My Life has become shorter and becomes more precious then ever...

Divorcebusting.com

Over the past few months I have had on and off stomach problems and thought that my discomfort was either from my over indulgence of the hot and spicy foods that I really love or an ulcer that was completely stressed-related for going through the hell that I have gone through over the past year.

Well If only I was to be so lucky...

After a ton of tests and and lastly a biopsy a week ago..I spent yesterday with a oncologist and has diagnosed me with gastric lymphomas. So that means stomach cancer...

The outlook and prognosis �possibilities� are 50/50 response to chemotherapy after surgery. That an average of 12 months of life could be achieved, or even as short as 6 months.

The chances of complete remission are more remote and less then 1-2% for total recovery and this all depends on surgery, chemo and how far it's really progressed after surgery. I am scheduled for surgery next week.

He strongly advised me to make prime directives and make my life plans accordingly right now.

So now I am faced the reality of all this and telling this to my immediate family, my two young children who are 2 and 6 and finally the x-wife from hell. I am only 36 and facing the reality that I could be dead in 12 months or even shorter. No one has any idea of this as I did not want to alarm anyone.

I am overwhelmed with a fury of emotions, anger, sadness, hopelessness and in tears since yesterday and extremely depressed knowing that I am literally �alone� in my shortened life now.

quote:
PLEASE I ask for all and everyone's prayers in explaining this to my family tomorrow. I have no contact order with my X, so I am preparing a fax to send to her attorney Monday. I would have preferred to meet with her and explain face to face but that is not possible. I guess I can only beg and plead that that she let me see the children as much as possible now, more then ever...under the circumstances...I hope she has a heart somewhere buried in her...

-Lost Dutchman

LD,
Oh my God...I don't know what to say except you are in my prayers. I can't believe after all that has happened...now this. I pray she can find enough compassion in her heart to allow you to see the kids. This is such a shock. Call me if I can do anything.
GG

LD

I am sorry this is happening to you.

DD

((((hugs))))

I pray for your children that they will know how concerned you are for their future, almost more than your own. I pray that your XW can open her heart to be there for you and her children. I pray for God to give you strength and peace along with a good prognosis in surgery.

We are here for you, please know that!

Take Care!

LD
This must really be difficult. I don't know what your religious beliefs are. If you are looking for verifiable evidence that the Bible and its promises of a resurrection are true, please email me at EBTon3@aol.com.
Blair

Lost Dutchman,

I am so sorry! If you need somebody to talk to, please feel free to email me rayannedber@yahoo.com
((((((((LD)))))))))

rayanne

Sending you a hug. I will pray for you and your family. Please remember we are here and will "talk" anytime you want. There is always someone awake on the board. Keep us informed and try not to hold everything inside.
Gail

LD,

your story makes me so sad.

i hope your XW remembers the love you once had and is able to be a real friend to you during this time and give you all the support you need.

i hope you get to spend as much time with your kids as you can.

please keep us all updated and know that we are all thinking of you and praying.

I can't imagine how you feel and my thoughts and prayers are with you. Good luck my friend.

Markz

Dutchman,
I am a Missouri Lawyer, If you want to run anything by me I would be happy to give you my free thoughts (EBTon3@aol.com).
Blair

I am so sorry. I am sending out all my thought, prayers and good wishes your way. Please post if you need anything.
A

Even though I'm new to this part of the message board, please know that I am praying for you and your kids. Focus on them, as they will lift you. And they will remember your strength always.

Lost Dutchman,
I have never posted on this forum but check in from time to time. I am sorry for you diagnosis and as with everyone else, I will keep you and the little ones in my thoughts and prayers. If you need anything post and I'm sure that you will get the help you request.

God Bless,
Patty

Hello Dutchman....I want to address the "prognosis" the doctors gave you. My mother was diagnosed with lung cancer in Sept. 2000. It was stage 3b. They told us she had 1 to 2 months to live without doing the chemo and 1 to 2 years to live with doing the chemo. Well, my mom did the chemo right away and also radiation. She has been in remission for a year and a half. She went back to work full-time right after the chemo was done. Next month will be 2 years since she was diagnosed. She is doing soooo great. I thank God everyday for this miracle. Miracles happen every day. I will be praying for you. Nobody can put a number on your days, only God can do that. Please do not listen to their predictions. Be strong, do all you can do to fight this! Never give up, never, ever give up! TC

LD,
You have my thoughts and prayers also. I can't imagine what you must be going thru worrying about your children.

I am a nurse, I agree with TC, the doctors give you stats about the prognosis, but each case is different. It is up to only God to know how long each of us will live. Put your faith in Him, and trust him to take care of everything.

{{{{{{{{{HUGS}}}}}}}}}}}

SB

I'm very sorry to hear your news. You and your kids will be in my thoughts at this difficult time. I agree with others; try to remain positive - I know it's not going to be easy but do try. I believe a positive attitude can have a very positive affect on things.

LD -

I am so sorry to hear your news. You will certainly be in my thoughts.

I urge you not to take the Doc's word at face value and hope you can find some positive treatment that will help you out. The science writer Jay Gould was diagnosed with a nasty cancer years ago. He researched treatments and wrote a really amazing article about cancer treatment and how to interpret the statistics: it's VERY different than a layman would think. I'll see if I can find it online for you....he died only recently.

Ed

Check it out:

http://cancerguide.org/median_not_msg.html

Ed

Hi Ed....fantastic article! Thanks for sharing that with us. Dutchman...please read it! It is so true. We never told my mom in the early stages of her diagnosis what the doctors said about her prognosis, as she never asked. She just had the attitude "okay, let's get this chemo started, let's fight this thing, I ain't done living yet". I am sure she realizes now, 2 years later, what her prognosis was. But, she continues to amaze her oncologist and all her friends and family. I cried and cried when she was first diagnosed and we were told "one to two years". My husband finally told me "you can't grieve her, Tracie, she is still living. She needs you to be positive and strong for her." That made a lot of sense to me. I don't mean to make light of your situation. It must just be devastating. But, attitude is everything here, and I am just wanting to share with you that miracles do happen...I see it in my mom every day! TC

Just wanted to pop in and let you know I am thinking about you. Try to keep a positive outlook.

I wish you strength, Dutchman.

Dutch,
I read your thread and it brought tears to my eyes to think that your life may be cut short after all you have been through. I can only offer one piece of advice, live your life well and know that you are an exceptional human being.

I pulled up some information on your particular type of cancer and would hope that your doctor will review the tests again. Hopefully they can do something to alleviate your pain and stop the cancer from growing any further. There is a very good possibility that your timeline may be longer, what w/proper medical care, etc.

I pray that your attorney can reach your spouse's attorney and will work something out so that you and your children can spend some quality time together. Sometimes God does work in mysterious ways. You will be in my thoughts and prayers. Now is not the time to turn away from God. You need him now more than ever.

Take care!

Dutch -

I am praying for you.

The positive outlook and other advice on here sounds great to me.

God Bless.

LD, You are in my thoughts and prayers. Do not let the doctors and their negative predictions get to you. The others are right, only God knows the number of your days.

I can tell you that I beat 10% odds at the age of 21 and I am 40 now...If you ever feel the need to talk, email me at SJDrebbie@aol.com.

How are you doing LD?

I just spent 5 days by myself up at friends cabin at Mt Hood. Chance for me to reflect on many things; life, death and the big picture. I actually did a lot of praying,soul searching, crying...a bit of a spiritual retreat I think.

I have surgery in the morning. I'm a bit nervous, so please keep me in your prayers...

Since I have been out of town, I haven't heard back from the X. I still have a ton of phone, email messages to go through yet. I am just really tired and I am off to take a nap...

So god bless you all and pray that the doctors have a keen eye and guide their hands during surgery in the morning.

I will have someone contact GG or email when I get out of the hospital.

I have family and a few friends that came in town. I am surronded by very loving and supportive people now, which helps a bunch! [Smile]

I hope all is well with you.

-LD

Dutch,
My thoughts and prayers are w/you at this time. Know that the good man upstairs will be right there w/you during the surgery. I have every hope that your surgery will be a successful one. Take comfort in knowing that you have family and friends all over the world that are pulling for you. We will wait for GG's posting. Take care of yourself!

Our thoughts and prayers will be with you tomorrow
LD. I am so glad that you have family there with you. ((((((((((LD))))))))))

rayanne

Prayers and positive thoughts to you

LD,
You are in my prayers. I'll let the folks know as soon as I hear from you. Next time I'm in Portland, we'll get together.
GG

LD: TC is right - attitude is everything - you can fight this with all you have - please do it for you and the kids! Of course you are in our prayers!!!

Missy

LD I've been praying for you. I'm anxious to know how the surgery went. Bet you're glad that's over. Now comes the next leg of the journey, eh?

I'm glad to hear the soul searching you've been doing has brought some peace, and to hear of the support around you.

I am holding you in the light, my friend. Prayers and positive thoughts coming your way.

Velvet

Sorry Folks,
No word yet from LD. As soon as I hear, I will let you know.
GG

Hi LD,
I pray things went well for you.. Ron

LD is out of the hosp. Very tired and feeling lousy. Starts chemo next week. So, he's planning to shave his head. I will keep you posted as I get messages from him.

He wants to thank everyone for your prayers.
GG

Hi GG,

Please add my prayers and best wishes to LD, life sucks sometimes but you just have to fight with every last ounce of your being,

We are all here for you LD, sending you our love and hoping that your wife will soften in her stance, be good to yourself now and do whatever seems right and comfortable for you.

Love and a huge ((hug))Pearl

GG,
Thanks for the update. Please relay our thoughts and prayers to Dutch. He's got a tough road ahead of him, but he's strong and has a determination to fight this. I hope that his wife will soften a bit and reach out to him during this time, but we shall see.
God works in mysterious ways and Dutch's time on this earth is not over yet. He's got a lot of living to do and share it w/someone special.

Take care!

What happened with communicating to the X's attorney? Did the X have a change of heart and give you time with the kids?

I pray she shows compassion.

Has any heard how LD is doing?

I have been off and feeling lousy and the new format completely caught me off guard.

Update is I am hanging in there. Since surgery I have had lots of nausea and generally feel lousy. Bonus chemo started last week...

The past couple of days I have been really depressed in a deep dark funk...I made an appointment with a headshrinker to try to get some medication in dealing with this all.

I had no response from the former spousal unit to all this...no get well, I hope your ok, the children should see you, etc. not one peep from her family...she really could care less. Oh well, so be it.

I am off to take a nap now. Keep me in your prayers.

LD

LD - So sorry you're feeling lousy. It is alot for your mind and body to take on. I really cannot believe that your X spouse could be so cruel as to not call or anything. I hope that for your kid's sake, she gets some sense. Hang in there!

Take Care!

LD you are certainly in my prayers, and I'm sure I speak for many on this board. I pray that everything comes to you that you need right now and the depression lifts.

I'm a veteran of that so feel free to email me if you want to talk: artist97@paris.com

Peace go with you, my friend.

LD,

Keep your chin up and your food down. You're in my prayers...

So sorry to hear you're feeling so lousy. I too cannot imagine a spouse or former spouse being so cold and cruel. Boggles the mind. You hang in there, rest all you can, and take care.

MomOfTwo

I stumbled upon this thread and my heart goes out to you. I will continue to pray for you. Your retreat made God very happy as He desires a R with you - He heard those prayers - listen for His answer. I pray that your wife softens toward you and there is healing for you and healing throughout your family.
2 Corinthians 12:9
And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.

LD
People here from all over the world are hoping you feel better soon.

LD,
Hope you are feeling a little bit better this week. Take it one day at a time and know that the man upstairs is watching over you. We miss hearing from you!

Dutchman,
I'm so sorry you are feeling lousy and that your ex wife is so lacking in compassion. My thoughts and prayers are with you. May you feel better each day and find the strength that you need.

I do believe in cosmic Karma. One day her actions will come back to her. She not only hurting you, but her own child. One day that child will become an adult and realize that her mother kept her from you. She will not appreciate her mother's actions.

Stay strong. Try to beat this thing.

I haven't been in the best condition lately so posting has been limited. I have had just intense headaches and sleeping a lot.

Chemo sucks and depressing to boot. A little girl who is about the same age as my d (6) comes in at the same time for treatment. It just breaks my heart to see a child who is completely innocent be stricken. The hardest part is watching the parents crumble while the little girl is full of courage. Makes me think is itreally all worth it

Although the attending nurse that I have had at the hospital is really beautiful...she has flirted with me the last few times (single/never married) says she likes my bald head-thinks it's very sexy...WTF! She has even called me at home a few times to see how I was doing..made me feel a bit better. Bedside manner, pity or ???

I couldn't even imagine a date with anyone -Can you excuse me while I hurl?...OR BTW I could be dead in 6 months.

I miss my children more then ever lately. Its really cast a black cloud over me in seeing this entire time. I missed my D starting first grade...

This has been messing with my PMA that I suppose to focusing on for treatment so i can kick this.

All you spiritual folks keep praying cause right now I don't have a lot of faith in anything or anyone.

later-

LD

Dutchman - I am praying for you right now and will continue to. You sound like a brave man - and you do need to exert all your energy to getting well. Stay strong and ask as many people as possible to pray...the more the better.

God bless.

Lost Dutchman,

I am terribly sorry to hear of your heartbreaking health news. My prayers are with you. Just what you needed on top of everything else you are going through. Best of luck to you! I hope you come out of this with a clean bill of health.

Hi LD,
My lf's mom is going through the same thing right now too. She had treatment on monday. Really takes alot out of her. Funny thing is(if it can be funny), she is the rock on witch the family keeps leaning on. She is chipper, makes sure she calls them all even though she is weak.
Those people amaze me and I feel that in you too. You'll beat it. Keep flirting with that nurse even though you may not want too.
Prayers to you and a speedy recovery..
Rondo

LD,
Chemo does take a lot out of you and it will be a while before you feel much like your old self. Take each day as it comes and know that you have many people who love you. One day soon, your w will realize what she's done to you and your daughter. I just hope and pray that God will intervene and find that soft spot in her heart for just a little while.

As for the nurse, I think she really does like you. She doesn't pity you. Apparently you two have hit on something special. Cherish the time that you talk to her. You just never know, this may be the special person that God wanted to come into your life at this time. Don't question her motives, just accept her friendship for what it is. She will help you through this if you will allow her to. Friendship goes a long way when you are healing.

LD, please take care of yourself. Post when you are up to it. We all miss you.

LD,
Hot nurses don't ordinarily call you at home out of pitty! There is something she likes.

First of all, the nurse knows the score on treatment, etc and I think she genuinely likes you.
Second, I am continuing to pray for you, and family as you requested. Take this opportunity to speak to the Lord yourself, too. Just as a Dad beams when his baby gurgles and reaches up to him with recognition - so does your heavenly father look upon you. Sometimes I just don't feel like praying (for my H) and I tell Him, I ask Jesus to pray for me. He does!
Can you just imagine Peter's face when Jesus told him that the devil had been inquiring about him! And the sigh of releif when Jesus said don't worry, Peter, I'm praying for you. Peter didn't even ask - so make a request.
LSL

Hang in there LD! I'm a big believer in positive thought. Enjoy the good bedside manner you are receiving. You are in my prayers.

LD, that nurse sounds like a ray of sunshine. These things come along for a reason, and can really help you along. Just enjoy, and take it as a compliment, which it is.

Prayers and positive thoughts always, Velvet

Dutchman,
Take it one day at a time. Who knows where this nurse is going? Just relax and enjoy the special attention. It's good for the PMA. Maybe it's a sign of better days and better things to come.

Feel better, OK?

I want to thank you all for prayers and support. It has has been provided me a lift and some inspiration that I really needed.

I have felt a bit more like a human lately. The medications must be starting kicking in.

The nurse with the bedside manner invited me to visit the local children's hospital cancer ward this weekend with her. She volunteers up there and said that it would be good for me to see a different perspective as part of my recovery. I said depends on how I feel physically. Mentioned that if was to go she would even make a picnic lunch for afterwards.

We have talked a few times over the past couple of days. So I have a bit more information. She 28, 8 years my junior. Engaged once to a doc, broke it off as he was playing around. Father died when she was 12 of cancer.

Mentioned that she has to be careful about getting attached to a patient because of her position and such. Said that she may want to reassign me to another nurse in the oncology department. I said fine as long as it's not Helga, as she gave me a sponge bath while I was in post-op recovery that would terrify any grown man. She chuckled and said that its good that I have not lost my sense of humor through this.

In a wierd way I can't wait to go to my appointments and see her. She looks and smells as sweet as a georgia peach that has rippened in the sun.

yummy!! Peaches have pits right?

Seems to me the more I just play this all-off, the more she shows interest. My guess is that guys have basically thrown themselves in front of her because of her looks. I have flirted, but not seemed overly interested. I think she finds me interesting and challenging. That old DB stuff can be useful even now.

So like they say one day at a time...

-LD

Dutchman,
You sound much better!

It sure sounds like you've got yourself a date! That's great. She is passing you on to another nurse to avoid a potential conflict of interest. Soooooo, I'd say she's most definately interested in you. You gotta let us know how your date went!

Keeping a positive attitude helps you heal and can make all the difference in the world. Just keep those good thoughts coming!

Just checking in to let you know I'm thinking of you and still praying.

God bless you.

LD,
Of course she's interested in you. I know what your soul is like, and what you look like as well, remember? Trust me, she's interested. That whole reassigning you pretty much gives it away if there's any doubt. If you were older, you'd be my type, too. That's pretty cool about your date. Have a good time!

I hear some PMA returning.

LD,

Just read your situation. My prayers are with you friend. Continue to put youself in God's hands. He cares so much for you.

BTW...I agree with the others, the nurse IS interested in you. She sounds really nice. Have fun on your date.

Chelle

Lost Dutchman,

I posted to you earlier today, but for some reason, I don't see the post. I have been having computer trouble. Sorry I haven't posted to you lately. I have been thinking about you.

How's it going? Looks like you have a fan.

Good for you.

I hope you are feeling okay. (((((((((((((LD)))))))))))))

rayanne

Hey Dutchman: Just read this thread, so sorry to hear about your cancer - I am on staff in volunteer psycho-social support organization for cancer patients and their families in a Qu�bec hospital, and so I know this to be a truth - Nurses in oncology usually DON'T feel pity for patients, they feel respect, admiration and are in awe of their courage - all of us who work with people living with cancer do ... you are walking a rough road, and you have kept your sense of humour, and your head up - WAY TO GO !!!! BALD IS SEXY !!! Your personhood doesn't change - if that nurse shows interest - take it at face value. Please try to laugh if you can EVERY day, and keep positive upbeat types around you - BE POSITIVELY SELFISH - let go of those that drain you - I'm sure you've heard of that book "Everything I Need to Know I learned In Kindergarten" or something like that ?? Everything I need to know I have learned from people living with cancer, and their family and friends, and the biggest thing is that "it ain't over till its over". People with poor pronogsis can live long, and people with excellent prognosis can die quickly. I'll be sending you positive vibes every day - I hope that you are getting good support - hang in there man !!!

LD,

My heart and prayers go out to you. I also do believe in miracles and pray for them constantly. I can't imagine having to give that news to your family.

Thank God it sounds like a little angel has come into your life. Much deserved it sounds like based on others who know you! Wishing you love and healing.

Lost Dutchman,

Have not heard an update in awhile.
Hope your private-duty nurse is taking good care of you.
I continue to pray for you
and that the Lord will work in your W's heart and bring your babies to visit.

Sounds like you are a "chick-magnet" and don't even know it -
BTW, that is part of the attraction ("unawareness").

Romans 8:28
And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God,
to them who are the called according to his purpose.

1 Corinthians 1:25
Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men;
and the weakness of God is stronger than men.

2 Corinthians 12:9
And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness.
Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.

http://bible.gospelcom.net/

Lifting you and yours up in prayer,
LSL

LD,

Our thoughts are with you. Tried to email, but it bounced back.

rayanne

Anyone have an update on Lost Dutchman?
Let him know he is still in our hearts and prayers.
LSL

Hi Dutchman,
Hope you are ok. My thoughts and prayers are with you.
MC

Folks,
I haven't heard a thing from LD. In fact, I emailed him 10/7 and got a msg saying the mailbox was full and couldn't recieve any new ones. Today, his address does not exist. I don't know what to say. It doesn't look good. I lost the phone number that I had of the place he was staying. So, I can't even call his friends to check on him. I'm sorry, and I'm out of ideas.
GG

GG,
This doesn't sound good. Can you email whatever particulars you have on the guy? I may be able to do a little detective work at this end and locate him for you. I'm very worried about him.

Snodderly,
I was praying someone could - I am extremely worried and he keeps surfacing in my heart. I will pray for your success.
LSL

GG,

My emails came back too. It's now saying "mailbox doesn't exist."
Snodderly, this is the address I had, if it helps any. Wish we had more to go on.

another_dutchman@hotmail.com

GG,
I'll see what I can do. It may take me a couple of days, but I have enough friends who may be able to crack this email address for us. GG, I need to know his real name. Do you have that? If so, email it to me. You have my work address.

Snodderly,

You might want to consider contacting Michele's office, they may have some information from when he signed up as a member. Maybe that would help.

Just a thought...
Thunder~

Thunder,
Thanks for the suggestion. I'm hoping that others are working on our lost Dutchman. I've been searching and searching and am coming up empty. Will continue the search. I need to know what area of the state he was living in. Anyone know?

Snodderly, I believe it was Portland, Oregon.

My apologies, sorry I have not posted in sometime...my health has declining over the past 7 weeks...extremely tired, more pain and a complete loss and interest in food...Basically I am living on pain meds and fell I am just living on borrowed time.

Chemo is completed and I am in a holding pattern right now....I have an appointment in 3 weeks to determine where I stand in recovery...I know and feel the answer to this question already

I was �seeing� the nurse...but I ended-up pushing her away from me. I am not interested in getting �close� to anyone and I don't want to hurt anyone ...she is turn says that I am being completely selfish and feeling sorry for myself. I said whatever and that I don't need or want anyone and she was free to leave...she did and I have not heard from her in over 2 weeks..oh well, thanks for the memories...that really is what life is, just a bunch of memories right?...good ones and bad ones...

No response ever from my X on the letter I sent to her atty months back regarding my sitch and no visitation or contact with the children. In 1 week will mark one year since I have seen or talked to the them...seems everytime I try to get visitation or contact with them I catch some form of anger or outlash from the X..So I don't expect to see them ever again. I just don't have the strength or the resources to fight this battle any longer, I am behind on CS/Spousal support and the X has filed contempt charges against me and 2 weeks ago obtained a warrant for my arrest. I called the state and basically explained the sitch, they don' t care, it's all about the $$ so my hands are tied and I can't do anything to change this. I am in debt over 200K, my life insurance lapsed last year when I was going through the D and now is impossible to get when you have cancer, making money when you are sick is difficult and I have liquidated everything to just pay medical insurance and bills. So this just helps to dig my grave and adds to my crappy PMA.

If the cancer is showing no signs of remission or improvement, I don't plan to stay in this world any longer then I really need to. So if the upcoming status is negative I will end-up doing what I need to do in given time-In Oregon, assisted suicide is legal...death with dignity...one doc has already given me what I need when that time comes for me...selfish sure, but I am not going to live like this and become a complete vegetable in my final days-it's about quality, not quanity... My relatives will be here for the Christams Holiday,if I can make it till then, might be the ideal time...

I am not scared to die, nor am I scared to go to hell....life on this earth has been hell...so the physical change in venue won't make a damn bit of difference to me now or later...

The temporary hospice that my friends have set me up is comfortable, but somehow is depressing. I would have preferred to be surronded by my two kids right now...as Mick Jagger said, �...you can't always get what you want...if you try sometime...you get what you need�...I have this, so I am extremely thankful for what I do have.

I want to thank each one of you for your prayers and all of your support during this time, you have taught me so much. I hope that your lives are filled with love and much happiness as you all truly deserve.

A friend of mine has loaned me a laptop and my old hotmail account another_dutchman@hotmail.com has been reactivated, so if you like you can reach me here. As you can understand, I can't give out my number out cause I am a wanted man now....

Love to all-

Lost Dutchman

You don't owe anyone an appology LD. (((((((((LD)))))))))))
We were just concerned about you. I'm very sorry that things are so rough! ((((((((((((LD))))))))))))

rayanne

I hope you have the opportunity to tell your children you love them. Maybe you could make a video?

My prayers are with you. Know you are a child of God and you are loved. All of us have been so concerned. Much love to you!

Dutch,
We are so very concerned for you and your situation. I'm glad you were able to come to the board and let everyone know your situation. DD has made an excellent suggestion. If you are unable to see or speak to your children, do a video and give it to your lawyer and he/she will ensure that it is given to them later on. Dutch, I sincerely hope that, when and if the time does come, your family is w/you. Please take care of yourself.

LD,
I truly hope you get to see or talk to your kids soon. I can't believe that someone would keep them from you given the situation. God speed my friend.

Markz

DutchMan,

Wondered how thing were going. Continuing to pray for you.
My prayers are more valuable than money or time (man-made items) and I don't expect
you to waste them by planning on hell !!!
I expect you to spend eternity in heaven - I will be looking for you - don't disappoint me!
You need to be there waiting for your children, too!
Custody for eternity - how does that sound.

I hope your doctors give you encouraging news.
God's plan and timing is perfect and all things happen for a reason.

You need to be assured of your salvation
so I just searched all over looking for an email a pastor sent to my H.

I found this notes from a teaching by Bob Hokstra:
http://www.calvarychapel.org/livinginchrist/

God's Word in Counseling
Trials and Testings
The Flesh versus the Spirit
Pointing People to the Lord

TRIALS & TESTINGS...this is when we usually seek counsel

...usually the Lord has more planned than our survival/escape...
The Lord has things related to:
- trusting in God who raises the dead
- showing God's power in earthen vessels
- preparing an eternal weight of glory
- and learning the sufficiency of His grace
these are the kinds of things the lord wants to attend to

most of us :
how do i get out of this?
how do i survive thru this?
.. And the lord can sustain us ..and the lord can get us out

THE LORD HAS A FAR BIGGER AGENDA THAN THAT.

FIRST THINGS GOD MAY WANT TO DO :
- trusting in God who raises the dead
how about being raised right here in our walk when we are
buried in circumstance, trial, or battle Paul and his missionary team were being buried
- they despaired of life

2 Corinthians 1
8 For we would not, brethren, have you ignorant of our trouble which came to us in Asia,
that we were pressed out of measure, above strength, insomuch that we despaired even of life:

look what God had in mind:
9 But we had the sentence of death in ourselves, that we should not trust in ourselves,
but in God which raiseth the dead:

EVERY CHRISTIAN NEEDS TO GROW IN FAITH AND TRUST IN THE LORD..MOST OF US WANT TO..
WHAT IS SO OFTEN THE OBSTRUCTION?
THE TRUST WE STILL HAVE IN OURSELVES

IF ANY MAN WILL COME AFTER ME, LET HIM DENY HIMSELF, TAKE UP HIS CROSS DAILY...FOLLOW ME
- {DEATH TO SELF...SELF-IMPROVEMENT/ SELF-HELP/SELF-ESTEEM...}
The Bible tells us we are blessed if we
have low self-esteem
...BLESSED ARE THE POOR IN SPIRIT...NOT WHAT I CAN DO...WHAT I CAN CAUSE TO COME TO PASS..
often the Lord let's us get buried circumstancially and experiencially -
WHY? - that we should not trust in ourselves, but in God which raiseth the dead-

...the great apostles had impossible circumstances too ...IT IS PART OF THE BATTLE
...look what the outcome can be...
TRUST in the LORD - not only who raises the dead in the end-
but raises those who are deadened by their own impossible circumstances:
10 Who delivered us from so great a death, and doth deliver:
in whom we trust that he will yet deliver us;
PURGES YOUR TRUST IN YOURSELF -

THE WORLD IS A PLACE THAT WANTS TO BURY US ALIVE - AND THE ENEMY - HE WANTS TO DEVOUR
US...so there are times we have thee deadening situations. (But)We serve a God who raises the dead.

- showing God's power in earthen vessels:
2 Corinthians 4
7 But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us.

WE ARE CLAY POTS. - WE ARE VESSELS (MEANT TO CONTAIN SOMETHING) - ORDINARY/WEAK We break
easy - a clay pot
The glory is not the vessel that we are - it is the content(TREAUSRE-GOD?S LIFE IN US) that God wants to put in. Then
God puts us thru a process where the glory goes to the content - not the vessel.

8 We are troubled on every side, yet not distressed; we are perplexed, but not in despair;
9 Persecuted, but not forsaken; cast down, but not destroyed;
(=> clay pots can't handle that - it is the content.)
10 Always bearing about in the body the dying of the Lord Jesus,
that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our body.
(This is an attitude/confession - we are to always carry about with us- you must be willing
- you embrace/confess/hold onto the dying of the Lord Jesus -
AND IT IS IMPORTANT-IT IS RELATED TO THE LIFE
OF JESUS BEING MANIFESTATED IN OUR BODY. )

PEOPLE SAY - OH I WANT THE LORD TO BE SEEN IN MY LIFE! - THE LORD SAYS - WELL, HERE'S THE PROCESS
- I PUT MY TREASURE - THE LIFE OF MY SON IN A VESSEL LIKE YOU
- I PUT YOU THRU IMPOSSIBLE THINGS AND HE'LL BE THE EXPLANATION OF HOW YOU CARRY ON
AND EVEN THRIVE AND EVEN ABOUND AND EVEN BARE FRUIT
....BUT I WANT YOU WILLING TO CARRY ABOUT IN YOU THE DYING OF THE LORD JESUS
- HOW DO YOU DO THAT? - WELL IT'S AN EMBRACING OF A PERSPECTIVE.A CONFESSION. AN ATTITUDE.
WE HOLD ONTO / AGREE WITH/ TREASURE / SEE AS RIGHT - THE DYING OF THE LORD JESUS...
THE BEST I COULD DO ON MY OWN SHOULD BE ON THAT CROSS - WE ARE AS FILTHY RAGS
- THAT THE LIFE OF JESUS CAN BE MANIFEST IN MY BODY.

11 For we which live are alway delivered unto death for Jesus' sake,
that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our mortal flesh.
(This is an action- DONE TO US BY GOD)
12 So then death worketh in us, but life in you.
13 We having the same spirit of faith, according as it is written, I believed,
and therefore have I spoken; we also believe, and therefore speak;
14 Knowing that he which raised up the Lord Jesus shall raise up us also by Jesus,
and shall present us with you

Allow God to comfort you and minister to you.
Please toss out the suicide-meds. Seek the Lord.

I will email you.

Faith. Hope. Love. & lots of prayers for you and yours,
LSL

LSL,

Proselytizing by it's very nature disrespects other faiths by assuming that one knows better than another. Christians are not the only ones that have a strong spiritual life.

I have a very strong relationship with God and I am not a Christian. Hell is a Christian concept that even some Christians do not accept. It does not exist for me.

Assisted suicide is a personal choice, and God is about love, not burning people up for eternity. That is a fear-based way to control people that worked in the Dark Ages and the Spanish Inquisition, but today many walk with God free of fear.

The above beliefs are mine and I would never try to get others to stray from their own spiritual journey out of respect. Please respect other faiths.

Velvet,

Homeschooling Mom surrounded by Born Agains, who was born perfectly OK the first time.

Wow Velvet!

I hear alot of pain and anger in your post to LSL. Has a "Christian" hurt you deeply before?

Sharing is what this BB is about and that is all I hear in LSLs post. If it offends anyone, they are free to choose not to read it. I hope you are not suggesting that LSL give up her first ammendment rights of free speech and curb her rights in order to respect yours? Asking LSL to change how she shares her story just so someone feels less threatened is the same thing as what LSL has done that seems to have offended you (ie you have just done the very thing that you accuse her of, just in a different way!)

Velvet, I am glad that you are a spiritual person. May I suggest that the next time you are communing with your God as you stroll on your beautiful land (I saw the pictures you posted...It is beautiful!!!),that you ask HIm to show you his truth about Jesus and ask him to reveal to you where you have been hurt by a "Christian". See what he does with this. Only you need to know about this, in your own mind. Just ask Him/Her and see what happens.

I'll leave it at that for now. Come visit me on my thread if you wish over on MLC.

I apologize if I offended you when I told you awhile back on your thread that I would throw dirt on my head and sit with you in your grief like Job's friends did.

shockedandamazed

shockedandamazed,

I was offended by LSL's post also. It's not our place to preach to people. This board isn't about religion. I happen to be Presbyterian, but I think Lost Dutchman needs some support and friendship, not people judging him. This is NOT
the thread for a religious debate! Let's have a bit of compassion here!

rayanne

Hey rayanne!

In light of your response to me I went back and read more of LD thread and LSLs long post. I just didnt see it that way.

I saw it as her encouraging LD and cheerleading, not judging. I do not know where LD stands with faith matters, but if he is unsure I hope he explores the issues soon since he seems to be planning on jumping into eternity soon.

"religion" is not a game or a hobby...in fact I do not even like the term, because it diminishes the reality of it. the fact is that there is an eternal absolute truth out there, whether anyone at all beleives it or not. we cannot change it...our decision to not believe it doesnt make it go away.
When we each die, we will be faced with this...whatever it is... whether we want to or not.

My prayer for each of us, especially LD under the immediate circumstances, is that we all explore in our own hearts what that true reality is. That we each ask "God" in our own private minds (whether we belive in Him or not) to show us what this reality is.

The God I know(the God of the Bible)...will answer all who truly seek him with an open mind and heart. Just try it if you are willing...quietly in your own mind. No one will know but you and God. You dont need to report back to me or LSL.

Personally, I have just met LD here today on this thread and I cannot count myself among his long standing friends. However, I am deeply saddened by his tale...it is most unbelievable and grievous. I will pray for him tonight when I log off...sooon.

But in reading this tale I am struck most with the thought that "God really loves you LD...and I think he is trying to get your attention." I wish you well and I hope you choose to stay around long enough for God to bring your kids to you. For reasons I cannot explain, I have this feeling that things will turn around for you in some way, if you simply ask God "what".

I know this is a strange post...but that is just what I am sensing right now for LD.

Thanks rayanne! Good night all!

sleepy as well as shockedandamazed

Shockedandamazed,

I agree with everything Rayanne said and what I wrote was how I feel. Please don't tell me how I feel - only I can know that, after all. I am neither in pain nor angry.

Just as you and LSL feel any belief other than Christian is wrong, I feel the same about proseletyzing Christians. It is an insult to my faith. And I thank God that Hell is not in my vocabulary or my beliefs.

LD and others,
We all care about you LD. Your story is an example of what should never happen to any family in a civilized society. Your desire to end the extreme pain is perfectly understandible.
I think all of the people here want to help. Some here, including myself, think that if you die of this disease that you have a hope for future life. It's hard to sit by and watch your circumstances, know about a solution, and remain quiet.
Some here are concerned about hell. I understand their feelings. I and my religion (after very careful study) do not believe there is a "hell". The English word "hell" is a translation of hebrew "sheohl", greek "haides" and "geenna", none of which mean a place of eternal fiery torment but death from which God can resurrect us.
I think what we all feel is we want to help to make some sense of all of this.
Divorcebusting is about communication of our thoughts. The truth comes through communication. I think we all can be respectful of others opinions while at the same time feeling safe to express our own thoughts. Religion is a part of that, and for some of us, a big part. We can communicate without debate. Perhaps in that open communication LD will see something that helps.

Dutchman,
You have been on my heart these many months. I have been praying for you, your wife and your children.
You are in need of hope and there is hope in God. You spoke of King David in an early post and talked of hell.
I realize from your posts you know of hell. Hell was not created for man. Jesus spoke the most on this subject.
Know also this, God went to prepare a place for you and it is in heaven.
I pray you have been able to continue to read or hear the Word of God.
I was thinking of you at Thanksgiving and through the Christmas season. Please let us know how you are doing.
Cling to Hope, for in God all things are possible.

Psalm 39:7
And now, Lord, what wait I for? my hope is in thee.

Psalm 42:5
Why art thou cast down, O my soul? and why art thou disquieted in me?
hope thou in God: for I shall yet praise him for the help of his countenance.

Faith. Hope. Love.
LSL

http://bible.gospelcom.net/

snodderly,
Any info on the Dutch Man?

Faith. Hope. Love.
LSL

Dutchman,
You continue to be on my heart. I continue to pray for you, your wife and your children.
Can one of your friends post for you?
Has anyone heard anything from him? I was not successful in contacting him by email months ago (he did not respond).
Love. Hope. Faith.
LSL