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Kimmerz,
Your man/child wants some attention from "mom". The attention can be good or bad, but he's hoping that if he tells you about his health you will give him a good dose of attention and sympathy! The dead silence is because you are not showing as much interest as he had hoped. You aren't cooing all over him and asking a hundred questions about his health. Keep in mind...he's in the "me" game and that's what he wants...attention.

Their health goes down the booby hatch once their crisis is in full swing. They are attempting to burn the candle at both ends and let's face it, our bodies can't do the things that they use to do when we were 12 or 13. I think he's finding it out and that's why he's having a difficult time now w/his health and let's not forget, depression plays a major role in all of this too.

I will be surprised if he has the girls over if he's not in good health, but who knows...tomorrow he might be skipping rope!

You are beginning to truly understand that it's not you, but him and only he can fix himself. BTW, miracles happen every day and don't be surprised if something wonderful comes your way when you least expect it. It may not be reconcilation, but it could be something else that will help you in the future. One never knows what the man upstairs has in mind for us.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
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Kimmerz Offline OP
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Note: XH would bring up physical complaints in two different ways. Angry and irritated ( usually was during a depressive spell) and any concern from me was met with silence or being aloof. Innocent and child like. When I would focus on that he appeared to like the attention and then his mood would lift.

Either way I feel it's narcissist behavior. I mean look at it. He's bitching about his pain yet in his mind it's my fault he's got pain because he's so unhappy and depressed. Yet he can't deny the attention I give him though he resents having to take it from me. Or there is just him craving attention and doing it in a way where he knows I will notice it.

Ok now a rant is coming.....

Has this man had any empathy for my aches and pains over the last few years? Has he ever offered to rub my back or feet? NO! He hid the freaking Advil all to himself for his aches and pains. I had to ask for it or buy my own.

Do you see why I get very suspcious when he does random acts of kindess?

One thing he did spend alot of time doing is actually separating himself apart from me and the girls. He had his televesion, his computer, his gaming system, and stereo system all to himself at his desk. He started doing his own laundry and cooking his own food. He started acting arrogant, and he was above us. He would buy new dishes and decide they were his and his only. If we used them and they were dirty I got stoney silence. He has his very own refrigerator with his soda, snacks, candy, beer, etc. He has stashes of so much candy that he literally could survive nuclear winter. Overtime he didnt share anything with us, and if he did he resented it...including his paycheck.

Ok ya....I think Im done with that. I don't see how it's humanly possible for someone to be so self absorbed that they be able to achieve emotionally connecting with anyone.


M=42 XH=44
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XH marries OW 6/2014.
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Gosh, kimmerz, I'm wondering the same things you are about your XH's behavior. If you think about all of the information you've read here and elsewhere you will probably see that your XH is following a predictable pattern. You know how toddlers need to touch "home base" and then they run off again? Well, I wonder if that's what your XH is doing. It fits with MLC, but also with adults who missed an important developmental stage. Since it seems that MLCers have unresolved childhood issues and traumas it's logical that they would also not have safely passed through early life stages and maybe even suffer from arrested development. If you're interested it might be worth researching. I agree with earlier posts that your XH wants attention from mom. Play it cool, listen and talk softly when you must respond. Think of how you wanted your parents to respond to you when you were a kid/teenager and had a problem. When parents helped us feel safe we opened up more. When things fell apart home was the best place to be. However, if our parents were critical or rejected us we retreated and found others to confide in, or at least I did. Think of times when you just needed a parent to listen to you and it helped you feel better. Then you were able to carry on with your life. We all know that the WS acts like a teenager, so does this at all seem to fit what your XH is doing? Please don't spend any energy on all of this unless it interests you. Anyway, you can create a safe haven for your XH if you want to. In the meantime, keep learning and healing. It seems to be giving you the peace you haven't had for many years. On that note, a couple of books that I've started reading might appeal to you also. They are Men are like waffles woman are like spaghetti, Boundries: When to say yes, how to say no and Zen and the art of falling in love. I'm finding these good for dealing with my H now and helping with healing, but I will also use the information in the future. You can get the gist of them by downloading a free sample.

On another note, here's another similarity that we have. My H complained about his back and arthritis in his ankles. He also wasn't sleeping well. Once he left he told my son that he felt great. He had no more pain. I'll be curious if I ever hear about the problems returning once he is no longer able to self medicate.

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Very interesting Golf Mom, I think I will look into that. The books you mentioned sound really good, and Im always up for a good book.

XH and his mom never were really "close". I've seen him alienate her on and off and have times where they were extra friendly, but I never sensed a true mother/son bond. His mother has some serious issues and is an alcoholic. Infact she's been emotionally unavailable to him all his life up until she's gotten older and making some small changes in her thinking. The fact she finally admits she's an alocoholic and knows her drinking triggers is a good step. Took her 60 years but she did it.

My mother and I were unsually close. I always felt welcome to talk to her about anything except her alcoholism. That was disaster immediately. However when XH and were together in the early years, he liked staying at my house. Infact when he got really sick with a virus he didn't want to go home to his house, he stayed with us. And he was the worst patient imaginable! LOL....I now look back at that with laughter and humor. But I remember my mom saying " well doesn't he want to go home. Doesn't his mom want to help take care of him?" and I said " I don't think so Mom, I think he wants to be here.She's off working all the time and not home". At that time XH was 20 years old.


Ok....well the psychology of it all is clicking into place quickly. My mother and myself were mother figures to him. No wonder this abandonment issue with him is so intense and he's so full of resentment towards me. I think he's got Mom and Wife mixed up. Infact I asked him that 2 years ago, that I wondered if he had me and his mother mixed up. He actually thought about it for a bit, but only said " I'll have to think about that?"

This is me being completely honest here. I truly enjoy helping others help themselves. I love to encourage where and when it's needed and point out the great potential in people that they never see. I just can't help it. I see so much good in people and I feel good in pointing it out to them because maybe they can't see it. Now I don't mean this in a controlling way. It's just if I see people putting themselves down, or excessively critical of themselves or even others, I like to point out the good.

So I guess that's where I've gone completely nutts with XH. Going nutts in the sense is that when I talk positively to anyone else but him, I seem to help people feel a little better. Him? Well he sure doesn't act like anything I say helps, yet he consistently mines for some sort of attention and recognition. This is crazy making!

REalistially, this man has so much potential. Of course I let go of the idea he'd ever notice it in himself as he consistently chose not to strive to do better for himself. He always has an excuse. I remember he said to me " Wow you have alot of faith in me, I don't even think I could do that". I said to him " I've always had faith in you. I just don't think you have very much faith in yourself".

I have no idea how to create a safe haven for him, and quite frankly, do I want to?

Well yes I want to, but only if I get something in return, which would be emotional availability. Honestly Im damn near emotionally bankrupty myself by making the choice to do all the emotional work in the marriage with hardly any feedback or cooperation from him, and then the grief of this last year.


M=42 XH=44
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XH marries OW 6/2014.
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hahaha Kimmer! Those conversations with your X sound like my W...

She still does that... been doing it more recently again, but had been doing that for the past 6 months or so...

Emails about something "important" like the kids schedule and adding bits of personal stuff, complaints, whatever... candid convo... I'd respond to the candid stuff and then there'd be dead silence... so I've just learned to only comment on the "important" stuff and find the convo lasts longer... crazy

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Kimmerz, like your XH, my H grew up in total dysfunction. He was born to a teenage mom and was passed around to different relatives before his mom married. He always felt that he was treated differently than his sister who was the bio child of his mom and stepdad. As a teenager he found out the truth in a very ugly way. His mom leaned on him as a parent. I don't think my H was ever nurtured and cherished until we were together. Because of all of his issues he slowly killed what I felt for him. Of course, I still love him, but I became less tolerant of this behavior. When he left he said "You are wonderful to everyone but me." He walked away dejected. He hasn't yet made the connection to his own behavior. More on that later. I need to get to work.

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Kaffe,

that is just so weird how they do that. I've made small attempts to have small chit chat with him to see how it goes.

Guess what pattern I've found? If he's at work in the office the last few hours of his shift, I get pretty open responses. Or in other words when OW is not around.

If he's at home, where OW is 24/7, I get spurts. The spurts of texting has been the norm ever since OW was in the picture. When he's away from her he seems to talk to me alot. When she's not then it's quick and business like.

You know what I've found odd? Lately when I've mentioned to his family about XH being involved with the kids and indicating he and I have been communicating, the family appears to feel VERY akward. They just look at me like deer in the headlights or something. I would think that after us being divorced and separated for 1 year and sharing 2 kids together they KNOW we have to talk at some point. Is this normal for family to do after a year?

What I question is if XH has said things to indicate that we're still where we were back at Christmas and he still hates me? Because people literally look shocked and stunned when I tell them he and I are getting along better and tell them about all the good actions he's taken. Maybe they just don't feel right in talking about it now, which is understandable.


M=42 XH=44
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XH marries OW 6/2014.
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I definitely can agree that when they are with either the OP or their supporters / enablers, convo can be very short and abrupt... IF they even respond... and yes, if they are by themselves, they seem to get chatty...

Although, I have noticed that my W seems to stop the convo when it is something personal. She shares, I respond in a positive manner, and then she goes silent... but that is generally in electronic comm... I don't have enough experience to know it is a pattern in f2f...

As far as family goes... IDK... I have no comm with any of her family that isn't otherwise random and very infrequent contact shopping or social events. The convo is the standard "hi, how are you. Fine, you? Great, thanks. Gotta go, c u l8r..." stuff... I'm waaaay too careful to initiate any convo that revolves around W... If I were to guess though, I'd probably expect the same. That her family would be shocked to know that I am in any way involved with the kids or sometimes having decent, pleasant convo with W.

I really do believe that my name does not come up in convo in their circles. If I do (and I've seen them do this with other people who offended the family) there will be some chuckles had by all regarding some past, perceived offense and some derogetory comments made about my heritage or exaggeration about my idiosyncrasies.

They have to keep up that picture of us, because they can't have others, or even consider themselves, that they left someone who actually wasn't diablo incarnate...

All I can do is my best to present the best possible me... ALL THE TIME... in the event that I either meet up with them or meet up with family friends...

My Aunt... well, she's a nutbag... but she has a good heart... when her H and her split, he was the evil one who took up with a mistress, etc, etc, etc... the family, especially aunt and her daughter, spoke horribly about him for years and years... in the end, he made a poor choice (mistress) but whether he is a bad guy or not, who knows... so after about 10 or 15 years, the two of them finally became friendly (she let go of her anger and bitterness at him... and men in general... to some degree) and he comes to many family events and we all talk to him as a friend...

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oh, I did want to say that I have recently had that "group setting" where I was at an event where a large number of her family and supporters were there. I presented the AWESOME that is me and my W did bounce many times to me to have quick chats... a couple of times were specifically interrupting me when I was chatting with a) someone of the opposite sex, and b) a candid convo with one of her supporters...

She'd come in, get chatty... then she'd seem to go vacant and slip away... back to her group...

In the mean time, of the dozen or so that were at the event, I had good pleasantries with them and carried on. The only one who is outwardly still unreceptive is FIL... that's another long story though, that involves his history and fairly recent D with W's mom.

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Kimmerz,
The mlcer will only share if and when they are ready. They will only share what they want you to know. If your chit chat is getting into an area that they do not want you to know about, silence will be your answer. You are not dealing w/people who have a full deck, so you have to learn to listen very closely and sift through the garbage they are spouting in order to get your answers. It takes some time, but you will learn this technique and it's quite interesting how they are. Once you learn to stay in the "safe" areas of conversations, their lips become loose and the subjects will need to be sifted.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
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