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A Message from Michele
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#2213392 - 01/17/12 09:01 AM Re: W told me she is done & doesn't love me anymore-P2 [Re: Snowman]
25yearsmlc Offline

Registered: 04/03/06
Posts: 13511
Loc: CA- now East coast

Snowman - this is a long post. But it includes some other posts on Detachment that I hope will assist you in that endeavor.

Originally Posted By: Snowman
Before response to the various posts I must say I received a disappointing news about my W's trip to London (my negative light I guess). That news is that she has decided to book the trip during my S's birthday.

how old is your son? Pretty young isnt' he? Okay -1) it's not in your control. I feel as if a lot of spouses would take a trip to London if it came up, I'm afraid, if the child is young enough that celebrating another time would not be noticed by him. (And for HIS sake I hope that's what happens.)

But 2) besides, what are you going to do about THAT? Like several other items on your grievance list, I think you have to let it go. She knows when his birthday is....she knows. But I would not project your anger at her onto him on his special day...
put your love for him ahead of your anger at her, and you'll be alright.

I know I'm going on a trip without....----.

the rest of this paragraph is you keeping score w/your w and comparing the trips. Neither of you consulted the other before committing to the trips. I don't think anyone wins with scorecards so I urge couples to "lose the scorecard".

Besides, your w has her own scorecard and you didn't know about it - so my guess is she has a lot of points against you..

See, different views of the same event happen all the time even in calm happy couples. That's another reason you can't measure or keep score - b/c you are comparing apples to oranges. We don't view things the same.

---- she is going with girlfriends which will = lots of drinking, and she is now going during her only S's birthday. I'm passing judgement but I'm not the only one as everyone and I mean everyone says that same whether I should care what they say or not.

so how does passing judgement on her or listening to others do the same, help your situation?

How do you feel when it happens?
Why would people offer their negative critiques on your w, to YOU?

By way of reference, I spoke to my h's family ONE time in 2 years, about our m.

Mr. Bond, I didn't say you did or didn't understand the stitch. I said people pass judgement about who I am with knowing only bits or pieces of the story.

Snowman, Bond is a long time veteran and both he and I are very direct. We ask the poster here to keep the focus on who they can control, which is only the poster; ie you. the one person you can work

Others will chime in and validate your perceptions of your w's behavior, and on occasion I do too, but don't you hear enough of that in your life?

Sure sounds like there's an audience for your marital woes and-- I have to say that the peanut gallery comments only make it harder to

keep the road home, paved and smooth.
Meaning, don't make it any harder for her to come back than it already would be. This is not about being right but about being happy.

(That used to be in my signature block b/c I SO believe it and I was stuck on being right for far too long.)

I guess I just don't like your approach. You don't pass judgement on someone you have never met and then say why don't you see it from my perspective.

that isn't what he said. You are misreading his words and your approach is curt to a man who just donated his time to help you. And fwiw, You did say you are judgemental of your w, right?

Your judgement calls drowned out you advice to me whether it is valid or not. I will work on understanding your perspective if you will understand my when it comes to your approach smile.

First, your response is what drowned out your ability to receive some valuable advice. Second, Bond does this for free, and has helped many people. Be careful who you brush off here, as it tends to be the very person who can help you the most....listen with extra care to those who seem to strike a chord in you b/c ....they struck a chord that may need examining..

25yearsmlc, I'm trying to not loose hope.

good^^^'s too early to lose hope. But imo, you have to minimize the involvement of others. That just gets your ego wrapped in it, & upsets you more, which probably affects how you interact with her and not in a good way. Plus it involves and damages other relationships that can make an insurmountable mountain for her to climb if she wants back into the m, and makes so many things harder in the long run.

This is classic to only knowing bits of the story. I have mentioned earlier in my stitch that I went to IC for many visits. I got to a point were my C said to only call if I felt like I needed to because I had progressed so much. I probably should go back for a visit or 2 more---

Considering the situation you are still in , if your c thinks you cannot benefit from any more c, I'd say hire another one or call a DB coach. I know you'll take offense at that but before you drown it all out,

face this--- you are not happy and you obsess about your w b/c you are completely attached to what she is doing/planning, and you do a lot of negative mind reading about all her actions. I also had trouble not obsessing about "WHY" my h was doing what he was doing or when it would stop or what it all meant and my anger consumed me as did my constant thoughts about our situation.

I'm not a shrink but we both know that's not healthy. Do the detachment work asap.

As far as the anniversary talks or whatever it was, my W and I discussed talking about us so that's what I thought we were going to do. I know now that apparently that was not the case. You can beat me on the head or whatever else

you think you got "beat on the head"?? Okay well...

You said your w won't communicate, so does that mean she's stone cold silent?

Back when things were better, How would you and your w communicate when she felt a negative emotion?

When she was not pleased with something you had done or planned to do?
In other words-
How do you characterize her words, or handle them, when they are not positive to you? Do you feel attacked?

but I can' read her freaking mind which is part of the problem because she never communicates what she wants to me nor does she keep simple promises or commitments.

see above

We changed our schedule of sharing my S for her school which I agreed too but it made it so I would always have my son at the beginning of the week. Well we pay our daycare at the beginning of the week so I pointed that out so she could give me the check for daycare for her week or pay on Friday. Her we are Monday and she failed to do either so now I will be paying in hopes that she will pay me as she said she would.

do you have joint accounts? Is there some way you can calmly remove the money for that and let her know ahead of time,

or push the issue by simply staying on track via email or text, or some written form, so she remembers her actual promises?

Something tells me she sometimes agrees, or remains quiet and appears to consent, to keep the peace.

Or perhaps she wants to flee or she feels coerced. I'm just basing that on women's intuition, my experience in my professional life, and based on your words, but I know I could be wrong and often am.

But that's a guess. See if you can speak in softer tones with her and then re-cap what you think she has agreed to, without sounding condescending. Can't hurt.

Can you re-cap what HER 2 biggest complaints were about you, when she first dropped the bomb?

And how are you working on those two issues now?

I could go on but I will refrain as its all just me passing judgement on someone who continues act irresponsible financial or otherwise, sorry that's how I see it.

She just asked me for her Itunes login which I happily provided her and then she asked for mine to authorize my songs on her new computer and I even went out on the limb to do that even though she could possibly buy songs with my account. I offered to copy our whole music collection from our home computer so she would have it. She said that would be awesome.

not sure what all this^^^ is about. It's a nice gesture (copying her music for her) but you sound resentful of it, so I'm not seeing the love language being expressed here. Are you happy to do it or not? Do you notice anything about the tone you use about her, even when you are "happy to do it"?

(BTW please read "The Five Love Languages" by Chapman. FYI- I say this to all couples as I think it's among the best overall marriage books around, and most couples express & receive love in different "lanes."

They may not realize it for years or ever, and consequently they can both be loving their spouse, and yet have a spouse who does not feel loved....Can't hurt to read it).

My BIL inviting me over was not to get allies as this BIL was my W closest sibling. He is disappointed as everyone else is.

Re read the post I reacted to.

You said your bil was on the phone w/you and said something derogatory about your w, w/something to the effect of "now he gets what you have been going through" did not disavow him of that.

As i said elsewhere, the more other people comment on things, the harder it is to reconcile. I'd put a moratorium on comments and say "I apppreciate your intentions but for now I don't want to talk about it, thanks..."

How is it so many family members know the story AND feel free to comment on it? My guess is you called them to "ask their opinion"? While I do understand the temptation to do that, it never seems to help and usually makes things worse.

I would not invite their comments. At least not while you are in the midst of fighting FOR the marriage and struggling against the temptation to wallow in anger and fury.

In my 2 YEARS of dealing w/my h's MLC, I spoke to my h's family ONCE about our marriage.

I don't believe the more who know, the better---B/c again, I think that makes it harder to Keep the Road Home, Paved & Smooth...

Plus, there is a certain beauty and dignity in a man who refuses to criticize the mother of his children.

Furthermore, if there's a real chance she's mentally ill as you say your MIL claims, then remember your vows. (sickness and health)

And there's a reason the vows say "from this day forward" both would have to leave a lot of the past behind...while of course learning from it.

But a lot of LBSers say that about spouses who leave, b/c they want to blame it on something and not look at their marital dynamics..

it's not easy to dig deep and own our role in the demise of our m, EVER, let alone when we are in pain.

But I urge you to do so,

b/c the couples who DO reconcile for good around here, all seem to have made significant changes in themselves....usually starting with the LBSer and for a long time, maybe only the LBSer.

My 180's or traits to change:
-Spend max time with my son and make him top priority
-Be less controlling

what does this^^ mean and what will it look like?

-Be happy no matter the things around me
-Get more fit (Not doing so good but part of that is my lots of time with my S, no excuse I know.)
-Let go or detach once again (Probably never did)
-Enjoy and get involved in my hobbies

these ^^^GAL sound good. I would add that you have not detached- but I'll post something to clarify it for you if that helps. I could not wrap my brain around "detachment" for a long time

b/c I associated it with giving up or not caring. I was wrong.

I also hope your hobbies involve meeting other people who don't know the sitch b/c it really helps the self esteem and it reduces the obsessing.

I can admit I'm not the type that works well with someone smacking me on the head with judgement, criticism

who does? and who smacks you w/criticism? Are you talking about your real life or this board?

or anything else and then tell me to change.

read that statement^^^ and imagine someone else wrote that. What would your impression of them be?

At some level, do you see that for the marriage to be reconciled,

SHE has to believe it can change -- and that's going to mean

at least partly, YOU changing? Is that what's bothering you?

Why? B/C it implies fault? We all have them - and we ALL have to work on our them...that's why it takes a brave person to look within...

& not all traits that need changing are necessarily flaws, but still need to change, for the spouse...

I more in the lines of you show me how much you care before I care how much you know (this will probably be used against me).

I will assume you mean this in real life, and not here? B/C i don't know you. So what do you mean about showing we care?

I mean, we're here...taking our personal time to post to a perfect stranger in pain b/c we believe in the underlying philosophy of DBing and

building a community of support for marriage. AND b/c we have ALL been somewhere like where you are now. And it sukks.

Second, what's going to be "used against" you? What are you referring to here?

I can now hear someone saying that's what you need to do with my W and I agree but I have apparently failed to know how to break the barrier of being able to do this.

I don't know what this^^^ means...

My MIL is still convinced that her daughter is mentally ill

based on what? Leaving you? What else? Has your w ever seen a shrink? Ever acted this way OR mentally ill before?

Does your mil have an illness of her own she's projecting, or do you think she might be coming up with this as some sort of explanation?

Are she and your fil still married? What's their m like?

which I can't really say one way or another. It hard to argue against someone's own mother that has known her daughter her whole life until now.

good thing you don't have to argue or defend. Listen and evaluate.

For now I'm going to work on the letter unless people oppose this idea??

I can't comment about the letter b/c I don't know its content or purpose.
Must have missed that thread.

here are two posts on detachment that I found helpful.

This was originally posted by Peanut.
I) Detachment

Detachment is critical to the process of altering and repairing a relationship.

Attached, we take personally all that is said, not said, done and not done. Our ego gets wounded and we are more inclined to those actions that will undermine our very best chances of accomplishing our goals. We can not control the actions of another. We are, however, responsible for our own actions. We are responsible for our own happiness.

If we are detached from the actions of another, we can meet anger or indifference with love. Met with love we are in a position to diffuse the situation and transform it in a way that will be in alignment with our goals. On the flipside, detachment allows us to play it cool when we do get a positive reaction from our spouse. It is a way to break the distance/pursuer cycle.

Detachment is not withdrawal. It is not the mind saying, ‘I am not getting what I want so I must pull back.’ It is the natural acceptance that I am alone responsible for how I act. I can not control another person, but I can control how I respond to them."

2) Detachment is the:

* Ability to allow people, places or things the freedom to be themselves.
* Holding back from the need to rescue, save OR fix another person from being sick, dysfunctional or irrational.
* Giving another person "the space" to be herself.

* Disengaging from an over-enmeshed or dependent relationship with people.

* Willingness to accept that you cannot change or control a person, place or thing.

* Developing and maintaining of a safe, emotional distance from someone whom you have previously given a lot of power to affect your emotional outlook on life.
* Establishing of emotional boundaries between you and those people you have become overly enmeshed or dependent with in order that all of you might be able to develop your own sense of autonomy and independence.
* Process by which you are free to feel your own feelings when you see another person falter and fail and not be led by guilt to feel responsible for their failure or faltering.

* Ability to maintain an emotional bond of love, concern and caring without the negative results of rescuing, enabling, fixing or controlling.
* Placing of all things in life into a healthy, rational perspective and recognizing that there is a need to back away from the uncontrollable and unchangeable realities of life.
* Ability to exercise emotional self-protection and prevention so as not to experience greater emotional devastation from having hung on beyond a reasonable and rational point.
* Ability to let people you love and care for accept personal responsibility for their own actions and to practice tough love and not give in when they come to you to bail them out when their actions lead to failure or trouble for them.

* Ability to allow people to be who they "really are" rather than who you "want them to be."
* Ability to avoid being hurt, abused, taken advantage of by people who in the past have been overly dependent or enmeshed with you.

hope this helps

good luck
M: 57 H: 60
M: 35 yrs
H off to Alaska 2006
Recon 7/07- 8/08
X = "ALASKA 2.0"
I File D 10/16
DIV 2/26/2018
X marries OW 5/2016

Embrace the Change

#2213503 - 01/17/12 06:21 PM Re: W told me she is done & doesn't love me anymore-P2 [Re: 25yearsmlc]
MrBond Offline

Registered: 06/18/08
Posts: 12602
Thanks 25yrsmlc!

Snowman, she's totally right.

What you've been seeking is validation, saying that you're doing a good job, etc. What I see is that you're going down the wrong path.

When I mention something that you disagree with, you seem to take it as a personal attack and so you ignore or come up with a snarky comment, or say that I don't "understand" your efforts, etc.

I've been in your shoes and had many people kick my @$$. 25yearsmlc was one, sandi, puppydogtails, coach, robx were others. Did I always agree with what they said? Of course not. But their 2x4's helped me to get an insight that I never had before. Even if I thought they were dead wrong, I considered what they said and took it to heart. Sometimes they were wrong, but most of the time they were right. It's a matter of being open enough to learn.

Oh I understand your efforts. And the ones that will lead you back to your W are commendable. But if you keep thinking that people (especially your W) has some sort of vendetta against you, then your sitch will not change. You keep mentioning your W is "playing games" etc. All I see is a woman who is afraid to talk to you. You do put her down alot in your posts. Re-read them.

You blast your W for her choice of going on a trip when you're doing the same. Yes it's on your S's Bday, but her justification to herself is just as valid as your justification for yours is to you. Her trip is an escape same as the other men. Your expectations are putting alot of pressure on her.

Again, it doesn't matter that YOU don't see it, SHE does. Put yourself in your W's shoes (as hard as it may be for you). It's good that you have strong opinions, but you also must respect others' as well. Especially your W's.

You married her so there must have been something you thought was worth marrying. Remember those traits. If you constantly focus on the negatives with your W, all you will feel is negative. Small positive baby steps is what will draw your W back. I do see this as being salvagable, but you need to start changing your perception.
M-43 W-40
2D - 9 and 5

Emotion, yet peace.
Ignorance, yet knowledge.
Passion, yet serenity.
Chaos, yet harmony.
Death, yet a new life.


#2213717 - 01/18/12 05:31 AM Re: W told me she is done & doesn't love me anymore-P2 [Re: MrBond]
Snowman Offline

Registered: 09/12/11
Posts: 148
25 yearsmlc-

My W missing my S's birthday is just so out of character for her it blows my mind. She was the one that love to make a big deal about kids birthdays and when we went to other family members houses for kids birthdays they would flock to her. It is just so the opposite of her to do something like this thats all I want to say. I'm glad I get him for sure on his birthday and I will not project my anger on him for sure.

I did consult with her on my trip as I knew it affected her schedule and that's just common courtesy to do so. That's when her trip came up with me. No more scorecard, that is water under the bridge.

The passing judgement question is rehtorical as I know it doesn't help but it doesn't mean it doesn't happen in my mind or others. I would work my best to avoid it. It will limit my talk of the M with her family but I'm not going to cut them off or whatever because they know what they do. I will work to keep things positive or not talk.

I like your motto of keep the road home, paved and smooth; this is not about being right but about being happy.

Yes, I will admit I'm judgmental of my W's actions as she has done a 180 in ever aspect of life possible and not in a good way from the way I knew and loved her.

I will think about the chords that have been stuck more objectively. I do know you 2 do this for free and I thank you.

I had made good progress with my IC and I'm sure I have regressed as things have changed with the stitch and my obsessing started again. I was at a point months ago were I was not obsessing and doing good detachment work. I have backslide for sure.

When things were better I suppose my W would still hold it in and sit in a corner silently looking bothered through her body language but refused to talk about it (this is how she has always dealt with negative emotions that I can remember). She would rather let the feelings fester to the point of anger. I will say that's not how I am, I like to get the bottled stuff out and discussed. That's obviously a point of difference that we both have changes to make. I need to pull back and let her process things and I would like her to share what she has to feel. The sitting in a corner sending me bad vibes through body language was way worse for me than actually talking about whatever it was. I would always try to help or be the fixer because her extreme anger or blow ups would scare to the point that I felt desperate like I needed to help her fix the problem ASAP. I didn't feel attacked really, I felt left out like she didn't want my help, couldn't share her feelings, or she would rather bottle it up until it exploded. She would do this with others as well.

She transferred some money into the joint account today so hopefully that is resolved but I have had to remind her numerous times even though I know she checks the balance online all the time. We will see were that goes and I will work on wording things in softer matter.

When the bomb was dropped it was like word vomit of everything negative in our marriage she could think of and just made it up. I seriously can't recall 2 big things right now because there was not big thing to her it was just everything. She couldn't even explain it to me and still can't to this day.

Itunes-I get your point. I was happy to do it and I will. The giving her access to my iTunes account just scares me a little considering her financial decisions, that's all. I have read The Five Love Languages as that was the first book I read. Then I got shut out by my wife. A review couldn't hurt.

My BIL about walked out of their Christmas Eve family get together because my BIL was joking around like he always has and my W told him to F off. My BIL and his W were ready to leave until finally my W apologized. My BIL is aware of the situation without my talking as my W has left him hanging numerous times when they invited her over for dinner or whatever. I get your point though and I will again work on limited the talk although my W made the comment that if I had worked on my R with her family maybe we wouldn't be were we are now. None of them understand that as they think we have always had a good R. I think my W is projecting her issue with her family on me with that comment. My family is very close which I thinks bugs her because hers is not.

I'm still not ruling out mental illness either but I also don't say that I don't have a role in the demise of my M. My issue is control. I discussed it a lot with my IC and you all have pointed it out. I will work on detaching and my control issue. I will say my mother helped in passing our control issue down to us and my sisters agree as well. We recognize it and do it not with bad intentions but in efforts to try and make things better but that's not always how it is received. I know this and will continue to work on it by only controlling me.

I would like to somehow meet people that don't know about the stitch but most of my world knows I'm married and question where the W or kid is when I see them. Tough to do but I will try.

Me changing is not bothering me. I know I need to change and I want to for me. I have faults and a lot of them as well as changes to make for my spouse.

MIL thinking she is mentally ill-I have posted a lot about that opinion in my old posting so I'm not going to try to re-type all of it. It is not based on leaving me. Please read old posts about this. My MIL is not projecting a mental illness she might have. My MIL and FIL are not married. My FIL cheated on her and his 2nd marriage is rocky now too. That would be a whole another stitch to try to explain.

Read a few posts back to understand the letter.

Mr. Bond-I will work on doing what you have to say. I will get the negativity out of here. No more scorecard.
M: 5 years
Bomb: 7-26-11
Separated: 8-20-11
EA w/ multiple OMs
W filed 1/2012

#2213721 - 01/18/12 06:02 AM Re: W told me she is done & doesn't love me anymore-P2 [Re: Snowman]
workinghardguy Offline

Registered: 09/15/11
Posts: 982
Loc: Wisconsin
My W missing my S's birthday is just so out of character for her it blows my mind. She was the one that love to make a big deal about kids birthdays
Snow... I think it's a symptom of their self-focus right now. My W was always the same way. Her childhood birthdays were largely non-existent. So we've always done big, big birthdays for the kids. It was a point of contention the last few years as all three kids have birthdays Jan-April, and the cash outlay got to be a lot.

This year, for SS's birthday she didn't want a party or anything. Just went bowling as a family and then she took off right after lunch to go spend the rest of the day with her friends. I ended up taking SS to my mom's house so he could have a cake and presents, etc...
Married 6 together 8
Me:38 W:31 second marriage for both
SS12, SD10, S6
Bomb: 9/8/11 (day before our 5 yr ann)
W moved out: 2/18/12
D final: 11/12/12
Share S 50/50. Spend as much time as I can with SS & SD

#2213727 - 01/18/12 08:18 AM Re: W told me she is done & doesn't love me anymore-P2 [Re: workinghardguy]
MrBond Offline

Registered: 06/18/08
Posts: 12602
"in a corner silently looking bothered through her body language but refused to talk about it (this is how she has always dealt with negative emotions that I can remember)"

She probably felt like she didn't have a voice (in her mind) and that her opinion doesn't matter. All stemming from fear. In the future when that happens, maybe try saying something like "Hey I noticed that you are bothered about something and it's okay if you don't want to talk about it. I just want you to know that I am here if you do." Then give her a hug and walk away. It does wonders.

Forget about her affect on her family, your family, etc. Keep the focus on you and her. You are her H so she's ultimately your responsibility. If you see her family ganging up in disapproval of her, see what you can do to be on her side. Not saying that you agree with what she does, but show that you understand that she has an opinion and that it is just as valid as everyone else's. Women often don't want a solution or being told what they're doing is wrong. Sometimes they just need to be listened to.

How about this...rather than spending the posts writing about all the negative stuff your W is doing, how about writing something positive each time. It could even be about small stuff like ... she smiled when I held the door for her. Stuff like that. It helps to get the negativity out.
M-43 W-40
2D - 9 and 5

Emotion, yet peace.
Ignorance, yet knowledge.
Passion, yet serenity.
Chaos, yet harmony.
Death, yet a new life.


#2213751 - 01/18/12 02:09 PM Re: W told me she is done & doesn't love me anymore-P2 [Re: MrBond]
labug Offline

Registered: 11/25/11
Posts: 9676
Loc: Sonoran Desert
Snow, I have been a controlling, judgmental, angry, depressed fixer. I too know just where all that came from. I also now know that all those characteristics were defense mechanisms to keep my fears at bay, fear of rejection, fear of not having enough, fear of not being good enough, smart enough, yadda yadda. Defense mechanisms are good until they take over your life.

But the big truth is, I have to own those things, really own them. The person who passed on the control issues is not going to fix me. It's not my H's job, it's not my therapist's job, it's my job. I need to look at myself through H's lens and really see what he saw. It's the most difficult thing I think I've ever had to do because it's not pretty and it makes me understand just why he left. That scares me, because he had good reason and he may very well not come back. Do I wish he had talked more about what was bothering him? Sure. Would things have been any different? I don't know, I was so wrapped up in being right that I might have ignored it. I am where I am for a very good reason. To learn these lessons:

-hold the judgment
-when in doubt, go with the positive spin
-listen, listen, listen
-talk less

I've really gotten a lot from this thread and will continue to follow. I hope the best for you and your family Thanks, all.

One other thing, believe it when the vets here say that when you feel the bite or the sting of a post, that's where the growth happens. It is so true. We have pain in our bodies for a reason, the same is true of our minds. Focus on where the pain is.
Me 57/H 58
M36 S 2.5yrs R 12/13

Let me give up the need to know why things happen as they do.
I will never know and constant wondering is constant suffering.
Caroline Myss

#2213995 - 01/19/12 03:56 AM Re: W told me she is done & doesn't love me anymore-P2 [Re: labug]
Snowman Offline

Registered: 09/12/11
Posts: 148
Mr Bond.-I would love to have a chance to hug her and say that if she ever does that again but we have been separated for pretty much the whole time and my is W is avoiding me pretty much because she pulled he D pistol out of the holster but I don't think she intends to use it. All her texts are pretty much requesting things from me which I'm fine to fulfill when I can.

I agree that my W just wants someone to listen and doesn't want solutions. I thought I had learned that when we were still together but now I don't get that chance for now.

I will say that I need to vent a little today about what she texted me because I rather do it here than with her or someone else. My W asked me to give her half of some of the savings in a Ally account we have so she could pay tuition. I don't really have problem with that as I told her a long time ago when this all started that I would take my half and she hers which I did and have not touched it. She had not taken her part out of this account which is no big deal but they reason she stated in the text is what bothers me. She just rode my butt about getting some letter signed saying we both provide 50/50 support for our S for her supposed school loan and I did sign the letter (after talking to my L). My question is then, if she got a school loan to pay tuition which is what she told me then why does she need money to pay tuition?? She recently texted me the dates of her now set trip and now she is asking for the money.

My point is, if she needs the money to pay for hotel and other things on her trip or life just come out and say it. Don't lie to me and expect me to be so forthcoming. I just find this silly. Thinking from her point of view she may be afraid or whatever else to just say the real reason but lying to me just doesn't work for me. I will send her the money one way or another as it is hers but my fear is that she has pretty much taken all her half of the money and will spend it then divorce me and take the half that I have not touched because I have being living frugal to prepare for whatever the future holds. I'm sorry about this negative post but this just kind of miffed me today. Ok, I'm done venting.

La Bug-Thinks for your insight on the control issue and I agree that I need to own it. I was doing a better job of owning it months ago but have since regressed. I will focus more on figuring it out my control issue.

Thanks everyone for all your help, you all know I need it.
M: 5 years
Bomb: 7-26-11
Separated: 8-20-11
EA w/ multiple OMs
W filed 1/2012

#2214121 - 01/19/12 07:35 PM Re: W told me she is done & doesn't love me anymore-P2 [Re: Snowman]
MrBond Offline

Registered: 06/18/08
Posts: 12602
"but we have been separated for pretty much the whole time and my is W is avoiding me pretty much"

No more 'buts'. Buts are excuses. When you have an opportunity, just do it.

" because she pulled he D pistol out of the holster but I don't think she intends to use it."


"I agree that my W just wants someone to listen and doesn't want solutions. I thought I had learned that when we were still together but now I don't get that chance for now."

Another 'but'. You talk to your W all the time even if it is her asking you for a favor. Start by making those interactions positive.

So what about the POSITIVE action or thing about your W?
M-43 W-40
2D - 9 and 5

Emotion, yet peace.
Ignorance, yet knowledge.
Passion, yet serenity.
Chaos, yet harmony.
Death, yet a new life.


#2214200 - 01/20/12 12:46 AM Re: W told me she is done & doesn't love me anymore-P2 [Re: MrBond]
ANS Offline

Registered: 04/02/01
Posts: 2694
Hi Snowman,

I just browsed through your thread. Didn’t read it in detail. Just browsed.

You got into a few pissing contests with some folks, eh?

The way people express themselves...

Ya know? It all comes down to perceptions.

There’s a lesson here. Don’t get caught up on the words. Regardless of what you said to your W, or what your W said to you... More words.

Can you read between the lines?

Like MrBond just posted, nobody’s a mind reader. I’m not suggesting that you try to read your W’s mind. But regardless of whether your W’s complaints are justified, ask yourself where those perceptions came from.

Originally Posted By: Snowman
When the bomb was dropped it was like word vomit of everything negative in our marriage she could think of and just made it up. I seriously can't recall 2 big things right now because there was not big thing to her it was just everything. She couldn't even explain it to me and still can't to this day.

Did you take notes? She has given you a gold mine of 180’s. Don’t expect her to explain it, but take a look at the little things. Look at them with an eye to figuring out what you may have done that could be construed in any unlikely fashion to promote or support her negative perception. Doesn’t matter if the actual complaint is utter krap. It’s all perception.

And now... Do the opposite! That’s a 180. No judgment. She’s not right or wrong. You’re not right or wrong.

Hope this makes sense.

#2214239 - 01/20/12 03:24 AM Re: W told me she is done & doesn't love me anymore-P2 [Re: ANS]
Snowman Offline

Registered: 09/12/11
Posts: 148
Mr Bond-No more BUTTS even though everybody's got one, jk. Ok, I just sent the money to my W.

Positive-My wife said thank you when I told her I would send her the money. Also, my S & W called me as I was typing this because he was apparently scared of shadows. We talked about figuring out our S's sleeping problems and I told my W I had transferred the money. It was a positive conversation for me I felt like.

ANS-I will have to think about what was truly said as that was July of 2011 when the bomb hit. She has since apologized for a lot of what was said and even said she would take back most of it if she could in a text so I don't know what was real or not. This is were I have work to do.
M: 5 years
Bomb: 7-26-11
Separated: 8-20-11
EA w/ multiple OMs
W filed 1/2012

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