Let's start the new thread with a Friday Lawyer joke - This guy called up his lawyer to tell him he was filing for divorce, and the lawyer inquired as to the grounds for the suit.
"I've got grounds, all right," sputtered the irate husband. "Can you believe my wife told me I'm a lousy lover?"
"That's why you're suing?" pursued his lawyer.
"Of course not. I'm suing because she knows the difference."
---------------
Prior Thread:
MLC W Dates, Part 9
Hi Job,
I am well. I decided against going up north for the weekend b/c my siblings did not want me to also bring my kids.
I have s13 for the weekend. I continue to rest and recover from my spinal fusion surgery. I wish I could go swimming, or do something to get out, but short walks are the most I am able to do now.
W baked me banana/chocolate chip muffins - she must love me! They were good though.
Dear Wet -- It has been a very long time since I visited the boards but I want you to know I still pray for you and your wife. I am so sorry to hear that you had surgery and so glad to know you are recovering well. I know that many on this board have a different take on things, but if you are getting the daily e-mails from Charlyne Cares, I assume you will not be surprised when I say that it sounds to me like a huge amount of hope and connection is happening and that your stand is not in vain. You are looking at the circumstances and wanting things to happen out of her own volition, but from a faith-based point of view, it looks so clearly to me like God keeps ensuring that "all things [i](e.g., surgery, illness, muffins, slip of the tongue to say, "love,") [/i]work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose,”[i]. It is not going to happen the way you think nor on the timing you desire. It could take years for it to happen. But to my mind, if God turns the evil of your surgery into the opportunity to go and stay with your wife, you should go, no questions asked, "rely not on your own understanding" and let her be a wife to you at the times she is willing and able to be your wife. She is your wife, according to God. Charlyne explains this much better than I do, and Heart's Blessing has an article I often return to, one on being a stanchion, that talks about how a return will take far more time than we think we can bear and never happen the way we think it should or imagine it will.
But the funny thing is that I didn't come on line to tell you any of that. Something amazing happened to me today, and I wrote a letter about it, and I was just reading the letter over and it came into my mind that I had to send it to you. I don't question when something comes into my mind in that way and seems good and true to do. There must be a reason I am supposed to send this to you. So here it is, below. Sorry for the endlessly long post.
July 11, 2015
Dear S and E (and Father W),
I wanted to share with you the story of what happened to me today. It is an intimate story from a stranger but you will understand why I felt called to share it with you when you get to the end!
As an explanation of the back story, very much in brief -- I was called to the Catholic faith from Judaism, especially over the last couple of years during a crisis in my marriage and after a miraculous recovery from a severe illness last fall. Because Father W keeps the church open, I have come to Our Lady of X almost every day for the last two years to pray – in fact it all started when I couldn’t get into a synagogue on Yom Kippur for the third year in a row and remembered that the church was always open and went there to pray instead. Being able to go there everyday has allowed me to gain strength and courage for my stand for my marriage in impossible circumstances, and to help me through my illness and recovery. Learning what our unconditional marriage vows really mean has taught me the true meaning of that sacrament, and in turn understanding marriage as a sacrament and a covenant with God has helped me to understand what God is asking of me as a wife and a mother. My journey has included what to me are miracles; and I was baptized into the Catholic faith on the night before Easter of this year.
The last couple of weeks I had been feeling very low and had been asking God to rebuild my courage and my hope for the restoration of my marriage. Finally I decided it was time to go to see Father W to talk about these things. I spoke to him early last week; he told me to stop by Saturday, before he left for Italy. This morning I called the church and was told to come by between 2:00 and 2:30. I tried to get my kids lunch and set up with something to do so that I could run down to the church to see him by two, but I kept being delayed. When I did get there at 2:15, the secretary told me that I had just missed him, he had started a meeting, and it would take some minutes before he would be finished.
I sat in the office for a few minutes, reading through Ephesians in the hope that I would find a word to lift my spirits, and then I went into the church to pray. I always sit on either the far right or far left side of the church so that I can be a little hidden as I pray -- or if I want to be particularly near to Christ or to Mary! After a little while, I went back to see if Father W was free. He was still in the meeting. I was starting to worry about getting back in time to take my kids to soccer and finally, I decided to leave a note to see if I could come back another time. I was thinking at that point of how frustrated I was that I hadn’t just been on time, and how now I would have to wait until Father W came back from Italy, that I would have to carry the heaviness in my heart for several weeks. I left the note; but then instead of going out the front door to the street, for some reason, without thinking, I went back into the church. I started walking down the center aisle of the nave instead of going to the right or the left aisle as I always do, and I saw a seat in the center of the nave where the light from the stained glass window was making this bright area of beautiful light on the bench. I didn’t even look across at my usual spots on the far sides of the right and left aisles, but headed directly for that light. I remember even thinking, “I want to sit in the light and to feel God’s presence in the light.” I felt that I was being led to that seat. I knelt down in the seat and then just before I closed my eyes to pray I saw on the seat in front of me a program; I read it, and saw your names and that it was the program from a wedding. I assumed it had just happened, and I thought, “Maybe God put me here so that I would pray for their marriage.” I picked it up, looked at your names and began to think of how I would pray for S and E to have a wonderful marriage, which to me always means that husband and wife will cherish each other and make it through all of life’s difficulties in those earlier years and grow old together and become grandparents together. I always think of this as my goal for my marriage, that our family will be restored and my husband and I will grow old together. But then before I began my prayer, I thought I would look inside the program to see if there was something I could learn about S and E so that I could pray more specifically for them. And then I saw your first reading, from the Book of Tobit.
My heart sort of stopped at that moment, because the Book of Tobit is very special to me. I read it four or five years ago and I was very excited about it because it seemed to fill in some of what was for me imprinted on my heart but missing in Judaism, about love and forgiveness and the surrender of self. In excitement, at that time, I went to my uncle, who is a pretty major theologian in the Jewish world and asked him about it. He said to me, “Where did you ever find that? We don’t even include that in the Torah, it’s just all magic and folk tale. Only Christians use that book.” I was shocked and dismayed that this book that seemed to fill in some of what I had been looking for in my faith wasn’t even considered True. But I started writing a film script based Tobit because of my strong feelings about it; and I always imagine that when my family is really restored, I will finally be able to finish that script.
So it was very shocking that “my” book of Tobit was there. Maybe it is often included in Catholic services, and I just haven’t been to as many of those, but in the many weddings I’ve attended in my 43 years of life, I have never once seen the Book of Tobit included in the service. And when I read the reading, a flood of tears let loose – I felt like I was reading the words straight from God to me, encouraging me to remember that God created the world and created marriage for husband and wife to help and support each other, no matter what -- and that I was chosen for my husband and he for me, even if the current season was a dark and confusing one -- and that our marriage was for a noble purpose, and that we would indeed “grow to a happy old age.”
I was already crying with relief and gratitude at this point; then I noticed that the program was from yesterday afternoon, and that for some reason it had never been cleared from that spot, and it suddenly seemed to me that all that had happened in the past week, with me making that appointment with Father W and then not making it in time and having to wait so that I would be “led” into the church and to a spot where I never normally sit just to find your program and to get that message that would restore my strength and courage and conviction – not to mention all the things that had to happen for both you and me in our lives to both end up at X to begin with -- this seemed like no coincidence. It was as if the message had been left just for me, through the grace that was your marriage ceremony.
I sat there for a long time holding the program and reading that reading over again. I kept thinking of Saint Paul’s assurance that “all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose,” that we need never worry because God will turn everything to his purpose, just as he did in that moment for me. And I thought then that I had better write to you and tell you what happened, and that maybe this would make some difference in your lives together too.
I pray that you will always love and cherish each other unconditionally and that your marriage will be blessed as a testimony to others of true commitment and self-giving.
With love in Christ,
Gerda
P.S. Before my post gets some fiery replies, I just wanted to clarify that I don't think that your surgery would suddenly wake your wife up. Breast cancer woke my husband up only for one day and then he slowly but surely went deep back into that tunnel, that was eight months ago. But that one day was one of the happiest days of the past year for me -- even though it was the day I had a mastectomy! -- and it let me see that my husband is still in there, deep somewhere inside that weird, mean, selfish angry -- and very sad-looking -- alien he is mostly. It really gives me strength to remember that one day of true caring, and anytime he offers anything at all, to eat dinner with us, to put up a shelf, to carry a bag, I am always receptive and as open as I can be, without any expectation whatsoever for the moments and days following that offer. So if your wife came to take care of you for a few days and was a little weird and out of place and said a few things you didn't like or it all was a little tense, I think it's a great opportunity to enact your own patience and kindness and openness and zip your lips -- and when she leaves again, you thank her warmly and with no expectation for what might follow. She might retreat deep into the tunnel for a long while, she might not. I know that on this board people are big on boundaries, but I believe that would mean, for example, that, while she is staying with you to help take care of you, you tell her you have to leave the room when she criticizes you. That's my take!
I probably won't go back on this board for a long while, as you know. But sending love and hope!
Glad to hear that your surgery went well. How long do they say before you will be back to normal?
Kind of strange that your siblings didn't want your kids to come. Or did they just want adult time? I think your kids need to be there for you so maybe it was all for the best.
You are going to get lots of different views here. I don't take that as bad. As someone who has gone through it, I do have to say, this experience will show you what you are made of. Have faith in yourself to create the life you want. If she does ever actually want to come back, the odds are that you will be in two totally different places. The relationship would need to start all over and she would have a ton of self work to do, not many people get there.
God doesn't do the work for anyone.
People come into our lives for various reasons. I believe my ex was here to give me my kids, but he really doesn't know how to be a dad. I think he just want to be buddies with his kids, even now he differs to me when there are issues. He will have to decide if that is enough..
Keep working on your family and making your life a good one.
kat
Hi Kat, thank you for your thoughts on why people are put into our lives, and your kind wishes about my surgery.
Gerda, I am always thankful to hear from you. I have some thoughts that I will share about what you wrote. But I will save that for later.
W called me several times today, on s13 being in a sour mood, ways to help d18 get more from her college loans, and her money crunch b/c she has still not received our state tax refund. It's been over 3 months now and she was counting on the refund back on April.
So the discussion with W on her tight finances, W decided to tell me that she needs to find a "a roommate". Of course, the trigger flashed in my mind of W living with another guy and my s13, and this made me mad.
But I quickly calmed myself, and perhaps the roommate would be a female friend. I know she is not thinking of me, as a year ago I tried to "rescue" W from her housing troubles and offered to move in with her, which she rejected. But whoever the roommate is, it is something out of my control.
So my focus is now switched back to me and my recovery right now.
I want to make you smile, so here are a couple of good lines about lawyers:
First, from a movie:
You wanna waste my time?
Ok. I call my lawyer.
He’s the best lawyer in Miami.
He’s such a good lawyer, that by tomorrow morning,
you gonna be working in Alaska.
So dress warm.
-Tony Montana (Al Pacino), Scarface
And from TV:
As your lawyer, your brother, and your friend, I
highly recommend that you get a better lawyer.
-Jerry Horne (David Patrick Kelly), Twin Peaks
Hi everyone, I need some advice.
I picked up s13 today who was taking a shower when I arrived. So I sat and chatted with d18 who is getting ready to head to her out-of-state college at the end of August.
W came and sat down next to me on her couch. We had some light convo, but then obsessed W came out. She was obsessed about 2 things:
- Money. She still has not received the state tax refund which I gave her in exchange for my filing as "head of household." She needed reimbursement for signing s13 up for football (which I gave her, and
- Her "change of life", is this called menopause? She gave me gory details of change of moods, body hurting more (I gave her a little back massage), hair growing everywhere, her putting on 10 pounds, etc. When I mentioned I thought this was happening 9 months ago when she had an intense hot flash, she agreed and told more stories of her "hot flashes";
W continues to be fighting constantly with s13 over cleaning. Before she would let him leave with me she made him take 3 bags of garbage out. I supported W when he spoke disrespectfully to her. Finally, he got sick of W, took the final bag of garbage out, and went and sat in my car w/o telling anyone.
So here is where I need help - W continues to ask me to take over her 3 br condo, which is slightly more expensive than my current 2 br apartment. Should I suggest that we live together in separate bedrooms in W's condo?
W has no source of income, and she thinks she can get a much less expensive place to live on her own. Money is always tight for both of us, and so living together is a sensible idea for us both to save money. S13 would have the benefit of both parents being there for him, and I can keep him on task better than W on doing chores. I would ask that she pay a few hundred dollars a month towards rent, which should be less expensive than any place she could find.
Any thoughts?
Really wet?
You think it might make sense to move in with a menopausal woman you used to be married to that dates other people?
Masochist? Or just nuts?
Personally, I think you know better than to move in with a woman that's dating other people. Especially one that you used to be married to.
And for goodness sake, now's a good time to pull a 180 and not save her. That's part of what is needed, don't you think?
AJ
AJ makes some good points. She is playing the victim and you are falling for it. And if she is dating someone else is he moving in with you also? Just questions that I have
Yikes Wet - that sounds like pain indeed!! You are D now - maybe W just needs to find herself a source of income?
I would place the focus on having a comfortable and affordable place to live yourself and making sure the kids are ok. If W can't afford the place she's in, she may need to find a new place - but none of that is your concern IMHO....
Just my 0.2pence...
Wet,
If you share a condo, will you be ok watching her head out the door with some other man? Are you ok with laying in bed listening to the sounds they make when she invites him in later to spend the night? If you say yes to this, then ask yourself why you are willing to be her doormat.
You should not consider sharing an apartment with you ex until she has admitted things did not work out like she thought. That she has lost her identity as a wife. That she is financially struggling to make it. That she is un happy. That she wants to work on the two of you. I would not move in till you have work on the two of you and are at a point in the relationship where it will continue to move forward and have no chance of slipping backwards.
Thanks everyone for your helping me to see the obvious problems with moving back in with W.
Here is a bit more background on why I am considering the possibility of moving in with W:
- S13 is making friends at his current school, and it would be nice to keep him at this school. I live in a different city;
- W likely will be unable to stay at her condo b/c she cannot afford it, which means s13 might have to move out of his school district;
- I was told yesterday (by d18) that D20 who lives with me now, is considering moving out and finding her own place;
- I doubt W will EVER admit she has done anything wrong. It's just her personality, and this is not a deal-breaker for me.
A couple of other things make think that moving in with W is something to pursue. I have a 1 year extension on my apartment but the landlord never sent over the lease for me to sign. And W started this by inviting me over to her place to recover after the surgery I had on July 1st. I would stay in the 3rd br, and W has her own br.
But I understand W is still a mess. She is depressed (when she mentioned she was going thru menopause, I asked her if she was ready for her next "season of life" and she looked at d18 and said "no, b/c the rest of my life has been so miserable.")
And most importantly, things have not changed on the most important reason why W left me - I still do not have a steady paycheck coming in.
I think that the chances of reconciliation are better if we are living in the same place. It also seems W's OM has moved on after his heart-attack. I checked by doing a search of the dating sites and it seems W is "only" on one dating site. Not even the free dating site is coming up. So perhaps now is the time to shake things up by seeing if she is willing to live separately in the same condo.
And Life Twists, I would have to have a boundary of neither of us bringing other people back to the condo. This would be a deal-breaker.
Bad idea all around. She will bring her men around because she has no respect for boundaries that you set. You will work yourself up into is frenzy. Not good.
Maybe you could move so that your son could stay in his school district but if not, have him come live with you. "saving" your wife isn't your job. She chose this path and needs to feel the pain that goes with it. She can get a regular old job if she needs money. She has this idea that she was put one earth to be taken care of, but this isn't a fairy tale. So maybe the sugar daddy well is dry for her at the moment, but somehow there will be a new one and she won't be complaint so much to you.
There are much better solutions out there, go find one.
kat
Thanks Kat, and everyone else's unanimous voice - I hear you, don't try and move in with W. I am still torn on this though, as my real motivation is my son. I don't want him to be forced to move again (if W moves, this will be 3 moves in a little more than 2 years.) But for today, and at least this week I will hold off and stay away from W.
I had a good weekend with s13. Though I made a poor choice in taking him to the movies today. I let him choose, and he ended up choosing an "R" movie that was much worse than I imagined.
I made him 'pinky swear' not to tell mom what we saw. He said that mom has taken him a much worse movie than this (I can't even imagine that is possible.) So I guess we are good.
S13 starts football training camp this upcoming week. It's going to be hot...
That's not a bad thing. You two have a secret between you. Helps the bonding, Wet. Not that you want to encourage him to keep secrets per se, but some are going to be ok and even helpful. It's something the two of you share. Besides, he was going to see that movie with or without you at some point
Better to be with his dad and learn how to deal than to figure it out with his friends. Seriously. Just don't make that a habit, right?
As for the moving. I get what you're saying. I feel it. But honestly, he is affected by his mom's choices as is the whole family. Some things you can protect him from and others you cannot. What you can control is being there for him regardless of what life throws at him. And he can always come live with the stable parent - you. All of that can happen without you moving in with her.
Life is a funny thing, Wet. Your job is to teach him to be a functioning member of society. This is something that happens in our society. You can teach him how to deal with it by showing him. By being the stable parent. By being his dad.
He may not like all of it, but that's how life can be. He'll need to learn (from his dad) how to deal with life.
AJ
...As for the moving. I get what you're saying. I feel it. But honestly, he (s13) is affected by his mom's choices as is the whole family. Some things you can protect him from and others you cannot. What you can control is being there for him regardless of what life throws at him. And he can always come live with the stable parent - you. All of that can happen without you moving in with her... AJ
Thanks AJ, yes, s13 staying at his same school appears to be one of those things that is out of my control. I'm just not sure why W wants me to take over her place, and why she just doesn't go look for a cheaper place herself.
So last night 'The Bachelorette' is on, and W starts texting me. It looks like this is "our thing" to text each other during the show. It was fun, again I staid away from judgmental comments about Kaitlyn (who slept with one of the guys early on), all well and good.
Then W texted that one of the cute 28 year old guys "we should set him up with d19 and have an arranged marriage." Now, W has admitted to me that she has dated younger guys than this, and this was a nice sign of progress - W understanding men this age are for our daughters, and not her.
I think as my W's 50th birthday is approaching, she is feeling her age. It has nothing to do with our relationship or marriage, it's just nice to see her see guys in their 20's as off limits. But my mission this week is still clear - stay away from W.
And how is your recovery from surgery going? All is progressing well?
I like that you two have a "thing." Kind of interesting. Be careful not to get sucked in though, yeah? I think you've learned that by now
Maybe that's kind what you're feeling with the housing situation? Dunno, just wondering.
You also realize by now that the dating of other people is/was a symptom of what's really going on under the surface, right? And that what she's doing is not about you - that sunk in deep by now, right? Doesn't make it easier, but it helps some.
It's an interesting observation, Wet. The age appropriateness thing. But as a data point it's really an outlier in the story so far. Keeping the distance might be the best course for a long while to come.
Peace,
AJ
Hi AJ, thanks for your observations. I spent the weekend with s13, we went to the movie 'Pixels', which if you are a child of the '80's is terrific. S13 thought the movie was only "ok".
My recovery from the spinal fusion surgery is frustratingly slow. It has not helped in relieving the pain/neuropathy in both of my legs yet. But as with all things, patience.
AJ, I have been staying away from my W. However, we will need to work together to put together a response on taxes, as I received a letter from the state tax people asking for more information before they pay "my" refund (which is going to W).
"Bachelorette" finale and NFL football training camps opening this week, good reasons to be excited.
Wet, here's to a faster recovery process!
As for the W - there are of course things that need to be done over time. You have 'business' items to discuss.
As it turns out, you can be in the same room and distant at the same time. Just like you can be in a room full of people and be alone.
I'm thinking it might be a good idea to worry about you and the kids for now. I suspect she feels you'll always be there for her. Which you will if really important, I'm sure. But for silly business items or grown-up choices she can make? Perhaps it's time for some more distance?
Yes, NFL is coming! Looking forward to it...Are you pulling for a real team or something in the North?
AJ
This is scary. I received a notice over the weekend from the state taxing people asking for details and receipts to support education credits W and I claimed. I emailed details to W this morning on what was needed. Several thousand dollars is involved which W was counting on 3 months ago.
W called me up this morning crying, frustrated with the demands that the state is making. As an example, the state is asking us to provide copies of receipts and canceled checks (?) from 2014 for all of our youngest 2 children's paper, pencils, backpacks, etc.
I tried to support her, and telling her I have some receipts that will help. Then she started crying so hard I could not understand her. But part of what she said was me moving into her condo, so s13 could stay at his school and not have to move again. She may have said that she wanted me to move in with her.
Then it got scary. W told me that she was in so much pain. That she could not sleep. She was obviously depressed. Then she told me "Wet, promise me, that whatever happens that you will take care of s13."
I promised, but asked if she was planning on running away, and she said "no". I may have been wrong, but I read her statement as being that she might attempt suicide.
When I got off the phone I called 2 of her sisters that are close to her. I was able to reach 1 of them, and explained that I thought W might do something to hurt herself. SiL thanked me and immediately called W.
SiL confirmed the depression, the pain in her body and lack of sleep adding to the depression. SiL went to W's place, gave W a sleeping pill and took the kids for the afternoon, hoping she could get some sleep. SiL also insisted to W that she needed to get counseling, and that W needed to get her focus on herself and work on her own life.
I'm praying like crazy for her. I have not heard anything since.
Aye, that is scary, Wet. And not unexpected. I can't help but wonder if this is what bottom looks like for her or if there's more...
Keep us posted.
AJ
SiL called me to let me know that W is in a dangerous place. Several of W's sisters have made unnamed "accusations" against W, and SiL begged W not to look at her emails (which is where the accusations against W were made.) No one knows if W has seen the emails yet.
So tonight was the "Bachelorette" finale. So I sent a couple of texts to W on the shocking conclusion. She finally responded. I kept it light. She even commented on a "inappropriate M & M's commercial". So she seemed ok to me.
AJ, SiL agrees with you. That W had hit bottom. But W is a fighter, so I am not sure she is there yet.
Wet
Thats some scary stuff ... I recall about a year and a half my W hit that point, said similar things ... however she had said those things previously with me just to get my attention. She told SIL something similar and SIL called the sheriffs and had them check up on W (SIL lives out of state) ... well the sheriffs cuffed W (for her own protection) and took there to the hospital where I had to come and sign her out. Was an eye opener for me and ... more so for my W. We did find some humor in the fact W made it into cuffs before I did ... lol.
Even that was not rock bottom for my W ... but it does appear that for your W it quite possibly could be, now one would hope she starts some sort of IC (thankfully the SIL suggested this and not you) and she begins the work she really needed to do all along right?
Hang in there Wet ... you are doing well
Thanks CaliGuy, there is comfort in knowing that others have gone thru similar things that I am going thru now. I like how you found some humor (the handcuff thing) in a serious situation.
Yesterday was an emotional day. I picked up d18 and we went to the movie 'Inside Out'. This animated flick should come with a warning for guys that it causes extreme feelings of emotion. The movie starts with a family moving from Minnesota to San Francisco. The 14 year old daughter is unhappy and decides (b/c of her emotions) to run away from her family back to Minnesota. Here I am watching this with my daughter who is moving away from our family in Minnesota to Boston at the end of the month, and as the movie ended we were both weeping.
I returned d18 to W's place, to pick up s13 for the weekend. W intercepted me and wanted to talk. W talked with me for 20 minutes to explain problems she is having with 4 of her 7 sisters.
I have a history with her sisters, I have a good R with 2 of them. And I know the history of W and her dealings with her sisters. So I am the only one W has in her life that can really understand what W is going thru.
4 of W's sisters are making serious accusations that W is doing improper things. As an example each sister spends 1 day with their father taking care of him. Monday was W's day, and sister4 broke into father's place searched W's car and purse (found nothing) and just started yelling / accusing W (who is the youngest of the children). Accusing emails were sent by the "Gang of 4" sisters. And W is fed up.
I listened to W giving her my full attention, she was crying, we hugged 3 times during her 20 minute emotional talk. It was all about her, I supported her, spoke only to validate her, and she got a lot of info out. She spoke about how this will forever break her R with her sisters, and she liked it when I suggested that "I can't even see what forgiveness with her accusing sisters would look like."
The last hug W clung to me. W: "no one but you knows all of what I am going thru." W is going away this weekend with d18 and one of W's female friends and her daughter. At the end, I felt good about how this interaction went. I am starting to act more as a friend for W right now, and that seems ok.
Wet
Yeah I went to that movie with S and W ... was an amazing flick, probably the best one I have seen in a long time and its impossible not to through the MLC spin on it.
The interaction with you and W ... yeah I would see that as a positive, she comes to you and is sharing those very deep things she only feels safe with you in sharing ... the SFTU smoothie and just an ear does wonders. Well played Wet ... just take it for what it is .. a good exchange, do not get sucked in.
I had a nice weekend with s13. No problems. He did find a new show to start watching – ‘Cat-fishing’, which is about people who think an internet romance may not be with a real person. And the show’s investigators find out the fake person In the couple of shows I’ve seen, they are despicable people. And the truth is discovered.
I had a couple of ‘triggers’ over the weekend. W sent me a receipt by email which was from om as we try and assemble receipts as we deal with essentially a tax audit. The receipt had his full name and address and with this I did some checking on him – he has 2 recent dui’s, incl. 1 this past June. He was divorced (w/ children) over 10 years ago – and had 2 violations of his Order for Protection. Also a conviction for Disorderly Conduct. He also has a sizeable judgment against him. He’s just someone I don’t want around my kids. BTW, the searches are on a free website I've learned from my job over the years - no creepy stalking going on.
Also, d18 told me W and d18 were going away overnight with one of W’s female friends. W called me over the weekend and I mentioned her getaway, and she said this fell thru. And she also mentioned she was going out to see “a friend’s” new puppy. I don’t know why this still gives me a flash/trigger of jealousy. But this was over in a few minutes.
W tried reaching out to me, texting me during the season opener for “Bachelor in Paradise” (we liked watching last season’s "Bachelorette" show and would text each other during the show.) But I shut this down, I am enjoying ‘Big Brother’ instead.
Fantasy Football is starting up. I am having lunch later this week with one of the co-owners for our team. Otherwise, all is calm.
Arghhhh!!! I called W to deal with kids issues and tax issues. And W dropped another bomb on me - om is moving in with her on September 1st. He is moving into the 2nd bedroom being left by d18, who is going off to college.
I asked her if she had done a criminal background check on om? She said she knew some bad stuff in his past, and I rattled it all off for her om has 2 recent dui's; he has 3 convictions for anger related offenses. I asked W to please not let him drive our children. She agreed.
W told me she was not happy with this. But om has recently been thru rehab, and she told me if has 1 drop of alcohol he will be out of there. But b/c of her financial position, she needed someone to split the rent with her.
I know I can't control W. But to have this person around my s13, I am just scared for him. I just feel numb. Again.
I would mention this to your L. There may be grounds for him not having any contact with your minor S.
Just a thought.
Here is Friday's Lawyer joke: how come you can't find lawyer's sunbathing at the beach?
Cats keep covering them up.
------
Heavy D, you gave sound advice about bringing this to my lawyer's attention. The problem is, I have a crummy lawyer who I think is in love with my W.
Yes, I am my own lawyer
, and after preparing a joint Divorce Agreement (Pre-DB - where W keeps here stuff, and I keep mine) W has not signed the agreement. So nothing is filed with the court, and now is just not the time to dig my heels in.
Well what a crummy lawyer indeed!!! Hahahaha!
I don't know if that's a bad thing or good thing!
A good weekend with s13. We watched the Vikings football game together last night. He likes to argue with me that the Vikes are not that good, while I am a rose-colored glasses Vikes fan. He was checking Madden Football cards for players and saw that Adrian Peterson only had a "hit" power of 14 - he commented that Madden should have asked Peterson's son first about that rating (no offense intended). But he's a funny kid.
W texted me that she was away all day on Sunday, and asked if s13 could stay over night. No problem, I enjoy extra time with my son. W has shut down communications with me (and I with her) since she told me om is moving in with her and s13 on September 1st.
Here is Friday's Lawyer Joke: While delivering his closing remarks in the defense of the prostitute, the lawyer said, “You cannot single my client out. Although I have not gone to one of them, I know there are at least eight brothels in our fair city.”
A voice cried from the back of the courtroom,
“Which one haven’t you gone to?”
A quick journal. I have s13 for the weekend. D20 and I watched the latest version of 'Annie' last night. It's great. It has wonderful new songs to go along with some of the classics. And there are great performances.
The ending of 'Annie' is the typical happy ending - a happy family. D20 volunteered that she "doesn't believe in 'true love' anymore after Blake (Shelton) and Miranda broke up."
This was a kick in the gut to me. D20 is too young to be this cynical. And d20 had a happy family and happy parents growing up. She is the one of our kids who is most insulated from the foreclosure and separation.
I believe in 'happily ever after', whoever that may be with for me. But I could not respond to d20's comment. Oh the pain we parents can cause to our children.
Yes, my adult children have voiced similar sentiments to me. I think, in some ways, it was harder for them because they never saw my ex and me fighting, in fact what they saw was a mostly excellent marriage of 24 years. We were the family that took great trips together, where the parents were still affectionate with each other after all those years, where interesting discussions were had around the family dinner table, and interesting friends came over for informal dinner parties.
I think they feel that, if a marriage THAT good could still fall apart, what hope is there? And I admit I don't have a great answer for them, as I can't explain myself what drove my ex to be unsatisfied and unfaithful, and willing to inflict the same pain on his children that his WAW mother inflicted on him. I've offered MLC and brain damage (he had multiple concussions) as excuses for his behavior, but the kids aren't buying it. The best I can do is model a successful happy life after divorce.
Thank you kml, you give a good suggestion.
Life is stranger than fiction. So W had plans to have om move into her place on Sept. 1 with her and s13. OM has drinking and anger issues.
Today I found out that om was arrested for Breaking & Entering. Where was he trying to break into? W's place. Apparently he wanted to talk to W, and she wouldn't let him in. And he climbed up onto W's 2nd floor deck, with s13 sitting right there. OM was drunk, and may have wanted to take some of W's pills? And W called the police.
Life just keeps getting crazier. Anyway, I am getting away for the weekend with d18 and s13 to stay up at my sibling's cabins. There should be tubing, fishing and some game playing. It is a good time for the kids and me to get away.
I think you'll find that the kids understand what's going on. They are also likely torn because they want a relationship with both parents. What happens between the parents, is the parents business as long as they get what they feel they deserve - parents. For now. At a later date, with more life behind them, they'll be able to better voice what they saw, how they felt, and what it means to them. I wouldn't want to be the mom at that point, but good things can still come of it. It's never too late for that.
I know my son realizes. I know my ex tried to "replace" me with OM. I know the kids feel lied to and betrayed by their mother. I know they also saw my examples and they know I love them and never left them. That's what I was able to do for them, even though at times I really felt like taking a ride on the crazy train.
My son, talking to his uncle a while back who asked about his mom and OM, said that "the guy was ok, but he wasn't my dad."
They know. They also know it's not right, which may play into the concern. But they'll find a way through that with your help.
Enjoy the cabin, Wet. Sounds like fun.
AJ
The weekend get-away at my family's cabins was nice. D18 and s13 were with me. D18 is leaving on Saturday for a college in Boston, so it was my family's (brother, sister, their spouses and my Mom and Dad)time to learn more about what she is studying and to say goodbyes.
The weather did not cooperate though - it rained and was windy for the whole weekend. So it was card playing, and watching movies (my sister/BiL's cabin has a 3D movie player) - cool.
One scare with my Father. He just got a report that his heart is only working at 20% of what it should. He had trouble sleeping, and on Saturday night he became flushed, coughing constantly, and nauseous. It was interesting to watch my siblings and I try and figure out how best to help him - we each knew best of what Dad needed.
He woke up on Sunday after a good night's sleep, and everything was fine. I am starting to face the reality that with d18 moving out-of-state, that another family member (d19 also moved away) is peeled away since our separation.
Here is Friday's Lawyer Joke: Q: How many personal injury attorneys does it take to change a light bulb?
A: How many can you afford?
Q: No, seriously. How many personal injury attorneys does it take to change a light bulb?
A: Three. One to turn the bulb, one to shake him off the ladder, and the third to sue the ladder company.
Last Wednesday night the family went out to eat to celebrate d18's leaving town tomorrow to go a school in Boston. It was not a pleasant gathering, except for d18 and d20 enjoying each other. I was attempting to calm down after dealing with my car's overheating problems.
W was also not very pleasant as she was just pulled over by the police who informed her that her license was revoked. She ended up yelling at the officer in front of d18. Also W tried to pull information out of d20 and d20's dating her long-time friend. D20 shot back sharply "why don't you tell us what is going on in your life?" A reference to W having her om arrested last week for 'Breaking & Entering' at her place.
I tried to change the negative tone of our dinner by asking d18 what she was most looking forward to in moving to Boston? Her response - not having to deal with my parent's issues. Sigh.
S13 asked me over and over to let him come and stay at my place. He and W are continuing to fight. But b/c I was in a seminar all day yesterday, I told him "no" I did pick him up last night after his football practice. He was worked up the first hour here, but I got him to calm down and he even got to bed at a reasonable time.
Next Tuesday, 9/1 om may still move in with W and s13. I have no info on what W's plan is, and so I may be letting my fear get the best of me.
Yesterday I was up early and drove over to W's place by 5 am to take d18 to the airport. The plan was W was going with us. But W texted me to let me know she had the flu, and stuff was coming out of both ends
(ewww, W, tmi). So W ended up not going with us.
I got d18 off to her flight to her college with no problems. I am excited for her that she gets to start a new chapter in her life. She seemed genuinely excited also.
OK, here is my confession. B/c I knew we would be dropping off d18 at the airport, I knew the plan was I would be alone with W after we dropped off d18. I am hoping that given that om attempted to break into W's place last week and 5 police cars were called, that W's financial stress does not mean that she will still let om move in with her on September 1st (as was her original plan.)
I was all ready to discuss a couple of topics with W - first, how W dating other men hurt me. How s13 is not happy with our current arrangement, and then see if I could help co-parent s13 by moving into d18's bedroom at W's place. But b/c of W's illness, I did not get the chance. This is likely for the best. I have not contacted W this weekend, and instead I am enjoying my time with s13. School starts tomorrow for the boy. And today we will go out and get him a haircut. Unlike his daddy, he has a beautiful head of hair, but much too long with which to start school.
Always mixed to have a child leave for college. I just sent my last one off a week ago. I was joking with him that I would move away and not tell anyone. Truth is, I am getting the house ready for sale, but I'll let him know where.
As for your daughters' comments. er, that seems telling don't you think? The oldest is obviously angry at her mom, the next doesn't want anything to do with the situation.
I remember you talked about living arrangements. Don't you think it would be better to get full custody of your son rather than move in with his mom? That doesn't seem to have an upside from what I can see (based on what you write).
AJ
Hi AJ, so you are an empty-nester? That is really scary to me. When you spend so long of a time thinking of only the kids (and er, ya the W) that sort of freedom is not appealing to me right now.
The s13 sitch is, what can I say, complicated. W chose her place so that he can have some sort of stability. He is in the same school district, has the same friends for the past 2 years, and besides my having him on weekends is the only "normal" thing in his life. He did tell me yesterday om's breaking into W's place made him feel "bad".
My apartment is in a different city. And it appears I will have another surgery perhaps as early as September (3 spinal fusion surgeries in a year, is this called a 'hat trick'?
) From my perspective, s13 staying with W for as long as he can stand it, is best for everyone. Full custody will have to wait. Thanks for your thoughts.
A hat-trick of that sort might be less than desirable
What's causing you to need another one?
I get it. Things are never black and white, right? Just seems like it would be difficult to be in the same house and not really a good thing for anyone involved. I'm on the outside though, so questioning it is as far as I go. You have the decisions and consequences to live with and make the final call.
Yep, an empty-nester. Makes me sound older than I am, but yeah. Freedom? Hmm.. I've had the freedom for a long time now, although this is certainly more of it. I don't have to make allocations when son is around now. Heck, I don't even have to come home if I don't want to. I can stay out late and eat ice-cream for dinner if I want, with no repercussions or somebody else to worry about
Peace,
AJ
A hat-trick of that sort might be less than desirable
What's causing you to need another one?
Peace,
AJ
Hi AJ, I have lost feelings in both legs except for a constant burning. Before the 1st Spinal Fusion, this problem went up to my knees. After the surgery it went up to my hips, and so they did the 2nd fusion surgery.
The burning has now gone up to my lower back, and so they are thinking of doing a 3rd spinal fusion surgery in a year. This time it will be on my lower back, which I always thought was the spot (after looking at my MRI's) which was causing the problem.
Tomorrow is s13's birthday. W invited me and my parents out to eat to celebrate. It is convenient that s13's birthday always comes at the same time of year that the new Madden Football is released.
It makes for an easy gift for the boy.
Ouch. Sounds like a lot of fun, Wet - not
Madden football is always fun. Good stuff!
AJ
I am sorry for my earlier "Debbie Downer" post. Despite the problems with my legs, I am still able to walk without assistance. I am doing ok in the health department.
Tonight we celebrated s14's b-day. We went out as a reduced size family (W and I, d20 and s14.) But we also had my parents and W's Father. And one of W's sisters (whom I am close to) and her husband. It was really great to have everyone there.
So I was "on" making sure everyone was involved in the conversations, while being upbeat (esp. about the Vikings - Skol Vikings!) And a bit funny. Here is an example:
Me to S14 - Do you know how close you were to having a really weird name?
S14 - no.
Me: Your back-up names were "7" (courtesy of George from the 'Seinfeld' show), or "Benmont". Everyone looked at me like I was crazy. Well, of course, I wanted to name you after the keyboardist of Tom Petty & the Heartbreakers (keyboardist Benmont Tench).
The group burst out in laughter - but I couldn't tellif they were laughing with me or at me. Everyone was enjoying the time together, and as I said, it was lotsa fun.
Ok, I am sorry to bring up W, but I must. W let me know earlier in the day that she threw out her back, she was in horrible pain (along with her fibromyalgia), and she was seeing a doctor in the afternoon. The doctor gave her some Vicodin, and then at dinner she had 2 drinks - and for my tiny W, she was lit up.
At the end of the meal, W pulled me aside and asked me to drive s14 back to W's place. She told me she could not safely get him back home. Of course, I agreed.
W gave me a hug, and turned to give me a kiss but she caught herself. Dang, I can't even get a kiss out of a plastered woman after a nice night out. I gotta work on my game.
LOL. I didn't read that as a Debbie downer post, Wet. I asked, and you told us.
Glad it was a good time. Sounds like fun was had
Happy birthday to Benmon..er your son
AJ
Thanks AJ. Well, it looks like I have found myself back in the "friend zone" with W. Last night's meal out with our families was really nice. But today W called me to ask for my help - legal help so that she can fight her over $500 in tickets after she lost her driving license.
I agreed to help her. Please don't throw any stones. I am kinda behind on my child support (it's complicated. W's tax refund from my return was much smaller than we expected. And the refund amount was "intercepted" to pay the child support.) But W only sees the amounts she sees coming in. And it is something I want to do, and I know I can help her.
After this call, W called me again. This time it was about the family's cell phone plan (W has her own plan.) Even though W does not have a phone on our plan, she is the only one the cell phone company will allow to make changes on the account. I have paid on this for over 5 years, and they still won't listen to me. So W was kind enough to provide me with suggestions on how I can get a cheaper plan by switching.
So W is my buddy. And I guess I am hers. OM (or "angry/drunk guy" as I like to call him) did not move in with W on September 1st (praise God). So I guess it is time to warm up to W and see what happens.
Friday's Lawyer joke, what every lawyer is looking for in a client:
“I’m your dream client. I’m the most fun. I’m rich. And I’m always in trouble.”
-Larry Flynt (Woody Harrelson), the People v. Larry Flynt
Ok, I just had a weird convo with W. This is her first real weekend all by herself, with d18 away at an out-of-state school, and s14 with me. I'm sure most of us on this Board know what happens on those long weekends alone when our spouses are free. I wouldn't let my mind think about such things.
W's call came out of the blue on a Saturday night. She asked me to consider doing something for her. W asked me to take s14 to his football games and practices on Tuesday nights for the next couple of months. The reason for this change - W wants to attend a Bible Study on Tuesday nights.
Color me shocked. W is not a "book person", and in the last 5 years I never saw her with her Bible. I asked her 10+ years ago to attend with me a study of Romans by one of the big international Bible study groups, and she fought with her Bible leader the whole year. It was not a good experience for her.
I paused for a moment as W talked, and then I agreed to take s14 on his Tuesday night football stuff. Something new for W in a positive way, so I am all in. Faith comes from hearing God's Word. I hope this meets W's spiritual needs. My prayers for her growing faith in the process of being answered?
Hi Wet! I am truly impressed with your positive attitude and continued sense of humor... especially considering all you've been through and had to deal with. You are a model Divorce Buster that others can look to for inspiration and guidance!
So W is my buddy. And I guess I am hers. OM (or "angry/drunk guy" as I like to call him) did not move in with W on September 1st (praise God). So I guess it is time to warm up to W and see what happens.
I like this. Allow her to see the possibilities. Be open yourself.
Thank you FY for your kind words.
W called me last night at 9 pm, and she was kind towards me (?) She again brought up the topic of her going to a Bible study starting on Tuesday nights, but needed me to take s14 to his football games/practices.
I have been going on Tuesday nights to 'Divorce Care' at my church, and so there is a conflict. W remembered that I "go to church" on Tuesday nights, and she offered to look for another Bible study. She was thoughtful and nice to me - I am frankly not used to this.
I told W that this is not a problem, that it was time for me to "move on" from my Tuesday night program (I have been thru 'Divorce Care' over 3 times now), and that I was thinking of going to a Bible study myself on Monday nights. It all works out.
Perhaps W is getting cold feet about the idea of attending a Bible study. But I didn't want s14 and I to be the reason for her not going. Everybody in America enjoy your Labor Day.
Well played, Wet. And good perspective - like FY and even though I sometimes challenge your thoughts, I'm impressed by the PMA and compassion.
I'll still challenge you when it seems appropriate though.
Happy Labor Day,
AJ
I don't know what to do with this. I spoke with W yesterday. She found out that my tax return which I direct deposited the refund to W's account, was much smaller than we were counting on. She was complaining that back in April she could have filed her own return and received more money - I told her we could still do this, and offered to help her get her tax return filed (ugh, the Rescuer Wet reared its ugly head.)
Then W started talking quickly and my mind was still on the tax return issue. She said I should move into her place. That she can't find a cheaper place in the same school district (for s14)and that I should move in with her. Whaaaat?! I was still distracted, and couldn't respond to what she said.
I realize moving in with W for the money savings for us both is not the best way I envisioned seeing us coming back together. But it will help s14, which is reason enough. But if I quick move in with W, d20 who is now living with me, will lose her place to stay. I am leaning towards sitting down with W and seeing what she has in mind (like her activity on dating sites and om.)
More importantly I attended a Fantasy Football draft party last night. I co-own the team with 2 other guys and we were drinking beer, watching the Twins (who lost) and kicking out the football players who we should draft. We picked Adrian Peterson and KyRu from the Vikes. We have such a good team, I think it is just a formality that we will win the championship.
W and I scheduled to go together to traffic court this morning to fight her $500 ticket.
At 6am she texted me asking if we could move going to traffic court until tomorrow. She said had not had any sleep, and could use some extra time to get some extra sleep. Fortunately, I was at my Men's Groups sitting in a restaurant having my 1st cup of coffee this early in the morning. I told her that was fine, and that I would pick her up tomorrow morning.
I was all set to discuss with W to discuss if she really meant asking me to move in with her, and to see what she had in mind (especially as far as her being on dating sites and dating other men - if she wants to date other men, then I am not interested in moving in with her.)
But W just texted me to ask me if we can cancel her traffic court hearing until next week. She has scheduled her Landlord to come and fix her washing machine and microwave which are more immediate needs. I texted her to let her know that it was ok to do her traffic court stuff next week.
I am looking forward to take s14 to his football game tonight.
Friday Lawyer Joke (perhaps it is better stated that this is a joke about our clients?):
Does any of the following sound familiar?
Toddler Property Laws -
1. If I like it, it’s mine.
2. If it’s in my hand, it’s mine.
3. If I can take it from you, it’s mine.
4. If I had it a little while ago, it’s mine.
5. If it’s mine, it must never appear to be yours, in any way.
6. If I’m doing or building something, all of the pieces are mine.
7. If it looks just like mine, it’s mine.
8. If I think it’s mine, it’s mine.
OK, I get it. This will take some time, if it is possible.
Last night W asked me to drive s14 to his football game b/c she had a business man photo shoot. W was going to drive s14 home after the game. I took s14 to his game, and W knew I was going to leave at halftime, but she kept texting me that she was going to be at the game early, and I could leave now, blah, blah, blah.
I wanted to watch my son play football so I staid. W came to the game shortly after it started, and she stood by me (there were no bleachers, everyone brought their own chairs, except W.) After W refused my chair, I pulled my chair back to a retaining wall so W could sit on the short part of the wall.
W look tired and frazzled. She was not dressed to impress her "business man" customer (not even a push-up bra!). We talked for a bit about s14, and small talk about how big some of the 8th graders were. Then the convo became forced.
I was not going to bring up the topic of W asking me last week to move in with her and s14. I thought W was the one to bring it up. Anyway, the topic never came up. And instead, W after complaining about s14, said that when her time "was done" I could have s14 all of the time.
I did not follow up with what she meant - perhaps I should have. At halftime, s14's team was losing by 2 tds, and I decided to leave. W walked me out.
Here comes the Wet 'Doofus Move of the Night' - As we separated so I could go to my car, we hugged each other. It was nice. But W gently said "oww". Then said "oww" a 2nd time. When we finished hugging, I noticed the solid Coleman mostly metal fold up chair I had was in my left hand while we were hugging, and it must have bashed her in her sore back. What a dork!
Today, W and I got word that s14 seriously hurt his knee while warming up to run his phy-ed 1 mile run. W took him to the ER, and he is now on crutches. W offered to have him stay at W's place and they could "snuggle" up and watch movies. He preferred to come over to my place. Ok, I am letting my pride show up on this story.
I felt disappointed, after last night's seeing W and her threatening to have me deal with s14 full-time. But I preached patience to myself, and realized this could be a slow process, as much as I thought things were starting to move in a positive direction.
Wet,
Your w could have just been talking things out loud because whatever was going on w/her at the time was stressing her out. I'm sorry that your son hurt knee. I hope the damage isn't too great and that he'll be up and about in no time.
As for you my dear friend...keep your expectations at zero. Actions always speak louder than words and until she actually does something in her home to make room for you, as well as possibly helping you to pack and move, then I would take whatever she's saying w/a grain of salt.
Hang in there! She's still got a long way to go.
Dear Wet -- I haven't posted here in a long long while. I wanted you to know that I am still praying for you and your wife.
I read through this thread and I was very happy to see that your wife is looking for ways to be part of your life. And not only going to Bible study, but wanting you to know about it. That is AMAZING. Even if she still has a long way to go. I know that most folks are big on boundaries, and that boudaries are very important for our own survival, but I would also suggest reading Charlyne Cares on this topic -- because the reason that pulls your spouse back to you does not have to be the one you envision. It might be something that doesn't SEEM like a choice on her part. But she has so many choices, and she is choosing to ask you to live with her again! It could be that you can thank God for making her feel that she is so broke that she HAS to live with you, even if she thinks she doesn't really want to. That doesn't mean she is ready to be a real wife. But it means that you have the opportunity to continue to be her husband no matter what she does.
In my own life, I try to focus on what I have read in Charlyne Cares about the spouse's return. She says it won't happen as you envision, and that you have to zip your lips and it could take a couple of years (after the return, not after bomb drop! I know that looooooong, much longer!) before you start to have a real marriage again. My husband is an in-house prodigal, and believe me, it's a hell to live with someone who is going through MLC in front of you. But even when I am at my lowest, I try to remember to thank God that we are still a family, we are still under one roof. Your focus on your son is a beautiful thing, and you are right that he would rather have one household. I believe your wife might be awful to you for a while to come, or flip flop between awful and nice. But I believe you can zip your lips when you have to, pray all the time, and you will get through it and come out the other side.
And know that I'll still be praying for you, and will always have firm faith that if you are led by God in your own actions, this dark will be turned to the Good.
Love,
Gerda
Thank you Job. Yes, my W is like that - sharing what is on her mind off the cuff. Thanks also for the reminder that I should have no expectations.
Gerda! I am so happy you have stopped by. I am grateful for your suggestion of the 'Charlyne Cares' daily emails, they are great and filled with scriptures that encourage me. I also receive the Men's weekly devotional. And thank you for your continued prayers.
Yes, I have a vision of how things could work out between my W and I. And reality doesn't seem to be anywhere close to what I was thinking.
------
S14 came to my place yesterday after his ER visit for his knee. This is heart-breaking - one of the first things out of his mouth was "Dad, mom wants to go travelling across America. And I'm not going with her. Will you take care of me full-time when she leaves?" Ouch!
So now W's prior comments that her time being the mother of s14 "was done" is making sense. She wants to hit the road. W has a bunch of photographer friends across the country that she could visit. But I think this is just the "confused mind" of my MLC W.
W is thinking of doing a "road-trip" across the country, and also thinking about having me move in with her. Ayeyiyi?! I am having a tough time with this - except to remember to DB, and just give her space as she sorts thru this.
Good morning wet. I have been mia for a while and this week won't be any better.
The best you can do is be the rock for your son. I think your wife is thinking out loud and is still way too deep in her crisis to make much sense. If you do this, she can go run off and do this and that, sort of thinking. She isn't reconciling, she is running and from her parental duties as well.
Dig deep and stay the course. Create a solid place for you and your kids.
kat
A Friday smile involving lawyers -
Lawyers in the movies:
Everything that guy just said is bull(deleted). Thank you.
-Vinny Gambini (Joe Pesci), My Cousin Vinny
...and in literature
A Judge: a law student who marks his own papers.
-H. L. Mencken
I had some good things happen this week:
- I met with my old boss on Monday and he has confirmed our new fairer agreement. He also sent one of his clients to me for some immediate legal help;
- D20 turned 21 this past Wednesday. I took her to the bar for 'happy hour' today where I had my 1st legal drink. Our convo was forced, I asked her about all the things going on in her life - job, school, boyfriend, etc. She didn't feel like talking.
After her 2nd drink (I was driving) she seemed like she wanted to share something with me. But I didn't force it, she did tell me W is still seeing angry/drunk om. He is either in treatment again or in AA. D21 also told me that 'Mom' also mentioned when they had dinner together earlier this week, that she is seeing an extremely wealthy fellow photographer from another state who was previously infatuated with her. But she thought a year ago he was too old and kinda creepy. So I don't know or care whether he is back, or W was just telling a "war story" about her previous beaus.
- S14 is healing quickly from his bad knee. He should be able to get to practice again this week;
- I had some 'Spinal Tap' today and it felt so goooood. I had steroids pumped into my lower spine, and the numbing agent made my legs feel great for a few hours. I think they are on the right track of diagnosing and treating what is going on in my legs;
- W did not go to Bible study on Tuesday night. She switched to a Thursday Bible study, Yay!
I am encouraged by this past week's happenings. I have s14 for the weekend - if only he would wake up!
I was having a good week, then I received the call that my 85 year old dad was in the ICU. Heart disease, heart racing, etc. When I arrived there this afternoon, my dad's blood pressure was 89/58 - too low!
5 minutes later, his blood pressure was 171/120! He had trouble breathing, he was thrashing around and could not get comfortable. It was difficult to watch. My mom was there, and I was glad to provide comfort for her.
They changed medications and did a great job treating the symptoms. By the time I left, he was sleeping and all of his vitals were back to normal.
Hi Wet, I'm sorry to hear about your Dad. It sounds as though the hospital got things under control pretty quickly and it's good you were able to be there for him and your Mum. As you say, it's a horrible thing to go through though.
I hope things have settled down now and your Dad will be home again soon.
Take care, Sotto xx
Thank you Sotto. Yes, my dad is doing better. They removed 2 liters of fluids from him, which has helped with his breathing. He will be out of the ICU this afternoon.
Glad to hear your dad is doing better, Wet. Scary.
Of course, if you think that's scary, try waking a 14 year old football player with a bum knee
Nice to hear work is getting better too. Seems things are going your way...
AJ
My Dad is back at home. He is feeling better and hap-hap-happy to be out of the hospital.
Tomorrow is our anniversary. I have reverted in the past 2 days to thinking of how I can best use our anniversary to pursue my W. Maybe I will invite her out for drinks? Or dinner? Maybe I will do her taxes for her... Sigh.
I found a good anniversary quote from someone named Paul Sweeney. I thought I might send it to W:
"A wedding anniversary is the celebration of love, trust, partnership, tolerance and tenacity. The order varies for any given year."
So tonight I saw W as I picked up s14 for football practice, and W was heading out to her Bible study. Thankfully, common sense and remembering my DB training, I said nothing. No hugs. No kisses. No mention of tomorrow's anniversary. No pursuit. I will not send W any anniversary quote.
But dang W looked good. Soooo good. I still miss her.
Glad to hear your dad is back home. That's always a good time for a happy dance
AJ
Today is our anniversary date. I texted W after 10 am to tell her "Happy Anniversary. I hope that you have a great day."
W responded a half hour later with a text saying. "Thanks, you too."
My smart alec response - "Still the greatest band on Earth." (Do I need to explain this?
)
I went over and saw my Mom and Dad. He looks good, he is happy to be out of the hospital. D19 decided to text me a bit about her 'Papa', and I suggested she give him a call.
Weekend plans include having s14, his football game Saturday morning, and then a friend's wedding Saturday night. It will be nice seeing some of my old high school/college friends.
This morning I called W to see if she would sign a Stipulation to lower child support b/c d18 is 18 years old and off at college (called emancipation).
W told me what was on her mind - let's sit down and talk about "other things". We should be divorced now. Let's hire an arbitrator to finish this up. Divorce, Divorce, Divorce, is all she wanted to talk about. Then she complained that the child support wasn't enough to pay for s114.
On the divorce, all I said was "the ball is in your court" (meaning I previously provided her with a stipulated divorce agreement, which she did not sign.) I wish I would have said something more "pro-marriage" like I am standing for our marriage, if you want the divorce, then you do all the work. But I didn't say what I wanted. But at least I kept it short.
After she vented, I got her back on topic. She was uncomfortable, but our daughter is 18, and going to college, she said she would sign my stipulation and get it back to me. The call has left me unsettled, and a bit shaky.
Wet
I think exchanges like the above... They get caught off guard and the knee jerk reaction is to get defensive and resort to their "go to" which is the divorce card. I think at this point your W knows you are pro marriage... Otherwise it would be you who is pushing for that .... She went there because she did not see this coming, retorted she isn't getting enough to for S14 in an effort to keep things status quo... Good for her ... I wouldn't beat yourself up for the pro marriage stuff. Let her sit and marinate with this new change that is about to happen and see where she goes with it
W did not sign the Stipulation to reduce child support, though she agreed to (b/c d18 is now going to college). I will not argue with her on this. Instead, I will just file a Motion to get this done.
W appears to be in an agitated / flight mode again. D21 went to see W last night. D21 wanted to get some feelings off her chest to W, seeing W post on FB about dating a 34 year old guy, and this upsets her.
So when d21 got back to our place, she said W wants to move 50 miles to the west with another guy, but W understands she can't do this right now b/c it would move s14 out of his school. We both want some stability for s14 right now, and staying at his school, with his friends, is a priority. I am guessing I will soon hear from W again that she wants me to take over her condo and take s14, which seems to happen at the start of each month, so she can go chasing after her 'Prince Charming'.
Here is the Friday Lawyer's Joke:
A lawyer was walking down the street when he saw an auto accident.
He rushed over and started handing out business cards.
“I saw the whole thing,” he said. “I’ll take either side.”
Last night I went to pick up s14 to take him to football practice. I saw W and asked her to sign the Stipulated Order to Reduce Child Support, b/c d18 was "emancipated".
W was upset. She understood the reduction of child support hits her. She asked to see the Stipulation and I showed it to her. She was agitated, and said she would like to have her attorney "review it". I said "fine, I will just file a Motion."
I showed it to her again, and it was only 2 sentences long - d18 turned 18, and she graduated from high school. Simple as can be. So W signed it, but told me I "owed" her. I emailed it to the County Attorney for her review. I am thankful this issue was resolved without much of an argument.
Today I picked up s14 again for the weekend. His football game tomorrow morning. I will try and get some rest, as I am under the weather.
"owed her"? Back payments?
Get some chicken soup too, right?
AJ
Journaling - I had the chance to talk to d21 for a bit last night. She broke up with her ex-bf 5 months ago. Ex-bf has kept his distance until yesterday.
I find new fascination in watching break-ups to see if any get repaired. D21 was in love with ex-bf, and so I wanted to see if their year long R was something that could or should be fixed.
Ex-bf showed up at d21's restaurant job. This made her mad, she did not like the attention or embarrassment. He brought a giant cookie (I think she liked this.) And when her shift was over they went out for a drink.
When they talked d21's ex-bf placed too much attention on d21, instead of how he had grown thru the break-up. He told d21 that "she had made a lot of mistakes." But that he was "willing" to get back together (I guess he was saying he was willing to take her back, despite what she had done.) D21 was not impressed.
Another mistake of ex-bf was that he took the bus (he does not have a license) to see d21. But by the time they talked, the buses had stopped running. So d21 was forced to drive him back to his place. And he begged/pleaded that she see him one more time before he would leave her truck.
D21 is great, and she has moved on with her life after the break-up. Last semester, she took 20 credits (!!!) and had a straight 4.0 gpa, while also working. It looks like ex-bf is still stuck in the past, has not moved on, while d21 has gotten a life, and more easily moved on. It seems like I can learn some lessons from my d21's break-up and her handling of it.
I had a good weekend with s14. He had to face a football player 6 inches taller and 25 pounds heavier than he was. By the end of the game s14 had gotten into Giant football player's head, as he was complaining on every play to the ref that s14 "was holding me!" S14 had 4 straight tackles too, and a sack. Ok, the game wasn't great as s14's team lost by over 30 points.
W asked me today to make sure s14 was current with his homework. A near heart-attack experience! In the past 3 days of school, s14 had failed to turn in 13 assignments! Thirteen!!! I had a serious discussion with him about this, and the importance of doing homework, but he has a little smart-a$$ in him, telling me the homework doesn't really count. "It's just the tests Dad." No way was I going to let him get away with that kind of poor logic. I told him to call me on Tuesday to tell me how many assignments he had caught up in turning in.
I see my neuro-surgeon's office tomorrow, to see if a 3rd Spinal Fusion surgery is needed (Ack!)
I think it is great that you can see what didn't work for your daughter's ex boyfriend. Missing someone or the relationship is never a reason to get back together. Need to look at what went wrong and how has anything changed.
I hope all goes well with your spine check up.
I will write more when my world slows down. lol
kat
A quick update - my father went into the ER this past Wednesday night. He continues to have problems breathing, and had liquid in his lungs. He is back home now, and doing better. They are now planning on doing a pace maker for him next Tuesday.
S14's homework problems seem much better. He turned in most of his work earlier in the week. When I saw him last night he said it is all turned in (dad, for the scene to be complete, make sure to add the rolling of his eyes.)
I saw my neuro-surgeon, and they are going to try another steroid shot in a different part of my spine. They are trying to figure out exactly where the problem is. But every time they give me steroids, I seem to put on another 5 pounds!
The 'roids do that effect. I have friend in a similar situation (only worse) and they gave him the steroids. He gained 30 pounds almost over night which makes the back problem worse. The good news is, he was able to avoid surgery.
Hang in there.
Your son - it may be that he just needs to have his dad pay attention to his school work and show him what's important, no?
A pace maker could be a really good thing. I'm hoping for the best outcome!
AJ
Hope they get you all figured out Wet
W called me up a few days ago, and mentioned her Uncle passed away and her sister's odd response. This is the classic "creepy uncle" who molested 5 of the sisters, and dangled W when she was 6 years old by her feet out of a 3rd story window.
The sisters wanted to send 1 of them to be the family's representative to the out-of-state funeral(?!) W had a good but sad response - Just like I won't go to my pediatrician's funeral who molested me, I can't even imagine attending 'creepy uncle's' funeral, and I hope you(i.e., the sisters) don't go either.
S14 had his last football game on Saturday, and was a monster after this. He was yelling at me about everything. Today, he then decided he did not want to go back to W's place, after begging to go back for several hours. He then "ran away" by busting off the back door screen. I did not chase after him. He came back an hour later yelling at me for not going out to my van, where he was waiting.
I am taking W to a traffic court hearing 1st thing tomorrow morning to fight an expensive ticket. I better review 'Sandi's 37 Rules' about a dozen times more times before I have extended time together with her (you know driving together, on a train, then the trip back.) And why do I always think that I have a chance for s3x out of this? My mind is still so messed up...
I finally did it. I finally told my W that I did not want a divorce, and that if she wanted the divorce, she would have to do all the work. That the old marriage was "cr*p", and that I wanted to see how a new marriage might work with all that we've learned.
Here is how I got the chance to say this. I drove W to challenge her traffic tickets before a traffic Examiner. The Examiner was short with us, and rude - I asked for a payment history to help us better understand what was going on (W thought she paid the tickets). And the Examiner said he did not have a payment history. And then went on explaining the April payment did not pay the ticket. And the September payment did not pay that ticket, blah, blah, blah. I saw he was not going to be helpful, or discount the amount which was owed (over $700 bucks), so I set it for a court hearing in November.
Driving together W was writing out her version of the facts, and so we didn't talk much. After the meeting with the Examiner, we sat down and I got some tea, W had coffee. Talking about the Examiner being a jerk (at what point W was explaining what she thought the payments were going to, and the Examiner said to me "she's not getting it. Do you want to try and explain it to her?" - how rude!)
W was emotional. She does not have the ability to pay over $700 in tickets, and was frustrated by the rude Examiner. She cried. I tried to change the subject, and everything she would turn into something negative. Example, Me: "you are seeing your Dad later today, he must appreciate having you there"
W: "older sister will be there too, b/c she doesn't trust me around him."
I then changed the subject into something light, and kept doing this until I had W giggling.
W then brought up what was on her mind - divorce. She wants the divorce done now. I gently told her that I do not want a divorce. If she wants the divorce, she will have to do this all on her own. I then mentioned that the old marriage was "cr*p", and that I wanted to see how a new marriage might work with all that we've learned.
I am happy about this b/c I have never explained to her that I did not want a divorce. I have avoided talking to her about it. I hope that I have cleared up what my position is.
I caught her off guard, and she started crying again. She then asked me what I would do that would change how our "old" marriage worked. I mentioned 'communication', that I was a very poor communicator when W asked me tough questions. I would get defensive and would try and protect her from what was going on.
I then said I would make sure I was keeping W protected. W told me that her bad childhood experiences made it important to her that she feel she is safe, and in a safe environment. I explained this was important to me, I apologized for a time when I did not go downstairs at night when she heard someone break-in. I validated her need to feel safe.
I then told her that I understood her Love Languages, and that she needed to go out and have fun with me, go on trips, etc. She added that her strongest Love Language was doing acts of service, so she was tracking with me. This was all very positive.
I did a good job of curbing my tongue. With d21's example of ex-bf, I did NOT mention anything that W needed to fix - I thought about it, but kept my mouth shut. All of the discussion was what I needed to do to change our "old" bad marriage, and listening to W, and responding to what she said.
So we still had a train and a car trip back together. I kept it light, tried to keep the focus on her - she is going to AA. She is in some sort of group where she is learning about things like "anxiety" - a score of 500 is red-line. W's score was above 1,000.
But then W started talking about d21's new boyfriend, who is from the old neighborhood. How he was such a help "after the divorce". She mentioned "after the divorce" 3 times on our ride back. I let those references slide. I understand that W was still processing what I said, and this was a being said to keep me at arm's length.
OK, I am long-winded today, so I will stop here. When I got her back to her car, we hugged briefly, and that was it. I hope I gave her some things to think about.
Glad to hear you spoke your mind, Wet. Sorry you didn't feel safe saying it before in your marriage.
I would imagine with such a high anxiety, it's going to be hard for her to process your thoughts or see that her desire to feel "safe" and her actions don't seem to line up with common ideas on the subject.
How's your dad?
AJ
Thanks AJ. My Dad goes in for surgery today to have a pacemaker and defibulator (sp?) put in. I will be there with my Mom, and I expect my brother and sister will also be there.
What I am most encouraged about from speaking with W yesterday was that she is getting help. Attending AA, and another group that is teaching her about stress seems very positive to me. We all need people to stand alongside us as we face life's struggles.
I'm keeping your father in my thoughts and prayers today.
Thank you Job for your prayers. Medicine is amazing these days. My Dad had his pacemaker/defibulator put in on Tuesday, and was back home on Wednesday (yesterday). He is already sleeping better and he has his appetite back.
Today I am sharing 3 positive lines about the law and attorneys, for this Friday:
No man suffers injustice without learning, vaguely but surely, what justice is.
-Isaac Rosenfeld
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The United States wins its case whenever justice is done one of its citizens in the courts.
-Inscription on US Dept. of Justice Building in Wash. D.C.
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Law: the only game where the best players get to sit on the bench.
-Anonymous
That's great news. He will notice a difference.