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#1684174 - 12/31/08 12:00 PM Re: My Story [Re: A in Ohio]
JDOllie Offline
Member

Registered: 12/12/08
Posts: 1005
Loc: Ohio
Quote:
Jon - I know you mean well by sending this message, however, this is classic pursuing. Make sure this is the last apology email you send.


Yep, I know it was, but I wanted to make sure W knew that I had felt her reaching out to me, and I took a cheap shot, and I knew it.

She is very very sensitive - and when stuff like that happens, if it isn't dealt with, she'll stick in a corner of her brain, and bring it up over and over and over again. If I take complete fault for it, which I deserve in this case, she'll let it go.

I made clear not to mention anything about us, or how we used to be, or anything smooshy - just focused on me, and even left her completely out of it.

You are right though - I won't send anything like this again, and I normally never do, but I knew that W likes these types of apologies. It will make her feel validated, and it'll make her more likely to open up like she did again. I don't think you realize how HUGE it is that she called me and was so emotionally vulnerable like that. Probably why she reacted so out of whack...
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#1684179 - 12/31/08 12:06 PM Re: My Story [Re: JDOllie]
A in Ohio Offline
Member

Registered: 09/29/08
Posts: 804
Originally Posted By: JonF
While W was pitching-a-fit angry at me last night, she told D8 that OM was the "nicest man she'd ever met" - probably directly in response to W telling me that I was mean.

Somehow, that is oddly comforting to me - in an affair, smoldering sex is hard to compete with. But a guy that's "nice" - now THAT'S something I can compete with.


Very interesting question for the board. Female WAS, is the sex more difficult to "defeat" than the "nice guy" who is meeting her emotional needs? I argue that meeting the emotional needs is far more important than sex.

Any thoughts?
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#1684189 - 12/31/08 12:13 PM Re: My Story [Re: JDOllie]
A in Ohio Offline
Member

Registered: 09/29/08
Posts: 804
Originally Posted By: JonF
Yep, I know it was, but I wanted to make sure W knew that I had felt her reaching out to me, and I took a cheap shot, and I knew it.

She is very very sensitive - and when stuff like that happens, if it isn't dealt with, she'll stick in a corner of her brain, and bring it up over and over and over again. If I take complete fault for it, which I deserve in this case, she'll let it go.

I made clear not to mention anything about us, or how we used to be, or anything smooshy - just focused on me, and even left her completely out of it.

You are right though - I won't send anything like this again, and I normally never do, but I knew that W likes these types of apologies. It will make her feel validated, and it'll make her more likely to open up like she did again. I don't think you realize how HUGE it is that she called me and was so emotionally vulnerable like that. Probably why she reacted so out of whack...


I agree with what your saying and apologize when needed. My point is to work on yourself and not get into that sitch. Thus, "Make sure this is the last apology email you send".

No matter what she does, no matter what you FEEL, it's water off a duck's back.
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#1684192 - 12/31/08 12:14 PM Re: My Story [Re: A in Ohio]
JDOllie Offline
Member

Registered: 12/12/08
Posts: 1005
Loc: Ohio
Remember that W was furious at me at the time too... \:\) I agree that meeting emotional needs is much more important for women, and especially W. W REALLY needs a shoulder to cry on right now.

I'm not a female, but let me explain my thinking on it, and why I think it's easier to compete. If it is smoldering hot sex for a 31 year old woman hitting her sexual peak - how do you compete with that? I mean you could buy some bikini briefs, but she'll probably just laugh. Then, there's the problem of actually HAVING sex with W to compete!

You can gradually convince her that you are just as sweet and nice - especially as the polish starts to wear off, but how do you "gradually" convince her that sex with you would be better?

The "nicest guy" though:
1. Set up on pedestal VERY high
2. How long will this last? OF COURSE, you're going to be super nice in the first 6 weeks you date someone...
3. Um hello, being nice? How else is he going to get into her pants - that will shut MY W off like a faucet.
4. She is also putting all of HER nicest stuff forward for him, and her polish will wear off eventually.
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#1684233 - 12/31/08 12:46 PM Re: My Story [Re: JDOllie]
A in Ohio Offline
Member

Registered: 09/29/08
Posts: 804
Originally Posted By: JonF
Remember that W was furious at me at the time too... \:\) I agree that meeting emotional needs is much more important for women, and especially W. W REALLY needs a shoulder to cry on right now.

I'm not a female, but let me explain my thinking on it, and why I think it's easier to compete. If it is smoldering hot sex for a 31 year old woman hitting her sexual peak - how do you compete with that? I mean you could buy some bikini briefs, but she'll probably just laugh. Then, there's the problem of actually HAVING sex with W to compete!

You can gradually convince her that you are just as sweet and nice - especially as the polish starts to wear off, but how do you "gradually" convince her that sex with you would be better?

The "nicest guy" though:
1. Set up on pedestal VERY high
2. How long will this last? OF COURSE, you're going to be super nice in the first 6 weeks you date someone...
3. Um hello, being nice? How else is he going to get into her pants - that will shut MY W off like a faucet.
4. She is also putting all of HER nicest stuff forward for him, and her polish will wear off eventually.


I see your point and can understand you position...

I may be getting myself into trouble here and I'm hoping SMW, Breakawy, Veronica or anyone can back me up here......

In general, most women don't get "horny" like men do. For a women, it's emotional fulfillment. Smoldering hot sex is directly related to how a woman feels emotionally. Women entering their sexual prime is derived from the chemical in their bodies changing. Alright, before I get into trouble "labeling", let's leave it at "Women want to be emotionally fulfilled, thus making them horny".

Men, have a "fill tank" and it's a physical thing. Damn, I wish I could explain this better but here is my best stab.... Men, get "backed up" sort to speak. You produce seaman and when you hit the "full tank" you need to release it. Sounds primitive so we'll leave it at, "For men, it's a physical (or biological thing).

Read Men Are From Mars or something to get better understanding. I'm having a terrible time explaining.

You're right, he's trying to sleep with her. Most men will say/do anything to get some action. Especially now a days. Listen to single guys talk.. "working chicks", "game", "playin"... Doesn't sound like honesty, does it?
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#1684244 - 12/31/08 12:58 PM Re: My Story [Re: A in Ohio]
JDOllie Offline
Member

Registered: 12/12/08
Posts: 1005
Loc: Ohio
Although I defer to your excellence in all matters thus far, I would tend to disagree.

Although 30s is the sexual peak - I believe a large majority of women are willing to have sex ONLY IF they are emotionally fulfilled.

My W, and everyone of her friends is that way - if she is mad, feels like I'm not listening, if I say something unkind, etc - no nookie that night!

What I think happens in an affair is that women are willing to have sex because they think that will make the OM willing to LISTEN to them and thus emotionally fulfill them - basically it's a pretty sick trade-off.

I'm probably the weirdest guy ever - I self-imposed celibacy even though W was willing. I told her it wouldn't happen until we were friends first because I didn't want a relationship based on nothing but sex. There were times where I seriously wished I hadn't made that commitment! \:\)

Also, I think guys would probably have sex with a post as long as it stood still long enough - most women I know require a pretty good chunk of trust to allow that.
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#1684324 - 12/31/08 01:48 PM Re: My Story [Re: JDOllie]
MT35 Offline
Member

Registered: 09/03/08
Posts: 1623
Loc: Kansas
Jon-

Just wanted to say thanks for stopping by my thread. Also, I have problems with conversation with my H because I don't want to ask what he is doing the other half of his life he is living with OW. We had always talked about everything we did during the day, now I feel silence a lot because other than his time here with me and at work, it doesn't feel right asking what H has done because he is at OW's house. I understand that sometimes the words comes out, What are you doing? and after you say it, you think Sh*t, they are doing stuff with the OP, they aren't going to want to tell me that.

As for the 30's women and sex, I am 35 right smack in the middle of the 30's. I don't really no for others, but I know I want some sort of feeling for a guy before I was to have sex with him. Yeah we all get that juices flowing feeling, when we someone we are attracted too, but for me I want at least, how I have felt for since I was 15 was I wanted to know someone as a friend before I jumped into bed with them. I was never one to try for a one night stand. Now when I drink I know I am much more relaxed, but still not ready for something with someone I really don't know. Now my H will tell me he is horny all the time, has always told me that. I am not sure how that works for him now, he still tells me that. Not sure if that is what he tells OW too! Who knows! But I am not sure what it says about me that I still want to have sex with my H, even after everything that has gone on.

That is just one 35 year old woman's view, I know many others will feel very differently!


Edited by MT35 (12/31/08 01:49 PM)
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#1684330 - 12/31/08 01:58 PM Re: My Story [Re: MT35]
mishka422 Offline
Member

Registered: 12/12/07
Posts: 9638
Loc: GA
Ok, I'll bravely chime in on this one.

I'm 37 and I can tell you that in my case I was pretty distant with my XH prior to the bomb because I could feel the emotional distance. However, there is nothing that made me any randier than knowing that he didn't want me, was having an A, and that I no longer had the option of "getting any" again. Good grief! It was like a hormone overload for months that couldn't be satisfied. Now, don't get me wrong, I didn't run out and try to find someone to satisfy my cravings because that is not the kind of woman I am. I must have an emotional connection but losing that connection to the most important person in my life made me crave it so much more.

I don't know if that makes sense. Now that it has been over a year and the D is final my hormones have calmed down to next to nothing because there is no possibility of an emotional attachment. Again, no idea if that is making sense or helping you at all.

In short, women do need an emotional attachment in order to have smoldering hot sex in general. Now a quickie with little fullfilment can be done without any emotional attachment. Again, I'm not going there but I know plenty of women who have just for the momentary high.
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T19 M15 S19 XH46 M43
bomb12/4/07
PA5/07
S12/26/07
D final 11/17/08
Back together with no defined R 05/2010
confused....to say the least!!!


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#1684347 - 12/31/08 02:28 PM Re: My Story [Re: mishka422]
JDOllie Offline
Member

Registered: 12/12/08
Posts: 1005
Loc: Ohio
Thanks, ladies, I guess I was pretty close - and I know there are exceptions to the rules.
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#1684401 - 12/31/08 03:44 PM Re: My Story [Re: JDOllie]
JDOllie Offline
Member

Registered: 12/12/08
Posts: 1005
Loc: Ohio
Ok, some journaling:

W came to pick up S6 today - one big stupid thing I did, and I've learned my lesson. S6 said that OM was coming over, and I knew OM and W were going to some music thing, but I was thinking OM was coming to the party tomorrow (that W left out of \:\) Anyway, I told S6, "No, he's coming tomorrow" So the first thing S6 says to W is "Daddy says OM isn't coming over" W's face went through about 15 contortions - ending very quickly on pressed together lips. I can't tell if she was mad I was talking about him, or felt odd because she has never mentioned him to my face, maybe guilty. She just told S6, "Well, he's coming over a little later." All I could do was mumble, "I thought it was tomorrow."

Ugh - note to self, COMPLETELY ignore anything kids say about OM. Just say Oh, or change the subject. D8 wanted to text W and ask what OM's last name was, and I said, "Just talk to Mommy tomorrow." Boom, done.

So, after that horrible exchange - W was acting extremely uncomfortable - I've never seen her so uncomfortable.

I had taken the opportunity, of course, to put on snappy jeans, a fitted shirt that shows off my 22 pounds lost, combed hair, shaved, trimmed goatee, good cologne on. I just went up and stood about a foot away and leaned against the wall, (wanted to make sure she caught a whiff of the cologne) and she didn't do anything.

I just started telling funny stuff, showed her kids new gummy vitamins, asked her how work was (She said, "You know, pretty boring.") Joked about New Year's, etc.

S6 got his shoes on, and was standing there, and I wrapped up, got him his coat, gave him a hug, and shooed them out the door. I said bye to both of them, and W didn't respond.

I'm glad I sort of pushed them out the door very gently - instead of W ending the conversation, and leaving.

My goal is small with these times: just put a little tiny twist of myself somewhere in the back of W's head. I know OM has 99.9999%, but I'll start with .0001%.
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