Time for a new thread. I am not even sure what number this is, I just know the number is high! The name of my thread says it all. As each day ends and I close my eyes, I think about my day, how it effected me, and what I feel inside. Sometimes unsettled, but mostly at peace. The last few weeks have been difficult for me, I have been feeling a bit overwhelmed, but I am feeling more grounded and rebalanced and at the end of the day, my goal is to feel that peace within.
Tonight I took S to H. S was upset and has been complaining about going to dad's. I suggested he talk it out with his dad, S says he can't talk to dad. I told him to talk to him the way he talks to me, he shook his head. I couldn't help it, I told S that he does a great job of talking and communicating with me and to make sure he does that with his future wife! Lol. I added he should do the same with daddy.
So, dumb me, I let H know we were on our way and gave him a heads up that S has been having a hard time staying over there..I told him it's not him, it's just not home. I know, I know, what did I expect other than for H to feel that it was a guilt attack? I wasn't thinking, other than feeling frustrated that my child has to deal with this.
H replied that yes, it's a different place and thanked me for letting him know. Said he will talk to him...then it came. The 2nd TM saying S is too consumed with his games and H is only trying to get him to do things like a boy should like play outside and fix things . He believes that is the reason he doesn't like to go there, said he knows I would say his choices are his problem, and that he is accepting responsibility for that, but he is trying to expose him to things. Ended by saying that he is not telling me to change anything or worry about it, that he was just talking....
Well....wow! I don't get his talking very often so I was pleased with him opening up. So I let him know that I have the same issues at home with S, that S is a kid being a kid and that I deal by picking my battles.
Did I say something wrong???
He came back with he doesn't have the time with S that I do. Said he knows it's not my problem but he just can't let S play his games all the time and that he has to continue doing what he thinks is right even though he believes that contributes to him not wanting to be there.
Sigh, he obviously took this as a personal attack, no? And I see him putting blame blame blame like I let S do whatever he wants and H has rules so it's all my fault. Yes, S and I sit on the couch playing games all night and day, that is why he gets perfect grades, that I do every school project with him, why I am the only one who bathes the kid...yes, nothing but a picnic here at home.
Please give me any perspective here...although I know better to stay out of H and S relationship. It's just hard to see my kid unhappy whenever he has to go there.
So anyway, I was going to leave it at that and not reply. But I was bothered by this image he portrays of me. It is not who I am nor how I feel so I chose to speak up. I replied....
Please stop thinking and speaking for me in your head, I don't feel any of us deserve anything painful or difficult. All 3 of us are amazing people who deserve happiness. I am doing my best at home, I really was just letting you know what has gone on recently. Enjoy your night with him.
That brought me peace. I felt I stood up for myself without attacking. He can think what he wants, I know who I am and what I do.
Well, that apparently did the trick, he has sent several texts joking around... I was replying joking back but stopped. Time to do some yoga. I just can't figure this man out!
You did nothing wrong. You explained the situation to him and you both have different ways of interacting w/your son. At least you both have stated what was on your mind w/respect to your son.
Also, by responding back and addressing his response back to you was very good. At least he can see that you aren't attacking him or making him out to be the bad guy.
Continue to keep the communication lines open. You are doing great.
That communication exchange between you two sounds very healthy. It is best you clarified. So much is lost in translation via text as you cannot hear tone. (Unless we are talking about my H13 who has mastered the fine art of the teenage text rant! Lol.)
I think it is great that you two ended up joking, too! Keep it up!
Went on field trip with S yesterday to visit a local park where the Ohlone Indians lived. It was fun!
Later met up at school with H for teacher parent conference. Straight A's, we are very proud of S!
Later that night, I TM H that I had S set up for day camp next week but to let me know if he had any time off so I could fix the schedule and adjust the payment. He was a little confused and asked if I had anything I could give him with S days off of school. I told him I had given him the school calendar....He said he was confused because I had not written that info on the monthly calendar pages I print out for his fridge, to keep us coordinated. Lol, I couldn't believe he admitted that! So I joked back that if he needed help transferring the info from the school calendar to his fridge calendar, to let me know. He joked back.
Got TM from him today: Hello. I'm trying to get an early start on figuring Thanksgiving out. Let me know if you have already set plans or when we can talk about it thanks, hope you are having a good day so far.
Not really clear what he means? Does he mean who is taking S what day? Does he mean how are we doing this? So after thinking, I decided to be 100% open and honest in hopes of getting the same from him, possibly getting into his head, whichever way it goes:
Hello. I don't have any set plans yet other than stuffing myself! I am really not sure what to do about the holidays. I'm pretty confused about it all. Let me know your thoughts, we can talk anytime. Have a good day too.
I think your runaway h is hoping that you'll invite him to dinner. I don't think he's asking about where your son will be, i.e., w/you or him...it's all about coming over and playing the Disney Dad for the holiday. I hope that I'm wrong about this...but it sounds like he's hinting for an invite.
Hi Job. Lol, if he is expecting that, it's not happening. I have not heard back from him yet....He is the master of silence so not surprised
I am not really expecting any change in my plans to celebrate separate...it would take some grand change or statement from him to change my feelings about that....I am hoping to get an idea on where he is at...you know how badly being kept in the dark is driving me crazy!
If he simply comes back with who will have S on which day, I suppose I need to hear that from him. Otherwise I somewhat worry that if I am the one to decide this without hearing him out first, I may worry "what if" Does that make sense? Something is on his mind for him to ask me about it, I want to hear it.
If he comes back with we should all be together, this will possibly initiate an R talk...I know I know, I won't push it, could be really dangerous or could give me the chance to hear some things I need to hear, good and/or bad.
I had decided to let him approach me about this since I had already thrown some feelers out there, I just wasn't expecting it so soon. I am glad he brought it up. The ball is in his court, a definite 180 for me as I normally call the shots.
All I know is that I am making a Thanksgiving meal for S and I. I got all the fixings tonight! And I also know that no matter how this goes, I am going to enjoy the 4 day weekend
Straight A's! Well done to him! As for Thanksgiving, I agree with Job. I think the message from your H was testing the waters to see...did she really mean what she was saying about doing separate stuff during the holidays?
If you don't want to do stuff together, maybe reply on the basis of I'd like to do X and Y with S....when are you hoping to have him with you?
I recognise the whole calling the shots thing. I used to do a lot of that. For Xmas, I would do a calendar of the holidays and make sure we had a good spread of things planned. I realise now that I took too much responsibility for others on and whilst it was partly good and we did some great stuff, it could also be stressful for me and maybe a bit stifling for others? BTW, I managed to miss the Costco reveal....fabulous!! That is a moment I would like to have seen
Take care xx
Thanks Sotto. I also tend to make the plans, make the decisions, and have sometimes wondered why I don't let others have some say. It is one of the things I am trying to change about myself, which is a big reason I was wanting to see what H has to say first.
However, I feel a bit annoyed with myself. I set this boundary, was adamant about it. And with one text he [censored] me in to wondering if I am doing the right thing.
So I have been really thinking, and I do still feel adamant about him needing to live the single life he chose. Until that changes, until he comes to me with a change of tune, I need to stand firm. If we did Thanksgiving together without that, I believe I would be kicking myself...
I still have not heard from him but he had S last night so I prefer he give his attention to him. I plan on sending him a message today that I would like to split Thanksgiving, since I will have S in the morning, I would like him for first 1/2 of day for breakfast and he can have him for dinner. S and I can do our own Thanksgiving dinner on Friday, I am ok with that.
This is hard, really [censored]
Hi Mleigh - I am reading along and just want to lend my support.
It is a hard situation. I can understand all the emotion and logic at play. I am thinking of you.
Hi mleigh
I am so pleased you are sticking to your boundry, its so easy to waiver and give in; I suspect that if you did agree to spending t/giving with h you would be kicking yourself afterwards.
He made this choice, he needs to see what it actually means for him.
Stand firm and stay strong lovely lady, I am cheering you on from over here !!
Thank you guys! Your strong vibes worked. I decided, what is it I am waiting to hear first from H?? I have been waiting over 2 years and look what that has gotten me! Lol
I TM H today my idea and plans for Thursday and Friday. He replied:
Sounds Good....my dad is making food and said whoever wants to can come over so I'll tell him I'll be there afternoon.
Was that a half a$$ invite? Oh lucky me, maybe I am now a whoever. Well, if so, at least I got that! Or maybe hinting that this is his only option? I replied great, glad it works out.
Whew, got that planned and feel really excited about my Thursday breakfast and dinner with S on Friday. I am getting invites from friends on Thursday so I am looking forward to a Thanksgiving twist! Something different sounds great. My family is having dinner too, but they are an hour and half away, and that would involve picking up my mom, so I prefer to stay in town.
Now Christmas will be a whole different story, I don't think either of us will give up Christmas morning. So get ready for my spin on that!! Lol.
This is new ground for me, but your support is getting me through it. Thank you!!!
Hi mleigh
So pleased for you t/giving is sorted. Now you can look forward to the festivities with your s and friends.
Was that a half a$$ invite? Oh lucky me, maybe I am now a whoever. Well, if so, at least I got that! Or maybe hinting that this is his only option? I replied great, glad it works out.
You are reading waaaaaaaaay to much into this statement and giving your h waaaaaaay to much credit to be able to give you secret coded messages lol. I read his answer as just what he said - a statement - his dad is making food and all welcome ; which means anyone, as in neighbors, friends and the lady who works in the corner market ....... that is how I read it.
I wonder if you are feeling a little sad that h did not suggest what I think you deep down wanted him to - he is not ready yet, he has not yet experienced life without mleigh at his beck n call, give him the time and space he needs and you continue to make the fantastic progress you have been making. Focus on making your hols a special time for you and s.
Your doing so well :o)
Hi Lou. Are you sure there is no coded message there? That makes it so boring! Lol. Ya, your right. I tend to overanalyze.
IDK if I was hoping for something different. I really can't imagine sitting down for Thanksgiving dinner with my H right now. And I know I don't feel like cooking my famous prime rib for him. But ya, maybe a part of me hopes he misses me during that day. A part of me hopes he wonders why he chose this...
Mleigh- Nice job! As for potentially reading too much into things, let's remember his calendar dilemma. Oi! It is AMAZING some of these MLCers are able to hold down jobs given their foggy thinking.
Best not to even bother trying to read the MLC tea leaves. Lol!!
Hi mleigh,
You handled the Thanksgiving plans beautifully. Christmas is going to be tricky for a lot of us this year. I am not going to miss my girls opening up their gifts on Christams morning. That's non negotiable.
It's so nice to get so much approval from you all, the support here really means the world to me. I so wish we were all in the same community so we could get together!
Something keeps tugging at me, as Lou caught, I don't know how you can read me the way you do. It got me thinking, what is it that feels unsettled to me? I don't want H here in the house for Thanksgiving. I don't want to be with his family. I certainly don't want an invite to his house.
The picture that keeps coming to mind is us together about 6 years ago. Together as a family, excited about the holidays and getting our son excited about it too. I miss what we had and I very much miss my old H. What hurts is accepting those times are gone and accepting the way things are now. This is our first time doing a holiday separate except the first Thanksgiving after BD. I am furious inside about having to split time with my son, furious with H for putting us through this, but I am making the best of it. So thank you Lou for pointing that out, it got me thinking and I can put that feeling to rest now.
I told S our plans last night. He wasn't thrilled and asked me what I was going to do Thanksgiving night and if I would have a Thanksgiving dinner? I assured him I would be with friends and that we would have a great meal together on Friday.
I have S this weekend and I actually don't have 1000 things to do! So I plan on enjoying it. I have the carpet cleaning guy coming to my house today to clean, compliments of my cousin for watching his dog. He also is taking me to dinner Monday night as a thank you. I also think I will venture under the house to pull out the Christmas decorations. I get so creeped out under there, I hate spiders! Also, S and I ordered boxes of solar string lights to hang around the house as Christmas lights. I won't be climbing up on the roof! But we can line our yard with these and save money on the electric bill!
I also am waiting to hear back from the handyman. He came out on Thursday and I am waiting on his estimate to clean gutters and fix leaking pipe. You know, the pipe H insisted on fixing and seems to have completely forgotten about, as expected.
I hope you all have a great weekend!!
I want to add to my post above...yes I am furious with H, with his family, with his genes, with whatever brought this madness on that has affected so many people...me, my son, our families and friends, co-workers, so many...
I also am aware that I am pretty sure this isn't easy on H either. I am not happy about splitting Thanksgiving but it's my choice to do this as it feels the right thing to do right now, and I will go through this with compassion and respect for H. I will stay friendly and wish him a nice day. I will continue to stand firm on my personal boundaries while keeping the door open and light on. I still love my H and I hope he knows I am still here for him.
I know many of us here will have struggles this week. Let's keep our hearts open and chins up, stay strong and try to remember that our spouse is in crisis. Who knows where we may be this time next year. Let's continue learning and living.
Many hugs to you all
Mleigh - it is so understandae to have those frustrations. You are right, their MLC impacts so many lives and it is painful to watch them morph into the very opposite of who they were. Suddenly, we are married to stangers.
And yes, many of us are struggling through the holiday this week. Your words are uplifting and compassionate! You are doing so well. Keep your chin up and keep up the good work!!
It's so nice to get so much approval from you all, the support here really means the world to me. I so wish we were all in the same community so we could get together!
I think I’m in the same area you are. I know I’m very close to where Cali is. We should get together
.
Hey Bright. I am in Gilroy, which is near San Jose. Cali is more Southern CA. Which are you close to?
Oh, for some reason I though you are in SoCal. I'm in Southern CA. I've been to Gilroy and San Jose.
I want to add to my post above...yes I am furious with H, with his family, with his genes, with whatever brought this madness on that has affected so many people...me, my son, our families and friends, co-workers, so many...
I also am aware that I am pretty sure this isn't easy on H either. I am not happy about splitting Thanksgiving but it's my choice to do this as it feels the right thing to do right now, and I will go through this with compassion and respect for H. I will stay friendly and wish him a nice day. I will continue to stand firm on my personal boundaries while keeping the door open and light on. I still love my H and I hope he knows I am still here for him.
I know many of us here will have struggles this week. Let's keep our hearts open and chins up, stay strong and try to remember that our spouse is in crisis. Who knows where we may be this time next year. Let's continue learning and living.
Many hugs to you all
This is great, MLeigh. I'm sure many of us are thankful for this very healthy perspective on our spouse's MLC crisis. We all go through anger,sadness, confusion, and pain. But its nice to be reminded that this is a painful and confusing process for them, as well, and we love them still.
I'll take those hugs, (along with your words of wisdom) if you don't mind, and send many more back to you! Enjoy this new version of your holidays!
We just moved from San Clemente to Texas...big change. I miss my socal.
Hello all and Happy Thanksgiving.
I just dropped off my son with H. S and I had a great start to our day with a big breakfast. S is not happy to have had to leave and is not happy to be going to FIL but we are looking forward to our own meal together tomorrow.
Not much to update on H other then he seems to be in a real confused state lately. Interaction and trying to coordinate things with him this last week have been truly exhausting. He also has been having those moments of a bunch of chit chat texting, then back to total silence.
This morning I got the Happy Thanksgiving and the last minute invite to his dad's, he said he wanted to make sure I knew I was welcome to go. I started out with a Happy Thanksgiving back and a thanks but I already made plans. I also added a truth dart that of course I did not think I was invited. That when I had asked him about the holiday all I got was silence. Then told him what time I could have son over to him. I had to say something, nothing he has said recently was an invite with them, but I kept it light and friendly.
He said he was sorry, that he did not remember me asking if I could go but that he would have told me I was welcome to go.
I clarified, no I never asked to go, I asked his thoughts on how to spend the holiday and got nothing...
And once again, I got nothing. It's like talking to a rock, there is just nothing there. So I dropped off S, we were both very friendly. I told S to save some room in his tummy for tomorrow. H asked me what is tomorrow? I said, it's my Thanksgiving meal with S. He looked so dang confused you guys.
I told him all of this by text when we set the plans. I truly don't know how he is functioning at work because what little I deal with him, he seems totally out of it. I really believe he is confused about why the day has been split and why we are doing things separate. I think he truly believed everything was going to go down like normal. The look of confusion on his face said it all. I have no words for it really other than it is just so bizarre. It's like he doesn't understand what is happening or why.
I am heading to my friends ranch now for dinner, wine and board games. I am so looking forward to it, I even get to bring my dog! We will see how tomorrow goes. I still feel pangs of guilt for not inviting H to me and S Thanksgiving feast tomorrow, but I think S and I are better off doing it alone.
I hope you all have love in your lives today. Enjoy
They actually compartmentalize things and that's how they are able to function at work in most cases. Their brains are a mess right now and until things settle down for them, the wires tend to be crossed all over the place.
I do hope that your time w/friends was a pleasant one and today, you get to have dinner w/your son. He will be happy to be home, w/mom and his fur babies and a nice meal.
Enjoy your day!
Hi Job, I always love hearing from you and hope you had a nice Thanksgiving. Thank you for the explanation. I often wonder how he functions at work because when dealing with me he has no sense of time and doesn't seem to comprehend things well.
I had a wonderful Thanksgiving last night. My friends ranch house is beautiful, my dog had a blast running around.
H TM this morning that he was heading son over soon and asked me if I was making prime rib. Yep, I think you and others are right, he wants an invite. He also asked about switching his night with son from Saturday night to Sunday night because some last minute plans came up. I did not really give him an answer to either question, just said see you guys soon.
Here is where I need some advise. I have plans to go to a cookie party tomorrow night. However, I have been feeling really tired, like I am fighting a bug, and would actually rather just stay home with son. BUT, do I let H just do a last minute switch like that???
When he got here, he went straight to the kitchen, saw the prime rib sitting in the sink, pointed at it and said "I knew it!" I laughed, told him yes I am making prime rib, that my friend and husband got wind of it too and are now joining son and I for dinner, I told him you are welcome if you want....I felt kind of put on the spot to be honest, but he said no, wasn't big enough to feed everyone...which is true. I got a small one thinking it would just be S and I.
He again asked about switching nights, I told him my plans are a bit hard to get out of and said he should have let me know sooner. He said he knows, the plans just came up today. Of course he did not tell me what they are. I said I don't know, I really don't have time to think about it right now but will let him know...ya...I am just putting him off. So he pushed, asked if my plans are for late or if he could have his mom watch S and I could pick him up after my plans. I told him maybe, I don't know, will let him know...
Truth? I would love to stay home and have a quiet night with S, especially now that I am having friends over tonight...but I also feel H should learn his responsibilities and life as a single dad...although his enabling mother will bail him out, but I know S would rather be at home...if I cancel my plans, I am doing it for S not for H....
Advice??
If you don't feel up to going tomorrow night, then don't. However, if you want to go, then go. Your h needs to learn to coordinate time w/you earlier rather than at the last minute. His mother could watch your son until you are ready to come home/pick him up.
Tomorrow may give you the answer you are searching for because you may be coming down w/something and then you'll most likely stay at home w/your son.
I figured it out. My son is going to have dinner and tree decorating with his BFF. H can do his thing and I can do the cookie party for a couple of hours, (if I feel up to it) then pick up S and bring him home with me. I also told H that since I won't really be with S much tomorrow night, I still want my Sunday night with him. No switch.
I took care of a problem for H that was really his problem. I guess I am not much better than his enabling mother. But I did it for S. He does not want to go to his grannies for the night, and I don't really like him over there anyway with her a$$ husband, and I would have been thinking about that all night and not enjoyed myself. This works out for everyone and S will have a great time
Yay mommy!
I'm very happy to read that everything is sorted out and both you and your son can go somewhere and enjoy yourselves.
Have fun!
Hi Mleigh-just dropping a line to say I hope you had fun at your cookie night and hope that you feel better.
And I am right there with you on how mind blowing the MLC confusion is. Once after I could see that H knew he was very confused, I asked him if he saw fog and a tunnel. And I told him I was worried about him. (I figured he may not even remember me asking and I was curious.) He said he did not see fog nor a tunnel. (LOL.)
He asked me if I thought he was losing his memory. He looked worried. I said no. I told him to give it time and reassured him that he was not starting dementia. He was very thoughtful and quiet. I could tell from his face that he knew something was wrong. Very sad.
Hi Hawho. Thank you for stopping by. You know, asking H any kind of personal questions has become a taboo thing for me throughout this crisis, but I think I am ready to give it a try. A simple "how are you doing" is in order. Your post made me realize I never ask him anything...
I made it through my Thanksgiving weekend and am happy with how it all went. I have no regrets about how it all went down with H. We did our separate things and I kept my promise of keeping it light and friendly.
H came yesterday to pick up S. His 11:00 arrival was more like noon. I expected that as his time management has gone out the window. He brought me a timer for the Christmas lights I set up. We had one here but couldn't find it anywhere. He also brought some supplies to fix the leaking pipe. He heard the handyman had looked at it and whoosh, he is fixing it! Lol.
He was outside in the front for about an hour working on it. During that time, I heard neighbors outside, people walking by, wild turkeys gobbling in the distance, our dog running around...and as I sat in the house with S, I wondered if H missed any of this. You know, all the sounds of home.
When he was done, he came in. Me and S were both sitting at the kitchen table doing our own thing. H just stood and looked at us for a moment quiet until we both looked up and smiled...I asked him all done? He said that should do it. He then laid back on the sofa chair and called dog over to snuggle.
After a few minutes, I got up to get S things together to go with his dad. H was still laid back on the chair and I had a flash of curling up in the crook of his arm like I used to do any time he was in that position. H caught my eyes and I looked away, didnt want him to see that thought.
We chatted a bit, was a nice mini visit. He even complimented me a couple of times about different things I was concerned about, saying he knows I can do it.
H left with S and I got to baking. What a nightmare. I am a cooker, not a baker. I forgot the eggs in the first batch, then forgot to do the criss cross in my peanut butter cookies on the second batch, but I managed to make a plate of cookies! Before leaving, I was snuggled on the couch with dog watching The Santa Claus and got very close to flaking on the party! But I don't flake so off I went.
There must have been 30 different kinds of cookies and tons of food! A great idea for a party, but I was really feeling tired, so I stayed a short while, got S and went home...
Oh, that reminds me. My friend, mom of S BFF, had texted before picking up S from H to take with her that she had texted H last night and that day to confirm the pick up but never heard back from him. So she was checking with me to make sure the plans were still on. She has already mentioned to me before that she is done trying to coordinate get togethers for the boys with H because it is just too difficult! Lol. Boy do I understand! Anyway, H Finally responded to her and all was fine.
S told me he had a great time with them at their family get together and that he even met a new friend.
Back in the day, I would have lost sleep and stressed wondering what last minute plans H had made that he would give up a night with S for. I am curious about it, but it did not consume me.
S and I were in bed at 10 and both slept until 9 this morning. I think this busy weekend has caught up to us. Today, I vow to rest all day!! And watch lots of movies....and eat leftovers.
Happy Sunday
Well, is the pipe fixed? That is so funny that he finally fixed it before the handyman came back to do so.
Yes, it's time to ask some very simple/basic questions. It doesn't hurt, but remember that you have to keep your expectations at zero.
Your baking was a challenge...wasn't it? That's okay. At least you can now sit back and chuckle over that challenge yesterday.
I'm glad you went to the party and had a great time. Parties always tend to have so much food and so many different goodies this time of the year. It's hard to decide what to eat at those things.
Son had a good time too. That's wonderful and I bet both of you were tired at the end of the day.
Enjoy the rest of today and smile...because both you and your son had a great day yesterday.
Well, I got my mini R talk that I have been whining about for months.
I took S to H place tonight. As S went in the house, H told me to not get mad but he wanted to talk to me about S. He said he talked to S about him not liking to go to his place, and S told him that I don't make him do chores like he does. I admitted I am not good at having S do chores, but I do have him clean up after himself. H listed things he has S do like empty the dishwasher and put his clean clothes away....I told him I just tend to do things that need to be done without thinking about it, but I will make an effort to have S do some things to see if that changes his tune....but I added, don't you think maybe it's more than just that? I told H that he knows S hates being away from home, he has his pets and things at home, I said who would want to go back and forth between places?? I told H that S has told me that he simply just doesn't like daddy's place.
H agreed that he is sure it all plays a part... again told me don't get mad, but to try the chore thing. So I told him, don't worry, I am not going to get mad and that I hoped at this point we could talk about anything...
So I took my chance and asked him, how are you doing anyway? He shrugged and gave an "eh" He said it's tough being away from S and not being able to spend much time with him. So I swept my arm around his place and asked, well, is this the answer for you? He said if he knew what the answer was, that he would know what to do.
I said, if you see yourself staying here for good, please tell me because I would want to know.
He said don't hold yourself back from doing anything...
I told him, I know I can do whatever I want at this point, but we are still legally married and I am just not that kind of person who could ignore that....He said he knows how I am and that I couldnt.
Then he exclaimed, you seem happier! You are doing things around the house and you just seem a lot happier.
I told him that I wouldn't say I am happier, but I am happy. I said that has nothing to do with you, I realized that a person isn't who makes you happy or unhappy and I finally realized my unhappiness wasn't because of him. I told him I got really buried in being a wife, a mom, working and I just totally lost myself. I have finally found myself again and am happy just being myself again.
He was quiet. So I told H to please know he can talk to me about anything anytime, and I always want to know the truth even if it's not what I want to hear.
It was a very calm and friendly conversation. No anger or judgment.
So, we will see if and how that gets processed, but it seems he is still in his haze. Just needed to know!
Hi Mleigh - I think you did a great job of communicating to your H that you are open to hearing more from him.
It sounds like he is just ambling along. I do find it interesting that he seemed to take notice that you seemed happy.
Nice work sneaking in a quick temperature read.
I agree w/HaWho...a great job on communicating w/your "teenager". He doesn't have any idea what he's going to do in the future, much less next week. At least you were able to get a temperature check w/o him realizing what you were doing.
I do find it interesting that he noticed you are happy. I'm glad he did.
Thanks guys. Ya, it was a nice peek into H head. Yep, still fog ridden!
I wonder about the Happy comment. Was it...He thinks I am happier without him therefore he stays away? Or was it a justification to ease his guilt of what he is doing? Hmmmm, not sure and won't waste my time on that one.
I also realized, yes it is sad he does not get a whole lot of time with S. Although it's his doing, still sad. However, I did not go through having difficulty in getting pregnant twice, losing our first son and 36 hours of labor to have a part time child. The best part is, I waited, for the right guy, someone who would be a great father and husband and never abandon us as my own father did. I waited so long that I didn't finally have my son until I was 37....
And here we are...
But, I will just get that off my chest here. It's neither here nor there, right? As Forrest said, life is like a box of chocolates. I choose instead of bitterness, to appreciate all the wonderful things I have in my life. I choose to cherish my time with S. I choose to keep that peace, it helps me to sleep at night
Mleigh, my dad left too. And, I did everything in my power, I thought, to prevent my kids suffering that pain of abandonment... And, they got it worse than I did.
I want to know how to stop the cycle so my girls don't go through this too. I think that's where there is value in looking at it. Why/how did I marry someone capable of this?
Heather, do you think we saw someone in our spouse that needed to be "saved"? Maybe we didn't realize it? Maybe our choice of H had something directly to do with our fathers?
Something to think about....
I think I saw something familiar in Matt. I felt a pull. Maybe part of that was God wanting me to be with someone where I could learn specific lessons. I still feel the pull (but, no worries--enjoying the blocked thing). I don't regret my marriage. But, I don't want my girls to suffer through this same thing.
I think the person I was at 19 was amazed ANYONE would love me. AMAZED. And, after surviving a terrible situation at home, I was overjoyed to feel GOOD! In love.
I overlooked the red flags I was mature enough to notice. I also didn't have much by way of lessons in that area. I had a mom who suffered terribly with codependency and sorta saw herself as deserving of being the shid on the bottom of someone else's shoe. She is still with someone who considers her lazy and has cheated on her at least twice.
As a mom, I'm sure I would have pointed out Matt's red flags... My mom did say, I think he is still immature and you may reach a point where you will outgrow him. And, Matt was clean for two years in N.A. when we married. I don't know. For me, I think I married the right person... but, he didn't stay clean and I had my own issues that I couldn't seem to conquer WITHIN the marriage.
Had a recent situation with my daughter which makes me feel a little better about my kids... My 21-year-old daughter was dating this cute, apparently nice frat boy. After a few weeks, he showed off some weirdness... he was really clingy. Hates his family. Has a bitchy mother. He became upset when he couldn't get in touch with Cal. He overreacted when she watched a movie innocently with another guy. Then! He showed her some marks on his arm where he had burned himself with a cigarette while drunk at a party.
When Cal shared the first stuff, I wasn't controlling about it, but I DID share my concerns. Hey, ya know this guy sounds like he has some issues. Don't let him slow you down. Be aware with this one and watch yourself. He sounds a bit controlling. I trust you will make a good decision, but I have these concerns... Yadda, Yadda...
When she told me about the cigarette burns. BAM!! That's when Mama Bear stepped in. I told her to end it. I don't trust this boy with my daughter and he sounds troubled. When she said he threatened to hurt himself if she broke up... BAM! Mama Bear got more persistent and told her she needed to end this right now. End it.
She did. She was going to end it anyway.
MLeigh,
Just answered my own question. I feel so much better. My girls will be OKAY! Why? Because... I've learned that there's more to a relationship than the pull you feel.
The pull is great... But, there needs to be more and you CANNOT ignore any red flags. Hopefully, because Us MOMs have had this experience, we are more tuned into the red flags now.
I've been dating. I now see that I can turn someone away even if they are attractive to me. I deserve someone with his shid together.
And, if my daughters marry someone with these issues. I can, hopefully, be an example of how important it is to have your OWN life... a life which will continue even if your spouse has a nervous breakdown.
Great insight Heather:) We can only do our best to raise our children to have strong values and self respect. I think after what we have been through, we will be extra attentive and aware of our children's romantic choices!
Hello. Just a weekend check in.
Enjoying a very nice and mellow weekend with my son. It's nice and needed after having such a busy Thanksgiving weekend. Watched S buddy for a few hours Friday night. Went on a walk this morning with my girlfriend and dog, I was even able to drag S along!
I finally got a bolt lock put on my front door. I have had nothing but a simple lock, it has bothered me for years and especially now that S and I are home alone. I have not told H, and I don't have a key for him, I don't see any reason to. However, I let S know where the keys are hidden outside in case we ever got locked out.
I put out more Christmas decorations inside and outside the house. A guy was driving by while I was outside. He stopped to tell me "looking good!" Nice to hear
I assume he was talking about my decorations? Lol
I am making plans with friends for the next few weekends, to keep S and I busy.
I was debating with myself about asking H if he wants to join us to get a Christmas tree. I decided I am at a point where I would need to see effort from him. Then I was thinking, maybe he will ask me about it. I could literally hear his text message ring in my head, then all of a sudden I actually heard it on my phone. I got a wave of excitement, I very rarely hear from him on my weekends with S. Well, he was just asking me to measure S head for a helmet. I kicked myself for even responding to it. He could have waited to figure it out himself.
So I was thinking more about our relationship. When I think back, I basically feel like I dictated all the steps. I suggested we get married, how pathetic is that. We were in Cancun, he kept insisting I climb Chichen itza. I thought for sure it was because he was going to propose at the top. Did not happen. I told him later that day and laughed about it, he proposed that night. Out of guilt? I will never know.
I suggested having a child, I planned all vacations, we hung mainly with my friends. H had like no identity, it was like he just tagged along and went with the flow. It's no wonder he needs to live his own life now, I can't see a reason why he would want to come back...
Just honest thoughts going through my mind. But like I said, I feel like I should not be asking him to join or suggesting plans or ideas to him. It's time he speak up and make his own choices. If he wants to join S and I for something, he needs to say it. I have lost so much respect for him, it's something I need to see to gain some back.
I need to set up a daycare schedule for S for the 2 weeks he is out of school this month. I actually emailed H about it this morning, the first time I have ever emailed him. Lol. It was just too long to text and I didn't feel like calling him or even talking about it when I drop off S tomorrow. I wanted him to have the dates in writing and I wanted to make sure I explained it clearly. I am curious to see how he responds to the email and if it helps to plan a schedule with him.
Not much else new here. All is good and enjoying my favorite time of year. Hope you all are having a nice weekend.
Butterfly
You are sounding strong
I like the idea of seeing if H will make his own choices -sounds like a 180
and the email, keeping it simple and to the point
creating a good co-parenting situation
hope you enjoy your evening!
sorry..name wrong! but the post was for u
mleigh,
It's time to step back and allow your h to make decisions on his own w/o your assistance. He'll never grow up and learn how to make decisions if you are there to "save" him. Part of growing up is learning responsibility and accountability. Give your h the gift of time and space. He will grow up, but it will be on his own time clock.
You and your son will enjoy yourselves in selecting a Christmas tree. Your h won't miss you, your son and the many activities that you share if he's there w/you every step of the way. The only saying "absence makes the heart grow fonder" is true. Select a tree, dress the tree and then if you want to invite him over for a toddy and/or cookies, then do so. Make sure the house smells of delicious foods and warm memories so that he has something to take back to the "ranch" to think about.
You are doing very well and I hope that your h realizes what a treasure you are and will come home in the coming year.
Hi Job. So one thing I struggle with is the worry of H believing I have moved on and that I no longer want him around by doing our traditional family things without inviting him.....that comment about me being happier now haunts me a little bit.....
But then as I type that, the truth is that I am only honoring his wishes, right? He left our home and family. If he wants to become a part of it again, HE needs to take those steps without me holding his hand. That way I also would know it is what he WANTS and chooses to do...
Does my thinking sound correct and on track to you?
MIL sent an email inviting me to her annual Christmas Eve party. Usually it's an open house style, this year she wants a head count. I replied that I already have plans, but thank you for the invite. (I don't have definite plans yet, I just know I want to be with friends) She replied that I am and will be missed and that she just wanted me to know that. I replied thank you, that I appreciate hearing that.
I keep getting emails from a work buddy of H, just random jokes. Last night I emailed him back to say that I just wanted to let him know that H is no longer at that address. I told him thanks and to take care.
Just another H reminder out of my hair.
If your h wants to be a part of your life, he needs to take the necessary steps. Sometimes, we have to let them go in order for them to grow up. Yes, by leaving him alone, you are honoring his wishes.
Let me put it to you this way...how can he miss you, your son and the life he had w/the both of you if he asked about joining in on family events? He can't. He's not spending enough time alone to actually miss the life he had w/you.
I would continue on making my own plans and if he should inquire about the tree, you then could tell him that you've gotten the tree already and have begun to decorate. Now, that would leave the door ajar for him to offer to come over and you could go from there...but to ask him about going...I still think you should go ahead unless you hear from him by the time you want to purchase one.
I'm glad you responded to the invite of your MIL. She still wants you to know that you are welcome and are family.
Okay, I'm going to give you another scenario about the jokes. Is it possible that your h is using his work buddy's computer to send jokes to you? People in crisis have been known to do this because it's safer and they can interact w/you w/o you even knowing it's them. Also, your h could have asked him to send those jokes to see how you would respond. Just food for thought.
I do think you've got a very good handle on your situation. The only thing I suggest is letting go, giving him the space and time to figure things out. Keep those expectations at zero and do not worry too much about what he said about you being happier. He doesn't realize how many egg shells you walked on while living under one roof.
Hang in there!
Thank you Job! Thank you so much. I get it, it all makes total sense. My heart gets a little soft at times, H has these eyes that get to me....but I got this.
I will stick to my plan, which is to pretty much continue on as is and stay quiet about Christmas. I don't like how I called the shots about Thanksgiving. This time, I stay quiet. I already know S will be waking up at home Christmas morning, I won't budge on that and S has already voiced that is how he wants it. I feel confident H won't take that away from me. So that leaves how he wants to spend that day up to him. My lips are sealed.
S and I have plans to get our tree on Sunday when he comes home from H.
I have started my Christmas shopping for S. Getting my own gifts on my own, again, not checking in with H about it.
Dropped off S tonight with H. We laughed while I told him the story of our kitten terrorizing us last night while she was hiding under S bed. You know, you try to get off the bed and she attacks your feet....we were hysterical last night. We have so much fun in this house! I still get the feeling H has something to say...there is such a hesitation whenever I leave....IDK, may just be nothing.
Not sure the work buddy's emails could be instigated by H. They go to a group of co-workers, not just me. It is strange that they had stopped for a long time, then started again, but could be just a mistake. I am curious if he told H that I replied back.
Thank you again Job for your continued support and your kind words
M
so confession.... I have not posted in a bit but I consistently read up on you and cheer you on from afar. Was nice to see how you handled Thanksgivings and continue to handle your H.
Wanted to touch on that whole "You seem happier" thing. From what I have learned in all this ... you touched on it .. they have some guilt tucked and weaved in that depression they are going through. for my W more and more of that guilt seeps out as she continues to process it ... I suspect your H has a bit of that knowing what he is putting you and your S through weighs on him regardless if you can physically see it or not. He is still baking and its tough to know in limboland wth is going on with them regardless how hard we try or like me how good I was at mindreading.
My advice ... not that you need it as job is rock solid ... continue as you have, love regardless ... hang in there.
Always good to hear from you Cali!
H called the house tonight to go over the schedule for the 2 weeks S is off school this month. We actually got it covered between me, H, Grammy and S buddy's mom. I am proud of H for coordinating days off and coordinating with his mom.
So the Christmas conversation came up. He said he would like to have S Christmas Eve since that is his regular weeknight to have him anyway. I suggested that I was hoping to offer S a different option than going to grammies as he has done every year. H said, but I am going there and I am the parent. So I said so are you telling me I will never have a Christmas Eve with S again!? (H has taken him that night the last 2 years as I also have declined the invite to his mom's) H said it's only happening this year because it falls on his night. So I said I guess that depends on Christmas Day....what are your plans?
H said he assumes S wants to be home, so he figured after his mom's, they would come here and stay the night to wake up in our house Christmas morning. He went on to say that he would like to spend Christmas day with S, so since son will be home, that is where he would like to be. He said he could sleep on the couch, or with S, whatever, he just wanted to be with him here and when he wakes up Christmas morning.
I let it sink in, then told him I totally understand and that sounds fair, that I am ok with that. I said we could always make a prime rib or something....I didn't even finish the sentence before his whole tone changed and he cut me off and said, "YES PRIME RIB!" He said he has been craving that and went on rambling that he can buy it, what is the name of the cut, how many pounds, oh he can't wait to eat it yum....it made me laugh at how excited he got.
I will be honest, I am very happy about this plan. I was worried he would want to split the day, I really didn't want to do that with my son, Christmas day ever since he has been born means the world to me. I let H suggest the plan, it is his idea and request and I think it will be nice. Don't worry, I am aware nothing may change, but I am truly happy to be spending the day together, at home as a family. I get to have S home all day
I won't lie, I am looking forward to it. I will do like Job said, have good food and nice memories for H to take home to his "ranch"
Another quick note...after that New Years Eve came up. H wants S that day and evening. I again (I know! I'm an only child, ok?) Said well what about me? I would like to have him some part of the holiday too since I may have the day off. So H said, "well we can all do New Years Eve together, I don't mind..." I cracked up and said, wow, that is a great invitation! How could I possibly pass that up??!! He cracked up too, it just sounded so terrible the way he said it. He said he didn't mean it to sound that way. Anyway, we decided to see who is able to get the day off with S and would figure it out later.
So I did good? I let him bring it up? I think with Christmas, yes I could have said no, we split the day, but that is not what I would have wanted for S. For any of us. Thanksgiving is one thing, Christmas another....I think this will be ok. I will just focus my day on me and S, assume H will be the distracted, rambling, sometimes cold MLC'er he has been for 2 years, all will be good! no expectations!
I think you handled the holiday situation very well. Now, off you go to think about what types of memories you want to send him home w/over the holidays. Good food, fun and laughs along the way. Make the home warm, loving and make sure the house smells of baking, i.e., such as cookies or other holiday treats.
You've got this covered!
I know I am good when I get Job's approval! Planning it is! I am realizing, I think my Prime Rib is the lighthouse, not me!
Very nice M ... and the icing is its all H's idea.
I think like job says, the way to a MLCr's heart is through their stomachs and other senses that can get around that fog'd up head of theirs. I know for my W when I cook her eyes brighten up, especially when she sinks into one of my famous steaks. I laughed at the Prime Rib being the lighthouse ... epic.
Yeah, good work M. Way to keep it together.
The holidays are an interesting time. Try to enjoy the day and not think about anything but the present.
AJ
Nice work!! So funny about the prime rib! Remember when he was over a while ago eyeballing the prime rib you were about to prepare? I think you planted the seed then!
Now, if only there was a magic clarity pill for their egg nog . . .
Hey mleigh, great job on resolving the holiday dilemma! Job has a very good advice to make sure that the house is smells of backing. I few years ago (right after the BD) I had a phone conversation with a relationship coach, before H was supposed to come over to paint the doors. She advised me to bake some cinnamon rolls for breakfast. She told me that the smells of backing, especially vanilla and cinnamon trigger the feelings of comfort and safety of a home.
And, of course the prime rib! You’ve got it!
Oh the pressure to bake! Do you remember I forgot the eggs and realized it half through baking cookies? Ok, I got this. I will already have cookies I made for Christmas gifts I am giving out this year, so I am thinking a bundt cake...
H has been doing daily random texting the last couple of days. I don't always respond right away, in fact last night I was already in bed, could hear his text ring, and decided it could wait until morning. I was too comfy snuggled with dog to get up!...these holidays really do bring them peeking out of the tunnel, huh?
Hi MLeigh, I think it's no bad thing if you feel like baking, and it may remind him of what he misses about home. But I think the main thing is just to treat it as a single day which will hopefull pass pleasantly and have no expectations. It will be nice for S for you all to spend a little time together and then life will continue.
I can recall you posting about similar days in the past, where you guys have spent time together and H has continued on as he is. He may (or may not) continue do that for some time yet. I hope you have a nice time and take it for what it is - a pleasant interlude. And I hope your bundt cake rises (if that is what they should do...I have no idea what one is!)
Take care xx
Hi Sotto. You made me laugh. Bundt cakes are regular cakes, just a different shape, you use a special pan, and it's topped with icing instead of frosting. Really good with coffee!
You are correct in reminding me of past time spent together with H. It tends to leave me a bit blue. I was really excited at first about it, but the reality is here. I intend to treat this as a wonderful Christmas day with my son. On this day, H can come and go as he pleases, which is actually what I expect him to do. I can't imagine he will spend the whole day, I would guess he will be away between morning presents and afternoon dinner. I will have all my favorite Christmas movies on, my lights all around the house, good food cooking and baking, and enjoy my day. I am looking forward to the day more than anything else...
Want to know the sad part? S was not happy when I told him the plans. He wants it just him and me. I just can't grasp this, I don't understand his lack of a connection with his dad. S also doesn't want to do Christmas Eve with H at grannies. He said it's boring. I told him you need to talk to your dad, ask him if you guys can try something different? S said why bother, he doesn't listen. It puts a bit of a damper on it all, if S can really care less whether his dad is around or not, it causes me to wonder why I am doing this? Keeping the family together for S is a main motivation for me....
FIL texted me yesterday asking if I needed help getting a tree. Very sweet, but how sad it must feel to have to step in for your son....I told him thank you, that S and I can handle it. I kept thinking about it all day. So last night, I sent FIL a message. I told him that I was thinking of him and that in my generation I have come across very few men who still show chivalry. I told him I work hard to teach S such and that he is a great example to S for that. I sent him hugs, he sent hugs back.
Oh Mleigh- it is so difficult as the children start to become cognizant that something is off. It is painful to watch as a mother. I think it is very healthy that you defer these issues to your H. Clearly you are a good listener as your son opens up to you. Kudos to you!
Your FIL sounds great. Is there a way to have your son spend more time with him? That bonding might be great for both of them. No?
Hi Hawho. Ya, there is only so much I can do about the R between S and H. That is on H to figure out.
I had a nice weekend! Saturday H came to pick up S. H sat down at the table with S and I and chatted away about work. He seems so stressed with it! Funny thing is, he went on and on about his work buddy, the one who was emailing jokes to me and who I let know H is no longer on that email. H was going on about an argument they had on Friday about work, how weird he is, how the guy threatened to quit....I did not bring up the emails.
In conversation, H commented on all my solar string lights I have in the front, asked me for a third time where I got them. I told him I love them, that they turned out really nice looking afterall. He said he knows, that he saw them...then faded off. Right away that confused me as they have only been up for 2 weeks and he has not been to the house at night for a long time...when did he see them??
H was very relaxed and in no hurry to leave. I however had lunch plans with my cousin so I nudged things along a bit. H asked to take some lights and decorations for his tree. The lights were fine, we have tons. But many of the decorations belonged to my grandmother, they are very special to me. So we decided I would go through them first and put aside any extra random ones for him.
My cousin showed up to pick me up just as we were finishing. H and my cousin shook hands and chatted, very cordial. Cousin and I took off for lunch. We talked about the fact that H wanted lights and decorations for his tree, but has not offered to help me get one. We actually laughed pretty hard about it! But my cousin told me, as he is male, he said sometimes guys just don't think of that stuff, sometimes they just don't think. He also reminded me how self sufficient I tend to be, stubborn to a point where I won't ask for help even if I need it. Gave me food for thought.
That night I went to a birthday bbq with friends. I had a blast, great food and fun watching some of the guys jam together to play some great blues music. I was amazed by the talent of a 17 year old kid playing guitar, serious talent!
This morning I woke up to a very stormy day. I LOVE this weather and enjoyed it. I did some yoga and relaxed. When it was time to pick up S from H, I asked H if he could help get a tree on my truck. He said sure.
I picked up S and H followed us to the tree farm in his own truck so that I wouldn't have to drive him back. H grabbed some kettle corn for us all to share as we looked for our tree. It became very stormy again, rainy and windy, and I just could not stop laughing at the fact that we were doing this in such terrible weather. It was really funny to me for some reason. Just as we finished and got in our trucks, it began dumping rain. S and I cracked up more and H texted "we just made it!!" That trip will be a memory for sure!
I was able to drag my tree upstairs into my house. It was not easy! Especially getting it in the stand. I could hear my cousin telling me how stubborn I can be. H had offered to come help but I figured I could do it. It is decorated and the house looks like Christmas!
Getting ready for the work week now, it's been very busy getting houses closed before the holiday. Next weekend I will be baking lots of cookies! I have decided to bake for friends and co-workers this year instead of gifts.
I hope you all have a good week
Need some help, advice, ideas. I was not planning on getting H a Christmas gift. I was just going to take him some cookies, and I have a pic in a frame of him and S that says daddy and me for S to give him.
Now that he will be here and we will be doing gifts together, I wonder if I should have something for him?? A gift card would be easy, but I don't want restaurants so he can take someone else! I don't want to get clothes for him to wear for others. I don't want to get him anything for that stupid house....I am really stuck...
I know, I am sounding a bit selfish and stubborn...I honestly am having a hard time buying him anything. I was shopping last night and could not bring myself to do it.
Any ideas???
Why not get him a CD of his favorite musical artist? What about a gas gift card?
Good idea Job, I like the music idea. I also thought of golf. He used to love golfing. He hasn't in a while, his golf clubs are in the garage! But he used to really enjoy going with the guys and I know they ask him from time to time.
Thank you!
Hi Job - great gift ideas! Mleigh- I can just pop off my H's latest MLC CD off to you? That 'oughta help out with the depression. Lol!
How about a book? I think I am buying my H the new Elon Musk biography. This is very kind of me as really, he deserves coal in his stocking.
Do you know his love languages? That becomes important at Xmas time.
If you want to leave the door open for any possibility of reconciliation - even if you think you might be through - I recommend putting some thought into this. (But keep the receipt and make sure you can return it in case he shows up empty-handed!).
If gifts are his love language, you're best off (usually) buying exactly that thing that they told you about or circled in the catalogue (even though that takes the fun out of it for me). If he's a word of affirmation person, something that has a positive sentiment attached. Etc.
Hawho, I would love the CD! I am sure my H would be able to relate. H doesn't really read other than car and driver, which he has a subscription too.
Kml, I get your idea, but don't feel it. I am avoiding anything personal at this point, it wouldn't feel right to me. And truthfully, I have no idea how H lives his life these days as I was cut off from that over 2 years ago. All I have to go off of are old hobbies. His love language was touch, not an option right now for me. Another is food! He will be getting his favorites that day.
So, a local golf course gift card it is. He is lucky to get that, I am only doing it as we will be together on Christmas. I am just not feeling it....
I sent him a TM of some really funny school work S did. He replied and asked about us all seeing Star Wars this weekend. I told him this weekend is pretty full, I have lots of cookies to bake and we have plans to drive around Saturday night to see Christmas lights with his BFF and family. H replied going on and on about S being addicted to his iPad and computer, how he can't even come up with ideas for Christmas gifts he wants. And of course H wants to see the lights with us. He says "I do want to be around for things like that"
Ok I am irked. Please please tell me it is ok to reply to him that we are not a rent a family for when he "wants" to be around. Can I tell him that we prefer a full time family member? How about you don't get to pick and choose when you decide to leave your family?
Ok, I may regret it but said....well, being around for things like that changes when you leave your family and your home. Sorry, not fighting just saying. We deserve much more than a sporadic daddy
But it's Christmas! So I will let you know the plan. Sorry but that comment irks me, just being honest.
I expect silence
Actually, I turned my phone on silent and put it away. I don't care about a comment or silence right now....
What the heck has gotten into me? I think I may be a little pi$$ed at his wanting to be a part of our holiday, and knowing everything will go right back to the way it has been after.
Still venting! Lol. I know some of you may think I am crazy. I mean, H wants to see Star Wars with us, he wants to be here for Christmas, all things I should be wanting, right? Thing is, this has nothing to do with S and I, this is H being his selfish self to have what he wants when he wants it. Then continue on back to his single life. Yes, it leaves me feeling used, frustrated and pi$$ed!
I hope I don't regret Christmas. I want my son home all day, I hope I don't regret having H here in order to have that. I am worried that I will. Thanksgiving was wonderful just being able to do my own thing....
IDK, I am feeling a bit confused about all this right now. His comment really set it off. "I want to be a part of these things" Tough sh$t! You should have thought of that when you bailed, left me with a huge house to take care of by myself, forced S and I to split apart, threw away 15 years of our life, have S growing up in a split home. Tough!
I am guessing I would not be very good at reconciliation of any sort. If he reaches out for genuine reasons, he may get his hand bit. I am strong, but maybe not so strong in forgiving and forgetting.
Just getting this out here....feels good
Hi Mleigh - I understand what you mean about not "feeling it" when it comes to giving a personal gift to your H.
The last 4 years my H has shoved every gift I have given him into the back of a closet. And when he opened them he was hostile! I know the MLCer has a difficult time accepting gifts from the spouse while in crisis. I have decided that I will give my H a gift even if he does not give me one. It just feels like the right thing to do even if he is not appreciative. My kids are watching, too!
As for your H's interest in joining you for Star Wars, I cracked up at your "rent a family" line. Hope it does not offend you; but it's a keeper!!!
I am curious what the vets will say on all this.
Thinking of you and sorry as I know it is all so painful to re-visit.
Hi Mleigh
First ...breathe .... Come and vent here anytime, heck, I do it ALL the time lol.
I have two words for you Cake Eating. H wants it all and whilst you give it to him he will continue to expect it. Allow his comments/requests to slide on by, he is trying to get you to play his game with his rules, but you make your own rules mleigh, ones that are in your favour. When he left his family he gave up the right to be included in anything you do so let him stamp his feet and get into a sulk, you stick to what makes you feel comfortable.
As for reconciliation - ha ha, I am the poster girl for doing it the wrong way, so if/when this becomes an option then deal with it at that point as you really don't know what you can and can't forgive until your actually facing it.
Feel angry and p#ss#d, get it all out and then let it go, move on and find your calm place again. You are going through so much, I want to jump through the screen and give you a big hug and tell you that your doing great, you really are. You are faced with a huge challenge and you are meeting it every way it is coming at you, be proud of yourself as I sure am.
I agree w/Lou, i.e., cake eating at its finest. He is the one that is picking and choosing what he wants to do w/his family. He will continue to do this until you decide what will or won't be allowed.
Don't allow the holiday season to dictate your decision as to whether your h participates in other activities during the holiday season. Remember...I did point out that they do come out to play and want to be a part of the family scene during the holidays and once March 17th comes around, they disappear once again.
You've already decided to have him come over on Christmas to be w/you and your son...I think that was a huge plus, but when it comes to other activities, I wouldn't include him in many of them. As for Star Wars, I think it would be nice if you and your son went "alone". Your h needs to see and learn that leaving the family unit and living on his own won't cut it in the real world. If he stamps his feet, let him. He'll get over it and hopefully come to realize that in order to participate in family activities, he needs to get his act together and grow up and be the mature man and want to come home.
It's time that you think about what YOU want right now. If it means doing things w/your son on your own, then do it. But, you are the one that needs to determine whether to include your h in your family activities. I'll leave you w/a question....How can he miss you, the family unit and his home if he's participating as a family member and yet goes to his place when the fun is over?
You've been doing extremely well, but it's time to take the cake away from your h. Also, remember to breathe and count to 10 before saying or reacting to anything he suggests to you about family time.
I agree with Job. Christmas Day is a done deal and it sounds like you are comfortable with this ONE day arrangement. He is seeing all the other activities he will miss and he is counting on you to make this easier. I like how he sorta tried to weasel his way into the other stuff...and, Kudos to him for working hard to make it seem very low-key and even turn it around so HE feels like HE is making the decision on what activities he joins!
Like... "Yep. I don't want left out of ALL the fun stuff. Count me in on these, specific activities."
Very immature, but very adept at how he sorta eased into the whole thing. Spectacular manipulative move. Bold. Ballsy.
Thing is... You got this MLeigh. If this man never shows up to another holiday event, you will still be okay. You have the makings of a life without him. You have worked so hard to create this life on your own and have done it respectfully.
Even your son has made peace with his Dad living on Mars. I suspect your H is sensing this. He sees you able to function and even thrive without him.
Now, he needs to SEE it without participating and watch you thrive from afar. Don't let him hook you. These are his choices.
He is a master cake eater.
Yes, I agree that he seems to be saying - I'll have bits a, b and c of the marriage - suits me to be part of those. I don't want x, y or z though. Partial marriage.
As others have said, do what works for you and try not to worry too much about how he is going to amuse himself over the festive season..
Take care my friend xx
Wow I was expecting some backlash or 2 by 4s for some reason! Thank you all so much. I feel like a B for what i said to him, but I am human and have a right to be upset.
I am back to my happy place. I will not be contacting H about Christmas lights or star wars. I have my weekend with S planned and will continue on with my own plans.
I am going to send H a quick reply about his concerns with S and the game. I don't want to ignore that as H went to a lot of work to send me a letter text about it! Seriously, he needs to get his priorities straight. But I will validate his concerns and keep it upbeat and positive.
Thank you all for your hugs, had a bit of a tiff last night! You all are such blessings to me. Make it a great day!
Mleigh, thanks for posting. H put up a tree today and brought presents. I so do not want his gifts; he left with the only gift I wanted.
You said everything I am thinking. If you're a B, then I'm joining the club.
We are similar in sitch, you help me so much.
mleigh4, I agree with other opinions here about the cake eating. He is definitely cake eating. And it is up to you whether you want to allow it or not. Here is my take on this. You said that you would not be good at reconciliation, if it comes to it. Then you obviously have very high expectations on all of this. I bet there are a lot of people on this board who would give anything to have the situation you have for a possible reconciliation. What I mean is that there is NO OW! I don’t know if this would be any easier or not. I don’t remember any posters who reconciled with their spouses when there was no OW and if it was any easier. The only poster that comes to mind is labug, but I she was not sharing much detail (feelings) about her reconciliation.
I’m not saying that you should tolerate this cake eating thing, is you don’t feel like it. If you and your son are perfectly happy without H, then there is no point to allow him to be included into every activity you are doing. You need to think what is best for you and your son. I completely agree with that. But, will you be ok and happy if your H would stop wanting to do anything with you and you son and treat you like the strangers, and like you never existed? Which I get from my H, and it hurts. You say that there is something still holding you from completely ending this. I guess you will have to figure it out. I just want to make sure that you are doing what you feel is right for you and not doing things to punish H or show him what he might be missing. Because I see so much hope in your sitch. I might be wrong though… I don’t consider myself an expert or a vet in MLC. It is just my opinion.
Finally got some time to re-read and answer.
Hawho, good point about S watching with the gifts. I did not think of that.
Lou, thank you so much for the kind words. Do what feels comfortable is right. I am seeing the cake eating clearer and clearer.
Job, my wise one. Even though it makes me feel a bit bad, I am following my true feelings. I honestly don't want H to be a part of our plans this weekend. Not as he is today. Why would I want this situation to spoil my favorite time of year? Not going to let it happen. You are right about Christmas, plans are made, so I will go through with it, on my terms. And yes, I reacted a bit too quickly. I knew that as I was typing him! I could have said things differently.
Hi Heather. Boy you got it. I was thinking last night, S and I were forced to change our whole life, our whole way of living. So we did, we have created our own world, without much of H in it, and we have done a great job! We are happy and enjoying our new world! H thinks he can just pop in when he wants now? No. S and I went through a lot and worked hard to get here. I am very cautious of H motives and will continue to make sure he doesn't succeed in sending waves through our calm waters.
Sotto, it is hard sometimes. No one wants to hurt someone they love, and I am sure somewhere in him it hurts to be excluded from these things. I also know we did not ask for this. H needs to face his choices, I am doing no one any favors if I don't stand my ground. So I try not to worry about him too much.
Hi Buttercup! Thank you for stopping by. It makes me very happy if I am able to offer any comfort. I will read up on your sitch. I hate when standing up for myself makes me feel like a B! I think the way for me to change that is by changing my approach. That is something I have been working on for a while now!
So, all good in my camp here. S and I are having a great night, had a yummy dinner, and just watching Elf. I love that movie! Never any response from H, as expected. The sulk is on. Looking forward to a nice pre Christmas weekend
Hi Bright, just saw your post. Well, there is no OW that I KNOW of. I mostly believe there is not one, but of course I wonder. I am not sure if it makes it any easier. That would mean he left us.....for what? Either way, he still:
Had an all night text fest with my so called female friend--which when caught brought out BD.
He lied about his whereabouts many times
He hid things from me
He hid his phone around me
He physically rejected me
He left me
Does it matter if for OW or not? I don't know, but I do know I am deeply hurt. I have a thick wall around me, I am not sure if I can let him in. I am working on figuring that out. 100% honesty -- I believe at this point if things do not work out, it will be because of me. Aside from being abandoned by my father, no one has ever hurt me so deeply. Can I get past that? I don't know.
We get along very well for the most part, and I am proud of myself for getting that far....I don't think I would say I am punishing him....I see it as making him face his choices. I rarely turn him away and wasn't going to until he said those words to me, I want to be a part of those things. What about every other moment and day that S and I face?
I would need to see some continued effort from H to know he was being genuine. Right now? Something tells me he is sitting alone in his quiet dumpy house with his Christmas tree and he just doesn't want to be left out of things we used to enjoy doing. I don't feel like his motives have anything to do with me. I don't feel even a hint of that from him. Maybe if I did, my walls would come down a bit....
mleigh4, I hear you. I feel you hurting, because he abandoned you. Because he chose to not be part of everything, and not just the things he wants to be part of. I also understand the feelings of being abandoned by a father. I was not abandoned, but my father was not present much in my life, I never felt I was protected or cared about. I know the feelings…
mleigh4, I am supporting you all the way. Only you know what is best for you.
Bright, BINGO! The feelings of not being protected or cared about, it's an issue I have had all my life. I felt it with H for a while, then it slowly faded....not sure if it was me or him.
I hear you too, it's confusing to want him to be a part of our life, and then turn my back when he wants to be...I guess I just want that for the right reasons. Am I short changing us? IDK....I will keep listening inside and continue to do what feels right. It's all we can really do.
Thank you Bright and everyone for helping me talk this out. If H comes forward again asking to join,....ugh....not sure. I will see how it goes, see what happens. I am just going to keep moving on.
Continue as you have been. Sit quietly for the answers will drop into your lap when you least expect them.
Christmas is a time for miracles and I've seen plenty over the years, so who knows what might transpire this year. Keep your heart and mind open and if something feels right, then do it. Okay?
Okay Job. I know the holidays bring up a lot of emotions and I know this is the case with me. Knowing that, I am taking my own emotions with a grain of salt! If that makes any sense!
I wonder how many of us were abandoned by our fathers?
Mine came home and cleaned out his closet during the day when no one was home. No warning or explanation to his kids. It was the day before cheerleading tryouts--he didn't know that though because he was my dad and he didn't engage in my life.
Doing some digging into my childhood with my sponsor in D.A. Got me thinking here.
My mom got pregnant while my dad was home on leave from Vietnam. He was at war when I was born, continued to do 3 tours of duty, and was pretty messed when he was done. He left for Germany, stayed in the air force, and lived in many different places, wherever he was stationed. I never heard from him, I used to dream of him rescuing me from my depressed mom. I only met him once, when I was 18. He had come back to the states to live with his mom, his health was bad. He was an alcoholic and heroin addict, he died from liver disease when I was 19.
I often wonder if I am attracted to people who I want to rescue because of this. Weird thing is, I honestly thought H was better than me when we started dating. I thought he was too good for me, I knew I had daddy issues and he just seemed so together....turns out he was a mess himself!
Okay Job. I know the holidays bring up a lot of emotions and I know this is the case with me. Knowing that, I am taking my own emotions with a grain of salt! If that makes any sense!
I was just listening to something on this when dealing with serious issues, the speaker said we need to have a plan, say for us dealing with the MLCrs .... And when things get tough refer to the plan not our emotions, emotions will and can quickly derail is from our plan. Made some sense to me.
I too was pretty much abandoned by my parents, father worked on the road and was self one home, when he was he and my mother would be found at the local tavern... At 44 I still know the number to that bar as I would constantly have to call to find out what was going to be done for dinner
Part of me wonders if our own childhood issues some how attract these MLCrs like torpedos to a ship it's like they almost seek us out knowing we are equipped for the crazy they will one day unleash on us ..... Ya know just thoughts one is left with as we pick up what pieces from the crisis
Cali,
I think the attraction is that we are "fixers". I certainly didn't have any childhood issues to deal with and yet, my xh was the poster child for MLC and still is this very day.
You learned good coping skills as a child and were able to deal w/your own issues and I don't think your childhood issues, etc. attracted your wife to you. Your wife felt safe w/you and knew you were "stable" and are a good provider and husband/father, i.e., maybe the opposite of what she had at home as a child. Unfortunately, we never know what will happen after we are married and we certainly didn't learn about MLC in biology class many, many years ago.
Just my two cents.
Cali, I still have the Rolling Rock label imprinted on my brain. Could draw it in my sleep.
So, we chose people who had the very issues we NEED to play out in order to work through our own issues... And, vice versa.
What precisely did we need to work out? That we could survive the abandonment again? That our worst childhood fear wasn't going to kill us?
Or, did we need to just feel the leftover feelings we never dealt with?
There's at least three of us with profound rejections, abandonment suffered in childhood.
Bigger Question: How do WE stop the legacy here?
Cali, I see I made a mistake in how I reacted to H. I feel badly about it because I know I hurt him. I could have handled it very differently....how will he see me as a safe place, someone he can talk to, if I bite his head off, right? I told him he can talk to me anytime about anything....so he opened up....and I clubbed him. Not nice and not the person who I want to be.
I saw this behavior my whole life with my mom. She would stomp, pout, spew horrible things when all she really wanted was love and attention. Instead she pushed so many people away. It's like your own personal sabotage.
I love your idea about referring to your plan, not your emotions. I will keep that in mind and hopefully do better next time
Weird thing last night. I have not heard from H since Tuesday night. He called at 9:47 last night. I answered friendly and he just started rambling on about how he wants to ask S if he will help him decorate his tree or not, otherwise he will do it himself. He said S would not help him all week and that it really hurt his feelings. I could tell he was outside during our conversation, I could hear the wind, he sounded really upset and flustered. I told him I understood his frustration, S isn't much into the tree decorating anymore. I told him he could decorate it for himself? Then asked if he wanted to talk to S? He said yes.
So, S told him he would help him and they hung up. The whole thing was so weird. Where the heck was he and why so upset about this that he had to call at 10 o'clock at night? I was mostly floored that he has had an undecorated Christmas tree in his house for over a week. I just wanted to reach through the phone and hug him, he sounded terrible.
It sounds like your h was missing the family unit and what you did as a family, i.e., tree decorating. Sure, he was disappointed that your son didn't want to help him decorate earlier in the week...but this is something he's going to have to face as your son continues to grow up w/o his father being in his life full time. Some of the consequences of his actions are biting at his heels this year.
I know you want to feel sorry for him...but don't. He made the decision to move out. Your h could have remained home, sought counseling and worked on his issues...but he didn't. Tomorrow, he'll back to his usual self because he got the attention he wants, i.e., son coming over and helping him trim the tree.
You will see a lot of this "poor me" during his crisis...don't buy into it, especially during the holidays. They feel the tugs of their old life and miss the things they did w/their family...but that will soon pass when the holidays are over and done with.
Continue as you have been...like a teenager, he'll get over it or he'll trim the tree w/or wo your son's help.
MLeigh,
Remember, he is a master manipulator and cake eater. Don't bite. He is, in my opinion, again looking to you to ease this discomfort. Read Job's post, then read it again. He isn't being considerate of your feelings here, he is looking to make things feel better on his end.
You told him your truth... That's all. He is a grown man, even though he may not act like it.
Hi Mleigh - Regarding the issue of you feeling like you snapped at H, the message you related to him is healthy and honest. Don't be too hard on yourself there. It's a healthy boundary you set.
If, in hindsight, you still feel you were too snippy, maybe look for ways to improve that for you! One thing I am still working on is sleeping on things. This is still very hard for me to master. However, everytime I have exhibited that patience I felt more comfortable with my response than what my initial reaction was. Maybe, eventually I will be able to eliminate this delay in response with practice.
You are doing really well! Keep it up.
boy do I know what you mean re gifts -- bear in mind I have about a week of your posts to catch up on so forgive me if this is out of whack ...
Here's what I did:
book
some candy treats that he loves
will also bake him some of his favorite cookies
does that help?
M
Yeah job as always is spot on, my W was/is the master at pulling the sympathy strings, again these are their choices. Last year I would get calls and texts at 1,2,3 in the morning... Like you there was one that was just seriously strange, I had S at my place and she called around 11 about life insurance ... Ya know like anything could be done at 11 at night about that, was more like she was reaching out in a way... Cake eating/temp checking and processing and yup... Next day was like nothing happened and back in the tunnel she went
You are doing well, this dance are doing is very hard... When to be the lighthouse, when to be firm, when to love from a distance and when to show the way home is available but doing so without pursuing .... I laugh typing this thinking I'm far more nuts and scrambled than she could ever be.
He has to still process, and the Holidays bring pressure all by themselves, we know the MLCr does not handle pressure very well ... For us it's hard to know what to do with every situation that arrives, I've concluded personally there is not a chance to navigate this without mistakes, but I know there isn't one misstep that will blow it all up. Just keep going, you've done this dance far better than most.
ok I'm all caught up now.
scratch the book --- scratch the gift advice.
re: the cake eating ... listen to Job and Cali and all the other wise ones here. I think it's perfectly ok to set a limit. For me, I feel like a B when there's a certain ... "edge" for lack of a better word? to my boundary. It's not anger, because healthy anger is ok ... it's the edge of either passive aggressiveness or outright vindictiveness ... maybe treating them the way they treat us? that makes me feel bad about my actions. So, I really like Ha's advice about sleeping on it. I don't know about you, but that's a real challenge for me because I'm so used to jumping immediately when H calls -- that's what I've done for 26 years --- hard to change that overnight. When I take that step back and wait, respond vs. react, good things happen and I feel much better about myself, so that's the best advice I can share. Hope it helps!
... i too have serious abandonment issues. the good news is, HEY - this is my biggest fear yet somehow I"m not dead yet from this, so maybe there's a cosmic plan. who knows.
anyway, keep posting. know that we are all here for you. xoxoxoxoxo
I read Jobs post, all of your posts several times.
As I mentioned, I am giving homemade cookies as gifts this year to many. So yesterday I started my baking. THIS time I was very careful and no ingredients got missed! So I did 2 batches yesterday and doing one more today. About 150 cookies to give out!
As I was getting ready to go look at lights with S and friends last night, I was very pulled to reach out to H. I had told him I would let him know our plans...I decided not to. We drove around, saw some good houses, but S and his friend complained most of the time, they just wanted to go back home to hang out! We may need a new plan for next year. So, S buddy came back with us and slept over.
My friends also stopped by for a bit. They sampled the cookies for me, I got approval
All in all, having a very nice weekend. Expecting more rain and feeling really tired. These days have been busy so I plan on doing some down time today. I have some outside furniture to put away, this El Nino stuff has me a little nervous about handling the house on my own. So I want to get the yard and house as prepared as I can.
Thanks again for all your input and Happy Sunday.
You guys are not kidding about the whole memory loss thing! H had bought a bunch of see's candy for S school fundraiser. I gave it to him almost 2 weeks ago. He TM today asking if he could pick it up. I told him, silly Willy, I gave it to him a while ago. I suggested he look in his truck because when he took it, it was in the truck and dog had jumped in and we were worried she scratched up the wrapping on the candy. He then remembered and said it must be in there still. How did he not see it for 2 weeks?? Does he not go anywhere much? Well, I guess a good sign that he isn't driving a date around! Lol
Sunday night FIL TM that he had gotten a prime rib and asked if I wanted it. FIL does this often, he is very giving, knows I like making Prime Rib on Christmas. So I told him that H is in charge of getting prime rib to check with him. About 1/2 hour later, H TM that FIL offered a prime rib, but that he declined, wants to get himself. Then asked how many pounds, and if that was still the plan....seems what I said must have made him unsure about the Christmas plans.
I told him his plan sounds good to me if good to him. He said ok, sounds good.
Monday night dropped off S to H. It was pouring. Since I don't go inside his house, we were chatting outside while I held an umbrella over us. I left and came across a lady stuck in the mud around the corner from his house. I called H, he and S came to the rescue and towed her out. Gotta say, H always comes through for that kind of stuff. It was great for S to see H be such a hero. S was mesmerized watching him in action
Christmas shopping is done, presents wrapped! I even got gifts for MIL and FIL. I ended up getting H a golf gift certificate, picture frame with pic of he and S, and a target game for him and son. We also secretly stuff stockings for each other. Not sure if that will happen this year, but I got him some good coffee, a coffee tumbler, his favorite candy and a guy magazine. I feel good with that.
Work is ridiculously busy, so the days are going quickly. I am a little nervous about Christmas day with H, but I keep thinking of AJ telling me to just enjoy it. So that is the plan!
Hi Mleigh - lucky it has not been hot enough for all those chocolates to melt! The memory problems are astounding, truly.
As for being nervous, one thing that helps me is to focus on making it a nice day for my kids. Maybe this will help ease things?
That is really special that your son saw his dad be a superhero! And it was sweet of your H to help.
I like the gifts you chose for your H, too!
Have a Merry Christmas Mleigh.