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#1841385 - 09/21/09 11:45 AM Re: I'm new wondering if this works... [Re: Butterfly1]
Dia Offline
Member

Registered: 07/14/09
Posts: 1259
Hey, Hope,

Hang in there. We all hit rough patches!

Re: Him staying over (and other stuff, too) - the more you can keep the pressure off of him, the easier time he will have making those baby steps. And while it sucks to high Heaven, the only way to do that is by detaching and backing off as you've already noted.

It might also help if you started agreeing with him when he makes statement like the one about how the odds are against you. This is very counter-intuitive, and it can be fear-provoking for you but it does work.

Example:

H: Just don't use this against me if we D.

Hope (light and casual): Oh, no worries. I know where you stand. (then physically walk away like you have something to do elsewhere in the house)

Example 2:

H: The odds are against us.

Hope (light and off-hand): Yes, I know. (and go back to reading your book or whatever you were doing)

When you do this, you need to give the impression that the issue matters so little that it's hardly worth taking your attention off something else to respond.


Edited by Dia (09/21/09 11:46 AM)
_________________________
The trouble with having an open mind is that people put things in it.

My sitch - Divorce Busted!
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1804137#Post1804137

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#1841407 - 09/21/09 12:16 PM Re: I'm new wondering if this works... [Re: Dia]
Butterfly1 Offline
Member

Registered: 08/18/09
Posts: 1836
Loc: California
Dia!

THank you = I'm ready to do this. I have to be very smart about my responses and stop acting from my feelings. I will do this. I literally have to practice my words like an actress.

Per your advice, when he got up this morning, he was quick to run out - and everything inside me shrank with feeling rejected and afraid. Instead, I said, "OK, see ya" and kept working on my computer. Good job, right? Why is it so hard? Why does it hurt so much?

Although inside, I'm getting more terrified of this legal separation. I know that if I don't give it to him, he'll react like I'm controlling, he'll pull back even more, and file a D,. If I do, I show trust, calmness, and like I have a life no matter what happens - but I'm agreeing to not sharing a life with him at all, which IS totally against my intuition.

Note - he still hasn't gotten the paperwork together to file. Have to show that it's inconsequential to me and my life.


Edited by Hope4Luv (09/21/09 12:22 PM)
_________________________
Me: 42
Him: 43

Two divorcees in a relationship

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#1841473 - 09/21/09 01:34 PM Re: I'm new wondering if this works... [Re: Butterfly1]
Butterfly1 Offline
Member

Registered: 08/18/09
Posts: 1836
Loc: California
More of the same behaviors:
-saying ILY
-long "talks"
-being home whenever H comes over
-reacting to H's anger - button pushing
-sad when around H
-resisting H around legal sep
-feeling responsible for H's anger, frustration

Trying something new:
-No more ILY until I hear it
-no R talks, or very short succint ones - I will set and keep limit
-GAL or busy in house
-light, upbeat, laughter when around H
-agree and let go (not show it bothers me) when h talks about legal sep
-Let H deal with his own anger/frustration

-listen, validate, then walk away
_________________________
Me: 42
Him: 43

Two divorcees in a relationship

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#1841489 - 09/21/09 01:45 PM Re: I'm new wondering if this works... [Re: Butterfly1]
Dia Offline
Member

Registered: 07/14/09
Posts: 1259
Re: legal sep

This is another hard one, and it's something I've not had to do in my own sitch so I'm not speaking from experience. The advice hre, however, is the following:

1) Let your H be entirely responsible for this. You will not assist in any way, remind him of deadlines, etc. If he never gets around to it, so much the better.

2) Accept that you cannot control this, so don't try.

3) The message to convey to your H is along the lines of: "If that's what you think you need to do, I understand." The Guccis of the world will even AGREE with the sep. "Yes, this is probably for the best." I've never had to do that, but it sure does seem to give the WAS pause.

4) If your H does present you with sep. paperwork, DO NOT PANIC. Sep paperwork doesn't mean it's over. Keep DBing. It's ok to say you will look over the papers and get back to him. You don't have to allow him to make you sign on the spot.


Edited by Dia (09/21/09 01:47 PM)
_________________________
The trouble with having an open mind is that people put things in it.

My sitch - Divorce Busted!
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1804137#Post1804137

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#1841492 - 09/21/09 01:48 PM Re: I'm new wondering if this works... [Re: Dia]
Butterfly1 Offline
Member

Registered: 08/18/09
Posts: 1836
Loc: California
UGH! ok. What else can I do except accept it? H has opened up waaaay more since I've demonstrating this attitude, per GUcci. I have not given him any help, but not fought him. He is taking steps on paperwork, but slowly. If you read my sitch, H has put into LS agreement a commitment to 5 months MC or agreement is null. My only hope.

I do not understand!!!! But I will say it. Even with the inner cringe.
_________________________
Me: 42
Him: 43

Two divorcees in a relationship

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#1841494 - 09/21/09 01:50 PM Re: I'm new wondering if this works... [Re: Butterfly1]
Dia Offline
Member

Registered: 07/14/09
Posts: 1259
5 months MC, hmmm?

DB Coaches are licensed and credentialed therapists.

I'm just sayin...


Edited by Dia (09/21/09 01:51 PM)
_________________________
The trouble with having an open mind is that people put things in it.

My sitch - Divorce Busted!
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1804137#Post1804137

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#1841503 - 09/21/09 01:55 PM Re: I'm new wondering if this works... [Re: Dia]
Stronger Offline
Member

Registered: 06/23/09
Posts: 986
Loc: Florida
Ok, really really think about this.
He says he wants out. He says he wants a legal separation first and if you give that to him, he will go to marriage counseling.
How sure are you about OW? Has he admitted this? Or are you just suspicious?
Lately, he’s been pretty mean to you and pretty horrible about S as it relates to discipline but good otherwise, right? He’s been sort of jerky about coverage for S too, but more that he’s around but isn’t very firm about when he’s going to be making it hard for you to get out and do stuff, correct?
Every now and then, there are good conversations, break throughs if you will, and you get to talk to the guy you married while the crazy guy who’s been around lately seems to take a break, right?
There are moments when it seems like he misses you and wants to be around, even spending the night the other night, right?
Is there still intimacy between you two? None of my business really….but it could be a good sign if you are.

At this point, I think you need to really back off, which you admit is hard, but you’ve got to do it. It’s for your sanity. There haven’t been enough good days. Think of backing off as cleaning off the slate to create more good in the marriage than there is bad.
_________________________
M-34/H-35/S-4
Bomb-11-08
OW confirmed 12-08-OW ends 6-09
D finalized 4-10
Stronger=Happy

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#1841536 - 09/21/09 02:33 PM Re: I'm new wondering if this works... [Re: Stronger]
Butterfly1 Offline
Member

Registered: 08/18/09
Posts: 1836
Loc: California
Stronger
He does not say he wants out. He has admitted to not being 100% sure. What he says is, he "doesn't think the odds are in favor of us being able to work this out" and he wants "protection in case - like insurance." He has also said this is an option in place of D.

He's good otherwise. Some nights every week where we are talking, laughing, watching tv, opening up. He's not making it too hard to get in and out of stuff - he's agreed and thoroughly stuck to a 50%
time share of evening/morning care with S where H sleeps at our house.

The unaccounted for time (I suspect is OW) has only been once or twice in the last 6 wks. H told me in our last MC session, 6 wks ago that he "got together with someone else" and in a conversation a few weeks back said he's "not going to stop seeing her and it's up to me to show I"m the better choice to return to." Could be a bluff as he is quite insecure with women, or it's not a big affair at the least, as he's accountable for his time 98% of the time.

Yes, break throughs, good convos - I don't post them here as much as I do the angry outbursts, but in the last six weeks, they have been increasing slowly.

No intimacy. Not a surprise, there was no intimacy for years in our M - a reason we both had flings, an issue brought up in MC previously, but never really faced. Intend to face in upcoming MC - recently had some talks where I validated his hurt and took responsibility for my part in that - something I never could do before when I always blamed him. My blame is what pushed him toward OW, he says, because it "proved" to him that someone else would respond to him more positively than I would - he said he believed me before when I blamed him, feeling bad about his sexual performance, and now he feels it's not all his fault. (BTW this is the same reason I slept with someone else - to prove to myself that someone else would respond better to me so I didn't feel it was all my fault - I've looked at this and moved on, unwilling to act out like this ever again).

I've validated over and over and appologized admitting I was avoiding my part in it and if we ever get there again, I want to show him I take responsibility and that I was wrong.

Backing off is the hardest thing for me. Especially when I sense this female threat lurking in the wings. But what made me stop thinking about other men as "better options" was when my H moved on and found OW - I realized I was just reacting to H, but that I had to look at my part in why our sex life was zero. It seems too late now, but I want to work through this. Now he doesn't. Ugh.

I cant' seem to back off without depression. It feels like giving up.
_________________________
Me: 42
Him: 43

Two divorcees in a relationship

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#1841538 - 09/21/09 02:35 PM Re: I'm new wondering if this works... [Re: Dia]
Butterfly1 Offline
Member

Registered: 08/18/09
Posts: 1836
Loc: California
Originally Posted By: Dia
5 months MC, hmmm?

DB Coaches are licensed and credentialed therapists.

I'm just sayin...


You mean go for DB coach instead of MC?
_________________________
Me: 42
Him: 43

Two divorcees in a relationship

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#1841556 - 09/21/09 02:50 PM Re: I'm new wondering if this works... [Re: Butterfly1]
Dia Offline
Member

Registered: 07/14/09
Posts: 1259
It's a possibility. The coaches will work with one of you at a time, or both together. You can click over and read up on their credentials through the Telephone Coaching link at the top of the page. If you want to explore that option, I'd schedule a session with a DB Coach yourself first to talk over this whole idea of the Coach working with both of you, your H not being sure, etc. He will need to feel comfortable that they will be fair and objective, that they won't simply pressure him to stay in the M 'because that's what they do', and talking to the Coach may help you find ways to convey that message in a manner he'll be able to hear.

Another tactic is to schedule one session but let him go first, by himself. That way he won't feel you've contaminated the waters, so to speak. They have an 800 number with someone you can talk to if you want more info.

I absolutely do not mean to pressure you to do this - it's just that it did help me and the DB Coaches seem like they might be better than many other therapists at not deciding at the drop of a hat that the best thing they can do is help both of you 'move on', ya know?

I've only had two sessions, and they made a huge difference for me. My H has never talked to them, but I may suggest it here shortly.
_________________________
The trouble with having an open mind is that people put things in it.

My sitch - Divorce Busted!
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1804137#Post1804137

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