Now the work begins....

[25yearsmlc]

Just found this post and your comment elsewhere. Did not know of your sitch in April wherein you posted searching for Bond and me...So I'm sorry for the delay.

MODERATORS it would be nice to get private messages for THIS very reason...(just saying...)

Thank you!! For calming me down. It is soo hard for me not to let my imagination go wild. Or, doubt his intentions when he has lied to me in the past.
His anger upset me.. Still does.

Yes, the past is the past but sometimes I feel if I understood it I would prevent from happening again.

I have OFTEN thought this too...but I don't know how true it is. I guess what I do know is

there is no way to KNOW if we really understand something...how can we KNOW we are "getting it"?

What if THEY the WAS do not know why, or do not themselves understand OR are too ashamed to say the whole truth...what if they did know, but then they changed anyhow? So how relevant is it?

What if your h went through a truly "selfish ass" time?

whatever there is to "understand" is maybe only relevant as to what YOUR ROLE or behavior contributed since you are all you control anyhow...

maybe focus on YOU and what you know you have to work on, and stick to that for some chunk of time.

But I don't like your h's anger or indignation. If you can CALMLY say

"do you feel YOUR anger at me for MY discomfort, is really helping the cause?"

Are you in counselling getting solution based therapy? Are you going to Retrovaille? If not, why not?

Do you think you two can solve this all your own without new tools?

Your desire to "understand this to prevent it from happening again" -

might be better aimed at "gaining tools to avoid it happening again."

[lifejustgothard2]

We did go to a marriage retreat/intense counseling session in March. This was at H's encouragement.
It was very revealing and healing.

Sometimes I think with his anger it is because he doesn't want it brought up ( what happened) I know this isn't right but I am just trying to understand him.

[lifejustgothard2]

HI Just checking in... maybe I need to be in a different forum?. Not sure anyone reads this. But, just in case...everything is going well. Celebrated our 21 st Anniversary.

[Denver_2010]

Hello! I just saw your post on my thread. Thought I'd pop by over here.

To your question about bringing up OP with your spouse...

I'm not sure who said that it is bad, but i agree with that.

Why? Sure, I do think that the mention of OP could possibly bring up old feelings or memories for your spouse, but there is a more important reason why we should not do this...

Because we should not hold the affair or the fact that there was an OP over our spouse's head if we are working on reconciling.

I believe that to recover and have a successful reconciliation, that we do have to forgive our spouse for their choices and actions during the separation.

How can do we forgive... how can our spouse believe that we have forgiven... if we are bringing the subject up over and over again?? How can the marriage move forward?

I don't believe that it can.

Deal with the fact of the A. Forgive if that is what you choose to do. Move forward, create a happy, affair proof marriage... and look to better days.

You cannot change the past... no matter how hard we try.

[Starsky309]

I mostly agree with Denver. I do think that for the first few months of reconcilation, if the betrayed spouse feels the need to ask questions and get some answers in order to aid their healing, that the formerly-wayward spouse should do everything they can to create a safe atmosphere to do so, and to answer the questions as best and as honestly as they can. And the betrayed spouse, for their part, needs to thank them for their honesty and not attack them for any answers that they might not have wanted to hear. Often this obviously delicate ground is best covered in MCing, with a counselor well-trained in dealing with infidelity.

Once this healing period has passed, however, I would encourage the betrayed spouse to not bring up OM/OW, for the reasons Denver states in his post. I can honestly say that in the 5 years since my wife's affair, I've brought it up exactly ONCE in MCing (and that was over 4 years ago), and maybe 3-4 other times since then and those were all just "I think that's back when we were going thru our stuff" kind of casual references. NOTHING heavy or even containing any questions.


Starsky

[Denver_2010]

I mostly agree with Denver. I do think that for the first few months of reconcilation, if the betrayed spouse feels the need to ask questions and get some answers in order to aid their healing, that the formerly-wayward spouse should do everything they can to create a safe atmosphere to do so, and to answer the questions as best and as honestly as they can. And the betrayed spouse, for their part, needs to thank them for their honesty and not attack them for any answers that they might not have wanted to hear. Often this obviously delicate ground is best covered in MCing, with a counselor well-trained in dealing with infidelity.

Once this healing period has passed, however, I would encourage the betrayed spouse to not bring up OM/OW, for the reasons Denver states in his post. I can honestly say that in the 5 years since my wife's affair, I've brought it up exactly ONCE in MCing (and that was over 4 years ago), and maybe 3-4 other times since then and those were all just "I think that's back when we were going thru our stuff" kind of casual references. NOTHING heavy or even containing any questions.


Starsky

I agree with that. I'm just coming from the perspective of someone who learned all that he wanted to know about the A/R between my W and the OM. I got all of the answers that I needed during the many months that we were working towards getting to a point that we could reconcile.

I don't have further questions, nor a need to know more. So, I try not to ever bring it up.

[lifejustgothard2]

I need to do the same. But there are so many holes either in his memory or the story. Maybe that I just can't even understand how/why he did what he did. So, maybe it will never make sense.

I try really hard to not bring it up. That is why I was asking about the brain/chemical thing.

I have a "friend" who seems to like to remind me of OW and of any sightings of OW. I really don't care and also- I wouldn't know her if I saw her. I need a break from this"friend"

I do feel like I am hyper aware about whether or not he is looking at other women, etc. This is dumb. I never did this before and now I find myself doing it now.
It has been hard for me lately to be a "women only a fool would leave" THings seem to be surfacing.

I am rambling and in a rush but will write more later.

[Denver_2010]

I need to do the same. But there are so many holes either in his memory or the story. Maybe that I just can't even understand how/why he did what he did. So, maybe it will never make sense.

Are the two of you in MC? It seems that would be a great place to talk about this issue and these questions.

My W and I are not in MC. I would go, but my W is soured on it because of some poor experiences that we had prior to our S. She also does not believe it is healthy for us to go into it bc she thinks that it will simply be drudging up the past and finger pointing. I somewhat agree with that part. This is why we both agree that the Weekend to Remember is a good idea.

For me, I don't seem to have the questions that you do. I did have most answered though as our S progressed. So maybe I just don't have as many holes as you do. I have no need to know more about what happened in the past. I simply want to start over and move forward. That's not to say that I don't sometimes struggle with my thoughts, but becomes less and less as we move into a more normal life.

That's my take.

I try really hard to not bring it up. That is why I was asking about the brain/chemical thing.

Boy, I don't know. I agree with Starsky in the sense that the BS should be able to have his or her questions answered in the beginning. I also agree that that should happen in an MC setting. But I also think that this kind of depends on whether or not it was true betrayal... a true affair. I'm pretty wishy washy on the dating thing during a physical S. Sometimes I think that it is okay, and other times I think that the two people are STILL M'd even if they are physically separated. The bottom line for me though, is that either way, I have to be able to forgive. And that is for me more than it is for my W.

I don't know your sitch, but for me, my goal is for it to never come up again. Either in my thoughts or in my words. I think that in time that will happen and it will be a mere blip in what otherwise will be a good and happy marriage.

I have a "friend" who seems to like to remind me of OW and of any sightings of OW. I really don't care and also- I wouldn't know her if I saw her. I need a break from this"friend"

I would not tolerate this. You need to have a very straightforward talk with this friend and tell her/him how you feel. Just tell her to not bring the subject up. It is sensitive for you and that you are trying to move on. Her mentioning it is not helping the healing process.

Otherwise, I'd dump the friend.

I do feel like I am hyper aware about whether or not he is looking at other women, etc. This is dumb. I never did this before and now I find myself doing it now.
It has been hard for me lately to be a "women only a fool would leave" THings seem to be surfacing.

I am rambling and in a rush but will write more later.

I think that it is normal for you to feel like this. However, please remember, that men are visual beings. Much more so than females. I may get slammed for that statement, but I believe it. It is normal for men to notice attractive women. And to look. I'm sorry, but it just is. I can tell you that when we look, it doesn't necessarily mean that we are thinking about cheating, that we would, or anything else. It just means that we noticed.

I'm kind of embarrassed to admit this, but I've kind of trained myself to do a little self talk when I notice an attractive girl...

"Wow, that girl is hot. My W is hot too. I'm very lucky to have her in my life." Or something along those lines.

Maybe your H is doing the same.

[lifejustgothard2]

Help! I need advice quick!!! H just got a bank statement in the mail today. It is from an "old" acct he opened when he left us.

I left it on counter. When he got home he stuck it in his pocket. So, I casually asked- what was your bank letter about? Oh its a statement he says. No, I said looks more like an overdraft. If it is he says, its from an automatic withdrawl. I do know he has that on there but he no longer uses acct. It is a automatic withdrawl for checking protection.
I asked him to show me the letter. He said No. I should trust him. He got very defensive. Now remember- he left us for 8 months, lived with OW and lied for years to me about money issues.
We have been piecing for 10 months and things have been going quite well I think. THis is the first "trust" thing to come up.
His phone has no password. He leaves it out in the open. Calls me all the time. etc.

He thinks I should trust him by now he said.
He did apologize later but still did not show me the paper. Stubborn or liar!?!

The tears just finally quit for me. The pain of the past came back like no ones business. I know I shouldn't cry- But what do I do????? Help please.

[MrBond]

Ask him again. Don't accuse him of anything, but tell him that you've been struggling with what he did in the past and you don't trust him. And that as a show of good faith, you need to know that he's being honest with you and that trust is earned not given. And as his W you have a right to be comforted.

Have the two of you gone to MC after he came back?