTD, I just had to chime in. Yes, it looks like I'm about to get D. And I felt exactly the same way you did -- wanted the stats to be more in my favor.

I wrote a year ago today in my diary (long before I heard of DB) that we have a "loveless, empty M".

Today, I feel vibrant and alive. I feel like I gave 100% or more to try to work things out. I feel like I have some tools to grow and move on. I feel like I can leave this D without the bitterness that I always hated that I saw in divorcees.

The reading posts, stories, ideas, advices, IS serving to making me better NOT bitter. It's worth a lot, a whole lot, even if my M cannot be saved.

Tad, I read everything on your thread as if it is directed to me, I have always appreciated your honesty and love the advice you are given. I need to heed it too!!!


Me54/H47
'08 H is "done"
March '12 H moved out
Brink of D, December '12
2014 totally reconciled!
......
"I firmly believe in the...absolute possibility of marriage renewal."
Jim Conway
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Originally Posted By: NotSureWhatToDo
I am read, read, reading but it just seems to me that I need to go ahead and get divorced since there is no hope...

Sorry HOPE is always alive no matter what as long as it is within YOU.

DIVORCE = SPACE

They are going to get their space no matter what.
Sometimes we have no choice about it.

DIVORCE is also just a piece of PAPER.
There are two types of divorce.
LEGAL which I think is what you are talking about.
And emotional(spiritual).
That is the part you CONTROL.
You may need to get a LEGAL divorce but that does not mean that you must give up HOPE.
Only give up EXPECTATIONS.

I believe that the LBS is the one that get to decide in the end.
And if you have not gotten to decide yet then it is not the end!


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How did Mach put it?

^^^^^

The reason I am friends with a guy that lives over 3000 miles from me.....

(I live closer than Mach ....) :P

And one I've never met. smile


Everybody hurts. It's part of life. Don't miss the good stuff.
Drew #2288816 10/12/12 05:59 PM
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Originally Posted By: Drew
How did Mach put it?

^^^^^

The reason I am friends with a guy that lives over 3000 miles from me.....

(I live closer than Mach ....) :P

And one I've never met. smile



That's pretty dammed close to what I said.


discounting mileage, tire wear, and coffee breaks....of course

Mach1 #2288839 10/12/12 06:54 PM
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Sorry had to chime in since we are discussing "Mach quotes"...

Person 1 - "I trying to have a rational conversation with someone who is irrational"...

Person 2 - "Ummm..can you repeat that."

Person 1 -"I trying to have a rational conversation with someone who is irrational"...

Person 2 - "Ummm...can you say that again..."

Person 1 - "I trying to have a rational conversation with someone who is irrational"...

Person 2 - "Okay...one more time..repeat that..."

Person 1 -"I trying to have a rational conversation with someone who is irrational"...

Person 2 - "okay gotcha"

LOL....ahh...the good ole days.


"The difficulties of Life are intended to make us BETTER,not bitter".
"Fear is a prison, where you are the jailer. FREE YOURSELF!"
"Life is usually all about how you handle Plan B." - Jack3Beans
ericmsant2 #2288840 10/12/12 06:56 PM
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Lmao almost fell off the chair......Eric u r one of a kind mijo....:)


Done 01/2014
iluvme55 #2288870 10/12/12 08:27 PM
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Quote:
Tad, I read everything on your thread as if it is directed to me, I have always appreciated your honesty and love the advice you are given. I need to heed it too!!!


smile You're welcome.

Quote:
What I am saying is that maybe Tad….SHE WANTS to see a little fire in ya.


How? Why? We are divorced which is what she wanted. And....she has an OM.....

Quote:
I’m gonna go out on a limb here…I think you are still standing dude. I applaud you for that.

I think you need to figure out if YOU want to stand or not. You really cannot do both. YOU stand or YOU don’t.


This is tough. Obviously I really have no reason to stand because we are already divorced. She gets married next summer. I guess I am not giving up 100% until she is married. Is that a bad thing? I just don't know.....

I will work on the list of ten things. Having a hard time coming up with that many, but will try to post them.

Also, no need to apologize my friend.

XW and S19 have been arguing for almost a week now. I have stayed out of it. He's really been giving her a lot of sh!t. I hate the way he feels, but there is nothing I can do about it. It is her mess I guess.

Tad


Currently:
M 56 XW 57
Sons 38,33,31,29

The Sitch:
Married 26 years
EA w/ OM 9/10
Bomb 10/10 (5 weeks after 25th anniversary)
Sep 12/10
She wants D 1/11
W files 5/11
D final 10/11
XW marries OM 6/13
Mach1 #2288898 10/12/12 09:27 PM
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Originally Posted By: Mach1
discounting mileage, tire wear, and coffee breaks....of course

Tire wear? Yeah, maybe on the 747 when it touches down way up north ...

smile


Everybody hurts. It's part of life. Don't miss the good stuff.
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Tad

Quote:
How? Why? We are divorced which is what she wanted. And....she has an OM..

Really? Have you read the MLC resources? Do you really understand that the divorce was the LEGAL process, the emotional divorce is something totally different.

I am not saying that she wants you back. Only she knows that answer. What I am saying is that maybe Tad...IF you wanted to keep trying that you should try something a little different.

Quote:
I guess I am not giving up 100% until she is married. Is that a bad thing? I just don't know

Then IMO, you are standing...and I admire that about you. It is NOT a bad thing IF that is what YOU really want because you love her. If you are standing because YOU are afraid to lose her or afraid to be alone, or afraid to deal with your own issues....well then are you standing or are you stuck.

Also, if you are going to standSTILL that is also not a good thing. Are you really starting to deal with your demons? Are you really starting to find out WHO TAD the man really is? If you are not, then honestly, you are doing yourself and HER a disservice.

Don't make all of this for naught dude.

Quote:
I just don't know

IMO, knowing if you want or do not want to STAND is separate from becoming the best person YOU can be. You should do that anyways.

BUT....

Don't do it for her (that would be an expectation wouldn't it) do it for YOU Tad.

I'll check back on Monday buddy for the list of Ten.

Have a good weekend!

Eric


"The difficulties of Life are intended to make us BETTER,not bitter".
"Fear is a prison, where you are the jailer. FREE YOURSELF!"
"Life is usually all about how you handle Plan B." - Jack3Beans
ericmsant2 #2288937 10/12/12 10:52 PM
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Yes Tad. It is her mess between her and S19. Your part is to help him and yourself. Not in a bad way, Tad. You're the man of the house and you are his leader, mentor, and father. That's your place and his birthright. You'll help him through things WHEN HE ASKS smile

Good to see you toying with the idea of anger, Tad. I don't see enough of that yet in your posts, but it's good to see *some*. You are starting down that path for more growth...slowly so far.

Work on the list, Tad. Really. Dig down and work on it. Seems hokey, but there is a reason.

Good stuff! Keep going!

AJ


"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter" MLK
Put the glass down...
"Yesterday I was clever so I wanted to change the world
Today I am wise, so I am changing myself."
beatrice #2289010 10/13/12 09:49 AM
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Tad has gotten angry, or at least I've heard him get angry with her.
Some people are different. I would get angry at my ex during our divorce and after our divorce but I couldnt stay angry. Thats why i tried to talk to him over and over. Some people just dont hold onto that anger long enough.
For me I start thinking its a useless emotion and give in.

Tad its ok to stand, its ok to get mad, its ok not to tell her off. Do whats right for you.

Do you get upset when you tell your kids something over and over and you feel like they dont listen? Well these people here are feeling the same.

I respect everyone here but everyone dont move as quickly as others and some can get pretty upset about it.....all because they care but i think some have to learn they can take a horse to water but they cant make it drink. Listening helps alot.

I have to say sometimes it does sound like a board where people are trying to save there relationships.....married or divorced.

Hugs Tad


_________________________________________
M:42
H:40
S:18
M:20yrs/together 21yrs
Bomb:9/08 ILYBNILWY
Sep:9/18/08 "ow" :25
Filed:11/18/08
D:12/8/08
M:Different 26 yr. old 7/09.
Newborn 4/10
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edit....where people are NOT trying to save their relationships


_________________________________________
M:42
H:40
S:18
M:20yrs/together 21yrs
Bomb:9/08 ILYBNILWY
Sep:9/18/08 "ow" :25
Filed:11/18/08
D:12/8/08
M:Different 26 yr. old 7/09.
Newborn 4/10
ericmsant2 #2289012 10/13/12 10:03 AM
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Originally Posted By: ericmsant2

Quote:
I guess I am not giving up 100% until she is married. Is that a bad thing? I just don't know

Then IMO, you are standing...and I admire that about you.

Maybe you just need to stand in a different place.


Me-70, D37,S36
Cadet #2289024 10/13/12 11:40 AM
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You know I think we all end up trying so hard to move on, that we don't really stop to think of the reality of LEGAL divorce compared to EMOTIONAL divorce. Those really are two whole different entities.

I think we all tend to think that because our marriage is legally no longer binding, that our emotions will just follow suit. Gee, if it were only that easy huh?

Glad you brought that up Eric.

Tad, you can still stand, move forward, and still heal and grow too.

When I knew I had abandonment issues and I read a wonderful book about abandonment, it was the domino effect in my path to healing....which I still am healing. Along the way I've discovered alot about myself, even XH as to why things turned out the way the did. And it's not anything like "well he said this, and I had to do that cause he's so horrible" sort of thing. I started to see our personal internal issues that resided in both of us that would surface, would make us act and the other to react. Geez you keep that crap up for years and there ya go!

Digging deep takes time Tad, so press forward, but be patient with yourself.


M=42 XH=44
M=18 T=21
D14 D11
Divorced 4/2012
XH marries OW 6/2014.
Kimmerz #2289027 10/13/12 12:03 PM
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Hey Tad...


I'm not around here much anymore. Mostly because I am in such a different place in my life that I was 5 years ago.

Yea, I just had the 5 year anny of my bomb date. No flowers, no texts, and believe it or not, I didn't even realize it until the day was almost complete. It would have went un-noticed, except that it falls on a very good friend's Birthday. It is unfortunate that it does, and now, his birthday takes priority on that day. I also view it as my Birthday in some ways. The day that I was given the chance to go through this incredible opportunity.

I haven't read much from you recently, just what you have on this thread. And I can tell you, that although you are stuck...it is a good thing for now.

What you describe is exactly where I expected you to be. And to be honest ?

To pass on something that my good friend Bworl told me.....If you weren't having these thoughts, then I would be concerned about you.

From what I see, you are still dealing with Fear. And although you may say that you aren't, I can tell you that you really need to be honest with yourself about it in order to move past this place.

It is a fear of success. You are afraid of moving too far ahead of her. Afraid of becoming too self-dependent, afraid of becoming too independent of her, or the relationship as you both used to have. You are afraid that she won't be able to find you if she changes her mind.

It is a real fear, and one that isn't easy to put behind you. Unlike the fear of falling, or the fear of Eric dressing up in his Tutu and dancing around in your kitchen......This fear is one that you cannot predict, nor should you. It is one that you have to live...everyday. And If you fail ? There is no way to know that, or determine if you have overcome it or not. It is a part of just living your life for you. It is waking up every morning, and making the choice to have the best day ever. And you accept what comes your way, in a positive way.

You have taken you time through this, and you really have become a different Father than you were in the past. And from what I read from you, you have really embraced that role. Is there any chance that you have hidden inside of that role ? You let it consume you to the point that your new role as a Father, consumed Tad the way that the role of a Husband consumed you ?


Anything is possible......right ?

I think it is the reason that you have a hard time posting anything about who Tad is, without all of the drama of your ex-wife behind it.

Tad, it's okay to miss her, it's okay to still have love for her, it's okay to cherish the memories that you have with her. It's okay to look around you, and think of how things could have been different.

What keeps you stuck, is that you expect that to happen.....

And when you expect that to happen, and it doesn't, then you wonder if all that you have been through, was worth it. You start to wonder if she really is or was MLC. And you start to wonder, that if she is MLC, then why isn't she moving through this.......These thoughts are dangerous for you. What if she isn't MLC Tad ?

What then ?

Does it change anything about the person that you are now ?

Does it change you in any way ?

Does it in-validate the work that you have done on yourself ?

Does it take away the relationship that you have with your boys ?





It comes down to a few questions that I'm not sure that you have the answer to.

What do you want ?

What are you willing to give to get it ?

Have you reached the point, where you are selling yourself for the outcome ???

And if you are.....is that acceptable to you ?





You say that you aren't good with words...that is an excuse if you ask me....

You have no problems typing endless rubble about her.....


So I will repeat the text from the other night.....

K I S S

Keep It Simple Stupid





Keep it simple....

Mach1 #2289096 10/13/12 06:39 PM
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Mach, that was such an insightful post. I agree with you. I have almost gone through the fear, and I've been at this for ages. Much longer than Tad.

What Mach says, Tad .... keep it simple, but also take it slowly. There's no rush to figure everything out in one day.


Me:57 H:52 M:28 Got another lawyer last year and filed.
D35,S/D twins28,D22
EA4/04 End? Who knows?
"Life is like a mirror. Smile at it and it smiles back at you." — Peace Pilgrim
BeingMe #2289153 10/13/12 11:18 PM
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Great post Mr. Mach...or should I say "MAC DADDY"..LOL...ROTFLMAO.

Tad, I wanted to check in on and you to see if you posted a response to the 10 questions.

I hope you are having a good weekend dude.

Eric


"The difficulties of Life are intended to make us BETTER,not bitter".
"Fear is a prison, where you are the jailer. FREE YOURSELF!"
"Life is usually all about how you handle Plan B." - Jack3Beans
ericmsant2 #2289638 10/15/12 08:12 PM
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Thanks everyone. I had a decent weekend. Just spent it at home with the boys and watched my Cardinals lose.

Eric, ten things I am grateful for or ten things that make me happy? Not coming up with much my friend.

Update:

Saturday I checked the mail. I had 6 pieces of mail in my mailbox. 5 of them were for XW. It seems like that has been happening a lot lately. She gets more mail here lately than I do. Weird thing is, it isn't even her old address. I have moved....

Sunday when I was getting ready to watch football, S17 gets a phone call from XW. Turns out, XW was parked in my driveway and wanted to know if the boys wanted to go to lunch. S17 and S20 went. That is fine, but WTF? I'm sure she wouldn't like it if I showed up to her place unannounced....

S17 said she asked a lot of questions and wanted to know where I was. Whatever.

That is all for now I guess. Thanks for all of the input. Not avoiding questions Eric. I just haven't come up with much.

Note to Antonia, I started writing a book about a year before XW went nuts. Believe it or not, it is about a man that loses everything in a divorce. I have started working on it again and it is almost finished. It's a little weird, but I would like to get it published. Can you point me in the right direction? I don't have much money.

Tad


Currently:
M 56 XW 57
Sons 38,33,31,29

The Sitch:
Married 26 years
EA w/ OM 9/10
Bomb 10/10 (5 weeks after 25th anniversary)
Sep 12/10
She wants D 1/11
W files 5/11
D final 10/11
XW marries OM 6/13
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Tad,
I'm glad to see that you are back to writing. I do hope that you are able to get the book published.

When I was receiving mail for my xh, I would write his new address on it and stick it back in the box. Eventually he did a change of address.

Tad, she's not thinking about how you feel when she pulls into your driveway. Just let it go...her brain is mush.

I'm glad you spent time at home with your sons. Sorry about the Cardinals.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
job #2289673 10/15/12 09:03 PM
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Tad

Quote:
Eric, ten things I am grateful for or ten things that make me happy?


My answer....
Quote:
I mean really…can you write down 10 things that make you happy.


Quote:
coming up with much my friend.

Try harder!

Quote:
Not avoiding questions Eric.

I didn't see you answer Mach's either....

As for the mail, I still get junk mailed addressed to my xw and I too moved. I throw it in the mail.

Quote:
Tad, she's not thinking about how you feel when she pulls into your driveway.

SHe is probably not Tad but it doesn't mean you can't think about her ...just that you also need to think about TAD.

Oh..one last thing...

Answers please.

Eric


"The difficulties of Life are intended to make us BETTER,not bitter".
"Fear is a prison, where you are the jailer. FREE YOURSELF!"
"Life is usually all about how you handle Plan B." - Jack3Beans
ericmsant2 #2289677 10/15/12 09:07 PM
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LOL. Hey Tad, my ex still gets more mail at my house than I do. Know what? It's mostly junk and I stopped forwarding, telling her, etc years ago. I just throw it away if it's obvious junk mail. She's been gone a long time and has had ample time to change the address.

Tad, glad to hear you are writing again.

How about writing those ten things? smile

I wonder Tad. When you write do you get into the character a lot? Curious..

AJ


"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter" MLK
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"Yesterday I was clever so I wanted to change the world
Today I am wise, so I am changing myself."
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It wasn't my intent to high jack someone's thread.

I was just saying what this place seemed like to me.

I wasn't trying to offend anyone.

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Ohhh and it wasn't my intent to be snide. For that I apologize.

AJM #2289766 10/16/12 02:14 AM
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Hey Tad!

You've encouraged me to hear that you've written a book and wish to get it published!

I took want to write a book someday, but what about, Im not sure. Many things I'd like to put on paper.

Keep up the good work Tad!


M=42 XH=44
M=18 T=21
D14 D11
Divorced 4/2012
XH marries OW 6/2014.
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Hey Tad, regarding the ex's mail, when a letter arrivied here, the last one of hers in fact to come here from her bank the Halifax bank 2006. Delboy opened it cause I thought it would be interesting and it was. It was a returned rubber cheque(check)£79.00 from her fiance. I tried my best and put it in another envelope and got it stamped like from the bank. But perhaps she knew that I had seen it, so after her being away from our house for more than 2 1/2 years she finally changed her address.

Love
Delboy

Delboy #2289852 10/16/12 01:07 PM
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Tad,
Sorry for the hi-jack...Just a quick shout out to Delboy! How are you and your family doing?


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
job #2289854 10/16/12 01:20 PM
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Hi Snodderly, thanks for asking about me and my family, my daughters are doing very well indeed. Regarding myself and other events I will have to start a thread of my own. Oh she finally spoke to me for the first time in just over 6 years, she said 'Thank you' cause me and youngest D had fixed other mans lawn mower, I spent over 2 1/2 hours on it, but youngest d would only charge them the price of the parts and d said dad has done most of the work on it. I kept my van engine running when we dropped it off but she was in the garden and she came out to the back of the van, doors open when she said it.

love Delboy

Delboy #2289855 10/16/12 01:24 PM
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Delboy,
Definitely start a thread! We've missed you!


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
job #2289888 10/16/12 02:44 PM
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Originally Posted By: Eric
I didn't see you answer Mach's either....


It's okay Eric, I'm used to Tad ignoring me....


Originally Posted By: Tad
Eric, ten things I am grateful for or ten things that make me happy? Not coming up with much my friend.


I can think of the first four....

Originally Posted By: Tad
Sons: 26,21,19,17



???



BeingMe...

Go easy on yourself as well...it takes time

Mach1 #2289932 10/16/12 04:22 PM
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NSWTD,

if you stick around you'll get used to me.

I didn't really think you were being snide, and that is why I put the ; ) behind it.

When I say something that could potentially be taken the wrong way? I put a : ) to soften it.

And I wasn't suggestioning hijacking Tad's thread but to create you own.

When a person first comes here all they want is the 'good' stuff. They don't want to hear about the people who are doing amazingly awesome but not married. And it gets sort of depressing not seeing that all over the place...

I just ask you give it your best shot at being married and growing.



Experience is a brutal teacher, but you learn. My God, do you learn. - C.S. Lewis

Life is usually all about how you handle Plan B. - Jack3Beans

Listen without defending; Speak without offending - FaithinAK

TRUST THE PROCESS - Cadet

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Tad, unfortunately I don't have any experience publishing novels/fiction. I only know about non-fiction/academic publishing and proposals.

I know a lot of people are doing self-publishing via amazon. I don't know what the cost is or if there is no cost or what--but I guess I'd start looking there.

There are many "vanity" presses--those are other places that will let you publish if you pay the fees--but they can range a lot in pricing. That avenue wouldn't be acceptable in my field so I never pursued it, so I don't know the costs involved.

I have a friend who has tried unsuccessfully for years to get a novel published. What he's done is to just try to send it to publishers or try to find a literary agent. He gets rejected over and over. I think the reason is that he has no resume at all. I've suggested to him that he start "small" and contribute some short pieces to regional literary journals to build a resume of sorts, but he just keeps going for the whole novel, and I think it's very rare that someone writes a novel and some big company picks it up.

Your best bet is probably self-publishing at a cost or trying for some short story publications in small literary journals.


M45
Bomb 6/09; EA 6/10; Divorced 1/11
Proud single mom of 7 little feline girls and one little feline boy
"Fall down 53 times. Get up 54." -- Zen saying
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Hi Tad,

I have an old fiend who self-published on Amazon Kindle several of his books for 99 cents. He got picked up a few months ago by a publishing house for his genre for his latest effort (which is really good, I have the original Kindle version before the houses editors had him change somethings...).

I am thinking the same path if/when I decide to publish.

This sounds like a perfect GAL for you, man... MAKE THIS HAPPEN!!!

smile

T^2


In the depths of winter, I finally learned that within me there lay an invincible summer. - Albert Camus

Uncertainty is the very condition which impels people to unfold their powers.-Eric Fromm

job #2290207 10/17/12 01:42 PM
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Quote:
How about writing those ten things?


"The difficulties of Life are intended to make us BETTER,not bitter".
"Fear is a prison, where you are the jailer. FREE YOURSELF!"
"Life is usually all about how you handle Plan B." - Jack3Beans
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I will seek assistance elsewhere

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Hope all works out well for you and yours NSWTD.



Experience is a brutal teacher, but you learn. My God, do you learn. - C.S. Lewis

Life is usually all about how you handle Plan B. - Jack3Beans

Listen without defending; Speak without offending - FaithinAK

TRUST THE PROCESS - Cadet

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Thanks everyone. T2, I was actually thinking about going the Kindle route. It might be my best bet for now.

Eric, Mach, J3B, AJ, everyone else....not ignoring. I just haven't been on here the last few days. I will try to answer:

Quote:
It comes down to a few questions that I'm not sure that you have the answer to.

What do you want ?

What are you willing to give to get it ?

Have you reached the point, where you are selling yourself for the outcome ???

And if you are.....is that acceptable to you ?


I want to be happy. Plain and simple. I am not happy (or as happy as I could be) right now. I am still working through the depression. Doctor says it seems to be getting better, but I still have a way to go. To be honest, I want my life back. Whether that happens or not is yet to be seen. No, I'm not expecting it, but it sure would be nice.

What am I willing to give to be happy? Anything that I have to I guess. What exactly do you mean by "selling yourself?"

Eric, you told me to list 10 things that make me happy or that I like. They may be cheesy, but here you go:

01 My sons
02 Gardening
03 Astronomy
04 Bowling
05 Watching football
06 Writing
07 The Ocean (Don't ask why I live in Arizona)
08 Fishing
09 The mountains
10 Rain

Told you it was cheesy.

To those who responded to my standing comment:

Thank you. I'm not sure if standing is the right word though. I have accepted the fact that she is getting married, but......I am not giving up. In my mind and heart there is always a chance until she says "I do." As of now, I'm laying low and taking things as they come. I figure I've got 8-9 months and the clock is ticking....

Tad


Currently:
M 56 XW 57
Sons 38,33,31,29

The Sitch:
Married 26 years
EA w/ OM 9/10
Bomb 10/10 (5 weeks after 25th anniversary)
Sep 12/10
She wants D 1/11
W files 5/11
D final 10/11
XW marries OM 6/13
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no, you don't

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Tad,

I think what stands out to me is your statement "I want my life back"

There is no question as to whether or not that will happen. It WILL NOT. I'm not saying things won't drastically change and she won't come running back. I'm saying that even if she did, THINGS HAVE CHANGED. YOU have changed. SHE has changed. The ONLY thing you know for sure is that whatever your future holds, it will be different than the past. To hold onto hope that that's NOT the case is making you stuck. If you want an idea of what it's like to be fortunate enough to have your spouse come back, look at my case.

First of all, they never come running back. They peek out, drag their feet, run away a lot etc. It's not fun. But even having my H back, the R is totally different. This is a new R. He's still battling depression, the OW lives nearby and still ends up popping into the picture every few months for various reasons meaning *I* have to be strong enough to believe that I can trust my H. But the biggest thing is that *I* continue to live on, much like I did when he wasn't around. My H still has very very bad days. Yesterday, he slept in late, didn't say much when he arose. Complained of not feeling well. Then took another nap. Then awoke and took a long shower in the dark (something he does when he's battling anxiety). Then took a long car drive (to calm down). Then came home and went back to bed. We had an event planned in the evening. To be polite, I woke him to tell him I was leaving and he said OK. I never asked if he was coming. I left it up to him to either get up or not. And I never got upset that our plans were changing due to him being in the fetal position all day. I got plenty of my stuff done during the day and enjoyed my evening without him. This is totally NOT what my life was life before the bomb. And to be fair, yesterday was a very bad day. We have many more good days than bad.

To make a long rambling story short. As you KNOW, you are still stuck. Your actions are NOT something that would be attractive to an MLCer. You are NOT moving forward. You are not leaving her behind. You're still essentially still pacing around hoping she throws you a bone. Take a minute and read what my H wrote to a friend of his in my thread. It'll give you some insight into the mind of an MLCer. They do NOT want a puppy waiting for them. Puppies are whiny, annoying and poop a lot. They want the lone wolf who can be perfectly content moving on WITHOUT them but also perfectly happy being part of a pack.


"Love me when I least deserve it, for that is when I need it the most"

M18
Me39,H42
D16
Bomb 1/10
Moved out 3/10
OW 6/10
H wants to R,OW gone 11/10
H moves back 5/11
H wants to wear rings again 9/11
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Tad

Quote:
I am not happy (or as happy as I could be) right now.

Maybe because you are NOT doing all of the things that you listed below.
Quote:
01 My sons
02 Gardening
03 Astronomy
04 Bowling
05 Watching football
06 Writing
07 The Ocean (Don't ask why I live in Arizona)
08 Fishing
09 The mountains
10 Rain


Quote:
Told you it was cheesy

Tad….First I don’t think they are cheesy at all. Second, I hope and pray that there comes a time when you really would not give a hoot if I think they are cheesy or not…because they make YOU happy.

So, are you gardening more? Are you planning fishing trips? Do you take hikes in the mountains? Do you read up on Astronomy? Do you follow horoscopes? What are you doing to try and do these things that YOU determined make you happy. Oh…and if you tell me funds are tight…here are a couple of suggestions. Go to a local river, stream or pond…and go fishing. Hikes tend to be free. Google Hicking in Arizona and see what comes up. Bowling cost money but a lot of times I see Groupon or living social deals. If need be, take 5 bucks a week and put it away so that maybe once a month or once every other month you can go bowling.

Quote:
I figure I've got 8-9 months and the clock is ticking

8 or 9 months of waiting and hoping OR

8 or 9 months living and hoping for the best?

There is a difference.


Alb – [b]NICE to SEE YOU[/b}

Quote:
I think what stands out to me is your statement "I want my life back"

I saw the same thing!

Tad, please read Alb’s post several times. I am not telling you to NOT wait for her, to not stand or whatever you want to call it…I am suggesting that you stop and finally focus on YOUR happiness. If you have read any of the DB books….they talk about “doing what works”…”about becoming an attractive option”…”about not going down cheesless tunnels”…..

Focus on your happiness Tad for YOU finally. YOU have given her everything you had…now give YOURSELF something….Happiness Tad…Cause she just may wake up and realize what she is missing.

Eric


"The difficulties of Life are intended to make us BETTER,not bitter".
"Fear is a prison, where you are the jailer. FREE YOURSELF!"
"Life is usually all about how you handle Plan B." - Jack3Beans
ericmsant2 #2291439 10/20/12 07:58 PM
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Tad,

All those items you listed are nouns. It might help you to ATTACH a verb to each item and make a project. Here are 9 for your 9 months. Plant a garden, visit a planetarium, hike up a mountain, draft an article, take your sons to a bowling alley, swim in the ocean, buy tickets to a football game, go fishing, sing in the rain.

Start with one item a month with the steps Eric gave you.



MissAgnes #2292145 10/23/12 06:14 AM
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Thanks Albuquerque, Eric and Miss.

Alb, it was nice to hear from you again. As you can see, I am still stuck to an extent. I'm moving as fast as I can I guess.

Eric and Miss, I plan to start doing some of them soon. It is a little difficult though without a car.

I flew to Portland over the weekend to visit a friend. When XW found out, she insisted to S17 that I actually went to Denver. WTF? Why does she care? I don't know ANYONE in Denver.

I was kind of down this evening and decided to come here.....

Tad


Currently:
M 56 XW 57
Sons 38,33,31,29

The Sitch:
Married 26 years
EA w/ OM 9/10
Bomb 10/10 (5 weeks after 25th anniversary)
Sep 12/10
She wants D 1/11
W files 5/11
D final 10/11
XW marries OM 6/13
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Hi all. Today is my birthday and I'm a little down, but I do plan to have a good day. It was two years ago (yes, on my birthday) thst I found out that W was still talking to OM. It was the first year that she didn't wish me a happy birthday.

I plan to have a good day though. S17's birthday is Sunday. his GF is coming over tonight to make a double birthday dinner.

There really isn't much more to report on my end.

Tad


Currently:
M 56 XW 57
Sons 38,33,31,29

The Sitch:
Married 26 years
EA w/ OM 9/10
Bomb 10/10 (5 weeks after 25th anniversary)
Sep 12/10
She wants D 1/11
W files 5/11
D final 10/11
XW marries OM 6/13
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Oops....I meant S19.


Currently:
M 56 XW 57
Sons 38,33,31,29

The Sitch:
Married 26 years
EA w/ OM 9/10
Bomb 10/10 (5 weeks after 25th anniversary)
Sep 12/10
She wants D 1/11
W files 5/11
D final 10/11
XW marries OM 6/13
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Happy Birthday! I hope that you have a great day and can enjoy the time you spend w/your son and his GF.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
job #2293064 10/25/12 07:32 PM
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Happy Birthday, T.

I think today should be the day that you start to change your mindset. And set about trying to change the memory associated with it.

I am sure that you have birthdays that you can remember with fondness. And each year can be a new beginning.

It is all in how we choose to look at it.

So try to look at it differently, T.

You get to spend a lovely dinner with your children. You get to make a wish and eat cake. You get to think about what you want the next year to look like.

It's all in the mindset. Change yours. Starting today.

Have a great day!

uRworthy #2293084 10/25/12 07:51 PM
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Happy Birthday, Tad!

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Happy birthday, Tad. And to your S19 on Sunday. Have some laughs, eat lots of cake, then begin your personal new year with a positive mental attitude. If you don't have sad things that happen to you, you're not going to know what the good stuff is. Just don't let yourself stay down too long.


Me:57 H:52 M:28 Got another lawyer last year and filed.
D35,S/D twins28,D22
EA4/04 End? Who knows?
"Life is like a mirror. Smile at it and it smiles back at you." — Peace Pilgrim
BeingMe #2293378 10/26/12 05:32 PM
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Thanks for the birthday wishes. It was a decent day. I did seem to miss XW a little more for some reason. I know that I am not supposed to ask questions, but I'm going to ask anyways:

According to things that I have read, when the MLCer "reconnects" with children, couldn't that just be them trying to "normalize" things? XW seems to be trying to reconnect with them, but couldn't it just be her settling down a bit?

Tad


Currently:
M 56 XW 57
Sons 38,33,31,29

The Sitch:
Married 26 years
EA w/ OM 9/10
Bomb 10/10 (5 weeks after 25th anniversary)
Sep 12/10
She wants D 1/11
W files 5/11
D final 10/11
XW marries OM 6/13
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Originally Posted By: tadpole1025
According to things that I have read, when the MLCer "reconnects" with children, couldn't that just be them trying to "normalize" things? XW seems to be trying to reconnect with them, but couldn't it just be her settling down a bit?

Sigh ....


Everybody hurts. It's part of life. Don't miss the good stuff.
Drew #2293486 10/26/12 08:57 PM
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Drew,
Have you read the thread on reconnection? If not, here's the link. It might help explain why they reconnect w/the children first.

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...e=69#Post190969


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
job #2293496 10/26/12 09:18 PM
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Snodderly,

It's not the concept of reconnection that led to the heavy sigh.

It's my continued perception that Tad just can't let go.

So he remains stuck.


Everybody hurts. It's part of life. Don't miss the good stuff.
Drew #2293500 10/26/12 09:25 PM
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I understand. He's just not ready to let her go and allow God to work on her completely. Someday, he will...


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
job #2293504 10/26/12 09:32 PM
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I just wish Tad would realize:

It's really all up to him.


Everybody hurts. It's part of life. Don't miss the good stuff.
Drew #2293507 10/26/12 09:38 PM
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Drew,
Yes, it is all up to Tad to decide when he is ready to let her go.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
Drew #2293509 10/26/12 09:39 PM
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I understand Drew. I just had to ask. Just curious is all because I've noticed a big difference in her in the last month or so.

She or someone has also been checking out my FB lately (after blocking me) because she somehow knows stuff that can only be known from there. She's either checking it out or is finding things out from someone else.

Yes, it is hard for me to completely let go. I loved her more than anything. I'm sure it is harder for some than others but still difficult for all.

Tad


Currently:
M 56 XW 57
Sons 38,33,31,29

The Sitch:
Married 26 years
EA w/ OM 9/10
Bomb 10/10 (5 weeks after 25th anniversary)
Sep 12/10
She wants D 1/11
W files 5/11
D final 10/11
XW marries OM 6/13
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It's more difficult to let go when there are children involved, even if they are almost grown. Also, when an mlcer is a droplet or a drop-in, they tend to be around more so and it's difficult for the wound to even begin to scab over and begin the healing process.

Tad, it is very hard and difficult for everyone. However, the grieving process timeline is different for each and every person.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
job #2293637 10/27/12 11:38 AM
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Oh yes when kids are involved, it's like the wound never truly heals. I feel this every time I have to interact with XH. At times I wonder if he's suffered as much as I have and puts on a brave face at the same time like me.


M=42 XH=44
M=18 T=21
D14 D11
Divorced 4/2012
XH marries OW 6/2014.
Kimmerz #2293644 10/27/12 12:27 PM
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I believe the MLCer is oblivious to the damage and suffering that occurs to the LBS and children in the beginning of their journey. They are much to focused on themselves.

As the LBS gains strength and confidence and starts managing their lives regardless of what the MLCer thinks or is even aware of is what sometimes draws the MLCer to at least look back and maybe even question the choices and decisions they've made.

It seems to be as the LBS stabilizes, the shoe of pain and suffering eventually switches to the foot of the MLCer.

It takes a long time for the MLCer to move in any direction if at all. During that time what is generally seen are just peeks from out of the tunnel.

I realize this isn't what all MLCer's do, just what I've observed in H 3 years from BD and from what I've heard and read from other LBS sitches.

Tad, you can hold on to your hope as long as you decide to. The trick is to not let it interfere with moving forward. I can tell you that knowing someone is still stuck and wallowing in their misery is not attractive. Making the best of the situation you're handed is. Thriving and not just surviving is key.

I am still standing after 3 years. One thing I'm not doing is letting the sitch keep me from moving forward. That way I'm prepared for any direction.

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Babbling....

Pretty emotional night tonight.

I realized something about myself. I'm either not as far along as I thought or I took a step back.

XW came today and picked up S19 to take him to lunch for his birthday. He turns 20 tomorrow. When they returned, S19 told me that "she talked about you a lot." He said she would just pop me into conversation. He said she asked how I was doing and if I was still seeing my lady friend. I am not by the way. He said that she talked about me just as much as OM and her wedding. He also said that she admitted to hardly ever talking about herself to other people. S19 said he got the feeling that it was because she was ashamed. She told him that she was going to send me a "happy birthday text" on Thursday, but decided against it because she didn't want to ruin my day. S19 told her that it could have had a double effect where it made my day worse but also made it better. She agreed. Why in the Hell would she want to say happy birthday to me? She didn't want to or do so last year or the year before.

She also told him that she cares about me a lot. Well maybe, but I don't believe you do what she did to someone you care about. But.....if she doesn't care, she shouldn't want to be my friend. See the confusion? I think I may be just as messed up as the MLCer.

The emotional part for me:

She told him again that she wants to be my friend. I don't get this. Why?????????? She has spent the last 2 years believing that I am the devil. I just don't understand how she would want to be a friend even with OM in the picture. Damn. If I "hurt her to the core", why would she want to be my friend? I've asked these questions a hundred times and still don't understand. She told him that it is normal for people in our situation to be friends. I'm sorry but I probably know about 20 divorced couples and only two of them are "friendly." Not "friends" but "friendly."

Now the tough part:

I'm not sure that I can be her friend without it causing me to have some sort of hope. I just don't think it is possible. Plus, to me, being her friend tells her that what she did is ok. However, if I do decide to stand for my marriage and hope to reconcile, that isn't even possible without a friendship. I just don't know what to do.

I asked S19 if he wanted us to be friends and he said "I want you guys back together." Well, that isn't happening unless I do decide to be her friend. I really don't know what I want. I think I could forgive her in time, but not sure if I can be a friend without having some sort of hope.

I just don't know.

I guess the question isn't "can I be her friend" but "do I want my marriage restored." I just don't understand the "friends" thing with the MLCer.

I'm just at a loss right now. Not only do I have to decide if I want to be her friend, but I need to make a decision before she gets married next Summer. I feel like I am wearing a watch that says:

08 Months 00 Days 00 Hours 00 Minutes 00 Seconds

It is like a bomb just waiting for all of the columns to go to 00. It's ticking and there is no stopping it. Every day it gets closer and closer.

Sorry for rambling. I'm just trying to be honest with my feelings. I like to write this stuff down. It helps in a way.

Can anyone explain the friends thing in any more detail?

Looks like I have much more thinking to do.

Tad


Currently:
M 56 XW 57
Sons 38,33,31,29

The Sitch:
Married 26 years
EA w/ OM 9/10
Bomb 10/10 (5 weeks after 25th anniversary)
Sep 12/10
She wants D 1/11
W files 5/11
D final 10/11
XW marries OM 6/13
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P.S....

People that are friends

Call each other

Text

Share things

Go to lunch

Hang out

Confide in each other


People that are friendly

Say hello.


Tad


Currently:
M 56 XW 57
Sons 38,33,31,29

The Sitch:
Married 26 years
EA w/ OM 9/10
Bomb 10/10 (5 weeks after 25th anniversary)
Sep 12/10
She wants D 1/11
W files 5/11
D final 10/11
XW marries OM 6/13
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Tad,

This is one I struggle with too. If my H and I were friends how come he brought OW1 into my house and screwed her when I was visiting my dear friend who'd just been diagnosed with cancer? I doubt there's a "friend" in the world who'd do that. Yet he insists we should try it. He says it makes life easier. For whom?

Intellectually as a concept it seems like it's a cool thing to do. In reality, some days I manage it, some days I don't. Mostly I am civil. Friends, no, not really. My friends would not open me up and eviscerate me like he did. However we have no kids. Maybe that changes things. Yet, we work together, so see each most weekdays.

So in a very convoluted way I am saying, who knows if its doable! X

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Hi Tad, I’ll share something with ya. I do know where you are coming from, it took me about 2 years to finally let go of my Ex W. Some of these MLC’ers are so really screwed up it’s unbelievable what they do.

So regarding myself and my Ex W. I kept praying to God for answers, I believe he told me the following: Let her go, any future relationship(s) you enter needs to be with someone (emotionly) mature for it to prosper.

God bless you

Love

Delboy

Delboy #2294047 10/29/12 10:01 AM
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Dellboy, I hope you don't mind me asking but how exactly did god tell you this? I'm not being "smart" or anything like that. I've seen similar things in OP's posts here and wonder,.., how?

Sorry to hijack your thread Tad, Just very curious about this.


M: 29, H: 31
D: 9
S: 8
T: 13 Y
M: 9 Y
ILYBIDKIILWY 12/09/2012
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Worrying does not empty tomorrow
of its troubles. ~~~ it Emptys today of its strengths
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Hi Lisa.7, It takes a lot of prayers and bible study to find out in one's heart of hearts (what to do). As time went on, I learned about discernment and so with the help of God (through prayer time) and the discernment I now had, I woke up one morning and it became very clear to me want I needed to do, and what I needed in any future relationships.

God bless you
Love
Delboy

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Hi Tad, A lot of the MLCers say they just want to be friends. But most of them just keep on twisting the knife!
Here’s a song for you.

Love
Delboy

‘Can We Still Be Friends’

Songwriter; Todd Rundgren

(For me, the best version is sung by Rod Stewart: Note the lyrics towards the end have been altered and added to, probably by Rod Stewart to suit his situation when he recorded his version in early 1984).

We can't play this game anymore
But can we still be friends?
Things just can't go on like before
But can we still be friends?
We had something to learn
Now it's time for the wheel to turn
Grains of sand, one by one
Before you know, it’s all gone

Lets admit we made a mistake
But can we still be friends?
Heartbreak's never easy to take
But can we still be friends?
It's a strange, sad affair
Sometimes seems like we just don't care
Don't waste time feeling hurt
We've been through hell together

Where do we go?
Where do we go from here?

We can’t play this game anymore
But can we still be friends?
Things just can’t go on like before
But can we still be friends?

We awoke from our dream
Things are not what they always seem
Memories linger on
It's like a sweet, sad, old song

Where do we go?
Where do we go from here?
Where do we go from here?

I can’t play this game anymore
Can we still be friends?
Things just can’t go on like before
But I just wanna be friends
I just wanna be, wanna be, wanna be
And now I just wanna be friends

Yes, something I’ve learned
Something I’ve learned
Now can we still be friends?

Let’s admit our mistakes
Hmm, now

Delboy #2294191 10/29/12 06:03 PM
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Hi Delboy. Are you friends with her though? How is that going?

Tad


Currently:
M 56 XW 57
Sons 38,33,31,29

The Sitch:
Married 26 years
EA w/ OM 9/10
Bomb 10/10 (5 weeks after 25th anniversary)
Sep 12/10
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W files 5/11
D final 10/11
XW marries OM 6/13
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I think your distinction between "being friends" vs. "being friendly" gives you a guideline.

If you are in any way, shape, or form thinking that "being friends" is the way to "get her back", I'd say to walk away from that line of thinking. Because then what you're doing is a tactic. It's a method of trying to control the situation to your advantage. And it very likely will not work.

(Notice how the more you've pulled away and not allowed her to hurt you so much she is suddenly playing the I want to be friends card? That's because she's losing her punching bag and wants it back. I don't think for a minute she genuinely wants to be friends. She gets off on hurting you; she's shown that a billion times).

You've also already said you can't go this route without opening up to all that hope again. You already know what hope gets you. It makes you focus to an absurd degree on every single little nuance of her moves/words. It gets the focus on her and not on you. You struggle enough with keeping the focus on you.

I think you have your answer here, plain as day. The only way to take care of yourself first and foremost is to focus on you, and to do that, the most you are capable of right now is being "friendly." Treat her like she's a business associate only.

I'm 3 months away from the initial bomb and I had a 6 month relationship with someone that was very meaningful that is now over, and I'm single again. I'm probaby the happiest with me I've ever been right now and the most "over" things I've ever been.

I no longer want my XH back at all. I am a different person and I don't find myself attracted to the person he has become. We really have very little in common other than a shared history.

As a result, I contacted him a few days ago. I've not spoken to him in a year. I contacted him to catch up. He's responded and we have had a civil, friendly conversation. I think this is good. But I have zero hope or wish to reconcile with him as a mate, and honestly, there is a part of me, a very small part, that thinks I might be able to be friends with him again some day, but I still recognize that it opens up a lot of possibilities for hurt, and to what end? I've got tons of friends who haven't betrayed me and treated me like dirt. So even for me, and I consider myself more "over" my ex than you seem to be, I'm still sticking with being friendly only.

I think you open a HUGE can of worms if you attempt a friendship at this stage.

Let her get married. Let her crash and burn.


M45
Bomb 6/09; EA 6/10; Divorced 1/11
Proud single mom of 7 little feline girls and one little feline boy
"Fall down 53 times. Get up 54." -- Zen saying
AntoniaB #2294270 10/29/12 10:17 PM
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3 years, lol, not 3 months!


M45
Bomb 6/09; EA 6/10; Divorced 1/11
Proud single mom of 7 little feline girls and one little feline boy
"Fall down 53 times. Get up 54." -- Zen saying
Delboy #2294278 10/29/12 10:32 PM
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Originally Posted By: Delboy
Hi Lisa.7, It takes a lot of prayers and bible study to find out in one's heart of hearts (what to do). As time went on, I learned about discernment and so with the help of God (through prayer time) and the discernment I now had, I woke up one morning and it became very clear to me want I needed to do, and what I needed in any future relationships.

God bless you
Love
Delboy



Hmmm, interesting. Thanks for answering.


M: 29, H: 31
D: 9
S: 8
T: 13 Y
M: 9 Y
ILYBIDKIILWY 12/09/2012
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Quote:
(Notice how the more you've pulled away and not allowed her to hurt you so much she is suddenly playing the I want to be friends card? That's because she's losing her punching bag and wants it back. I don't think for a minute she genuinely wants to be friends. She gets off on hurting you; she's shown that a billion times).


Wow Antonia. This is so very true. I've noticed a BIG difference the more I pull away. Just last night she sent home a pie with S17 and told him to make sure he cuts it so "your father" can have a piece. This boggles the sh!t out of me. She is definitely being nice. She seems to be trying really hard, but the wedding bells are getting closer.

Quote:
Treat her like she's a business associate only.


Haha! She doesn't even get that. I am completely dark. No contact at all in 5 months with the exception of replying to her text a few weeks back when she reminded me that KISS was on David Letterman. That REALLY still boggles the sh!t out of me.

Quote:
Let her get married. Let her crash and burn.


This is what scares me. If she gets married, there is not even a glimmer of hope. If there wasn't OM, I think things would be a little different....maybe A LOT different. I think I could wait for her. With a wedding happening next Summer, I feel like I have a deadline.

Tad


Currently:
M 56 XW 57
Sons 38,33,31,29

The Sitch:
Married 26 years
EA w/ OM 9/10
Bomb 10/10 (5 weeks after 25th anniversary)
Sep 12/10
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W files 5/11
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Perhaps she feels sorry for you because she does feel guilty, and now she's getting married, and you don't have someone. Note that she did ask if you were seeing someone.

Just a thought.


Me:57 H:52 M:28 Got another lawyer last year and filed.
D35,S/D twins28,D22
EA4/04 End? Who knows?
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Originally Posted By: NotSureWhatToDo
Why is this "place" called divorce busting when mostly it is divorcing / divorced and stuck / bitter and stuck?

I am read, read, reading but it just seems to me that I need to go ahead and get divorced since there is no hope...


you are not reading the pages that have the happy endings b/c a lot of folks are here IN THE TRENCHES so if you want the happy endings, go to the success stories. Or come back in a year or two and see who is out of the trenches.

Even those of us who could "leave", still post here to help those in the trenches.

But I daresay a lot of the "victorious" ones go and have happy lives so we don't post here anymore. Thus there is some "natural selection" going on that makes it look worse than it is. Most, but not all, of those who post here are NOT happy.

Not sure if that answers your question b/c I'm not sure what your point or goal really was...I guess venting?

So, try other forums here.


M: 57 H: 60
M: 35 yrs
S30,D28,D19
H off to Alaska 2006
Recon 7/07- 8/08
*2016*
X = "ALASKA 2.0"
GROUND HOG DAY
I File D 10/16
OW
DIV 2/26/2018
X marries OW 5/2016

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Originally Posted By: tadpole1025
Babbling....

Pretty emotional night tonight.

I realized something about myself. I'm either not as far along as I thought or I took a step back.

XW came today and picked up S19 to take him to lunch for his birthday. He turns 20 tomorrow. When they returned, S19 told me that "she talked about you a lot." He said she would just pop me into conversation. He said she asked how I was doing and if I was still seeing my lady friend. I am not by the way. He said that she talked about me just as much as OM and her wedding. He also said that she admitted to hardly ever talking about herself to other people. S19 said he got the feeling that it was because she was ashamed.

why do you still let your sons act as intermediaries for you? We've said many times it's NOT helping you but you let it happen b/c you want the connection or pretense of one. So be it. I do think it's unfair to your sons though.



She told him that she was going to send me a "happy birthday text" on Thursday, but decided against it because she didn't want to ruin my day. S19 told her that it could have had a double effect where it made my day worse but also made it better. She agreed. Why in the Hell would she want to say happy birthday to me? She didn't want to or do so last year or the year before.

B/c she probably didn't think you could have handled it last year. And she was right.


She also told him that she cares about me a lot. Well maybe, but I don't believe you do what she did to someone you care about.

First, it's NOT all black and white. She can care about you and NOT want to be married to you. We see that around here all the time.

We even see LBSers become WASs not b/c they are mad/punitive, but b/c they no longer see their spouse the same way. Sure they'll always care esp when it's a long marriage and there are children. That is a lot of memories together and kids you raised.

But she'd rather be married to OM. That hurts but it's not insane. She can still care about you and want a buddy friend father of her kids, but want to be married to OM.


But.....if she doesn't care, she shouldn't want to be my friend.

What? She just said she cares! She wants your sons to know she bears no ill will and isn't hating you. While I see YOUR confusion, I do not see hers.


See the confusion? I think I may be just as messed up as the MLCer.

The emotional part for me:

She told him again that she wants to be my friend. I don't get this. Why??????????

B/C it's much easier for HER! For her to have you as a "friend" is better than as an enemy. A friend who has no expectations and makes no demands.

She can stay closer to her sons & eventual grandchildren, she can show her sons how compassionate she is towards you in front of them, and not have to share them at holidays or split them with you. B/C hey, you're all friends...

Being friends with you is much more convenient (for sheer convenience it's easier on both of you but I know why you feel differently about it for emotional reasons) This desire to be friends is very common.



She has spent the last 2 years believing that I am the devil. I just don't understand how she would want to be a friend even with OM in the picture. Damn. If I "hurt her to the core", why would she want to be my friend?

B/C

B/C
1) it's easier for her and or;

2) she didn't mean it; and or;

3) she meant it then, but doesn't mean it now.


Tad, Don't make this more complicated than it is.


And by analogy - If my h had beaten me, I would not spend a whole lot of time wondering and asking WHY he beat me...& there wouldn't be endless questions "asked hundreds of times" for two years...

I'd just stay away from him, and not expose myself to being beaten again AND I'd not let my kids see me beaten ever again. And I'd move on with my life.

Do you see the relevance of that analogy?


I've asked these questions a hundred times and still don't understand.


Sooo, Tad,

how's that "asking these questions a hundred times" working for you?

Is it clearing things up? NO IT'S NOT...and

there are no "GOOD" answers to those questions. And you have heard that 100 times (and you still don't understand...)


She told him that it is normal for people in our situation to be friends. I'm sorry but I probably know about 20 divorced couples and only two of them are "friendly." Not "friends" but "friendly."

I know a lot of couples who are able to attend family events without any visible discomfort. They make the event about their children and not their pain or discomfort. They put their needs to the side to be there for the kids. (My inlaws were one example. NO ugly scenes took place and they all danced at our wedding).

Some might not call it "normal," but I think it's healthy for the kids to see us seeing our spouses with compassion, warts and all.

That is not to say you ought to suck up to her for it. Just that someday when this isn't consuming you, and it is, then maybe you'll see my point.

And yes I know a few who are actually friends. It takes time or happy remarriages that reveal in fact they were not so well suited originally.

OR it means that enough time and detachment has taken place.



Now the tough part:

I'm not sure that I can be her friend without it causing me to have some sort of hope. I just don't think it is possible.


Agreed it's not possible at this time so you tell her (do not make your sons tell her this) that. You say "No thanks. It's not possible for me to be 'friends' at this time. It might not ever be possible. Time will tell." The End. If you are clear and firm then she will understand (and respect you for it) and your sons can get that message too.



Plus, to me, being her friend tells her that what she did is ok.


that's a myth. It's a lie that many LBSers tell themselves so they can hold onto their pain and anger. NO ONE WHO KNOWS YOU, will think you're suddenly fine with OM.

The idea that an LBSer has to be angry and cold and judgemental to show that they have not forgiven, just shows that they have not forgiven!...

and they lessen the odds of reconciling with that behavior.
Til now I didn't realize you have done zero forgiveness work.

You think she's supposed to "deserve" it before you can give it. But that's another falsehood.

She doesn't have to even know you forgive her. It's not something you tell her unless she asks, (which she won't anytime soon.)

Its about you letting the wound heal over. It's about your moving forward and GAL finally...

Forgiveness does NOT = condoning behavior.

It's a gift you give yourself and as I said, she isn't really a part of it. It's about not staring at the pain inflicted, but healing and living and letting go of the anger and

NOT asking the same questions hundreds of times...
it's about being free.


However, if I do decide to stand for my marriage and hope to reconcile, that isn't even possible without a friendship. I just don't know what to do.

I asked S19 if he wanted us to be friends and he said "I want you guys back together."

Oh... cry That is the saddest, most dysfunctional thing I've read on your thread.

It's NOT their jobs to get you back together.

My mc said "never discuss recon with your kids unless it's 'VERY LIKELY' or they'll never learn to adapt to what is, and they'll see heartbreak as somethig you never heal from...so don't involve them at all until you believe it's really going to happen."

And here you have them acting on your behalf to create or facilitate it....that is an unfair tragedy to me.

I hope you'll see the damage you are doing and enabling to be done to them. So that you'll stop it from happening.

You're showing them that you cannot be happy without your w, even thoug she left you for OM and is still with him and she has publicly announced her engagement to OM.

I don't get an 'shame" factored in those choices. I think she sounds resolute and wants to move forward and wants YOU to move forward.

Please don't think that holding onto the pain proves your love. It implies that those of us who moved on sooner didn't feel the same love and that's not so.

Plus off the top of my head, I believe all of the couples who reconciled here had LBSers who GAL and changed their lives and moved forward

and then their WASs noticed and wondered and they *(WAS) knew how to reach the LBSer.

Your xw knows how to reach you. God knows She does it all the time.


Well, that isn't happening unless I do decide to be her friend. I really don't know what I want. I think I could forgive her in time,

why do you believe that?

Who said fake friends lead to reconciing?
Be realistic. You've made zero progress towards forgiveness yet. Why or how do you believe you'd ever forgive her? I'm really curious b/c I think your concept of forgiveness needs some polish for sure.


but not sure if I can be a friend without having some sort of hope.

You already said you can't. So don't until you can, if that ever happens.

I just don't know.

I guess the question isn't "can I be her friend" but "do I want my marriage restored." I just don't understand the "friends" thing with the MLCer.

what is to understand? You can't see how much easier and convenient it is for HER to say you're friends now? I do. Way less drama.


I'm just at a loss right now. Not only do I have to decide if I want to be her friend, but I need to make a decision before she gets married next Summer. I feel like I am wearing a watch that says:

08 Months 00 Days 00 Hours 00 Minutes 00 Seconds

It is like a bomb just waiting for all of the columns to go to 00. It's ticking and there is no stopping it. Every day it gets closer and closer.

Why decide anything?
Since you are alright with waiting, why stop? I mean, so what if she marries OM? Why would you ever stop waiting for her? Why ever move forward or GAL?

For that matter, why should your sons ever move forward? Why teach them to adapt when they can cling to the "hope" that all will be well someday...maybe...

maybe OM will die or leave the country, or she'll suddenly wake up and say "WTH? Where's Tad?" and THEN she'll come home and THEN everyone can pretend it didn't happen...AND THEN you can "forgive in time"...??


Sorry for rambling. I'm just trying to be honest with my feelings. I like to write this stuff down. It helps in a way.

Can anyone explain the friends thing in any more detail?

Looks like I have much more thinking to do.

Tad


I feel like I have explained this.

My fear is that the only "details" you can understand are the ones you want to hear, so if I say "it means she wants to come home and she's testing you" THEN you'll hear that.

But if I say "she does want to be friends. You have a lot of memories together and you have 3 sons and things in common..." but "She wants OM as her h. Period", you'll say "oh SHE is so confusing" b/c you don't want to hear that.

I hope you'll release your sons from their "recon" duty, soon. And that you'll free yourself too.


M: 57 H: 60
M: 35 yrs
S30,D28,D19
H off to Alaska 2006
Recon 7/07- 8/08
*2016*
X = "ALASKA 2.0"
GROUND HOG DAY
I File D 10/16
OW
DIV 2/26/2018
X marries OW 5/2016

= CLOSURE 4 ME
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Originally Posted By: tadpole1025
This is what scares me. If she gets married, there is not even a glimmer of hope.

So I don't know how to say this without it coming out harsh;

Why? At one point we all thought our marriages were forever so ....


Everybody hurts. It's part of life. Don't miss the good stuff.
Drew #2294870 10/31/12 05:53 PM
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Hey Tad. I was gone for a bit and will likely be gone from the boards for a bit, but wanted to share something that I ran across a while back.

First, she is trying to hurt/control you and has been for a very long time. You know that and you know why you are staying as dark as possible. Keep that up my man. I told you we have a lot of similarities, you and I wink

Keep in mind it's not a matter of whether or not she wants to be "friends" or feels guilty or whatever... you know by now she has to work through her own issues her own way. But you can be you regardless. It just takes time and focus, right?

I was asked a little while back to answer a question in two ways by finishing the sentence. Can you?
1) I stay attached to my ex and do NOT forgive her because...
2) I do NOT stay attached to my ex and forgive her because...

Cheers,
AJ


"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter" MLK
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Mr. Tad!!

Originally Posted By: tadpole1025
I realized something about myself. I'm either not as far along as I thought or I took a step back.


Sometimes we need to take a few steps back before we start heading forward once again. No worries, it happens.


Quote:
She told him again that she wants to be my friend. I don't get this. Why??????????


Most likely to alleviate guilt, IMO. Given what you've been through so far, would it be safe to say that whatever the reason is, her needs would be first and foremost?


Quote:
She told him that it is normal for people in our situation to be friends. I'm sorry but I probably know about 20 divorced couples and only two of them are "friendly." Not "friends" but "friendly."


Haha! She said, "normal"!! I'm kidding, sort of... smile

Trust yourself, trust in what you see. For what it's worth, you can add me to the "friendly" catagory. I'm sure it happens, but "friendly" is probably the most likely scenario.

Let's say it does happen, would this be a healthy friendship for you? Would it be a positive in your life? What do you look for in a good friend?

Quote:
I guess the question isn't "can I be her friend" but "do I want my marriage restored." I just don't understand the "friends" thing with the MLCer.


The above sounds like this friendship would have strings or conditions in a way. Also sounds like going from 0-100 in an instant.

Quote:
I'm just at a loss right now. Not only do I have to decide if I want to be her friend, but I need to make a decision before she gets married next Summer. I feel like I am wearing a watch that says:

08 Months 00 Days 00 Hours 00 Minutes 00 Seconds

It is like a bomb just waiting for all of the columns to go to 00. It's ticking and there is no stopping it. Every day it gets closer and closer.


Tad, this sounds so grim, so absolute. Remember your thoughts and perspective will always lead the way. Don't know about you, but this road seems like a bumpy one that ends with a cliff. Who's driving?? You or Mr. Fear? Plenty of other roads out there, ya know? I may be missing something, haven't been here in ages but who says you have to make a decision on this right now?

Quote:
Sorry for rambling. I'm just trying to be honest with my feelings. I like to write this stuff down. It helps in a way.


No need to be sorry. Keep doing what helps\works.

Quote:
Looks like I have much more thinking to do.


I beg to differ buddy. I think you're putting way too much thought into all of this. "THE right answer to this crazy mess doesn't exist."

How about just focusing on being your best. You can't go wrong with that. Ever. Live your life and trust that everything will fall into it's own perfect place.

True friendships grow naturally. There are no questions of how, why or should I. Strings do not exist. There is no need to plot or plan or figure them out.... They just happen.

Keep it simple. Keep living your life and if\when your paths cross be friendly. No less, no more.


Don't stand still.
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Hi Tad, You asked me about my sitch regarding contact with Ex W. When she left (26th Jan 04) we had a bit of contact, but regarding only stuff on the surface.

They don’t like to be pursued, well it got to her that we could perhaps reconcile. Feck me!! Late June 04 a letter came to me from her lawyer saying, If you do not divorce Liz by way of her adultery, and we don’t hear from you in the next 6 weeks then she will start proceedings against you, siting unreasonable behaviour on your part!

Well Feck her I thought! She was on holiday in Corfu with (OM) Nic when I received the letter. When she got back, us as a family minus eldest D (because she had an important exam at college) confronted her outside the hotel where she worked. No joy.

I didn’t respond to her lawyer, but by the end of the year another letter came on the 31st Dec 04 (happy new Fecking year!) from yet another lawyer, this time she had started to proceed on grounds of my unreasonable behaviour. Well after the decree nisi was declared Feb 05 She dropped this Lawyer, then my lawyer kept chasing Liz and it took to the 20th Nov 06 to finally be divorced and on my terms. ( I prayed to God, And I said “my life Lord” or this deal £££££, which is it to be it’s up to You ) I got a brilliant deal, which her lawyer told her not to take! Thanks be to GOD!!!

The following is the only contact between us since early July 04:

Early Nov 05, she arranged to meet me, I got ambushed I knew my then pastors would be there because Liz arranged it thru them, But Nic was there I said “Liz you come outside on your own” she did, all it was about was her having more access to youngest D, I said only if Nic’s not around her, which more or less worked out.

Late June early July 06 she walked down our garden path to speak to me, I met her on the door step, It was only later that I found out why she came, She wanted youngest D to sometimes stay with her and Nic and his son and I was not to stop it. Jan 07 one of my D’s was on the phone to Liz, when Liz said “happy birthday” to me!

Late July 2012, Me and youngest D dropped Nic’s lawn mower off (at their house) which me and youngest repaired etc, youngest D said “dad did most of the work on it” I had my van engine still running D took the mower out thru the back doors. I’m looking in the rear view mirror and hoping for a quick get away when Liz said “Thank you” to me.

So I am really well and truly detached from her.

Love
Delboy

P.S It’s still shocking for me to see her, as she now is, it’s fecking unbelievable! That’s what it is.

Delboy #2295250 11/01/12 05:56 PM
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Look, the guy I was in a relationship with for just 6 months, which ended just over a month ago, HE is bothered that I'm not seeing anyone. He immediately started seeing someone and he's "in love" apparently, and he's acting like a different person with this girl than he's ever acted in his life. I'm actually finding it kind of comical. And he is asking every other week if I'm seeing anyone yet, or if I'm still on match.com. When I said that I was "done" with online dating because it has been one bad experience after another and I'm happier alone, he acted SADDENED by that. He started saying "oh come on, you can't let it get you down, you have to get back out there! There is someone for you, I know it!!"

This guy didn't betray me. But he feels guilty because he's with someone and I'm not, and the fact is that for all his talk about independence, he's really not independent of needing a relationship. This only makes me feel MORE powerful or "together" because I'm seeing I don't need a relationship to have happy moments in life.

Your ex I'm sure has some level of guilt. If you're with someone she can tell herself that she did the right thing because you've found someone new.

I agree so much with everything 25 years is saying. I think these people DO care about us. In fact I believe my XH loves me. He "loves me but is not in love with me." And I totally get that now, because that's exactly how I feel about him. Therefore it really almost doesn't bother me anymore that he is with someone else. This is where your XW is coming from. It is entirely possible to care deeply about someone but not "choose" to be with them romantically. Just because someone pledged to love us romantically for life doesn't mean that it has to happen that way.

Simplify it this way: These people for whatever reasons woke up one day and felt differently about the way they connected with us. Maybe it was a one day thing; maybe it was a slow-growing realization. They didn't feel in love anymore. Emotionally they weren't feeling a connection.

Many of them likely hid this for a long time and went through the motions. Pretending they were happy. Why? Because how do you tell your spouse, the person you pledged to be with for life, this horrible news? So they faked it on some level. They hoped things would change for them. Things didn't change.

They got in deeper and deeper, living a double life, a life where on the surface they pretended to love us. In fact they may have even OVERDONE it a bit, saying things like "hey let's get remarried and redo our vows" (my XH did this a week before leaving me and I think I remember yours doing the same, Tad). They laid on the charm and the love and insisted, even when we asked if things were wrong, that things were GREAT. Then there came a point where for many of them, they met someone else. Someone who loved them for the persona they were OUTSIDE our lives. The person they projected they wanted to be but could not around us because we'd have said "what's wrong with you, why don't you love me anymore?" This new person made them feel GREAT about themselves. There was no guilt over the way their feelings changed, over how they were living a double life. They were this single entity with the OW/OM. And that OW/OM probably worshipped the ground they walked on.

Eventually they made a choice. Go off with the OW/OM because that was "easier" than trying to repair things with us, because they felt "in love" with that person, that was a sure thing, where repairing things with us when they were already distracted by someone else was just an impossible task for them.

And this is when the bomb hit us. Out of nowhere.

So it seemed to us at the time like we had to keep asking why. Or how. How could they be one person one day and another the next? How could they just keep on treating us this way after they left, toying with our emotions?

Well the answers are all there, in all the behavior that is the same among all our exes. They fell out of love with us (and for MLCers this is often more about their own inadequacies unfulfilled than relationship problems, but they buried or hid relationship problems as well), they panicked, they hid their true feelings, they became ashamed of their feelings, they found someone else to confide in who very presence would not trigger that shame in them, they realized this new person could ONLY make them feel good about themselves and never bad, and they chose the path of least resistance:

They chose to cultivate that "in love" feeling with someone else rather than face us and themselves.

And in the end, they aren't in love with us at this time.

That's all there is to it. Remove your shattered ego from it and it's almost clinical. A series of steps taken by someone weak who could have or should have said from the getgo that they were feeling differently, but likely hid it for awhile. I honestly believe my XH thought he was doing me a favor hiding the way he felt. He said "I didn't want to hurt you. I hoped my feelings would change back to what they used to be on their own."

My XH acknowledges now that he should have spoken up, shouldn't have misled me with false proclamations of love or promises to renew vows. But he can't take it back. What's done is done.

My XH isn't in love with me anymore, and he's in love with someone else. And you know what? I can't change that. I accept it. So my energy is 100% into MY life, MY relationships with family and friends.

Tad I beg you please try to look at this from a more detached, clinical perspective. On some level it's the most personal thing you'll ever face, likely, but on another, it's a script, and it's NOT personal. It just is. It's what happens when someone is human and can't keep a promise made, tries to hide it, then ruins things completely.

This person, your ex-wife, needs to follow her path. She needs to get married if that's her choice. She needs to see where it takes her, and you have to let her go and follow your path. It may be that some day your paths converge again. I don't think her being married is the end of "hope." Some of these people marry or even have kids and years later realize the full extent of what they did and try to reconcile.

But you can't be a good role model to your kids if you sit there ignoring your own life waiting for this to happen. You have to live as if she is GONE. It's the only way for you to really survive and thrive.

I'm sorry this is so long but I guess I thought I had a lot to say that I hope helps you see things from a more detached view.


M45
Bomb 6/09; EA 6/10; Divorced 1/11
Proud single mom of 7 little feline girls and one little feline boy
"Fall down 53 times. Get up 54." -- Zen saying
AntoniaB #2295431 11/02/12 03:59 AM
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Antonia that was wonderful!!!! and I feel like it was "spot on".
My xh said to me, "he tried" AND I didn't want to believe it at the time, but I really think he did.
I think he tried very hard to convience himself he was still in love with me.
I saw real tears when he moved out. He had no reason to cry, or so I thought, but he was hurting. He felt so guilty, he wanted his family to work, but it was no longer there for him.
He needed excitement, something new (MLC). He knew he was hurting me, but he HAD to move on with HER, he LOVED the attention he was getting. He felt younger, more alive.
She GOT him, his NEW self. He could be this other person with her, the NEW person he had become.
BUT, he still loved me and didnt want to hurt me, he worried I would not be able to go on and TO THIS DAY, he STILL thinks I am the same person that stood there crying adn begging him not to leave. I am sure he thinks I would LOVE to have HIM back.
What he dont know is I would love to have my FAMILY back, I miss my family....him not so much, esp the person he became and is now.
He told his best friend that after he and ow (which was #2 ow), got married (which she was already pregnant), he wanted to have children.....twin girls. Said he wanted a challange.
He also made the statement that "things were so different", with this new lady.
Of course they were, he needed a new high, a new life and she was young and in free.

ANYWAY Tad, Antonia is spot on. I think most of our spouses have felt this way. It may be a MLC but regardless they are not "In love with US anymore". They are looking for a high, a new relationship to make then feel new again.

In my case, my xh had to remarry, was prb pressured, but he did, and he has a new son. This may last and it may not.
Your xw may get married and it may last and it may not.
It just depends. If the person they marry and can their high going and the IN LOVE feeling for them going, then they may stay married. OR It may wear off and they may wake up.
Hope is never lost! It isnt over until GOD says its over.

BUT like everyone says, he have to go on. You cant sit and wait, well you can, but what kind of life is that for you OR your children.
You also cant jump when she offers a nice little jester.....is she coming out of this, blah blah blah.
Tad if she wants you back, you will know it. She will make an effort and it wont just be jesters in my opinon.

To add to what Antonia was saying about her ex bf being different with new gf....well. Its like this, if a person is into you, you will know it, they will jump leaps and bounds, go out of their way to show you. There wont be any excuses. This is why some act differently with others. We think, well nobody will have them the way he/she acted with me, no one would put up with that....the fact is, they DONT act that way with someone THEY truly fall in love with. They ARE different because their feeling are stronger/different.
I am not good with words, hope you got the point. smile

I know my xh is totally acting different with new wife, even down to how he dresses and his hobbies.

Anyway Tad, you will be ok, you are just at your own pace. Some fight longer than others, some have a hard time giving up and letting go. I am in that club! smile

Hugs,
Renee


_________________________________________
M:42
H:40
S:18
M:20yrs/together 21yrs
Bomb:9/08 ILYBNILWY
Sep:9/18/08 "ow" :25
Filed:11/18/08
D:12/8/08
M:Different 26 yr. old 7/09.
Newborn 4/10
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ugh....so many grammar mistakes in that. AND jesters....lol is suppose to be gestures. Its late, whatever, you know what i mean. lol


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H:40
S:18
M:20yrs/together 21yrs
Bomb:9/08 ILYBNILWY
Sep:9/18/08 "ow" :25
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Renee has a bunch of great points in her post above...and I also wanted to add to mine, since I was talking with another poster about this post off the boards, that them falling out of love with us temporarily, which often leads to their affairs, well, this is not an acceptable reason for them doing what they do. It is a reason, but it's not "acceptable" or morally right. I think what binds the MCLers together is that they are so addicted to the idea that marriage has to be this constant "high" of "in love" feelings that they assume a marriage should be over if they feel differently at some point. They conflate the way they feel about themselves in mid-life, at that 20 or more year mark of marriage, about how they are aging and "time is running out", with this sense of needing to shake things up or restart from square one. Look how many of them "regress" in the way they live...suddenly they don't want homes, they want apartments. Suddenly they blow money and live dangerously and shun all sense of being "responsible adults". They often take up with people drastically different than their age, people with totally different lives, as if they want to explore some whole new life, version 2.0. (When my XH downgraded from a home owned and land to a pricey 2 bedroom apartment in a small development that looks like every other apartment in the state, he took pics of it and said "Life 2.0 is GREAT!!!")

What I'm getting at is that MLCers don't have the capacity as adults to weather the ups and downs of marriage. ALL marriages go through spots where one or both don't feel as "in love" as they used to. I'm sure if any of us were asked we'd have said at one point or another things were just "ok" in our marriages, not great, but not bad either. But we are all the types who stick by the partner in those cases. The MLCers just do not. They bail.

So I just wanted to add that. Fundamentally the MLCer is a different personality type than we are, and we can't change this about them, so it's best to just let them drift while we take care of ourselves and our own families.


M45
Bomb 6/09; EA 6/10; Divorced 1/11
Proud single mom of 7 little feline girls and one little feline boy
"Fall down 53 times. Get up 54." -- Zen saying
AntoniaB #2295906 11/03/12 07:08 PM
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Thanks everyone. Renee and Antonia, I see your points. I truly believe what you said about MLCers not being able to handle things like adults.

This thread is full and it is time for a new one. Perfect timing too! I received another text last night and have posted it on my new thread:

From The Twilight Zone

smile

Tad


Currently:
M 56 XW 57
Sons 38,33,31,29

The Sitch:
Married 26 years
EA w/ OM 9/10
Bomb 10/10 (5 weeks after 25th anniversary)
Sep 12/10
She wants D 1/11
W files 5/11
D final 10/11
XW marries OM 6/13
AntoniaB #2296192 11/04/12 08:28 PM
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Originally Posted By: AntoniaB
L--
This guy didn't betray me. But he feels guilty because he's with someone and I'm not, and the fact is that for all his talk about independence, he's really not independent of needing a relationship. This only makes me feel MORE powerful or "together" because I'm seeing I don't need a relationship to have happy moments in life.

Your ex I'm sure has some level of guilt. If you're with someone she can tell herself that she did the right thing because you've found someone new.

I agree so much with everything 25 years is saying. I think these people DO care about us. In fact I believe my XH loves me. He "loves me but is not in love with me." And I totally get that now, because that's exactly how I feel about him. Therefore it really almost doesn't bother me anymore that he is with someone else. This is where your XW is coming from. It is entirely possible to care deeply about someone but not "choose" to be with them romantically. Just because someone pledged to love us romantically for life doesn't mean that it has to happen that way.

Simplify it this way: These people for whatever reasons woke up one day and felt differently about the way they connected with us. Maybe it was a one day thing; maybe it was a slow-growing realization. They didn't feel in love anymore. Emotionally they weren't feeling a connection.

Many of them likely hid this for a long time and went through the motions. Pretending they were happy. Why? Because how do you tell your spouse, the person you pledged to be with for life, this horrible news? So they faked it on some level. They hoped things would change for them. Things didn't change.

They got in deeper and deeper, living a double life, a life where on the surface they pretended to love us. In fact they may have even OVERDONE it a bit, saying things like "hey let's get remarried and redo our vows" (my XH did this a week before leaving me and I think I remember yours doing the same, Tad). They laid on the charm and the love and insisted, even when we asked if things were wrong, that things were GREAT. Then there came a point where for many of them, they met someone else. Someone who loved them for the persona they were OUTSIDE our lives. The person they projected they wanted to be but could not around us because we'd have said "what's wrong with you, why don't you love me anymore?" This new person made them feel GREAT about themselves. There was no guilt over the way their feelings changed, over how they were living a double life. They were this single entity with the OW/OM. And that OW/OM probably worshipped the ground they walked on.

Eventually they made a choice. Go off with the OW/OM because that was "easier" than trying to repair things with us, because they felt "in love" with that person, that was a sure thing, where repairing things with us when they were already distracted by someone else was just an impossible task for them.

And this is when the bomb hit us. Out of nowhere.

So it seemed to us at the time like we had to keep asking why. Or how.
How could they be one person one day and another the next? How could they just keep on treating us this way after they left, toying with our emotions?

Well the answers are all there, in all the behavior that is the same among all our exes. They fell out of love with us (and for MLCers this is often more about their own inadequacies unfulfilled than relationship problems, but they buried or hid relationship problems as well), they panicked, they hid their true feelings, they became ashamed of their feelings, they found someone else to confide in who very presence would not trigger that shame in them, they realized this new person could ONLY make them feel good about themselves and never bad, and they chose the path of least resistance:

They chose to cultivate that "in love" feeling with someone else rather than face us and themselves.

And in the end, they aren't in love with us at this time
.



That's all there is to it. Remove your shattered ego from it and it's almost clinical.
A series of steps taken by someone weak who could have or should have said from the getgo that they were feeling differently, but likely hid it for awhile. I honestly believe my XH thought he was doing me a favor hiding the way he felt. He said "I didn't want to hurt you. I hoped my feelings would change back to what they used to be on their own."

My XH acknowledges now that he should have spoken up, shouldn't have misled me with false proclamations of love or promises to renew vows. But he can't take it back. What's done is done.

My XH isn't in love with me anymore, and he's in love with someone else. And you know what? I can't change that. I accept it. So my energy is 100% into MY life, MY relationships with family and friends
.


Tad I beg you please try to look at this from a more detached, clinical perspective. On some level it's the most personal thing you'll ever face, likely, but on another, it's a script, and it's NOT personal. It just is. It's what happens when someone is human and can't keep a promise made, tries to hide it, then ruins things completely.

This person, your ex-wife, needs to follow her path. She needs to get married if that's her choice. She needs to see where it takes her, and you have to let her go and follow your path.
It may be that some day your paths converge again.


But you can't be a good role model to your kids if you sit there ignoring your own life waiting for this to happen. You have to live as if she is GONE. It's the only way for you to really survive and thrive.


I'm sorry this is so long but I guess I thought I had a lot to say that I hope helps you see things from a more detached view.


ALL great stuff all there for you to process and take in Tad...OR KEEP RESISTING b/c it makes you suffer more.


TAD-
if your wife had died 2 years ago, what would you be doing now with your life?



Would you keep asking "WHY?" Or would your sons keep hoping mom comes back to life...would you really curl up in the fetal position?

Wouldn't you eventually Try to GAL and show your boys something optimistic about what a man can create in life when he gets dealt an unfair hand?

whatever GAL things that you'd be doing if you finally accepted that she's gone

is what you ought to be doing now.



M: 57 H: 60
M: 35 yrs
S30,D28,D19
H off to Alaska 2006
Recon 7/07- 8/08
*2016*
X = "ALASKA 2.0"
GROUND HOG DAY
I File D 10/16
OW
DIV 2/26/2018
X marries OW 5/2016

= CLOSURE 4 ME
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5 years later and I am replying. I have been reading and reading more but still see what seems like the same bitter people. Thank you Jack for asking what's my story. My story is like everyone else, things didn't go like the fairy tale I was promised as a little girl. Life is hard sometimes and blame isn't with just one person. The other half of a marriage that isn't posting here isn't always the bad guy. We only get one perspective in these postings that paint the other person as bad but life just isn't that way. Both were probably bad, good, loving people that didn't make it through a terrible time. I wish people here wouldn't jump to conclusions about a person who isn't posting here. Thanks for being here to help people.

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You are a bit late in posting to Jack. Sadly, Jack passed away in the fall of 2016.

It's true, there are two sides to every coin. Some can be bitter about the cards that life has handed them, but I see a large number of people all across the forums that are taking that same exact hand of cards and doing something productive w/their lives. Yes, it's true, it takes a while for them to come to realize that none of us were promised a fairy tale w/a happy ending.

The written word can be interpreted many ways. Sometimes, the writer is just venting their frustration, other times, yes, they are lashing out and can come across bitter, and then again, they are just expressing their thoughts and seeking some support/advice and even 2 x 4's along the way. Very few remain bitter and angry. The words bitter and angry take a lot of energy to maintain and can create health issues and create problems in any type of relationship. We do hope that if we come across people that continue to express those two issues, that we can help them find their way and come to realize that they can only control themselves and how they react to their own unique situations. There are some that get annoyed and frustrated w/us when we point out the "bitter" and "anger" issues, that their either remain stubborn and ignore our comments or their leave. They are the ones that we can't reach, i.e., even after years of posting here. For those individuals, I feel sorry for them and keep them in my prayers that some day, they will come to realize that the bitterness and anger are keeping them stuck in one place.

Divorce Busting isn't just about saving a marriage...it's about saving yourself, learning how to react to behavior and/or comments made to you. It's about finding your inner self that you've put aside in a relationship and yes, it's a tool that you can use in your every day life and not just in the marriage.

So, per Jack's question...what is your story? As he suggested a long time ago...how about starting a thread of your own and just maybe you might be surprised by the support, advice and guidance that you receive? For you to return years later, then there is something you are still searching for...what is it? Maybe we can help.

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Nswt,

You replied on a post Tad wrote in 2012.. i hope you keep reading.. he progressed at his own pace and regained strenght, knowledge, honour and his independance. He is a success story eventho the main goal was not reached. Maybe her departure was in fact a blessing?? Or maybe not.. but i can tell you that he was and is amazing and an inspiration for some struggleing. Offering Hope of better days..

There is 2 sides... there is also 2 minds, 2 views etc.. rediscovering ourselves as individuals is a challenge and also a gift. ( in my case )

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Hey NSWTD,

There was a time when I was probably the most pathetic poster on here although I didn't realize it at the time. smile

When I cam here, I wanted to save my marriage. THAT WAS IT. I didn't want to hear suggestions about getting a life, finding out who I was, blah blah blah. I loved my wife dearly and deeply and couldn't possibly imagine a life without her. I wanted her to return. PERIOD.

Eventually, when the hurt, bitterness, anger, disbelief and all the other stuff subsided, all I had left was ME. Eventually, I guess I had to look inside whether I wanted to or not. I actually think that I began to do it without realizing it.

I'm not even sure if I know what I'm trying to say here. My marriage was not saved, but I am a better person today than I was when I first came to this board in early 2011. (God, that seems like such a long time ago.) I do consider myself a success because I am enjoying life. I'm doing things that I never had time to do before. I like who I've become....the person that I was MEANT to be. I get tickled about the things that most people take for granted: a cool breeze, the smell of rain, seeing a baby duck at the park, my photography....I'm ranting. All I'm saying is there is SOOOO much more to life than your EX. It took me forever to realize that but when I finally did...that's when I started to enjoy life. I am not bitter. Lonely sometimes, but happy.

Please start a thread.

exquisitetobe: THANK YOU for the very nice words.

Tad
smile


Currently:
M 56 XW 57
Sons 38,33,31,29

The Sitch:
Married 26 years
EA w/ OM 9/10
Bomb 10/10 (5 weeks after 25th anniversary)
Sep 12/10
She wants D 1/11
W files 5/11
D final 10/11
XW marries OM 6/13
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