Unfortunately, things have deteriorated. Vacation was up and down, and I think overall, she's decided in her head she's not willing to do anything so she's just been waiting for, really looking for, some justification to proceed to divorce.
On my side, I think my biggest problem has been patience. I am really working hard to try to be patient, but I think we have some misunderstandings between us as well that are increasing the problems.
Couple of things recently that came to light:
1) W told me she basically told the man she is having an EA with that he is the reason she is able to get up every day...he indicated it was the same with him
2) I saw on my internet history very late Monday night that she had spent the evening looking for apartments
3) W saw divorce attorney Tuesday and turned in a parenting plan. We discussed this last night and she said the attorney said she was screwed if she moved out, screwed if she stayed.
4) W has indicated that her feeling is that I'm controlling the entire situation and am not willing to do anything different
On the control issue, I will admit, yes, I've been controlling and with regards to the relationship, yes, I have been leading. I told her that I was only leading because she only wanted to lead us to divorce and I wanted to improve it. With that said, I relinquished control yesterday and told her she could figure out how she thought we should move forward and let me know. She said that's not really giving her control because I've already indicated what I will accept. I disagreed and said I was willing to discuss any scenario, but that didn't mean I'd automatically agree.
I scheduled an appointment for my own attorney today...will see her Monday to find out what my rights are.
Last night, W comes home, surprised I didn't go to golf and asked me what happened. I said it was just too hot. She asked if I was staying home and I said, I was planning on it, but could find something to do if she preferred I leave for a while. She said no, offered to make me a plate for dinner. We sat in bed and she grabbed my hand and said "you're my friend." I was starting to work on one of our dialogue questions and we talked about her attorney appt, her expectations, thoughts, etc. We only talked about an hour, but it became clear she felt trapped and thought I was being rigid. I tried to explain how flexible I was, but I'm not sure she believed me.
She also told me that she thought everything I was doing, holding her hand, telling her she looked nice, etc, was geared towards ML. She believes that I think this is a way to keep her, by having creating a connection. I was frankly shocked at this, as I have really never been the aggressor (an issue for a long time until we discussed at some length a few years ago), and still am not due to how rocky our relationship has been. I realize this is making her feel pursued, but I was really surprised she thought I was actually thinking this way.
This morning we only had 30 mins or so and I tried to reiterate she had control, but needed to actually spend some time thinking about it rather than leave us in limbo. I also indicated I was flexible about things, but she left the conversation saying it didn't matter, because she was already done and wasn't willing to work on it. She said if I'd have been the person I am today 5 years ago, we wouldn't be at this point. Of course, nothing I can do about that.
Anyway, pretty upset and frustrated. I can see that she's conflicted....she wants to believe it I will stay as I am now but isn't willing to risk her heart again. Weird thing is, we're actually missing what I consider the most important retrovaille follow-up this weekend (forgiveness, trust, etc) because my brother is getting married. Oh the irony.
Well, I've been confused and back and forth on detaching versus actively working on things and it's become clear over the last few days that I should have detached. My problem was, every time I did detach, she pursued me and I took that to mean she was interested. The result was that she never got the space she needed. I see now that I should have forced the space, at least until she was ready to commit to working on things. I basically let her sit on the fence for the last year and got walked on continually.
We had a great time at the wedding Sat....we danced, kissed, acted like H/W & family. Sunday, she decides she's doing her own thing again...disappears for nearly 4 hours and when I went to store I saw her car at the local bar. I went in and found her with OM (something for work she says, and I honestly believe her as she wasn't drinking). I was panic'd, and tried to explain my feelings (without getting mad), but she decided to get mad instead and say she's done (again). She felt like I was stalking her and trying to control her....I can see her point, but she refuses to see mine. I should have detached and let it be.
She said she's moving out at the end of the month and wants kids every other week. She would rather swap weeks at the house so the kids aren't uprooted every week, and I agree, that is probably better short term, at least until we get out from under the house. I see an A today to go over what my options are.
She said she would still go to retrovaille post sessions if I wanted, but she doesn't buy into all of it. I'm not sure if it's even worth the time, but I think I've got to complete the program for my own sanity.
So maybe I can get some input on the following:
1) should I agree to every other week in the house or should I make her take the kids for the week she wants them. She's going to stay with her brother and I think that's crappy for the kids, and her brother's family. I have read "don't move out" a lot, but I'm not sure where this one lands.
2) should I agree to the divorce or drag my feet? On one side, if I don't agree, she'll think I'm trying to control her and on the other, if I do agree, everything will move that much faster. I'm kinda leaning towards letting her go as I recognize she needs space, but I've read a lot that I should not do anything to help with the process.
3) Last night, we talked a long time about her issues. Ultimately, she feels trapped. She feels controlled. She doesn't have the desire to try right now. She isn't saying she doesn't want to be with me, or work things out, she just desperately needs some space to work thru her own issues and see if she feels differently about our past. I get that, and I do agree....but I asked if there wasn't some other option that would allow her to get her space (i.e. in house separation, every other week w/o divorce). I think this probably seems like pursuing, but I really worry about the damage we might be doing to the kids just so she can figure out what she wants. Thoughts?
On the bright side, I think for the first time I'm clear about what I should be doing. Heading over to read the 37 rules again and will dust off DR for another read as well.
I talked to A today and got a little input on the situation. Nothing new, no surprises....basically what we've been discussing is ok.
I also went ahead and signed up for a couple of DB coaching sessions, as I feel I need to change gears and could use some help getting my head straight.
Hiya Break. I hope my good friend Mach doesnt mind me stopping by. You are fortunate to have his input. He really makes you think.
If I may, I see that you are reading a lot of books on just about everything. And I am all for knowledge is power. But, the thing is, you cant let all this consume you.
It will make you craaazzzzy.
There are a few ways to figure out what you want to change about you. One of them is to take those things that your w has said and think about which ones are valid.
Then look at some people whose personality traits, actions and values you admire. Think about some things you have always wanted to try.
Think about who you want to be. For you. Then work towards that. Some days you make it, some you dont, but that should be the goal each day.
As you continue to look inward, a couple of things happen. You start to change, you start to become more confident and comfortable with who you are becoming. And then, you become more attractive to people.
I know it seems very negative right now.
But we dont know what the future holds. The only thing we can do it become the best person we can.
We are responsible for our own happiness.
So, continue exploring inside, continue moving forward on working on you.
Well, I've been confused and back and forth on detaching versus actively working on things and it's become clear over the last few days that I should have detached. My problem was, every time I did detach, she pursued me and I took that to mean she was interested. The result was that she never got the space she needed. I see now that I should have forced the space, at least until she was ready to commit to working on things. I basically let her sit on the fence for the last year and got walked on continually.
We had a great time at the wedding Sat....we danced, kissed, acted like H/W & family. Sunday, she decides she's doing her own thing again...disappears for nearly 4 hours and when I went to store I saw her car at the local bar. I went in and found her with OM (something for work she says, and I honestly believe her as she wasn't drinking). I was panic'd, and tried to explain my feelings (without getting mad), but she decided to get mad instead and say she's done (again). She felt like I was stalking her and trying to control her....I can see her point, but she refuses to see mine. I should have detached and let it be.
It is part of the push-pull that occurs when you DB.
You push, she pulls away...
You pull away ?
She pushes....
Recognizing what MIGHT happen in these situations is the balance that you are looking for here. The problem, as it seems, is that you feel her pushing toward you, that you start having expectations about what "might" happen if you over compensate for this or that.
What is something that you might be able to do, to recognize that pattern of behavior ?
What is something that you can do when you do recognize that ?
Letting go of expectations...
You didn't expect to be married after one date with her...did you ?
Think back to a time in your relationship, when you had zero expectations...
How were you then ? What do you see differently now ?
Originally Posted By: BD
She said she's moving out at the end of the month and wants kids every other week. She would rather swap weeks at the house so the kids aren't uprooted every week, and I agree, that is probably better short term, at least until we get out from under the house. I see an A today to go over what my options are.
Really ?
That means that every other week, that YOU get uprooted from your home.
And you are okay with that ?
I see way more internal conflict with that, down the road.
Originally Posted By: BD
1) should I agree to every other week in the house or should I make her take the kids for the week she wants them. She's going to stay with her brother and I think that's crappy for the kids, and her brother's family. I have read "don't move out" a lot, but I'm not sure where this one lands.
There is a certain....consequence to one's actions. And by no means am I saying to force any of that. It is not your role to supply the Karma in this situation. What I am saying....is that is moving out of your house once every other week, to do something that is not a decision that you want, a good idea for your emotional well being ????
Yes, it will be a crappy situation for your kids, and yes, it will be a crappy situation for your BIL and family.
Well I may not endorse you being the judge, jury , and executioner for her. I am an advocate of letting the WAS feel the ramifications of their decisions. Letting them own their piece of reality that they have created.
For me, it would be a matter of this.
Is moving out of my home, every other week, really the best thing for me ????
( forget everything else for now, and focus on what is best for you. Because in the end, what is best for you, will also be what is best for your children )
Originally Posted By: BD
2) should I agree to the divorce or drag my feet? On one side, if I don't agree, she'll think I'm trying to control her and on the other, if I do agree, everything will move that much faster. I'm kinda leaning towards letting her go as I recognize she needs space, but I've read a lot that I should not do anything to help with the process.
Ohhh...there are....ways my friend.
I think a common misnomer is, that the legal system works quickly and efficiently. That could be no further from the truth.
All you have to say to your lawyer, is that you want this to go slooooowwwwwww.....
Quote:
3) Last night, we talked a long time about her issues. Ultimately, she feels trapped. She feels controlled. She doesn't have the desire to try right now. She isn't saying she doesn't want to be with me, or work things out, she just desperately needs some space to work thru her own issues and see if she feels differently about our past. I get that, and I do agree....but I asked if there wasn't some other option that would allow her to get her space (i.e. in house separation, every other week w/o divorce). I think this probably seems like pursuing, but I really worry about the damage we might be doing to the kids just so she can figure out what she wants. Thoughts?
I think that you should rest on this for a couple days. Then read your own words again, and see if you have a different view of them.
She is telling you that she feels controlled....
Is she ?
Originally Posted By: BD
I get that, and I do agree....but I asked if there wasn't some other option that would allow her to get her space
YOUR way ????
Time and space means that SHE wants to find her way, not that she wants you to find it for her.
Your fix for her issues will not work.
Originally Posted By: BD
I was panic'd, and tried to explain my feelings (without getting mad), but she decided to get mad instead and say she's done (again). She felt like I was stalking her and trying to control her....I can see her point, but she refuses to see mine.
This is more of the same thing from you to her.
I would feel the same way as she does. And truth be told, you would feel the same way if the roles were reversed.
IF you really see her point, as you say....
Then you should be validating her points, instead of trying to insert your own agenda onto her.
She doesn't see your point right now, because she doesn't want to see your point right now.
And let me ask you this....
What have you shown her differently about yourself since the bomb ?
Thanks Brookie. I appreciate your comments, as well as everyone else who has chimed in....especially Mach1.
Originally Posted By: Brookie
If I may, I see that you are reading a lot of books on just about everything. And I am all for knowledge is power. But, the thing is, you cant let all this consume you.
It will make you craaazzzzy.
There are a few ways to figure out what you want to change about you. One of them is to take those things that your w has said and think about which ones are valid.
True...I have dug into books like crazy, and it has been thought provoking mostly. Usually I get a little out of each one...a book on trust helped me with negative thoughts, for example.
With that said, the only problem that has really caused is that I can see different perspectives, and it can confuse me. With regards to who I am, my wife loves who I have become over the last few years. She said "If you were this person 5 years ago, we wouldn't be here." The problem is that she cannot get over the past...she can't seem to forgive me for my errors, and she can't seem to get past the fact that she has said she's done....in her mind, once she said it, she has to stick to it. The initial bomb was Feb 2011...and she still tells me over and over that she was done then and hasn't changed her mind.
Now, with that said, she has been happy to act like a couple in every way for the most part, even trying to improve some of her negative behaviors. But when we have a bump, we're right back to "I can't get over the past."
