Q&A with the WAS - DivorceBusting.com

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I have recieved a lot of questions as the WAW and I thought it would be beneficial for the LBS to have a thread set aside for FAQ's.

Here are questions I recently recieved and my answers.

Quote:

When you waw'ed, did your H pursue?
How long did he pursue?
What got you thinking otherwise?
Was it when he quit persuing and how long after?
Or was it that he found someone new that sparked your interest again?
When he pursued, did you shut down? Ignore him? Not answer emails until you got really pissed?

H did pursue. He did all the things Michele tells us not to do. I can't blame him though. I admire that he was so determined to save our marriage although at the time I didn't see it that way.

H pursued for 10 months. I told him in late Sep 06 that I wanted to separate. At the end of October 06 I left. In Jan 07 he found a therapist that we saw together. On May 1, 07 he gave me an ultimatum to move back in or he would file for the D. I resisted and he backed down. I told him that maybe it was me and I would work with the therapist myself. In reality we only attended counseling for 3.5 months together (not nearly enough time for either of us and with the wrong therapist) In Aug 07 he went on vacation (I moved back in a week before). He returned after a month a stranger and dropped the bomb. In early Dec 07 I moved out for the second time and I was in limbo until July 08 when I filled separation papers. He responded with a D request but he is stalling on talking about a settlement.....

During this entire time we continued to interact as if we were both still invested in the marriage and that divorce wasn't even a consideration but that we were just getting some space. I of course wasn't invested. I didn't feel connected to him. I thought our problems where too big and besides he wasn't going to change our M wasn't going to change and I didn't love him. However, I continued to spend every weekend at home, go to family functions together, go on vacations, attend counseling together, didn't tell family or friends of our separation etc. I did however remain distant. I rarely called, avoided going to lunch with him (we work within 5 min of each other), didn't show affection, and if it wasn't for him protesting I wouldn't have gone home on the weekends.

It wasn't until he dropped the bomb (10 months after I dropped the bomb) that something clicked. It really was one defining moment for me, a split second that changed everything for me. Up until the second before my feelings hadn't changed. I believe he met someone (This is not what sparked my interest. I didn't suspect anything until after the bomb). I don't believe anything physical happened but meeting someone in the midst of turmoil has a tendency to change your perspective on your significant other. The prospect of losing everything hit me right then and there. Now we are going through the same cycle, roles reversed. I can only hope that this trip overseas will have the opposite effect that it did last year.

In short, the more he pushed and pursued the farther I ran. I couldn't stand the constant pressure, the R talks, the guilt trips. What I wanted was to find solutions to see changes in our M and in him. I realize now that I needed to make changes too. This is why I believe that the 180 and finding solutions are your most valuable tools.

I didn't have this on the original post but I also wanted to say that it just took time and experience to realize I had something better at home. Be the better option, don't feed into the games, argue or pursue and eventually, hopefully, the WAS will see it as I did.

Hope, thank you for sharing your story with us and opening yourself up to the question of the LBS (which I am sad to see you are one now as well). I have not had time to read your other threads, so forgive me. Did you have an EA or PA when you seperated from your H? Do you think that if he would have stopped persuing you and changed himself instead, you would have wanted to come home earlier or was it the fact that you finally felt like you had lost him that got you to turn back to him? The old only want what you cant have mentality. Once again, thanks for sharing any insight you can bring to all of LBS. You are giving us a gift.

hopeful,

I posted this question in one of your other threads but hoped others would maybe shine a light on this question here.

If after a long time of pursuing, when the LBH finally went no contact, did you feel more relieved at first or did the curiosity kick in right away?

Quote:

Q: Did you have an EA or PA when you seperated from your H?

A: I did not however, to be honest I was distracted by the attention that I recieved as someone who's marriage appeared to be over.

Quote:

Q: Do you think that if he would have stopped persuing you and changed himself instead, you would have wanted to come home earlier or was it the fact that you finally felt like you had lost him that got you to turn back to him?

A: EXACTLY. He pursued endlessly but that did not change the fact that neither of us changed (note that the WAS doesn't see the need to change themselves so you must be the first to do it)and therefore our R didn't change. For me it is not an either or question. If he would have stopped pursuing me and changed I would have come back but because he did not it took for me to feel as if I was losing him to turn back to him.

Quote:

Q: If after a long time of pursuing, when the LBH finally went no contact, did you feel more relieved at first or did the curiosity kick in right away?

A: Initially I was relieved until I saw that he was really done and no longer wanted me. I later realized that I was not relieved that he had given up but rather relieved to be free from the pressure. What this means to the LBS is to stop pursing, no R talk, no pressure, and don't show the WAS that you are hurt by what they say or do.

HIC~ Mind if i answer some too...this is awesome, i am like you and get questions as well.

christa

Christa,

Yes, please. Everyone is encouraged to ask and answer questions. I just started the thread but it isn't for me. Everyone, LBS and WAS, please chime in!

great...what a awesome idea $\:\)$

"Q: Did you have an EA or PA when you separated from your H?"

I did not have any type of affair...just was tired of constant fighting and arguing that never resolved, so one day i packed and left.

"Q: Do you think that if he would have stopped perusing you and changed himself instead, you would have wanted to come home earlier or was it the fact that you finally felt like you had lost him that got you to turn back to him?"

My H, did stop persuing about 2 months after I served him with papers. Once I had space to figure out what it was that I had REALLY done...I truly started to think. It was then, I realized, Oh boy, I really screwed this up. This journey that we are on, isn't about him changing per say, i realize now (in hindsight) how much I needed to grow. I had lost both of my parents within a 2 year time frame, and had many other stressors in my life. With the time we have been separated, I have realized not only what I have in my H, but what I could have done differently, and how I can be and will be a better spouse. This "journey" has been about really figuring out who I am, and how I can be the best "me" ever, because then...I can be the best W ever. hope that makes sense. I have to accept him for who he is...end of story!

"Q: If after a long time of pursuing, when the LBH finally went no contact, did you feel more relieved at first or did the curiosity kick in right away?"

I was relieved at first, then as time has went by, it becomes harder. I am at ease being on my own...but I always wonder what he is out there doing. I know there is OW who fades in and out. He does however, talk to me on and off. We are at 19 mos, separated, and I still have hope. Until papers are signed...I will have hope.

I am happy to help Hopeful answer questions....just ask!!!

christarn

Hope and Christar, thank you both sooooo much for opening up about your true feelings. It gives more insight into the thought process of a WAS to us LBS.

May I ask some more? Was it a slow process for you to want to R or did it just hit you one day? If it was slow, did you try reaching out with little gestures before actually proclaiming that you want R to work? If fast, did you just wake up and say I want R backand then profess to LBS your feelings? DO you think that the WAS spouce wants to R awhile before they tell LBS but wait to say anything because they are affraid that things will go back to being so awful, like when they left?

Ok, that's it for now. I'm sure I will come up with plenty more. Thanks again for helping us out.

BH~ No prob, ask away!! Glad to share all that I can.

"Was it a slow process for you to want to R or did it just hit you one day?"

It was a slow process for me. After leaving, we tried MC, then OW was in picture...I got flustered, as we were supposably working on our M, so I filed for D. He continued to call for about 1-2 months give or take. After that, I slowly started to think...Wow, what in the hell have I done. I really just started to miss him. It was simple things that really started to hit me...fixing our favorite meals and eating it alone; not having him there when I needed someone to talk to; not hearing his voice when I came home...it slowly got to me. 19 mos later, I still can not imagine living my daily life without him being there. Even though were are separated, there is not a day that passes that I am not hopeful our R/M will be restored and be even better. How I explained to him that I wanted to try to work on things is rather crazy. We started texting...at first he was really angry towards me...then slowly he started to warm up. One day he said we should talk, so I held him to it. I said that sounds great, so we met at a bar...he wanted to talk about me buying a house...and I told him how I felt...I will never forget the look on his face. He did not know whether to slap me or cry...i will never ever forget the expression on his face when i uttered the words, i think we can work this out...

"DO you think that the WAS wants to R awhile before they tell LBS but wait to say anything because they are afraid that things will go back to being so awful, like when they left?"

I waited, first off, just because we had a hard time finding a day that we could meet. Second, I was terrified of his response, was he going to say hell no, was he going to agree and say yes. I honestly believed he would be all go, and say yes...but here I am, 19 mos. later, still trying to show him that we can work this out, that I am not who I was then, and never want to be that person again. I have strived so hard to make positive changes within myself, and I would just like to be afforded the chance to show him the changes. We did put our D on hold, and talk on and off. I just don't think he honestly knows what it is that he wants. I truly understand the hurt I put him through, but we are the only ones that can help eachother...nobody else can help him make the hurt I caused go away...except me.

hope this helps $\:\)$
(((brokenhearted)))
christarn

Originally Posted By: brokenhearted

Q: Was it a slow process for you to want to R or did it just hit you one day?

It hit me one day. See my answer to the next question.

Quote:

Q: If fast, did you just wake up and say I want R back and then profess to LBS your feelings?

My H picked a ridiculous fight just so he could tell me he was done. At that moment I snapped out of it and started begging, pleading, crying.

Quote:

Q: DO you think that the WAS spouce wants to R awhile before they tell LBS but wait to say anything because they are afraid that things will go back to being so awful, like when they left?

There were many occasions when I thought that I should go back but when I would come home or spend time with him nothing had changed. It would remind me of the frustration I experienced, the rejection I felt, and the nights I cried myself to sleep because I felt unwanted and unloved. Who would want to go back to that? So yes, I wanted my relationship back but I was afraid things would never change.

Hopeful,

Have you dated anyone else since?

I haven't. I do not feel comfortable dating until my divorce is final.

If you guys don't mind, I would like to reverse this for just a moment! I would like to ask the LBS a few questions, if you don't mind answering. Then we can get back to subject at hand!

My H wavers back and forth, sometimes he talks to me, sometimes he doesn't...any suggestions as to what I can do to help this sitch?

Anything I could do better to ease his anger? Last time we actually had a phone conversation, he said he would never be able to forgive me for what I did, and just still had that "angry" voice...any advice/suggestions?

I've been texting just random, generic stuff...he responded at first, and now has stopped; feedback here would be great $\:\)$

any suggestions, ideas, comments...I would love! I've been at this for 19 months now...so am up for any ideas!

thanks so much
(((hugs 2 all of you)))
christa

Chris, if my H was to come home, at first I would be very happy, but then the resentment and anger that I have been keeping on the back burner would come flooding out.

I would hope that my H would do some of the following:

Have an open and honest conversation where he would answer any and every question I had with COMPLETE honest. He would also have to be COMPLETELY transparent in his life until I felt safe again. This means all passwords to email accounts, can check cell phone whenever I wanted, key logger installed on his computer and he would tell me where he was and what he was doing for all of his day. Not saying it would be easy to live like like, but after a the trust established there would no longer need to be these checks and balances.

I would also hope that we could have a discussion where he took complete responsibily for his actions and tried to see from my side the pain he caused..if you want a good place to see it go to survivinginfidelity.com. THere is sooooo much hurt on the BB that I could not stay there for long. Might give you insight on what to say to show understand with H.

Finally, I would want him to be professing his undying love for me and trying to "win" me back. He would have to work really hard because of the vile way he tried to destroy our M.

Hope I have not been too harsh....I really would not be that harsh with H either, but he would not know that. I now have a much better understanding as to why people have A. I know his had nothing to do with me.....she is not attractive AT ALL and is a size 18/20 while I am 5'8", size 4/6 with a very curvy figure. Glad I finally saw her because it really drove the point home that its about building his ego, not me.

Good Luck.

Thanks BH! I have tried a lot of the above...last summer we were dating frequently; then after christmas...he just cut me off...i'm not sure why.

i would be so willing to do any of the above...great suggestions, but as of now...he won't even answer a text msg! got to figure something out $\:\)$

thanks for the feedback...you are not harsh! it's what one would have to do to feel safe!

thanks
(((BH))))
christa

Crista,

You are in a tough spot.

He has some anger I am sure. For one of the rare times in my sitch, I have found myself very angry this weekend too. I have been asking myself what would I say if I got a call from her next week? the answer seemed to be,-throw it back in her face.

Quote:

Anything I could do better to ease his anger? Last time we actually had a phone conversation, he said he would never be able to forgive me for what I did, and just still had that "angry" voice...any advice/suggestions?[/

How long have you gone without contact?

In my opinion, don't smother him. Ask him to have a sit down with you and you will answer any questions he has. (I think BH stated the same) After, I would give him time.

I know this as a guy. Nothing draws our attention more than when we feel the other is LEAVING US BEHIND. You know a little of how that feels and what he went threw. Maybe it is time to remind him by LRTing a bit.

(I am hoping lrting works for me but this weekend was a heart wrenching killer for me)

Good Luck

Thanks NHF!! He hasn't text msg back in over a week....i have sent 5 since. The one thing i am trying to do is be consistant. When I did try LRT, he said i was ignoring him, and after 4 weeks he did text...but he started a fight. I'm extremely sensitive as to why he is angry, i know what i did, and how selfish it was...and would never do it again. i just would like him to see the changes i have made and then decide whether or not we should get a D...we really never even tried.

thanks for your suggestions!! It means a lot to me

hugs
Christa

Hi HIC and Christa,

I'm a LBS with a WAH...I know that the male/female perspective on these situations may be different, but I'd still love to hear your perspective as there must be some similarities.

My questions for you:

1)Did you ever say things about the relationship, undermining things like you didn't know if you wanted to be married anymore? If you did say these things, did you mean them at the time or were you testing your H in any way?

2)Did you feel depressed at the time that you were the WAS, and was this part of what led to the decision to WA?

3)During the time that you were the WAS, on any level were you glad that your H was fighting for the marriage even though you wanted less pressure about it? I guess what I'm trying to ask is whether this commitment made up in any way for the way you felt you'd been neglected in your Rs?

Thanks so much!

ITH

Hi Christa,

I'll take a stab at this one...

I might have a somewhat different situation than most in that I do have nearly constant contact with my WAH, by his choice. We IM at least every other day. I think he is being very honest and open with me (too much so in some cases), so if he decided to recommit, I would probably trust his commitment to me, but I am not sure how I would react initially.

That said though, like BH, I am starting to feel a bit angry. I think it is a natural part in the process where after we have actually made the needed changes, and are working so hard, we see that the the WAS is still hardened to us, and it gets to be really hard to handle.

I am not sure how your contact was with your H when you were the WAS, how open and honest you were through the process, and what kind of things you said to him. If you said some very hurtful things, no matter how justified, I think it is only natural that his anger would start to build. I think that I have to go back to what has been said so many times on this board that it would be the actions that counted. If H said he wanted to recommit, it would take me seeing the actions that backed this up for quite some time before my anger subsided. I also think anger is based in fear, fear of getting hurt again. He is probably afraid to open up to you again. Are there actions that you can take, things that you can do to show him how sincere you are? Is it a 180 for you to express your feelings? Could you try writing him a letter? Have you spoken to a DB coach yet?

Unfortunately I do think LRT might be the only way to reach him, unless there are other 180s that involve contact.

Have you been begging and pleading? While it may not be fair, if he is angry, he might actually feel that you have this coming after what he feels you put him through. I could only imagine that if H were to suddenly offer to recommit, there would be a big part of me that would want to test him, would want to see how far he was willing to go. However, if he just went dark on me after all of this, I would definitely still take him back, and I'd probably panic a little.

Hope this is somewhat useful...

ITH

ITH~ Thanks so much for the feedback. I have had a DB coach since last june...she's great!! I've tried LRT, going dark, writing a letter, there really isn't anything i have not tried. at first i did the begging/pleading thing...but quickly backed off of that. then i came here...met some really GREAT people...and I'm learning as I go!! i'm truly learning to 'do work" as forrest gump says!!! anyway...thanks for some awesome suggestions!!

now onto you!!!

"1)Did you ever say things about the relationship, undermining things like you didn't know if you wanted to be married anymore? If you did say these things, did you mean them at the time or were you testing your H in any way?"

I said so many mean things, I can't even remember them all. I don't ever think I meant them, but at the time I was soooo angry, the anger was within myself. When I began to process everything, it was me who needed to figure "life" out. I really was not "testing" H in any way...i was just sooo frustrated, we stopped communicating, we fought all the time, we stopped "dating" having fun together, he did his thing, i did mine...it was really a sad sitch. i just want a chance to show him, now that i have my life back together that i can do this...i can be a better wife than i was...he just has said, i should have never take my anger out on him...if i truly loved him, i would not have done what i did.

"2)Did you feel depressed at the time that you were the WAS, and was this part of what led to the decision to WA?"

YES!!! I was being treated for depression at the time I WA. Unfortunately, I was on the wrong anti-dep. med, and I was seeing a IC who encouraged separation/D...I had also lost both of my parents within a few years of eachother...and a few years prior to all of this. Everything just built up. Now, I'm 150% better, I am on the correct anti-dep. meds, seeing a MD, who is correctly adjusting them...and stopped seeing the IC who was telling me to go for the D.

"3)During the time that you were the WAS, on any level were you glad that your H was fighting for the marriage even though you wanted less pressure about it? I guess what I'm trying to ask is whether this commitment made up in any way for the way you felt you'd been neglected in your Rs?"

My H only fought for about 2 months, then stopped, about 1-2 mos after, the tables turned...but he didn't really want to work things out. We "dated" on and off, at his choice, until early this year...then he decided to stop seeing me all together. We were texting back and forth, then that ceased as of last week. I truly thought he would want to work things out...he's never been a "quitter" we both agreed prior to getting M, we would not get a D, it was a deal we made...and look at us now...it's so sad.

If you have more questions...feel free to ask!!! Hope this helps you $\:\)$

christa

Wow thanks for the great responses to my questions!

Out of curiosity, in your case, is your H absolutely opposed to seeing a counselor with you? Would he be opposed to something like an intensive with Michelle? Does your H realize that you were that depressed, and does he realize that that played a part in the things that you said? Do you think if you could get him in front of a therapist who might validate that that kind of behavior is typical for someone suffering depression it might help?

So then a couple more questions about being a WAS too if that's OK...

1) Did you feel guilty while you were the WAW? If so did this play any part in you not wanting to be around your H?

2) Did you doubt your decisions as you made them during the process? Just wondering whether you were confused, or felt like you had clarity?

Thanks!

ITH

Morning Christa,

Quote:

I said so many mean things, I can't even remember them all. I don't ever think I meant them, but at the time I was soooo angry, the anger was within myself. When I began to process everything, it was me who needed to figure "life" out.

i just want a chance to show him, now that i have my life back together that i can do this...i can be a better wife than i was...he just has said, i should have never take my anger out on him...if i truly loved him, i would not have done what i did.

Did you tell him this?

NHF~ I tried last summer to explain so many things to him, but he doesn't believe anything that comes out of my mouth...there is absolutly ZERO trust. he said after what i did, how could he be certain i wouldn't go back to being "the mean angry monster" (that is what i now call myself, or how i refer to myself, as to the person i was during that time frame!) I could never go back to being her...wow, i long for an open and honest relationship, where i can share my thoughts and feelings openly and honestly...which i did with him...up until a certain point...then we just stopped talking and being together....i could never go back to that. So long story short, there really isn't anything I have not tried to tell him! Thanks for the suggestions...truly appreciate it $\:\)$

ITH! I'm glad I was able to help, I'm happy to answer any of your questions...and i appreciate, so much the feedback you are giving/sharing as well!! I would LOVE to do an intensive with Michelle, and would be more than willing to pay for it...and could do so, but as of now, he won't even answer my texts...so I'm not sure how i could get him on a plane to Colorado?? (not trying to be a smart arss there either) any ideas?? i think him talking to me, and michelle facilitating would be so awesome and beneficial...since she is the leading expert on WAS, but like i said..it's getting him "there" that is holding me back!!

Alright enough about me...blah blah blah....on to you!!! $\:D$ !

"1) Did you feel guilty while you were the WAW? If so did this play any part in you not wanting to be around your H?"

I had absolutely zero guilt until he and I started talking more, and I truly realized how bad I had hurt him...then the guilt kicked in...and wow, I don't know if I will ever be able to forgive myself for the pain i caused him. It must have been horrendous...i know the pain i am feeling now, and each time he says something mean the wounds grow deeper...so i think/feel that is an outcry from how he feels, which is pain, and hurting.

"2) Did you doubt your decisions as you made them during the process? Just wondering whether you were confused, or felt like you had clarity?"

I wavered back and forth for about 6 months about getting a D..not neccesarily WA...just telling him I wanted a D...then things got better for a while, then I found out he went from a party to another party with his ex girlfriend, and they were texting back and forth...he tried to lie about it. I knew then I was done. That was oct. of 06, i moved out while he was on vaction in jan of 07...we tried MC, and i was truly ready to try, but then the phone bill came, he was talking to same OW as mentioned above while we were supposed to be "working" on our R/M...so went to my L...and filed for D. I let anger get the best of me. I don't know how christian you are...but i pretty much let evil little satan rule my brain...damn that little devil!

I hope, again, this gives you some more insight, please don't hesitate to keep picking my brain...i'm happy to brainstorm with you. I feel as if knowledge is power...it makes me, feel like if i know/understand what is going on, or what he could be going thru...i might be able to adapt some of things i do accordingly, or be at ease about some of things going on his head...if that makes sense!!

hugs 2 you both for your input on my side of things $\:\)$
take care, keep the questions coming, i'm happy to help!!
christa

Thank you, thank you ladies. You are providing an invaluable service. This will bring me at least some piece of mine.

Summary of my sticch. After 17 years, W drops bomb on EA (maybe PA) in March. We are on divorce track. Of course I believe I have been a good husband - good money, nice home, lots of family travel, me good with household help, lots of hired household help for her to do own thing. Problems - emotional distance, loneliness, W feeling unaccomplished as a writer/poet, me not knowing her love language. Of course I did all the wrong things when the bomb was dropped in March. Did MC, W did not drop affair so no real chance. Agreed to D and working with mediator. W believes she has been slave to my demands (still do not know how as I always viewed W as equal and never asked for anything), W does not believe trust can be restored because of EA (from note I saw lying around), W believes she deserves better H.

My questions to you:
1) I am doing the LRT but, I believe, my Ws love language is quality time. How do you feel about the LRT?

2) We are living together and while I am not talking about R, I can see she wants to get the D over with. Will D provide us with a better chance to reconcile?

3) How did you feel about whether trust could be restored with H? We want to be friends but she is very distance now and frankly I think there have been other EAs. Should I tell her that she needs to work on rebuilding my trust in her?

Your feedback is invaluble. Thanks

Christa,

I know.

I spent 11 months dumping my heart out but getting no where. I took full responsibility and validated her feelings she was having from the beggining. (wants/needs not met)

The hardest part of that is when they don't respond. Ignor you.

I had something happen last week and it has really got my head in a mess. I gave in and sent her an email after about 10 days NC. It was pretty simple but I am sure it was "pursuing in nature". It just said, I miss you so much in my life. I wanted to be there for you and the girls. I wanted you to be proud of me. I haven't played late night cribbage in a long time.

She responded back (which is rare in itself) and said she was sorry. Really. She told me she was proud of me. Thought I did a great job on the house. ( I bought a house that had to be remodeled before it was livable and that really cut into the wants and needs time she wanted from me) She told me how the girls were doing and she said we could play cribbage (on-line cribbage) sometime.

I responded back and told her I didn't want her to just be proud of me for the house. I wanted you to be able to say- thats my man and he loves me. He is working hard right now but he is getting something accomplished. And he has a dangerous job but he takes me and my girls with him on every call (in a photo).

I finished it by saying, I am sure you have the girls ready to start school.

She responded to that but only about the girls and how they were true to their personalities in how they were feeling about the start of school.

So she responds (or at least recently started) to some things as long as it doesn't seem R related. But what do I do here? Do I keep going with my LRT or do I text her for a game next week?

HFGW~

The first two questions are really difficult for me to answer as I am at the opposite end of the spectrum, I do know it hurts when my H is "dark" and avoids me, but also know I get more response out of him the times I have went dark. I can not say whether a D will bring the two of you closer together or not...that is one heck of a loaded question!!!! Either way answered, there will be hurt and anger that will need to be dealt with, sooner rather than later, no matter the LL of the persons involved. IMHO!

"How did you feel about whether trust could be restored with H? We want to be friends but she is very distance now and frankly I think there have been other EAs. Should I tell her that she needs to work on rebuilding my trust in her?"

Trust is a two way street, it is give and take. It starts with baby steps. If my H gave me a chance today, and asked that i called him every hour with an update of where i was and what i was doing, you had better believe i would do it in a heart beat...i would do what i needed to do to make him feel safe with me again. He trusted me with his heart, with his love, and i broke that trust. And in a very cruel way...I would do whatever he felt necessary to regain that feeling of trust, until slowly he felt comfortable again. When trust is broken, it takes time, patience and compassion for it to be restored; it takes a partner who is forgiving and ready to do all of the above and give the other partner whatever he/she needs to feel safe again.

NHF~

"So she responds (or at least recently started) to some things as long as it doesn't seem R related. But what do I do here? Do I keep going with my LRT or do I text her for a game next week?"

These are just a few suggestions I would have...act as if. One thing I had to learn, and it took me a long time to learn this one, he is no longer my H, he is my friend, so i had to quit looking at him as a S...look at her as a friend, nothing more, nothing less. How would you text a friend? Also, lay off of the R talks...plain and simple....putting any pressure on her is going to backfire in your face, and move you back further each time. She is your friend, nothing more nothing less. I don't want you to think i am being cruel, I just want to help you, so you do not make the same mistakes i have made. If you haven't already talk to a DB coach...they are great. they help to make this stuff so much easier. Talking to her about the R, will just make her feel bottled up, and anxious...or when my H and I first split and he wanted to talk about our R/M all the time, I would get angry...he didn't want to talk about it when we were together, and needed to, why now? Be her friend, show her you can do that...and show her your awesome changes/180's...have you set goals? keep yourself busy, it makes time go smoother and faster, so you will not be so preoccupied with all of this. Trust me, you can do this...if you would have asked me a year ago, how long i would wait...i never would have said 2 years...but now that 2 years is coming up...hell yeah i'm going to wait two years...i'll even say 3. It's the first 3-4 months that are the hardest to get thru. YOU ARE DOING GREAT!!!! YOU CAN DO THIS!!! one minute, one hour, one day at a time. go buy paint by numbers and do them upside down...it helps relax your brain!! watch church on the internet...joelosteen.com(he's inspirational christian) if you are a church person, go for a walk, buy dishes at a yard sale, then break them all...just alleviate frustrations....keep yourself busy!!!

take care both of you guys!!
sorry it took so long to get back with you, it's midterms this week..so i'm hit and miss around here this whole week!! gotta do good in school $\:D$

hugs
christa

Thanks Christa,

It is easier to not talk about the R when she is responding. I just feel like I should pull back and make her wonder. That would be a 180 she isn't expecting.

LOL-I've already made the mistakes you made.

Good luck on midterms...let us know when you got the results of acing them.

J

NHF~ if your gut is telling you to pull back...i would go with it! just my .02!!!

I hope to ace it...that would rock!! with the prof. i have i will be ecstatic with a B!!!

take care,

christa

Quote:

Q: Did you ever say things about the relationship, undermining things like you didn't know if you wanted to be married anymore? If you did say these things, did you mean them at the time or were you testing your H in any way?

A: I was really cautious about saying things to hurt him only to find that my actions where devastating to him. I can remember saying things to the effect that nothing was getting better. He could always see the positive and I only saw negative.

Quote:

Q: Did you feel depressed at the time that you were the WAS, and was this part of what led to the decision to WA?

A: Absolutely. I tried for six years to make our M work. I read every book I could get my hands on, searched the web (wished I had found DB) and tried all the techniques. I compromised, I changed a bit, I asked him to change, and asked him to go to counseling and �work� with me at this M. He thought all was well and nothing needed to change. I was depressed. I felt as if he wasn�t invested in making the M better and didn�t want or love me. I constantly felt rejected in one way or another and for those reasons I was depressed. Without him willing to go to counseling I felt I had no choice but to walk away.

Quote:

Q: During the time that you were the WAS, on any level were you glad that your H was fighting for the marriage even though you wanted less pressure about it? I guess what I'm trying to ask is whether this commitment made up in any way for the way you felt you'd been neglected in your Rs?

A: I was glad that my H was finally fighting for our marriage and through little fault of his own little was changing. I would have liked him to invest time, such as the DBers here are doing, in finding solutions and creating change. That is the way to fight for your M not by pressuring the spouse.

Quote:

Q: Did you feel guilty while you were the WAW? If so did this play any part in you not wanting to be around your H?

A: I did although I didn�t realize the magnitude of his pain until I became the LBS. I was also cut off from my feelings due to years of frustration and anger. I came home every weekend and sometimes staying longer, continued to go out of town and on vacation because of the guilt but the pressure made me want to stay away.

Quote:

Q: Did you doubt your decisions as you made them during the process? Just wondering whether you were confused, or felt like you had clarity?

A: I was back and forth throughout the whole process. I was worried I was making a mistake but didn�t know how to make things better or to love him enough again. I told my therapist this and unfortunately she was not pro-marriage and fed me all that mumbo jumbo about � go with your feelings�, �it�s ok to want to be on your own�, �marriage is difficult but it should not be this difficult� etc etc.

Quote:

Q: I am doing the LRT but, I believe, my Ws love language is quality time. How do you feel about the LRT?

A: That depends. Did you spend quality time together before? If not and that was one of her complaints then you want to spend more quality time and make the R a priority. In my sitch when I wanted to do the LRT my coach suggested that I not because quality time was H�s complaint during the first separation.

Quote:

Q: We are living together and while I am not talking about R, I can see she wants to get the D over with. Will D provide us with a better chance to reconcile?

A: One thing that has helped my H and I at least become friends, and I say this a lot, is to show him that I get it. My behavior and actions are that of a friend not a wife. I have also said things such as I get that you do not want to be married right now and I have put aside hope for this marriage.

Quote:

Q: How did you feel about whether trust could be restored with H? We want to be friends but she is very distance now and frankly I think there have been other EAs. Should I tell her that she needs to work on rebuilding my trust in her?

A: I feel she may get defensive on this one. I understand it was/is hurtful to have your trust betrayed. Trusting again I believe is something that you have to work on within yourself. Hopefully if you show you trust her she will be more trustworthy but you can�t change her actions.

Christa and Hopefull - thank you so much for your responses. You rock! I am praying for you both. I can also offer you the H perspective if you wish. I will take your advice and see what I can do. Admittely I am feeling conflicted. The LRT contains a lot of not spending quality time with my W, where emotional distance and lonliness is one of her chief issues with me in the past. However I do not want her to feel crowded or pressurd and I think that just being around me gives her that feeling. I am ask my DB coach about this and what to do next.

Originally Posted By: HFGW

The LRT contains a lot of not spending quality time with my W, where emotional distance and lonliness is one of her chief issues with me in the past. However I do not want her to feel crowded or pressurd and I think that just being around me gives her that feeling.

HFGW,

Thank you. I am always interested in hearing the H's perspective. Men are such different creatures than women. I understand that his experience as a WAH is potentially different than my experience as a WAW. Do you think his pride has a lot to do with it?

In regards to the LRT if it was one of your wife's chief complaints that you two didn't spend quality time together then your 180 would be to spend time with her. What can you do to take the pressure off? It is my guess that she is not comfortable in a romantic relationship. You must first eliminate the negative feelings then build a friendship. The romance and recommitment comes later. Show her that you get it. Make the time you spend together about rebuilding a friendship not a romance. DO NOT go on dates. Participate in and invite her to fun activities that involve groups. Just my opinion of course.

All the best

Originally Posted By: HOPEFULinCALI

Thank you. I am always interested in hearing the H's perspective. Men are such different creatures than women. I understand that his experience as a WAH is potentially different than my experience as a WAW. Do you think his pride has a lot to do with it?

Hopeful - I read your recent posting and my heart goes out to you. You must be really hurting with what your H is doing. I will tell you that pride does have something to do with it. The pride that he can command the attention of a younger women. It is likely to get very physical, and I am so sorry to say so. However you know your H the best and can determine how far it will go. I can tell you it will not last given the age gap. It may be just an ego thing playing out. Set boundaries and stay in your home.

HFGW~ happy to help!! Will be back after midterms to pick your brain about the H!!! He's a tough nut to crack $\:\)$ You will be in my prayers as well $\:\)$ Take care of yourself....Christa

Best of luck with Mid-terms. We can crack your H for true love awaits!

Thanks HFGW...that would be nice...he's a "crazy mess" LOL!!!

off to school!

christa

Hi Christa,

Do you use the email with which you signed up for this account?

sg

yes!

Prof still hasn't posted grades $\:\($ It's making me nervous!!! I knew the answers to most of the questions. It was ten essay questions...WOW!!!

It's been two weeks, who's counting!!! LOL, since contact with H...do you guys have any suggestions? Stay dark? Try a text? I am really not wanting call him until his anger settles more...I'm just scared it will escalate into a fight, which I do not want. When I tried going dark before, it worked, he text me at about 3 week mark, the first time, second time around, I lasted 4 weeks, and text him...and well, now we are here!!!

Any suggestions?

thanks guys!
christa

Christa - stay dark. At a minimum it requires you to move on with your life and to feel better about yourself. Only if you have something to communciation to him, nothing about the R, should you attempt to contact him. Otherwise stay strong. I guarantee he is thinking about you, which means he will at some point contact you.

Stay strong.

((((((((christa))))))))))

If you can stay dark do it. Let go if you have the strength. Move forward and forget the past. It is too painful.

I swear I just want to jump in a hole and cove myself. I have had contact wth my ex. Good contact but deep down, I know she is not coming back. It only makes the feelings and effort I have had feel like a big giant kick in the head.

I would love to say...I don't want you. I don't need you. But everytime I have contact, within a day or two, I feel like I am back at square 1.

I don't know what works. I don't know that anything works. I hope you find your strength.

Hello everyone

I am an LBS and thrilled to see this thread offering insight into the WAS mindset from WAS themselves. I had the same questions that I saw answered earlier in this thread (thank you!)

I did something foolish not too long ago; I asked her if it was possible we could have NSA sex life..cause, well...ya know. A man needs to eat & we men get a lot of emotional needs met through sex and I have been feeling so down and miserable lately I am just craving the scent of a woman. (we still live together for the time being)

She tells me thats impossible for her, she has zero interest, that I should seek NSA outside the marriage and that I 'have her permission'. That I was an attractive man and shouldnt be too hard to find a willing partner. It really hurt me to hear her be so causal about suggesting I get some strange. :-(

So my Q for WAS is:

Did you ever tell or encourage your LBS to go ahead and hit up the NSA action?

Did you do it as a bluff?

Or did you do it as a test?

What do you think it means?

Does she really not care???

Hello Energy - I am a LBS with a WAW. I am not surprised she said what she said. You are probably just affirming many negative feeling she has about you. I also would like to hear from the WAWs on this forum. My sense is that your request is unnecessary pressure.

If you want her back, start DBing.

This is a fascinating thread.. I finally decided to read the WAS forum mainly because I didn't think there was anything else to learn after reading DR. Anyway, , a couple of the posters here may recognize me from my posts in Newcomers. I've been in a bad place recently and almost gave up. I haven't talked to my wife since June yet I woke up the other day and it just clicked that I want to keep trying. I talk to her daughter on and off and asked her to approach her mom about us meeting. Well, I received an email from my wife today and man, was she PIS*ED!! I mean really angry. "I don't have time for your garbage" That was the nice part of her letter. She is a WAW, last November, no papers yet mainly I think because I told her that she was going to do the footwork on the D and pay the $500 court fee for a no-contest divorce. Anyway, I'm not a physical abuser although we have had NASTY verbal fights in the past, I don't stalk her or anything like that. I actually was dark from June until now. So my question guys, is WHY is she so angry? She was calm as hell when she did the WAW in November. Cool as ice actually. But now...Wow!! She is having plenty of money problems. We don't have any kids together and I do not owe her any money. Can you guys shed some light on the anger issue and why she was so nasty with the email? I am confused to say the least.

Ok, I have more info today and boy, I don't know what to do here. I'm about a week away from being able to afford to call a DB coach as money is a bit tight for me right now. Anyway, W emailed me today regarding her anger. The reasons: She cannot afford to pay for a divorce. Again, I said I would sign, but not pay the 500 dollars nor go to get the papers. She's pretty angry about that. Also, I guess she is in deep financial trouble: She says that her and her daughter are fighting to keep the house. It's her house, she owned it before I met her. I split the bills with her while living there. Well, she was diagnosed with Type 2 diabetes in January so along with the medical expenses and her using the equity in the house to finance 2 cosmetic surgeries and without my income she is in trouble. She works full time, but she dug a huge hole by borrowing against the house. She is also mad because she feels I still owe money for some credit card purchases a couple of years ago. I'm being honest when I say that I paid every cent of my part of it. She believes otherwise. Since I am here, I would not try to make things worse by welching on any money that I owe. Admittedly, I was short on my part of the bills by a few months during a bad stretch at work. But I basically paid extra the following months. She has conveniently forgotten that and there is no telling her different. Sooooo...What in the hell do I do? There's a 50/50 chance she loses the house especially during these times. I could really use any and all input here. I mean, DBing is one part trying to be a friend, but it also says not to be a pushover either. I am clueless people. How should I handle this?

Have to add this in...More of a vent than anything else. That email from her today was tough. Another choice comment was "This marriage is a sickness" That kind of stunned me at first this morning and I shrugged it off for the most part and went to work. Now...the shock wave from that has come rolling in. That was quite an uppercut by her. Glad it wasn't a physical fight: I would have had a broken jaw from that one. I knew that the 'wave' was going to hit: When I get stressed, I usually start getting drowsy and thats what happened throughout the day until by the time I got home(staying at a friend's til next week) I pretty much had driven home in a fog. I'm glad that someone didn't cut me off today(a regular occurence here) because I probably would not have reacted in time- thats how OUT of it I was and still am. Ouch.

I have a question, but I have to tell you my sitch, at least the last week of it.

We have been separated for just over 3 months. We live on the gulf coast and here Come IKE. It was heading our way. I called W and asked if she could come down and help board up the house. After some m and hawing she came down to help. While was down allegedly helping board up the house she helps for about 2 hours and goes off to get her hair done. 2 hours later she come home and telling me that she would like to get her nails done. So she leave and an hour later she calls and wants to have lunch and to meet at a local restaurant. I meet her there and tell me to set next to her at the table. I usually set across from her. We have a nice friendly talk and she leaves to go back the her apt. We kissed on the lips and she gave me we call a to tight hug for about 45 sec. and make a satisfying moan. I am thinking my DBing is working my second baby steps.

After she left I got to thinking, she did not come down here to see me or work on the house she came down here to get her hair cut and nails and toes done. The storm hits Saturday morning early and I am fine at the house and she is setting in her apt. with no water, and no electricity. I offer her the opportunity to come back home so she could work remotely and she decline the offer. She goes with lights and water for 4 days.

The more I thought about her doing her nails and hair the madder I got. I could not stand it �.I broke the DBing rules and called her told her what I thought about it. She told me that she did come to see me, she came down to work on the house. Then she tells me that she get more pleasure out her job than our R. She will never come back. I should just get use to it. She said she does want to date; she does want anything to do to with me. We talked for an hour and half.

I had invited her to a formal affair fundraiser the week earlier before the big blow up of mine. She emails me today hinting around if she could go to the fundraiser tonight. After she told me 6 days ago she didn�t want to date or have anything to do with me. I asked her if she would like to go and she said yes.

I am really CONFUSED! If she doesn�t want to date me and she doesn�t want to be around me, why is she hinting around to go and accept the invitation? What is going on here?

Am I crazy and am I reading this wrong�.Does she not what she wants?

Very Scared 54: I'm no expert, but wouldn't you file all that she did last week under the category "don't believe anything that she says and only half of what she does"?

For the very generous WAW/S's here willing to answer LBS's, I think what you're doing on this thread is awesome! For LBS'ers like myself, it's almost like having a sparring partner! I might plunk down a few questions and scenarios to see how it would play out in WAS' minds some time soon.

Keep up the great work!

I will try to be back ASAP to answer questions....Gotta write a couple papers for school...then life should settle a little!

glad to help
christa

Oh man, let me tell you.....Today, I get a text from step daughter informing me that....W is thinking about wanting to meet me. Whoooooa! Now this is like 24 hours after she beat the living hell out of me with a 2x4 via the emails that I mentioned. For the first time, I didn't bite back. In the past, I would come back at her with return fire of my own. This time, I finally played it smart. I owned up to her complaints, which are true....for the most part. I apologized for the legitimate complaints that she had and brushed aside the complaints that are not completely warranted. Bottom line, I didn't let her drag me into the ring. Guess this would be called a 180, eh? I was mad at some of the stuff, but I remember reading: "Don't freaking do it"....don't argue back. I did write a letter earlier today....Kind of from the heart, but I stayed away from the I love you's and such. I basically said despite all of the recent problems, I would do it again even if it meant having to walk through hell again. I meant it too. Guess it got through. We'll see.

Oh yeah. I have another thing in my favor. Stepdaughter and I have pretty much been pals since we met. Anyway, she said that she will talk to her mom and try to keep contributing to the cause. She never wanted to get involved too much because of fear of being reprimanded, plus she was mad at me for some stuff that I said to her mom a few months ago. Actually thats one of the things that I did offer a sincere apology for. And I meant it. And those two have radars like SAC...if I didn't mean it, those two would somehow KNOW. Don't ask me how.

Here's a scenario that I'd like to vet with WAW's...

Let's say hypothetically speaking *wink* that you made a decision to leave you H, without any explicit notice that you wanted out of the M, took the day off to pack your stuff and moved out, wrote a "Dear John" letter, and filed for D.

Question #1: What would you be thinking/feeling if your LBS, with the exception of 2 short, non-pursuing emails since the day you left, went "dark" for...oh, I dunno...say a month and a half?

Question #2: Keeping in mind that the LBS went dark (or at least very dim) immediately after you left him and did not plead, beg, argue, etc., what would you be feeling as a result of the lack of contact? Phrased another way, would you be expecting he LBS to plead/beg, and would it upset you that the LBS did not act the way you expected?

Question #3: How would you react if after 1.5 months of silence your LBS wrote you a letter/email to basically apologize for his contributions to the deterioration of the marriage but no mention of "trying to work things out" or any other variations of pleading or begging?

Question #4: Same scenario but disregard Q #3...if your LBS wrote you a letter after 1.5 months of mutual vows of silence, what would you like your LBS to have written?

Wow...these are pretty tough I might add...

Thanks in advance, guys!

More questions!!!

I am still Confused ,,,,, but optimistic !!!!

After inviting herself (in a round about way) my WAW came to a Fundraiser as my date. She had a very hard week and was very obviously tried. The mood was a little tenses, but we did have we had a good non-R conversation. There were other people at the table, which gave us others to visit with. W had two glasses of wine. After about an hour the mood relaxed and we began to enjoy each other�s company (at least I did and I think she did as well). At the end of the evening I walked her to her car. When we got to the car she turned to give me a huge and I planted a very passionate open mouth kiss and a nice too tight hug on her. That hug and kiss lasted at least 2 � 3 minutes. I can�t remember the last time we kissed and hug like that. It became very passionate and I could hear and feel her pleasure. I know she became aroused�. I know I was. I asked her to come home for the night and W turned down the offer. She said that we weren�t suppose make out. We both acted like teenagers for a couple of minutes. After a couple of peek kiss on the lips, she finally broke away and got in her car. I told her that I loved her, but she did not return the phrases. I know I am not suppose to say that, but I thought is was appropriate at the time.

I may have played my hand a little too strong. But I have been thinking about sometime like this for months. I would like to think she drove back to her place thinking about how turn on she was in that brief moment of time. I hoping it will be another little step forward.

The question is:
Did I do any damage?

She could have stopped this encounter, but did not. Do you think she just wants to see if we can rekindle our relationship we once had? She keeps saying she just want to be friends, but she is not pushing or even talking the big D.

Do you think she is just trying to keep the relationship on that footing (friendship) by participating in encounters like this one?

I know you should not believe anything they say and half of what they do, but I think she wanted just as much and enjoyed it just much as I did

Your insights on this situation would be appreciated.

Cought off Gaurd~

These are just IMHO hypothetical answers to your questions!! Keep this in mind $\:\)$

Question #1: What would you be thinking/feeling if your LBS, with the exception of 2 short, non-pursuing emails since the day you left, went "dark" for...oh, I dunno...say a month and a half?

This is exactly what my H did...the less he persued, the more I wanted him...he in his own way DB'd...and it worked. However, when I tried to go back...he wanted nothing to do with me...too much anger and hostility for the way I left. he did not email me, just sent a few random text msgs.

Question #2: Keeping in mind that the LBS went dark (or at least very dim) immediately after you left him and did not plead, beg, argue, etc., what would you be feeling as a result of the lack of contact? Phrased another way, would you be expecting he LBS to plead/beg, and would it upset you that the LBS did not act the way you expected?

My H, did the whole begging thing for about 2 weeks, we tried MC, then he started talking to OW. He was still texting me as well. The less he persued the more it made me think, what the hell am I doing...again this is just me and my feelings. Each WAW does what they do for different reasons. For me, it was a matter of loosing both of my parents, my H and I had poor communication, and I had went back to school it was all way to much on me all at once. I was over stressed, now that my life is managed, I realize just how bad I f'd up, and want to get my life with my H back on track; however, he just filed for D...and I have no control over his actions.

Question #3: How would you react if after 1.5 months of silence your LBS wrote you a letter/email to basically apologize for his contributions to the deterioration of the marriage but no mention of "trying to work things out" or any other variations of pleading or begging?

Just my 2 cents...I would stay dark. Give her time to think about what she did. The longer I had time to figure things out without H, the more I realized how much I missed him.

Question #4: Same scenario but disregard Q #3...if your LBS wrote you a letter after 1.5 months of mutual vows of silence, what would you like your LBS to have written?

I was ready to come home after 1.5 months of silence...so a letter stating I could have come home would have been awesome! and something stating he was ready try MC again. again just my 2 cents.

You might try a DB coach...they are awesome!! Also, just my 2 cents, i would continue the dark approach, as I stated above, the longer my H did his own thing...the more I wanted him. He even went and bought a Harley, which was a huge 180; things like that drove me nuts...making me want to go home even more. Stop, think, then react. Even though it is harder than hell, believe me after 20 months, I know, react without emotion. The more emotion that goes into our thinking, the more we as natural humans over react...i hope that makes sense.

Keep your chin up....I still believe there is hope for my M...and my H filed this past week. Until D papers are signed...there is hope! take care of yourself...then DB. Work on some 180's, work on you...stay focused...you can do this and you are doing this $\:D$

christa

Very scared...I will try to get your ?'s answered later today...I have company arriving any time!

christarn
Thanks for your detailed responses! It really helps shed some perspective on my sitch. I have a few follow up questions if you don't mind:

Originally Posted By: christarn

"My H, did the whole begging thing for about 2 weeks, we tried MC..."

What if your H didn't do the 2 weeks of pleading/begging and no MC...he just went completely dark save for the few random txt msgs you mentioned? I'm just curious if the pleading/begging should have preceded going dark in order for the LRT to be more successful. Would going dark immediately after the bomb signal to the WAS that the LBS agrees that divorce is the answer as if silence was the same as agreeing to S or D.

Oy...I'm probably overthinking this...

Ok guys, another email...Maybe somebody can shed some light here? First W emails and says "no way" as far as meeting. Then.....I get another saying " I am considering meeting you but I just want you to know that I have no interest in wanting to get back together ever" WTH??? These emails came like an hour apart. I haven't answered them because I could use some input here before I respond. This some kind of testing or baiting to see if I come back with a negative response?

Now I found out she is probably going to lose her house. This has turned into a Stephen King novel

I AM HURTING REALLY, REALLY BAD!!!! I AM SO DEPRESS I DON�T WHAT TOO DO!!!! I AM SETTING HERE WITH TEARS IN MY EYES TRYING TO COMPOSE MYSELF, BUT IT IS SO HARD.

It has been not more than 4 months since the bomb was dropped. My WAW and I hard talking off and on. I have DBing hard. I even thought I was making some good progress. I back slide and 2 weekends age and had a long argumentative R talk, but thin had a date the next week and had a passionate make out kiss (as she calls it) Two days later we meet again and when we departed she told me no make-out kisses and we need to talk.

I met with my Therapist yesterday, and I briefed her on our argument. My therapist told me that I have living in a fantasy that we are not going to get back together. I have been doing everything to win her back and she is still in the same place (mentally) she was 4 months ago. She is not working her problems out; I am the only one doing the work.

This is not something I want to hear. She maybe right. I have tried going dark, but every time I do something comes up that we have to communicate.

Please someone tell me that this can still work out. Please someone reassure me that there is still time. Please someone tell me that it is not a lost cause.

Very scared, I am truly sorry you are hurting...please read the post i left on Seasglasses thread. Jen_Jam's top 10...it's a good one!

Also, until papers are signed...there is always TIME!!

TIME truly is on your side!!

I know it hurts, and i am sorry for the pain you are feeling....but it does get better, time is on your side.

Please read jen_jam's top ten on Seaglasses thread...it helped me get thru some of my really bad days!

take care of you!

(((((HUGS VS54))))))
christarn

Hey VS,

Hang in there. I am in the same boat as you and had a panic attack just last night. These will come and go. Go for a run, scream at the top of your lungs. You need to do something to get that nervous energy out. You can do it.

Okay I got a question for the WAW's

A big issue for everyone here seems to be 'physical touch'. When a WAW seems to have made up her mind about leaving, a switch seems to go on that makes any physical touch from their significant other seem like touching a hot stove.

My wife is like that. She had never been really the physically affectionate type, but now it's like if I just try hugging her goodbye (very platonically), she ducks her head down and can't even look at me. It's like hugging a lump of clay.

For her, she had a very strong EA that ended but she's still very frigid to my touch even though we get along great otherwise.

Do I just let her be the one to intiate something or do I lightly initiate 'caring' touches like patting her arm?

Hi Christarn,

Thanks for your kind words and your hugs. I went to seaglass�s, thread and read Jen_Jam's top 10. Thanks for referring them to me. It will help me to remember these things.

I seem to be the only one around me that thinks that we can be saved, including my W. I feel like I stand alone on this matter. Thank God that I have the people here to vent and talk to when no one else seems to care. ��.. That is not necessarily true �. They care! �� They just want me to be better. To be my happy self again. They don�t understand that I can�t be happy at this moment in time with crises hanging over my head, in my heart, or in my mind.

I know that I want to be with someone and I want that someone to be my WAW.

I have been telling myself over and over again Time, Time, Time, Time, is my ally and patience is strongest weapon right now.

I guess I just needed to cry out a little bit earlier, because I felt so alone.

Thank you

Hi Christarn
My wife walked away on me. I have a question for you, when you left did you believe that everything in your life would be perfect? and your H would just be like, OK now my life is better now too? I know these questions sound cruel but I am asking about WAW in general. I just would like to know what goes on in peoples heads.

D~

Yes, I believed everything would be perfect...I didn't care what H thought, or about his life. however, it didn't really work out that way. Once I was on my own REALITY set in quickly, no one to help with ANYTHING!! WAKE UP CALL!!! No one to lay in bed with at night, no one to talk to when I was lonely, no one to eat dinner with, no one to call on my way home from work...etc.

You're not cruel, you are curious! Keep in mind, when I walked, I was severely depressed, and had lost both my parents (within a 3-5 time frame) since leaving I have been diagnosed with a form of mild manic-depression, which I think played a huge role in my walking out. I will NEVER make excuses for what I did, it was wrong, and totally went against everything I vowed to my H. I just would do anything now, to work it out....I just need him to "see" now that I am back to the "old me" things can be different. ok, sorry..back to your ?'s!! When I walked, all I could think about is a stress free life, nobody to help me make decisions, no body to tell me how i should spend my pay checks, nobody to tell me anything...and he had spent an evening with his Ex-GF, which put the icing on the cake...so I WA. The day he found out, I felt extremely guilty, cried most of the day, I called him, told him what I had done....he already knew; the neighbors called and told him. We tried MC, I received the phone bill, he was talking to Ex-GF while we were in MC...then I went off the deep end and filed for D...that was a very huge mistake....hind sight is always 20/20! I would change a lot of the things I did if I could go back, unfortunately, I can only learn from my mistakes, and keep praying that my M will work out.

Hope this helped
christarn

VeryScared....you are never alone! We are all here, listening, and watching, and praying with you $\:\)$

I have index cards posted on my mirror

one states...PMA
second one states...Let go and Let God
third one..PATIENCE
4th...one minute, one hour, one day at a time

I keep reminding myself this is a journey, and it's a lesson of time and patience.

I do not know your views on spirituality, if you are christian, a few good webistes are: rejoiceministries.com and joelosteen.com

rejoiceministries....sends out daily scripture about "standing" for your marriage

joel osteen is an inspirational christian minister, if you sign up for his website (free of charge) you can watch his sermons on streaming video....they are uplifting and simply awesome...I watch them when I am having bad days.

take care of yourself....you can do this!!
(((VS)))
christarn

Christarn

You show a great deal of understand, wisdom, and compassion for a person of you age. Keep the faith and I shall as well. I know that I am never alone, while I am here.

Thank You.

Thanks VS! you are sweet $\:\)$ I guess it's the nurse in me!!

take care of you!!<------PRIORITY #1!!!!!

hugs,
Christa

Originally Posted By: stuck808

For her, she had a very strong EA that ended but she's still very frigid to my touch even though we get along great otherwise.

Do I just let her be the one to intiate something or do I lightly initiate 'caring' touches like patting her arm?

I know for me... I need to be emotionally connected to want physical touch. I don' t think that is uncommon for most women.

For me it has to do with trust... If I can't trust you with my emotions, why would I trust you with my body??

The better understood I am, the closer I feel to H, the more likely it is I am to initiate or allow physical contact.

I think for men it is the reverse... the more physical contact they have the closer they feel to their W. and the more likely they are to listen & understand them.

Well I stand-alone now. My therapist, my family, my friends, and my WAW, everyone. Am I that dense? Can I not see it? The more I think about following everyone advise the stronger I love grows for my W. I have never loved her as much as I do now! Even after all the things she has said to me. I guess I need something I can�t have.

The only thing I see is either file the D now. So I can get started building a new life, but then they all say wait 6 months to file. So I wait and hurt for 6 months. I hate coming home to an empty house. I hate being alone. I don�t want to date; it would make feel like I am cheating on my W & M. I know I need to GAL and maintan a PA, but its hard when you are standing alone.

It is going to be a long night. Very, Very SAD

VS~ 72 hour rule, do not make any decisions with in 72 hours, and big decisions such as a D...i put in the one week to one month rule...meaning i give myself lots of time to think...is this what I really want.

Your family, and friends are not the ones who will have to deal with the repercussions of a D...you will...you are not in this alone...we are all here!

FIND A NEW THERAPIST!!! my MD once told me, therapists/counselors are like blind dates, it may take a couple before you find one you kinda like...if you and your IC don't see eye to eye, why continue to go. It is why I stopped seeing my IC...she convinced me a D was the only way, WOW!! WRONG ANSWER!!!

Buy a paint by numbers and do it upside down...it will work the left side of your brain...or something like that...long story short, it will preoccupy your mind! and get it off of the emotional stuff it is going thru. by the books (DB/DR)and read them!! then re-read them, and then re-read them....they are great resources!!

((VS)) I know you are frustrated, but do not worry, you are not alone, take some deep breaths, and take it minute by minute....no body ever said it would be easy...they just said it would be worth it....that's what a wise man once told me! Don't give up...you can do this!! Stick to your vows!! you're not dense, you are a fighter!!! Fight for what you believe in, the sanctity of your M!!!

(((((VS)))))
christa

VS -

I second what christarn is saying.

When my wife left with my two Ds, I had never felt so alone before in my life. Everyone told me to give up too but there's always, always hope.

Turn on some music, watch a bad movie on tv, anything to get your mind off it.

If we all can do it, so can you. Take deep breaths. Hang tough and take it one minute at time.

Originally Posted By: Bridgestone

My WAW has said the very thing to me; yet she can go out and find a new OM and sex with him within a day. Explain that one to me if you could?

You guys are great!!! ((Christarn)) I know I am being redundant. Thanks for sticking in there with me. You Too ((Suck808)). Both of you make me feel much stronger.

I can!! Do this!!

I have doing it for a few months and today someone sneezed and my house of cards collapsed. I taught my kids that Life is not always easy or is it always fair. I told them that they would need to get up one more time than life knock them down. I have practiced that all of my life� I guess I forgot for a time. Well� its time to put it back into practice. Thanks again for your encouragement.

Tomorrow is a new day. I am good now! Thanks for you help. I AM NOT ALONE ANY MORE knowing you are out there. I hope you get what you are working so hard for. I am here for you as well. That may not be much but I will be here at your side.

VS~

of course you can do it!!! We never have/will doubt that...damn that crazy satan for trying to play tricks on your mind!!! LOL!!

make cards hang them on your bathroom mirror....post as much as you need to. we are all here together...one big happy DB family $\:\)$

take care of yourself <--------- rule 1 $\:D$ after that everything will start to fall into place!

We all have bad days, and that is normal and ok...hang in there my friend! the sun will peak through the clouds and a bright new day will appear! Don't let anyone steal your joy!

(((VS)))
christa

Originally Posted By: marriedCrazy

Originally Posted By: Bridgestone

My WAW has said the very thing to me; yet she can go out and find a new OM and sex with him within a day. Explain that one to me if you could?

On that day, her trust in him caring for her emotionally outweighed her trust in you for the same.

That is how I would explain it. How sure are you he was 'new'??

Bridge,

That's a great point. Sometimes it does seem that the WAW hooks up with someone quicker than their spouse sometimes. It could come from the fantasy idea of what they're ideal romantic relationship would be.

In the case of my wife, she still works with the guy whom she had the EA with. So even though she says that the affair is over, psychologically, I don't think she is. And that's what is stopping her from moving on and continuing our relationship.

Sigh, it is tough to try and outshine a guy whom she sees everyday and we have such brief interactions. I just wish there were a way to really 'wow' her to get her over the hump she seems to be in now.

VS54~

Are you ok? Just wanted to check on you...I didn't see where you had posted today...let us know how you are doing...please $\:\)$

(((VS)))
christa

VS54~

Hey buddy, just checking in as well. Keep us posted.

stuck808

I am a lot better today than I was yesterday. Your feedback has re-knew my hope in my stich. Your concern for me is touching Thank you!!

I am still a little confused why she aloud me to give her a make-out kiss and hug at a party on Friday night and then turns cold the next time I see her on Monday saying �no make-out kiss�. I could tell that she enjoyed the kiss as much as I did. Now she wants to have another R talk. I don�t know which way this talk is going to go.

I have a medical procedure next week and she will be taking me to the hospital. She has planed to pick me up at home drive me to the hospital, stay for the procedure, after the procedure she will drive us to one of our favorite place to eat and then drive me home. I have to be at the hospital a 6 a.m. That means she will have to get-up at 3 a.m. leave her apartment by 4 a.m. to get to our home at 5 a.m., turn around and drive back to the hospital arriving by 6 a.m. She did not ask, but she may be waiting for me to ask her to come home the night before to spend the night.

I don�t know if I should ask if she want to come home the night before or wait to see if she asks?

What do you guys think?

VS~

I would not push her to stay...you will only push her further away...just my 2 cents. If she hints towards wanting to stay, then bring it up. But only if she brings it up.

I'm glad you are doing better.

I think it says a lot that she is taking you to this appt. she could have said "hell no" i'm not getting up at 3am!!! which is what my H would have said!!!

keep up the PMA $\:\)$

christa

((Christarn))

"I would not push her to stay...you will only push her further away...just my 2 cents. If she hints towards wanting to stay, then bring it up. But only if she brings it up.�

I was leaning that way. At this point in time I have gone DARK. I have tried this before with little success on my part. It is like tell a kid they can�t have any candy and that makes them want it even more. I think she is doing the same thing. Sometimes I think she is reading the same books I am.

�I think it says a lot that she is taking you to this appt. she could have said "hell no" i'm not getting up at 3am!!! which is what my H would have said!!!�

You think this is a good thing?

I think it is as well, but I some times think I see things she does in a more positive light than others. Even though I don�t think in her mind she wants to come back to the M at this point.

Are you sitch improving any? Do you feel you are making headway?
Thanks for keeping up with me.

Originally Posted By: Very Scared 54

I think she is doing the same thing. Sometimes I think she is reading the same books I am.

She might be. I came here with that mindset of understanding what I thought might be H's 'playbook' to get me back. It does come up fairly high on search engines when 'divorce' is typed in.

good luck & peace
Bridge

(( Bridgestone))

Thanks for the feedback!

Did it help you understand what he was doing?
Did it make it harder from him?
Did it make you mad that he was DBing you?
Does it make it hard for LBS?

Originally Posted By: Very Scared 54

(( Bridgestone))

Thanks for the feedback!

Did it help you understand what he was doing?
Did it make it harder from him?
Did it make you mad that he was DBing you?
Does it make it hard for LBS?

1- He is NOT DB'ing.. far from it.

2- It would have if he was doing it, it would have made me very very angry at the time & that may have been enough right there for me to file. There are things that if he were to do from DB, probably still would. And would push me VERY hard the other way.

I see some of these techniques, when used with the mindset of 'getting the WAS back' as game playing. When used with the mindset of detachment and GAL (and REALLY TRULY used that way & I see few that do,at least initially) I can understand & appreciate that technique.

3- See above
4- what is 'it'?

(( Bridgestone))

4. What is �it�? If the WAS knew the LBS game plan (DB) would it be harder?

Truly WITH ALL DUE RESPECT to you and your stich, you said you came here to find his playbook. After being here and writing and reading things on this forum, do you want to reconcile with H now? Have you change your mind about what you want to do about your M/R? Please take no offence to my questions.

Have the things you have read here made you think differently about your stich? If so what?

It appears to me that many of the people here have experienced a lot of the same feelings, emotions, and mindsets. In addition, it sounds to me a number of WAS�s have changed there minds about walking away. Some even regret their decision and want �Do Overs �. Sometimes it looks to me that tier pride get in the way.

I do agree with you about that DBing is like mind game. Dr. Phil has a book out called how a woman can catch a man (or something like that) I haven�t read it, but it was explained to me like this. It is like a game. You can�t win unless you play. Do you want to be right or do want to win ion a R. I may have this a little backwards, but life is a game, that all of us play everyday. We learn from wining, but we learn more from losing sometimes. I think we should learn what every way we receive the information. If we don�t change we stand still and everything move on and we are left behind standing alone.

((Any One))

This may be a demon running around in my head, but I feel that I should verbalize it to let it out and see what you guys might have to say about.

I don�t think my W is having an EA or PA with OM, but it could be with OW. How will that play out? Will it make a difference? An A is A.

Any thoughts?

Originally Posted By: Very Scared 54

(( Bridgestone))

Truly WITH ALL DUE RESPECT to you and your stich, you said you came here to find his playbook. After being here and writing and reading things on this forum, do you want to reconcile with H now?

No.. not as he is. But that is different then where I was when I came here. When I first came here, I didn't want him no matter what.

Originally Posted By: very scared 54

Have you change your mind about what you want to do about your M/R?

To some extent. I was so numb & exhausted when I left that I was just trying not to drown. I wanted my interactions with my H to go away so I could surface & take a breath. During that time I think I recognized (even if just subconsiously) that I was throwing stuff away, good stuff, along with the bad. Probably why I waited...It took 6 months for me to regain any bit of 'normalcy' of me again. It took another 4-5 for me to begin to heal enough to approach H about trying to communicate in more healthy ways, even if just for the sake of co-parenting.

What I want to do about my R, now?? Part of me doesn't want it to fail - I have real issues from childhood with 'failing' (although being separated 15 months.. I think is a pretty good indication it has).. on the other hand, I don't want it to swallow me as it did in the past.

I am still working on me, trying to work with H on communication issues becoming more self-aware and self-loving.. which I hope will translate into a successful R.. with someone, maybe H, maybe not.

Originally Posted By: very scared54

Please take no offence to my questions.

thank you for asking so kindly

Originally Posted By: very scared 54

Have the things you have read here made you think differently about your stich? If so what?

that I am not alone in my fears, in thinking the way I do about me, my R or my H. That angry abusive men can change, but their wives can not 'make' them... they have to want it and work for it. That I am worth it.

Originally Posted By: very scared54

In addition, it sounds to me a number of WAS�s have changed there minds about walking away. Some even regret their decision and want �Do Overs �.

I would say some want do-overs as long as there are changes on BOTH sides. I would say rarely does a WAS want to or go back to the "same old, same old".

Originally Posted By: very scared54

Sometimes it looks to me that tier pride get in the way.

maybe pride, maybe fear of that the price of retribution exacted by the LBS for their actions of leaving is too high, maybe the LBS just isn't enough 'as is' for the WAW to go back to, maybe people change & grow too far apart during a long term relationship and being comfortably unhappy is no longer acceptable.

Originally Posted By: veryscared 54

We learn from wining, but we learn more from losing sometimes.

The title of my 2nd thread... Losing is a curious form of winning.. a quote from one of my favorite authors Richard Bach.

Peace
Bridge

(( Bridgestone))

I truly hope you find your way to happiness. Whatever path, that may be. I hope you find and get where you want to be.

Thank you for your insight. I know which side of the fence you stand on this matter is painful.
VS54

Originally Posted By: Bridgestone

Originally Posted By: marriedCrazy

Originally Posted By: Bridgestone

My WAW has said the very thing to me; yet she can go out and find a new OM and sex with him within a day. Explain that one to me if you could?

On that day, her trust in him caring for her emotionally outweighed her trust in you for the same.

That is how I would explain it. How sure are you he was 'new'??

Well, from the phone records; she was only communicating with one OM for less than 2 weeks. Next OM within a couple of days.

She was also posting on personals detailing what bar she was going to be in and how to find her.

Hi,

Adding questiions here for the WA spouses on this board...I know I am in a different sitch as I have a WAH, but it's still always useful. Sorry to be so wordy, but I think the background will help before asking the questions...

In a nutshell, my H has been depressed, maybe some form of MLC (but without OW) etc. for the past few months. I've been living out of the country for a bit on foreign assignment (free way to do a trial separation) and H finally asked when I was coming back. He FREAKED out as though he had thought that I would never be returning, made some ludicrous suggestions about me going other places to work for a few more months etc. This was first by IM and then by phone, and I had never seen or heard such ridiculous spew, being married to me was like prison, I was a bully, couldn't I just leave him alone, I was so selfish etc., etc. It was like a temper tantrum. I was about 75% good, a few backslides talking about how I'd changed, and pushing the fact that I wanted to work on the relationship, but given what I was dealing with, I think I did well.

The next day it was like the fog lifted and there was a rainbow. He wrote me this email that was the first positive thing I've heard from him in ages. It wasn't all positive of course, but he said he missed me, and was willing to try (although still skeptical and not wanting to live together). I didn't respond to the email right away as I wanted to think about it. The next morning I got an IM asking if I'd seen it. I was away, and when I came back just changed the subject. He then asked me again if I'd seen it a couple of hours later, said the main messages were he missed me, and was willing to try, and we'd see where things go.

I told him yes that I had just wanted to think things through before responding. He said no response needed but I did so anyway just thanking him for having the courage to share his feelings with me, agreeing that we should take things slow, and validating wherever I could without being too eager.

So, my questions to you...do you think this is a normal part of the process, that a MASSIVE amount of negativity has to be diffused before any efforts can be made? If you said things like this to your S and he was calm, did this change your feelings afterwards?

If your S changed and started reacting calmly to anger and upset, did this make you angry?

If someone who has spoken only in absolute negatives for the past few months suddenly starts acting a little bit positive, does this seem like a true sign of improvement? If, in your sitches, you ever said positive things did you mean them even if you didn't mean all of the negatives?

If you had or did offer a small olive branch to your LBS how would you have wanted to see him react?

Thanks for your insight. As of now I am just acting like it's business as usual, not reaching out to H, responding only reactively and matching his tone etc.

ITH

Originally Posted By: istherehope

So, my questions to you...do you think this is a normal part of the process, that a MASSIVE amount of negativity has to be diffused before any efforts can be made?

yes very much so, but I'd be surprised if he worked through it that quickly?? From what I'ver read the stages of reconciliation have to start with diminishing of negative emotion.

Originally Posted By: istherehope

If you said things like this to your S and he was calm, did this change your feelings afterwards?

not sure how you mean 'change their feelings afterwards'.. do you mean the resentment? diminshing it faster??

I think it has to do with being understood.. if the LBS is reacting in anger & defensive, it is hard to get validated & feel understood. If the LBS is calm & detached and just goes 'uh-huh' that isn't helpful either. It needs to be empathetic listening, IMHO.

Originally Posted By: istherehope

If your S changed and started reacting calmly to anger and upset, did this make you angry?

No, but my H (LBS) has anger issues so most times he was angry and intense it shut me down or it stirred the pot more, I got more defensive, more scared, and I retreated behind my wall to snipe at him until he went away and quit hurting me with his words.

when he can listen calmly, empathetically.. he gets a lot more out of me that is 'real'. Otherwise when he is intense & loud & angry what I can give him is pure BS.

Originally Posted By: istherehope

If you had or did offer a small olive branch to your LBS how would you have wanted to see him react?

with compassion, forgiveness, no resentment, kindness, understanding, empathy, love

good luck
Peace
Bridge

(((Christarn)))

This maybe an improper questionto ask. I do not know all of the protocols here. If this is wrong please let me know.
Are you OK? I haven't seen you here thios weekend.

I emailed my WAW today. I am trying to stay DARK, but I could not help myself. Sometimes I have needed to make myself happy and emailing her makes me happy. She out of town at a business meeting and I went to a spot that we like. (Paraphrasing) I told her how great the place looked and wished she were with me. I sent the email mid-day and haven�t gotten an email back in response at the time of this post.

I probably screwed up again, but I guess shouldn�t expect anything if it wasn�t asked for by her. I was kind of hoping that she would remember the good things we have done and what it could be again. I know I am thinking like an LBS.

Anyone have any thoughts? How would any of you guys react?

Veryscared I am fine! This was my weekend to work, on top of that, I am in school full time, friday I have my research proposal due...what does that mean you are wondering: a 20-30 page type written paper...yes puke, puke, puke!! I am working on Master's degree in Nursing! I will say one thing...it keeps my mind off of the H and my sitch!

It's not against protocol here to ask if people are ok, just can't leave any personal contact info, or stuff like that...other than that they're pretty laid back!

i would, as hard as it is, lay off...let her do the communicating with you. if/when she's ready to talk, she will...give her some time.

thanks for checking on me!
Christa

(((Christarn)))

I totally understand about weekend or (60 hr week) work and going to school at the same time. I did it too, both of us did and with kids at home. It will take your mind off of a lot of things.

I know I need to lay off. I will wait and see. Thnaks

I glade your OK. Have a good week.

thanks VS...you have a great week too. I am/have cut back at work, just can't do it; get good grades and work, school requires way too much of me right now. And I'm not going to pay a poop load of money just to fail a bunch of classes!!! it's not worth it!! So i'm down to 2 12's and just a little OT here and there. It still keeps me busy and still pays the bills. That's all that matters!

back to paper writing...bleeckkkkkk

(((vs)))<-----back at ya $;\)$

christa

Thanks Bridge,

I really appreciate your thoughtful responses.

In terms of my H working through his resentment so quickly, I'm not sure yet...he HAS been seeing a therapist, and HAS been reading loads of self-help books, and trying to do everything in his power to get himself well as a person, regardless of how the R turns out, so I think if anyone were able to work through something quickly, it would be him, but I don't know for sure. Also for what it's worth, there were no issues of infidelity, lying, abuse or anything in our sitch. He felt that I was controlling; this was the major issue. I am not saying it's not a legitimate one, only that it "should" be easier to deal with than some of the other issues I've seen (I hope!)

What I meant by the LBS acting calmly to your anger was, would this make you feel less angry? I think you answered this though by saying you would be looking for empathetic listening. I hope I have been doing this...I sure have tried!

Thanks also for talking about how you would have wanted your H to react to the olive branch. This is really nice to see. I am going to take your words to heart and hope that I can live up to them.

I hope you are well. Your help is greatly appreciated!

ITH

Well WAW is coming home to spend the night. This may sound strange to you guys, but let me explain.

We haven't slept in the same house for over 4 months. I have a medical procedure at a hospital an hour away. I have to be there at 6 a.m. She had agreed a long time to go with me to any medical procedure that I have. They found a tumor in my lung in 1/08 before we separated in 6/08. It is not malignant, but it will get bigger if not kept in check. Sorry I digress. Anyway she would have to leave her apt. at 4 a.m. to pick me up and drive another hour back to the hospital. Her email to me said she could drive down early that morning and pick me up. My return email to her was it is totally up to her, but if she would like to come home the night before it was OK. I told her that she could sleep in the extra bedroom and I promised I would not start any hunky-panky.

She just emailed and said that it was a good idea about her coming home the night before. She said she would call me when she leaves her apt. I told that I might be riding my motorcycle, so she should call me and leave me a voicemail.

My horoscope for this week is positive for this type encounter. I know it is silly, but I need all the luck I can get. Wish me luck and I will report back.

Any words of wisdom/advise form anyone out there?

VS54~ where are you located, state wise...I work with one of the best lung surgeons out there. Dr. steve hazelrigg...you can google him, he's pioneered some really GREAT stuff

I do post lung/heart/vascular nursing...let me know if you need anything.

let her make all the decisions, no R talk, be light and fun in the conversations! smile when you talk!

Christa

((Christa))

I am in the Gulf Coast Area. Hurricane IKA just came threw the area. They tell me that I have a fat tissue tumor, extremely rare, less than 1 tenth of one percent are found in lung. It is commonly found just under the skin on the arms, legs etc. They were able to take most of it out with a laser. The roots are still intact so growth is possible. That why we are monitoring it. It is locate in a spot that if we were to remove it, I would lose one half of one lung. surgery is not worth it now. I think my Doctor is doing a good job. Of course you know all of that being a practicing BSN and working on your MSN.

I plan to be so good that sugar would not melt in my mouth. I am in a good frame of mind, feel confident, and ready do what ever it takes to get the job done. You and others here have given a renewed confidence that will make a deference in my sitch.

By the way did get your paper done in time? How long do you have left? It took my almost ten year to get my BS going part-time and working full-time. I know how hard it is to get your education the way you doing it. I read your sitch today and I am sorry that you are here, but I am glade you�re here to help with my sitch.
Thanks

VS~ rough draft is done, one of the perks of my job is we have an awesome nursing facilitations dept. it is staffed by 2 former nurse educators with their PhD's in nurse education. So I sent the rough draft to one of them, and will critque it with her on thursday, make corrections and turn it in on friday. I also have finals on friday...YUK!!!!!!!!!! I am in accelerated program, so should graduate Dec. of 09...if everything goes according to plan!

Yeah, my sitch is flippin crazy. My H needs serious IC and something for bi-polar disorder! I haven't heard anything from his L, or my L....so maybe he's laying low again...he probably got a 1000$ bill from his slimeball atty, who only did 2-3 hours of work....my H is so screwed if the D goes threw. I am filing for a conciliation hearing, which is court mandated MC...if one of the members of the marital party feels the M can be saved, the judge can grant this...right now it's my hope. that and the fact i am going dark, way dark...first time i've done that. so we shall see. I have also found out, for sure OW is in the picture, but she has floated in and out sense we seperated, so i am not sure what that is all about. ok enough about me...it's my crazy mess!!! oh the drama!!

Yeah, I believe God brought me here for a reason! I have met some of the most awesome people ever. It's amazing how the people here can change your life, and you don't really "know" them....you just type back and forth!!

((((VS)))) <----- back at ya $;\)$

sounds like you are in good hands....like i said, if you need anything of have any ?'s just shout. we do wedge resections (taking out part of the lung) daily. I am extremely familiar with what you are stating. Is your surgery tomorrow?

christa

((Christa))

No surgery, but I am having my third Bronchoscopy Wed. This is the way they are keeping the tumor at bay. They have zapped it with the laser each time. May I ask what part on the country you are?

It sounds to me the your H is the one who is losing, even with the OW. My W does think she has a problem. It is me and all my faults that have drawn to this point. At least that is what she thinks. The only time she needs to talk to her C is after she talks to me. It takes two to dance. We are not to filing, but the law will allow the judge to order MC. I hope it doesn�t come to that. I hope she will a change of heart before that happens. Well that is a big hope. It a long shot but it is the only shot I got.

My Mom and W are in the medical field. Mom has a MSN and taught in an AND program for some years. I kind of live around all of that stuff. I know what you are going through.

You will do well!

I am in the cornfields of IL!!! Abe's hometown $\:\)$

that is my goal...get done and start teaching. i already teach as needed at a lpn school here in town...it's fun! i also do teaching on my unit...it's a passion i have!

i am in the same boat as you, hope H will change his mind before things get any further along.

Well I am off to bed. 12 hour shift tomorow...yuk!!

take care
christa