Moving forward together and piecing

[Harrier]

First of all, I don't want to think I'm attacking you or anything. You have been given a great opportunity here (most who are on the boards would kill for) and I would hate to see that all go away because of one issue.

I don't know that it was shocking. But I do know that I didn't realize how much I was holding inside until I threw that glass. I've been holding things inside for a long time. I'm worried for me too, because I'm hurting that much.

I go by the rule of what would I say to my 5-year-old if he saw me do that. I guarantee if he saw me do that he would be freaked out.

His EA definitely dragged me right back to that place, of the pain I went through before with being cheated on, however I think some of that is normal. I went to therapy for a few years after my first M, and I did a lot of work on myself back then. I don't really give that much thought, or my first H, except to say that my current H knew about all of that pain I went through, and went on ahead and chose to cause me that same pain too. That's where I'm pretty much coming from, but I would not say I'm living directly in the past.

What did you back then to work on yourself? how did you get past it? Obviously, you didn't stay in the marriage of other reasons.

I think praying can do many things.... I witnessed a miracle this summer with prayer, witnessed a miracle with my daughter surviving her birth... I believe prayer can help me, but I also believe in helping myself too.

I guess I worded this wrong. Prayer can be powerful for a lot of people. But I guess what I was saying is that i don't think you can rely on prayer and prayer alone to get through the anger (you know this). It's going to take other things.

I was angry seeing them. He told me they were all gone and when they popped up again, it brought me back into the pain I had repressed from last summer. I get that his action was positive, and I'm glad he tossed them. I don't think this process is going to be cut and dried for me. I'm still feeling a storm inside of me.

I get that. I mean it's been over a year since I found out about my W's EA and I still get have a reaction when I hear a certain song. It's gotten ALOT better, so there is hope. I don't think it's like a light-switch to turn on or off. It's a progression.

Not so cut and dried for me. I'm still processing this, still trying. I can't stop what I'm feeling inside and shut it down. I have to handle it and address it, or I'm going to make myself more sick than I am now. Hair falling out, MS pain worsening, not sleeping well, anxiety attacks. After my appt yesterday, I've come to see how much I have held in, and how this must be faced. I will be dealing with it in a healthier manner, having a few appts with H before moving.... talking more openly about my anger, rather than reacting.

I'm not holding this over his head forever. It's been Sept, when I found out about his EA. This is still fresh for me. I don't know how to just shut my feelings off, as if it were a tap. Something I'll be working at...

First of all I don't think anyone is asking you to shut down your feelings. They are natural reactions that anyone would have. I mean we all are different on the spectrum of feelings of course. 4 months after my W's EA, I was not nearly in the state of anxiety I was in.

I think professionals used to think letting your anger out was healthy and a way to move things forward. I think people are coming around to the idea that anger just breeds more anger. (note there is a difference between letting the anger out and letting the feelings that cause that anger out)


[quote]There are lots of techniques to help get your anger under control.

Are you saying I should keep looking at OW's facebook? I'm confused. I don't think it's healthy to be going and checking her facebook... There is a lot that can trigger anger.... from what I understand.... in this process, sometimes we will feel like we are doing great, then suddenly something comes along that reminds us of the event.... and it hits without notice. I don't think I'm avoiding, I'm facing it head on.... but yeah I don't want to feel like I need to check her facebook...I want to put OW behind me... if I can't do that, how do I move on with my M.

Well exposure therapy can be effective for OCD patients. (My W is a psychologist and has done with in this field) But I'm not advocating it for you, nor would I suggest doing anything without the guidance of a good IC.

Thanks, I really appreciate the feedback.

What I see is someone who is taking a lot of blame and personal responsibility for your H's EA. Too much in my opinion. Yes we all have our roles, but you seem to think that your H was doing this intentionally to perhaps cause you pain (or so I gleened) But there might me 100s of other reason for the EA that have nothing to do with our or your self worth. You are the same worthy person that you were before the EA...Nothing has changed that. No the M issue, not the EA.

[angel61]

CTflor, I found out that physically hurling things, even if not directed at my H, made him feel unsafe in his own home. So yes, it is shocking. I used to do that too, and did not think of it afterwards, but it became a big factor in his MLC mind as part of his justification why he had an EA.

I think Retrouvaille can really help you. It is all about feelings, in the first place. It will help you face those feelings and not act on them in a negative way.

I saw your post in my thread. So are you going to the April sessions? Did you mean the SF bay area?

[angel61]

Oh, I forgot to say that yes, praying together feels good. So far, we haven't started the couple devotionals, more of a family prayer, but I do feel closer to him afterwards, and also with our D.

[Ctflor]

First of all, I don't want to think I'm attacking you or anything. You have been given a great opportunity here (most who are on the boards would kill for) and I would hate to see that all go away because of one issue.

I don't feel attacked at all. I'm really grateful for the feedback! I know I am very lucky... to be in this position that I'm in, and lucky that things have turned out to be in my favor. H tells me "I feel good inside. Even though things are bumpy for us, I feel so happy that I am with you. I'm in a good place again and I feel more connected to you". This is good, and I'm glad to see h in a good place, but you know ..... the storm inside of me is still going on. Last month, I tried to suppress it... I put on my happy face. I ignored the hair falling out, I went on and kept tears away from him, and anger from showing. But the hair has been falling out, I'm dropping weight again. There's no medical explanation for it, other than I'm getting sick from holding all of this in. I don't know if that is healthy.

Way I see it, and according to the counselor.... during our discussion. H did this. He made this choice that has affected me, and now, H will have to deal with the fall out from his choices. H has told me that he will be patient and help me to the best of his ability while I deal with all of this. He is understanding of it. Will it go on forever? I hope to hell not. I want to feel better. I cannot shield h from my pain any longer. He is going to have to look at it. If he cannot handle it, then.... I'm sorry for that. I have to take care of me too. If I walk around shoving down my anger and my pain, then I think I'm going to end up very emotionally and physically ill. It has to come out.... and I know there are different schools of thought on that, but I really think it's not good to just hold in anger. I know there are many tools for handling it healthily and I'm doing that now, by going to counseling.... by taking care of myself.... by GAL, by talking about it and not holding it all in, until it erupts with me throwing something, like a glass.

I go by the rule of what would I say to my 5-year-old if he saw me do that. I guarantee if he saw me do that he would be freaked out.

My daughter was not home, and I knew she was not home. After H had that tantrum where he threatened to leave us when she was listening, we do not discuss our M when she is around.

What did you back then to work on yourself? how did you get past it? Obviously, you didn't stay in the marriage of other reasons.

I was going to weekly counseling and a support group for women in domestic abuse. I left my h, got divorced, moved away.. I got past it by getting away from him, and going to therapy. I stayed single for a number of years and didn't date for awhile until I felt I could trust again. It took me a long time to learn how to trust again, and I didn't allow myself to get involved in another relationship until I was ready. In all honesty, I trusted my h fully when I got with him. I didn't have any issues with not trusting him. I sold my home, left a good job, and moved to another state across country in order to be with him after we dated for a couple of years. So, that really took a lot of trust on my part to go that far.

I get that. I mean it's been over a year since I found out about my W's EA and I still get have a reaction when I hear a certain song. It's gotten ALOT better, so there is hope. I don't think it's like a light-switch to turn on or off. It's a progression.

yeah.. I really do hate that feeling when we are out together and a song that he put on her cd comes on the radio. It just really really... [censored]. I don't even want to feel that way in the future. I just don't.

First of all I don't think anyone is asking you to shut down your feelings. They are natural reactions that anyone would have. I mean we all are different on the spectrum of feelings of course. 4 months after my W's EA, I was not nearly in the state of anxiety I was in.

You know what is strange? I'm am way worse than I was when I was in the middle of H's crisis. I am feeling worse than I did after finding out about his EA and OW. When I was in the heat of all of that, I was really at my strongest. I may have been really scared, but I was not a huge emotional wreck. I seemed to be able to hold things together much easier. Now.... I feel like I'm really a mess inside.

I think professionals used to think letting your anger out was healthy and a way to move things forward. I think people are coming around to the idea that anger just breeds more anger. (note there is a difference between letting the anger out and letting the feelings that cause that anger out)

I mentioned that above... I just don't know what to think of this, cause as I said, holding it in and not dealing with it at all has been making me sick. then I end up erupting with behavior, like throwing a glass. I mean, I know it's not okay to continue that behavior... but I am working on ways to handle it when it becomes that strong.

Well exposure therapy can be effective for OCD patients. (My W is a psychologist and has done with in this field) But I'm not advocating it for you, nor would I suggest doing anything without the guidance of a good IC.

I feel sad and depressed when I go look at her facebook. It actually feeds my anger at h. I look at her picture and I think.... "Really??? HER? That? WHY? UGHHH" then I think...... "He was really going to throw me and our daughter away for that?" I mean.... going to her facebook just throws me right back into all of these dark feelings. I don't know if that is healthy or going to help me?

What I see is someone who is taking a lot of blame and personal responsibility for your H's EA. Too much in my opinion. Yes we all have our roles, but you seem to think that your H was doing this intentionally to perhaps cause you pain (or so I gleened) But there might me 100s of other reason for the EA that have nothing to do with our or your self worth. You are the same worthy person that you were before the EA...Nothing has changed that. No the M issue, not the EA.

It is really interesting to me that you have picked up on this. Even h told me in counseling that I have blamed myself way too much, and that I'm too hard on myself. H has told me repeatedly that what he did was about him, and not me. I think for the better part of my life I've battled with self esteem issues, and the abuse from my first M did not help much. But over time I think I really improved. I was feeling good about me again, starting to like myself more and more.

Maybe my attaching my self worth to h is co dependent and it is something I need to work at .... a lot! I did take his EA to heart, I know that I have gone over it in my mind .... why he did this to me.

Not good enough, interesting enough, pretty enough
Not exciting enough, sexy enough...

[Ctflor]

CTflor, I found out that physically hurling things, even if not directed at my H, made him feel unsafe in his own home. So yes, it is shocking. I used to do that too, and did not think of it afterwards, but it became a big factor in his MLC mind as part of his justification why he had an EA.

I think Retrouvaille can really help you. It is all about feelings, in the first place. It will help you face those feelings and not act on them in a negative way.

I saw your post in my thread. So are you going to the April sessions? Did you mean the SF bay area?

Thanks Angel. I did not even see it this way... that he may feel unsafe around me. I don't want him to feel this way.

Yeah, I'll be in the SF bay area.

[Ctflor]

Last thoughts..

Am I going to just lose my mind, or will this get better?

[angel61]

Honestly, I don't know.

There were times in the past that I had horrible anxiety attacks, and sometimes I wished I would lose my mind so that I could get away from the pain.

Hey, I am from the same area as you. I will probably meet you when you go to Retro as my H and I will be volunteering to help.

Do you have an account on the alt?

[Harrier]

I can get better. I really but it not going to be fun or easy. My W and I are in a much better place. I'm not going to say that we are headed toward recon or anything yet, but I rarely let her see my anger, anxiety, hurt feelings over the EA.

It's been about 14 months since I found out about the extent of the EA. I don't think about it as much nor do I obsesses about everything, but every now and then something will still hit me. I don't know if that ever goes away.

But I do react to it differently. My biggest problem now is that our m is in a holding pattern. I'd feel differently if my W would commit to a recon.

My W has apologized multiple times. But one thing I don't thing she gets is how devastating her EA was to my self-esteem. Even though I know it wasn't 100% about me, it still hurt. I think I have some trouble because I don't always feel the empathy from her.

I'm guess in your case, it's similar. I mean your H has got to see that it's going to be a process to rebuild the trust with you and you have to be open to rebuilding that trust as well.


P.S. I didn't mean to suggest your D was home.

[Ctflor]

Friday and Saturday.... feeling very off key. Feeling a lot of anger and resentment sitting in my chest for most of the day. Don't really want to be close to h. Just want some space. The anger is at times, boiling inside.

Go to the doctor fri for a check up about my anti anxiety meds. Already, the doctor is wanting to pull me off of them. I don't think they are doing any good. And since I cannot tolerate anti depressants, I'm not sure what I can take that is going to help anxiety, anger, or depression.

The doctor refilled the meds for another 30 days, and will begin the process of tapering me down until I'm off of them.

To be honest.... taking any medication that is only going to push down the anger and pain I feel... is only going to make it resurface later on. It's going to put off the process that is needed in dealing with it anyway. It will either resurface in other physical ailments, or it will manifest in more anxiety ..... that cannot even be controlled with medication.

The only thing I can see helping is venting here and going to therapy.

Why in the hell do I feel SO freaking mad at him right now? I look at him and I just feel sick with anger sometimes. But I have managed to engage in deep breathing, in walking away and going for walks, in reading, in talking to a friend, etc.

I'm getting to the point where I'm tired of the anger itself. I'm exhausted and sad at the same time. Just when I think it's going to ease up and just go away..... and I'm smiling and laughing again.... BAM, it's right there again... like an under current.

I start thinking about ow's face, h's interest in her, the lies, and all of the deceit that took place. The lies directly to my face. It does not take much for these things to flood back.

Will this ever get better?

H has done everything he can. There is nothing I need for him to do at this point. This is for me to work out and for me to solve. Yes, he caused me to be in this position, but.... to me, he has done all I think he should.

He has already apologized numerous times
He has openly cried... many times
Has been very open about his feelings and emotions
Has been patient and loving
Has been a listener
Has already taken some of my anger and much of my sadness..
He's totally understanding about the place I'm in at the moment
Has written me a few letters over the past few months
Has gone to counseling, has been active in wanting to save our M
Expresses his regret and his desire to be with me..

There's more but I can't think of it all right now.

I'm right there at the forked road, and I'm stuck standing there.

I want my marriage, and I want to forgive him.... but I'm just not there yet.

[2thepoint]

"I'm right there at the forked road, and I'm stuck standing there.

I want my marriage, and I want to forgive him.... but I'm just not there yet."

CT - It is clear you are struggling and still trying to heal. I am sorry that you are having such a tough time letting go of the anger and resentment. It is important though for you to know that by hanging on to your anger and resentment, you are really only hurting yourself.

The other day Newt Gingrich's ex-wife did a television interview where she was clearly out to extract revenge on her former H. They have been divorced for 10 years and yet here she is, 10 years on and still clinging to her bitterness. It was not attractive and you could just see by her appearance that she was an angry woman.

Do you want to be like Gingrich's ex-wife?

Your H seems to truly be trying to make amends and there really is only so much he can do. IMO, it is going to be up to you to let go of the hurt otherwise your M may never recover.

Below are a few of my favorite quotes on forgiveness (there is another in my signature block).

Resentment is like a glass of poison that a man drinks; then he sits down and waits for his enemy to die.
--Nelson Mandela

We are all full of weakness and errors; let us mutually pardon each other our follies
--Voltaire

Forgiveness is the fragrance that the violet sheds on the heal that has crushed it.
--Mark Twain

I wish you well as you continue your journey and search for the path to forgiveness.