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PS, I've never tried the note, but we have been known to email each other - from the other room of the same house!


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(((((Hope)))))
I know it's hard to deal with anger like that. Dont' think too much about the long term. When things start to get hot, just concentrate on the moment, and see if you can keep your anger under control. Even a little bit might make a difference. If you don't escalate, it might cut him off at the pass!

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THanks - I'm doing better at keeping my mouth shut, but it's the internal reactions that are hard to bear. I think they call this "fight or flight"? I get an enormous knot in my stomach and I get almost dizzy, like I can't think straight. Sitting still with those feelings is so painful. I'm working on self soothing. In the past, I just wanted him to stop - but asking, explaining, even walking away just escalated. That was during my better moments. During my worse, I would just start raising my voice to shout over him and there ya go, we're both being angry.

So, you are right. Concentrate on the moment , staying calm even if my internal emergency system is going off, and not allow the escalations of the past. Who knows, he might even notice! lol


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hugs hope.

I completely agree with virtual on the "moment" thing. I have a "flash temper" myself so I can sympathize with the agony of keeping it tamped down.

Keep working on it, it does get easier.

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I think there were some suggestions in DB for this. Wasn't there something on "Controlled Fights?" Probably easier to write about than initiate, but it may be worth looking at.


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I agree...stop the cycle of anger. It's crazy. No one is going to win. So stop.

Doing the 180’s, GALing, Going Dark, these are suggestions and that’s all. They do not always work and then work like a charm for others. You have to figure out your own situation and make the decision for you. (Going Dark did not work out well for me. 180’s GALing….made a HUGE difference in my life and situation.)

Stop saying I love you. It’s pressure. You have to remove pressure.

Yes, he is afraid to trust. Are you? Do you have trust issues with him too?

When it comes to his complaints….are you in agreement? Are these things you can work on and still be you? Still be proud of yourself and have self respect? If yes, go to work, if not, then don’t do it and explain to him why and if you need to ask him questions for clarification, do that too.

-taking better care of the house and yard - he is much neater than I am and I realize what I am comfortable with is not what he is comfortable with - cleaner desks, cleaner yard, no dishes in sink, etc.
Is this something you can do? Is this really a change you can make? I love a clean house, but not everyone is annoyed with a few dishes in the sink for a day. I sort of am. But I don’t tell anyone or complain about it, I just clean it. Because I’m willing to do that for as long as I’m healthy and able. I like cleaning. But do you?

- not interrupting him or walking away - this is hard when he is screaming at me, but I guess I have to do it. Also, my therapist told me I should walk away if he is being verbally abusive, so there's a conflict there in my mind.
Here’s one where I think you need to explain yourself. If someone is yelling and screaming at me, damn right, I’m walking away. If he’s talking to you and trying to communicate with you and you just don’t like what he’s saying so then you walk away, ok, he’s got a point. He needs to understand screaming at you get’s him left in the room alone. (Calm down and speak to each other. H and I are much better at this now and man, does it help with the blood pressure.)

- staying calm - oh this has been my hardest one because we are both volatile people and I get resentful that he only sees that I should stay calm while he admits he should be able to swear, vent, yell, whatever he feels. But he says I am the one who has been too volatile over the years all I can do is take responsibility for my part in it. However, when I do express remorse, apologize, say I am working on it in therapy, etc, he just says he doesn't believe me so I don't know what to do.
This one is simple. Just shut up and SHOW him. Do not engage him. I think a great 180 suggestion for you….speak calmly. He starts to interrupt you, you just stop talking. Wait until he’s done, start talking. He interrupts you again, stop talking. Eventually he’ll notice he’s the ass. Works like a charm for me.

-he doesn't want me to say "you do it to" although our therapist agrees we both have habits that lead to horrible fights, he does not in any way want to feel blamed. I understand this because I don't either. However, I am trying to be the one who changes. It just hurts to be blamed myself.
So stop it. But don’t let him do it to you either. “I have stopped blaming you….because I don’t want to be blamed either.”

- doing what I say I will do - follow through. He is nitpicking every little thing I do or don't do but I need to be extra careful or else he explodes at the tiniest thing.
I think these types of complaints are more tricky. Do you not follow through? If yes, would you like to change that about yourself? Or is he exaggerating….Yeah, I’ll pick up your dry cleaning? And then you forget?

Some really valuable advice I got here…you aren’t going to argue anything to him. You may be the dumbest person on earth right now and you can’t convince him of anything. Scream the truth and facts all you want….doesn’t hear you. So stop it. Show him your changes. Stop telling him you changed. He’ll have to see it. I’ve been at this for 9 months now and my H has flat out told me “Like the changes, not sure if it’s all BS….I’m waiting to see.” So they are watching. I’m lucky I got such great feedback.

If he’s really going to get on you about every little thing just to get on you, there’s nothing you can do but tell him “I’m sorry you think that, but I like me. If you have a suggestion as to how I can improve, I’ll take it under advisement…don’t’ expect me to incorporate the suggestion….like I said I do like me, but always open to possible improvements.”

Small improvements are good. Keep a journal of them. Be encouraged but keep working on you, for you.
If the yelling continues, you simply tell him, not yelling “I’m not going to be yelled at. When you are calmer and you have your thoughts in order, I’m ready to listen. I think that’s reasonable. Two adults talking out a disagreement.


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That's a really good post, Stronger...it will be helpful to a lot of us. Thank you.

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Stronger - this is amazing advice - of course what I know I should do, but I try to anazlyze why it becomes so hard in the moment. I'll post later in response after I put my son to bed. THank you all (((hugs)))


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@Giving - I got "Dance of Anger" today from library. Great book about changing the anger cycle. I also got DB again - will check "Controlled Fights" THX!

@Virtual, Painful, Stronger - working hard on changing my side of the fights. doing 180's - babystep progress every day.
It's not just stopping the yelling always. I agree with the walk out and talk later strategy, but lately it makes him more enraged, blaming, abusive. It's why I said earlier I try to sit still with all the panic and alarms running through my veins. Yes, ideally I should walk away and say we'll talk anything through when calmer, but his response is to escalate, raise his voice, and deny "I'm not yelling!" "I am calm!" "You're just trying to ......(fill in the blank accusations)" etc. My goal is to de-escalate, so I'm still in a quandry here - will discuss with MC if H returns Monday to our app.

Sometimes, I have to sense it coming before it escalates. That is trickier because it is less obvious, but I have to resist the temptation to explain my position, ask him to speak nicely, ask him to consider my point of view. Although this seems counterproductive to a "healthy" relationship, it actually escalates things somehow and eventually he gets angrier, then I get angry, then he blames me then I blame him for starting it in the first place then we're nowhere.

Tonight I proudly did some 180's with beneficial effects:
- He had earlier said he'd put our son to bed, but when the time came he was on his computer. This usually upsets me because I feel he is ignoring us, not keeping his word, not respecting how tired I am from being with our son all day, etc. When I asked if he still intended to put son to bed, he got upset. My 180 = I


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(oops...continue)
....I walked away, not angrily, just letting it go. When he sarcastically said, "Why don't you help me - oh I guess the answer is no" which in the past would have made me angry and feel he was being even more insensitive, I did a 180 = I said "How can I help you?". He needed help on a map, so remembering he's felt neglected, I helped him. He seemed to like that and so did our four year old who also chimed in to help (and hug) us.

When he left saying he didn't have time to put our son to bed I 180'ed - I said that's fine, go ahead, have a nice night. I honestly wasn't even resentful. I felt I'd rather have him gone than here and angry.

When leaving - and here's where the tiny button was pushed toward escalation that I had to catch - he said "See you Sunday - or maybe tomorrow, I don't know" as he was walking out the door! Even though my internal alarms started going off, (how rude, how unfair, how insensitive) I said, "I need to know the schedule (of visiting our son) farther in advance." He said something blaming - like I was the one who was sick all week and wanted things flexible - so I said well call me when you can to figure out the schedule.

THAT WAS A 180 = I would have usually felt indignant that he was flaking out on the schedule. This is a common trap - he flakes out on telling me when he will come over to be with our son, then I get upset, then he gets rude, then I raise my voice, then we are fighting and it goes nowhere. My 180 = I let it go. I decided if I didn't see him until Sunday, I would not show it bothered me, I would show GAL and I would just bring it up in therapy. I would not get into an argument.

The final part - he did call a half hour later, to my surprise. Even more surprising HE WAS CALM. He has been in full attack mode for months - this was a real change in his response. Instead of complaining, begging, explaining, etc, I 180'ed = told him calmly that "If I had said see you in two days when you had our son you would be livid." He calmly got my point. That's a change. He reassured me he "didn't mean to say see you in two days" and then started explaining his schedule and the things on his mind and that he had to juggle and why he didn't know if he could come over Saturday night (tomorrow) or not. This is new. He has been so angry and defensive, he's just exploded at any mention of what he is doing and why lately. He let me in people. He thawed. It was truly a miracle.

Then back to usual.

I said "ok, what time tomorrow (Saturday) should we talk to discuss the plan for the evening?" He suddenly explodes. "Oh get off it!" and "Why do you have to know every detail?" and other rude comments. This is how he's been for months. But my 180 = i told him to do what he needed to do and that it didn't matter to me. Not in a vindictive way, it really is not worth the anger. It mattered a lot more when he would talk to me like that when my son was four months old and I was exhausted from round the clock feedings and no sleep. But I didn't remind him of past hurts either. That doesn't help.

Sorry for the long posts - but man, I'm proud of how I handled it.


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