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#2239335 - 04/19/12 07:52 PM Re: We started marriage counseling & now he wants out [Re: fightingforit]
BklynMom Offline
Member

Registered: 09/29/11
Posts: 1750
Your H is such a a$$. But its exactly the same thing my H would say.

You need to ignore their irrational and insane comments. Time is on our side. Your H thinks your S sadness is a passing phase. Time will show him otherwise. Each drop off and pick off will have some degree of sadness. Children will always ask for Mommy & Daddy.

I know its hard to swallow that he is not gonna wake up soon but take the high road. Let him look like a fool.
_________________________
----
M 39
H 35
D5,D4
M 4
T 9
ILYBNILWY 5/18/11
Left 7/11/11
Divorced 12/1/13


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#2239339 - 04/19/12 08:04 PM Re: We started marriage counseling & now he wants out [Re: BklynMom]
fightingforit Offline
Member

Registered: 03/23/12
Posts: 96

Thanks, I just ordered the Mr. nice guy book to my kindle, will start it tonight after they go to bed. I see your day was rough too, you are a bit ahead of me so I am gaining inspiration from your non-reactiveness. I felt like you did, like this fake family thing may make it easier for them which I don't want but I know it's better for the kids. Here's to better days ahead!
_________________________
M 37, H 37
M 10, T 12
S 4
D 2
3/14/12 ILYBNILWY
4/2/12 H consults a L, files nothing
4/26/12 H moves to his new place

I do not want to have regrets

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#2239395 - 04/19/12 11:53 PM Re: We started marriage counseling & now he wants out [Re: fightingforit]
Maggie3 Offline
Member

Registered: 03/28/12
Posts: 157
He's not the same man you married, remember that. Your kids and you deserve to be treated better- keep staying strong and try to find the little positive moments in your day and focus on those.
_________________________
Me-32
H-31
M-1yr, 9mos/T-6.5yrs
No kids, 3 pets
H estranged father passes away- 8/11
Bomb- 1/15/12
Began LRT- 4/1/12

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#2239505 - 04/20/12 02:35 PM Re: We started marriage counseling & now he wants out [Re: fightingforit]
Underdog Offline
Member

Registered: 04/08/03
Posts: 6115
Loc: Denver
Fifi,

Wow, I haven't posted to anyone with advice in a really long time, so forgive me for being rusty.

So... why not take a new tact with your son? Can you ask your H to let your son help him move? My oldest was 8 when her dad moved out, so I had him ask her to help him so that she understood that she had a place with him and to let her feel part of that process. It helped... especially if you are going to be splitting parenting time. Help your son realize that dad's place is also his home.

Quote:
I said that I feel so sad and divorce is against my morals.


Well, dear, you're going to have to stop making statements like that around him. It smacks of being all about you, and you can pretty much predict how he feels about that, right?

If you have difficulty using all the DB skills presented, choose one big one and own it. Are you the kind of person who just spouts out whatever you're thinking? Then invoke a 24 hour rule and stick to it. Are you the kind of person who has to be right? Then work on your skills in ceasing pointing that out to him and others. Do you continually emotionally vomit on others? Then work on contingency plans to do that in safe places and with safe people. Do you operate by the seat of your pants in pretty much everything you do? Then make a list of rules of engagement and stick to them... as long as the list is fairly short and simple.

Get it? Do a 180 on your worst behavior or at a minimum, the one your H throws at you the most often. Work on *showing* him that you are committed to changing what he dislikes the most in you.

BTW, this does not mean that he doesn't bear responsibility for the condition of his side of the street. But you can't control what's going on over there - only what's going on with yours.

I did read that your H is P/A. My XH is too. This is probably a learned coping behavior from his childhood. Only he can cure it. But I mimized its ugly head when I *could* help. In situations where I knew he would say one thing but think another and probably act on that, upfront I gave him permission to disagree with me. For example, if I asked him to take one of our kids to a birthday party, and in the past he would say yes but not act on it... I rephrased how I asked for a favor. "H, it's okay if you say no, but I've got XXX going on and I'm wondering if you would be able to take son to a birthday party on Saturday?" When I deliberately invoked the concept of a choice ('cause they truly believe that you force them), he realized that he could choose to say no. It took time to make good headway here, but I really worked on it, and then I thanked him (without pointing out a changing behavior) for choosing to keep his word. This also means that you can't punish him for saying no. That's *YOUR* choice, right?

Does this make sense?

Your H is on to something with assigning your S4's anxiety to your reactions. Try not to own all of it, but if your S4 sees you wrapped around the flag pole, chances are good he's going to follow you. So put your big girl panties on and work on being neutral in front of your S4. If you're okay, he's going to see that and act accordingly too.

I'll put a reminder to come back and check on you. I don't come around very often here (mostly to see old friends) and with my D18 graduating in a few weeks, things are a little crazy right now.

Take care--

smile Betsey
_________________________
"There are only 2 ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle."

Albert Einstein

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#2240302 - 04/24/12 12:41 AM Re: We started marriage counseling & now he wants out [Re: Underdog]
fightingforit Offline
Member

Registered: 03/23/12
Posts: 96

Underdog, thanks for giving me food for thought.

Quote:
So... why not take a new tact with your son? Can you ask your H to let your son help him move? My oldest was 8 when her dad moved out, so I had him ask her to help him so that she understood that she had a place with him and to let her feel part of that process. It helped... especially if you are going to be splitting parenting time. Help your son realize that dad's place is also his home.


[color:#FF6666]
I am open to any and all suggestions about how to help my S4 though this. My MC (both of our IC) has suggested that she doesn't want the kids to see his new place, it would be easier if all of his visits with him are at our house. This is the exact opposite of the advice she gave my girlfriend who sees her as an IC. She said the sooner the kids she her ExH new place the better. If I am being honest I hope it means that there is hope for us long term.
Quote:

Are you the kind of person who just spouts out whatever you're thinking?[/quote]


Guilty as charged. I am working on this with my IC. I have been doing much better in the past 5 days. Doesn't sound like long but hey it's a start.


[quote]Get it? Do a 180 on your worst behavior or at a minimum, the one your H throws at you the most often. Work on *showing* him that you are committed to changing what he dislikes the most in you.[/quote

He would 100% say that my biggest issue is control. I have taken control of some things (house, kids stuff, social planning) . He is passive aggressive so in our major life decisions I feel like he gets his way a lot (i.e. our current situation). So I will work on control, this gets easier for me as I am detaching.

[quote]
When I deliberately invoked the concept of a choice ('cause they truly believe that you force them), he realized that he could choose to say no.


[/color]Wise, wise advice. I am going to start this one today. I think that is why he says I control, because he never tells me when he doesn't want to do something!

Thanks for your post, I read your bio on the vets forum, sounds like you really lived the principles and continue to do so smile
_________________________
M 37, H 37
M 10, T 12
S 4
D 2
3/14/12 ILYBNILWY
4/2/12 H consults a L, files nothing
4/26/12 H moves to his new place

I do not want to have regrets

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#2240310 - 04/24/12 01:11 AM Re: We started marriage counseling & now he wants out [Re: fightingforit]
fightingforit Offline
Member

Registered: 03/23/12
Posts: 96
I think that I am s-l-o-w-l-y starting to catch onto DB. The past few days have been better. I am still sad, acknowledging that to myself and my close friends, but I am starting to do a few things I thought I would never be able to accomplish.

Detachment.
It feels surreal, to detach. I know I am only supposed to believe 50% of what they do and none of what they say. The the facts are that he consulted a lawyer and signed a 1 year lease that started last weekend. He describes being so unhappy because of me. I want a partner, not a prisoner. Detachment has come to me in the past few days much easier than I ever expected. I hope it is a gift from a higher power, not just a passing phase.

180's
1. Don't control, or anything that resembles it.
2. Don't manipulate with guilt. This hasn't worked so far, it just makes him push me further away.
3. Try to give him compliments on what he does well, instead of pointing out what is wrong with things he does/ says.
4. Don't react to harsh words/ statements with "overly emotional" responses.

Ok, I think that's enough homework for me for now.

A quick update on my current sitch is that he picked up the keys tonight for his new place. We are having a 2 hour session with our C tomorrow to decide on the best timing for the move, that will make the easiest transition for the kids. He has texted me a few times that he is sad, I am not sure how to respond. I usually say something like "it's a sad situation, thanks for letting me know how you are feeling" ( That is a 180 for him).

The old me would have just pushed to get him out asap to ease my anxiety. It has been hard to have him here in body but not mind and spirit. I am going to practice my 180's tomorrow during my session, and not control the timing of the decisions.

If anyone has any other advice for tomorrows C session please share!

Thanks smile
_________________________
M 37, H 37
M 10, T 12
S 4
D 2
3/14/12 ILYBNILWY
4/2/12 H consults a L, files nothing
4/26/12 H moves to his new place

I do not want to have regrets

Top
#2240423 - 04/24/12 02:14 PM Re: We started marriage counseling & now he wants out [Re: fightingforit]
Underdog Offline
Member

Registered: 04/08/03
Posts: 6115
Loc: Denver
Hi there Fifi,

(Sorry, I like acronyms and something tells me that you are so not a Fifi in real life... wink )

I was a little surprised that your IC gave you and your friend completely opposite advice. What's up with that? Well, you have to do whatever YOU feel is best for your son. That's it in a nutshell.

On your first reply... something I learned in my MC with my ex. I was guilty of the same thing, was charged with the same offenses and in my way of thinking, because he *didn't* take control, weelllll...... someone had to, right? And damn it, that was me!

But what if... what if... you decided just once NOT to be in control? Do you think that they'd fall apart if you didn't? Well, maybe. But maybe not. Maybe control is your way of enabling. Maybe control is your way of pretending that having it means you have your sh!t together. But maybe control is an illusion. Chew on that for a bit. Find out (at least in your head) why you feel you HAVE to have control. That's usually an inside job, and only you know the answer. My own was based on a wacked out version of the chaos theory. If I had control, I could fix the problem with my strength, faith and willpower. Unfortunately, it didn't allow for mother nature's intervention or the free will of others. frown That was another 2 years in therapy...

So getting back to your 180s. REALLY good work, Fifi. I mean brilliant. You're paying attention to what isn't working. You're learning not to have answers for his musings. Keep going! BTW, I found detachment did come in phases, but once I got the hang of it and became cognizant of my need to be better, it became something I worked at. And it became easier to do once I knew I could achieve it with some attention to the matter.

I really don't want you to give up hope. Leases can be broken. And I personally found it much easier to employ DB methods with my XH living elsewhere. I was happier in my own home, and it gave me every opportunity to make my interactions with him positive and meaningful as I possibly could make them. So try to wrap your head around the thought that his moving out is a GIFT. Yes, that's right... a gift. He's taken a brave step to take control over what he can control (which is very unnatural to a true P/A personality). He will be left with his own thoughts. And an extra cheer for you for not nibbling on that bait with him.

(Actually, I could jump... you got something huge you realized and employed... and it just may be a sticking point with him in future contact with you. You didn't take control of his emotions for him or emotionally vomit on him about how you were feeling. Excellent!)

Try not to get caught up in that statement of believing half of what they do and none of what they say. I do believe in it to a large degree, but when you start assigning weight to what you will believe and hear, it skews things. What I would say is to pay less attention to words that are not followed by action, and more attention to actions that are supported with words. They're telling. And for goodness sake, do not let on that you are analyzing him! (I can promise you from experience that he won't like being some experiment. grin)

I won't dispense advice on your C session tomorrow. Undoubtedly, whatever you need to discuss will take center stage there. Go with it.

And I really liked that you recognize you don't want to be married to a prisoner. Wish I had thought of that line myself... I did know that I hated focusing on the one person in my life who thought I was a complete biatch, when there were dozens who thought I was a good person. Eventually, I learned to let go of his projections and self directed musings that he vomited on me. It just took time.

So, the moderators here used to tell us that what we focus on expands. That was undoubtedly the best observation I ever received here. As long as you focus on the problem, it just gets bigger billing in your life. If you focus on you and YOUR life, that will also take center stage.

Drop the rope, let him wallow around in his own pond, and you work on making your pond the most attractive, fun place ever. No matter what he decides to do, you will gain from replacing his name on the marquee with your own. Don't you totally deserve that?

Good luck tomorrow!

smile Betsey
_________________________
"There are only 2 ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle."

Albert Einstein

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#2240602 - 04/25/12 02:48 AM Re: We started marriage counseling & now he wants out [Re: Underdog]
Cadet Offline
Member

Registered: 11/24/09
Posts: 5113
_________________________
Me-60, D27,S26

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#2240758 - 04/25/12 05:13 PM Re: We started marriage counseling & now he wants out [Re: Underdog]
Maggie3 Offline
Member

Registered: 03/28/12
Posts: 157
I did know that I hated focusing on the one person in my life who thought I was a complete biatch, when there were dozens who thought I was a good person. Eventually, I learned to let go of his projections and self directed musings that he vomited on me. It just took time.

I like this Underdog!
_________________________
Me-32
H-31
M-1yr, 9mos/T-6.5yrs
No kids, 3 pets
H estranged father passes away- 8/11
Bomb- 1/15/12
Began LRT- 4/1/12

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