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Hi Guys, I've started a new thread following hitting over 200!!
After Xmas day, wife and I have spoken everyday since, usually about the kids, but we are talking, big change after 4 weeks of no contact!!
Its all been light and easy going.
Last night she came to the house to see the kids for a while, I have them all week, she is back at work and I'm still on holiday.
It was all fine then she asked if I could help her with some bills this month, it was xmas, she was nearly broke and it would really help. We started to talk about it, our daughter got a little upset, she thought it was an argument, so I said I'd call her when she got home
I went in the bath and called her to talk about things, basically xmas has wiped her out, she has the house to pay for, bills etc, and was really struggling this month, I asked her why should I really?, I gave her our home, I'm not allowed inside, and theres another guy there when he's home?
She said that he had nothing to do with this, fair point, she had not stopped me from coming in, she had and I told her so, and this month was a 1 off, she knew I had the money, and it would really help her, but she understood if I said no.
Then we got on to us again!!! I know big mistake!!
She said that she she is still hurting badly and is still upset by all whats happened, she actually said she missed me at times, thats a new one!!!, but the hurt is still larger than the feelings of missing me. Again I listened and validated, I told her that the 4 weeks of no contact was better for me at first, I just got on with things and was happy, but over time I missed her more than ever, she said she understood and knew what I meant, not sure if she saying that she felt the same, but it did sound like it.
She then mentioned my AA meetings and said that I wasn't the only 1 needing councelling,she needs to understand what happened also, again I'm not sure but I think she is having some councelling somewhere,this is the first time she has mentioned this, she followed this up by saying how hurt she was still
I told her I was happy in everything in my life, I was fit and well, work was good, our kids are great, but I cannot help how I feel about her, we have been apart 14 months and it still hurts, again she said she understood, not sure if that means she is hurting also or just agreeing with me.
She told me she still had a lot of bad memories and had them daily, the neglect and the hurtful comments when drunk, she said that I didn't understand how much I hurt her, I told her I have tried to understand, and would like the chance to make new good memories, that the hurt I caused only I can put right
I didn't mention OM there's no point, it's obvious he's just a crutch for her, this is all about me and her, he's just a by product of the situation.
So I guess it's back to no contact as best I can, she has to go through what ever she has to go through, the pain is still there, I cannot help her if she won't let me
I know she still loves me, I'm in the same place I have been for the past year, it's not getting any easier or better between us, I don't know if I should now look for a new relationship with someone else?
I miss my wife, I love her, but I cannot go through the rest of my life like this?
She knows my feelings, and I know hers
We get on fine, we love each other, I've lost my anger and resentment and I'm in a good place, but there seems to point in trying to convince myself theres a future for us, I need to move on.
If I do, I'm doing it for me, I have a lot going for me, and I have a life to live, I just don't want another year like the last.
If I meet someone else, I'll still love my wife, but maybe it's time I had someone being there fo me, someone for me to take places and sadly someone to benefit from the changes I have made and the lessons I have learnt
I so wish that person could be my wife, but if she doesn't want to be that person, there is no more I can do.
Loc: somewhere out there...
Well, I hope the New Year brings you a lot of hope and progress with your situation. I guess, since she sees the good changes you have made, and it is obvious you are able to keep them up, it is just up to her to move forward from her hurt, eventually. Who knows what it will take for her to get out of the muck she is stuck in. She sees you getting a life, she sees how well you are doing. The A will hopefully end soon. The new has to wear off. Reality may be already setting in, when she has to call you for more money. vc
I've stayed off the boards for a while, evreything is the same old,same old
I feel like a mouse on a running wheel at times, same things going round and round!!
We have gone from no contact, to her calling me 4-5 times a day, mainly about nothing important, just feels like an excuse to call me.
A few weeks ago, after about 5 calls in one day, she even apologised for calling again?, I asked her what was going on between us?
We don't talk, we have both moved on, fine, I get it. Then it starts again, the calls, the laughs, the constant contact, its really nice, but we both know whats happening, we both know we love each other deeply, she said she understood what I meant, but just enjoyed us getting on, I asked her how OM would feel if he knew, she said he was really nice, and she would not do anything to hurt him, she talks about him as if he's a good friend, not the love of her life?
I said we both know how we feel, its just between the 2 of us, we look at each other and I know what she's thinking, again I got the past brought up, my faults and the pain, again I accepted it.
I said that maybe we should just go back to no contact, its easier for us both, and the kids are not getting any mixed messages, my son had asked me if we were getting back together, we were getting on so well!!!
She said she understood and agreed it might be for the best.
Tough love for sure!!!
That was 2-3 weeks ago, it worked for about a week, then she called about something kids related, now we are back to the daily calls, she even laughs when she calls now, she knows she is doing it!!!
Om is back for around a few weeks, so I expect that the calls will stop for a while!!, I'm not going to mention anything, just leave it be
I don't call her, except to return a missed call, which I usually miss on purpose.
When I have the kids she calls my home, she speaks to the kids, then asks to speak to me, so I can't really ignore that call!!!
She has commented on the changes in me, how I'm a good person, a good parent, she was even talking about a past time when I was drinking, and ended with, thats all in the past now though!!, maybe slowly she is coming round, but its all a very slow process, but I just have to maintain being me!!!
A few developments have happened and a few of your thought would be great
As I have said OM is around and as predicted the calls have stopped, I haven't called her, so there has been little contact for the last week really.
A few things happened regarding our D, nothing heavy just a few odd comments, it was pretty obvious that my wife and OM where having a night away somewhere, no big issue to me, I had the kids that night, and I just let the hurt go, and did not mention anything.
The following day she called me a few times, about nothing really, but as she had not called for around a week, it was obvious, again I didn't mention anything, the out of the blue she asked how my not drinking was going?
I told her fine, I didn't think about it really, I still went to AA, but I had complete control and was very happy, she said she was really pleased and we left it at that.
I have recently been taking a girl out I have knew for a long time, she is a little younger than me, very attractive, and we get on really well, its nothing serious, but I am enjoying the company of an attractive woman again, my wifes friends saw me 1 night with her and the next day I got a call from her about it, she was all cool about it, but the fact she mentioned it, meant it was on her mind.
So...last night the kids where with her and I took my friend for a drink and a meal, nothing fancy, but it was nice, while we were out wife called, I just let it go to voicemail, then she called again, then again, then again.....!!
When it got to 11 missed calls with no voicemail messages??? I called her and asked if there was a problem, tld her I had missed the calls, she said there was no need to ignore her if I was out with my girlfriend!! I just laughed it off, and it was only about my son wanting his laptop dropped off!!, 11 calls!??
Then this morning I was out watching a footabll game in the local park, wife called again, was I ok to talk?, told her where I was and it was fine, she started talking aboutthe kids then mentioned last night, told her I was just out with XXXX, and I didn't ignore her, then said I had to go.
5 minutes later she called again, asked me to call her when I'm on my way home
So I stayed a while then got in the car and called her, she asked if I was ok? She said that I didn't seem myself on the phone last night and was I ok?
I told her I was fine, and thanks for the call, she was going on about a few things, and I asked her if she was ok?
She was surprised at that, and said she was fine, then asked what I meant, I said that she seemed to me to that she was not totally happy, but maybe I was wrong, and I was sorry if I was.
Then it was all about us again!!
Basically she knows we are both seeing other people, and this is my fault, she still had loads of thoughts about me and the hurt I caused The OM is a nice guy, but if I hadn't hurt her he would have never been on the scene, and if he upsets her in anyway he's gone!!, again its all about me and the hurt I caused.
I listened and accepted what she was saying, and I also told her I was sorry again, I'm also sorry for the fact she is still hurting and hope in time that those memories fade
I also said that only me and her knew how we really felt, I know I hurt her and I didn't deserve anything, but I missed her as a friend.
Then there was a load of what I did wrongs, and never did's, again I accepted it all, I was very calm right through it all, I am so happy in myself and my life that I can handle all the hurt I still have without losing control and blowing off
We ended the call laughing about something and there was no bad feeling, in fact she just called again to ask about something to do with the kids!!!
I am as confused I as have always been!!, without it dominating my life.
I know the feeling between us is still massive, but again the past is very much still in her head, we get on great, we can both talk calmly to each other, and she still cares for me judging by the calls just asking if I'm ok?
I'm not going to change anything I'm doing, as there is no need, everything is calm and positive, maybe we are no closer from being together, but we are not getting further apart either.
I love this woman with all my heart, but there is nothing I can do until she wants to be with me, all I can be is a good friend to her.
I cannot believe how much I have changed in the past 6-9 months, I'm a different person, maybe this is what she is seeing also, I just don't know!!!
Well it feels like I'm checking in with my weekly update, not much of an update, just the same really, well almost.
Like last week, OM is around still, so there is no contact for a week, I understand, I just get the odd text about the kids.
Last night I had my son stay over, it was his mums night, but she asked could I have him as she was going out, I knew it was with OM, but I said fine, I like having my son stay and didn't mention OM
So I get my son, and he tells me she has gone out with OM, no surprise!!, I asked him how he felt about everything, he said he was Ok, but didn't like OM being around, he doesn't like him, my son thinks he doesn't like him either, and that I should be back home, It was lovely to here how much he missed me, but also hurt that he was upset.
He then asked about my "girlfriend"??
I asked what he meant, he said that his Mum had told him that I had a girlfriend, and thats why I couldn't take him to football 1 night?, I laughed, and told him that I didn't have a girlfriend, but I knew a girl that I liked, that I took out a few times, but she wasn't a girlfriend, and that I only missed that night because I had to work late, I also said that nobody will come before him or his sister, that I hadn't forced another person him like his mother had, and would never do that to him, he just laughed it off, but why has she said these things to the kids??
My only thoughts are that she feels some sort of guilt for her actions, and is trying to point out she's not the only person seeing someone?, not sure really, but I still don't get it??
So today, as every Sunday, OM goes out with his friends, and I know the my W will be calling about something as a reason!!
I actually went out with my "friend" for lunch, it was really nice and relaxed, I can't have had a signal on my phone, but when we came out I had 3 missed calls pop up from my W.
I ignored it, said bye, and went home, I had 2 calls on my house phone from her, than after a while, she called again and I answered it.
It was about nothing again, school uniforms, and yes, she suddenly found what she was looking for when I told her I didn't have it at mine, it is so obvious she was just calling for a chat!!
And again it got around to us, she asked about my AA meetings, told her I had been going, I was fine, very well, and happy, she was pleased, then said that we only split because of my drinking, I acknowledged it, and asked hypothetically speaking, if I had realised that I was drinking too much and needed some help, would we have still split, she said no way, we only split as I was drinking and she had to do something about it.
The conversation went on about the past again, she is still hurt by what happened, she said that seeing how happy the kids were with me, and how happy they are with me not drinking is putting a lot of pressure on her?
She said that she knew that they wanted us back together, but splitting up was mainly for the sake of the kids, and that I would still be drinking if she hadn't left, again I agreed, and thanked her for leaving me and helping me get to where I am now.
She then talked about our home, how expensive it was, and that us splitting was putting pressure on her with that also, bills etc, I said I knew what she meant, and it was sad that we split up, as we had a great lifestyle with material things, lovely home, holidays, cars, etc, but we were both suffering from it, and our kids mostly, but I will try to help as I can
We sorted of ended it there, again both on good terms, but I don't expect a call until next weekend! haha!!
Maybe I'm reading into things too much, but there seems a very small seed of doubt in her mind?
Again it was as basic as saying I love you, but your drinking hurt us all, I still love you, I know your not drinking, but I cannot be sure, or trust you?
Its all the interest in me?, if she was totally over me and moving on, why the interest, the kids will only tell her good things, and how happy they are with me, maybe she is testing the water for herself?
I could be miles away with my thoughts, but when OM is not about I get the calls, even my son mentioned it last night that she calls me a lot when OM is not there, its not bothering me, I know its happening, if anything I smile thinking she's "cheating" on him with me!
There seems to be something going on in her mind, maybe she is getting serious with this guy, and is just making sure she did the right thing before totally commiting to him?, or maybe she is seeing that I am not calling her, chasing her, I am not drinking, I'm happy, and getting on with life, and in that moment maybe she is thinking, " what if?"
Everything has gone back to the same old same old, OM is still around, he's basically living with my wife without actually moving in
I'm keeping calm about it, but it does hurt when I think about it
What I don't get is the contact we have, then don't??
Is she unsure about it all, or is she just being social?
We had times when we had no contact at all, so she could have maintained that, but as soon as we speak, it's back to non-stop contact when OM is not around, then back to very little when he is?
Sunday was a typical example, if I ignore her calls, she rings constantly until I answer, she doesn't leave any messages, just rings and rings, my house and my mobile
I don't call her or contact her, that's all from her, and conversations between us are good
There is no signs that things with OM are coming to an end or on the rocks, but we still talk alot when he's not around, he probably doesn't know how much we talk, she acts very cool when he's around and doesn't call me, she is so hot and cold
I've told her that we both know what's going on, she hasn't denied it, but it continues, it's confusing, but at least I can see what's happening, and try not to let it bother me
So it seems she is either unsure about being with OM or she is having some doubts about us? I try not to think about it, but the hot and cold is so obvious, to call me, chatting and laughing when he's not around seems very natural, which makes me think the cold front is all a front for his benefit?
So if she's pretending in front of him, she is basically lying to him in a way, I can pretty much guarantee that he doesn't know she calls me nearly everyday when he's away??
She's got the best of both worlds, but I can see it
I'm maintaining my distance and not putting any pressure on her, she knows how I feel, she just has to go through what she feels is right, don't know what's going to happen between us, but at least I'm being honest with myself and my feelings
Loc: somewhere out there...
Hi DC, I'm glad to see things are going ok with you. Do you wonder if your W feels you have now moved on, since you are dating? I don't think the dating is a good thing, since you are still married, but you have to decide that for yourself. I know y'all aren't serious, but what if the lady feels differently?
As for seeing the A with om ending anytime soon, who knows, it could possibly burn out eventually. One thing, she seems to want to know you are right there when she wants contact with you, and that's why the calls over and over. I wonder if she would feel panicky if she began to feel you HAVE really moved on from her. It seems she calls and calls constantly until you answer, to ask a relatively unimportant and non urgent question as an excuse to make sure you are still available for her. Maybe I am wrong, but it seems to me she does not want you to move on, no matter if she may say so. And she probably feels relieved when you finally answer. And it's like okay, good, he's still there.
As for om, he probably is just in this for as long as he can get what he wants without much effort other than coming in every other week or so, and with little or no commitment. If he knew you and your W were talking so much, he may get a bit jealous, if he's that type, otherwise he probably could not care less. But, he is just a nasty old a-hole, anyway, you are much better than him.
You call it dating, but its not really, we are just friends at the moment spending some time together, nothing else
Its funny because my wife obviously thinks its dating as she told the kids I had a girlfriend, still not happy about that, if or when that happens, that should come from me, not her telling tales, I've let it go and not mentioned it to her, but it does seem quite childish?
You maybe right, she could be scared that I've moved on, she has asked about things, and I tell her its nothing serious, and I'm doing nothing wrong, she agrees with me, but I do think this wasn't expected in a way, yes we split up, but she knows how much it hurt me, how I wanted her back, but now I've done a full 180, don't call her, spend time with someone else, and I'm happy in me, I'm sober, fit and well, I think all of this has caught her by surprise a little, it maybe why she is spending more time with OM, but if I'm honest, i think she is trying to make it work with him, rather than just going with things, if she was so happy with the guy, and all was well, she wouldn't have any interest in me at all.
I know I think about her daily, but I don't call her, or ask about her, so for her to find a reason to call me, I must be on her mind a fair bit, I don't think its just a spare of the moment thing, its too regular and obvious, again I could be wrong?
The OM could be a lot more serious in his feelings than she is, I know he's lent her money for some home improvements, it seems he's really keen, and I don't think he's aware of whats going on, as I have said, she doesn't even acknowledge me when I get the kids when he's there, but when he's not, she is out chatting to me, calling me, etc, its so obvious that I just smile now about it, no use getting upset anymore, I'm so past all that anger and hurt.
There is also the talk about if I hadn't drank, there would be no way this guy would be on the scene, its hardly painting this guy as the love of her life!! And the comment that it was only the drink that split us up, then asking how I am, still going to meetings, how I feel, do I miss the drinking, I truly truly feel, she is sat watching me, I know she never saw this coming, the changes in me, she has told me so, I'm 7 months sober, she never ever thought that would happen, and honestly neither did I!!
Then there is the happier, calmer me, the smile is back on my face, we laugh on the phone, when he's not around she comes to mine once a week, usually about nothing, but she calls she needs something, usually kid related, and put the kettle on, she laughs when she says it!! All of this has totally thrown her, but to be honest, even my friends cannot believe the change in me, so she's not alone!!
So I continue with being the best me ever, and just hope one day, she wakes up and thinks, "what if?"
That is all I need, I have the rest of my life under control, and she will be the winner if she gives me a chance.
Loc: somewhere out there...
Hi, yes I am doing ok, a tornado wiped out much of my neighborhood, but our house came through ok, thank God.
Ok, I get it is just friends, hanging out together, just be careful with your feelings as well as hers.
Your W does seem torn, but trying to make something of a go with om, who knows? She still keeps bringing it up about your drinking, so I wonder if every time she feels guilty about the situation, and what she is doing, she brings it up. vc
Any thoughts on this guys would really help, bit of an awkward 1!!
My "wife" call me on Saturday asking if I could look after the kids for a few hours 1 night for her while she went out for a meal, no problem, they are my kids and I miss them.
Then it was could I drop them off for her as she was having a few drinks and not driving, yes fine no problem to me.
When I dropped them off OM car was there, kids looked at me, and I knew they felt awkward, but I smiled and got on with things, this is not going to get to me, even though it hurt!!
Anyway moving on, I knew OM was going back away today, and I knew she would be calling me, low and behold, guess who has just called!!!
It is so obvious it laughable, but I don't mention anything, just seem happy and helpful.
So today's problem is our son, he's just sat on his Xbox for hours and she cannot get him to do anything when she asks him to, he's angry and unhelpful, she wants to know if I can sort him out, and have his Xbox at mine, I said thats fine, no problem.
I did point out though that he's on it too much at her house, I didn't mention it but she basically lets him do what he wants when OM is around to keep him quiet, I said I know its hard but you have to be firmer with him and not just let him do what he wants, she agreed and said she has let him get away with things, but would appreciate my help on this, she has tried but thinks he needs his fathers influence more!!!
So because she has caused a situation, she is asking me to get involved and sort things out.
Again I said I would speak to him and try and help, she was all thankful and appreciative.
So, my thoughts are, he's my son, he's my responsibility, but why should I get involved with a situation she has caused because of OM, but I am his dad?
But the comment, he needs his dad?, whats that all about? Of course he needs his dad!!, but she left me and took up with OM!!!!
She has also mentioned in the past few weeks about how she feels under pressure because the kids miss me, and how well we get on. I dropped something off at the house a few days ago and the kids came to my car to see me, my daughter got in and was cuddling me and hugging me, then I saw out of the corner of my eye, my wife, stood in an upstairs window watching us having fun.
I'm going to speak to my son, not give him a hard time, just try and be his dad, and his friend, and try and give him some advice and maybe find out whats going on with him.
I epect the OM situation will be part of it, not sure how I handle that with my "wife" if he brings it up, but I'll just have to see how that plays.
My other thought is, is she trying to use the kids as an excuse for us to try again, without her losing face with friends, family , and OM?
OM has just left, and she calls me, as I have said its so obvious to me, but she is calling me.
I know she has doubts, or is torn about our situtaion, we have spoken about things and what happened, etc
She has also said that she wouldn't do anything to hurt OM, he's a nice guy, it makes sense to me that IF she was even thinking about trying again, using the kids as a reason really helps.
I have nothing to base any of this on, other than the conversations we have had about us recently, and that anytime OM is not around, she finds a reason to call me, when he is around, nothing!!!
I smile about it now, no use getting upset about whats going on, I'm happy, in a good place, but I do miss my wife and family.
How old is your son? How is he handling your split and the new situation in general? I have a 14yo son and he would play xbox all day if he could, and all night. I could definitely see this as playing you two off each other. He's mad at mom, displaying it by doing what he feels like doing and disrespecting or ignoring her wishes. He's taking advantage of a situation where dad's in a different house and at mom's he understands they'd like him to stay out of their way and be quiet...time for xbox!
Talking to him is good no matter what. Let him know you care, find out what's going on with him and how he's feeling. Give him a chance to express what he's feeling. Find out if he thinks it's a good idea to fill up his time with xbox or if he has other things to do there. Separately, maybe talk to W about whether S might be feeling ignored there and see if there are activities she could try to do with him. In our house, grocery shopping gets S14 out of the house and "connecting", and we try to get him outside with friends whenever possible.
Definitely the issue of S being disrespectful or playing too much xbox is for his mom and dad to figure out. It's good she's not enlisting OM in the issue. She doesn't seem to have the confidence in her parenting, or ideas for tools to work with, to modify his behavior while he's with her. I'd suggest maybe a coparenting class, so S14 doesn't get the idea that there are two sets of rules or that you aren't both capable of parenting him.
I'd suggest not letting mom's request for help on this distract you into thinking she's trying to get back together. Give the problem with S attention as a standalone and let whatever plays out with her play out. You don't lose, no matter what, by being a caring and effective dad.
Adinva 47 H48 T22 M19 S16 S14 6/15/11 IDLY 6/11-12/12 in-home sep 12/16/12 H moved out Nothing signed yet ____ Be the change you want to see in the world (Gandhi)
Loc: somewhere out there...
I also don't believe she is using that as an excuse to maybe try again. Maybe she just wants you to make things easier for her, by asking your S to behave better for her. Which if he is being disobedient or disrespectful, you should tell him he needs to act right. However, if he is using Xbox as a distraction when om is in the house, if she is allowing him to play video games to keep him quiet and out of the way, then that is for her to deal with. Your S seems bright enough to know the difference. She should not use you to make things easier with om. And her getting you to babysit (yes, I know they are your kids) while she goes for a night on the town, is just plain using you. I would not be so available for her on those occasions if I were you. Talk about being walked on.
OM has gone back away, and my wife has found out he has been emailing another woman for months!!! They have never met by the sound of things, but he's been flirting in emails to her for quite a while, they have spoken about meeting but haven't yet?
Wife is really upset, she has told me its not because of him, but the upset and lying She told me that he's a nice guy, but she could never trust him again, he's trying to wiggle out of it, but she seems firm that it's over
She has had 2-3 hour conversations with me each night since she found out, told me everything about them, I have listened and been a good friend
We have spoken about us, again she has told me that it was only the drink that split us up, and how much she loved me, it was all past tense, but I know how we both feel
Last night she came to mine for dinner with the kids, I cooked and it was really nice, kids loved it, they were really happy and relaxed
So now do I just keep my distance, no pressure and be there for her, or go a bit dark??
Loc: somewhere out there...
Wow, that is news. I guess it wasn't so serious for om after all. He wasn't such a good guy as she thought, was he?
I would tread very carefully here, though. You don't want to rush into any sort of R talk that might make her back off. Definitely no pressure. She could let om back in, but knows she can't trust him, so even if she did, it would most likely be short lived. Take it really slow, have the dinners at your home, let her come if she wants, let her have the opportunity to see what she could have every day.
I think she will eventually see the one she left was, in fact, the better man after all.
So now do I just keep my distance, no pressure and be there for her, or go a bit dark?
Well I came to read about your son but thought I would start here. IMHO mirror her, let her control all contact. Yes no pressure, validate, no pursuit at all. Treat her like a friend that you would meet on the street, she really is no more than that at this point. Do not get involved with her an OM, that is none of your concern and you could not possibly help anyways.
As far as you son goes, yes be his DAD. Whatever that might take. Love him unconditionally no matter what he does. Including tough love if that is required, but for right now I would suggest being a soft place for him to land and maybe some TLC, hugs, whatever is needed.
VC, you have always been very supportive, thank you
The weekend has been great for me, I have seen loads of the kids, had some great contact with my wife, and its all been very easy.
Even my son has said that mum and I have been speaking more and she seems happy?
We have not spoke about OM since Friday night, she hasn't mentioned him so I haven't
She has been in touch a lot, mostly about the kids, but I'm being helpful if she asks for some help, I'm not offering anything, but just being there for her, and its gone very well, but really it always has?, just OM got in the way of things.
The conversation we had on Friday was total honesty from both of us, I thanked her for leaving me, it took that to happen for me to see the mistakes I was making, and to stop the drinking.
She told me OM was a nice guy, but that was it, she didn't think it was for ever, but was only living each day at a time, we spoke about holidays, and she said that although she might have went away with him, she would not go away with him and our kids?, not sure why, I didn't ask, but that does not sound the basis of a serious relationship?
My son has told me he didn't really speak to my son when he was around, so I'm not sure how serious this guy was either, although he told my wife he loved her and had never felt like he did right now?, so why was he emailing another woman!!
I'm just being there for her, and just mirroring her, I don't call her, I don't ask anything, I'm just there for her when she wants.
But as a big positive to me, we laugh a lot together, we talk a lot, and she has been very open to me, she even said that nobody knows her like me, and that we are good friends.
We even spoke about our marriage and our relationship, how we were best friends, enjoyed each others company, found each other attractive, and the physical side was always great, it was only the drink that was an issue.
She knows I'm not drinking anymore, so I think little seeds are being sown, slowly!!
Whatever happens, happens, good, bad, or indifferent, but its nice to have her as a friend again, I have really missed that, she has said the same to me.
Hopefully OM is out of the picture, and maybe, she can now see I'm not the drunk I was, but the man she loved.
Loc: somewhere out there...
I am glad your weekend went so well. Your W no longer has this glorified image of om to compare with you, so maybe the reality of her situation will hit her. Maybe, eventually, om and his memory have faded away, she might consent to have a date with you, and who knows what could happen in the future?
And, at least if om wasn't exactly friendly with your kids, they didn't get attached to him.
Thats a great point that I never thought of, they were not attached to him, so if he has gone from her life, there is no real hardship or pain to them, if anything my son would be happier if he wasn't involved anymore!
She called a few times yesterday, about the kids, but nothing else, I think she has gone back into her shell for a while, at least I can see whats happening and not think about the whys or reasons for things now, they just are!!
Whatever happens with OM there is always going to be a doubt in her mind, and thats nothing to do with me.
I'm just the smiling, happy, helpful, "ex-husband", who also happens to be her best friend!!
Sounds like really good work, well done! Every long-term deeply satisfying marriage has a core of friendship, it's essential. Keep in mind that the "shell" is always about safety - it's not unusual to have a "heart-to-heart" conversation followed by some "shell time". When you stir up some good feelings within her, it will be accompanied by some fear for a while. Respect the shell, she'll come out sooner and stay out longer if you do! Hang in there, you can do this!
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Wife and I have been getting on really well, lots of general chat and honesty
This morning she asked me if I would look after the kids for a few days in April as she was going away for a friends birthday, then she dropped in om was going with her, she had not mentioned him since the email drama and thought it was over She told me that it wasn't about him, it was a friend of his she met while with him, and would really like to go, my initial reaction was no, I cannot just standby and help her while she goes away with om, but after I calmed down and we spoke some more, it's not about him, she wants to go, and would really like me to help her, she said that she wanted to be honest with me, that I had been controlling in our marriage, and hoped I could understand that this was about her going away for a birthday that she wanted to attend
I agreed, I explained my initial reaction which she totally understood, but she was being very honest with me, and so I said yes
She thanked me, then we had a 2 hour conversation about us, the past and the future She said that she is on a journey to find what she wants, om is still there, but she doesn't know what's happening, she isn't thinking about it as he's away for another month
She told me she loves me, that I'm her best friend, that she likes the changes in me, but she needs to have some time to heal from the hurt She is considering councelling , she spoke about us working things out in the future, but doesn't want to commit to anything
She said the last few weeks we have come really close again, she wants to be totally honest with me about everything she does and thinks, she doesn't want to be on edge around me, she acknowledges my changes and loves what I've become She mentioned how I am with our kids, how they love me and my relationship with them is very sprecial
Basically she told me to be her best friend, not to apply any pressure on her, let her find her way, and who knows what will happen, she said we may end up back together, but at worst we would be best friends
It's dbing at its best!!!!
So I can only continue what I'm doing and who knows what will happen?
If anything being told she loves me, cares for me, and that I'm her best friend isn't bad really!! If anything it made me love her even more than I do
I am now totally taken back as to how my "wife" is thinking?
Since earlier she called me about our daughter not being well, its only a minor tummy bug, but she was telling me how she was, then we got on about us again, how we are going to best friends, and be totally honest with each other, this is all from her, major shift in her attitude to me.
She wants to be able to do what she feels she needs to do, she is on a journey to be happier as a person, but wants me as her best friend.
Then she tells me that she is thinking about going on holiday with our kids, and maybe I could go as well, if we are getting on??
I mention what OM would think, and its sort of brushed aside?
Then we are talking about how much we chat, how would he feel if he knew how much we talk, she accepts he would not like it, but its brushed under the carpet! I told her that we both know whats going on, she calls me about the kids, but really they are just used as an excuse for us to talk to each other, she just agreed with me!
I know she is not giving no promises, but is telling me to continue being how I have been lately and who knows?
This is the first time she has told me since we split up, that there was a possibility of us working this out, still not sure how its happened, but its also hard not to get carried away by it and start to push.
She even said that when she goes to the birthday party with OM, she might realise what she actually wants and come home to me and wanting to work on us!!!! WTF!!!!
I just feel that this is a major turning point in "us", there are no promises being made, but its being heavily insinuated that there is a chance, this is the first time in 17-18 months that this has ever been said, I have felt it from her, but she is actually telling me, maybe, lets just see, lets not fight anymore, and maybe we can sort this out.
Major turning point, just hope I don't mess it up
1 question is, should I go a little dark, give her some space now, respect her wishes, or just continue what I'm doing, always being available??
I just don't want to mess up any chance I may or may not have?
Just a few things to add that have come to mind what my "wife" mentiond when we were talking, and they maybe give people hope in what they are doing.
She told me he changes in how I am are massive, and she loves how I have changed.
She said I have gone from being the last person she would want to look after our children, when I was drinking, to the ONLY person she would want to look after them, she told me how I care for them, have fun with them, and how much they love me are unbelievable.
She mentioned how I don't lose my temper anymore, yes I may get upset with things, but I don't blow up anymore, and she feels totally comfortable talking to me about anything.
I cook, I clean, and I take care of my house, again, this was an issue when we were together, I did little around the house, but now I do everything.
These maybe small things to most people, but she has noticed the change, it has taken her a long time to tell me this though, so please don't give up working on you and the changes you are making, they have to be for you, but your "spouse" will see them, you just have to mean them,and make them part of you, not just a way of getting them back.
My big issue and the reason for the split was my drinking, but again she has told me she is very proud of what I've done, and what I am doing.
Don't give up guys if you really want them back, or are just unhappy with how your life is, you can make things better for you!!
Glad to see your situation's improving DCSUK. I'm in a real state of limbo myself, and haven't had anything positive for the last couple of weeks. Been following your story and it gives me hope that good things can happen to those who are devoted to the process. Keep it up not only for yourself, but to inspire those like me who are floundering around wondering if this is really worth it.
M:28 | W:28 | T:4.5 | M:2.5 | No Children EA1 Uncovered: Jun 2011 EA2 Uncovered: 2011-09-29 S: 2011-09-29 I'm moving on: 2012-05-08 My story: http://bit.ly/K3ttPM
I don't want to preach, but if you want them don't give up!
It's hard and slow , very frustrating and tiring, but just try and keep positive
I have been so low at times, I thought about suicide, but how can I do that to my children and family, it would only aid her in thinking I wasn't worth it!!
Be positive, go to the gym, train hard, change how you feel and look, you will love the new you!!
Yes, you will think of them every day, every morning I wake up my first thought is her, but that pushes me to keep going!!!
Another big thing she told me is that she thinks about me everyday, now when you see your wife with om and not talking to you, you naturally think you are the last thing on her mind, but your probably the first! But this is all about you!!
Be the best you!!
Sow a seed of doubt in her mind, make her question her desicions, make her think about you!!!
But to do this you have to put you first!!!
It's really really hard, I know!!!
But a few kind words after 18 months apart, the love of my children, and my inner happiness has made it all worth while!!
Loc: somewhere out there...
Hey, I am glad to hear your W is talking up all the positives about you. It would be REALLY great if she meant it about y'all taking a family vacation together with the kids. That could really let her see your changes are for real. I wonder if she is just keeping her head in the sand about om, since she knows about another w he may also be involved with. Who knows? Hopefully the weekend out of town may be really crappy, and she finally gives him the heave-ho.
Who knows what is going on inside her head? But it does appear she is very torn in whatever it is!
We have really connected, but now she has backed off again, so I'm giving her the space she needs, and has now asked for, and she will do what she thinks is best.
BUT, the change in her attitude is a big positive, there have been no promises made, but she has mention reconciliation as a possibility, and although I don't want to get my hopes up, I have to listen to what she is saying, which is, give me some space, I'm confused!
Its a lot better than, go away, I hate you, don't call me, ot speak to me ever again!!!
Loc: somewhere out there...
Good, DCS, you have been living your life, moving forward, and she is at least seeing that you can go on and have a good life. As to whether she decides she wants to be a part of that, who knows? She has to get out of her system what she needs to get out, and perhaps she will come out on the other side a better person, too. And, like you said, her even mentioning the possibility of reconciliation is a big step.
And it is lots better than telling you to go away, and being otherwise mean and nasty.
DC- Just read this thread, didn't see a link to another one. Did you have one because I would like to read from the beginning.
My W moved out about 8 months ago and we have progressed into being pretty good friends. However, we recently had our first R talk in about 6 months a few days ago and she says she is thinking she wants to D.
I was quite dissapointed as I felt we have made great progress and were reconnecting but she says she just has a gut feeling that she can't be my W anymore. She says how happy she is that I am a better person and father and have changed so much for the better but she just thinks we're on different paths.
I am greatful that we are friendly and we have 3 kids so I know we will be intertwined somehow but my heart aches for that romantic loving relationship that I believe we could have.
Anyhow, your strength, resolve, and patience is remarkable. Please continue to share.
Thank you for your kind words, but believe me it has been a long hard road to get to where I am now
What I can say though, is don't be afraid of divorce, it's a word, I honestly don't know if I'm divorced or not? I haven't heard from my solicitor for months, and have not seen any certification so who knows? But I'm not bothered either way!!!
I love my "wife", and if I can spend the rest of my life with her without being married, I'd take it now!!
I read the books, it helped but I didn't learn, I had a lot of support and some harsh words on here, again it helped, but I still made mistakes, only time really helped me, also the clarity of not drinking made me understand things so much better!!
Another BIG moment was only recently when she told me, she will always love me, but I had to let her go her own way, make her own mistakes, this had to happen for us to ever become a couple again
It's hard, but I have to believe that one day she will know its me she wants, the only issue being is that maybe by that time, I might not want her???
But if I don't want her then I must be happy!!!
I think about her every hour of every day, but she doesn't dominate my life or any desicions I make anymore
Thanks! The word divorce and the fact that she consulted a lawyer definitely scared me but like I told her, I respect and accept her for who she is and I do not want to be with someone that doesn't want to be with me.
I am just going to do my best to give her time and space and be the best person I can be.
I have gone through phases where I don't think I want to be with her, or at least the person she is now, but I will continue to have hope for our future for myself and our 3 kids.
Drinking has previously been a problem for me as well so I do my best to not overuse as i know things are much better and clearer when i don't drink at all.
What do you feel helped you progress with the detachment the most, if anything?
Thanks again and please continue to update and share, it really helps people like myself.
It's used time and time again on here, but getting a life is key!!!
I have my kids 3 nights a week, so I don't have massive amount of time on my own, but what I do have I use!!
I go to the gym 3-4 times a week, is been a great help and made me feel great, made me feel better, and boosted my confidence!! When you go from benching 80kg to 140kg in 4 months, your waist line has dropped 4 inches, and your chest is bulging, you feel great, you also feel great about the fact your "wife" looks at you in a certain way!!! It happened to me again last night when I took my son home, her eyes were popping out of her head, I don't say anything, just smile knowingly!!
1 other thing, which I know people are not sure about, but helped me, is female company
The confidence of knowing a lady wants to spend time with you, as a person, really helps and makes you feel good about yourself!!!
Confidence is everything, from how you look, feel, to who wants to be with you!!
When you are confident and happy, she will find you more attractive, and think "what if"?? That's where I am now I think??
She is thinking "what if", she just needs to decide !!!
I have my kids 3 nights/week as well and its tough wanting to GAL and wanting to read books, learn here and elsewhere, work out, maintain a clean and laundered house, and find some time to relax.
I have always worked out and been in very good shape so even though I am currently in and working on getting in the best shape of my life, their is not too drastic of a change for her to notice.
It is more for me anyway. I work out 3-5 times/week and am still a competitive basketball player. I do not feel good if I do not exercise regularly, physically or emotionally. She rarely if ever complimented me on my looks and I'm not expecting her to now.
If it doesn't work out with us maybe somebody else will appreciate it.
I have yet to experience any female company and to be honest I'm scared of that dynamic so I haven't actively searched for that.
Not sure if I'm scared that my W may find out and be happy that I've moved on as she has seemed to or scared if I do that it insinuates I'm done with her.
Definitely something to explore further.
Glad you have made such good improvements and your w is noticing, keep up the good work.
I have tried to make all my decisions based on a true desire to improve myself and not as a strategy or tactic to influence or manipulate my W's thoughts so I agree with you their about the female company.
I am more happy with myself now then I've ever been in my life and I will do my best to keep moving forward with or w/o her.
The current dilemma that is plaguing me is that most advice that I've recently receieved on here after a long post I put up about the recent talk I had w/ my w are suggesting I go dark and set more boundaries.
Right now we see each other every day and our kids come to my house after school and stay usually until after dinner and then go to her house if it his her night. If it is my night she will usually leave after dinner.
We have made a lot of strides in our communication which has always been an issue for us and I feel our friendship has blossomed again and we get along pretty well and share things and encourage each other, etc. (me probably more so than her)
8 months ago she was emotionally closed to me so I am greatful to be in this place now.
Anyhow, the fact that she feels she still wants to move for a divorce does cause concern and eventually I am going to want a romantic partner but I just don't feel its the right thing to do to tell her I need space and she shouldn't be over my house and we shouldn't talk or communicate as frequently.
She wants to remain good friends and although I'm not sure if I am going to be able to keep this just friends thing up forever, now does not feel like the time to tell her I need to move on w/ my life w/o her in my life so much.
Anyhow, thought I'd share with you since you seem to be in a situation where you are fostering friendship and less concerned with going dark, creating mystery, let her know what life is like w/o you, etc..
Not a lot has changed. but the same patterns are there!!
OM was around for a few weeks, it was as if I didn't exist at this time, just the odd text, it really is so obvious!!!
Anyway they had there little trip away, she didn't tell the kids he was going, said it was for a friends birthday, which it was, but she forgot to mention he was going also!!, how crazy!!
I have just moved home again, got a really nice 5 bed place, got a great deal, kids love it, I'm happy, so we move on!!
Yesterday, OM goes back away, guess waht, I get a call!! Haha!!
She was all nice then dropped in, the bank has increased interest rate on the mortage and she is really struggling, could I possibly help!!!
I explained things were tight after moving, but I would help if I could but couldn't promise anything.
I asked if OM was helping her out, basically he lives there when he's home, so why not?
She told me she would never live with him? The house was for the kids, and she didn't want that commitment with him?? When I asked why not, it sounds she is not that bothered and there is no real future?
Then started about us!!, all the usual rubbish, me, drink, isolation, etc!! I then told her while I agree with a lot, she had him in the background and only left because he was involved, she played it down but sort of accepted it, then I got she will never love anyone like she loved me, how she still hurts about what happened, and thinks all the time about how happy we were before things went bad!
I said that life/marriage has its ups and downs, nut when we had a down, she left, we never really tried to save it, she just left. She said she didn't know what else to do etc, but knew what I meant.
Anyway, we left on a good note, but reality is kicking in!!
She is broke, is with someone who she has some "fun" with, but it has no real future, and he "ex" is straightened out, happy, well, not drinking, and being a great father to our kids!!
Don't know where it will go, but it does seem only a metter of time before something happens between us again, it might be months,it might be years, but it will happen.
The difference is, I'm not waiting for it, what will be, will be!!
Firstly, OM is over, my ex hasn't told me, but I've heard through the grapevine that she ended it with him, I have not seen him at the house, or his car for 7-8 weeks, so I think this is the case, although I have not mentioned him or the situation to her.
Secondly, she is in contact with me everyday, it could be a text, or a call, but there is always contact from her everyday. I see it as a small positive, we are getting on great, we laugh, send each other jokes, but its all initiated by her. Yes, I like it, not getting carried away, but it's nice.
There has been a few social events regarding our children and sport, and we have even gone together to these!!!! We stand together and chat, smile, all nice, no issues, even some of our friends have asked me if there is something going on between us?
There isn't of course, but it does feel like a togetherness, we are both comfortable in each others company, is it a start?, who knows, but its nice.
So, I carry on, being the best "me" I can be,she is noticing, and has even mentioned a few things about my changes.
Either way, my life is so much more settled now
Keep going guys, it gets easier, not better, better for me is her back, but I'm in a good place right now.
Loc: somewhere out there...
I agree with notsosunny. Let the casual family together times go on awhile longer. The more she is in your company this way, without pressure, lets her see how things could maybe one day be again with you two. Who knows, maybe she will ask YOU out.