Summertime....and the living is easy...

Happy Sunday, Folks!

On Friday, STBX had told me and S that he had a truck and he was coming over to get his 2 pianos, his bee hive and beekeeping supplies, 3 wheel bicycle, basketball hoop and other assorted junk.

I had asked him some time LAST YEAR to have his stuff out by Easter. We even discussed it at our last mediation appointment which was Dec. 20th. In January I again asked him to get his stuff out by Easter. Well during Spring break my sister and her family were visiting, so I didn't push things when it didn't happen back then, and we both got busy with the end of the school year.

On Monday, when I considerately called him to warn him that the papers were coming and talk to him about some other things, we discussed that this week would be a good week for him to get his stuff since he is not quite so busy. He starts teaching 3 more classes on Monday so he is about to be really busy again.

So, I fully expected the stuff to be moved Friday. He was going to come at about 3:00, and he had roped S into helping him. Of course I don't approve of that, but S was very easy going about that and I thought it would be More stressful for him if I made a fuss about that.

So D and I planned an afternoon of shopping and a movie.

We were gone before he got there, and we stayed out until about 11:00. D scored some really cute clothes that were majorly on sale and I got some cute summery sandals. We saw "Bewitched" and then came home.

I opened the garage door, expecting to see lots of negative space. Well, guess what. NOTHING got moved!

OOOOH I was SO MAD!
H had left a message on the machine that he was not able to get a truck. The thing is, that message was left at 6:30!
S was not home, but the next day I asked him what happened, and he said that H had flipped out at the truck place, got in a fight with the clerk and stormed out of there. I tried calling him several times on Saturday, but he wasn't picking up, and I didn't want to leave him a message.

Saturday night my dreams were filled with anger, I was telling him things like, "You messed with me for the last time, buddy" and "I'm bringing out the big guns now, mister" and other, similar scenarios.

My friend tells me it is good that I am getting into the "anger stage"...

Anyway, I kept my cool, because I also found out on Saturday that I will probably be going to Chicago later on in July because my sister is having an operation and I will help her with the schlepping of children and helping out with my Mom that she does. She won't be able to drive after the operation or lift anything over 10 lbs. So my schedule will allow for me to go out and help. And although my kids are very capable on their own, I do want to have H available as a back up/safety net...or at least a dinner! So I didn't want to antagonize him.

I never know how to handle him. He is SO Passive Agressive! I don't want to antagonize him, yet he makes me so ANGRY!

Well, today he called at about noon. We talked. He told me that he could do the move on July 8th. I told him that works well for me. He said he still hasn't received the papers. (Service by mail) He asked me if I am determined to go through with this. I just said, "Yep!"

He said that he found his benefit plan booklet and his statement, which I had asked him for on Monday.

We talked a little longer then he asked to say hi to S. He closed with "thanks for talking with me"

So I am glad I didn't spew a bunch of anger in his direction, but if his stuff isn't out by July 8th, it is going to be listed on Freecycle !

After the call I went with my girlfriend and her daughter and helped them pick out a new computer!
THAT was a lot of fun, and then we set it up.

Came home and had dinner with D, S was gone, but earlier he made homemade Pad Thai for lunch, and it was delicious!

Tomorrow I have a 4 day workshop I am attending with a good friend. So back to the grindstone!

Ta Ta for Now,
SG

Boy, your H sure is a mess. Picks a fight with the truck rental guy to get out of moving his stuff. He really needs to get some help, doesn't he?

But you sound Mahvelous!

Life for you going forward is going to be bright, I know.

Ellie

Well done SG!!!

I too, am still feeling anger towards my ex. He too, is still spewing at anyone and everyone he encounters (told to me by Ashley). I'm not sure that some of these guys EVER outgrow the anger stage. Mine is angry that I didn't give him photos while my mom was ill (of the family) and wants them YESTERDAY!!! He is refusing to sign off the timeshare that I bought outright from him in Feb as a result. He is also questioning Ashley about who is looking after her while I'm away for a couple of days. GEESH - as if he cares. OK, enough about me. I just needed to vent too. Like you, I'm even angry in my sleep.

I think its best to always wait a day or too before calling. In my case - I will likely not call at all - just gather the photos and call my lawyer. Less contact the better. You had a chance to be less reactive and he was not so angry. You were not quite what he expected and appear the better person for it.

I've been thinking of you and it sounds like your time away in July will be good for you. I'm heading to Vancouver in August but I won't get to California at that time. I still plan to visit, just not sure when yet.

Well, July 8 is only a few more days away. You've waited this long. Let's hope he comes through. Sure sounds like strange items he is taking, but then its always that way.

Hope today is a good one!

Love Barb

Hi SG,

I had a kick ut of reading your post this morning. So STXH still has not gotten rid of his junk out of the garage. Well, just post a big moving sale for the Sunday paper, "everything in the garage has to go...pianos, basketball hoops, beehive, bicycles, etc." You will have a bunch of die-hards come out of the woodwork and guaranteed your garage will be empty. But I know what you mean about not getting his behind upset since you will be needing his help. Had I not been gracious enough to send my H two tickets for graduation, he probably would not have offered to pay all of S17's college fees

Instead, I will be sending him all the payment coupons at $850 per month for 10 months. I am sure he also was looking at it for tax purposes too. As it turned out, I win, he wins, and S17 wins

Just got a letter from him too with his last CS money, vehicle titles all endorsed by him, and a new SA that he & I will have to sign. He just ask me to let him know when I would be available to have it notarized. He is out of town this week as he and the bruha (witch) went on vacation. But I am ok with it now. Like you, I have accepted the fact that my M is dead and am making life decisions now without him. It is freeing to know that I can do whatever it is I want to do without consulting anybody.

My S17 will be leaving for Europe come 7/06/05 for 13 days. It is his graduation and birthday present from me. He has started working at Coldstone Creamery and he says he enjoys it a lot. Just that his arms get so tired at the end of his shift making those ice cream scoops. And I get half off if I want to buy some.

Have a nice summer SG...I am on my way to getting a tan with my walking again.

Love,
Hopie

Hey SG: Sorry for the hijack but I just wanted to say hi to HOPIE!!! Hi!!! Boy - you've come a long, long way. I'm so glad for you. Letting go and moving on are such big steps. You're doing awesome. Glad to hear it!

Love Barb

Hi Goddess,

Well, as you know this is coming from a former wife of a passive/agressive man. So my thought is this, to let him continue to yank your chain would be the same old same old. We are enablers and that's a sickness also. It has been the hardest thing to break. Just like with our children, unless we put our foot down and say that enough is enough, this will continue. I know that you already know this but it always helps to refresh my memory when a friend points it out to me.

By leaving his 'stuff' there, he not only has some control but for some crazy reason there is still that connection with his old life or something to go back for. It should be for his kids but he's not in a very healthy place at the present.

Maybe if the 8th comes and goes with no movement you should at that point tell him that you will take this as him not really wanting this stuff. Since you can longer store it, maybe it would be best for all concerned to put an add in the paper and sell it.

Trucks are expensive but if he really wanted these things that badly, he would pay whatever it cost. He already had a built in moving man with your son.

Whatever you decide, you have to remember that what he is doing, serves a purpose for him. I'm not even sure that he really is aware of what that is, but you can bet that everytime he gets his way, he still thinks he's calling the shots!

Love you,

Bethie

Hi SG,
You sound great!!! I had the same problem with XH about moving stuff. I finally sent him a very nice email stating that I'd tried to work with him for a year on taking care of it but that for various reasons it hadn't worked out. I gave him a specific date (30 days) and said that if it wasn't moved by then, I would have someone haul it away and take it to the dump. I apoligized for having to take that stand but let him know that I had no other choice.

He did take some of the stuff and I really did have the rest hauled to the dump. I don't even know what was in some of the boxes. I didn't look and I didn't care. I fugured if it wasn't important to him, then why should I care. I know you have some big items that you would most likely be better off selling. Maybe he could buy them back from you if he really wants them!!!!

Good Morning Friends!

WOW!

Shucks you guys! I checked the board at 6:30 West Coast time, and there was ALL this great SUPPORT! I am on my way out the door and I have to run, but replies to you all are coming when I get back later today.

Thanks Ellie, Barb, Hopie, Bethie and Quo!

Now I am off to learn some more cool stuff about computers, teachers and training.

TTYL,
Love SG

Hey SG!
Trying to catch up. How was your class?

Dont blame you one bit for being sooo angry at your STBX
they are impossible! Mine is sooo much the same, I have asked him nicely to pleaseeee let me know what he intends to do w/ the tax money, and I cant even get a return call, so frustrating and you wonder why they feel they can treat us like this.

Makes you want to give him an ultimatum, come get your stuff by XX or the goodwill will be having a field day!

I do hope for you it gets resolved, I am sure you cant wait to get it OUT.

Let us know how your classes went!

Happy Friday Morning, Friends!

My workshop was awesome; I learned a lot and networked with some big-time local leaders in my field. Have some possibilities for part-time contract work that will pay fairly well, too.

Things have been quiet on the home front...kids are busy with work and school. We have all been getting along well...This last week I have been living the life of a typical commuter because I had to leave the house early and drive for 40 minutes then come back in the early evening. I must say, I do appreciate my normal 5-minute bicycle commute all the more!

Today the tree guy is coming to take out the birch trees. I am really sad about that.

Not too long ago my D found a roll of film when she was cleaning out the car. We got the pictures back last night. They were of a wedding the whole family went to, I think it must have been about 4 summers ago. D definitely looks a lot younger! The married couple now have a 2 yr old and have moved to Portland. Looking at the pictures I have a whole mixture of feelings...That period of time was between bomb one and two...I think...I will have to go back and check my timeline. H was definitely playing me and OGIRL at the same time in those days. He has that deer in the headlights look, too.

WOW! To think I have wasted SO MUCH TIME on that loser!

Oh well, onward and upward to better things.

I am pruning and removing the dead and worthless from my life. The trees will be removed, and so will everything else I can't use!

SG

well, ever since finding those photos I have been thinking about my timeline and how long I have been in this mess. I re-read my first thread, which is here. I realized that I have been weeping and moaning about this man since 2002 when I first found H's secret e-mail account. If that were all there was, it would be bad enough, but as usual, when the LBS finds out about the affair, it usually has been going on for some time. In this particular case, H had OGIRL as a student in the summer of 2001. Her shoes were still at his apartment Christmas 2004. That is 3 1/2 years of the current drama/trauma. There is more, and some of you already know that I found out he had (at least) an EA in 1991.1992 and 1993.

While I was willing to forgive and reconcile for a LONG time, and put up with plenty of BS in the process, those chances flew out the window last Christmas when H told me in mediation that he wanted to "work on the marriage" while his OGIRL was still sleeping at his apartment.

And you know that I served him with divorce papers earlier this week.

And you know I have given him every possible chance...right?

SO

Today he had plans to pick up D and she is going to stay over at his house, tomorrow they are going for a hike in the mountains. He came over to pick her up, and we were talking out in front of the house. I asked him if he had the day off...He said yes, he has a summer schedule that is teach TWTh and FSSM off. He asked me if I have Fridays off this summer. I said I have today off, but I will be busy next Friday.

He said, I don't know what I am doing next Friday.

WTF?!?!?

I said, I thought you were moving your stuff next Friday. He said, "Oh yeah, maybe I will" "I called around and the earliest the truck places had anything was next Friday."

I said, well, what should I do if you don't move your stuff on Friday? He said, what do you mean? I said, "well can I asume that you aren't very interested in this stuff if you haven't gotten it out by then?"

Things got ugly.

He threatened me and implied that I am only in this for the money. He said he was doing me a favor by continuing to pay the mortgage. I told him it wasn't about that and I had given him plenty of chances to get his stuff out. He said he never agreed to any of the other previous dates, that I was just telling him what to do.

D came out of the house and they left. Shortly after that he called me and appologized for saying mean things, but I was too mad to accept it. We tried to talk, and I just let him have it. I reminded him that I gave him all those chances when he told me I was one of his "Two wives"! He denied ever saying that. He denied even having Affairs! I said BS! He denied EVERYTHING! and he said I "had it pretty good since he was working hard since the day he met me"

This is where I lost it. I worked my damn ass off our entire marriage. I put in 90% of the parenting and I supported him his entire career. He made some crack about me not earning enough money and living off his wages. HELLO! I am happy that I have a plan and a good career that is starting now, but I am NOT HAPPY about having to start over at the ripe old age of 48! I had hoped, that after a lifetime of hard work I would be able to relax and enjoy a little leisure with the man I loved at this stage of the game. I DID NOT ASK FOR THIS! I GAVE HIM YEARS of chances!

At some point he said that maybe I am a "little ahead of him on the divorce curve" and that I am a little more certain of things than he is! Then he contradicted himself and said that he didn't want to be married to grumpy old me!

well, that was the last insult and I lost it, started crying and called him some bad words....(Protecting your ears and eyes here...!)

I then cried for about an HOUR, and dug up all the evidence I have stashed away in a drawer, to remind my self of all the BS I have been through my entire marriage.

I am venting here a bit, and now I think I am done. I thought I was beyond tears with this man. 19 years is a lot to give up.

SG

((((((((((((((((((SG)))))))))))))))))))))))))
I think most of us have gone through a similar scene with our crazy Xs.
I honestly believe they have the ability to splice out all their past BAD behaviors...no affairs, they worked hard, they always were sweet to us etc, etc and WE were the consumate bitches.
Yes, I learned that mine NEVER had an affair (tho that photo of he and Ho in bed naked together seems compelling)that he NEVER hid away money, that he NEVER promised me the house etcetc. And HE built the houses and HE had to work two jobs (working and building the houses?????) and what 2 jobs did I have (cause building the houses and mother/wife/cook/maid/chauffer didn't count) etc.....

They blank out anything they did and 'make up' stuff or at least come up with it in advance of our reactions..to justify their own bad behavior.

Mine had been doing it all our marriage..I just didn't know it.
As Bethie said, "We are enablers and that's a sickness also. It has been the hardest thing to break. Just like with our children, unless we put our foot down and say that enough is enough, this will continue"

I have no way of knowing for sure, but even though I am long gone from Xs life, I think he still tells people that it is MY FAULT for whatever is happening in his life.

So, SG...don't let him. You could hire people to take the stuff to his house and if he wants it he has to pay them to get it. Make sure you sign the contract MRS. X and keep the S in MRS. very illegible...HA!)

I cry every time I think how much of my life I have spent being an enabler, be rejected by my X, trying to put it all back together and then trying not to anger him after he decided he wanted the divorce. So many years and it is still not done. Don't make that same mistake sweetie...be strong!

gd

((((SG))))
Vent away girl!!! Yup, I'd say his time is up!!! You have given him every chance and he's blown them all.

Save your energy as far as arguing with him. The WAs are never at fault and never apologize. Use your energy to pursue the D and move on. Wish I had better advice but I really do think that once you accept that you can't believe anything he says, you'll just let it roll off you.
Jill

Thank you GD1 and Quo....

I am doing better today, but still feeling a little fragile. I was very surpised at myself for crying so much. I basically cried all night last night...it would come in waves, and then go.

While it was happening I was able to step back and observe, "Hey, I'm crying!" and just let the tears flow. I know it was a release, and part of the grieving process.

Today my H and D are on an all day hike. I really somehow thought we could have a cordial and civilized divorce.

I am sad because I really, truly loved him! But it still holds, even if he doesn't think so... What do I have to gain from reconcilliation? NOTHING! I get a cheater and a liar. What does he have to gain? EVERYTHING! His life back, me and the kids and the house.

Unfortunately the summer is a bad time for things to go sour. My income drops drastically until October. Usually it has been fine because he works extra to make up the difference. But he is being such a jerk I am a little worried.

Thanks again, ladies!
SG

Hi SG!
{{{ SG }}}
I'm w/ Q, Vent Away!! This is the place to do it, after all, it falls on deaf ears w/ the STBX!
Do not blame you one bit for being fed up!
these WA have had more then their fair chance and now its our turn to set some rules

Just remember SG, you are the sane one, they are out in la la land and I dont mean L.A!

Hope your 4th is/was a good one
Is it next weekend you take D to SLO?
You'll have a nice weekend !!
Talk to ya soon girly

Happy National Holiday, everyone!

It is late, and I am hanging on to the last bit of the weekend by staying up late and posting. My summer vacation is about to end, summer session starts tomorrow!

I did have a great weekend once I got over the horrible encounter with you know who...

Saturday night I went out to the movies with a girlfriend, we saw this movie: Crash. An excellent, thought provoking film that should win some Acadamy Awards! We saw the movie and then de-briefed afterwards with some drinks at a cafe. My kind of night! It was so much fun, and my friend had never been to that cafe or theater before. It is funny, H and I would go on that exact same "Date" frequently, but it was such a drag with H! He would leave a movie and declaim, (loudly!) "Well, THAT was a waste of 2 hours!"

On Sunday my friend and I took the short drive (90 minutes) to San Francisco. My friends daughter stays alternate weekends with her dad there, so I came along for the pick up. We stopped at a Dim Sum restaraunt and picked up some Dim Sum to go and then we went to the beach. It was chilly and overcast, a welcome change from the 90-100 temps we have been having in the Valley!

Silly me forgot the rule about sun screen in cloudy weather and now I am bright red! My daughter says it makes me look angry!

But she says it in a nice way!

It was very soothing and relaxing to look at the endless horizon of the ocean and listen to the waves. One of my all time favorite things!

On the way home we stopped at IKEA and I got some stuff for the house...bookends, a few throw rugs and some cool outdoor lights. It was a perfect day.

Today, on the Glorious Fourth, I drove my daughter to work, yes she had work today and went in like the trooper she is. Then I went to Yoga class.

The teacher often gives us a thought to focus on during class, and today, naturally it was " What Does Freedom Feel Like? "

That is a good question. There are so many different kinds of freedoms, and there are so many that we take for granted...I know that I enjoy certain freedoms just because of the accident of being born into the USA as a White person, with educated middle class parents.

But today as I was doing my Yoga, I was thinking about the actual feeling of freedom. To me, the iconic feeling of freedom would be of flying...I sometimes have great flying dreams and I can really feel free when I am having them.

At this point in my life, and the divorce process, I would say I feel fairly free. I don't have to worry about mister grumpy coming home and disrupting the calm home I have with the kids. I can do pretty much whatever I want here at home, and that wasn't really the case for many years. We had a walking on eggshells kind of existance, where we were very tentative around each other.

I guess my life is calmer, and a lot more free. I am glad about that!

And now I am going to bed.

SG,
Sounds like you had a great holiday weekend. I saw Crash a few weeks ago and I loved it. It's one of the best movies that I have seen this year.

I want to be just like you and Queenie when I grow up!
Cheryl

YAYYYYY SG!!!! Sounds like you're on a roll. Good for you!!! Really, you do sound better than ever. I'm thinking that making the "final" decision to D has been a huge weight lifted off your shoulders.

BTW, are you aware that we have another date this weekend????

Hi Goddess,

Oh..oh.. your H is showing a little remorse here??? that taking the pianos will mean that it is really over...what planet did he fall off from again? He did this to himself and is now reaping what he has sown. I guess he really thought that you would be there forever. But, time's up and he just needs to continue on with his chosen lifestyle. He used his last dime and he did not even know it. Figured he can sweet talk you each time before.

Wait till you get your MS and be making really big bucks...and then have a really handsome hunk right next to you graduation day

That would just be about perfect revenge... Me, I am ok with the status quo for now...living in limbo land. But I think OW will be pushing for my H to file for his D since she has been D for over a year now. I will sign that piece of paper when it shows up in my mailbox. I have relinquished all claims to my H including emergency contact information. I listed my son as my next of kin. I yelled at my car insurance folks for changing my address to his. I got my new statement this week with the right address on it this time.

I got an unexpected raise too...I guess they like me at work. I am back to walking my hour and a half and I am in a much better mood because of it. Now, I just need to go to the gym for my lunch hour like I used to.

So forward we all go Goddess. Life handed us lemons and we are making sweet lemonade.

Love,
Hopie

He moved every thing out except the beehive!

It is a little tricky doing that, and he promises to get that done soon.

He did rope my son into helping him...

But he also swept out and mopped the garage when he was done.

SG!
So glad H got all his stuff out, I know that must be a relief to you!
Now you have a nice clean, clutter free garage , thats all yours!

I am still coming across bits and pieces of STBX stuff around here!

Hows your weekend going SG?
Is your D all ready for SLO? My S two best friends are leaving soon, one for USC in L.A, S hopes to join him next year, and the other up to Santa Barbara, S is a bit sad I think, his best friends from middle school, but life changes, and when you cherish a friendship, you work at keeping it up i think.

Hope your summer is super so far SG
drop us a line!

Hi Karen,

Thanks for stopping by. My weekend has been busy. I had summer school on Friday and Saturday. Today I mostly caught up on bills and paperwork and then did some homework.

This evening I drove D and 3 of her friends to H's house. She is having a sleepover over there with her friends. This week they each get to schedule a day and a night with the whole group. I took them over there, and H invited me in. I saw how he has his piano set up, and he said he gave away the second piano. I noticed a lot of evidence of OGIRL, such as Japanese soap and shampoo in the shower, a set of 4 wrapped toothbrushes from JAL on the bathroom sink (laid out for D and her friends) and a big basket filled with Japanese tea and cookies and fruit in the kitchen.

Just last week H was telling me that he thought he had a chance to get back together with me!

I didn't say anything since D and her friends were there, but I sure was annoyed.

H acted all nice and friendly.

He will be getting an e-mail from me!

He has to go to court tomorrow, his speeding ticket has grown into a failure to appear and a warrent out for his arrest. This is going to cost at least $500!

The big dummy.

D doesn't go to SLO until September. Her start is the week after Labor Day, so that is when I will be there, the weekend of the 9th-11th...

I go to Chicago next week to help out my sister who is having surgery tomorrow. Illinois DBers, sorry, I won't really get a chance to get away! But I will be thinking of you!

So, that is my weekend. Busy and stressful. Dealing with delusional H and lots of homework to do!

But I am glad to have something to focus on.

Thanks again Karen!
Talk to you soon,

SG

SG -
as you get things together for D to go to college - got to Linens and Things and look for a Serasoft blanket. Absolutely the softest thing you have ever felt in your life - my D says it's like touching a kitten. I had to get one for S18 - I figured that would be a totally comforting thing to have if he's ever having a bad day.

Ellie

thanks Ellie!

My D is very into soft things and very tactile. She has her "blankie" that she hides in her pillowcase when she goes anywhere. She also has a super soft blanket that she may take with her, so thanks for the tip! I was reading your thread in "just for fun" and I saw some good tips there.

This week D is doing a different fun thing with each of her 3 good friends. They are spending the night at a different house each night, and each friend is hosting a different event. D took her friends on a 2 hour trail ride. One of the girls had never been on a horse before that. I think they had fun...but it was very hot that day...we have been experiencing temps in the 100's this week! I took the girls out to lunch, and then they just wanted to "chill" so we rented "Bride and Prejudice" the Bollywood version of Jane Austin. I took the girls to my computer lab and we watched it on my big screen with the LCD projector! It was fun. The girls were not familiar with the story, although I KNOW D has seen the Greer Garson and Laurence Olivier version...The girls did pick up on the name "Mr. Darcy" from the Bridget Jones movies.

I think we will rent the Colin Firth version and have a little education! Jane Austin is always good for young ladies!

D has been gone for 3 nights now and I reallly miss her. She did pop in a few times for a change of clothes, but that is about all.

Today S finishes his summer session, and he is off to road trip with friends to SF and then to Santa Cruz. My life as "a woman alone" is starting already!

It is a good thing I have so much homework to do!
SG

Hey SG!
HOT enough for ya??

101 yesterday, was 117 in Palm Springs I heard. egads, wheres the rain. ha ha

Sounds like your D is having a blast!! ohhh to be young again!! well that young! she has so much life ahead of her, dont you sometimes wish we could do it over again? well some of it?

Can relate to your woman alone life! my S although living here, is either at work or out w/ friends, they did midnight bowling last night, then out to eat, where does the energy come from?

Yup your H is def like mine, I say wth or worse! most every time I encounter him lately! hey but SG, come on now, He wants to see clearly now the rain has gone, he wants to see all obsticles in the way. haha, prob butchered that song!

Sounds like you are doing well SG, keep up the good work
and thanks for your pat on the back on my thread!!

Love and summer hugs

Your post reminded me of a funny story re HOs. While X was pretending that 'I swear on our kid's life that I am not having an affair'...d and I both knew he was lying but weren't calling him on it, so he was thinking he had outfoxed us. Ho had sent him some refrigerator magnets of cats (she has two)and he had them on...his refrigerator. So D was visiting and she points to the magnets and says: ewwww dad, what are those tacky things doing on your fridge? And he sputtered for just a sec while he said: oh I just got them out of a cereal box!

These guys are in such a state of denial...and they believe their own stories. I wish I had confronted X, but I was under the delusion that 'a Ho is just a symptom and it lasts only a few months'. I now believe that calling your spouse on his(or her) adultery is the ONLY way to have any chance of his ending it. It seems they get off on 'pulling one over on the old ball and chain'. It is the 3 year old child in them that likes to feel they are putting one over on mom?

Glad you are getting financials while there is still good communication (well.....communication of sorts) between you.
Keep trucking, girlfriend!
gd

I agree wqith GD 100%. While I confronted STBX about his affair, he denied it. We BOTH knew he was lying yet I allowed him to remain in the house and live with us while acting "as if". All he ended up doing was getting angrier and angrier.

When they think they'll get away with that kind of behavior, they stop loving us. I wish I'd have kicked him out the day I found out. It may not have changed what ultimately happened, but I wouldn't have felt like such a damned fool for having put up with it.

I honestly think that by trying to keep our marriage and families together we actually help them to leave it. I agree, calling them on their adultery is the only way to have a chance at fixing your marriage.

Hey SG,

You are doing so great! I'm glad you're getting the financials out of the way. Your H has to learn, like all the others, that yes, there are consequences. I bet once you're out of his life, he's going to really miss what he had. Might take a while, but I do firmly believe that's what happens to all of them.

We all gave our spouses way too many chances and look where it got us. Well, we are better off than them, aren't we?

At least we know what we do want and don't want out of life. They'll be out there trying to figure it all out while life passes them by. Ironic, b/c that's the one thing they're all afraid of...life going by too fast and missing out on SOMETHING. When that something they're searching for was right in front of them all the time. Sad.

Anyway, you sound great, girlfriend! Take care of yourself!

love,
SE

Well folks,

time to pull myself up out of the basement. I just spent a week with my family, my sisters, nieces and mom. Chicago was HOT and MUGGY but it was good to see everyone. They are all being very supportive of me and my situation.

Still busy with school and whatnot, and it is late! Just wanted to say "HI" and I hope every one is keeping COOL!

SG

Well Hey SG!
Glad you dragged yourself up from the basement!

You certainly do not belong there!

Glad you had a good time in Chicago! Nothing like being w/ family to lift your spirits ( well to some degree

) Always wanted to visit Chicago- on my list.

Sounds like all is quiet on the ailen front, hope your summer is movin along, IS IT HOT ENOUGH FOR YA??
eesh, we have even had thunder/lightning storms, which is unheard of here!

Do not be a stranger SG, we'll miss ya

Hi Karen! Are we going to get a chance to meet, finally? Won't that be GREAT!?!

The heat has been unbearable. It always gets hot here in the summer, and I have always been able to handle it because, I am a teacher, and I am USUALLY on VACATION! So it doesn't matter that the heat takes everything out of me and makes me move as slow as a slug and all I want to do is siesta!

BUT this summer I am so BLEEPING BUSY! and I have to THINK! and it is TOO HOT! and I don't have AC! Tho I may break down and buy a room unit later today!

Fortunately it cools down at night and the early AM is quite comfortable, chilly even! So this is what saves me and this is when I get my writing done...unless I am playing hookey and posting on the board!

Talk to you soon,
SG

Oh Goddess,

You know how it gets here in the summer. So muggy that you can cut it with a knife and there is never even a cool down at night. I just say Bless the person who invented central air! I don't care how much my bills is, a good nights sleep is so worth it to me.

So will you be an empty nester when your daughter goes to school? I'm just not sure if your son lives at home as a communter student. I'm getting kind of excited. I have 1 more year with my youngest daughter and then she is off to college. Not so long ago I never thought that I would feel this way but now I see it as an adventure for me. My whole world will change and who knows where that will lead. I guess I'm as ready as I'm ever going to be..........

How do you feel about it?

Love,
Bethie

Just journaling here...

It is good to be back in my humble California Ranch Tract Home! The teenagers did not burn down the house while I was gone! And in fact everything looked great. The kids did a nice job of supporting each other, S cooked meals for D as he is on vacation and she is working several jobs. I was helping out my sister who had surgery last week and I had forgotten what it is like to have 2 little ones under the age of 10 to take care of! LOL ! It is exhausting! (Sis is fine, btw)

It was fun to see my family tho, haven't seen my mom or my other sis in 2 years. My mom is interesting to hang out with. 77 yrs old, chain smokes and drinks like a fish. One of the things I did that my sister usually does is buy my moms groceries and monthly liquor supply. 1 1/2 gallons of "Old Fitzgerald" and 3 bottles of vermouth! But believe it or not she has a sharp mind and a sharp wit...and a few "Personality quirks" In spite of her terrible lifestyle, she remains reasonably healthy...to the astonishment of her children!

I was reading David Sedaris the other day. In one of his books he has an essay called, "A Plague of Tics" where he talks about his OCD. He states that most of his symptoms went away when he started smoking! I really think that explains my mom...she is a bit OCD...I think I have mentioned how we 3 girls get alarmed at her "Howard Hughes" like behaviour sometimes.

In any event, she is my Mom. And I, as the oldest, have always had an extremely difficult time getting along with her. So much so, that I moved away at a very young age. I was 17 when I moved to Colorado, which is about a 2 day drive from Chicago. We have never been close, there has always been some fundamental differences in how we view the world. I think her obsessive worrying really turned me off, for example. She would worry about the most ridiculous things, but then she would worry about normal things as well. As a child I could not distinguish between the reasonable worries and the crazy ones, so I rejected them all. (A crazy worry was that if you opened a car window while driving down the freeway, the air would suck you out the window.) A reasonable worry was that something "bad" would happen to me if I took public transportation into Chicago at night. For all her worrying, she was remarkably reluctant to leave her apartment. From the earliest age, I was sent outside to play, with no supervision. My mom grew up in a very small town in Iowa, and she somehow thought the city of Chicago was just as safe.

In 4th grade I was beat up by another girl in the park, in 5th grade mugged by 3 teenagers who stole my purse, and in 6th grade was flashed by a weirdo at the park. The time I was mugged by the 3 teenagers, I was astonished by the fact that there were adults all over the place, and no one did anything. This was at the Lincoln Park Zoo. It was obvious that these 3 much bigger kids were intimidating the smaller kids, and they grabbed my purse and ran. I shouted, "Stop, thief!" just like in the movies, but no one did.

We bummed a dime from someone to call the police. I thought that was what you did when you were robbed...but this being Chicago, and us being little kids, all the police did was give us a ride to the edge of their district, instead of the extra 20 blocks that would have gotten us home.

ANYWAY...

In spite of all that, I have always wanted my Mom's approval. Don't we all? And I FINALLY after 48 years have it. For the first time in my life, she has told me that she admires me and is impressed by me. None of my other accomplishments have meant anything to her...but now that I am in grad school and handling the kids and managing this difficult time so well, she is impressed.

And you know what? It feels good to have that now, in my life!

SG

Hi Beth!

Yeah, that humidity is a killer! If I lived in the Midwest I would not have held out against the AC for so long....

My son claims he will be moving out in October. He is 19, so that is fine with me. If (and notice I said "if"

) he does, then I will be an empty nester.

I have mixed feelings. I love my kids and I really enjoy them as people. I will definitely miss them! But all it takes is for me to walk into the messy bathroom, or find dishes at the computer or in the living room, or find socks all over the place, and I start to think that living alone will be JUST FINE!

Between now and December I will be incredibly busy with school. I still have to finish up 6 units this summer, then 6 more in the fall, which will include my research project, my portfolio, and mentoring a colleague in educational technology! If I can pull all that off I graduate Dec. 16th!

So I think if I can keep my nose to the grindstone I will be too busy to miss my darlings. After December, tho it will be a whole 'nother ball game.

I suppose I will be busy trying to find a "real" job!

I actually enjoy living alone...We will see what happens. If you want, we can start a support group for empty nesters!

See you in October!
SG

SG,
I loved your post also. I was always looking for approval from my dad. I must have gotten it at some point because his will stated that if anything happened to him and his wife, their son would come to me. I was so surprised to find that out!!!

I'm going to try really hard to make it to the CA party. I'm dieing to meet both you and Karen.

Thanks for sharing SG.

Jill

Hey SG,
You are so right about children are always seeking approval from their parents, I know I do. My parents are amazed on how well I am handling my pending divorce. The only thing that I am happy about is that I haven't done anything to be ashamed of...at least not yet. I am a self proclaiming daddy's girl and would never do anything that may upset my parents.

Jill,
My dad told me the same thing! I have a 12 year old little sister whom I love to death, but I just pray to God that she never have to move in with me!

Cheryl

Well my friends,

Time again to get out of the basement...I have very little to talk about these days...school/work/career is going great I am really enjoying my studies, getting involved in cutting edge research that has to do with video/technology and education. Meeting leaders from around the state who are in my field. AND staying VERY busy.

I haven't actually talked to or seen H since I returned from Chicago! It feels great, really. I have been SO overwhelmingly busy with school that I haven't had a chance to do the time-consuming running down of paperwork for the actuarial evaluation. But I will do that week after next, when school is done. I get a very short break, then back in the thick of things...My hours have increased from 25 to 38 for next year. Plus I get lots of professional growth credit from all the school I have been doing...so I should see a significant raise in my income.

D and I go to SLO the weekend after Labor Day.

Definately mixed feelings there, I will miss her I am sure, but I think it will simplify my life to some extent.

IF every thing goes according to plan, I graduate on DEC 16 TH!!!!!!! Then Look out world!

I have been getting inspired from AG and her sprinkler system and patio...H was so bad with money, we never had anything for home improvement. I now realize that he was probably spending big bucks on OGIRL... He always kept some of his $$ separate...supposedly to go into the kids college fund, but that is woefully low!

So I see changes on the horizon...and none too soon.

Take care all,

SG

Some of you may recall that I served My H by mail back in June...Because we are doing mediation, and also because this was stipulated in the papers, the regular 30 day for response didn't apply. I was WAY too busy this summer to deal with anything, anyway...and I think H was too. I just finished all my summer obligations on Friday, and Saturday was my first day of summer vacation... (All you teachers out there can understand when I say this was rough for me to work all summer!)

Last night I was watching a video with S and H called. He wanted to know if he could meet me somewhere and give me the papers. So we arranged to meet at a cafe downtown. I got there a litte early and ordered a salad and a glass of wine.
H got there and did the same. We had a pleasant dinner, and chit-chatted about his upcoming hike on Mt. Shasta. He is going next week with a buddy, and he brought along his maps and guide book.

Once dinner was over and the plates cleared we started to talk. H told me that he always thought that he would be able to "step out and then we could reconcile and he could come back" He told me he was sorry for the pain he caused me (again!) He acknowledged how hard it must have been for me to 1) give him the ring back and 2) fill out and serve the papers. He said he was sorry, he didn't mean to drag his feet on this, it was just so hard on him, and he really didn't want a divorce.

I told him that I had been willing to reconcile for a LONG time and I gave him MANY chances, but he had never been able to reach my bottom line, which is no girlfriend. I reminded him of all the times he lied to me about her being out of his life and wanting to make a life with me. Like the time we were in his Mother's house, and he held me and told me, "I choose you" This whole time, H is on the verge of tears, occasionally wiping his eyes, but I am miraculously remaining calm, and firm and steady.

We talked about our lives together. He said he appreciated every thing I have done for us as a family, and how great I was. I asked him if that was the case, why couldn't he drop the girlfriend and make a commitment to me? I told him I ALWAYS gave 100% to him and to our family. and that is what I wanted from him. I wanted a VOW of honesty and commitment, but for some reason, he is/was unable to give that to me. I told him, "You're STILL involved with her! your piano is at her house!" he said, "Aww that is just a consolation prize."

We chatted some more. I told him about another couple we are good friends with who recently separated. H made a rude comment that made me glad I am divorcing him. He said, "what happened, did C get fat? She was starting to put on the pounds."

I said, "Yeah, that is a good reason to break up!" but they aren't breaking up, they are in counseling and I have good hopes for them.

H told me that the symbolic thing for us breaking up is the burning the string between two candles that he got the day of our wedding. You know, those candle pairs that are dipped into wax and are on the same wick? H bought a small pair of those on our wedding day. He told me he always imagined them being together until one of us died, and then they would be separated and one burned in memory of the other. He has always kept the candles in a box on his dresser. He had brought the box and candles along so that we could burn them apart.

We walked to the park and talked about the kids. Finally we burned the candles. H gave me a hug, walked me to my car, and that was that.

Hi SG,

Sounds like H has finally got the point. His fantasy of "step out/reconcile/come back" won't be continuing. I can't believe he actually said that to you!

Glad to see STBXH didn't use the potential loophole of not having the 30 day rule apply to protract the proceedings any longer than he did. XW dragged it out so much that I ended up having to do everything to finalize what she started. Oh well, it did get done that way after all.

The symbolic candle burning seems to indicate some real level of acceptance on his behalf. Your post sounds like it qualifies for one of those "Official goodbye stories" found in the thread started by LastResort a short while back (here in Surviving, of course).

You sound real good. How you handled the meeting shows a lot of strength. Still, it has to be kinda tough, so (((((SG))))).

Summer break notwithstanding, perhaps is was better that you were extra busy this summer, maybe helping you through all this that way. Just a thought. But you now have some vacation, right? Go get it! I'm envious....in private postsecondary we go all year round.

Have a great Sunday!

Rob

Oh, BTW....what exactly is "educational technology"?

Hi SG,
Just catching up on your busy summer! I'm exhausted just reading about it.
Dontcha just hate that the walkaways are such cowards about everything? At least yours has apologized for hurting you.

You sound full of p and vinegar and ready to burst out of that cocoon! When my d went off to college I really didn't feel much of the empty nest syndrome...i was a very hand's on mama bear while she was at home, but I always thought that college was 'time' for kids to spread their wings and hopefully use the sense we try to pound into them while they live under our roof. I also think that most of us sacrificed a lot of what we wanted to do for our kids and our spouses, so when the kids fly, i think we feel a little sense of relief that we can start making ourselves more of a priority.

Glad to hear your hard work is going to pay off in a better salary!
gd

Hi Rob,

Thank you for the thoughtful post. Yeah, I think at this point my H is full of sorrow and regret, but he just doesn't have the balls it takes to do the right thing and leave the floozy in the dust. He was wistful and positive about our 20 years together and he repeatedly said how great our lives were. I finally, at one point said, "if it was so great, why couldn't you do what you needed to do to fix the situation and dump the girl?" He sadly answered, "that is the million dollar question, isn't it" I told him that I still thought that counseling would be benificial for him, and he said, "Yeah, my mom thinks so too!"

Today as I was thinking things over I realized that DBing really has helped me through this whole process. I can honestly say that I can imagine spending time with him (for example at D's college functions) and being OK with it. Although I was sad about the whole business, I really feel like I am at yet another milestone of detachment, and at this point I really do want the best not only for me and the kids, but also for him.

He had made a big mess out of his life, and I hope that he will be able to recover and come out the other side a more mature and less selfish man. Hey, I can hope, can't I?

I have a few 3 day trips planned over the next 2 weeks, then get busy and get ready for school. Classes for my masters start the 26th and classes for where I teach start the 29th.

Educational Technology is just a fancy name for computer teacher! I teach "curriculum integration using technology" and I train teachers how to do it. I also will be qualified to do "distance learning" when I am all done.

Talk to you later,
SG

SG,
You handled that last meeting like the goddess you are, with dignity and grace. If I ever get a finally meeting with my STBX, I hope I will handle it like you did. I agree that DBing has really helped me. I shudder to think where I would be without Michele's books and this site.

I don't understand why these WAS could think that they could lie, cheat and steal but their LBS would still want them in their lives. My STBX said something very similar to what your STBX said to you, he wanted to remain close friends once the D was finalized. Friends?

Well enjoy your couple of weeks of freedom before you have to return to school.
Cheryl

Hi gd,

Thanks for the visit!

I have mixed feelings about D going away. . .

I am sure I will miss her, but I am also sure she will get some much needed growing up here, and she will really enjoy college!

We went shopping for her dorm sheets yesterday. The dorms have "extra-long twin" beds and need special sheets. We went to Linens and Things, and there was nothing she liked. There was always something wrong. Then we went to Bed Bath and Beyond...still no go. Finally we went to Macy's and found 100% cotton sheets, the right size, and a normal color. This took ALL DAY! I was sympathetic because the dorm sheets offered were in horrible electric colors that would keep me awake at night, so I understood, BUT!

I called her the princess and the pea. She just half heartedly laughed.

So some things I will be glad to let go of!

Oh, did I mention the mess that seems to follow her from room to room?

It is a good thing I will be busy this fall, or there would just be too much empty space.
Really, I am happy for her and I am looking forward to my next phase of life.
3 years ago I was looking forward to an empty nest and more time w/H. Well, that didn't happen. So now, empty nest and more time for ME!

Are you going to the SoCal DB party in October?

It would be cool to meet...I am still considering it strongly.

Take care,
SG

(((SG)))
You handled the contact with STBX beautifully. Kudos to you!!!

It really does sound like he understands what he's lost.
And you're right, it's very difficult to be "friends" with someone who hurt us so badly.

You sound great!!!

Hi SG,

He actually said the he thought he can just step out and then reconcile and then he can come back??? Now that the door is finally closed, he puts out the big guns...by talking to you and showing tears..This is what happens once they knew they spent their last dime. So sad..too bad..

We both will have empty houses this fall. My S18 will be moving into his dorm next Wednesday, the 24th. S18 will only be 30 miles away though and he can always come home during the weekends. My STBXH will be our pack mule to haul S18 stuff to the dorm (refrigerator, computer, clothes, etc.)

I just talked to my H's attorney and I will pick up the paperwork from their office. So my D paperwork is on its way. It's ok...I have had two years to think about it and even though I still don't want the D, I will not get in his way. At least I will no longer be in limbo. No use trying to hold on to an M when there is only one person trying. It just does not work. Maybe, he can finally face his issues once I am out of the picture.

I am glad to hear you will be getting a hefty raise. And graduate studies is just around the corner. I wanted to attend at least one of the DB gathering but since it will be in October, I don't know if I can swing it with work and trying to see my folks before they go back to the Philippines in October. Not very likely I can go. God bless you Goddess.

Love,
Hopie

SG!!
Hey you! Wow! Quite the chat w/ STBX uh? amazing, yet what is amazing is I am not surprised! My STBX a few months back, sat across a table from me and said, I still want a divorce, BUT its so that we can have a much better chance of getting back together in the future,,,Say What??

Sooo, nothing surprises me anymore, and you are right, your H dosnt seem to be able to get to that next step--- one day, he will for sure want to and I have a feeling you will have moved on, way on!

Glad your daughter got her sheets! I have seen these electric colors at work! egads, how does anyone relax in colors like shocking pink and super orange? lol

You sound good as usual SG, I sure hope you will be able to make it in Oct. It would be such a pleasure to meet you!!

Hi Hopie!

I am in vacation mode for a little bit here, not checking the boards so often. Thanks for the visit! Well, not only is my DD leaving on September 9th, but S announced the other day that he wants to move out by the end of August. D's comment, "He wants to beat me out!"

And, yeah, she is probably right about that. The 19 yr old doesn't like the 17 yr old passing him by.

I am visiting my friend up on the North Coast and heading back home today. We spent a fabulous afternoon at the beach, it was overcast and a little chilly! A big change from the 100+ I have been sweltering through in my area!
I actually almost didn't pack enough warm clothes! only by putting on a lot of layers was I able to stay warm.

It was great seeing my friend. She will be moving further away in about a month, so I will miss her. She has been my sanctuary to run to throughout this entire mess. But I feel like the worst is over and I am really looking forward to my future!

We chatted girl talk last night...and I got started on what I am looking for in a man!

I can't believe I have come so far! I am too busy for anyone right now, but after graduation, LOOK OUT!

Well, it is fun to imagine a new future.

And it is fun to imagine my house without teenage mess everywhere. I will turn my S's room into an office when he moves out. That will be just the ticket for my studies and work!

SG

Karen!

LOL! I have seen these electric colors at work! egads, how does anyone relax in colors like shocking pink and super orange?

She kept on looking at them and saying, "Yuck, I can't sleep in anything so ugly!" and plus they were all poly/cotton blends, and she is a 100% cotton kind of gal.

Well, thanks for the visit! I will have to see what is up in Karen's world, and check your thread.

Take care,
sg

Hi Goddess,

You are sounding so good and so strong! Boy this sure has been a long hard road, but we've made it. We are the lucky ones to have found this board and all of this great support! I have no idea how anyone who doesn't have this comes through.

As for your husband, I do feel sad for him. To know that you are probably making the biggest mistake of your life, and yet be powerless to do anything to change the course is something that I will never understand.

I have 1 more year with my youngest until she also flies the coop. It's sad but exciting at the same time. If anyone told me that I would be this conflicted, I would never have believed them. I've always felt that my son and I kind of grew up together, then my middle one came along for the ride & we had so much fun. My baby however is just that my baby and the time with her was just a bleep on the radar screen.

Nobody ever tells you how deeply you will love your children.........sigh.

Take care Goddess. You are the best!

Love,
Bethie

Hello friends!

My all to brief vacation is over and now my life is in overdrive for the rest of the year. The first day of school (Where I work) was Monday, and as usual I had such a great time seeing all the kiddos. I really love that aspect of my job!

I don't know exactly what kind of work I will be doing when I graduate, I know it will have something to do with education, but I am fairly certain I won't be able to continue doing what I do and support myself. In my area (which has a HIGH cost of living) my job is not suitable for someone who is on their own. Our district has lots of jobs that are funded at a level for someone who either a) is working a supplemental job so that they can be involved with their kids school or b) is working an entry level job so that they can say they have experience in the school system.
These jobs are typically filled by Stay at Home Moms who have advanced degrees and just want to work a few hours to be involved with their kids schools. Since our area has no shortage of this kind of worker, there is little interest on the districts part in fully funding these positions.
ANYWAY I digress. I just know that I won't be able to continue doing what I do now, and part of me is a little sad about that since I love what I do.

Speaking of a little sad...My D is getting ready to go away in 10 days. She is saying goodbye to her friends and her teachers. Yesterday she had her last piano lesson. We LOVE her teacher! D spent almost an entire day making a hand-made card for her teacher and wrote a very lovely note. Yesterday when she came home from her lesson, she was a little sad. She had to spend some time in her room, alone.

She also will have to say goodbye to her riding instructor, someone she has been working with and riding with since she was 13.

At this point I think the saying goodbye part is overwhelming the great new experiences part! <sigh>

My Master's is in the final stretch. I have to complete my research project and write it up, plus I have to mentor someone this semester. Then graduation on December 16th!

If everything goes right I will be graduated and divorced by 2006. Then on to bigger and brighter things!

Well friends, I have been SO busy lately, not much time to post, but I do read people's threads...Love and strength and hugs to those of you who need it! (You know who you are!) and Love and strength and hugs and congratulations to those of you starting new adventures! (Quo and AG!

)

SG

Hi Goddess,

So great to hear from you. I understand the sadness that you feel on seeing your daughter off to school. It ends a chapter that we can never get back. However, I now realize that when we do get our kids back, they are now somewhat different people. I find now that I am one of the first people that my son will call to share any news with, or to vent, or even seek advice. That's a far cry from those teenage years when the were so guarded and everything that we said or did P'd them off.

How exciting to be about to embark on a whole new life. It's kind of like a second shot at things. This time I plan on playing my cards very carefully. I have no doubt that with you being the person you are, wonderful things will come your way!

Take care...........

Love,
Bethie

Hi SG,
It's so exciting that you've almost accomplished your goals!!! Wow, I admire your perseverence. My goal, at this point, is to retire and find something I love doing. I'm thinking life guard, jet ski rentals, bartender, cruise director....

I'm sure you'll find a job that will work out for you.

Just tell your potential employers that you're a "Goddess"!!!

Hey SG!
You are an awesome Goddess for sure!
What accomplihsments you have tackled,and you did it , rasing your C and going thru this nasty MLC!

I bow you to you my goddess lol
Really you should be proud, now see THIS is what its about, watching people like you, dust off and not only get on w/ their life, but get on w/ it even better then before!

go gettem girl!