Husband has moved in with affair

[8anb]

Well, no one has posted a response to me and i am wondering if i am meaningful? i have not spoken to my spouse since monday, 2/27 and although he called me this morning i did not answer. i am trying to figure out how to detach with children as he has text our daughter who will not have anything to do with him at this point. i want my children to continue to love and support their father during this time but do what they have to in order to deal with the situation. i just do not want them to do something they may regret in the future or even worse not to have a relationship with their dad. I am not sure how to react when he calls as i have stated i believe he sends mixed signals. it seems he cares about us, but then i feel he only calls/texts because he wants to know what is going on, but i am not allowed to know or ask how things are with him - just does not seem fair. Any thoughts on his behavior or what might be a good response? i have also been thinking about contacting one of the divorce coaches to for advice if i am doing the right things or should try different approaches - not sure what to make of his actions. don't know if i mentioned this or not, but he took nothing from the house just a few clothing items but left everything does that mean anything?

[TSquared2]

Hi 8RgB6anb,

I will throw out my .02 on some things, I am sure some of the vets will be around soon with better seasoned advice.

how can i detach when he continues to contact me - only to see what is going on at the house or with the D or GC? and when they get off the phone tell you they love you - how do you deal with this?

Do not answer, let it go to VM, etc, UNLESS it is an emergency, especially concerning the kids. Call/email/text him back when YOU are in a good, strong, detached state of mind. If he says he loves you, don't say anything...I have not been replying at all to that (but it has only been said a couple of times the past 8 months or so, I haven't had much opportunity to practice this and see if any effect... Let him talk, validate as needed, do not respond to inquiries with much detail..."things are fine" (and fake it if need be). Did you see sandi2's "37 Rules"? Print it up and look at them until they are second nature.

i believe he sends mixed signals

He doesn't really know what he wants yet, despite what he says I would reckon. Be prepared for a lot of this...my W has been all over the place on this journey.

i sent him a brief overview of MLC and said i think that is what he was going through and needed to get a counselor to help him work through issues, but he insisted of course he has no issues and is doing what makes him happy as he has fell out of love with me.

Don't do this...if MLC, then its his journey...he will NOT accept anything you say, any books or articles will just push him away...if the sky is blue and you acknowledge it, he will say its pink, or lime green...what has helped me a lot is to think of W as a teenager (we just had gotten through our first teenage child going through his process, so had some "training" there). He doesn't think he has a problem, because you were the problem (we know differently, of course, we did contribute to M issues, but...).

i just do not want them to do something they may regret in the future or even worse not to have a relationship with their dad.

Not your responsibility. Period. Just try to explain, best you can to them, what MAY be going on (maybe give them some MLC links to read up on).

What have you found to be YOUR contributions to the M issues? We are responsible for some of it, we need to figure out what we are responsible for and decide to fix us.

Some one here said to look at this as a gift of time....time to look within and create the person we want to be for the rest of our lives. I found many of my old roles, while necessary and helpful during the first part of our M, many are no longer needed/useful and need to go.

What have you done for GAL?



T^2

[8anb]

ok, so he has been calling my office all morning and i decided to answer. he just wanted to know how our daughter and grandchld was - did not mention other two children. and since our dryer broke and i had to buy new one - made sure i took care of that and how his son could pick it up to save me the delivery fee - politely said that was ok. other than that proceeded to say he had to go to doctor for illness, but he is doing fine and checking to see how i was. got off the ph just saying bye - i guess he has reduced me to nothing more than a friend. how can i employ any db techniques if he has no contact and does not live with me?

[Grace_O]

Hey 8,

i just do not want them to do something they may regret in the future or even worse not to have a relationship with their dad.

You're job is not to damage their relationship with their dad. Nothing else. This is something I have struggled with for the last few years. I get it. What I did was make it clear to my D's they could always call him and if they want to see him, that's fine with me. I want the details so I can have a clue as to what ditch to look in should the need arise to go looking, but other than that, it's between them and their Dad.

it seems he cares about us, but then i feel he only calls/texts because he wants to know what is going on, but i am not allowed to know or ask how things are with him - just does not seem fair.

I think it's their way of staying connected, but what they may not see, is that in general, you "share" your life with people it's a way of connecting. When they don't sahre, it's the elephant in the room. It isn't fair. nothing about this is. What I learned to do was talk about D's and some of the things in my life. Your H is actually engaged at least with some of the kids. I know it isn't what you want. Is it something you can work with? That's up to you.

We all know the "I need to go be happy". I think part of them truly wants to be "friends". We've been part of their lives for so long and are the Mother's and Father's to their children. I think they are trying to reconcile what they want with what they've done and need to keep it friendly so they don't feel so bad. Yes, I do believe they feel guilty ane hurt behind the damage, BUT, they need to go be happy. Are they? Arguably.

don't know if i mentioned this or not, but he took nothing from the house just a few clothing items but left everything does that mean anything?

My H did the same. In my case did it mean anything? I don't think so, I think it was avoidance. My H is not yours though.

If you have the resources to use a DB coach, I would absoultely do it.

how can i employ any db techniques if he has no contact and does not live with me?

You emply them by working on you. That's really what they are about. Then when you do see him or have contact, you aren't a wounded animal. And you will see him and have some kind of contact, if for no other reason than the kids. Does this mean you jump every time? No. It means that right now your focus needs to be you and the kids.

A lot easier said than done. Takes lots of practice.

Since he's living with the A, you need to establish what boundaries you need for yourself too.

HUGS

[TSquared2]

i guess he has reduced me to nothing more than a friend.

It s_cks, is not fair, but be glad in a way that you are not getting the venomous angry spew from him. I have been thankful for the "friend" days, hours or minute or two in my sitch. Lately they are increasing for me.

Something posted on my sitch that may help give you a road map of sorts:

Got this off "Work thread for Jack - LBS Stages".
Maybe it helps.

Denial- Without a doubt the first phase. It could be as simple as denying that there is something wrong or amiss. Eventually turning to denial that it is actually happening to us, denying our part in everything, and the worse part.....denying our inner self's to come out. Maybe because we don't know how.....but at the point everything is caused by some outside catalyst. Sounds very MLC like to me?

Bargaining-I put this here instead of after anger because I feel the deep seated thought out anger is yet to come. We have felt the quick anger brought on by emotional pain and trauma, but not that thought out and reviewed anger that is to come. So we beg, plead, whatever it takes (during this stage I actually saw the positive side of an open marriage...granted my situation is only slightly different...LOL). We will do whatever it takes to save the marriage, yet haven't realized that the marriage is gone. dead! Fini!

Anger-This stage is third...why you ask? At this point our bargaining, selling of our soul, absolutely nothing has had the expected results. So we feel deep down anger and conviction that we are right...they are wrong....and We will win no matter who loses! This very well might be the hardest stage for anybody going through this. I have been scanning lightly in newcomers and see so many of that boards "mentors" stuck themselves in this stage. Trying to control what is uncontrollable out of anger and not based on sound decision.

Depression-At this point the energy involved with our anger is used up. We are burnt out......and now we are ALONE. Yes...we have been alone in the physical sense for some time, but the bucket is finally empty.

Resentment-Slightly different than anger.....more identified with long periods of being OK....then boom.....anger comes bursting back in very brief, but extremely intense blasts. I think it is almost a triggered response...a missed ball game, long weekend with a sick child, or coming up short on a mortgage payment. A catalyst disturbs the beast sleeping within.

Acceptance-I place this before forgiveness because I feel you have to accept the marriage is done before you can forgive the damage it's death has caused. At this point you know that you are alone. The resentment is gone because you accept that triggers from resentment are just yours alone to deal with. This is also a great time for personal growth. Confidence that you will survive on your own, that you can do thing yourself, and that the sun will still rise tomorrow.

Self-growth-Regaining on confidence continued. New perspective of the things around you. Constant questioning...of yourself and the principles we follow. At this point anything is possible....for ourselves.

Forgiveness-At this point you can forgive yourself for your part in the demise of the marriage. You can also see the pain the process has caused our spouse. The knowledge that neither party has really come out of this unscathed is apparent. You will know at this point that the journey was beneficial for both parties as long as neither got tripped up in their respective journeys. Maybe the marriage is renewed...maybe not.

Renewal-The world is different (I know that I see it differently). We are almost reborn to a life that that has unlimited potential. Things that were once taken for granted are cherished...and things thought essential are no longer that important. We are finally able to cash in on the independent self that we have found within ourselves.

Living again-At this point we move on, piece, whatever hand we have been dealt. Everything behind will be seen with compassion for the pain it caused and the enlightenment about ourselves that we achieved.

[25yearsmlc]

Hi 8,

First, before you jump on the "MLC" bandwagon let me assure you, it isn't that important to "diagnose" WHY this is happening, but what it is YOU can control and do about it. Plus I'm Not convinced MLCs end faster or with better results than other reasons. As for depression "always" being present...I don't disagree with that

but I think it can be well hidden behind their odd actions...and they may act happy and seem happy like my h did for a solid year before he confessed to me that he was "actually depressed", and he seemed surprised that he was.

I spent way too much time on my h's intentions/plans/feelings and wondering WHY he was doing what he was doing (asking unanswerable questions of the universe, repeatedly and ad nauseum)

when instead,

I could have changed my life and myself and my future and my kids...a whole lot faster. Bond is right when he says detachment is key, and I'll attach a quote about that at the end of this post.

No, he never complained.


really? I suggest you think again...

Of course I could be wrong, but I've been here a long time and he'd be the FIRST man to "never" have uttered a word of frustration, or a "sigh",

or show some passive aggressive behavior

Or have less or different sex...

either he's a pathological liar, has a medical/ mental condition, OR you missed some signals from him.

All I'm really saying is to Dig deeper... AND also, if your marriage had "No problems" before all this happened, then in effect you are powerless...

but if there are things YOU can work on to improve and change, then you are EMPOWERED...do you see this?


Everything started around Oct as i said - and since we have a blended family the issues were i was keeping him from his two children and family.


did he SAY anything about you keeping them from you? That's a complaint, btw. Any truth to it?

in actuallity his one son moved in with us a month after we were married - he was 15 at the time and stayed until he was 21. I was on active duty then and had orders to Hawaii and we decided we were going to retire where we currently were - with that I went to HI by myself with the 3 children as his then 21 yr old went to live with his mom as that is where his 11 yr old brother resided. during this time he came to HI every 6 months or more and still things were good.

so you two were apart for 6 months at a time?

Why didn't you remain together? I'm not getting the situation. My h is getting deployed to an unaccompanied combat zone soon, (in the Reserves) but if he were going anywhere else, we'd all be going.

What was the reasoning for being apart so much? I'm a bit confused.


he did feel i cheated on him there which i did not, but admitted to being closer to someone than i should have been.

So maybe some sort of emotional affair? How did you two resolve it? Did you simply drop the subject and hope it was all better? I'm being sincere, not sarcastic.

Anyway we move back in Aug 04 and 10 months later his other son moves in and he is now 15. he never would really interact with the family just his dad, when i mentioned it to my husband he would say that is the type of relationship we had and i needed to deal with it - hindsite we should have taken a diferent approach.

well this^^^ is a big issue...and I submit, a "complaint" of your h's (and of yours). You sound as if you were Not satisfied with what sounds like rude, odd behavior from your stepson, and your h did nothing to address it but tell you to suck it up. Is that an Accurate summation?


well in about a year and a half he went back to live with his mom because he felt he was not treated fairly - the child was doing poor in scholl and we are the type of parents that school is your only job and if you do well you can have almost anything you want he could not see this and my husband had even given him leadway but was in agreeance that he should leave.


(First, it's helpful and easier to read your posts if you write in shorter paragraphs-at least for me reading it...just an FYI)

Second, sounds as if the Stepson was unhappy too, correct? Your h was in agreement that your stepson should leave b/c the stepson wanted to leave, or because he was causing problems, or both?

When was this? And - How did your h behave AFTER his son left?


then a few years ago he went through drug rehab and i did not really support my husband on this but he also stated it was ok.


WHO went to rehab? Your h or your stepson?

And what do you mean when you say you "did not really support your h on this"? What did you want him (your h or your stepson) to do, instead of rehab? Why would you NOT support it?


so anyway in oct he said i prevented him from seeing his children although we made many trips and i made some alone to pick up his one son - they live in a different state. i have never kept him from any of his family and when we decided not to travel for holidays it was a mutual decison, however, not it looks as if i ma the bad guy. i want my marriage to work and have begun the process to mend the relationships with his two children and it is going pretty well.

you cannot change the past OR HOW HE SEES IT and that is a fact that many people have accepting. I know I did. I wanted my h to see our history the same way I did.

But just like two people who see a car accident won't have seen the same exact things, two people in a marriage view their history with different "LENSES" and cannot see things in an identical way.

The past isn't so important, other than learning from OUR mistakes...what matters is that you two see your future the same...that takes time.


i am not blaming anyone as i can see where i made mistakes and have improved a lot since then.

how so? See, the fact is that,

Unless your h believes marriage to you can be better/different,

he will not come back.

Right or wrong, it's up to YOU to show him that changes are being made and that marriage between you two, from this day forward, can be better and different than before.

now he continually talks to this one son who is 21 as the other is in the air force and has not had a good relationship with him in a while. but his one son he talks to about the affair and tells him he has to get used to her as she will be around and is not going anywhere. he still tells me he loves me when we talk and yesterday says he is mentally drained from the situation this week - the situatuion being he and i. i have given him space and told him to call when he is ready to discuss us and mend our marriage but he continues to call to see how the children are or just to see what i ma doing. not sure what that is about.

You MUST read the Divorce Busting or Divorce Remedy books as soon as possible. I prefer the latter.

It will show you why some of your reactions are not helping you.


i have read plenty of stuff on MLC and was hoping this was not it as i want this to be a short evolution. i have repeatedly told him i love him and the door is always open for him to come home.

Okay first, this will NOT be a "short evolution". This is a marathon, not a sprint.

Don't keep telling him you love him...in fact I'll post some "rules for newbies" after this post.
And since I don't know what 180s (ie new behaviors that are the opposite of what you did before)

are, or how you are GAL (= "Getting A Life") to be less predictable and to help yourself through a tough time

and to GROW, I don't know how to advise you about what to do. I mean, I don't know what you are doing, specifically, to grow and change.

You do HAVE to read the book I & others mentioned to you, b/c the books form the basis of THIS unique approach to saving marriages. The author was on Oprah and is worth studying up on...you will get way more out of posting here, once you have read at least one of those books.

You cannot change HIM. Don't waste energy trying. It backfires and wastes valuable time. You can Only change yourself & how you interact w/him, no matter how long you've believed otherwise.

True, A marriage is a relationship between 2 people,

so when one person in that marriage changes, the marriage itself changes.

So YES one person can change it all (as your h has shown).

So what do You want to work on, in YOU?

He's not writing here trying to save the marriage; you are. B/C of the financial actions he's already taken, You need information b/c knowledge is power.

I'd see a lawyer to get that information asap to protect yourself financially even if you "do" nothing...it helps to KNOW what your rights are.

If you are active duty or retired military, you can get free legal advice from a military lawyer (JAG Corps officer). If not, pay to get an hour's advice--well worth it.

You should know that Statistically, men prepare for divorce, financially, much much more than women. He's ahead of you in terms of planning.

Yes, You can work on saving the marriage AND protect yourself financially at the same time.

I did.

Good luck, keep posting and see if you can answer the questions I asked so I can get a better handle on the situation and what you can do to help yourself.

hang in there...


These are the 37 "Rules" for newcomers assembled/organized by Sandi, (modestly modified by yours truly.)

It consists of principles based on MWD's "Divorce Busting" approach. I recommend you copy and paste & print it out. Carry it in your pocket if you have to. I know I did.

FOR WHEN YOU GET "THE BOMB"….

1. Do not pursue, reason, chase, beg, plead or implore! This turns the spouse completely off!

2. No frequent phone calls to spouse.......let him/her be the one to call you. Then don't try to hang on to your spouse through conversation.....instead, you say good-bye first.

3. Do not point out good points in marriage or try to get him/her to read marriage books, look at your M pictures, etc. Especially, do not get him/her to read the DB/DR book. That is for you only!

4. Do not follow your spouse around the house like a puppy dog trying to get his/her time and attention.

5. Do not encourage talk about the future. They don't want to think about a future with you at the moment, so stay clear of that subject.

6. Do not ask for help from family members or friends. Don't discuss private matters with them that would upset your spouse. Don't make "alliances" with his/her family. It backfires.

7. Do not ask for reassurances (That is showing neediness and
being clingy.) Show self-respect and self confidence.

8. Do not buy gifts to make "brownie points". (Can't buy his/her love and affection.)

9. Do not schedule dates together at this point. (That is pursuing.) Save for later when the R is much better.

10. Do not spy on spouse by checking emails, phone bills, etc. (Not good for you, and it will make matters worse.) In short, No snooping.

11. Do not say "I Love You" (It is being "pushy" and trying to
make your spouse say it back to you......he/she will despise you for it.)

12. Act "as if" you are moving on with your life with or without them, and that you are going to be okay. Keep a good attitude.

13. Be cheerful, strong, outgoing and attractive at all times! In other words, be the best you can be and look the best you can look at all times. Even when wearing jeans and T-shirt, wear good cologne/perfume, b/c it does cause the spouse to take notice.

14. Don't sit around waiting on your spouse to see what kind of mood he/she is in or what he/she is going to do or say – get busy, think of things to do. Go to church, go out with friends, etc. in order to get a life for yourself without waiting on your wife/husband.....but it is okay to invite them, just don't act as if it will change your plans if they do or don't go.

15. When at home with your spouse, (if you usually start the conversation---then don't, wait for him/her) then, be rather scarce or with your words, but don't sound rude or too short like you are mad. If your spouse asks what's wrong....just say "nothing" and have a pleasant, warm expression on your face.

Keep it short and simple. Don't get into an argument! Stay polite and don’ t act like you are pouting. Use poise and class. This does not mean to act like you aren’t speaking, but don’t be overly talkative.

16. If you are in the habit of asking your spouse his/her
whereabouts, ASK THEM NOTHING!! No matter what time he/she comes home. You are giving them space and asking no questions! You enjoy your time with your kids, friends, etc. Remember, you are getting a life, also.

17. You need to make your partner think that you have had an
awakening and, as far as you are concerned, you are going to
move on with your life, with or without your spouse...AND be happy regardless.

18. Do Not be nasty, angry or even cold - just pull back and wait
to see if spouse notices and, more important, realize what he/she will be missing. (But never ask him/her if he/she has noticed any changes!!) This is important! If you do, then you have blown it. Asking them about noticing your changes makes the change look "tactical", to get them back, and not real or lasting.

19. No matter what you are feeling TODAY, only show your spouse happiness and contentment. This can confuse some of them b/c it is not what they expected. (That's good! Be less predictable.)
Show your spouse someone he/she would want to be around all the time, somebody that can be attractive and fun to be with. That somebody is you! Don't overkill in your attempts to outshine another person your spouse may be having an A with (if there is OP in the picture) to the point of looking like your attempts are "fake", b/c your spouse will see through all of that.

20. All questions about marriage should be put on hold, until
your spouse wants to talk about it (which may be a while) so this takes patience on your behalf.

21. Never lose your cool! No losing your temper. Don't let your spouse trap you into a fight. Don't take her/his bait.....leave the room or the house for a while, if you have to, in order to avoid a fight.

22. Don't be overly enthusiastic, don't over-kill; in anything you do b/c it will come across as fake.

23. Do not argue about how your spouse feels about something (it only makes his/her feelings more negative.) Only they know how they feel!

24. Be patient......very, very patient. Give your spouse space and time. When you pull back, it will draw them towards you. It feels opposite of what you want to do, but it works!

25. Listen carefully to what your spouse is really saying to you. Look them in the eyes when they talk to you. Do not interrupt them when they are speaking and stop what you may be working on to look at them when they talk. This shows them that you really care about what they are saying.

26. Learn to back off, shut up and walk away when you want to
speak out (or scream and yell).

27. Take care of yourself (exercise, sleep, laugh & focus on all
the other parts of your life that are not in turmoil). This is for your health's sake, and happens to make you more appealing & easy to be around anyhow.

28.Be strong and confident and learn to speak softly. Read self
help books, inspirational books or listen to tapes. They are for you only.

29. Know that if you can do 180's, your smallest CONSISTENT
actions will be noticed much more than any words you can say
or write, or single dramatic gestures.

30. Do not be openly show that you are "desperate" or "needy" even when you are hurting more than ever and truly feel desperate and needy. This is a large turn-off for your spouse.

31. Do not focus on yourself when communicating with your spouse, instead, focus on them. Eye contact.

32. Do not believe any of what they say, and less than 50% of what they Do. Your spouse will speak in absolute negatives because
he/she is hurting and scared.

33.Do not give up no matter how dark it is or how bad you feel.

34. Do Not ask your spouse if he/she has noticed your changes. Those changes are for you and for the rest of your life...with or without your spouse. If it is just to get your spouse back...they won't last and the same problems will return.

35. Do Not send several TM's or emails throughout the day unless absolutely necessary.

36. It is best to stay away from the bar scenes where other problems easily arise.

37. Do not backslide from your hard earned changes.

[25yearsmlc]

on another note, he completed a physical today for extra life insurance for our family - does that mean anything concerning his state of mind? he told me that his state of mind has improved since he moved out - but just on friday said he was mentally stressed over the situation? i sent him a brief overview of MLC and said i think that is what he was going through and needed to get a counselor to help him work through issues, but he insisted of course he has no issues and is doing what makes him happy as he has fell out of love with me.

please do NOT "diagnose" him at all, let alone TO HIM...that makes his feelings "wrong" and that does NOT work. Do not do what does not work. (Divorce Busting 101)

This telling him what's wrong with him and sending him literature YOU think he ought to read, will NOT help your situation. Read the books so you understand why this does not help.

And focus only on what YOU can do to work on YOU...let go of him and his issues

b/c it prevents you from doing the inner work you must do on you.

Focus on YOU, not him.

Stay in your sandbox and don't get into his.

Do you understand what I mean?

[25yearsmlc]

If you can hire a Div busting coach, DO IT.

I found them VERY helpful and specific. But I urge you to FIRST READ the Divorce Busting book or the Divorce Remedy book.

Is there a reason you have not?

It will help the coach AND YOU, to first read the book and then make an appointment with them. I ended up having about 12 to 15 over a 2 year period and think it was the single best thing I did, (although I also had a great mc I don't want to overlook.)

[25yearsmlc]

here is a short piece on Detaching and there are a lot of pieces written on the board about this...

but here's a short one...


"This was originally posted by Peanut.
============
II. Detachment
Detachment is critical to the process of altering and repairing a relationship.


Attached, we take personally all that is said, not said, done and not done. Our ego gets wounded and we say or do things that undermine our goals.

We can NOT control the actions of another. We are, however, responsible for our own actions. We are responsible for our own happiness.

If we are detached from the actions of another, we can meet anger or indifference with love.

Met with love, we are in a position to diffuse the situation and transform it in a way that will be in alignment with our goals. On the flipside, detachment allows us to play it cool when we do get a positive reaction from our spouse. It is a way to break the distance/pursuer cycle.

Detachment is not withdrawal. It is not the mind saying, "I am not getting what I want so I must pull back."

It is the natural acceptance of the reality that "I am alone responsible for how I act. I cannot control another person, but I can control how I respond to them."

[8anb]

thanks for the response. I have not really been focusing on him, when this started in Oct i took what he said to heart and he even commented that he could see the changes in me and he had never seen someone do a complete 360 and he hoped the changes were for me, not him and would continue despite the situtation. I have looked at me and how i treated his children over the years and started on rebuilding those relationships to some degree of success, it is a work in progress and i continue. It is hard for me to GAL, becuase i have a 1 yr old grandchild i am responsible for, a 19 yr old that has a life and a 15 yr old that i am trying to enable to continue on without really being affected. that said, i have started to work on projects around the house such as cleaning things out that should have been done some time ago - this is keeping me busy to some extent. i have let him do the contacting, but it appears he feels the need to contact me weekly or every few days - again it is hard to detatch when they continue to contact. in some ways i feel as though i am now the other woman becuase he only contacts me or our daughter when he is at work - not when he is around ow. anyway, just trying to make it one day at a time, reading the other stories, praying several times a day and attending church regularly helps but not much. i suppose as time goes by it may get easier, but i am trying:)