I don't know the what's and why's of how this r has reached this place.
I don't know if h is in mlc, ow withdrawal, never truly cared etc... and it serves me no good trying to figure it all out.
I am taking back my life.
when h first left I was ok (maybe it was denial) I went out was happy did my own thing etc...
then reallity set in that h wasn't comming home and I got lost...on came the anxiety attacks (passed out one morning while alone with the kids due to information overload) loosing weight so fast that others were concerned, not sleeping etc.
but as time went on I accepted the sit...I was living for me doing my thing, enjoying my life despite the fact that I wanted h in it, stopped asking him to come home and started asking him to just get on with the d.
h came to me wanting to try again...I stayed lovingly distant for a while..but as time went on and h started comming home more and more and finally started to live here once again I let go of me and put the focus back on "us" h is not ready to deal with "us"
I must get back to the place I was when h first came home...I must keep my distance from h until he is ready if that time comes great if not I'll deal with it when I'm ready to.
so back to me...I sent in the application to volunteer for the ambulance company and just called to make sure the got the ap.. seems they will accept me, I just have to meet with the director (who taught the cpr course I took) for a tour of the facility and some other things, fill out a few forms and get into an emt course. I'm physched!!!
the dining room is my project for now..it will keep me busy nights for the next few weeks.
this week
mon night paint dining room (h may be out plowing and not home til tommorow, may stay at his appartment)
tues night c appointment then stop by home depot for paint for the china cabinet
wed night paint dining room
thurs night movies with a friend "how to lose a guy in ten days" should be a trip!
fri night paint dining room
sat night did have plans to go to a comedy show with another couple but they got sold out so ??? paint??
sunday go to mass 10 am!!!! ??????
just incase your wondering why so much painting in the dining room it has a chair rail and wainscotting so theres a lot to do, plus it's a brand new house with builders flat paint so the first coat get's sucked right in.
making a better life for me...h may join if not...his loss!!
I will be pleasant
I will be kind
I will be considerate
I will be possitive
I will do my own thing
I will be me!!
? should I bother to make him breakfast anymore??? I don't want him to think I hate him that after all was his justification for ea well at least one of his justifications. mlc or what??
LL backing off h!!
Oops...posted on your old thread...
Quote:
I was curious about this...wanting a little more info. Does he really say nothing? You know, in a way, he sounds like a lost soul, LL, drifting through life... It's entirely possible that when you say this and that to him about what you think his feelings are, he really doesn't know them himself, so he doesn't respond. Maybe the question is, how does one bring him back to the land of the living? Maybe the answer is to engage his other senses, that it really isn't your R, LL? From what you say, it sounds like he is (and will be with OM) this way with everyone. It sounds like he needs to engage life a little bit...get a taste of something he's been "overlooking" for seemingly many years. Maybe OW was simply a destraction from this pain?
don't really know how to answer all this.
for the most part yes h really says nothing and mostly it is because he doesn't have any answers.
for the most part I see that h has very superficial r's with people, I don't know the true nature of the r he had with ow, maybe he was able to be open and talk to her I don't know.
it is not my job to pull h into the land of the living I've been doing that for 10 years I'm done trying to get him to live.
I always had a life...worked, went to college, had friends, went to parties, had parties, danced, sang, made new frieds, worked out (roller blading and gym) etc...h simply sat idly by when he would come to parties he'd fall asleep or get drunk, when I would visit him at his house he'd fall asleep, when he'd visit me at my house I'd fall asleep. when I turned 21 I started to frequent a local bar made some new friends and played darts and had a ball...when h would come he would sit up at the bar while I socialized, some people there didn't know he was with me. imagine going to a bar full of men with your girl and sitting at the bar while she plays dart with them???
I don't know what h wants of this r if he wants anything at all of it.
right now from what h has said he is here because he needs to be here. basically doing the right thing for the family. this in the end will not make h happy nor will it make me happy.
I've given up on h. it's been far to long.
LL
interesting?
it's snowing and of course h needs to plow however the snow isn't supposed to end till somewhere around 11pm.
h left about 11am and didn't plan to come home, intended to stay at his apartment and then go out plowing from there. of course this disturbs me and further sends the message to me that h just doesn't want to be with me.
I let him know ok fine we'll see you tommorow night then. h says what do you mean I said I'll be home sometime in the morning (I know how these storms work) anyway another session of me talking and h with nothing to say.
I let h know how it is that I feel and how what he says and doesn't say re-enforce what I feel and unlike he thinks it is not isolated insident after all I would be a hypocrite if I was just mad because he went out sat night...that it is a compilation of things said and not said done and not done.
let him know that what seems to be the only way for me to survive in this r is to just shut down..to accept that my h doesn't want to talk to me to be with me or to "be" with me but that doing that may lead to trouble as I am a fun person, attractive, smart, likeable, sexy etc...and once I leave this house to go to work etc...someone is sure to notice that and what then do I do...say no I am married and accepting the fact that my desire to be wanted and needed and desired aren't being fullfilled but I accept it??
h says he's trying? I say h all I'm asking is that you talk to me..there never seems to be a good time so I say why not go to a c..that would be shceduled time to talk..do I want to drag up old baggage? no...I simply want to sit down and find out how we can each make the other happy...as it seems neither one of us wants to leave so since we don't want to leave why not do something to make it so we are happy?
told him I am done trying...I will live my life for me...h said nothing and so I said goodnight h.
h said he would call later to say goodnight to the kids.
the phone rang saw that it was h so I gave son the phone...
son daddy are you comming to my house?
son drops phone on the floor
I give phone to dd who says bla bla bla and then walks away..
h asks what sons problem is...
son is 3 that's what his problem is...I just said he wanted you to come home.
well h says he's leaving in a half hour and will be home...he'll wait out the storm here and then go out.
thing is that both kids will already be asleep by the time he gets here so why come as he wont be here when they wake and I've already told him I'm done??
I scratch my head and wonder WTF????
I still plan to paint tonight...I have nothing left to say to h.
ball dropped.
I don't get it, h only wants to be with me when I give up??? when I say that I will be ok without him, that I don't need him? it baffles me truly baffles me.
LL who doesn't have an alien on her hands but a real weirdo!!
Thought I would drop by your new digs, LL!
Quote:
well h says he's leaving in a half hour and will be home...he'll wait out the storm here and then go out.
thing is that both kids will already be asleep by the time he gets here so why come as he wont be here when they wake and I've already told him I'm done??
Because he wants to be with you. Guys can be very stupid about expressing themselves to their spouses. Believe me - I'm one of them!
Quote:
I don't get it, h only wants to be with me when I give up??? when I say that I will be ok without him, that I don't need him? it baffles me truly baffles me.
You're detaching from him - your sitch. He knows it and is trying to react to it the only way he knows how - by spending time with you. In a way it's a good thing but you want more. Frankly LL,
you deserve more. To borrow something from my work with the outplacement service - he does not have your skill set. To put a humorous spin on it:
- The wheel is turning but the hamster is d**d!
- He's a few fries short of a Happy Meal!
- He's two tacos short of a combo platter!
But what can you do? I like the items that you listed at the beginning of the thread - especially the one about the volunteer EMS. Spread your wings, LL!
I am far from a Christian person but I particularly like one of their sayings on the BB:
Let go, Let God.
Protect yourself - protect those wonderful children of yours. I need to go fix dinner for mine...
P.S. - Really this CyberSitter software W put on our home computers!
LL.
Quote:
it is not my job to pull h into the land of the living I've been doing that for 10 years I'm done trying to get him to live.
Agreed. What I was kind of meaning (which I guess wasn't very clear) is that when you begin to really detach and do things for LL, maybe he'll gravitate towards you a bit more. He'll see you doing X, Y, and Z and want to participate. Was this the LL when your H first came home and seemed to be attentive for a few weeks?
Quote:
I always had a life...worked, went to college, had friends, went to parties, had parties, danced, sang, made new friends, worked out (roller blading and gym) etc...
Okay...I guess I questioned the "extent" to which you have done this because of something else you wrote:
Quote:
it is funny that when I tell people I am insecure they don't believe me
when I tell people I am shy they don't believe me.
when I tell people that I feel anxious when going out to parties and social gatherings they don't believe me.
My point in saying this is that doing the opposite of these things is a 180 for you. So, right now with all the activities you've listed in other posts, it certainly sounds like you are doing 180s. Were you doing these 180s when your H came back, then kind of stopped...only to restart recently? Is it possible that you fell into some of the usual R patterns of the past?
Just wondering...
jethro
Quote:
Is it possible that you fell into some of the usual R patterns of the past?
yup! foolishly I expected that i would be h's friend not his only friend of course becuase he is not mine. but I had hoped that we would do things together and be like best friends or at least close.
I still go out at least once a week and do my own thing although when h first came around there were nights when I would take off by myself and go to the movies or to a bar to play darts (can't do that cause it will lead to trouble feeling the way I do, last time I wasn't there 15 min shooting darts by myself and a man asked to play with me)
don't mind going to the movies alone (actually I recomend it now)
I don't want to just go out all the time with my friends or myself and have my fun elsewhere...I want for h to be a part of my life...yes I want my own life and for him to have his...but I would like for OUR life to be more than put the kids to bed and then turn on the tv and that is the way it is unless I say let's go out (actually it's a 180 for him to accept, as before even when we'd get an invitation he'd decline...but hell I'd still go)
I wonder what if anything h will have to say to me tonight.
could be good, could be bad...I'm actually not even expecting him to say anything..once dd falls asleep I'm going to start painting. (have to wait til she's asleep as I don't want to have to go to pick her up while I have painty hands)
LL
LL,
I for one second the guys opinion: we are sometimes just very slow. It is good that you keep a low expectation. On the other hand, your H is trying. He even admitted he was trying. That is some pride to swallow... (sorry, another guy talk as we tend to stick to beer bottle and little jokes rather than admitting that we are smushy
)
Wish you good night painting. I sensed that your H noticed your change. He will catch up...
Chuck
h is a strange one...he came...he lit fire..commented on my painting (wonder if I'm just making a big mess that I'll end up painting over anyway, oh ms doubtful that I am) get this one the man who likes all white walls and thought the room looked fine the way it was said "it looks good" "it's different, different is good" do do do do (twilight zone theme)
so he sat and flipped through the news channels lit a fire..I went in to sneak a butt (only smoke in the house when the fire is lit and sit basically on top of it) h asks how much longer I'll be painting...a little bit..h says he's gonna sleep for a bit has to get up about 1 or so for plowing...will the alarm bother me or should he bring the alarm down to the couch? (HELLO IS THERE ANYBODY HOME??) I told him it was his choice.
h again commented on the dining room and gave me a kiss on the cheek??
say something damn it!!! speak!
ok then so ??? I don't get it, don't get it, and know I wont be getting it tonight
though I would love a massage but wont ask cause for some reason h's massages never stay innocent.
so I still don't know what's going on here but I continue to take my stance the ball is in h's hands now!!
LL
LL, sounds like you are having fun painting...and h said it was nice...gave you a kiss..keep doing things for you..you have come along way since last summer...some bad days, but hopefully more good ones..
Sue
How's LL today? Sounds like maybe your H was attempting to volley with the ball in his court last night?!?!
jethro
well all I can say is that h left some time in the wee hours to go out plowing...I was asleep but obviously not asleep enough because I remember h leaving...when he left h came over to me kissed my forhead and let me know he was going that he'd call later...and then asked if he could have a hug before he left...I sleepily obliged. h called this am to see how things were going round here...kaos!!! now I know why they invented school...to keep moms from going insane!! summer can't get here fast enough.
when h called he did ask if I had plans for tonight...I have a c appointment at 7 so let him know, then asked why he said just wondering. so maybe I shook something up with my taking a stance don't know...will have you know though that after all the things that I said to him..I let him know that
I've never hated him (he thought I did over the summer)
I've always loved him, respected him, admired him, and appreciated him.
maybe it was a dobson letter in words I don't know. still not expecting anything...
so far I've done a good job not making any mention of valentines day at all!!! hope I can hold it together if the day comes and goes with nothing from him.
that's all for now!!
LL
Quoting lostlove:
when he left h came over to me kissed my forhead and let me know he was going that he'd call later...and then asked if he could have a hug before he left...
LL, there's somebody in there, I just know it!
rjj
Quoting lostlove:
...I remember h leaving...when he left h came over to me kissed my forhead and let me know he was going that he'd call later...and then asked if he could have a hug before he left...
...when h called he did ask if I had plans for tonight...
...so maybe I shook something up with my taking a stance don't know...still not expecting anything...
Just sit back and watch. While your H may never be comfortable with verbal expression, he seems to be more comfortable with responding by making positive changes in his actions. The key here is to catch him when he is doing it right and letting him know how you appreciate it. Then he is less likely to stall out by thinking there is nothing he can do to make you feel better, and then it will become less likely you will have to jumpstart the cycle all over again.
I was a bit more long winded when responding to Bob last night, but afterwards the words came to me ... encouragement to be more attentive towards each other on a personal level is the first step to sparking a higher level of intimacy in the R from which is the source of those feelings you wish to nurture.
'til later,
KAW
let's see now...my h spent what he admits to being 3 times a week at this womans house for 30min or so and talking to her on the phone on a daily basis (and you know it wasn't to see how her kids were or to say what time he'd be home) left me and somehow was able to communicate to her his feelings for her whithout so much as a kiss...a passionate embrace??? am I a friggen loonatic or something...
this is why either want the words to come from h or for h to admit that his r with ow was infact a pa and not simply the ea he expects me to think it.
at this point I do not believe ow is totaly gone...maybe he doesn't see her as often or talk to her as often or at all but ow is indeed still there...she may never go away...and I do not want to have half a h.
if h doesn't love me the way he wants to love a woman then there really is no point and that is why I take my stance. he is free to do whatever it is that makes him happy. in the end it will be his loss cause ow isn't much of a woman!!
LL
Quote:
this is why either want the words to come from h or for h to admit that his r with ow was infact a pa and not simply the ea he expects me to think it.
LL, Based on what I've read on this board and in Michele's books, I doubt that either you or I will ever hear these words.
Aha! I’ve got it. There’s a central commissary where all of our WASs, betraying Ss, and distancing spouses go to eat the same common slop that turns their brains to mush and messes up their internal gyroscopes. Up is down, black is white, cheating is OK, lying is now permitted, skulking around with OP is terrific, and on and on. Y’all know the drill. And those of us who truly care for them, wish for our families to stay together and enjoy a wholesome homelife, are considered as mere conveniences by them. And that holds, whether they actually leave, or stay behind but live secret lives. All we can do in these cases, is to cultivate our own gardens, do those things for ourselves which we’ve surely been putting off (I know that I have); maintain that old PMA as much as possible; cool it with the pursuing, OR talks, snooping, begging, chasing; assuming an air of mystery; and, in general, distancing in a healthy way.
Re: the air of mystery bit, a funny thing happened today. By way of background, W has, on a couple of occasions, suggested that I “go out and find someone more compatible.” Mine is not to reason why, but perhaps it’s to justify her own extracurricular amorous activities. Anyway, this afternoon, I mentioned to her that I had spoken by phone with Ms.X, a very beautiful, desirable (and available) friend of ours who had moved away about five years ago. W asked, “Oh, and who called who?” I quickly added that I called her. W was taken aback somewhat but quickly recovered. I have the feeling that it’s little DB’ing incidents like this that possibly have a cumulative effect which just might lead to more consistent, desired behavior by the S.
Hi LL,
I think your H is reacting to you and your stance this weekend. Hopefully he will find his way home to your wonderful embrace soon.
Dotto
LL,
I know how much frustration you must feel. By reading your post, I can relate completely the interactions with my W. I am a slow feeler, as my W is complaining that she could not understand my feeling. The only difference was that she walked out on me, while you stayed.
Hang in there, LL. All I can say is it takes time. I thought I was sensitive and emotional, but I also had a hard time trying to express my feelings in front of my W, no matter how much I tried. I know I'll get there. with time, your H will too...
If you would like to offer some advise of talking about feelings, I would love to get your thoughts on my thread...
Chuck
hmmmm...
hmmm...
hmmmm...
I fear I am in danger unless I keep faith and ignore the part of my brain that tells me this will never get any better than it is...
h is trying he just doesn't seem to know what to say or do...and despite the fact that I basically am "holding up the cue cards for him" (is what my c said) h still doesn't know what to do.
was reading "charcoals" thread over in newcommers..she is a potential waw but is trying...her h has been asking her to commit and she runs off to the library or book store...his asking..pleading for her to commit is pushing her away...and yet she is commited at least temporarily she has not left, not filed, cut off om, is comming here seeking advice etc... interesting..I told her that perhaps since she cannot pledge her undying love to h to show him that commitment she could simply tell him that she is commited to trying to make the r one in wich they can both feel happy and fullfilled. she had not thought of putting it that way...wish I could be an annonomous person telling that to my h and getting him to say it to me. but then I should simply look and see that h is commited to trying just in his way...he doesn't always say or do what I want and sometimes doesn't say or do anything at all..but h is here and I have to place more meaning in that....he didn't have to come home as in his own words..we were doing ok with him gone.
charcoal mentioned a book "a piece of crap" she grabbed of the shelf for h...she began reading it and it made sense to her...it contains (loss for word...worksheets etc) to do together to open the line...get to know your partner better etc...maybe I will pick it up..look through it and see if it would be something non-threatening for h and I to do...make a game of it or something ya know.
I don't want to be un-happy and I don't want h to be un-happy...neither one of us wants to leave (well not really) so then something has to be done...if we can do it in a fun way then it is still getting done.
I have hope...for how long I don't know but patience is something I must keep.
btw...h finally mentioned v day...after a comercial for v stuff...said so what do you want to do? I told him I was leaving it to his discretion..so we'll see what happens.
LL
You know, LL, I got kind of a wild thought when I read your post. So, you've told your H X, Y, and Z about what you need from him, yet he doesn't know how to implement your suggestions. You also mentioned the cue card analogy. What if you left sticky notes in odd places around the house to tell him what you want today? For example:
- Leave one in his pants pocket that says, "Call me at 10:30 and tell me you love me."
- Put one on the shower door that says, "give me a deep kiss ON THE LIPS before you leave for work."
- Put one on his comb that says, "when you come downstairs for breakfast, come up behind me, put your arms around me and kiss my neck."
Perhaps leave one for him each day. Over time, hopefully by him actually doing these things, they'll sink in and become more "instinctive." Frankly, maybe you REALLY do need cue cards!
jethro
What a great idea.
Let us know what results you get LL!
Hugs.
would be nice but would also be quirky and don't know if it would just annoy h...maybe slipping something in his pocket now and then actually I did just do his laundry so could slip a few things in his jeans then I wouldn't know what day it would be...??
on occasion h does give me a random hug...did one morning come up behind me and put his arms around my waist..thing is and always has been the inconsistancy of such things. I wonder what's with the inconsistancy...it's not like I want him to do those things every day..but they seem to come few and far between same a sex...it's not non existant just totally random and major gaps in between. (there were times even before all this that 3 months would pass with not so much as a kiss)
we'll see what happens as h seems to wait a bit and then act on what I say in his way.
plus there is the whole thing with him feeling that if I ask and then he acts right away it still isn't good enough because I had to ask..ie one night last week I was upset...questioning his love for me etc...h didn't know what to say so said alot of the wrong thing or nothing...the argument went on and on...till I finally said ...it would be very easy to stop all this...all you have to do when I say I feel this way is hug me and tell me you do care...you may not want to hug me but hugging me will make me feel better and then inturn you will feel better. by then it was obviously as h felt to late to give me that hug...so off I went back to bed..only to come back down and ask him to stand up and give me a hug.
it really is all a bit ridiulous isn't it?
LL
LL, try the sticky note thing. Why not? If he gets annoyed, then stop. You talked about doing some fun exercises out of the "crap" book. Why not make this fun? Why not ask him to do the same thing?
It's something different. IT'S A 180!!! Change the dynamic.
jethro
I am devistated right now to say the least!!
the night of our wedding my h gave me a pair of diamond earings...
this christmas he gave me a new pair with slightly larger stones..shortly there after I lost a back to one of the original (sentimental) pair...and had left them on the window cill to remind myself to get a new back for it.
well while cleaning up lunch i ran the disposal heard a noise...son asks what's that noise..I said something must be in there..son says oh it's your glass things...he put them there cause he didn't like them. I kept fishing in the disposal for 5 min while in tears hoping to find them...nope but did find a mangled pair of loop earings that h had given me for my birthday last year.
I called h...h said we can get a new pair...I don't want a new pair...I already have a new pair...I don't know why my son does these things to me.
I appologized to h for being so emotional h said no need it's understandable and that he's going to finish up where he is and come right home to check the pipes to see if they may be there...I hope so but I doubt it...they are small and light and are probably gone. I had hoped to one day give them to my daughter perhaps on her 16th birhtday but now I will only have a pair that have no real meaning to pass on. i can't stop myself from continuing to search the disposal knowing full well they aren't there and I can't stop these foolish tears either.
well if nothing else...h's reaction does show me that he cares.
I am to hurt to even punish son.
LL
Oh LL,
((((((((((((((((((((LL))))))))))))))
I hope your husband can fish them out.
Hugs.
ll, so sorry!!!!!!!!!!!i hope your h can find it. lisa
lostlove, i had no idea where you were coming from... now i do...
the book, that P.O.C.? you know I was just trying to relay my ambivalence to picking up a book for my H? It turns out to be a piece of gold, not doodoo
.
what it did for me, was to see and mourn for my lost friend. it helped me remember the smallest thing... how cute he was on our first date, and how endearing his request to kiss me on our first date was... "The Seven Pricipals for Making Marriages Work" I think is the title. It's not pushy. It doesn't make the "leaver" feel bad at all. It paves the way back to feeling good without making the leaver really feel anything about all the negativity. Other books were making me feel bad. OR, making me angry because, damnit, WHERE THE HECK WAS MY FRIEND??? WHAT'S THE POINT WITHOUT FRIENDSHIP???? The worksheets are just exercises and the ones I've seen so far will guide me to knowing my H knows me. My H will know what's important to me. AND - my H will share his hopes & dreams with me.
It's funny to me that we've been together 12 years and have never spoken of retirement. I mean, I know we're young... but still... that little cabin on the lake? Whatever, like WillWin says, there's alot of work to do. But honestly, I feel like if this book can be our bible for a while, we'll be just fine. I feel like the hard part is over. Hopefully, i'm not just being manic, ya know?
I'm scared, in a way. I'm scared to commit because I've been so burned by the loss of friendship. He was trying desparately to own me. It was terrible. So, if he can be my friend, then we're golden. If he can't - well then, at least I tried.
imo - i would not do stickies in his pockets. i would not ask for any tokens of love. your H will give them when he feels them, but he will feel compelled not to if you ask cause he doesn't want to lead you on or give you hope he's not prepared to give. give your H this book. just keep telling him you're sorry, and try to keep your chin up... try to be goofy, try to smile.
i dunno,
good luck
LL, sorry about your earrings..a few years ago, before all this mess, I had cleaned my rings, and droped them in the kitchen..found all but the diamond.. it had bounced and fell through the kick board under sink..I searched everything around it, later after i went to bed, h was looking and saw the space under sink, and found it, brought it to me in bed, woke me up and everything..so I know the feeling.
As far as yur h expressing feelings, I have always been shy about that, i did not grow up with any signs of affection being shown, so when h used to kiss me in public or try to hold hands in front of my family i was hesitant..i had gotten better as the years went by..but he has always been the initiater of those things..I have opened up alot the last few months..able to hug people more freely..give him some non threatening ideas to express himself if he doesn't seem to be able to get the cue from you..
Sue
thanx for stoppin by char...
does make a diff when you know where your posters are comming from and I understood the "piece of crap" bit about the book too!
so folks..you wont believe this one...h comes home gives me a big supportive hug...checks the u joint? and don't you know amognst the dirty water we ran through a seive we found two little diamonds!!!! not a scratch on them!! I can't believe the settings went but the diamonds stayed..h said "guess they weren't meant to be lost" I said thank you thank you thank you a million thank you's...h smiled and said your welcome a million welcomes!!! then another huge hug from h!!
happy happy LL..
LL,
Not much to say but sorry to hear about the earring...
And it seems that your emotions matter a lot to your H as well, after you gracefully apologized for being emotional...
Chuck
Tell me again that your H does not love you...
Quote:
Chuck is right on the money - your emotions do matter a lot to H. Maybe this little incident will be the key that opens the lock for you. Then you'll have to thank that S of yours for "carelessly" tossing the earrings down the drain!
Ahh...yes. The universe has strange ways of bringing all of us closer together, does it not?
jethro
Quote:
Tell me again that your H does not love you...
Am I turning green over here?
Hi LL,
I haven't been around here much lately. Have done some more soul searching. I can see you seem to be doing better. Glad to see your H made some love deposits today!! Baby steps!
ll, yay! things happen for a reason. lisa
Lost, I am with the guys, try the notes, I wish my WAW would have done that, we really are CLUELESS!!!!
Poe
yippy skippy, lostlove! that's t-riffic!
I just don't think things will ever change with h...h is who he is and doesn't seem to want to put in that extra effort...LL would have to have a major crisis a day to have h show her his love...but then what is love anyway...while h was "in love" with someone else...last year the first night that I put dd to bed without nursing her which would be the last time I ever nursed a baby...h was comforting and supportive said the right things etc...but then the next day probably went to lunch with his pathetic needy ow or at least called her. ugh!!!!
so last night in a nutshell...LL was up feeling possitive about "us" and then crash!!!
after the emotional overload of the earing incident...decided maybe we should just go to friendly's for dinner...so we did...went to the pet store with the kiddos while we waited for the food to come...had a nice time...on the ride home h talked a bit about some business issues..then we got home..he had to plug his truck in (cold) so I gave both kids a bath and put dd to bed...sat and watched a sesame street counting video with son h sat on the phone with "buddie" just shooting the [censored]...I put son to bed while h was still on the phone...h got off phone...watched tv (cnn) then h layed on couch and fell asleep...I watched tv for a bit then at 11 decided I was going up...sat on couch next to h and asked him if he wanted to sleep on the couch...he said yes...I put a blanket on him and asked if he needed to wake up anytime, if he wanted an alarm....no he said...so of to bed I went with my "bender" why should I go without just because h is lame!! when I woke h was in bed...h stayed in bed till 9 when he smelled the sausages...ate...went and took his shower and off to work he goes.
empty....very very empty....this isn't going to work...something HAS to change..and the only thing I can change at this point is to just decide to not love him anymore!!!
LL
I wish that I were the man...or that we didn't have kids...then I would simply go pack my things righ this minute and leave!!!! and never ever ever look back!!!
I am fed up...patience??? I'll be a friggen blue hair before h ever changes...I live in a rut with h and nothing will ever ever change...there is nothing I can do ....the only thing I can do is become complaicant and accept this m for what it is...I don't want that!!!
I don't want to play anymore!!! I want out!! I want to rip off my skin and run as fast as I can....I don't even care where too...I just want to run!!!!
I don't want to be a wife...
I don't want to be a mother...
I don't want to be anything to anybody anymore!!!
I hate my life!!!
LL
(((LL)))
I do feel for ya. It seems like each swing of the pendulum is traveling to greater ends. It looks to me you are longing to have your H string those positives into a continuous thread, but H hasn't bridge those gaps yet, but he is closing the gaps. He is IS trying and doing more. At first you recognized a good thing from your H about once a week, then twice a week, maybe three times. Then next is to put two of those days together in a week, then two days together twice in the same week. Its a process creating more better days than bad ones and you are somewhere in the middle of that right now, and unfortuantely it is an agonizingly slow process with no other way to hasten it. It has to be taken one day at a time.
Take a moment and just breath. Allow yourself to relax and empty the thoughts from your mind. Then take some time to read thru your last couple of threads. You will see you have had more positive posts in the last the one before. Slowlee the dynamics are changing. It won't alway be the way it is now.
'til later,
KAW
it doesn't really matter anymore...
I do not know h...never really did....
I do not know what h does all day...
do not know his friends...
do not know where he is all day, when he will be home, when he has to leave...
I just don't want to give a rat anymore and I mean it...I am so sick of living my life like this...I tolerated it before it was simply the way my life was....now in the face of all that has happend...ow...separation...wanting d..etc...why should I continue to stay in this r??? why??? h doesn't want to do any of the real work..just wants to make nice nice!!!
maybe some day h will decide to be open and honest with me once again...maybe someday h will want to get down to business and let me be his friend...maybe I'll still be open to the idea but chances are pretty high that by that point I will be spent and just wont care anymore!!!
LL
LL,
What a rollercoaster! I was getting so excited about your progress after last week's low, and then another dip
How do we stay open for the good things but set boundaries to protect ourselves from repeated emotional damage?
Hugs and more hugs,
Acorn
ll, what are you going to do?
when my h distanced from me and had a foot out the door and a heart for ow i refused to disapear. i showed up at his work with cookies, at baseball games with the dog, at his friends house just stopping by, etc. this was in 99 and it may have bugged the hell out of him but it felt like i was losing him anyway so why not. i refused to disapear. if you don't know what he does all day, show up. if you want. if you are really so unhappy, maybe you should stop focusing on the m and on what you are going to do.
it sounded like you had some real goals for yourself. go for them. make your life more about you and your future. your h does love you, but right now it doesn't seem to be the way you need him to.
have you guys tried c? what does your c say about all this? lisa
it is difficult for me to just show up as I don't know where to just show up!! h is a landscaper...it is his own business he could be anywhere...he could be at the shop and I know sometimes he is because I get knocked off line when he signs on to check the weather but that is only something he does during the winter...
he is not at the shop all day...he is there for a bit..then to the post office, an appointment, a job site, a customers house screwing the housewife??? I don't know???
the summer before last while I was preg with dd on the way home from doc appointments I would call him to see where he was so I could bring son to see him..then he was leaving home at 5:30 am and not returning til almost 7 or after...h would oblige if he was in the area would meet us at the shop but if I asked him to go get lunch or something he couldn't.
h works in an area that is about 30 miles from here a 30 min ride...to toss two kids (3 1/2 and 1 1/2) into a car and drive to just show up would be ludicrous...
what am I going to do??? live my life for me what else can I do...h doesn't get it or doesn't want to get it...honestly I should have been the one to walk away not him only difference being if I had walked I would not have come back as he has there would be no point.
h is not open to going to c..wont even fill out a questionare that my c gave me for couples entering c to give me an idea of where he is...wont read anything...wont talk about anything..
there is not much that I can do but live my life for me...that I know scares h...because when I told him that is what I will do...h said and just what does that mean...think it's a simple case of " I don't want to be with you...but I don't want you to be with anyone else either"
I've been waiting for to long for this man to open up...I know there is someone in there...for some reason he just doesn't want to share himself with me...
my c thinks maybe h is holding onto some anger or something..don't really know..how can we even begin to have a clue as to what's with h when h doesn't so much as say boo about us.
I don't know if h wants me to be affectionate toward him or just to leave him alone.
I don't know if h wants me to talk to him or just leave him alone
I don't know what h wants I really don't and when I ask h these things I get no answer...
it's just hopeless....
I am afraid...not afraid to live my life...not afraid that I can't live without h as a real part of my life....not afraid that I wont make myself happy...not afraid of things like that...what I am afraid of is ending up in an ea or pa of my own..
LL
ll, it would be very difficult to pack the kids in the car and drive around looking for h. sorry, i hadn't thought of that. if you stay focused on your career goals, you may find you start to feel better about your sitch. your h may still change. fear is an incredible motivater and you mention h seemed scared about you living life just for you.
lisa
LL, I know you're frustrated, and I do fear you becoming a WAW. Something in your post caught my attention:
Quote:
I do not know h...never really did....
some day h will decide to be open and honest with me once again...
The last sentence kind of contradicts the first one. Are you sure you're not selectively choosing to remember what you want about the past? Seems you're getting ever closer to that WAW point.
I certainly understand your frustrations. However, when you really step back and look at things, I have to agree with KAW, your H does seem to be trying...ever so slowly. For whatever reason, you telling him what you want/need verbally just isn't working. Why do you think? Maybe this is the pattern that needs to change? I don't know, but it seems such a shame to just become apathetic after all of your hard work.
-Have you tried contacting a DB coach?
-Have you tried the sticky note idea?
-Have you "insisted" H fill out the form from your C?
I still think there are things to try before "giving up." I hate to see you so disheartened.
(((LL)))
jethro
Hey ll,
Sorry things have been so hard for you lately. I wonder what the anger he might be holding onto could be about? It's very difficult that he won't fill out the form. One thing to try might be to make it about you, not him or the R....your C thinks it is very important to get that info to help you work on you.
Happy Valentine's Day! Your generous heart will attract love one way or another.
Acorn
Quote:
I do not know h...never really did....
some day h will decide to be open and honest with me once again...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The last sentence kind of contradicts the first one. Are you sure you're not selectively choosing to remember what you want about the past? Seems you're getting ever closer to that WAW point.
I never really did know h...h always hid things from me, the only way I ever knew where he went with his friends was when his friends would be around and remenis stories...rrrgggg! I say open up once again because for a bit when h first came home he did seem to start to share little stories about things with me...telling me about his day etc...that has faded.
I am not becomming a waw...I am in the begining stages of waw and have been long before any of this even happened...honestly I did at times sit and think...well someday maybe something will happen to h and then I can find real love...horrible I know...thing is now I know h feels the same of me only he didn't wait til something happend to me he just went out and found it for himself and now is forcing me to live with it.
there really is not much that I can do or want to do at this point...honestly I don't think I even love h anymore...he is my h the father of our children etc...but do I really want to spend the rest of my life with him??? don't think so...will I leave soon...no...when will I leave..I don't know...will h try to stop me...no!! he will finally be free of me like he wants!
there is no point in my calling a db coach..what they will tell me is what I already know...leave him alone...be happy, be mysterious, do things for me that make me happy, no or or r talks, no talk of ow, act as if etc...
sticky notes? honestly would just piss him off...the old no matter what I do "it's not enough for you"
insitst that h fill out the c form?? last tues night I asked him to fill out the form, read a book, go to c, do something that shows me that he is truly interested in this r...h did nothing...I did however put his form in with his business bills that I folded stuffed sealed and stamped for him...(did notice no bill for ow, either he took it out or she didn't have any plowing or sanding done and no forwarded balance for the past months) I don't think h gives a rat...
and I am begining to think I don't give a rat anymore either...I will live in a nice house...take care of my children and do my best to get along with h so the kids can enjoy a "family" become an emt...a part of the community...after I get comfy with being a volunteer emt I will find a company that pays...pick up a few shifts...put the money asside..go to school...further my education...get my life in order...do things for me...and eventually if h doesn't change I will leave or ask him to. will he be schocked like so many of the men that come to this board..will he try to win me back...read books...suggest c...reflect...etc...nope..he will let me go. honestly if I were to call a lawyer today and start filing h would accept..hey after all he tried didn't he? he came home didn't he? he showed everyone that he did the right thing didn't he? he's made himself look like the good guy now hasn't he? I will be the bad, bad woman who leaves her h simply because he doesn't love her...I will be just as ignorant and selfish as the ow herself...I understand her always did the only part I didn't understand was how she could carry on a r with a married man...that I wouldn't be so ignorant to do.
there is no point to any of it..h will never change and honestly I don't want him to change I just want him to be him with me..that is something he doesn't want to do or just doesn't know how to do and he is unwilling to do what it takes.
what could h do to make LL happy?
go to c...even if just once by himself
ask me to put my ring back on...even if in a mad way "why don't you put your damn ring back on!!" I would gladly with a smile!!
ask me to go out somewhere with him...anywhere...I'd be happy to just go run an errand for christs sake!!
h to initiate sex or physical intimacy at least once a week (come on now it's been at least two weeks!!!)
h to tell me something funny or annoying about his day at least 3x a week
h to let me know what his schedule is...
h to let me know what his intentions are (is he staying around for the kids? will he stay forever or just till they are old enough?)
h to tell me that he loves me without me saying anything to prompt it
h to ask me to sit on the couch with him once again
h to call me during the day for no other reason than to say hi!! and let me know what he's up to.
h to consider me his friend
h to confide in me something
h to express some desire to have me around...ie...when I go out maybe call me and say "hope your having fun...I miss you" "wish you were here" or even a pathetic...please don't go out tonight I want to hang out with you.
h to be a h!!!! not just a breadwinner doing the right thing comming home to his poor little w and kids!!
I am to good for this...I am to much of a woman to feel this way...I am special...I've got umf (as some guy told me the first night h left...I couldn't stay home so went out with a friend and within an hour or so had a guy following me around like a puppy all night!!)
I am smart
I am funny
I am independant
I am beautiful (hot damn!! yes I am!!)
I am sexy
I am adventurous
I am loving
I am considerate
I am kind
I am genuine
I am sincere
I am honest
I am a lot of things that h see's and doesn't see I am a prize and should be treated as such or at least treated as someone special or important or of value...
in this r
i feel dumb
i feel ugly
i feel fat
i feel mean
i feel useless
i feel selfish
i feel needy
i feel unloved
i feel boring
i feel hopeless
h knows how i feel always has and yet h has never wanted to do anything about it...h's idea of how to fix things was to go make another friend...to leave his w etc...
I don't think any of it really matters anymore
so you fear I'm in danger of becomming a waw...I already am one!! I'm just not walking away!
let's see it's valentines day...let's see what last minute card h can scrape up...and gee will he foolishly spend ridiculous money on roses again even after so many years of my asking him not to on v day? will he not bother to get me anything...will we simply eat our chinese food while watching cnn and then go to sleep..will h try to initiate sex?? hope not because I don't want him to anymore...if I want "sex" i can go up to my room and have "sex" myself...i don't need a man for that...I want physical intimacy and h doesn't seem to want to be mentally intimate with me wich is where it should start!!!
honestly even as I type this I just feel empty...yes it bothers me to feel this way but the tears have faded the anger dull it's just numbness now total numbness!! when and if h does something will it be too little to late? probably so..but then h probably wont to anything anyway...h is content to live this empty life!!
LL
I'm sorry, LL. I really am.
(((LL))) a Valentine's Day hug for you...and hoping your H will go outside of the box tonight...
jethro
LL,
Quoting jethro:
hoping your H will go outside of the box tonight...
Ditto to that...
Make sure you reward yourself with a good V-day today...
Chuck
(((((((((((((LL)))))))))))))))
Just skimming your posts and something jumped out at me. We just happen to be at this section of the KLA tapes in the KLA group ...
Try to avoid "always" and "never" thinking!
(examples)
I do not know h...never really did....
h always hid things from me
Maybe instead of looking for the rule, look for the exception - are there times when H didn't hide something ...?? I know how hard it is to look at the positives and not the negatives when things are going so wrong and you feel so horrible but I bet once you start looking for them, you'll see them.
As for the list of things H can do for you - does he know about this list?
I'm sorry for not being as familiar with your sitch as I should be but I'll throw out these questions anyways... have you told your H of your unhappiness? (I assume you have) Does your H know you're practically a WAW? Have you tried counselling?
You're right, you are a good person with a lot of great qualities - why don't you think you have those qualities in your R? What can you do to change that?
The dedication to the commitment you made is great - that you are staying with your H when you want so badly to leave. I know you don't feel love for your H right now but as we say over and over again... love is a decision and you made that decision! Love can grow again if the decision is there to let it do so.
LL,
Sorry your feeling so down and hopeless. I know how awful it is to feel that way. Believe me I've been there, I think we all have. I wish I had some advice for you, but I just really don't know what to tell you. It's a difficult place to be in. I'm sure you'll find your way soon. Take a few steps back and look inward, it will come to you.
I hope you H surprises you tonight, and you have a good Valentines evening.
Take care and (((((LL)))))
Laney
{{{{{{LL}}}}}}} Keeping you in my prayers.
Hi LL,
I hope things are better for you. Let's make plans next week.
I know that things seem hopeless but remember, you get those hugs occasionally and they will come more often I am sure!
All of the things you said about yourself I concur! You are a wonderful woman, a great Mom, and hell I can vouvh for the fact that you look damn fine! I'd kill to look like you on a bad day!
Hope the night goes well.
Dotto
ok so LL got the good h today...h called son to the door when he got home...had son give me 2 doz white roses and a big huge balloon from the kids...h then came in and gave me a nice hug and a kiss on the cheek..
after putting son to bed early (for being his fresh little self) h gave me a card from each kiddo and a card from himself and a gift cert for a roman holiday (manicure, pedicure, facial, hair, make-up and lunch) before then h gave me another hug...I went out and got the chineese..(was a good girl and called my nana to wish her a happy v-day) came home and ate while watching cnn ( actually with all that's going on I find it interesting though admit it makes me feel pretty ignorant of our gov and the world of politics but then they all seem pretty ignorant of eachother too) then h cuddled near me and started to be physical I didn't really want to but played along for a while but then pooped out..h was ok with that...
I thanked h for all the wonderful gifts and said do you know what my favorite gift was...h said "yes...I gave you two hugs" so then h if you know then why do you hold out??? why do you let me go for days on end thinking you just don't get it or you just don't care...to then be the h I want??
so then as they say...hop aboard the rollercoaster ride...it aint over yet!!
LL
Waahoo!! Maybe we can get everyone here to do the wave for LL ... LOL
Actually, it just occured to me...I don't think your H has yet realized it is a consistant effort in order to make each day a better day. I truely believe he wants to LL, but probably is expecting that this stuff should just fall into place and doesn't realize that in order to make each day a better day, he has to put in an equal amount of effort if not more than he did the day before. He doesn't know that what he did today will not continue to carry the same momentum into tomorrow, but thinks it should. So he doesn't realize that he has to do it all over again, day after day.
Anyway, so glad to hear you received a warm Valentine from your husband.
'til later,
KAW
Hey, whaddayaknow!!! I'm so happy for you
I'm glad you had a little joy this day. Great job catching him doing something you like
Acorn
Hi LL,
I can so much identify with how you feel. Before my H left, I could have written your post from this morning myself!
I'm glad he pulled through in the end today. It's a pisser that he knows what to do, but just doesn't do it every day!
rjj
Hi LL,
Glad your V day was so special. Hope tonight is equally as good.
Dotto
i am happy your h came through for you! lisa
LL, sounds like your h is trying...just does not get that he has to repeat it everyday...Men..can't seem to live with them, yet we really don't want to live without them(well, most of the time)hope good things keep coming your way..
Sue
Hi LL,
I hear your frustration, I know your struggle. Some guys just dont get it. Your guy was attracted to a live wire, someone that made him laugh gave him lots of fun. I have tried to switch the tide and have him give me back what I gave him. It just doesn't work. I have told him exactly what I want from my man. Right down to dotting the I's and crossing the T's. I realize that I am the entertainer, I am the one that gives this relationship life. So, I take what I want hugs, kiss's and leave it at that. I needed to stop thinking that the reason he wasn't doing it was because he wasn't interested. My suggestion to get back to the person you enjoyed and be that person. Don't let someone upset your apple cart. You know the rest.... Loretta
Wow, LL.
- Gifts (more than just flowers)
- Hugs
- Intimate attempt
He gets it. Now, he just needs to get it through his thick cranium that he has to do this stuff far more often!
I'm happy your H went outside of the box, LL.
jethro
so far three days in a row of the good h...ok not the perfect h but the very good h anyway.. don't know what the correlation is but I'm not going to stop what I'm doing anyway...focussing on me...doing my own thing...the next couple of days might be tough as it is going to snow but I still have some work to do in the dining room so that should keep me busy in the evening while h is out plowing and I'll do my best to not be bothered if h spends any time at his apartment..I will do as h suggested the last time he stayed there and consider it office space.
hope this strech lasts...
LL
Great LL, just remember there are bound to be down days..for who knows why...h tired..worried..it doesn't mean he is thinking or feeling any different towards you..try to do the fun things for you at those times.
We got some of the snow but sounds like the east is really getting it...spring is only about a month away!!
Sue
ll, thinking of you with all this crazy weather! we went for a walk this am. my pom(little fat dog) loved it! my h is fast asleep which is not unusual. he sleeps like a baby and i toss and turn. not fair. hope you are not going stir crazy. we watched lady and the tramp and it was the longest my d has ever sat still. plus she is sick. when will it ever be spring?????????lisa
Hi LL,
Glad things seem to be better. You are doing something right.
Hope you survive the snow.
Dotto
LL,
I am so glad the good H is still there. Keep doing what you are doing, because it is working! Hang in there lady.
doing my best to deal with the snow...
h left yesterday to go out and get ready for the storm...was out plowing til 1 am but did call a few times and even called at 12:30 to say he was on his way home...seems like he's more alive too...not just I'll be home at such and such but little comments and conversation..came in about 2am after plowing our driveway and slept for a bit...actually overslept and left at 7:30. has called a few times to say hello...had fil come over to shovel for us and fil stayed with the kids so I could make a diaper run. don't know what time h will be home as it may snow again...he is currently waiting in out and possibly cathcing a few winks at buddies house...(makes me feel better that he's there and not at apartment) doing my best at accepting this is his job and it's ok that he's not here and it will be ok if he does come home before I go to sleep only to fall asleep himself.
been doing laundry and hanging with the kiddos...god I can't wait for summer!!!
I do hope the good participating h stays around!!! and I sure hope it is not just a mask for something bad going on.
LL who's currently burried under 2 feet of white stuff!!! ugh!!
I cannot imagine living with snow all the time. It must get pretty old. Of course here, we would just love to get some of the pretty white stuff. But having it every day for weeks must get depressing.
I'm with you LL, bring me some sunshine!! I'm ready to wear my shades!!
Thanks for stopping by my thread.
How's LL today?
Quote:
seems like he's more alive too...not just I'll be home at such and such but little comments and conversation..
I'm happy for you, LL. It's great your H seems more "present."
So, are you getting cabin-fever yet?
jethro...enjoying the CA weather after living in AK for five years...
Quote:
So, are you getting cabin-fever yet?
omg yes!! thought I'd take the kids on a super market adventure and get some food shopping done...to realize that sons car seat is still in daddys truck...doh!
oh well so home again we are...
yes things are going well..perhaps for no other reason then I've decided to simply expect nothing from h other then for him to come home at the end of the day...(unless it's snowing)
I'm appreciating the little things he does around the house...like emptying the diaper pails and small trash cans throughout the house..letting me sleep in a bit...makin my tea...giving me a hug occasionally...
we'll see how it goes...
LL
Thought I'd send a little sunshine to brighten your day and hopefully melt some of that snow ...
`\\|//
-
-
,//|\\
33 days to spring...
'til later,
KAW
he lets you sleep???!!!that is worth BIG points in my book. if my h would get our d just one am a week i would be ecstatic. lisa
never ever ever happend before all this crap...I was on duty 2-4-7 while he did whatever he wanted...it's one of his 180's!!
for some reason...my high of everything is going to be fine has ended...don't know why...we'll see what tonight brings..I'm going to meet with the director of the ambulance co..having my mother come over to watch the kids so h can move some snow around outside...actually better that way than had I stayed home...as h has basically not really been here at all the past two nights cause of the snow so it would certainly annoy me to have him outside "playing" around in the bob cat while I attend to the kids...
haven't heard from h since I last called him at 11:30 perhaps that is all it has taken to throw me off..I don't know but I will do my best to act as if...
funny thought I just had...act as if...ya act as if you just don't give a crap!
LL
Quoting lostlove:
... so it would certainly annoy me to have him outside "playing" around in the bob cat while I attend to the kids...
haven't heard from h since I last called him at 11:30 perhaps that is all it has taken to throw me off..I don't know but I will do my best to act as if...
funny thought I just had...act as if...ya act as if you just don't give a crap!
Whatever works so you can let go and not sweat the small stuff...
'til later,
KAW
Hi LL,
Enjoyed our chat on Monday night. Sorry H hasn't been home but I see the snow and can't imagine how hard he worked.
I am having a tough go of it. Detaching is not my strong suit. Hope all is well.
Dotto
Quoting lostlove:
I'm appreciating the little things he does around the house...like emptying the diaper pails and small trash cans throughout the house..letting me sleep in a bit...makin my tea...giving me a hug occasionally...
LL,
Is H maybe showing love to you in his love language? Sounds like "acts of service" may be his love language. Although that isn't yours from the sound of it. Have you thought about that, and does it help you understand him better? Just thought I would throw that out there to see if it helps.
I think that this things are good - glad to see he is helping and let you sleep.
Hi..boy you guys sure got the storm...will it be melted by June???
Sounds like you are doing ok despite h not being around too much..that's good...good luck on the meeting with ambulance co. hope it all works out for you. Take care...KAW said spring is only 33 days ..yipee
Sue
Hi LL,
Sorry for being so needy last night. Just having a bad day. Again. Hope DD is doing okay. Maybe today you can get out and enjoy the warm
weather. 42 feels like spring!
Dotto
as always folks thanks for stopping by, it's always a little pma boost to see posts on my thread!!
dotto, don't worry about being "needy" I understand completely...dd has a very bad cold...that is why she was crying she wanted mommies full attention!!
so things are things...looking for the simple little things and trying to stay possitive..
last evening when h got home he let me know that he will be taking on the task of cleaning some roofs...and even elaborated on a conversation he had with buddie about helping him..even though it's simple stuff.. I appreciate it cause for so long h had stopped talking to me about such things...I never really knew what he was doing.
well I attempted last night to make an advance at h...actually don't like to be too forward as i have dealt with years of rejection from h so I try not to humiliate myself to much in that regard...but when we were lying in bed I did say..hey are you asleep..h said yes...then I said..hey..are you "really" asleep...h said yes...oh well so I left it at that...tried not to get pissy about it and went to sleep myself...what can ya do.
h over slept this am...made a joke at himself last night saying "i actually have to be at a certain place at a certain time" oh well...h thanked me for waking him...I told him to be carefull on the roofs...h said he probably wouldn't be on the roof he'd be on the ladder (nice to be the boss send your employees into danger and keep safe on the ladder) well I asked him to call me when he finished each house so I know he didn't get hurt or anyone else either...he smiled.
so off he goes..
still feeling myself headed once again down the negative train...I wonder how much of a correlation there is with physical contact or lack there of and my happiness with the sit??
met with the ambulance director...who as he gave me the tour and explained everything kept asking if he was scaring me away...they are in desperate need of a new facility but we'll have to wait for the voters to approve a new building.
so all I have to do is fill out a criminal record release..when that comes back and is ok'd (I don't think I have a record) then it's a major physical (like a 3 hour one) then I sign up for and take an emt course...have to find one that fit's around the vaca I am taking with the kids.. (going to fla with kids and some friends, h may come for a day or two) I'm pretty excited but also scared..I was told of one womans first three calls being bad ones...three cardiac arrests in a row and all three didn't make it...since she has had better calls but eeeeeggg!!
so another day...we'll see what the rest of the week brings..still have more painting to do in the dining room...took a bit of time off from that..all thats left is some trim (wainscotting) and the china cabinet..and then it's done.
LL
Sounds like LL is having a few of those "normal" days.
Quote:
still feeling myself headed once again down the negative train...I wonder how much of a correlation there is with physical contact or lack there of and my happiness with the sit??
You know, I do the exact same thing. If I don't get some sort of physical attention from my W, then I feel distant from her. And, after sex, I usually feel pretty good about things. (why is it that I'm talking about sex so much lately on my posts?)
It does seem like your H is trying a little harder in this department?
Quote:
still have more painting to do in the dining room...took a bit of time off from that..all thats left is some trim (wainscotting) and the china cabinet..and then it's done.
Taking you long enough...
No, I understand. I built and installed a chair rail in my office, then painted different colors above and below it, so I know how long this stuff takes.
Have a good day, LL.
jethro
not having a very good day feeling wise...
it's beautiful outside...like 44 a major difference to the freezing temps of prior weeks!!
dd has bad cold...little snot face!
had a friend come over and stay with her so son and I could go food shopping..
had a recieved call when I got back to the car from h...no message...
just having negative thoughts today..
how could h knowingly spend so much time with ow...how could h just sit and keep his mouth shut for so long when I'd ask if he thought this was the way it was supposed to be...all along knowing he wasn't happy but not saying anything..then all along knowing he was having an innapropriate r with another woman and still not saying anything about it...leaving etc...lying etc...
I wonder if I am having to deal with all these feelings...shame, embarrasment, humiliation, betrayal, despair, anger, frustration etc...is h even feeling anything or is he just happy to have the truth out and is merrily going about life as if it all never happend???
I am very frustrated that h wont go to c...or talk about us...
going with the flow..taking it one day at a time is fine and all but at some point these things will have to be addressed...and my fear is that by the time he's comfy and ready to discuss things I just wont care anymore..
so anyway as you can tell from my tone today...I'm heading back down the waw road...I don't like it I don't want to feel this way but really I am getting sick of "pretending" that all is well when it isn't.
"love is always having to say your sorry" why then does h take the stance that he already said sorry and now we have to move on...what if I'm not satisfied with that.
I don't know..
LL
Quoting lostlove:
is he ... merrily going about life as if it all never happend???
I know with my W this seems to be the case and she seems to get upset when she discovers I don't feel the same way. Actually, I wish I knew how she does it. Lately, I catch myself thinking this week last year during the "dark" period, she was doing this or saying that. But what good will come out of rehashing the past. Maybe they're right ... I've haven't tried acting "as-if" it never happened. Would like to try, but wonder how to pull it off?
'til later,
KAW
On the way home from work tonite
(I seem to do my best reflecting during the commute home for some reason) , I had sorta a revelation I think into what may drive our S to move forward as like nothing ever happened.
Basically, it is a defense mechanism that our S's use to avoid the guilt that they must feel for knowing they have caused us such hurt. Understandably, the feelings associated with that guilt must s*ck just like our feeling about being betrayed. They don't want to keep feeling that way, so it probably works for them to pretend it never happen. It continues to work for them as long as we "play" along by not making any references to the betrayal ... and there lies our catch-22 ... because we continue measure their actions now in reference to their betrayal as our defense mechanism (DM) to prevent the possibility of being hurt again. Unfortuantely, our DM appears to be not very affective and doesn't work, because in order for it to work it would mean a breakdown in their DM, which will make them feel like crap.
I hope that made some sense?!
Do others agree?
If so, there seems to be a conflict of interest in each others DM being used to help deal with the hurt. If this is the case, it seems we need to discover another means to nuture the healing. Any ideas on what these means could be?
The obvious one would be in MC where both can feel safe enough to let their DM's down to work together on the healing process, but what can be done when S doesn't want to participate in C for whatever reason?
LL, I hope you don't mind me placing this here, but I hope we can both benefit from any advise given on this and it was your post that got me thinking along these lines.
'til later,
KAW
Quoting KAW:
On the way home from work tonite (I seem to do my best reflecting during the commute home for some reason) , I had sorta a revelation I think into what may drive our S to move forward as like nothing ever happened.
Basically, it is a defense mechanism that our S's use to avoid the guilt that they must feel for knowing they have caused us such hurt. Understandably, the feelings associated with that guilt must s*ck just like our feeling about being betrayed. They don't want to keep feeling that way, so it probably works for them to pretend it never happen. It continues to work for them as long as we "play" along by not making any references to the betrayal ... and there lies our catch-22 ... because we continue measure their actions now in reference to their betrayal as our defense mechanism (DM) to prevent the possibility of being hurt again. Unfortuantely, our DM appears to be not very affective and doesn't work, because in order for it to work it would mean a breakdown in their DM, which will make them feel like crap.
I hope that made some sense?! Do others agree?
This makes complete sense to me! I'd had this sense of "conflicting DMs" all along in our M -- my need to talk about EVERYTHING vs. his need to avoid all conflict, etc. I KNEW that I was struggling with needing verbal reassurance from him (details, apology, etc) regarding his A. and that he seemed just not interested but I hadn't really been able to see it as an extreme case of battling DMs until you put it into words.
Quote:
If so, there seems to be a conflict of interest in each others DM being used to help deal with the hurt. If this is the case, it seems we need to discover another means to nuture the healing. Any ideas on what these means could be?
The obvious one would be in MC where both can feel safe enough to let their DM's down to work together on the healing process, but what can be done when S doesn't want to participate in C for whatever reason?
Well, I'm not sure I have the solution but I'd say that if each person is willing to step outside their comfort zone slightly, then, some progress can be made. For instance, while my knee-jerk reaction is to discuss everything ad nauseaum, I have actually done a lot of the work (getting through my grief, working on the sense of betrayal, etc) silently and on my own. Maybe this seems unfair but it became really clear, really fast that H. wasn't going to be willing to deal with the aftermath in the way that I needed. In fact, marriagebuilders.com and "after the affair" really depressed the hell out of me in the beginning because H. just wasn't fitting the mold of the "total repentent spouse". But, I figured out that I could be really pissed about that and get nowhere OR I could try to work things out a bit on my own, strengthen the marriage in the meantime and see where that takes me.
I DO think that my H. has a responsibility to edge away from his security too -- that means having the conversation when he doesn't want to, etc. But, as I said above -- whereas I may have initiated 10 conversations in the past, now I'd only initiate 1 or 2.
Has it worked? Time will tell, I think, but, our M. feels stronger than it's been in a long time, I've learned a new way to deal with issues (and I feel so much calmer than I thought I would NOT talking about every little thing) and I think (but don't know for a fact) that H. appreciates the way I've handled things. AND, he's definitely showing signs of be willing to involve himself -- just this past weekend, he apologized for creating a scenario where "even email is suspect" after we had a brief argument re. my feelings of insecurity when he checks his email late at night.
Small steps, right?
--Sage
LL..thanks for your post..sounds exciting for your emt job..that has to really give you a boost..I feel good for you..KAW really had some stuff to think about..the DM thing..how true that our s can't or don't know how to approach everything that has happened..c did seem to help, as h was able to freely open up..but for us he was so restless thst nothing was going to help until his need for being alone was met..seems like we wasted alot of time and $ going...take care..enjoy thte "warmer" weather..it is going to be 50 in northern Il today!!!
Sue
very interesting toughts guys...
thing is h's way just like sage's h was to always just avoid things..never mentioning that anythings wrong...
now if h is dealing with guilt and remorse about what he's done and said and letting it all out the one time that he did (back when he decided to try to come home) was enough to ease his concience to me though that seems odd I suppose I have to accept it...he got it off his chest made his appologies and I guess then I have to throw out the "love is always having to say your sorry line"
it would be nice (for me anyway) if h did have these feelings for him to at least express them on some level to me...maybe he is on some level and I just don't see it because I'm so busy waiting to hear it..but then we don't speak the same language all the time..which leads me to my real issue..
I wasn't happy in this m...my needs weren't being met...I often ran down cheesless tunnel after tunnel trying to fix things...begging..pleading...blaming...crying...etc...to get nowhere...
obviously I wasn't the only one who was unhappy...if I was meeting all h's needs why would he spend time elswhere?? why would he leave?? because I wasn't happy??
I ask h...what are your needs? h doesn't know..
I ask h...what about me makes you want to be near me? h doesn't know
I ask h...what about me (or what do I do) makes you want to run away? h doesn't know
I ask h..where do you see us in ten years...h doesn't know..
h has NO answers to these questions...not even vauge ones...
I am not totally interested in talking about the a..what I am interested in is talking about what h wants and needs...what h's expectations of us are...what the future holds for us..what h's intentions for us are...is he staying for the kids?? does he plan to some day leave...really I just want to talk about something other than gee this is what I did at work today..a truck broke down bla bla bla this broke that broke...I'll be home at such and such...
I don't know if I made any sense..
LL
Hey LL,
What about some more concrete questions, following Love Languages? Do you feel more loved when I cook you breakfast or when I let you know how much I appreciate you doing (something)? Etc....
Maybe he really is out of touch with his emotional needs, maybe he doesn't have the words to describe them.
Just a thought.
Acorn
Quote:
Maybe he really is out of touch with his emotional needs, maybe he doesn't have the words to describe them.
maybe I should just buy a copy of love languages and leave it somewhere for him???
I did leave the c form with the bills I folded for him and in snooping in his truck last night (ya ya shame on me) found it in a manila envelope?? odd place for it but better than the trash I suppose..don't know if that means he's considering filling it out or if he just didn't want to throw it away??
maybe if I leave the book around he might be inclined? maybe not...don't think it can hurt much..as he does seem commited to trying to make things work and is trying to hear what my needs are...perhaps in reading a bit he might discover what his are?? or it may just confuse the hell out of him.
today I feel like taking a ride down...ringing ow's doorbell looking at her and then driving away..I really wish I knew what she looks like...then I wouldn't think of her whenever I see someone who I think may look like her..but then I know I'd be tempted to spit at her or beat her over the head with a copy of dr...
wonder if her h is still living there...if they are still getting a d...if they are talking etc??? does it matter to my sit...probably not...so why do I care??? because I simply do...I don't like divorce...I don't like for families to be torn apart for no good reason...probably the only reason for me to have tried to save a m that I wasn't happy in to begin with.
LL who still isn't totaly sure what it is she wants either, but at least she's willing to talk about it!
Hey LL.
Well, I have to agree with KAW. I think our Ses don't want to face the fact that they've inflicted great pain upon us. They don't want to face the guilt, etc. I know my W simply likes to think that I'm floating through this thing pretty well without too many bumps. When does she acknowledge my pain? When I happen to mention that I'm hurting. She NEVER just comes out and says that she's sorry...but she has already any number of times...in tears. So, what good does it do for me to keep having her relive her guilt when I know she already has it?
Just because our Ses don't say anything doesn't mean they don't feel guilty. Talking about it just makes it worse...
LL, I have asked my W what she needs so we can try and work things out. I'm pretty much met with a roadblock here because she has as much said that I'm doing pretty much everything that she could want. When we went over our exercises in the "After the Affair" book I tried to identify what I could do for her, and she had VERY little to add. My list you ask? Well, like yours would be, mine was quite large.
I bet when your H responds that he doesn't know his needs, he's probably pretty happy with the things you do for him. Maybe he just doesn't have too many complaints? At this point, I know my W doesn't. It's frustrating for us because we want to "fix." We can't fix them, though, as they need to fix themselves. We're pretty much helpless here.
jethro
will I ever feel good in this r??
will I ever feel confident that h isn't going to leave?
will h tell me he loves me?
will h ask me to put my ring back on?
will h be happy? is h happy?
will I ever be able to walk up to my h and give him a big hug when he walks in the door? (right now I am afraid to I wait for him...I don't ignore him and am not cold..just indifferent...I hide behind the kids..even when he leaves in the am I don't go to kiss him good bye...when the kids go to the door to kiss him I stand back until he looks for me or asks for me)
I don't like it this way...
I don't like feeling that I can't just call my h during the day to say hey wsup?? having to hide behind son calling him...
I don't like all the uncertainty...
I don't like the indifference I am often met with..
I don't like acting indifferent when I am not.
I don't know how long I can keep up this stuff...I feel like I am just waiting for something...and fear it will never come and I will be left with an empty life...not empty of "family"..or a life of my own...but a rather empty r...
at night now I find myself getting in bed and wishing I were in it alone... I did after all spend a year in it alone...before h left at the end of my pregnancy he stayed on the couch (supposedly to give me more room, whatever) and then after she was born stayed on the couch because his sleep was being disturbed (ya again whatever) then left for 6+ months...so honestly I sleep better when he's not there.
I am swaying again aren't I...
I just get tired of waiting for something and I don't even know what I'm waiting for.
a hug
a smile
a kiss
an invitation
a response neg or possitive either will do
something???
LL kreeping back into waw mode once again as the snow melts..
I used to look forward to h comming home from work..even when he wasn't really here but was simply here...I used to want to do things with h..even when he didn't want to do things with me...
I find myself now not really caring one way or another if h work round the clock...when it snows..I just don't feel like I care anymore..and I know that is not the way it is supposed to be...I've grown to expect nothing from h...I still get a bit resentful at him for being here but not fully being here perhaps he is here as fully as is capable for him and not because part of him is elsewhere but because there is just something wrong with him??
I don't know??? but the one thing I do know is...this m isn't going to last and if for some stupid reason it does...it will not be a healthy one for at least one of us.
LL
LL, I know we've gone over this before, but at some point I really think you need to say something to your H. Maybe be honest with him about how you're feeling? I know you're kind of afraid of his response...whether he'll just be apathetic about your feelings or not, but maybe you need to try. It's high time he begin to deposit credits into your Love Bank. Seems you are really running dry.
Now, to switch gears a moment, has he not been a bit better about making those deposits? When he went outside of the V-day box, didn't you feel a bit better? When he found your earrings, didn't you feel better? Has he not been a bit more "present?" As frustrated as you are with the incredibly slow progress, it's important to recognize that he is trying.
I think what's going to happen over more time is you will continue to gravitate towards being a WAW. Eventually it will get to a point where you won't be able to stand it any longer. And what will happen if (and when) you meet someone who meets some of your needs?
Perhaps before things get worse you should be very clear with your H about some expectations you have about your R? I think it's fair that now that he's home, he listens to some of your needs and follows through with them. It almost seems like with each passing day, you feel as though you have less and less to lose. So, what would it hurt?
Just putting that out there...my measley .02...
jethro
I have very clearly stated to h how I feel...that if things continue the way they are I better not leave the house cause I am sure to have an a once someone gives me the things I am asking for...
h knows what I want and v day was a perfect example...after thanking him for all the gifts I said...do you know what my favorite gift was?? h said yes...the fact taht I gave you two hugs....
so h does get it...he does know...
the day h came home to look for my earings...first thing he did when he got here was pull me aside and give me a hug..
h knows what I want and need...is just cheap with it...
I have been a bit short lately..not sharp just short...h has on a couple occasions...said what's wrong with you?? I say nothing...cause honestly how many friggen times can a woman tell you and in how many different ways...you know you hear her..you know what she wants...how simple it could all be...what are you so afraid of...why don't you want to have a happy wife...what's the big deal...when you come in the door...grab her..hug her tight..kiss her cheek...ask her to sit on the couch with you...she is after all willing to watch your boring repetative cnn with you...say i love you to her...tell her she looks nice...smells nice...tell her something...about her...not the damn dining room wich you didn't want her to do in the first place!!
basically the only way h may wake the hell up is if I stop threatening and actually call a lawyer get the papers and give them to h...
is h even capable of doing the work it would take??? maybe not with me...he did after all convince an ow of his love for her enough so that she would leave her h for him...so maybe h just doesn't belong with me...
LL there never was anything for me to loose cept for the "family" when h left. was part of why he left...he knew I felt that way.
Hi LL,
Sorry things are bringing you down again. I was great yesterday but down agian today. I really think there's something in the air!
I'll try to call you later. Maybe we can get together and do something fun.
Dotto
{{{{{{{{{LL}}}}}}}}}}
Sorry you are sad and discouraged. When my H and I were at the Marriage Breakthrough seminar, one of the assignments Michele gave was to list ways you could make your S feel loved. My H pegged mine beautifully too - but same story, just couldn't (wouldn't?) put in the effort. In my H's case I think it was a bit of a passive-agressive control thing (I could do this for you but, naaaa, don't think I will).
I dunno, just comisserating with you.
Still, your H is making way more effort than mine ever did! Maybe he'll get there in time - I sure hope.
Have a nice weekend, LL.
rjj
ok so...h is not happy...doesn't know what he wants...doesn't have any answers....doesn't know what we will do...know full well of my feelings...I even told him that there are some nights when I feel like getting in my car and driving as fast as I can away...h understood.
so anyway...after a bunch of circular conversation...I mentioned the bb (he already knows of it but I think assumes it's mostly people on my side of the sit) and that I've come across several people in his position...(the one who had an ea/pa...is unsure of the m...doesn't know etc) I let him know about char....how she felt when her h asked for commitment..that I understood how he felt when I asked him the same...then mentioned the "piece of crap" (ha ha) book that she had mentioned and how it was (she felt) non-threatening..and that there were activities in it etc...would he be interested in it...after a moment of silence he said sure...
so I knew and now I know...h isn't happy...so now I know neither of us is happy...I am at least wanting to do something about it...h isn't sure and doesn't know what to do...I let h know that though I may be deep (his description of me) and phycological (also his) I don't pretend to have it all figured out..that I am scared and I don't know what will happen or if it will work (us being happy together)
said something really cool about simply believing it possible and going from there...but you have to believe..h right now doesn't but wouldn't say so.
gave another cool analogy of the need to nuture a r...compared a r to of all things a lawn!!
great lawn...beautiful lawn...don't water it...don't fertelize it and suddenly your lawn has brown spots and is fading..can it be revived...sure but it will at first take a lot of work...lots of water...irrating and overseeding...fertelizer...etc...yes there will be some irriparable sections but those you patch with new saud (or loam I get them confused) and suddenly your lawn is looking pretty good again..and doesn't need as much attention...but you do have to keep tending to it.
it made sense to h.
we'll see where all this goes...maybe nowhere...
btw...h has been plowing ow's driveway..and did talk to her when he did so.
LL
Hey LL,
Thought I'd come over here and check on you. I like how that one couple has come on here together and posted on the same thread... and been open and honest with each other. Do you think your H would be able or willing to do that?
Hi LL,
Great way to have H understand sitch using the lawn. I think this is the best thing you could have done. Now he understands. Now get out the hose and fertilizer and start fixing those brown spots!
I am sure he loves you as I know you love him. Now you just have to do what it takes to be happy again. As everyone says, patience and baby steps. You are so close LL.
Thinking of you in this rain.
Dotto
Morning,LL..I like the lawn thing..he does get it... but on his level and his terms..some people(not just men I suppose)can't seem to be able to start the healing and fixing of a r..I question myself if h comes back where, how do we start..it is a scary thought..keep looking and talking for small things.It takes both people to repair..but one might do it differently..we..the db'r is probably going to be the one that has to work harder on what is working and what is not...we have learned so many tools, tricks, ideas..our s have not had all this "training"..they don't have a clue where to begin.
If you truly are unhappy with the m, unsure if you really love h and want to make the m work, then you have to look at that.. This is only my opinion, but you have to answer all these feelings that are going on with yourself first...if you can't both come back to the r with forgiveness,commitment and the need to really want to rebuild the m, then it probably is is not going to work. We can't force anyone to express their feelings the way we want them or think they should be done, I knew when I married my h, that he was not romantic, did not send flowers..gifts..I knew he was not a talker, could not express his feelings..I accepted him..did not always like it..wished he would just send me flowers for no reason..the little things..did it contribute to the breakdown..probably..but I missed all the good things and qualities that he does posess...as he did with me also..through the years, we did not know how to work on the important things that keep a marriage going..and I am not sure right now that I know how to..but that is what we are all learning.
Sue
thanks sue...you make a whole lot of sense!!
lots of things to talk about I'll wait til later...
think I'll be calling a lawyer tommorow though..
bought..dr phil...love lang...and the 7 principals of a successful r..and got asked out to coffee by a man at the book store...busy day for LL.
I don't know what will happen with this r...h doesn't know what he wants and I'm starting to not want to work on it either which is not good.
LL (should add that I declined the coffee invite but did get him to buy db...met him in the relationship/self help isle) sheesh LL can't go out for a half hour without someone being interested in her and her goofy h sits at home not interested in her??? what's wrong with this pic??
LL,
Fun to hear about you being asked out.
I hope your H will pick up 5LL. What do you think yours is? I was wondering, it seems from your threads that it might be physical touch.
I was pretty sure that mine would be quality time/doing things together, but now I actually think it is gifts. The thought behind a gift means the world to me. I was crying yesterday over a snapple coupon my H gave me,
Maybe not such a bad thing to give yourself a DB break for a bit, recharge.... Maybe H will decide he wants to do some of the work, who knows.
Hugs,
Acorn
LL is all done...call me a waw if you wish..but honestly I am not walking away from anything as there is no r here to walk away from and apparently not one to build either as one party just doesn't know what they want so they insist on doing nothing.
tommorow I will be calling a lawyer to shedule a consultation visit.
tonight h has been foolish enough to make the decision to go out...no destination...may or may not meet with buddie...will stay at appartment.
asked h to give me his ring...h said he will stop wearing it when he's not married anymore...(gee there's my answer isn't it...he doesn't want to be married)
told h I will sell my ring and use the money to pay for shool...h said do what you want it's your ring.
so then I believe I can officially say this m is over...I am one waw that will not be chased...persued or even asked to work on the r..as I am dealing with a wah.
so ladi da di da...time for LL to get a life...and get rid of the h who isn't.
LL
LL,
So sorry
You will be great no matter what happens, I just know it!
I'm still hoping for your H to open his eyes and kick his own butt for the way he's been. If you must WA, WA. But can you walk away and leave the door open a tad bit?
Hugs,
Acorn
Quote:
But can you walk away and leave the door open a tad bit?
the only way h would have any chance at me opening up to him is if he were to open up to me...which he wont do..h will need to do a lot of work on himself get to know himself..and actually be willing to work on the r.
h doesn't want to do any of that and wont...so really there is no point of leaving the door open...I left it open over the summer and someone disguised as a changed man came in only to later reveal the same old h that had left.
facts of the matter are that in all honesty I should have been the one to have an affair..leave and ask for a d...I just didn't do it...I know I can live without him...and know that the kids will be well provided for...there really is no reason for me to suffer in this r anymore...after all there really isn't a r here anyway...simply to people going through the motions.
I'd rather get a d than have an affair myself and that is what will happen if I stay in this m.
LL
Dear LL,
I hate to see you so discouraged, especially after all the support (and hope, a lot of the time) you have given me. As you know, I feel I know your H. I would have many of the same questions if my H returned, although it really doesn't look like I will have that opportunity.
I keep hoping your H will be willing to go to counselling with you, and that you can find a good C - if he truly is like my H, he would open up more with a professional present (which may well be why they are both avoiding C). It's crazy I know, that he won't share those things with you alone, but C may be the best way to find out what he is thinking / hoping / wanting. Then look to change some of the patterns between you. Still, if he won't go...
I am thinking of you LL, and I feel your pain
.
take care,
rjj
HI LL,
I am so sorry for your pain but you must do what is best for LL. You have certainly given more than 100% to this R. Someday your H will regret the great opportunity he has squandered.
I wish you well my friend and I'm here if you need a friend. It's the least I can do for you.
Dotto
Quoting KAW:
Waahoo!! Maybe we can get everyone here to do the wave for LL ... LOL
Actually, it just occured to me...I don't think your H has yet realized it is a consistant effort in order to make each day a better day. I truely believe he wants to LL, but probably is expecting that this stuff should just fall into place and doesn't realize that in order to make each day a better day, he has to put in an equal amount of effort if not more than he did the day before. He doesn't know that what he did today will not continue to carry the same momentum into tomorrow, but thinks it should. So he doesn't realize that he has to do it all over again, day after day.
Anyway, so glad to hear you received a warm Valentine from your husband.
'til later,
KAW
so then how to if I even care to at this point...get him to understand the momentum needs to continue??? I cant persue for fear of rejection...I am at a loss...
sitting here....confident that I will call a lawyer tommorow and start the d myself...then I go back and read this thread and see the good days...and wonder...is there still hope?? can I do something to bring the good days closer together...can this m be saved.
will h come home tonight (he wasn't going to but s called him when going to bed and asked if he'd be here when the sun came up so I assume he'll crawl in round 3...will he sleep on the couch...will he crawl into bed...)
I don't know anymore...I don't know from day to day what h will come through the door...the happy one who gives me a warm kiss on the cheek or the one who gives me the obligatory peck?
I know what things h does and doesn't do that effect my moods...
I don't know what things I do or don't do that effect h's moods.
and h wont give me an answer....maybe he doesn't know...
maybe he's just a "guy"
we'll see what tommorow brings..but I still plan to talk to a lawyer just to get the informantion.
LL
LL
Here your (((((((((hug)))))))))
I feel your pain, and I hope you don't give up.
I agree H needs kick in the head/wake up call, and you need a break from him, no contact till your head/heart clears.
my 2c
Make a list of changes/your needs for him to meet.
If he makes an effort, give a little reward. But be firm.
Do you have a goals list?
Poe
PS: Tell him about the guy who tried to pick you up. Don't give any details when he ask questions, make him wonder.
LL,
I can ask you out in the book store, if you would like, I am sure my W would not mind...
Hey, I know it is frustrating, but, sharing one of the advises I was offered, get away from the drama for a while. Take the expectations and disppoitment away for a while in your daily life. Enjoy yourself and the company of the kiddo. it is tiring to think of them every day. That would not work for any of us, as it just wears us out.
Have a great night...
Chuck
Quote:
PS: Tell him about the guy who tried to pick you up. Don't give any details when he ask questions, make him wonder.
told him just after...I was sitting in my car outside the book store when he called to ask when I'd be home because he was planning to go out tonight. I let him know I had just been asked to coffee by a man...h said ...you do what you need to do!!
WTF???
h is a looney!!!
I must be a looney!!!
I should have said yes to the guy...I did after all meet him in the relationship section and most of our talk was me pushing the db/dr books on him.
I probably shouldn't be saying all this here cause he may just show up on this site!! then I'd be really
.
I do love my h. I don't want to give up. I do believe we can be very happy together. I just am tired of trying.
I've just been reading some in a book about affairs...I don't know if this is h's first or not...suppose that doesn't really matter..
there is a section about split selves...people who tend to do the right thing..people pleasers etc...
I would tend to think that fits both h and myself.
a r like this doesn't fare well...as one is always trying to please the other and ends up neglecting their own needs etc..
unlike h I am way too in touch with my emotions..the are very on the surface...I can cry at the drop of a hat!!
h keeps his at bay.
the affair in a split self person...can look like an mlc...they find passion...life...emotion..etc...and often attribute these things to the op..(h has done that)
what needs to happen in this scenario...is personal reflection..growth..etc.
I have done alot of that have been doing it for years now...sorting through the whats and hows of my persona..reflecting back to childhood wounds and making amends with most of them..learning and growing.
I don't see that h has done that...and in order for our r to go anywhere (or any r for that matter as even with ow..after a while she will burn out too..he needs to have ownership of his own passion..emotions etc and can't give her the keys to himself no one should hold the key..you should hold your own!! mho)
h is not in touch with his emotions etc...
the section of the book made a whole lot of sense to me...I marked the section and left it on the table...h probably wont read it and again it will just be me being deep and pshycological while h wants to just hide.
I feel like calling h and telling him that I love him and I'm sorry but I can't do this anymore if he is unwilling to do the work with me.
I wont because I know I will be met with silence and that will frustrate me.
time to do as my first piecing thread was tittled and "keep my mouth shut"
and that's that!!
LL
Morning LL,
I hope today is a better day for you. I think it's wise to reread your old threads and see how far you've come. As Chuck said and I concur, it gets so tiring to always be the one trying. I slept two hours last night which is typical because I ponder the R and how I can make it better.
I finally realized it's out of my hands.
If that is the book I gave you I remember the section. It realy is true. I do believe they don't know who they are. Deanna86 said to me yesterday to remember that they are in such deep pain. I hadn't thought of that. Perhaps Mr. LL is also in deep pain.
Should he address the pain and try to resolve it? Absolutely. Can you help him? If he lets you and if you want to.
As you've told me so many times you are a wonderful, beautiful, intelligent, loving, caring woman. You deserve to be happy.
One day I know you will be.
In my thoughts and prayers.
{{{LL}}}
Dotto
well h didn't come home last night and though he told son he'd be here when the sun came up and also told me that he'd set his alarm for 5 so he'd be here at six it is now 8 and no h. h called and left a message for s only at 7 30 saying he's on his way.
let's see LL's life.
LL get's engaged...4 months later learns her father is having an affair..
LL gets married...parents finalize their d
LL and H buy townhouse....mother sells home and each parent buy their own place
LL pregnant with son...is told brothers wife is having an affair and they are getting a d
LL gives birth to dd...3 months later discovers her h is having an a (though he denies it being anymore than a friendship at the time) and h moves out for a week
LL has family over for easter...LL is told by h that he doesn't want to be her h anymore and moves out to his parents
by june...h says he wants a d
by october h says he confused and wants to try to come home...mostly mentioning need for son to be ok.
feb...LL wants a d and her h will not try to stop her.
aint life grand!!!!
LL
LL has called the lawyer and awaits a return call to set up a consultation...h called again to talk to son...son doesn't want to talk to him!!
h is on his way home...kinda dumb don't ya think..it's now 8 he may not get here til 9 will then have to turn right back around and go to his office.
I should never have married this man..I knew he didn't love me then.
LL
8:30 h calls again...son still wont talk to him...still hasn't left his apartment yet but still plans to come to see son...so much for being here when the sun comes up.
I told him to not bother as he's already missed the point of what son had asked him...when the sun comes up...means when I wake up..son woke up at 7:30 and didn't bother to ask for daddy..he just wasn't here and when he called son didn't want to talk to him...can't force the phone on a boy who is holding his hands over his ears saying I don't want to say hi.
I told h that I've called the lawyer...h asked what did I say to him..I let him know the office wasn't yet open so I've left a message for them to call me back to sched an appointment.
h says nothing...
I let h know it is not what I want to do..but I'm given no choice...I can't be in a r with someone who wont even discuss basic feelings with me...that I will become an angry resentful bit ch and I don't want to be thought of that way so I must end it before then.
h still says nothing.
I ask did you hang up on me...h says no If I hung up on you would I answer you...I said it is what I would ask and if I got no answer then I'd know you did.
all h has to say is please don't file..give me some time...it's not what I want I just don't know what I want or what to do.
but h wont say that because he doesn't have a clue how he feels so he'd rather just let me go so I can be happy.
I love my h honestly I do...but I can't live in this r any longer...if I continue I will start to hate him and that I don't want. so I must end the pain.
LL
LL,
Do what is in your heart. Remember what you told me. D is only a piece of paper. Maybe H will realize what he is losing and come looking for you. Hopefully it won't be too late.
Dotto
