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Kimmerz Offline OP
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I just wanted to post a cycle I've now noticed.

Everytime XH is nice, and does random acts of kindess, I completely turn to puddy and my mind becomes VERY foggy, and I CANT see the truth. This is where I start to spin, analyze, feel crazy, get depressed and don't know what on earth is going on. I simply can NOT understand how he can flip flop so much. I make it my quest to figure this out....hind sight being 20/20... now LMAO.

Then..... as time goes on and there is less and less contact, the fog clears more and more. As the fog clears I start to see very important things that I had forgotten about or literally couldn't see because of the fog.

I am then brought back to reality. I can really see things for what they are. The things that aren't good, that were very hurtful from him, and the reality of why he does it.

So I pray that another fog bank doesn't come in. I guess Im finally getting hip to the cycle and will know better what to look for and when I need to step back even further and detatch more.


M=42 XH=44
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Kimmerz, I wonder if your XH responds the same way. If he sees your changes, but doesn't trust them. Does it cause him to start spinning again? Keep up the changes and growth so you can be who you want to be. When the changes are consistent he will be able to trust them. The same goes for him. If he's nice some days, but is a monster others then you know he's not trust worthy. Honestly, once you set and trust your own boundries I think this will become a whole lot easier. I'm telling myself the same thing. For now, try to look forward to each day with anticipation. What great things will happen? Look for signs of synchronicity. Who will you meet (male and female)? Detaching will allow you to do this, as I've discovered.

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Kimmerz, to answer an earlier post, yes my H is a conflict avoider. He's also emotionally unavailable. I addition, he is somewhat of a loner. At least he says he's perfectly happy alone, with no commitments. Personally, I think he's fooling himself. We are made to have deep connections. My H hides his feelings, but over the years he has opened up to me and cried when he couldn't keep it in. He knows he can trust me with his heart and that he can safely express himself with me. Right now he has convinced himself that he doesn't need that connection, at least with me. I understand many if not most MLCers try to forget the past and people in it. They want to start clean with someone who doesn't know the real person they are. Eventually, some come back seeking the comfort and connection. I guess this is where being the "lighthouse" comes in.

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Kimmerz Offline OP
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Geez Golf mom, I can't believe how similar things are with us.

Im asking myself some hard questions lately.

Why would I want to be with someone that doesn't want to be with me now?

Why do I want to be with someone that's a conflict avoider?

Why do I want to be with someone that's emotionally unavailable?

This is part of the fog clearing for me. One thing that I've found very interesting is that it appers a good majority of the MLCers tend to have the conflict avoidant/emotionally unavailable personality.

About him seeing changes in me, I don't feel like he even sees me. That im invisible. Though I come here and vent and go off like a firecracker at times, I feel that I've been pretty consistent in amicable behavior towards him.


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Originally Posted By: Kimmerz

Why would I want to be with someone that doesn't want to be with me now?

Why do I want to be with someone that's a conflict avoider?

Why do I want to be with someone that's emotionally unavailable?

This is part of the fog clearing for me. One thing that I've found very interesting is that it appers a good majority of the MLCers tend to have the conflict avoidant/emotionally unavailable personality.



Kimmerz,

I have read that true conflict avoiders, true emotionally unavailable people, are more inclined to experience MLC because they can't deal with the emotional upheaval that comes with transition and change. They want things, themselves, to stay the same. It's about control. If they let us in, they lose the control.

I've been asking myself the same questions since the initial shock of BD passed. I know the answers intellectually, but then there's the emotional side of it. I wonder if it's because love is a choice, and I've chosen to love my H, warts and all, unconditionally, regardless of whether he loves me back. And we of course crave being with people we love.

But lately I've thought there's two parts to it, which has helped me to find some peace. One part is the unconditional love I have for H. The other is the conditions upon which he and I can be together, the way I must be treated, the pragmatics of it all. I absolutely would not be in the marriage I had before where emotionally, intimately, I was ignored and kept at bay.

Those conditions include honesty, openness, trust and showing up in our marriage. Men, people, as you describe your H, are not incapable but are unwilling to do this. They are ruled by fear. I continue to love my H, but have realized that until he shows that he's willing to meet those conditions I don't want to be with him. Every *relationship* he has is doomed to failure because there's no true relating in it.

And then there's the question, "what is marriage?" For me, it's the person you're with and the life you build together. When you love the person, and when you built a good life, and when, in your case, you produced beautiful children, of course you'd want that and would put up with a lot to keep it.

As an emotionally unavailable conflict avoider who has chosen to run out on a marriage, such as your H and Golf Mom's, they've got a long road to travel. Their issues are beyond the *run of the mill* MLC. It's not simply a transition or self-identity thing. I suspect your and Golf Mom's Hs are also runners, like my H. I now know that he always has been, but didn't see it before because, in his words, he hid from me....in major ways as it turns out. "It's in the past, it doesn't matter" was his favourite response. Run much?

My therapist said to me that perhaps I'd gotten too close to H and he was fearful about what I'd find out. That fits well with his saying he hid from me and that he's scared to "grow a set" and deal with his issues. I wonder if something happened to him as a child, or if his "ineffectual" father and dominant mother never taught him how to relate intimately.

But I digress.

The questions you're asking yourself, I think, will help in building a soft place to land as you begin to see all the holes in the core of your relationship that come from being with someone who is present physically but never emotionally, who has a profound fear of true intimacy.

It's a tough road for us too. You're strong. And you're wise. So often people look outwards for answers, but the fact that you're looking inwards so you can understand YOUR motivations will find you in a much better place at the end of the day.


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Kimmerz, keep being you no matter what. Believe in your changes and know that they are now a permanent part of you. Your XH doesn't see you because he can't see past himself and his own needs. I truly believe in seeing people for who they are today. It makes it's so much easier to move on from the past and deal with others in the present. You deserve to be seen and accepted for who you are right now, faults and all. One thing that frustrates me to no end is my H constantly telling me that he doesn't believe people can change. In his mind, that's why he doesn't want to come home because eventually it will be more of the same. This is how little belief he has in himself and how little motivation he has to deal with his own faults. I guess, for the moment, he'll just continue believing all of the negative things about people including himself. You are asking yourself good questions. Believe me, I'm asking myself the same ones. I wonder what's broken in me that keeps me hanging on. Is it belief in my marriage vows or am I afraid of being alone? I won't know the answer until I move through my grief. Life with my H, at times, was not easy. I wanted more attention then I got, which left me feeling needy. He is secretive which had me concerned about money. He was somewhat antisocial (opposite of me) and at times that was embarrassing. However, when we spent time together and were connected I enjoyed being with him and felt very good about my M. It's all very confusing. My attorney is certain that he'll get tired of his fantasy life and realize what he had, albeit it might be too late. She sees it happen all the time. As for you, just keep moving toward a place of contentment. It will then be your choice whether you want you XH back in your life. You wil no longer except what he gave you before. You'll want more from a relationship with him or someone else. As for venting, keep coming here and doing it. I'm sorry that my response flip flopped between your situation and mine.

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Kimmerz Offline OP
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Hi there Golf mOm and GWn,

Thank you so much for these responses. I've read them twice and it's just so reassuring to hear your words.

Interesting things have happened with XH. He now is telling me about his physical ailments for the first time in a year. Past experience is he's stressing over something. Migraine headaches and bad back spasms always seemed to show up out of no where when he seemed in an extra depressed or sour mood for prolonged period of time. Can't tell you how many times I've worked on his back trying to get the knotts out. His headaches...well result of the gun blast.

My neighbor said she saw XH and OW shopping last week. She said XH appeared frustrated and and unhappy and was storming out of the store. OW didn't look happy either. Neighbor said she sees OW from time to time and she's just not a happy person by nature. I think she's aquaintences with OW. Im not close friends with the neighbor, so I find her obesrvation neutral, which I appreciate.

XH offered to bring home a BBq for me last week but backed out last night because his back hurt and has requested the girls ride the bus in the mornings if he's in a lot of pain.

I question...Did OW put a stop to him helping out? Or is this an excuse? Back problems are extremely valid with him.

I feel observant, but not obsessed with analyzing at this point.


M=42 XH=44
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Kimmerz,
No one really knows for sure what is going on w/your xh, but I would venture to say that his back is giving him a fit. It's a valid excuse and I don't think the ow had anything to do w/this request.

His sharing of his health issues is interesting. He may be sharing the info to get your sympathy or he is finally opening up and telling you about it. It's also a telling sign of his depression, as you noted...sounds to me like his little piece of heaven isn't so heavenly.

As for your neighbor, I think you already know this, but be careful. If she's bringing you information, you can bet that she's also carrying whatever you say back to anyone who will listen.

Sit quietly and additional information will fall into your lap.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
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idk Kimmerz, I'll go with snodderly...sit quietly...interesting how they come to us when they start to open, isn't it? I thought we were chopped liver... wink


In the depths of winter, I finally learned that within me there lay an invincible summer. - Albert Camus

Uncertainty is the very condition which impels people to unfold their powers.-Eric Fromm

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Kimmerz Offline OP
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LOL.... Isn't it T? Thank you Master Snodderly for your keen insights. I will keep them in mind.

I really am appreciating my gift of time and space now.

One thing I noticed that I find odd. Over the last year XH would bring up his health issues with me, as he has recently. In the past, the complaints of back pain, headaches, gout, neck, nasal congestion, etc. I did find it would come when it appeared he needed attention...this is while we were still married and living together.

NOW... he will bring these things up. He will say what he has to say and when I comment back he literally drops the convo like a hot potato. Example: XH: I slept in with a migraine this morning.
Kimmerz: Im sorry to hear you're still having migraines.

Dead silence for days. Then last night: XH"Might have to find someone else to move it for you (BBQ) if youre in a hurry. I wont be doing any lifting for a week or more my back is a major mess right now, need the kids to ride the bus in the morning".

Kimmerz"Holy crap what happened?"

XH: No clue just lifting at work I think.

Kimmerz; Ok I wil tell the kids. BTW I ditched the BBq when I saw what a piece is was. getting another one from a friend at work".

Dead Silence again from him.

So if he was wanting attention....why would he want it from me of all people?

What I find entertaining now is that when he left he said he physically felt much better. Said he was sleeping well and his back quit hurting. Of course he turned right around and told me he was drinking mixed drinks along with sleeping pills just so he could get to sleep. Then he'd slip and say his feet hurt.

I don't think he worked today and he will have the girls tomorrow night and the next night.

I dont know what's happened to me, but I feel I've let alot of this anger and resentment go. I feel like I finally did get my answer, which was WHY did this not work out for he and I.

Now, I know why. My second question has been, could it ever work out for him and I? I know the answer to that too. Only if a miraculous event came to pass and he were to achieve the ability to be emotionally available, physically available, and assertive.

Will that ever happen? Lol.....I do believe in miracles, but I am not holding my breath on that one.


M=42 XH=44
M=18 T=21
D14 D11
Divorced 4/2012
XH marries OW 6/2014.
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