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Wise woman. smile

It's very common for people caught up in affairs to admit to one level less than the truth, Bestgal. Some call this "trickle-truth." In this way, "there's nothing going on" = "friends", "we're just friends" = EA, and EA may equal PA.


Starsky


M57 W 57; D30 D28 S24 S20 GD7 GD2 GD1 GD5m GD1m
BD 5/07; W's affair 5/07-8/07

At the end of every hard-earned day, people gotta find some reason to believe. (Bruce Springsteen)
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Originally Posted By: Bestgal
I know that this is hardly the time to be jumping back into sexual intimacy with him, but between the lessening of our having sex over time, added to the affair that he recently had, its really made me feel rejected by him sexually.


That's it! I'm sorry to have to tell you, honey, that your thinking is stressed right now. And, you are probably not making the most important decisions rationally. Please believe me when I say this...Your first sentence, here, is the most important one you have said, and you should be listening to your own advice, your own words, and your own voice. It sounds to me like you have the wisdom. You only need to follow it. Having sex with a man who has been with other(s) is not safe! Until you get tested, you are not safe -- no matter what anybody tells you. Don't listen to themuntil you get tested, please.

Originally Posted By: Bestgal
I've been wanting to be with him even more than before as the days go by...and last night he said something like he can't even begin to think any thoughts of sex right now.


I have heard of this phenomona (some women want to have sex more when their marriage is being threatened). I don't know what causes it, but it is also not wise to engage, expecially when the cheating spose has indicated that he 1. either doesn't want it, 2. can't think about sex right now or 3. has admitted that there 'has been' another woman. These are all excellent indicators that he is not thinking about quitting the affair(s) and is choosing other(s) over you. Trust me when I say this, Men don't stop thinking about sex. They just stop thinking about doing the deed with you.

I know this is hard to hear, but right now, you shouldn't be wondering if he will "ever come back." You should be thinking about protecting yourself and possibly getting away from him until you are both seriously considering the road to recovery, and he is fervently attending the therapist with you and doing as he is told to do by the therapist, which will surely be to get rid of the other woman/women.

Oh, and one more important thing...it's true that most men have an affair with one women, and that's all it is. But, some men only admit to one affair. Sometimes there are multiple affairs that you don't know about, or will never know about unless you hire a detective, or you are an investigator. And, most of the time, those don't pan out well. It ruins your health, your wealth and your view of yourself. Don't trust anything he tells you until and if he is firmly entrenched in going the therapist route. You won't know anything until you have had at least several visits there. Don't trust him at all. You mentioned hearing two voices inside yourself. One is your heart, the other is your head. Don't listen to your heart until the coast is clear. Listen only to your head. Protect yourself!

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Quote:
Originally Posted By: poet
Originally Posted By: Bestgal
I know that this is hardly the time to be jumping back into sexual intimacy with him, but between the lessening of our having sex over time, added to the affair that he recently had, its really made me feel rejected by him sexually.


That's it! I'm sorry to have to tell you, honey, that your thinking is stressed right now. And, you are probably not making the most important decisions rationally. Please believe me when I say this...Your first sentence, here, is the most important one you have said, and you should be listening to your own advice, your own words, and your own voice. It sounds to me like you have the wisdom. You only need to follow it. Having sex with a man who has been with other(s) is not safe! Until you get tested, you are not safe -- no matter what anybody tells you. Don't listen to themuntil you get tested, please.

Originally Posted By: Bestgal
I've been wanting to be with him even more than before as the days go by...and last night he said something like he can't even begin to think any thoughts of sex right now.


I have heard of this phenomona (some women want to have sex more when their marriage is being threatened). I don't know what causes it, but it is also not wise to engage, expecially when the cheating spose has indicated that he 1. either doesn't want it, 2. can't think about sex right now or 3. has admitted that there 'has been' another woman. These are all excellent indicators that he is not thinking about quitting the affair(s) and is choosing other(s) over you. Trust me when I say this, Men don't stop thinking about sex. They just stop thinking about doing the deed with you.


I do understand that those above statements can be excellent indicators that men aren't thinking about stopping their affairs, but I have to disagree on that point...I know I don't exactly have a monopoly on the truth here these past few weeks, but he has said and tried to show me in every way possible that his affair is in fact over. Does he desire sex with me? Certainly doesn't seem like it at the moment! Will he ever? I believe so. We had a conversation last night about our relationship as well as our sex life and why each of us felt like it went off course. I think we were both surprised to hear such candid and to the point responses. There were things that neither of us intimated to the other and we both agreed that each of us brought some unresolved issues to the marriage.



Quote:
I know this is hard to hear, but right now, you shouldn't be wondering if he will "ever come back." You should be thinking about protecting yourself and possibly getting away from him until you are both seriously considering the road to recovery, and he is fervently attending the therapist with you and doing as he is told to do by the therapist, which will surely be to get rid of the other woman/women.


Yes - I agree with that, that I need to protect myself. I guess I'm doing that to the best of my ability right now. Getting away from him - that hasn't worked for me....it's only this past week that we've been living under the same roof again, and have started being very honest with each other. (myself included). I wouldn't want to lose that...






Quote:
Oh, and one more important thing...it's true that most men have an affair with one women, and that's all it is. But, some men only admit to one affair. Sometimes there are multiple affairs that you don't know about, or will never know about unless you hire a detective, or you are an investigator. And, most of the time, those don't pan out well. It ruins your health, your wealth and your view of yourself. Don't trust anything he tells you until and if he is firmly entrenched in going the therapist route. You won't know anything until you have had at least several visits there. Don't trust him at all. You mentioned hearing two voices inside yourself. One is your heart, the other is your head. Don't listen to your heart until the coast is clear. Listen only to your head. Protect yourself!




Makes sense to me. I don't trust him, and he knows that. All I can say at this point is that I'm grateful for the recent honesty. He asked me last night if I thought I would ever trust him again. I told him that would really depend on him, and how much progress we're able to make together. Ultimately I try to pay attention to my gut. When something doesn't feel or sound right, it usually isn't. But in order to have any chance of getting past this, I think my part is to be guarded, but open enough to not shut him out completely.

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Originally Posted By: Bestgal

Makes sense to me. I don't trust him, and he knows that. All I can say at this point is that I'm grateful for the recent honesty. He asked me last night if I thought I would ever trust him again. I told him that would really depend on him, and how much progress we're able to make together. Ultimately I try to pay attention to my gut. When something doesn't feel or sound right, it usually isn't. But in order to have any chance of getting past this, I think my part is to be guarded, but open enough to not shut him out completely.



This sounds very wise to me. whistle


Starsky


M57 W 57; D30 D28 S24 S20 GD7 GD2 GD1 GD5m GD1m
BD 5/07; W's affair 5/07-8/07

At the end of every hard-earned day, people gotta find some reason to believe. (Bruce Springsteen)
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Originally Posted By: gabbysmom23
I may have missed this, but has he actually said he is stopping the affair? That it is over? Have you had this conversation?


Gabbysmom23 - he has said he stopped the affair the day after I confronted him about it. We talk about it whenever I have questions (usually before we go to bed). The one time she's called him since, he's told me about. He said that his affair was a huge mistake that hurt us and that he didn't expect that I would believe anything he said. He said that all he could do is show me over time that he can be trustworthy. He has pretty much been an open book about it, and about our marriage and sex life in general.

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Originally Posted By: Bestgal
Originally Posted By: gabbysmom23
I may have missed this, but has he actually said he is stopping the affair? That it is over? Have you had this conversation?


Gabbysmom23 - he has said he stopped the affair the day after I confronted him about it. We talk about it whenever I have questions (usually before we go to bed). The one time she's called him since, he's told me about. He said that his affair was a huge mistake that hurt us and that he didn't expect that I would believe anything he said. He said that all he could do is show me over time that he can be trustworthy. He has pretty much been an open book about it, and about our marriage and sex life in general.


Bestgal, has the idea of a TRANSPARENCY plan been discussed between the two of you? This would be a great way to gauge his sincerity, and more importantly for you to be safe again in the marriage.


Starsky


M57 W 57; D30 D28 S24 S20 GD7 GD2 GD1 GD5m GD1m
BD 5/07; W's affair 5/07-8/07

At the end of every hard-earned day, people gotta find some reason to believe. (Bruce Springsteen)
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Originally Posted By: Starsky309
Originally Posted By: Bestgal
Originally Posted By: gabbysmom23
I may have missed this, but has he actually said he is stopping the affair? That it is over? Have you had this conversation?


Gabbysmom23 - he has said he stopped the affair the day after I confronted him about it. We talk about it whenever I have questions (usually before we go to bed). The one time she's called him since, he's told me about. He said that his affair was a huge mistake that hurt us and that he didn't expect that I would believe anything he said. He said that all he could do is show me over time that he can be trustworthy. He has pretty much been an open book about it, and about our marriage and sex life in general.


Bestgal, has the idea of a TRANSPARENCY plan been discussed between the two of you? This would be a great way to gauge his sincerity, and more importantly for you to be safe again in the marriage.


Starsky



Starsky, we haven't discussed it at length, although last night I said that I believed both of us being completely honest was really the only way to go. He agreed - not sure if that's what you mean? Can you be more specific about how I would term that? Is it like having each other's passwords transparency, or just being very honest verbally about everything?

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It's everything -- sharing e-mail usernames and passwords, keeping his cellphone unlocked at all times, swapping daily schedules with each other, changing his cellphone # and having detailed billing on the new line come straight to you (and/or the ability to go online and see the call detail). Those sorts of things.

Just google "infidelity" "transparency plan" and you can get some further research on it. The main concept is that it's not enough, obviously, to rely upon the honesty of the person who just had the affair, in order to make the betrayed spouse feel comfortable that contact has stopped with the OM/OW.

It also eliminates any need for "snooping" -- which is against DB teaching, and will only drive you nuts.


Starsky


M57 W 57; D30 D28 S24 S20 GD7 GD2 GD1 GD5m GD1m
BD 5/07; W's affair 5/07-8/07

At the end of every hard-earned day, people gotta find some reason to believe. (Bruce Springsteen)
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Originally Posted By: Starsky309
Originally Posted By: 25yearsmlc
I understand Starsky's point about the STDs...and the testing.

I could be wrong, but I don't think it's necessary in your situation.

It's YOUR LIFE and I don't want to advise you to be dangerous, but for ME if I were in your shoes

I'd find it depressing but I don't know your h.


I'm sorry, 25, but this is possibly the most grossly irresponsible thing I've read on here in a long time. When it comes to being medically safe, when a spouse has had an active affair, whether or not it's "depressing" is really no concern to me, nor should it be to anyone. If Bestgal has any doubts about this, she should ask her OB/GYN, and follow their advice. I'm really not advising anything that a good doctor wouldn't also recommend.

oh Starsky, I KNEW that would get to you! And I did qualify it. Also said I was speaking for myself. And my other point (which you didn't really focus on b/c you were so riled up and all)

was that the testing demand from SOME of the LBSers is destructively presented.

It matters A LOT how she says this.


And I admit up front, I could be wrong. I just think the "demanding" nature of it sounds off putting and punitive and not reconciliatory.

It's intensely personal and it is a delicate matter not to be said in such a black and white way, IMO.

At the time (maybe it's changed now) all she had an admission of making out. She has no proof of actual intercourse, and both parties deny it, or are we skipping over that? So when you advise her to demand that he & she get tested, it's also saying flat out he's lying to her.

I didn't say I believe him,
but I do think it makes it a tad harder to demand than if there was an open affair wherein everyone knew it was a done deal.

Isn't this OW living with another man? Your response will be "but OW cheated/made out so how 'monogamous' can she be?" I get that.

But are you lumping hookers in with every OW?
I'm sincerely asking.

anyhow... as gabbysmom says, an STD is pretty damn depressing too. Point taken.



Besgal, I want to caution you in that you're trusting that your husband is telling you the truth right now. HE HAS ALREADY LIED TO YOU, and when people get caught up in affairs, they LIE -- period.

Now is no time to operate based on your FEELINGS. Do what your HEAD tells you is the right thing to do, and do some research about infidelity. You are projecting onto your husband your own values, and he's simply not in the same place right now.

I don't know how much plainer I can say it.

Starsky


M: 57 H: 60
M: 35 yrs
S30,D28,D19
H off to Alaska 2006
Recon 7/07- 8/08
*2016*
X = "ALASKA 2.0"
GROUND HOG DAY
I File D 10/16
OW
DIV 2/26/2018
X marries OW 5/2016

= CLOSURE 4 ME
Embrace the Change
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Originally Posted By: Fergie
Originally Posted By: 25yearsmlc
I'd find it depressing but I don't know your h. MY H is an MD and the idea that he'd

sleep with someone who had sores on her genitals or any sign of disease and not use protection was just insane.

This is ridiculous. I can't can't believe I'm hearing this in 2012.

You realize 30% of women show no symptoms from chlamydial infections. Left untreated it can lead to infertility and has been linked to cervical cancer. And it's completely treatable!

My mother had cervical cancer, I have 3 RNs and 2 MDs in the family other than my h. YES I discussed it with people who know ME and H and medicine....


HSV can show no signs as well.

That belief that one can look at a person and tell if they have an STD, or that protection is 100%, is just ignorant.


YOU ARE MISQUOTING ME, AND YOU ARE INSULTING ME...

You didn't read the nuances or qualifications or caveats. Not surprising.



After my wife's affair, I got tested.

If it would have managed to happen we were to reconcile, I'd DEMAND she get tested and I wouldn't worry one single bit about her *feelings*.



I don't know you at all (& God knows you don't know me)

But Your wording & approach is rude & offensive.

I don't know if it's how you were with your ex-wife, but rather than prolong the hijack, I need to end this.

I got tested when I get my yearly PAP smear. Enough already.



M: 57 H: 60
M: 35 yrs
S30,D28,D19
H off to Alaska 2006
Recon 7/07- 8/08
*2016*
X = "ALASKA 2.0"
GROUND HOG DAY
I File D 10/16
OW
DIV 2/26/2018
X marries OW 5/2016

= CLOSURE 4 ME
Embrace the Change
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