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#2226679 - 03/02/12 09:34 AM Re: LRT (also known as Limbo land) [Re: ces67]
2thepoint Offline
Member

Registered: 09/30/11
Posts: 1692
"Is it wrong to remind her of this or is it love? I love her too much to want to see her walk that path. I know I can't choose for her and ultimately she has to decide what she wants. But as a friend, shouldn't I try and help her see the damage she'll inflict upon herself and others?"

You may think of yourself as a friend but your W see's you as the H she wants to D. So why would she care what you have to say. Also, a friend wouldn't have the kind of vested interest in the outcome that you do and she knows this.

So if truth be told, this is really about you and your feelings. You need to acknowledge that and work from that premise instead of trying to portray yourself as the concerned friend, cause it ain't gonna fly with her!

"I've got a draft of what I want to say and am having a close friend review it. Will post later for feedback. I know up front it may not be seen as "DB approved" but it may be the 180 I need to do.

The more I think about doing this the more a heavy weight sets into my chest. But giving into that weight and not saying anything feels like I'm letting go of my integrity."


Why do you think there is a heavy weight setting into your chest?

You are trying to pin things down. I understand the desire to do this but can't you see that by doing this you will in essence be cementing things in place. Why would you want to do that?

My W has been having an EA/PA for months. I've never confronted her about it as in "admit it, you're having an A!". Instead I just acknowledged that I knew and that I was terribly hurt by it and then left it at that. Now she has to work on her issues cause there is not a damn thing I can do about it.

She is on calls with OM all the time. Very similar to having a tee shirt hanging around or a picture of the OM in a collage of other family pictures. The daily reminder is there.

This is why I have to detach emotionally from her otherwise I'd end up like..... well let me give this analogy to chew on for a bit.

Place a rat on your chest and put a cage with no bottom over the top of it and just let it set there. What do you think the rat will do?

This is what is happening to you as long as you allow yourself to be pulled into the emotional pain that she is causing you.

Post your letter here, lets take a look at it. If nothing else, you'll at least get your feeling down on paper and maybe that is all that you really need.
_________________________
Me48 W50 S15 S11
M20 T23
Bomb-9/11; A-11/11; I move out 11/11

It's easy to find our bottom, it is our top that requires cultivation.

Every rough spot adds to our emotional constitution. -Barney Fife

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#2226738 - 03/02/12 11:00 AM Re: LRT (also known as Limbo land) [Re: 2thepoint]
ces67 Offline
Member

Registered: 12/23/11
Posts: 1024
First of all, thank you! I need my thinking challenged and I realize this. Here are my thoughts:

Cadet: Itís not DB approved because accusing & blaming pushes the WAS further away. My intent is not to blame but to acknowledge her behaviors and feelings for the OM and state my feelings of having reminders of him in the house. (like what 2Tp said in his post)

Do you see this as the same as blaming?

To be honest, whether others have done this before or not didnít even cross my mind. Iíve fallen into the trap of being too close to my own sitch to step back and think. Well, I at least I was able to stop and post here before I actually did anything.

Regarding what I want to accomplish with this action goes back to my thought that some type of catalyst is needed to move us in some direction. If she at least knows that I notice, she may actually have to think about how her actions impact others. I have no expectations that this will cause her to come running back to me. At this point I just want a reaction to cause a conversation.

Just talking to her about money this week caused her to spend a day in bed and ask to find a counselor. And all I asked her to do was think about having a conversation with me.

We have not had a R talk in months. Nothings going to change if this keeps up.

Mach: The more I look at my title the more I realize Iím confused. I started DB with the LRT. This was almost 18 months after the bomb. I saw some signs of a little more civility from W but very inconsistent. I still get lots of anger, resentment & bitterness thrown at me, which I donít return.

Limbo land refers to the fact that our sitch has not really changed or progressed in 20 months. It seems obvious to me that what I am doing is not working so I need to try something different. The opposite of not talking about anything would be confronting issues (at least that is what is coming to mind right now).

I donít think an LRT should be ďlimbo landĒ but thatís what my sitch has turned into. Iím trying to figure out different tactics to cause movement.

2TP: First, your ďrat analogyĒ reminded me of 1984 from Orwell, and that part of the book freaked me out!

I agree that W will not see me as a friend in this conversation. My concern is that she has pushed away all her friends who have given her honest feedback about her actions. I feel like if I donít do it, it may never get done. Sheís already pushed me away but her own choice not to provide for herself keeps her in our house and dependent upon me.

The reason for the heavy weight is because I feel paralyzed on what I need to do and feel that if I donít do something then Iím caving into fear.

I started reading the ďNo More Mr. Nice GuyĒ book. In looking at it, I certainly didnít have the awful upbringing some guys did but I still have some major avoidance issues that donít allow me to stand up for myself like I should.

The honest truth is I donít want to talk to my W about this stuff. But I know this is not from a healthy place.

The book talks about how nice guys hide what they feel because they are afraid they will be rejected. Iíve felt this. And to act differently from that, Iím going to share with you what I wrote to a close friend who has been walking with me daily in this struggle. This is crap I hate about myself but here it goes....

=====e-mail to friend=====
every time I see myself saying these things to W, a list of all the mistakes I've made come rushing up in me and I feel like I deserve the treatment she's giving meÖThe sad truth is I'm scared to say these things but I can't put my finger on what it is I'm scared of.

Fear of having W mad at me (I should be use to that)?
Fear of W leaving (at this point it could be an improvement)?
Fear of messing up?
Fear of being wrong?
Fear of a message that I'm not worth the time & effort of someone really loving me?

These fears are a big part of where I was not emotionally available to support my W and help her feel loved. Iíve got to figure out a way to be different and part of that is standing up for myself.

How do I stand up for myself and at the same time keep going on the DB stuff. I feel like Iím using the DB practices to fall into my own comfort zone of conflict-avoidance.

What am I not seeing?????
_________________________
Me:45, W:44
S:15, D:12
M:22, T:25
Bomb: July 2010
2 attempts at MC-stopped 09/13
Continue to live in same home-separate rooms

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#2226841 - 03/02/12 02:08 PM Re: LRT (also known as Limbo land) [Re: ces67]
Mach1 Offline
Member

Registered: 11/04/08
Posts: 3697
Originally Posted By: ces67

Mach: The more I look at my title the more I realize Iím confused. I started DB with the LRT. This was almost 18 months after the bomb. I saw some signs of a little more civility from W but very inconsistent. I still get lots of anger, resentment & bitterness thrown at me, which I donít return.

Limbo land refers to the fact that our sitch has not really changed or progressed in 20 months. It seems obvious to me that what I am doing is not working so I need to try something different. The opposite of not talking about anything would be confronting issues (at least that is what is coming to mind right now).

I donít think an LRT should be ďlimbo landĒ but thatís what my sitch has turned into. Iím trying to figure out different tactics to cause movement.


Below is a link to what LRT really is.

I read a lot of James John's stuff early on, and the board really felt his loss when he left.


http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...55814#Post55814


What I see, is that you do fairly well for a time with what you want. And then something happens to get you off track. It's like you take three steps forward, and then you turn around to see if she is following you.

You are doing this so that she can "see" that you are different, and in essence, you are showing her that you really aren't different...you just want your way.



Essentially, it is you that is keeping yourself stuck.

You also should take a look at the "tactics" that you are trying....

This should never be about tactics. I can tell you that a WAS can smell fake from three miles away. The things that you look at, and the things you change...HAVE to be for you, and very real to your core.

Please read the links....

Let me know what you think after that...

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#2226935 - 03/02/12 05:28 PM Re: LRT (also known as Limbo land) [Re: Mach1]
ces67 Offline
Member

Registered: 12/23/11
Posts: 1024
Thanks Mach. I'll look over it this weekend before I decide to do anything.

I agree that it is my thinking that is keeping me stuck. But my thinking has been not confronting things.

Fortunately (or not) I've never been one to rush into things so I am truly giving this thought on the best way to proceed.

It certainly hasn't escaped me that my discussion on money has prompted my W to ask about IC for herself. I don't want to ruin that by talking to her about OM and her putting up defenses that would stop her from IC.

Putting on my "happy face" and heading home now....

Thanks again.
_________________________
Me:45, W:44
S:15, D:12
M:22, T:25
Bomb: July 2010
2 attempts at MC-stopped 09/13
Continue to live in same home-separate rooms

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#2226962 - 03/02/12 07:02 PM Re: LRT (also known as Limbo land) [Re: ces67]
ces67 Offline
Member

Registered: 12/23/11
Posts: 1024
Random stuff:

Last night I took my S to a bb awards function. I drove the car my W ususally drives. The gas light was on. Usually I would immediately go and fill up the tank for her but I decided not to this time. It was the last day of the paycheck and I would have needed to use a credit card to fill it up. It was a short drive to the function so it wsa no problem to get there and back. Then either my W or I could fill it up today since its payday.

W calls me as I'm leaving work to ask if the gas light was on last night when we went out. I said yes. She said she wasn't sure if she had enough to run her errands and then get gas or not. Told her I'm not sure as I don't normally let the tank run that low and didn't know where all she was going. Left it at that. Said it in a up beat matter-of-fact way (I think).

W then tells me she is going over to a friends house for the evening. This friend is a foster parent and her husband works night sometimes. They have 3 kids of their own, a 1 yr-old the are working to adopt and then they just got 2 foster kids under the age of 2. So W and D will end up visiting over there for most of the night to keep her company.

S is out playing with friends and I'm left in an empty house. I really need to GAL going. Of course this does give me time to read through the links Mach sent. How's that for a fun Friday evening! (not)
_________________________
Me:45, W:44
S:15, D:12
M:22, T:25
Bomb: July 2010
2 attempts at MC-stopped 09/13
Continue to live in same home-separate rooms

Top
#2226964 - 03/02/12 07:03 PM Re: LRT (also known as Limbo land) [Re: ces67]
ces67 Offline
Member

Registered: 12/23/11
Posts: 1024
Also, spoke to my parents on the way home. Mom said W had called today and they talked for a while and W said how she and the kids were coming up for spring break. As I mentioned earlier. She had only said she was "thinking" of going to me but of course, she is going and already telling everyone else.

Its just so disrespectful and I'm tired of it right now. I also realize its attaching my moods to her actions and I'll get over it soon.
_________________________
Me:45, W:44
S:15, D:12
M:22, T:25
Bomb: July 2010
2 attempts at MC-stopped 09/13
Continue to live in same home-separate rooms

Top
#2226966 - 03/02/12 07:12 PM Re: LRT (also known as Limbo land) [Re: ces67]
labug Online
Member

Registered: 11/24/11
Posts: 8673
Loc: Sonoran Desert
Qtip, Quick Taking It Personally

Always helps me.
_________________________
Me 57/H 58
M35 S24 S21
Bomb 3/11 Sep 3/11
Piecing 9/13 12/13 Reconciling

"We can make ourselves miserable, or we can make ourselves happy. The amount of work is the same"~Carlos Castenada

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#2226969 - 03/02/12 07:19 PM Re: LRT (also known as Limbo land) [Re: labug]
ces67 Offline
Member

Registered: 12/23/11
Posts: 1024
^^^^^^^^^ grin

Thanks...
_________________________
Me:45, W:44
S:15, D:12
M:22, T:25
Bomb: July 2010
2 attempts at MC-stopped 09/13
Continue to live in same home-separate rooms

Top
#2227044 - 03/03/12 12:43 AM Re: LRT (also known as Limbo land) [Re: ces67]
2thepoint Offline
Member

Registered: 09/30/11
Posts: 1692
When was the last time you went off and did something for yourself? Isn't it about time to create a little mystery?
_________________________
Me48 W50 S15 S11
M20 T23
Bomb-9/11; A-11/11; I move out 11/11

It's easy to find our bottom, it is our top that requires cultivation.

Every rough spot adds to our emotional constitution. -Barney Fife

Top
#2227048 - 03/03/12 01:54 AM Re: LRT (also known as Limbo land) [Re: 2thepoint]
ces67 Offline
Member

Registered: 12/23/11
Posts: 1024
I get together with a couple friends every Friday mornning for coffee before work. But to create mystery, its been a while. Its probably time to do something. Thanks for the reminder.

W & kids are leaving a week from today for Spring Break. The kids will get to see my parents so they'll like that.

I'll do some stuff while they're gone but I need to do more while W is here to see it.
_________________________
Me:45, W:44
S:15, D:12
M:22, T:25
Bomb: July 2010
2 attempts at MC-stopped 09/13
Continue to live in same home-separate rooms

Top
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