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#2244707 - 05/12/12 12:41 PM Re: Learning, Unlearning, Doing it Differently #2 [Re: ~ kd ~]
2thepoint Offline
Member

Registered: 09/30/11
Posts: 1692
Originally Posted By: Kaffe Diem
IDK, I would love to hear from a WAS regarding this confusion... does a WAS really "forget" boundaries and send these types of "mixed messages"...?


I'm not a WAS but I'd say the answer to your question is a resounding, YES!

One minute my W says she is DONE, the next she is talking about wills, vacations, boob jobs. One day she says she needs space, the next she is planning whole weekends together with the family. One month she is going away for awhile, the next she is asking to go to the movies, out to eat, etc.

It is a wall of confusion!!
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#2244708 - 05/12/12 12:47 PM Re: Learning, Unlearning, Doing it Differently #2 [Re: Crimson]
~ kd ~ Offline
Member

Registered: 03/20/11
Posts: 4866
Loc: Canoe'k-land
Well, the one thing that IS different Crimson...

With MLC... even though they might "notice" your changes... they do that back and forth thing and there are a lot of mixed messages if the LBS focuses too much on the MLCer...

A WAS might notice the changes and if there is a move towards you... they are moving towards you...

An MLCer... they appear to move towards the LBS... then they panic and attack... and then they send gifts... or invite us to be friends... only to tell us they want no contact...

No 180 or any effort on your part would stop your W from moving towards... or moving away... from you... she will do that... she talks about a future with you, yet is continuing on the D path...

the work is the same... but... the results are different... you can not make ANY assumptions on the MLCer words NOR actions... and certainly expectations due to perceived patterns... don't even go there...

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#2244709 - 05/12/12 12:50 PM Re: Learning, Unlearning, Doing it Differently #2 [Re: ~ kd ~]
~ kd ~ Offline
Member

Registered: 03/20/11
Posts: 4866
Loc: Canoe'k-land
2tp, I understand what you are saying... although... from the WAS's I've read here... I'm not too sure about that...

I don't think that Sandi or Brit said to their H's that they wanted to get D and have another child with their H's... crazy

I'm not sure that either of them decided to break it off with their H's thinking that the world would be rosy... and I don't think they went out and got boob jobs... lol smile

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#2244711 - 05/12/12 01:05 PM Re: Learning, Unlearning, Doing it Differently #2 [Re: ~ kd ~]
Crimson Offline
Member

Registered: 11/16/11
Posts: 1285
".....then they panic and attack".

Interesting. I can see some of that pattern. The glaring moment was, again, the night we went out together and had a great time and then we are in the car for 5 minutes and she goes OFF on me because I said I wanted our son to have a sibling some day and "I never say I want it to be with her".

Wasn't going to post this, but a few Sundays ago at dinner she let me know she was no longer taking her antidepressants. She has been on them since we met - and long before. Depression runs in BOTH of our families. I don't think that that decision on her part is really going to help things much - especially at a time like this.

Sad thing is, at this stage I really don't think she has done a lot of looking inward to figure this out. Yes, she has said she was possibly mirroring communication problems she witnessed in her parents relationship - which was a good step, but I haven't heard much beyond that. I am still of the belief that if one was to ask her what caused all of this she would spend 80% of her breath on me.

Does MLC ever END? Is it possible to be there at 38-39 years old?

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#2244712 - 05/12/12 01:11 PM Re: Learning, Unlearning, Doing it Differently #2 [Re: Crimson]
Crimson Offline
Member

Registered: 11/16/11
Posts: 1285
...just to add more clarity, w said in an e-mail a few weeks ago regarding our last frozen embryo that that "is something that we started as a married couple and need to see through".

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#2244718 - 05/12/12 01:42 PM Re: Learning, Unlearning, Doing it Differently #2 [Re: Crimson]
~ kd ~ Offline
Member

Registered: 03/20/11
Posts: 4866
Loc: Canoe'k-land
MLC is named such because it (the namesake) generally occurs "mid life"... this same type of crises can occur at any period in a person's life when they might normally go through a "controlled transition" ie. they KNOW they are having to deal with a change of life... and they work through it consciously...

it occurs more often in mid life because they often didn't do any or all of the "needed" work during prior transitions... something often triggers the crises... that trigger could be something as far back as two years prior to the stuff that becomes blatantly obvious to the spouse (or other loved ones and close friends)...

Does it end? Yes, I would say usually... although the person who comes out on the other side of the transition may not be the person we knew... transitions are about remaking ourselves... if prior transitions were not completed, these changes can be abrupt and vast... there are those who appear to be in perpetual MLC, although they could simply be people who've made it through and are simply just vastly different people who we still expect to be the "old" person so our cognitive dissonance cannot be resolved and we don't "like" them in their new form... (and they don't like us much, either... biker / ballerina type differences...)

There are milder MLCs it seems, and those people may have gone through prior transitions in a more functional or complete way...

Anyhow, just putting that out there. There are just some things that your W is doing that IS confusing... and that's a pretty good indicator of MLC... not the "do I want to leave, or stay and try"...

For example, my W knows my mom is an alcoholic... my dad a recovering alcoholic (about 7 years dry)... and my W hides a box of liquor chocolates along with D9's stuff... doesn't say anything about it to me... tells D9 that it's for "someone over there if they want like, Gramma or Grampa..."... ??? crazy Of course yesterday was my b-day... so for all I know she might have meant them for me... but I've never liked those things and she USED to know that...

Not all the confusion is that obvious...

Again... IF your W is MLC... all you have is time... even if you are D... but you only have your life to live... detached from any thought of M or R... or thinking that anything you do at this time will help... but it is good stuff for the future... what you do now, like planting a bamboo... will yield noticeable results in the long term...

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#2244843 - 05/13/12 11:10 AM Re: Learning, Unlearning, Doing it Differently #2 [Re: ]
Crimson Offline
Member

Registered: 11/16/11
Posts: 1285
Tough one today - Mother's Day. We have usually been going to church on Sundays. It's starts in an hour and I am dressed to go - but still not sure if I can. I figure that it's a 180 I am trying to do - for me. So I don't think I am going to let her factor in. Church is neutral ground and if ever I needed a boost from God, it is now. Don't even know if she will be there - but my heart is telling me to go either way.

Happy Mother's Day, ladies - you are all doing your best and your kids love you.

Crimson

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#2244880 - 05/13/12 04:36 PM Re: Learning, Unlearning, Doing it Differently #2 [Re: Crimson]
Crimson Offline
Member

Registered: 11/16/11
Posts: 1285
Well, went to church and when I arrived she wasn't there. I took my usual seat and just before the service began she showed up and sat down right next to me. It was the first time we had communicated since the phone call on my way to work on Friday.

I'm sure I'll probably get a smack in the mouth from the board on this, but I DID give her a Mother's Day card. I wrote a nice note to her from the perspective of our son and then a quick blurb from me (nothing romantic in the least). We both enjoyed the message and then went to the nursery to pick up our S. I hadn't seen him since Tuesday. He saw me peek in and ran right at me with his arms out saying "daddy! daddy! daddy! daddy!" - I scooped him up - that totally made my day. W asked me to walk with him while she went to the chapel to say her prayers - so we spent a little bit of time together in the courtyard (he loves to put his hands in the fountains). W came back, we walked to her car - I strapped s in and said good-bye. W said thank you for the card and making Mother's Day special. We exchange a quick, non-romantic hug and that was it.

Maybe that violates going "gray" but I woke up this morning with a mindset of "eff it". I know this won't change anything, it won't stop the divorce - nothing will. But for one reason or another my heart felt compelled to get up, get her that card and go to church. GM - you mentioned to stop with the rules and tactics and just live - well, that is what I decided to do this morning.

I also had a quick inspiring moment with the spouse of a co-worker last night who knows my situation. He, too, is a new father. He just patted me on the back and said "do the right things and things will be alright". Simple, some may call it cliche, but it that moment - coming from him it actually seemed to mean something. Despite her saying we shouldn't communicate until after the proceedings are over, the card (and I've decided to give her the plate we made for her last weekend) seemed and felt like the right thing to do - regardless if it gets me one step closer to saving my marriage.

I am a different man, and I am going to do my best to live the changes that I needed to make at all times. W or not.

Crimson

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#2244882 - 05/13/12 04:47 PM Re: Learning, Unlearning, Doing it Differently #2 [Re: Crimson]
25yearsmlc Offline
Member

Registered: 04/03/06
Posts: 10464
Loc: west coast
I think you did great Crimson.

For all our analysis & microscopic staring, sometimes it's just as your friend & new father says,

do the right thing, hope for the best & let it go.

In the end, at best--all we can do is our best. I think you are doing that.


That just has to be enough (b/c what else can you do now?)

Good job.
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#2244884 - 05/13/12 04:49 PM Re: Learning, Unlearning, Doing it Differently #2 [Re: 25yearsmlc]
Crimson Offline
Member

Registered: 11/16/11
Posts: 1285
Thanks, 25.....thought you had left me there for awhile! smile As you can see, it has been a bumpy two weeks.

Thanks for weighing in -

Crimson

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