The awakening of me Part 3 - DivorceBusting.com

Day 1 of 3 of move out.....

It's weird. Real weird. He asked to take our comfy but ruined with bleach marks sheets. He got together some towels and was in the garage for a while. I offered to help, since he helped me move out, but he declined. He asked about taking the dresser with his stuff in it, a part of my bedroom set I got pre him. I said sure, for now.

Anyway, made it a normal night for me and S. Made dinner, a mean tri tip! and now just chilin. H took off to unload at "the house". Weird weird weird.

Time for a glass of vino

I'm there with you, with a glass of vino

. You are doing great.

Morning 2 of move out weekend.

Bare with me guys. This is proving to be a little harder than I expected, and posting my feelings is helping me from spewing them.

Last night H never came back but I pretty much expected that when he took sheets and blankets with him. I got the 7 a.m. TM to not worry, he passed out on couch and will be heading this way shortly. Please, he had every intention of staying there, just be honest!! What does it matter anymore?

So he showed up about 9 and talked with our neighbor across the street for a good hour. Then came in and sat down with S and I. Asked how S was feeling, let me know he picked up a bed frame for free on his way here. I answered cool, I mean what does he want from me? We had full eye contact and I searched his eyes....were you celebrating your first night with some skank last night? Were you really alone and just crashed out in your mismatched teenager furnished house? I can't see anything in his eyes, just blank.

But does it matter? Either scenario is sad. To choose that over family and home. Just sad.

So he is gathering things now, going to pick up his buddy to help him. BTW, his new hangout buddy? They have known each other since high school, buddy has never had a long term serious relationship and has been in and out of jail for stolen merchandise and drug use, currently living with his mom.

I am fighting anxiety, this feels to be a true test of changes I have made in myself. I am staying away from H best I can because I'm scared I will blurt something out. Working really hard to keep my mouth shut. I want to finish this weekend coming out with dignity and grace. I refuse to give him a reason to justify his actions. I want this over so I can start healing and move on.

Night 2 of move out weekend.

Well alrighty, I did well! I felt the anxiety and anticipation coming on, and I took control of it. H and buddy showed up. I made sure to come out smiling and joking with them. They took most of the heavy stuff H needed. H asked first about anything he took that we hadn't discussed. When leaving, H said he may or may not come back for some more, but planned on sleeping at "the house" tonight. He said tomorrow he wanted to take over S for a little while, then asked if all 3 of us could go to dinner. I said ok, but what about the super bowl? He said he didn't plan on watching it. Could be the lips flapping, we will see

So I am super proud of myself. S and I went grocery shopping and are feeling much better. I am in for the night with my son and pets, surrounded by love, I am good

Mleigh,

You are amazing :-)

We are here if the waters get rough.

Much love,

Heather

Thank you Heather. Your words mean the world to me. I am learning from the best of you here

I don't know what I would do without you guys.

Mleigh

You are doing great... And you are handling that moving this with grace. This roller coaster isn't something any of us asked for, but here we are... There will be ups and downs in the emotions, but you are showing incredible strength and you're only getting stronger and it's amazing to watch here from the sidelines. You've got this!!

Morning 3 of move out weekend:

Caliguy, thank you for your continued support, it means a lot

Last night S and I watched a movie, had dinner, played with the crazy animals, it was a good night. I moved some things around in my bedroom to fix the space where his dresser was and it looks really cute! We have 2 vanities in the bathroom with shelves on each side and his were all emptied out. So I moved my stuff over to fill it all back up. I also added some trinkets, they are ceramic stars I got from a wedding. I have 3, they say wish, believe and dream. Good thoughts to have each day as I get ready. Anyway, too soon to be erasing signs of H? Not for me. His choice.

About 8:45 H showed up. I didn't hear him come in and all of a sudden he said something, really startled me! He said he had gone to the store to get some groceries, went to have some cereal, and realized he didn't have any bowls. So he went through the kitchen and grabbed some things. He also went into my bedroom to get his laundry basket and I cringed a little. I hope it doesn't hurt his feelings that I am changing things already, but again, his choice. He didn't say anything. Came out and said his goodbye.

This morning I woke up full of energy. By 10 am I cleaned my bathroom, put away more of H's shoes and clothes in closet, put away some things he left in the shower, and shampooed the empty living room carpet where new furniture will go!

I am dying, just DYING to straighten up the spare room, H's room. The door remains closed. But I don't want to push it. I will let him have today to finish clearing his stuff out of there, but then that door is open, forever! and I am cleaning! H knows me and knows I hate disorder. I wouldn't say I am a neat freak, I just like organized and tidy

H has Direct tv going to his place between 12 and 4 today. He had asked S to come visit him today sometime. He had also mentioned us all going to dinner, but we will see how it all plays out. In the meantime I am staying busy and it feels good.

Time to clean the shower!

My goodness! You have been a whirlwind in the cleaning department. I do know what you mean about cleaning up and putting things away. It's nice to be able to look around and know that everything is nice and clean. I'm sure you can't wait to air out and clean up the "frat" room. It's going to take a lot of airing out. LOL! Don't forget to clean out from under the bed. They generally have stuff under there too!

Give him today and then tomorrow....look out!

M4
You are doing great as well as can be expected.

Stay strong and focused.

Night 3 of move out weekend:

S and I hung out most of the day. I want to make sure he is as well as possible for the school week. The day passed by with no word from H. About 4:00 he TM asking If S wanted to go to his place for a bit. We had been playing outside with the hose, giving dog a bath, so S was a little cold and I was getting him a warm bath ready. So I let H know and had S call him so they could talk. S said maybe he would go over later. I know S and that is code for no.

Some background. H has always somewhat alienated himself from us. Playing board games, playing in the backyard, going for walks, so many things over the years. H really never participated with us, always had something more important to do. So over time, S and I are super close and he and H, not so much. I know without a doubt H loves S very much and yearns to be closer with him, he just doesn't know how. To me it's simple, but H just doesn't get it and gets very annoyed if I try to talk with him about it so I shut up a while ago.

Anyhow, I actually felt bad. Pictured H home alone wanting to spend some time with S. I know, my empathy hits overdrive. And a boy needs his dad, I support it 100% So I TM H that if he needed to pick up more stuff here, I could make sure S was ready so he could take him to his place for a bit. H replied yes, that sounded good. That was at 4:00. We don't hear again from him until 6:30. He calls to ask if S wanted to go over for a bit. No joke. Didn't we already go over this??? Never mind he had said he wanted the 3 of us to go to dinner the other night. I knew, just knew, lips were a flappin. So I told him it was getting kind of late and he mentioned that maybe S wanted to stay night with him so again I put S on the phone and S told H not tonight, maybe a different night. So they decided H would pick him up from school tomorrow and have dinner, but H has an early meeting Tuesday morning so he would come back home. S said OK.

So H asked to talk to me and we went over plan. I told H we need to get a schedule in place and ease S into it as he gets used to H's new place and H agreed. I don't think it's a good idea to keep asking S if he wants to go over, that's too much for a 7 year old. I also talked to S briefly that we will get a schedule in place like we had before because it's important he spend time with his dad.

So there you have it. I survived the weekend, yay for me! H is already being MR. Flakey, but that was expected so no worries here. It's Taco Night!

You are doing great! Sounds like you and S are really close.
The nice thing about living on your own is no more walking on egg shells

Hi mleigh,
You sound like you are doing well. I can relate about how your H never wanted to be involved in the things that you and S were doing. I got the same from W the years leading up to B-day when she was entering MLC. For her she was always too tired to do anything. In the year before she left she would start saying it was time to get ready for bed earlier and earlier. Some days it started as early as 7:00 PM with her saying she was just so tired and wanted to get ready for bed and since she was sleeping in the living room on the couch, that meant everyone had go to separate rooms. It was ridiculous.

Have you thought about how you and H want to split custody? For W and I we are 50/50 with me having D15 one week, her the next. Since she moved 30 miles away and put D15 in a school across the street from her, it isn't easy on D15 or me. I swear the court shouldn't allow a S to move that far with a child if you are doing 50/50.

For what it's worth, I don't think your H is spending any nights with any "skanks", at least not yet. I have seen how they get all excited when they are first moving and I really think he is just feeling like a kid who is moving away from home for the first time. I also wouldn't expect him to remember any plans they may make like going out to dinner Sunday night. They tend to get caught up in the "new house" and forget everything else.

Be careful with the "empathy" thing. Your H's R with S is really up to him and while you may want to try and help him and S to spend time together or have a closer R, the best thing to do, IMO, is just let the two of them work things out. He will need to learn that he can't wait until 6:30 and ask S to come over. He needs to make an effort and plan time together.

You are just at the start of the new living arrangement between the 2 of you. I will tell you that it will be better once he is out and moved. Living with my W while she was in full MLC was much harder. It is much easier to detach once they are gone and you can stop the walking on egg shells and wondering what will happen next. Believe me, I've been there. Use this time apart to work on you and start being the person YOU want to be without worrying about what H thinks. You've got this!!

Hi Karma. Yes, S and I are super close. And I am enjoying the peace at home with H out.

Hi Matt. Thank you for your input. I stopped trying to help the relationship between H and S a long time ago. I agree, it's between them.

Had a good day at work. H picked up S after school and they are at his place. It's nice to have some time alone.

So I come home and there is a manilla folder on the kitchen counter. I open it and right on top are 2 magazine articles. 1 on mediation, 1 on divorce. They are dated last month. Also in the folder is H rental agreement for his place and his credit card bill. Obviously he left it here on accident. Or did he want me to see that? Is he trying to tell me something? Did his landlord give him this info, is that why it is all together? Lovely way to start my night.

So of course I want to TM him that he left his folder with is divorce information here and is he wanting to tell me something.... but let me guess.... you guys will tell me to not bring it up, right? If he has realized he left that here, he is either thinking ugh oh, or he is relieved.

Your thoughts?

Personally, I would screw with him and not let on I read anything. He is taking the easy way out by tempting you to learn info he is too cowardly to give you himself.

I wouldn't give him the satisfaction.

Sorry Leigh. Whadda Dickus move.

I hope you enjoy your break from the insanity. Remember the peace of living away from crazeeee?????? ;-)

Hi Lois. I have had a few minutes to let it sink in and the same thought came to my mind. If he wants to proceed further with something, he needs to come to me with it. I won't bring it up at all. I put the envelope with his mail to take, let him wonder if I saw it or not.

I did however read the articles. I figure I deserve the same information he gets! In looking closer, it is a magazine for police officers. My FIL is an ex cop. Such love and support from the in-laws, huh? I would bet that his dad came across the articles and gave to H. It is totally something he would do. He helps H in any possible way he can, even helping him to ruin his marriage.

Some background on FIL. I love him, he has a huge heart, but he just doesn't think sometimes. He helped me move out, even let S and I borrow his spare beds. After the fact, it actually hurt. I felt like he was helping the destruction of our marriage. Then once I moved back home, he was the one to tell me to move his beds to my house because H was going to use 1 in the spare room. Like we were talking about the weather. Yep, that was how I found out H was moving to spare room. I know in his mind he is just trying to help, but in reality, he is helping the destruction. This is something he should stay out of and have no part in.

So, he may have given this to H, possibly just for info. It doesn't mean he and H talked about it and it doesn't mean H asked for it.
And if H DID leave it out on purpose, oh well. Not getting off that easy

I will let it go. It's not like I don't know this is floating around us anyway, it just really took me for surprise. It hasn't come up in months, so I figured it was on the back burner.

On to enjoying my first night alone in a really long time.

Job - you called it. H is starting to grab stuff when I am not home. He cleared off a dresser today and took a candle holder that I can swear was a gift to me long before him. So I mentioned that and he got real defensive, said it was a gift to him. I told him ok, if he is sure, but I don't know.....

I am getting uncomfortable with him taking stuff when I am away. It's getting sneaky.

I also notice a definite change in attitude. He seems a little colder with a bit of an attitude. Got a little snippy when I asked if he could move his jeep so I could have my spot in the garage that I have parked in for 12 years and he took over with his dumb jeep weeks ago. Was only supposed to be for the night. I would move the dang thing myself if I knew how to drive a stick. My spot is convenient to load up my truck in the morning for work and school. Not trying to be difficult.

I wonder if he doesn't like my redecorating, filling up his empty spots? I know it hurt me a lot when I moved out, but come on! This is his choice. Or could be just that he is withdrawing now. Not sure.

Each time he leaves, he goes with paper bags of things at a time. He really doesn't know what he is doing. This whole moving thing has got him frazzled. This will take weeks at this rate!

Ok done venting. Thanks for letting me

Job, you had mentioned that MLC'rs are in a real fragile state. Do you think I am moving too fast, filling up and replacing things where he left a void, or moving things? For example, he had 2 shower gels in the shower, I had noticed he took 1 and left the other, a gift from me by the way. So I put it away in the cupboard. Well now it is gone. He either looked for it or came across it, but I feel bad that he knows I stashed it right away.

Should I slow down on doing stuff like that? I am doing it for me, I don't want his stuff all around me right now. But I also am not looking to hurt him or make anything worse....The reason I ask is that I am seeing a real change in attitude and behavior the last couple of days...

Your thoughts?

You need to really look around your home because there will be more missing than you think. They come in and take whatever is in sight. There is no rhyme or reason for what they take. I know someone, from this forum, that had a little boy and he had a cut little table and chair he used as a desk in his room. Guess what! He took the chair. Now, keep in mind, he couldn't sit on it w/o breaking it because it was a child's chair.

JeanS who use to post here came home one day and found the steps to the shed gone. They did reconcile a few years later, but the steps never returned.

My xh came by one day and took hand lotion that I had just purchased. I sent him an email and advised him that I didn't appreciate him taking the lotion when I had just purchased it and would like to have it back. That in the future, you ask, you don't take things. Sure enough, the lotion was on my porch the next day.

To answer your question about moving things around...you are fine. It's your home while he's out to lunch.

Yes, you will see changes in his behavior from now until his crisis is over. You didn't see them the last time because he wasn't the one leaving the nest. He is changing into the bratty kid who feel entitled.

Please be sure you put any valuables that you treasure in a locked place for a while. Also, don't leave money lying around. Some of these guys will take anything and everything. Don't be surprised if food starts disappearing. I had that happen too. You can't trust them.

Mleigh

Ughh .... hang in there the roller coaster is gonna get bumpy. Not that you can pinpoint the MLC and where their mind is .. but the trends are just crazy. Seems your H is wrestling with the guilt and guess what ... its easier to get upset at you and make this all your fault justifying why they must go through all this trouble of moving out .... certainly its not because they have lost it ... has to be you right??

Yeah .. lock down your valuables and now would be a good time to start with some boundaries IMHO.

OMG. Weird things are missing. A toothpaste that only had about 1/4 left in it? He took both garbage cans in the garage. Both?? 1 of them I bought for my apartment. He took a giant block of Cheese that he had said we would split. I just keep coming across things. So I need to speak, huh? Some things I can let go, it's just stuff, but I sense a little war/anger going on when he is in here grabbing stuff.

I will make sure to put special things away.

Hi Mleigh4 (M ok?)

So far since I moved into my own place I have had w make a point over wanting back: a sieve, two bowls, potato peeler, specific plates, a pan and this last weekend a teaspoon (not a set you understand, just a teaspoon)

There's no accounting for it and I put it down to wanting to feel an aspect of control but I just say fine. This isnt the big stuff and I have no issues with just replacing with those of my own choosing. I took mostly what I wanted from our apartment such as the TV/Bed/one of the sofas so im not sweating the small stuff but it is odd at times.

As the others said, you may want to sort some boundries and make sure the big stuff is agreed and anything small and precious (memory or price) is somewhere you can keep control of it.

Hang on in there.

Ed

Ok ... I am not .. well .. ok ok .. I laughed. 2 garbage cans and a block of cheese ... can we name him Ratatouille??

Lock your stuff up ... and yeah I would set a boundary here pronto!

Mleigh I am getting caught up on your sitch and really?? A block of cheese? These MLCers are just nut jobs!

You sound like you are doing really well! Good for you! It is nice to have the home to yourself without daily BS. Hope you get some peace.

I told you that they take things, i.e., sometimes they take things that do not make any sense to us, but to them they are very important. Also, they will take items that like food, toothpaste, etc., just so that they don't have to purchase it. But they forget one thing, when they run out, they have to purchase it themselves or they come back and get it from you again.

My xh took things that truly didn't make any sense to me. For example 20 pencils and 5 notepads?

Walk thru your house and see what else he's taken. If it's stuff that you will need as well, then it's time to tell him that in the future, before you load up your vehicle w/stuff from the home, let's talk about it. Right now, he feels entitled and the stuff in your home is FREE for him to pick and choose from. He doesn't want to spend any more money than he has to.

Set your boundaries. You may have to consider changing the locks or resetting your alarm, if you have one. The "helping himself" will not stop unless you put him on notice.

Thanks everyone, you really help to put this into perspective, how silly it is.

And Cali....Ratatouille... I burst out laughing at work. It set off a set of giggles that I really needed. Thank you!!

I will not sweat the small stuff, a lot of stuff can be replaced at the dollar store. It's really odd though. Like he is just grabbing whatever. I will let the small stuff go, but will nicely and calmly bring up a couple of items.

And the candle holder he took? Thanks to Job, I had taken pics of the rooms and looked at it, and there is no way that was a gift to a guy! It is so girlie, I don't know why he would take that!? But I have a ton of candle holders, so whatever.

I see some more things gone, however there are a lot of things he has left. We will see if it remains that way. I really don't want this to be a battle.

Job - if I changed the locks or alarm code, he would be furious. If he had done that to me, I would have flipped. This house and everything in it belongs to both of us so that would seem really unfair. And I am a very fair person. I will put valuables away and call him out if needed. When I had moved out, I still came and went as I wanted and he always respected that, never said anything to me. So I am digging for that same respect. He also had told me to take whatever I wanted...

Ugh, I am home on lunch and he just showed up. No work clothes, in his truck, interesting. And I am here...surprise surprise. Very very sneaky....

I'm glad you are playing "fair", but you were the one that moved out last time...things are a bit different this time around. We'll see how his move plays out and whether or not his personality changes even more.

Until that time, try to be more aware of your surroundings and jot down the things that disappear. They don't have to be expensive items, but it's always good to know what they take so that you will know what you need to replace at some point.

I hope and pray that I am wrong about your h and his move.

Thank you Job, I do appreciate your warnings and my eyes are wide open! I do a house check each day at lunch and each night. I tend to think the best of people and it has bitten me in the you know what many times.

So H showed up, with his felon buddy. Said he came to move the Jeep for me then was headed to Walmart to do some shopping. Ya right, took the day off work and picked up his buddy to go shopping at Walmart? So I had a quick chat with him. Asked if he was planning on taking any further things from the house today and that maybe when he does we can go over it, or split things up. He got a little defensive and I told him whoa, this is not war, I want this as calm and smooth as possible for all of us. He said he has only taken a few things here and there, but to let him know if he takes anything I need and he will bring it back. So I said, well, that's why I say maybe when you take something we go over it together. So he said he has barely taken anything, that he is trying to leave as much as possible and I said I have noticed that and thanked him. So he looked around and said he was going to take some pictures, but can just buy some stuff. Then he mentioned taking some of our trinkets over the bar, like Jack Daniels pictures and bottles and stuff. So I was thinking and not saying anything, and he said actually, I really don't need that kind of stuff right now. So I said, H, if you decide for this to be long term, or forever, just let me know and we can start splitting stuff up. It's no problem, no worries. He just said ok. He asked about our agreement on the money again, how to handle expenses and I reminded him what we had agreed on. I also asked that he be really careful if he is at the house and I am not because kitty runs for the door, and she is not chipped or spayed yet, too young. I told him S and I will be devestated if she gets out and lost. He just said, ya, I know. He has left the door wide open several times, "forgetting" about the cat. He also leaves doors unlocked. Drives me crazy. So then off he went.

I think the talk went well, but I don't assume he will do anything we talked about. Eyes wide open and aware

Mleigh,

You handled that really well. I read your words, and I felt myself calming down, and I am sure it had the same effect on your H. Good work.

You handled the situation very well. I just hope he remembers to watch for your kitty. Those little ones can run very quickly and are out the door before you know it.

I am really happy to hear you guys think I handled it well. I am really trying and seem to be holding on to those changes I have made in myself. Makes me even stronger when I can see the actual changes in me....

So my suspicions were correct yesterday about thinking it strange that H and buddy stopped by house to "move the jeep". They ended up going back in the house after I left. I knew because the house alarm I had set was not on, and the coffee table he asked to take, and I gave in to, was gone. Other than that, I didn't visually see anything else gone. What could it be...that they could not do or take with me there?..... I am trying to keep the mind from going, but I really hope H isn't involved with any stolen goods with this guy. But - whatever it is -- not my problem. It just makes me happier that H, and whatever it is, is out of the house.

On a happier note. I got the green light, also in talking yesterday, that his stuff is cleared out of the spare room. So whoosh!! Door opened and kept open! I opened up the window and turned on the ceiling fan to air it out. I straightened up a few last things he left, I just put it in a little pile, and vacummed the filthy floor. I decided to strip the sheets on the bed while I was at it. I go to pull them off, and they don't budge. H had ziptied the ends to the bedpost, and the bottom sheet corners were also ziptied. He also concocted some wire hooks to hold the sheets tight under the mattress. I couldn't believe I had to dig for the plyers in my house to cut off the sheets from the zipties, but ok. Then, I see he put shoes under the feet of the front of the bed post. That one I can't figure out and don't really know if I want to know....

Anyway, I must have walked in there 10 times last night just to see it empty and smile. What a good feeling..... never again.....S and I had a good mellow stress free night

Had a bit of drama tonight. H had picked up S and took him to his place tonight, then brought him here after. Says he is going to grab some things. So he gets a few backpacks and goes into "his" room. Then he heads into our office. I walked in to ask him something and he shoves something into his backpack. So I look at the desk and see our camera and video camera laid out so I asked, what are you taking in here? I said, again, we really should be doing this together. He dramatically started pulling gadgets and I honestly don't even know what 1/2 this stuff is. I don't even know where he had this stuff stashed! There was even like a computer memory board or something. What is he doing with this crap? He had a backpack full of crap.

Anyway, he got really annoyed, said he is not stealing or sneaking anything from the house. So I said, really? Then why the need to keep coming here with your buddy when I am not home? I said why don't you tell me the real reason you guys were here yesterday? Well that really set him off. He said he does not like me accusing him of things. Then he decided to take a cd holder filled with cd's and I said I think our cd's are mixed in there and he yelled that they are all his. So I said look, how would you feel if I kept coming to the house with my buddy and taking things when you were not home?? Especially a felon. I said I never treated you that way. He yelled he is helping him move things. I said, H, he is a convicted thief and I don't like him going through my house. H said this is my house too and I am really pissed that you are accusing me of stealing. So I said, look who you are hanging out with!! He said that's it, I'm outa here and slammed out.

I wanted to say don't let the door hit you in the.....but I didn't. I can't stand the in and out, stuff here and stuff there. I know it can't always be my way, I need to get a grip. But My radar keeps going off with his suspicious behavior. Was I out of line?

^^^^I can see why he would rather come to the house when I am not around, but I didn't start breathing down his neck until he started coming while I was at work.

What should I do? I don't know if there is much I can do other than hope for the best. And so far, I have not noticed anything big or of value gone. It seems to be stuff that I want even aware of..... It just makes me so uncomfortable.

I hope he can finish up this weekend so I can start moving on and relax.

M4
Are you able to change the locks? Set a date with him when everything must be gone that he wants to take and after that he cannot come to the house unless you are there?

When he does come, you must be calm and cool to avoid blow ups.

If he takes something you want or need, when you notice, ask for it back?

It would bother me a to have someone Im not comfortable with being back and forth in the house..

I'm w/Happy on this one. Give him a drop dead date for having his stuff removed from the home. What might work is ask him for a list of things he wants, have them set out in a room and then he can pick them up. This coming and going and taking things on a whim is crazy.

As for the friend being there....oh, no.....especially if he's a convicted felon who has a history of being a thief. He would not be allowed in my home when I wasn't there.

As I have suggested before, you are going to need to change the locks or the alarm code. Your h is really getting a bit nutty about constantly coming there.

^^^^^^^I agree. His top seems to be spinning faster. And, now that you know a bit of where his head is at--the sheet thing is just weird--protect yourself.

In my experience, once stuff is gone...it's gone and there's no getting it back. Mainly, because you are relying on a crazy person's mood to determine if he feels like honoring any promise.

You've allowed him his time to move Leigh...One weekend and then over the period of this week if fine.

Now be the harda$$. This isn't good for you or your son to have him in and out. Use your son to justify your actions with the locks. He needs things to remain as steady and same as possible.

It really upset my D12 (Asperger's) when we came home and things were missing. It impacted her sense of safety.

Draw a line in the sand and be prepared to back it up with a call to the sheriff's dept if necessary. The sheriff's dept. or city police will be happy to help if a convicted felon is helping himself to your belongings.

Here's to praying that this weekend is calm and H-less. I believe you have it in your power to make it so. He may tantrum a bit...but, he can tantrum elsewhere. He doesn't live with you anymore. His choice.

I would think that one mention of a call to the police would get him to back off. Maybe, even make the call so you have it documented that he had this convict in the house and you felt nervous enough to call the police.

He will be pi$$ed...but, if his friends are bottom feeders...then, they certainly won't want to help him move anymore. :-)

You don't need another weekend of stress.

I'd like to share a bit more of my sticky fingers xh w/you. When I began to find things missing and he was coming to the house when I wasn't home to do his laundry. Yes, I was paying the utility bills, the mortgage, etc. The only thing he walked away w/paying was is truck payment, one small TV and VCR. I changed the locks one day and two days later I had a VM left on the home phone from one of his co-workers telling him to pick up that he was ready to come down and help him move furniture out. Oh, yeah...I saw red. I called the man up and advised him to never call my home again as xh didn't live there, nor would he be able to get in to get furniture. The locks had been changed and an alarm system had been installed.

They truly do not like to come to the home when the spouse is there because they truly do not want us to see what they are removing from the home. They feel entitled and think of everything as theirs.

Bottom line, change the locks. This sticky finger business will continue until you do. It doesn't matter how many times you discuss the issue w/him, he's going to be determined to do whatever it is he needs to do. BTW, you need to remember that when you left, you were sane/rational and he's not that way right now because he's in crisis. You can't expect him to be "fair" when he's operating on emotions. You can't trust him right now.

Thank you guys!!! I thought maybe I was being unreasonable. So this is what I just TM:

"Hey, white flag. If you had let me know you had taken some time off to move things on Mon and Tue, it would not have felt so creepy. For S and I to come home and notice things gone was unsettling. The in and out and taking stuff here and there is not good for us either. And I have every right to be uncomfortable with buddy in the house. Can you please plan on having what you need by Saturday? Yes, it's your house too but you don't live here anymore. S and I deserve our calm and peace now. I would really like to treat each other with courtesy and respect, it will keep the peace. For S."

I don't expect a response, I can picture middle fingers and bad names, but Enough is enough.

Thank you again, I really appreciate your input so much.

Originally Posted By: job

They truly do not like to come to the home when the spouse is there because they truly do not want us to see what they are removing from the home. They feel entitled and think of everything as theirs.

X2^^^^

I had no idea what MLC was at BD, nor till about 8-9 months after!!! (Who was in a fog???) But totally agree with job, looking back at my MLC'r she took everything and everything that was worthy. I had blinders on thinking .. ok, I get she is upset and has been, give her some space and time .. 3 months all this will blow over so I did'nt really fight it.

Reading up extensively since ... M, you need to set some hard boundaries here, for you and for your H, he must know his choice is his choice ... he must respect you and your home .. .the one he is leaving. He and the convicted felon in your house on a free shopping spree bothers you, do not put up with it!

Thanks Cali. Ya, I'm a softy but it is time for some boundaries.

I realized, he has had the key to his house and has been moving things since Martin Luther King Day. So ridiculous. 3 weeks is more than enough time.

If after this weekend, he keeps coming in when I am not around, I will consider changing the locks. I just honestly don't know if I can do that, legally. We both own that house so I don't if I can get in big trouble for doing that. We have great benefits here at my job, and I can call a free legal hotline, so I will find out.

Hi Leigh,
Just wanted to add to the voices here. My W snuck in the house she left many times bringing her father (whom she KNEW I wouldn't want there when I wasn't). After I asked her to "let me know before you come" she texted me on a day I just happened to be home and not 2 hours away at work. She texted that she was on her way with her father and his wife. She showed up 5 min later! She thought I wasn't going to be there and she did "let me know" ahead of time. I wish I had a picture of the look on their faces when they pulled up and I was waiting in the driveway! Even after promising not to come when I wasn't there she used out 14 year old D key and kept right on coming over and taking things. She took the flour and sugar for baking for Gods sake! The kids coin collections that MY FATHER gave them (worth a lot of money and I still haven't gotten back). And Job is right.... Once they have something you won't ever get it back.

If I were you I would trust almost anyone more than H to be in your home when you're not because H feels it's "his house too" even though he is the one that left! 7 months later and my bedroom closet is still filled with HER stuff she doesn't wear or doesn't fit her anymore. She was quick to get the stuff she wanted but not to get her crap out of my way!

Don't make the same mistakes I did Leigh. Don't trust him and don't expect him to do the "right" thing. If he had any values he wouldn't be needing to move out ,he would be working to save his M and family! I hope you get that quiet, no H stress weekend!

If you can't legally change the locks, then add another lock to the doors and don't give him a key. You will be truthful when you say that you didn't change the current locks and do not give him a key to the ones. If asked about it, say, after having a convicted felon in my home, I do not want him to return and come into my home and steal stuff either while I am away or even here. I do not know the company you've been keeping, therefore, I do not know who has a key to our home and who doesn't.

There is always a way around these things and you have to think outside the box.

Most states allow you to change your locks once the spouse moves out. You just can't sell the art collection but changing the locks is perfectly fine. He moved out.

As long as he can enter and leave the home at will H will consider it his house too. If you want to send that message that is ok but changing the locks sends a message too. This is something you can control and it is entirely up to you.

My H moved far away and I still changed the locks. H has no idea but I did it for me. I needed to control something. If you just have a locksmith rekey them it is way cheaper. i also had an extra key made for H just in case he ever gets through this MLC. A key without an owner sounds so sad but I also needed to put some hope and positive vibes into this situation.

thanks again everyone. Your input means a lot and I am listening.

S and I had a great Thursday night. I never got any response from my TM to H, but I expected as much. The only H business I had to deal with was a phone call to S, to say goodnight. I didn't hear the conversation, I was in the kitchen cooking, but I did hear H ask S if he wanted to go to a Sharks hockey game Sat. Night, and S say no.

Some background...FIL has Sharks season tickets that he got for him and H to go to together. 2 tickets. It's their thing. So when I heard H ask S about it, I assumed H was asking S because FIL gave up his ticket for them to go. So after the call, I asked S, does daddy have a Sharks game Sat. Night? S said yes.

So to back up some more. The other night when H was here, he mentioned he was going to ask S to stay at his place Saturday night, but S told him he was going to see Spongebob movie that night with his friends. I told H, yes, I just found out his plans today and was going to tell you tonight. So H said, I will try to change a Monday morning meeting I have so S can stay over Sunday day night instead and I can take him to school. So I said, ok, but no time has been set for the movies yet, I haven't talked to the moms yet, so if it's during the day, you can have him over Saturday night. I said I will let you know, he said ok.

I swear, that was the exact conversation on Wed night. This morning, I looked up movie Times, the boys want to see 3D and the only time is 6:10, so the plans were made today with the moms. I thought to let H know and make sure that was ok, but then I remembered he has a hockey game so shouldn't be a problem......MY BAD.

H just called to ask what time the movie was, S told him 6:10. H hesitated, then told S oh, I was thinking you would come over tomorrow and stay the night, can I talk to mommy? I just thought, oh crap..

So H goes off, saying that I said S was going to the movies during the day and he could have him after and overnight. I said I thought he had a Sharks game, that S had said that. H said no, FIL had extra tickets up for grabs and he was seeing if he wanted to go. I said I am sorry, I assumed they had a game and that Sat night was no longer an option for him. He just kept going off on me and saying I said this and that so I got ticked because nothing was ever set, all was up in the air. I will take full responsibility for not checking with him, it was an honest mistake. But his attitude set me off.

So I stood my ground, I told him this is why we need a schedule! ( He can't set a schedule yet because he doesn't know his work schedule yet with his promotion and asked that I be flexible right now) I told him I don't know what is the matter with him, but I know exactly what I said and to stop putting words in my mouth and this is all his choice. I said, why don't you just take him after the movie? He said no, then it makes it into something bad, whatever that means. So he said he would just take him for the day on Sunday, I said ok. We hung up.

So here I am, feeling bad. I want S and H to spend time together. I really do. This was all a total dumb misunderstanding. So I almost....ALMOST.... TM H to go to movie WITH us, then take H home with him. But you know what? Screw him.

I thought of all the nights he went out for all hours, stayed in the garage all night, played on his IPad, mangrooned for hours, played at his new house, all instead of spending time with S. And now, after this week away he realizes how much he misses him?? Ya, your choice and your problem.

I love my husband, very much, would do anything for him. But this guy? Ya, not my husband and don't really like him. He has caused so much disruption in our lives, in many people's lives, and I finally am getting a taste of my freedom from it. I don't give a rat's a## what he thinks of me right now. You know why? Because I know who I am. An amazing, loving, caring person. Not who he tries to make me out to be.

It feels good, to let it go.

On a happier note. Having a wonderful rainy Friday night. S and I watched Back To The Future. S loved it. Had spaghetti and just hanging out. A much needed night, aside from the call.

H won't and can't mess it up:) I am taking 4 crazy children to the movies tomorrow night and spending Sunday with my girlfriends. I only need to deal with H moving more stuff tomorrow, so aside from that, looking to be a fun weekend.

Catching up....

Saturday S and I spent the day at home. I went around the house and made a list of what H has taken. It actually made me feel a lot better to see it on paper instead of jumbled in my head. Honestly, what he has taken compared to what is left here isn't all too bad. In going through cabinets, I came across some things H should have at his place for when he has S. You know, important stuff like a pan to make brownies, taco holders, little containers for his lunch box.... I also got together some dog toys for when H takes her. I did this for S and doggie, not H.

Saturday evening I took S and his 3 buddies to see the Spongebob movie. While there, H TM that he was giving me a heads up that he was going to our house to drop off some things he got me from Costco, (he had asked for a list), and to get a few things from the garage. He said he would get the rest on Sunday while I was home. I TM back thanking him for the heads up, that that was all I had wanted before, and to please get what he needed that night. I just did not want to spend my Sunday with him in and out. I also let him know I got a box of stuff together for him. When he was done, he let me know. I let him know that we were heading home in case he wanted to see S, but he said he was starving and had frozen foods so had already left. When I got home, I noticed he returned my candleholder back along with the garbage can from the garage.

Sunday morning was his day with S. He TM about 10:30 to se if he could head over. I said sure and got S ready to go. He came in and we went over a few things about S. I asked him how his place held up over the rainy weekend. He said the house was fine, but the roosters next door are waking him up every morning at 4:30. He then went on to complain that the toilet screws were stripped on the floor, and that the kitchen sink pipe broke. He said he has done nothing but complain to the home owner about fixing these things, but feels justified to do so......hhmmmm... Not so much his paradise?????

I can't help it, it makes me happy to hear it's not such smooth sailing. My favorite part is the roosters! That will drive him crazy. Just being honest

So H left with S and dog and I spent the day with my girlfriends. Later that evening, I was in his area so I picked up S from his place. I ended up hanging out for about an hour. H made chocolate chip cookies, the cheating kind :), and we watched some tv. He apologized for the house being a mess. Oh my, no comment on that. A definite boy pad with no sign of any female touch. I was happy to see that. I felt very comfortable, we had a good visit all together. When leaving, I told H he is welcome over anytime he wants to spend time with S, to come have dinner with us or help him with his homework. H said he definitely plans on that, and that he has been bombarded with the house falling apart. He said he will do that soon and that he still wants the 3 of us to go have dinner together soon.

So overall a good weekend. I feel H and I are back on peaceful ground and good terms. I feel more and more relaxed at home. I don't feel like he will pop in at any moment. You guys were right, with H leaving, a lot of the negative energy left too. I get the feeling it will only get better

I'm glad things are going well for you and your son. I laughed when I read that the roosters where crowing early in the am. Just wait until he can open the windows and hear them even more so. LOL! The place doesn't sound like a paradise at all. I can't even imagine the mess he's had to deal w/and the other things that will crop up in the days to come. Good luck getting the landlord to fix things!

I'm glad that things are peaceful and quiet at home. You and your son, as well as your pets need this. Pets can sense stress and it can affect the way that they behave at times. Life sounds like is good for you and I hope it stays that way.
Enjoy the peace and quiet...you've earned it.

All still smooth on the home front.

Monday night S and I had an H free night. I have to be honest, and I don't know if it's because it's new and will wear off, but I am really enjoying my H free house. It's just more relaxed. I'm exhausted, taking care of everything each night is a lot of work, but I feel fulfilled at the end of the day. And so tired I am sleeping great.

Tuesday night H TM on his way home from work, asked to come have dinner with us. I said sure, we can share. So we all had hamburgers, then H helped S with his homework. While I got S's bath ready, we talked a little about him coming while we are away next week to get some final things, and showed me what he was taking to make sure ok. He agreed that S seeing him in and out moving stuff is not good. He then asked if he could take some pics off the fridge. It's covered with our pics and S's school projects. He pulled one off and asked, can I take this one, I love this pic? I looked, it's one of the 3 of us sitting on Santa Monica beach when S was about 3, all grinning ear to ear. I was speechless for a sec, but told him sure, I have an extra at work. That one really threw me. If I see that on his fridge, that will blow me away. Not sure what to think of that. In our recent conversations, I see H's mind is as scrambled as eggs, he continues to make odd choices, but he is listening. He hears me, about taking things, about moving so much in front of S, he hears me and is reacting with respect. A sign of my old H.

Wed night MIL had S at her house for Grammy day. H picked him up and we met 1/2 way to do a S switch.

Tonight, another H free night so far. I am feeling great. Very relaxed, not thinking much about sitch, just staying really focused on myself and S. Today is our 15 year dating anniversary, but don't feel really sad like I did last year. S and I made brownies to give to H for valentines day. Our new couch is being delivered on Saturday. And Monday S and I head to SoCal to Legoland. All in all, things are good.

You sound far more relaxed now that h has moved out. The tension and stress aren't there any longer and this new found freedom will be the best thing for you and your son.

Things sound like they are moving alone. I'm sure you can't wait for the couch to be delivered tomorrow. It will brighten things up in the room. As for your trip to LEGOLAND...I hope you and your son have a blast. Enjoy the time away and I do hope that your h will remember to keep the door shut so that kitty won't get out.

Enjoy your time in LEGOLAND!

Mleigh

I am so glad to hear you doing very well. I also do like seeign that your H is at least wanting to still be around ... maybe he has his place, its less pressure and he can be alone with his thoughts and get through his stuff. I think that is key for him, and any MLC'r for that matter ... being allowed the time and space to work through this. You are handling it all with such style and grace .. its inspiring ... truly it is.

LegoLand? ... my neck of the woods, I am literally 10 minutes away and have been there just once ... lol. I was impressed ... be mindful of the traps ... they will try to get you to take the place home with ya!!

Enjoy your time, sounds like a great memory maker for you and your boy...he will LOVE it!!

Hi Mleigh.

I agree with the others that you sound put together and calm. Good for you!

On my thread I also describe my DH coming to the house "sneaking his stuff out". I hated it. I asked him to respect my boundaries.Hmm.

After he filed for D then I changed the locks. I couldn't stand him coming in and taking stuff. I know it's our stuff and he and I should have every right to the items but gee whiz- let's talk about it.

I tried to be open and have conversations with my DH at the beginning and all I got was deflected eye contact. No conversations about anything. He was and is weird.

I offered him to come over and I'd even make dinner for him and the children and I'd leave. Nope. He didn't want to be here. Our home is too much of a reminder of responsibility and the life he doesn't want. So for you to be nice - hmmm...just be careful. They are in a weird place. Take care of yourself and your S. Have fun at Legoland!!

In His Love -

VGE1

Romans 8:28

Job - I am loving my H free home. Don't laugh, but I even ordered some sandalwood incense to "cleanse" the house of negative energy. I didn't realize how much I myself need this time and space. I have S 95% of the time, but I wouldn't want it any other way. I feel sometimes like I am shorting myself, being too available to have S all the time and not really being able to have much girl time or alone time , but I also feel like my S needs me right now. It wouldn't feel right to push leaving him off with H when I see he is still adjusting.

Caliguy - thank you for your compliments. I myself am amazed at how I have learned to not react on emotions. It has had a wonderful positive effect on my life and in how I feel overall. You are by Legoland!!?? I would be broke if I was. This will be our 3rd trip, S absolutely loves it. The hotel itself is a blast. Hey! If you get a wild hair, grab S and join us!

Vg1 - sometimes I wonder if I am too nice, considering all we have been through. But it's me, it's being true to myself. I know when I look back, I prefer to see myself in a good light. Believe me, there has been a lot of anger, but it never fails to make me feel worse. I hope he doesn't take advantage of my niceness, but I care too much about how S sees me and who I see when I look in the mirror. I will be careful

So updating. Things are going good at work. I stepped down from a higher position for less money when I had S and have been reluctant to change that. I am a hard worker and have been encouraged by management to step back up but have always resisted. Well, we have a coworker retiring this summer and concerns on how to replace the position. I have let management know I am ready to step up to the plate and do whatever I can to keep our office running smooth they are aware of my situation and know I am mainly responsible for S, and I let them know that he has to be a part of the equation. So, we will see where that goes, pretty excited

Got our couches and love them. Today was V Day. Ugh, I am so glad it is over. However, I went into this day reminding myself that I am surrounded by love, I don't need a mans love to be important! But the day still stank. S and I had gotten a tin together filled with brownies we made, cookies and a giant Reese's, H favorite. I in return got nothing. I have to admit, I wasn't expecting that. Even last year he got me flowers, said it didn't feel right not to. I guess that has changed. So he came over to pick up S for the day and got his tin of goodies. I thought, oh maybe he wants to take S to pick out some flowers. No, still nothing when he dropped S off, but he mentioned how good the Reese's was! But you know what? I don't regret giving him something because it was a simple, loving and thoughtful gift from S and I, and at least 1 of us is being a good example for S! It feels good and ya, that's how I roll!

Overall, I am feeling good, but the last couple of days I am feeling anxious and not sleeping well. It may be Vday, maybe the upcoming trip, but I think once I am away I will feel better. I think the time away from it all is needed!

Mleigh

Its funny how things seem to fall into place when we need them to, at just the right time. The job opportunity sounds like just the right fit at just the right time and your priorities are all set, they know that and as management I would respect that knowing I have someone who can do the job and .. well .. just "gets it" as far as life goes.

Hope you enjoy Legoland ... I stay away from that place .. even though its 15 minutes away ... lol. S has today off but I am at work, I've been thinking of planning a camping trim during the summer with him .... he is getting to that age now .. and it goes so fast ... Enjoy your kiddo and the plastic blocks!!

hmmmm. Time to vent. It's been awhile? Saturday when H dropped off S, he mentioned he wanted to see S yesterday, before we left. Asked my plans for the day, which was nothing but getting ready for trip. Didn't hear from him until 6:00, asked if he could come over about 7:30. On his way, he called and asked if we ate or should he pick up something for himself, ya, for himself. I told him we had not eaten yet and there was enough for him. So, H shows up, has dinner, talked about how exhausted he was, thought he almost had a heart attack that day and had to lay down. Long silly story. Then rummaged through my freezer and helped himself to ice cream. Spun S around on my new swivel chair that came with the couch even though I asked him not to. The thing is brand new and I don't want it to break! He completely ignored me. Then he grabbed cell phone, want to bathroom, and came out letting S know he was getting ready to go. So obvious. A full blown teenager he has become.

So it left me thinking once again. Am I being TOO nice? I sense some cake eating here. Bothered me. So I had asked FIL to watch our dog while away but H insisted she will be fine at his place. S and I left this morning with plan for H to pick her up today. At 5:00, my cat sitter let me know dog is still home. She was worried that H would forget about her. H just replied to my TM that we made our trip safe. So I asked, did you get dog ok? He replied he was on his way to get her, that he had some running around to do today. BS. It's 9:00. I am so sick of his self absorbed a** I replied, um...ok..If you are....too busy....please just let your dad watch her.

You guys, I feel ready to blow. His self absorption has reached a level that I am fed up with and I am tired, so tired, of keeping the peace. This weekend has just done it for me. I think I am making this way too easy for him. I try, for S, to have him over with open door. But am I letting him cake eat?

I suppose it comes down to what feels right for me, what I can put up with. Your thoughts please?

I hope he picked up the dog. In the future, please do not rely on him for anything. They way that they will do things and then they don't or they are late doing them. Thank goodness kitty sitter was there to tend to both of them for a bit.

As for the ice cream deal, well...you have to decide what you will put up with. I wouldn't allow that kind of behavior since he's not living there and especially twirling your brand new chair around. I would have had to stop that action pretty quick. Take the cake, plate and fork away from him. You no longer have a diner or ice cream shop.

He will only get worse before he gets better. Do what you need to do to protect your heart and emotions.

Hi Job and thank you. I know I can't depend on him, but she is his dog too and he is always asking to take her home but S says no. Lol. He knows better than me!

I had a night filled with anxiety. Being away from home, worrying about my animals, angry at H....Thankfully I was able to get some sleep. I had a dream about H. He was telling me that he was seeing someone and he thought he loved her, but it didn't work out. I said, what!? Every time I asked you you always denied having someone. He said he didn't understand why I was so upset, that we were separated. So I told him, relationships are work, marriage is tough, but just because times get hard, it doesn't mean you bail. I yelled at him, you totally bailed on our life! He started laughing hysterically. I slapped him and woke up. Ugh, not a good dream!

I woke up wondering why am I so angry right now? Why so anxious? Well, it may have been the 6 hour drive of thinking. Lots of thinking about sitch and bringing me to feeling overwhelmed about it. I decided, I am on vacation, a special one with S with memories to last. Time to shake it off!

I have to hope the best for my pets. My cat is in good hands and safe. She will be fine. My dog, well, she is chipped if she gets loose while H is at work. There is nothing I can do now but hope for best.

As for H, it is what it is. I have not invited him over once since he moved out, that will remain the same. Dinner just happens, I don't invite him, and I see how much S enjoys it, so that will have to just play out for now. I think I may be a little too friendly with him, like good buddies or something. I need to watch myself. Like you said Job, I will pay more attention to myself and my things to protect myself and S. H is in major self absorbed overdrive right now.

Thank you for letting me get it out. I notice I can work myself through these downs quicker and easier. Time to enjoy the moment!

mleigh

I totally get it, the fact they become so self absorbed I often wondered at times with myself if I was feeling for us both, sad on both sides for the state of the M, angry for both sides for the damage done ... because our MLC'rs do not seem to have a clue that we are on the same spiining globe with them, as far as they are concerned its all about them and they honor us or our kids when they feel the need. Its very very frustrating.

As far as your dream ... I lived it, it was reality .. .and just to let everyone know, if your spouse leaves you, you are separated, there for the affairs do not count. Thats the rule, or so at least I have been told. There is a evil part of me, the one with the twisted sense of humor that thinks IF this M ever survives ... I will celebrate by going on vacation with W and S, see a hottie at the bar .. get her drunk .. inform W we will be separtated for the night ... ya know .. cause thats the rule and all ..... lol .. hey its a little fantasy I like to laugh about.

Mleigh ... you are on vaca, I am sure the H will take care of the dog, your cat is in good hands ... there is little you can do as you said, however there is something you can do .... enjoy that time away, make memories .. your kiddo is lucky to have a strong mother who has her chit together ... Have fun!!!

H is all alone and needs to be, let him sort his stuff out ... dude is in full replay mode and that's the hardest one it seems, let him to his work, you be you and just stay awesome.

Brought tears to my eyes Cali. Thank you.

I agree, H is in full replay and who knows how far he will go. I want and think nothing more than telling him go, do your thing and find that happiness you are so desperate to find and that I keep you from having. I would have no problem not seeing or speaking to him, cold turkey! I can't stand the man (used loosely), that he has become. But with S, that is not an option.

I have no desire for any R with anyone. I miss and love my old H so much. But sometimes I daydream. What if? Maybe this is a blessing, I have the chance to meet a man who gives flowers for no reason, who gives foot rubs, who will make S and I his number one priority, something I never had with H. What if? I will leave it to the man upstairs and cross that bridge when it comes.

Do you ever wonder what it would feel like, to be loved as much as we love our spouses? What an amazing thing. We are all truly special people here.

Cali - don't forget that, k?

mleigh

I totally and completely get it. Here is the thing ..... your MLC'r, my MLCr' ... the old ones we are hanging on to (I am like a 4 year old grabbing mommy's leg I swear) .... they are gone, and reading all that I have read, seriously ... gone. In my case, my W was this person I trusted 120%, loyal, fun, and most of all one of those women who walked into a room and people took notice, she never got it, had no clue as to how beautiful she was. Now .... ugh ... she is not trustworthy and seems she has this "I know I am hot now give me what I want" thing that is such a turn off.

Deal is ... the old spouse is gone, they have to go through these tunnels, and then they will combine parts of who they were with who they have become .... Ironically we are doing the same metamorphosis.(Think Butterfly's here) Seems to me the LBS's come out of the cocoon much earlier than the MLC'rs, we need to fly a bit, and then when they finally hatch its going to be up to us if we want to share ourselves with them again. We have to love them enough to allow them the bake time to become whatever they are going to become, they may very well stay a gooped up bitter caterpillar ... we may never know.

As far as a new R, with someone who loves ya back ... yup I have drifted into that fantasy a bit myself .. its hard not to ... just like I said how we are angry and sad for both us and our spouse, I also wonder if we love for both too as they are not capable of it. Then I realize its been so long, I am not even sure I would know what to do with myself, I would probably vomit just out of being freaked out.... yeah .. super attractive way to get chicks.

You are doing it proper, head high, class, you have time ... at this moment we are all still healing. Stay the course.

Back home from Socal! We finished off our trip with a day and night at Disneyland. Just not enough time! Now Disneyland is where I walk around in awe. The trip for S and I was great, but I really got homesick. That never happens. I could not wait for tonight, to be home with my S, my stinky creatures, my little lights and candles on throughout my house, my new couch. I just couldn't wait.

Throughout the trip I TM H pictures out of courtesy and because he asked. I would hope for the same if H was away with S. He finally asked to speak with S last night, so they did.

While away, H took the couple of things he said he would. Don't see anything else gone, the only surprise was dogs crate. He needed it to make her shady shelter as his place has no shade for her. When we went to pick her up on our way home, I saw his makeshift shelter for her and just shook my head. Tarp covered over her crate, next to his bent up mini blinds and yellow stained curtains, the place is just a dump when you look at it.

So H asked to come by tonight and see S. He came straight from work, still in his work clothes. It was right when dinner was ready so I invited him to make a plate. How could I not. H was here about 1/2 hour then started his hugs and goodbyes with S. Before he left, he called me into the kitchen.

He asked if I heard about his sister. He has 2, one I am close with and one has a drug addiction, we don't see her much. Well, apparently she has been evicted, with her 18 year old daughter, and is living in a motel jobless and close to being homeless. So H said his other sister mentioned living with me. I said, what!!?? No way. H said he told his sister and mom that he didn't think I would be open to that. I said wait, hold on a minute, why is my name coming up? Why not you? You have room in your place, or what about your dad, mom or sister who all have huge houses! I said I don't even understand why my name is coming up!? H just kind of mumbled something like ya, I don't know. Are they crazy?

So then I said it's sad that she is going through that, especially her daughter. H says ya, she made her choices but her daughter is the innocent one paying the price.....

So you know where I am going with this, right? I looked at H and said ya, pretty self centered choices, you know? Then I said, ya, you know. He just looked at me and said, huh? I said you know all about self centered choices. Um....ya...I said it. Not nice, I know, I couldn't stand him being all higher and holier than thou. I am a mamma bear when it comes to S.

So he said thanks for dinner, kissed S and left.

I know I am not supposed to judge or put down, but I don't regret saying it. I will be friendly and cordial but no, I am not always ok and accepting of H choices.

As for his sister, I also know drug addiction is an illness and can't always be controlled. My father was addicted to heroine and alcohol and died when I was 19 with only meeting me once.

I have a really bad attitude with parents making selfish choices, but I am trying to learn and understand for my father and my husband.

I'm glad your trip was a huge success and that you and your son had a blast. Disneyland will always be my favorite of the Disney amusement parks, after all...it's the original.

Now, about your h telling you about his sister, etc., I hope you don't get roped into that one. Her parents should be the ones stepping up to the plate to help her out, or better yet, your h now has a place of his own and plenty of space...he can have her come there and stay. She could be a great help to him...but your home is not the "mission for lost souls".
Quite frankly, his family is nuts to even think you'd take them in. After all, you just had one man/child leave to find himself.

I am sure your fur babies were happy to see you and your son. Enjoy your weekend.

Great start to my day waking up with my fur babies! I just wanted to post something about my son.

Last night he was snuggling with the cat and says, I think I know the point of life. I said, what is that? He said the point of life is to love and care about everything. I told him that is a great way to live your life. He went on to say how much he loves his animals. I told him how lucky they are to have him. He said, of course he loves them, they are our family. He said family is the most important thing in the world and we are a family. I told him, that is exactly right!

Later on, he again started talking about love and how important it is to let everyone know how much you love them. I told him it is very important, and sometimes you will get hurt, but mostly you will get love in return. He said ya, the more love you give, the more you get back.

Not sure where this all came from, pretty amazing for a 7 year old. But I worry, we all do, about how our messes effect our kids. I feel a lot better and figure I will continue to keep conversation open and continue to be an example of a loving caring person with an open heart. He is seeing it and I only hope he will keep his heart open and grow up to be as amazing of a man as he is now.

Your son is very wise for a 7 year old. He's going to grow up to be an amazing man and do some great things. How do I know this? You, his mother, are teaching him how to love unconditionally and have been taking the high road during your journey. You are there to listen, share and provide feedback to him. He knows that he can talk to you about anything and you will be there for him.

I'm sure your fur babies were so happy to have you both back home. It's nice to have them there to greet you when you wake up and at the door when you come home.

Enjoy your day.

MLeigh- Job is always so wise and so is your son. As time goes on I have never regretted being honest (in an age appropriate way) with my girls. To know we can count on each other to be honest and value each other as family is a gift that will help him deal with the trials of life.

Sounds like you are getting stronger every day without feeling bitter. It is tough to walk that tightrope. Fur babies do help though.

Happy Monday. Feeling much more relaxed and grounded now that I am home.

Saturday morning H TM that he would be home all weekend if S wanted to go hang out with him. S said not right now, just wanted to stay home.

Didn't hear again that night. Sunday, H TM in the afternoon that he wanted to know if S and I would like to go out to dinner. I struggled with this one. Part of me wanted to say no, but take S. But another part of me said go and enjoy. So I told him ok. He said good and that he made reservations. He picked our restaurant, a place we always go for special dinners. I didn't let myself get too happy but was looking forward to the yummy food.

H showed up to hang out with S while I ran to grocery store, then we were off to dinner. He said he would drive, which sent me in to a panic attack. I was terrified to get in his truck and smell female. Oh ya boys, we can smell it! But I figured it would be weird to say no so I talked myself down and got in the truck, and prayed. No female smells, in fact the seat was back like a guy sat there last. Whew.

Had a really nice dinner. It was really like being with my old H. We all played hangman and laughed, food was great. Had nice conversation. Then he got us dessert to all share. I really enjoyed it and was glad we went.

One thing, during conversation, he told me that he has been really frustrated with his dad. He says he was talking to him on the phone and his dad wasn't listening to what he was saying so he told him he had to hang up. Said they didn't talk for 2 weeks. Very very unlike them. I just listened. I have to say, me and his dad are the 2 people he is closest with. Do you think his dad is getting a taste of the MLC beast? Is this part of a MLC'er nearing their rock bottom? We talk but not in detail. Actually, his dad called and left me a message yesterday, I need to call him back tonight.

So I will not bring anything up with his dad and plan to continue to keep conversation light. Hope H enjoyed playing family last night. Me and S did, but I am not making much of. You just never know what is going through the MLC mind!

I'm sure his father is getting a bit frustrated w/his son, but you don't know what type of conversation they had. Maybe your h was bouncing off the walls or maybe he was just complaining or trying to tell his father what to do. Nope, he's not nearing rock bottom. Your h has a ways to go and some scrape the bottom and others hit it...but he's not there yet.

It will be interesting to hear what his father has to tell you. Listen to what he has to say and not share much w/him in the way of what is going on in the MLC department.

Good luck!

Quote:

the more love you give, the more you get back.

Not sure where this all came from, pretty amazing for a 7 year old. But I worry, we all do, about how our messes effect our kids. I feel a lot better and figure I will continue to keep conversation open and continue to be an example of a loving caring person with an open heart. He is seeing it and I only hope he will keep his heart open and grow up to be as amazing of a man as he is now.

It's been said that kids learn all they are going to learn from their parents by 7. I wonder sometimes. I do know they learn the basics by then and then test throughout their lives.

Your son showed a lot of wisdom there. I would say that the point of life is exactly that, which shows he learns from what he sees. i.e. you're giving him a great example of how to live.

The only thing I'd add is that a man's place is to also protect those things he loves and cares for and it's not always easy to do so. I think he sees that now in you. The easy path is for kids. The harder path is for adults but it's really the point, isn't it?

Nice to hear wisdom from kids, isn't it?

Peace,
AJ

Awww Job. Couldn't you sugar coat it a bit? Lol. Ya, something tells me you are right, he has a long way to go. I too am thinking long term separation here. It's just hard not to feel that hope, when you see those glimpses of your old spouse. My armor is still on though.

AJM, great advise. I like that addition and will be sure to mention that to S. I love our conversations, my son has an old and wise soul, for sure.

Ok I just caught myself on something and want your advice.

H has S tonight, for the first time in 2 weeks, and they are doing homework. H just texted me that the homework says to do this, but S says I only have him do this, so they are arguing, and H says in his text that he knows his homework isn't a big deal to me, but he is just asking S to do what it says. Basically it says to re-read a story and answer some questions, but S is always able to answer the questions because he remembers the story. He gets stellar grades and is considered in "advanced" levels, if he can answer the questions, I am good.

Anyway, I reacted and TM that I DO care much about his homework as I do it with him every night, and explained that the teacher suggests rereading if they can't answer the questions. I then TM H his teachers email in case he ever has questions.

Now, I am thinking, I should have just kept it simple and replied that they will work it out. Like Caliguy does with his wife, I always respect that. Instead I reacted.

I always get blamed when they disagree and S says, "but mommy...." How should I handle this? Any ideas? Just let him figure it out?

Ugh, H just TM again that he is just reacting to S attitude with him when he tells him to do what his homework says and that any time he asks S to help him with something, do his homework, clean something up, he gets attitude and told that mommy doesn't make him do that. He said he didn't think to ask the teacher if it's ok for him to skip what his homework says to do.

I replied, "I'm sure you guys can work it out :)"

I am just fuming. He never participated in homework, but now the one time he does, he critiques how we do it!? S teacher raves about him, but H would know that if he ever met her, talked to her, or went to parent teacher conference.

Ggrrrr he knows how to push my buttons. Our son does great in school, but I get no credit for all I do, just criticism. It's been like this forever. No admiration for all I do, just criticism.

mleigh

Breathe .... remember dude is in a constant spin cycle and feeling pretty lost, what to hurt people do? Yup they hurt people. I would think his critiques are a teenage attempt to feel better about himself, take it at that and dont give it any head space.

To answer your question on my thread... The W has in the past here and there taken her shots, however not that I want to make parenting a competition... if it were she knows that she better bring her A game and keep it there for a long time. Not that I am parent of the year but I coach every single sport S has been involved in, I pick him up every day, I take him to the medical apts (She can not handle the stress this brings) ... when S is upset its me he talks to and wants. Not that its W's fault to be honest, alot of this MLC thing has to do with her own childhood, her parents ... good people.. but very cold Catholics and there is no love shown what so ever ... which is a 180 from how I was raised.

My advice ... just consider it spew ... he left, so he is trying to somehow prove to himself he was in the right ... and from what I have gathered about you from your posts he is going to be hard pressed to justify his actions so its going to be the petty things like how you do homework

Thank you Caliguy. It is so petty, right?

I calmed down last night before he dropped off S. Was cordial as always. I like the way you look at it. He really doesn't have much to justify what he is doing right now, so he grabs what he can. Good point! We are talking 2nd grade homework here! And guess what? It was left at his place. But of course, THAT will be all S's fault. H is not able to look at himself yet, I see that loud and clear.

Looks like I have become a member of the spew club. I wonder if Cali can let me know where he got his spew jacket? And do they run in small?

The homework saga continues: Thursday I let H know that the homework was not in S folder and asked if he had it. H answered yes and that he would bring it over later. S and I have dinner, do his other homework, and it's getting later. The missing homework is a reading log with an additional reading assignment attached with questions to complete. At this point, I am thinking we will just not turn it in for his first time, but not the end of the world.

At 8:50, H TM that he had gotten stuck at the house waiting for the bathroom remodeling guy to finish but was on his way. ( The house is falling apart so lots of repairs going on)

So I replied that it's really too late for S to do his homework, that I will ask teacher if he can make up, and that he should have let us know that he was stuck so we could have gone and picked it up.

Here is where the spew comes in...

He responds "why didn't you just tell me that earlier?"

I reply, "tell you what?"

H says, "that there was homework on it? ( that one just cracks me up. What did he think we needed it for?) I just saw it sitting on the table this morning so I didn't look at it because I figured he knew what his Thursday assignment was...and could do it from the book...and I would just bring it over after the handyman left. Earlier when I said I would bring it over later you could have just mentioned that you had homework actually on the paper and I would've brought it over right away. Well I will be there soon either way and it's not yet 9:00 so I'm sure he can get it done before 9:30 when he normally goes to bed."

At least I can laugh about it, right? At first I took it personal, but that feeling left as fast as it came. His thinking is so irrational and blaming that I actually feel sorry for him and anyone else he may be treating this way.

I did not reply and was cordial when he came, I did not say anything about it. Like Jekyll and Hyde, he was perfectly pleasant. He sat down with S and did the homework with him. While S was rubbing his eyes and trying to do his homework, H kept asking him questions about his upcoming bday. S was getting annoyed be cause he is tired and trying to finish his homework, so then I sense H starting to get annoyed so I just said, it's getting late, let him finish his homework first. I said it nicely and after We even had good conversation. Then he laid down with S and rubbed his back, a pre bed ritual they had, before he left.

He had circles under his eyes, not sure if it was the lighting, and he looks really tired. I see anger from him coming more and more directed at me. I am keeping in mind, since his move out a month ago, that it will get worse before it gets better. That appears to be exactly true.

We were H free Friday night and it was glorious. I am so happy, having my home to myself. It's been a wonderful first month.

S turns 8 on Tuesday, so he is having his best buddies over for a sleepover tonight. I baked a cake and am making sliders and snacks. Yummy! H says he wants to be here for the festivities. Since he only spews on text so far, it should be fine. Looking forward to a loud, fun and sleepless night!

mleigh

Yeah the spew Jackets do in fact come in small .. you can have any color you want as long as its yellow.

I think your M is justifying, seems to me experience and what I have read they just HAVE to make the LBS in some way the reason for their problems, they keep slapping mud in the void thinking its going to take away the pain and nothing is working so must still be you, we breath and use their precious oxygen and it just pisses em off.

Strap that spew jacket, stay cool, you know its not you nor the homework ... dude is just lost and there is not a compass that he can use in that dark tunnel. I to think things will get worse the more frustrated he gets when all these choices have not landed him happiness, mine has done the same.

You sound good ... balanced... grounded ... your a tough one

Catching up....

Sleepover for S on Saturday night was a success. S had a great time. H came over and was really helpful. He even cleaned up the kitchen and dishes. While he was cleaning, I sat down on couch to watch tv. He came in and sat down next to me and watched tv for a bit. We had nice conversation and laughs, we were watching Jaws. He left about 9:00.

Sunday, per request of H, S and I went to his place to pick him up and bring him back to house so he could drive his Jeep home. I didn't go into his house, waited in truck for him to come out. He got Jeep, then took S and dog for first sleepover at his place. I hated it. It brings out anger in me. I didn't go through a miscarriage, 9 months of pregnancy and 36 hours of labor to have a part time child. But due to H's issues, I have to. Ticks me off. I made the best of it. Went to grocery store, watched a movie and drank wine.

Has anyone seen Stuck on you? With Greg Kinnear? Total MLC story and ending. I hadn't cried so much in like a year, but I loved the movie.

Monday night had S and pets at home, all was well in my world again and I got some much needed sleep. H called to confirm plans for S birthday dinner together tonight, and talked to S to say goodnight.

Today is S birthday, H is on his way to hang out and all go to dinner. Just the 3 of us. I suspect a good time, looking forward to it.

mleigh

Yeah that part time kid thing is the stinger that's for sure. I feel the same way.

OH .. THAT movie .. yeah ... completely total MLC type , however with a happy ending. I have often felt that scene where he is about to leave the ring but sees her reading his book and keeps hanging on ... there have been little things like that for me too, who knows... good movie.

Yes! Boy can we relate, so many times he struggled to let go, but couldn't. His run was over 3 years long.

Had fun at dinner. We laughed, played, joked. H insisted I try his food. He even gave me a hug, the first since Christmas. It's times like this, when he is so like old H, I look at him but think to myself.....are you done? Are you homesick yet? Can't you see we all belong together? Can you be yourself again so we can please just go back to being a family?

Sigh.....

Not much to update. Wednesday night H picked up S from his mom's and handled dinner and homework at his place. They showed up about 8:30 at my place to drop off S. Was interesting, H usually will TM that they are on their way. H said he forgot his phone at home, kind of threw me off when they walked in. Good thing I didnt have my hottie boyfriend here! Lol, ya right!

Thursday night I get a TM from H asking if S realized he forgot his grammy's birthday gift of cash at his place. I let him know he had realized it the night before. H said to tell S he spent it all on fruity pebbles. I thought to myself, this is my H free night. You moved so you could be away from horrible me, so go be alone. I am not sure why that came over me, but it did so I didn't respond

Tonight, Friday, I get a TM saying he would love to spend some time with S this weekend and threw out some ideas. I told him of course, and asked if he wanted to talk to S or want me to ask him? I mean really, I'm not his messenger. He replied, he just got home and would call S after he cleaned up. That made me laugh. You need to clean up first? Annoying and I don't know, BS? H called about 1 1/2 hours later and made their plans. I let S answer phone, did not talk to H.

I see with myself, the more fun we all have together, the more I pull away after. I don't want to get sucked in to his game. It's safer staying detached and distant. I only want to deal with H in regards to S, and only when needed. I figure, you left, go figure yourself out and leave us alone. I guess that is part of my detachment process.

Anyway, having a nice mellow night with my peanut and fur babies. I have had a really busy week, especially at work, and am exhausted. When I picked up S at his after school care, one of the dad's was bringing in pizza. I told him thank you and that was really nice of him. He said he was a divorced single dad, that it has been hard for his S, and that he likes to see the kids just have fun and be kids, because it gets tough when we grow up. I told him yes, that is the truth!

Had a nice weekend and got SO much done. I just can't seem to stop moving, cleaning and rearranging things in the house. I moved some of H's shirts in the closet to make more room for my shoes. I put some pictures out of my family, some great shots of my grandparents in Sicily. They look straight up mafia

I nailed a board back up on the wall that covered the ceiling fan wires. I hung our dart board back up from when the wall was painted. I emptied the hot tub to clean it and get it ready for spring and summer and cleaned up the back yard. I can't seem to sit still.

H came over about 2 to get son and take down the christmas lights on the house. I finally remembered to ask him, I couldn't bring myself to climb up on the roof otherwise I would have done it myself. I was telling him how I figured out how to drain the hot tub with the hose and he laughed and asked how I did it. So I explained. He just looked at me and asked if he could suggest a better way. I said, but I did it! I was so excited I ran in the house to tell S! It's not easy getting a hose to suck up water on its own! H said, next time just call me and ask, then went on to explain his way. At the time, I just listened, but now I am wishing I had said no thanks, I got it! I wonder, with his attitude, does it bother him that I am doing so much on my own in the house? He must be noticing things changed, furniture moved, projects finished.....and I am figuring it out and doing it on my own. It feels great!

H said he has his company party next Saturday. He said he wasn't planning on going, but they want him to hand out some awards. I told him that's fine, I will take S, but that I have a party the following weekend that I want to go to. He said ok, then asked if it's my friends 50 birthday party? I told him yes. He said ok, but I was invited too. H is friends with her husband. So I said, are you going? I am sure I sounded surprised. These are friends we always did stuff with and who he dropped at BD. He said he was thinking of it. So I said ok, maybe your mom can watch S? So, wow, I may be at a party with H there. That should be interesting....

The house is so empty without S. I finished watching a movie, Silver Lining Playbook, was good. Now I think I will start the fun of TurboTax! I am forcing myself to sit still and enjoy the down time and quiet. But sometimes, it's almost too quiet

Good for you Mleigh. I just starting using an empty drawer in H's armoire. Isn't that sad? D16 took down all his pictures months ago but I kept his spare toothbrush in the holder until just last week.

I know you'll have some rough spots but you have the right idea. Maybe I need to rearrange my family room?

Wow! You are definitely on a roll! Isn't it nice to get things done and you are able to figure things out for yourself? Your home is starting to feel more like you now....isn't it?

You are doing well...keep up the good work!

mleigh

As always you are rockin it ... who cares how you emptied that tub .. its done. I would think H is noticing you and the changes, then again the MLC'rs are so self absorbed he may not give it much thought right now.... but later he might see that you are doing your thing regardless of his crazy.

Keep going ... they say there is bacon

Thanks guys! I have always been independent, watched my mom do it all on her own growing up. But, it feels especially empowering right now.

Gwen, we all move at our own pace. The only thing sad is the sitch. I think you are doing great!

So, when H picked up S yesterday, he came in his work minivan. I have no idea why he is driving his work van around on the weekend. There are no back seats, so S has to sit in the front seat. Not safe for a 43 pound 8 year old. I don't know why H was in that instead of his truck, but it irked me. He drove S around like that, shopping and stuff. He is normally so over protective about that kind of stuff! So at pick up, H asked if he could drop off S in the morning for me to take to school because he had to be in San Francisco early. I said yes of course. So this morning at drop off, I mentioned to H that it would be safest to limit S time in the minivan because of safety. He got a bit defensive, argued about air bags, then left with no bye. Oh, and before that, he mentioned that he forgot he had time cards to do this morning so he spent all morning on the phone rearranging his San Francisco meeting.

Their minds really are mud, huh?

mleigh ... lol, my 8 yr old is 85 lbs ... he begs to ride in front, nope. I agree with your concern on the back seat, and dealing with a logical issue and an MLC'r is never fun.

Yes they had mush in the noggin for sure, I laughed last night as S is telling W something that happened at school, she asked a question and even my 8 year old got frustrated as he just told her, after the call he asked me... "Dad how come Mom never listens?" I just shrugged and said "I have no idea buddy... go brush" ....lol

Lots going on in my head these last few days. I'm not sure why, might just be hormonal, not sure.

Still riding on a high PMA. Love, love, love my home these days. It's back to being a home again. I was a little worried about how I would feel once H moved, but a month and a half into it, I think it is the best gift he has given me in years. Not that I want any of this, but in dealing with the man he has become. It's best he "finds himself" somewhere else. I feel daily gratitude that I don't have it in my face anymore.

With that being said, I also am experiencing the anger feelings again. I think of him, and see a person who's marriage got a little tough, a lot boring, so decided on flight instead of fight. Someone who decided to throw in the towel and contemplate starting a new life. Who thinks of marriage and commitment, loyalty and faithfulness, as something you give up when times get tough. It infuriates me. I am so disappointed in him, and my mistake, should I have seen this coming? Who did I marry?

Then, I hear your voices. Ya, you actually have voices to me

I hear, this is an illness. A type of depression. Something I could not have seen coming. Something that would have happened anyway. Most of the time, I can understand this. Then I have these days....

If anyone can suggest any good books to help me more to understand what H may be going through, I would love to know. I am an avid reader and want to learn more about this. I believe I am starting on a healing process. I have accepted the situation, I guess I am trying to understand it so I don't have these hateful feelings for someone I love so much.

Originally Posted By: mleigh4

With that being said, I also am experiencing the anger feelings again. I think of him, and see a person who's marriage got a little tough, a lot boring, so decided on flight instead of fight. Someone who decided to throw in the towel and contemplate starting a new life. Who thinks of marriage and commitment, loyalty and faithfulness, as something you give up when times get tough. It infuriates me. I am so disappointed in him, and my mistake, should I have seen this coming? Who did I marry?

Mleigh

I could have written this ... word for freaking word. I see it in my MLCr in just normal things, to hard .. toss hands up .. quit. I am not sure if she has always been this way, maybe they get a bit worse or maybe we are just sensitive to it.

The voice thing ... I hope mine is a cool morning show DJ type voice ... just puttin that request in there.

So as far as the reading thing .. I know the site gets its feathers up a bit suggesting books and what not. I see similarities in you, for some time I have read, read .. and read some more about the MLC, the traits, trying to gather information .. some good .. some not so good for me honestly. I think for me realizing 1.) There is really nothing we can do for them now, can not fix em regardless of the awesome tool box we have ... they have to fix themselves and 2.) I was reading for 2 reasons... the first ... to be honest .. knowing I am smarter than anyone on the planet, I would find the magic cure (yes I am laughing as I typed that) so after I jettisoned that idea, I read things about me ... not your typical self help books, ones that got to the core of MY issues .... and some that actually fed into the MLC and the destruction of my marriage. Am I to blame for her MLC .. no... would have happened anyways ... BUT I could work on me, who knows .. in time I am going to be one heck of a mate to someone, no-one, maybe just a great dad and that's fine by me.

The things I had to dig into ... I can share .. but I am sensitive about not making this post about me .. its about you and lending support. That whole time is a gift thing, its said for this reason, you get a chance to take a step back, look in the mirror, maybe fix a few of those things that you know you can work on when you are honest with yourself.

As far as those anger feelings, don't beat yourself up .. they are normal and part of the healing process ... if we do not have them then there is something to worry about ya know?

Originally Posted By: CaliGuy

Originally Posted By: mleigh4

With that being said, I also am experiencing the anger feelings again. I think of him, and see a person who's marriage got a little tough, a lot boring, so decided on flight instead of fight. Someone who decided to throw in the towel and contemplate starting a new life. Who thinks of marriage and commitment, loyalty and faithfulness, as something you give up when times get tough. It infuriates me. I am so disappointed in him, and my mistake, should I have seen this coming? Who did I marry?

Mleigh

I could have written this ... word for freaking word. I see it in my MLCr in just normal things, to hard .. toss hands up .. quit. I am not sure if she has always been this way, maybe they get a bit worse or maybe we are just sensitive to it.

The voice thing ... I hope mine is a cool morning show DJ type voice ... just puttin that request in there.

So as far as the reading thing .. I know the site gets its feathers up a bit suggesting books and what not. I see similarities in you, for some time I have read, read .. and read some more about the MLC, the traits, trying to gather information .. some good .. some not so good for me honestly. I think for me realizing 1.) There is really nothing we can do for them now, can not fix em regardless of the awesome tool box we have ... they have to fix themselves and 2.) I was reading for 2 reasons... the first ... to be honest .. knowing I am smarter than anyone on the planet, I would find the magic cure (yes I am laughing as I typed that) so after I jettisoned that idea, I read things about me ... not your typical self help books, ones that got to the core of MY issues .... and some that actually fed into the MLC and the destruction of my marriage. Am I to blame for her MLC .. no... would have happened anyways ... BUT I could work on me, who knows .. in time I am going to be one heck of a mate to someone, no-one, maybe just a great dad and that's fine by me.

The things I had to dig into ... I can share .. but I am sensitive about not making this post about me .. its about you and lending support. That whole time is a gift thing, its said for this reason, you get a chance to take a step back, look in the mirror, maybe fix a few of those things that you know you can work on when you are honest with yourself.

As far as those anger feelings, don't beat yourself up .. they are normal and part of the healing process ... if we do not have them then there is something to worry about ya know?

I could have written all of that as well!

I think that's what so comforting (if anything is comforting right now) through all of this... The similarities in so many of our sitches really drives home the point for me that 1) MLC is about them, not us although 2) we do have our own journey to take in order to make it through this and become a much better version of ourselves no matter what the outcome, and 3) this really would have happened regardless of who they were with at the age that this hit them...

Do I still get angry that this happened to my life? Heck yes! But I totally get that MLC causes people (our spouses) to all do so many of the exact same things -- including what you wrote about throwing in the towel on the R/M without giving us a fair shot at really working on fixing things. So I do feel anger about that, but understanding what happened to my W really helps me have some compassion for what she is going through. That doesn't make any of it right or fair -- but it helps me retain an unconditional love for her while I also work on detaching enough to go on my own journey.

And to answer your last two questions... Based on my personal experience and what I've read on this site and other related sites:

Should you have seen this coming? I don't think any of us could... Unless we'd been through it before with someone else. I know I never saw this hurricane coming... it formed right off the coast in the dead of the night, increased in intensity very rapidly, and moved in at Cat 5 strength before I knew what was coming. Prior to that it was mostly sunny skies with an occasional short rain storm, but mostly really pleasant weather.

Who did you marry? You married the person you thought you did... Just like I did and just like everyone else here did. We just didn't know that those people had ticking time bombs inside of them that would wreck them as well as everything in their lives. Some of us might have one of those time bombs inside of us too -- I don't think I do because I think over the years I've gone through various experiences that allowed me to work through many of my childhood/adolescent issues, but I still have some issues and now that I know about all of this (MLC) I hope that I can avoid wrecking my life in this manner.

Cali. Your voice is kind of deep, very comforting and nice, not to get too mushy! Lol. Your comment made me bust up.

Thank you Cali and Jer2911 for both of your posts. One thing I see loud and clear is the message that I need to take the focus off H and "why" and put it back on me. I seem to have gotten a little derailed again.

I guess part of the problem for me is that I really don't know much about H childhood. I really thought I was joining a family who had it all together, something I never had. I was way off. H doesn't talk about himself much. I know he lost his best friend in high school, was a freak accident with his heart. And I know he was not happy when his parents divorced, he was out of school I believe. But he never said much more than that. I assume one of those major things, or both, he never really got over. And over the years, I have realized he has no relationship with his 2 sisters, his mom is extremely passive aggressive and "fake happy", and his dad is a bit in denial of his son and hard to please. So I gather his childhood had some hefty issues going on and I see a real lack of connection in his family.

I will refocus on me and try to stop figuring this out. On a better note, I get the feeling I am crossing H's mind lately. The other day he TM that he was driving in SF. It's an inside joke of sorts as he HATES driving in SF. So I replied some funny comments back. Then last night he brought me some suckers from See's candy. Said he got all the favors because he doesn't know what I like. I am not reading into it, may just be temp checking, but it means I cross his mind which I think is good.

So I will keep on keeping on. Anger is there, but in check. No use letting it out on H. That reminds me. I had a headache last night, went to grab some Tylenol, it's all gone. We had about 3 giant Costco containers of different pain meds, they are all gone. I thought to myself, what the *ell did I do to you that was so bad!!?. He couldn't just leave me 1 bottle, or a few pills out of it!? Gggrrrrrrr

Just rereading your posts above and again want to thank you. You both remind me that I am on my own journey and have been given a gift of time, a blessing during this bit of madness.

When this all blew up, I started reading MLC books like crazy. Some helped, but some actually made me feel worse, more anxious. I stopped reading for that exact reason and figured maybe later, when I am ready. One thing I know for sure, this site has helped me more than any book, friend or therapist.

You all have taught me how important it is to let go. To let go of my fear, to let go of trying so hard to fix this. To let go of my H and give him the time and space he needs right now. I am able to do that out of an unconditional love I never knew I had in me, that you all helped to bring out. I am angry with him, but I love him, I am here for him and plan on continuing to stand because I believe in him and us.

Another thing your postings have taught me is compassion and patience. I have learned to use these traits daily in my life. I work in a busy and high stress field, in escrow, and in the past would get very frustrated with interruptions by people that would keep me from getting my work done. Today, my boss complimented me, said she is amazed at how much patience I have shown that is reflected in my daily customer service with people in this past year. While I am trying to get my files closed, random people are constantly walking in, needing this or that. With property issues, there are usually death and divorce issues. I now stop and really listen, do my best to help them with what they need, with a genuine concern. I would have never gotten here, without this experience. I see this compassion come out in me, every day in different ways, with friends, my pets, and it feels good.

So I hurt, And sometimes I cry and sometimes I punch my pillow and wonder what I did to deserve this. But most days, actually almost every day, I look at this as a really tough learning experience. A big life lesson. So I pay attention, listen and do my best to grasp what it is I need to learn from this and change about myself. I learn by making a change and realizing how good it feels to me. I see a new person emerging out of me and she is pretty cool.

Thank you guys, for standing by me, supporting me and listening to me. I don't post very much, I don't feel like I can really give much advise as I am still learning. However I root for you all and appreciate all the postings and opinions on here.

MLeigh, your posts always make me feel better. I can relate so much to what you are saying about unconditional love and how we are learning through all this.

Wishing you peace and a future full of limitless possibilities.

You sound great Leigh! It's not the trials that we go through in our lives that define us, it's how we handle them that does. You have taken the pain and turned it into a way to see the hurt so many are also dealing with every day. That says so much about who you REALLY are. And that person is pretty darn great! Keep moving forward, there are so many people who need someone like you in their life!

Gwen and Matt, thank you so much for your kind words. It's much needed. I see myself making progress on my journey, but I have been having an emotional week.

So, wow, had a bit of a night with H tonight. We had planned on H taking S tonight. H came over about 6:30 to pick S up. S was laying down. He gets constipated sometimes and it takes it's toll on him. So H sits with him and I hear him ask S if he is ready to go. I hear S tell him he doesn't want to stay the night over there. So H asked, tonight or always? S answered always.

Well crap, I see a storm coming. So they talk a little, and H too easily says if you don't come tonight, then how about Monday night? Well, H always sticks to spending time with S on his nights, so my BS radar went off. So H comes to me with this idea. So I say, what's the real thing you want to do tonight? Because I know your decision is about you, not S.

Oh ya, warning, bad DB tactics coming up.

So H insists that S isn't feeling well, and he doesn't want to drag him out, so Monday night works. Then he goes on to say he is ready to set a schedule, Monday nights, Thursday nights, and every other weekend. I tell H I am not ready to be away from him an entire weekend, and that we should talk about that on our own. (Not in front of S) So he says, let's do it now. So we go in the other room and he starts throwing at me that I am using S against him. So I tell him his relationship with S is his to figure out. He tells me that I throw S at him by saying things like this is his choice and his fault he barely sees S. I told him, it is! I continued on that S and I don't want this, that custody back and forth is hard on us and we need to ease into it. I went on a mini spew that all relationships get tough, that you don't rip your family apart, that I am his family, yada yada. Ugh, it all just came out. He started in on his years of feeling like an outsider, so I told him he alienated himself by not ever joining us, we always asked him too! I did not do a good job of validating, I will admit. I didn't blame, but I said it was both of us. I told him it's not fair to blame me for his unhappiness, that he needs to look in the mirror. He said he doesn't blame me, that he just thinks people are not happy when they are married. I finished by saying our problem was that we focused too much on what we were not getting, and not on what we were giving. I then told him I think he should go.

So we returned back to S, with nothing resolved. I grabbed my water and went to my room because I know that most likely did no good at all. I pulled myself together, and in he comes. So he says S will stay home tonight, but can he take dog? I started laughing and said of course. I then told him I don't want to fight and let him know this really isn't a good time to talk to me due to hormones. A light bulb went off and he said ok. He then said that he assumes I think he is out partying and having fun, but he said this has been hard on him too. He said he is not having fun and is doing what he is supposed to, reading, thinking, and went to talk to a therapist. I said ok, was kind of shocked to be honest, but just said ok. He said he just wants to spend time with S. I told him I want that too, that it just makes me feel angry and emotional that I worked so hard to have him, and now I have to learn how to have him part time. I told him it really [censored]. He said he understood.

So we agreed on a partial schedule, still some bugs to work out. We both agreed that we were starving and not expecting the night to go like this. I heated him up a piece of pizza to go, and him and dog left.

So I am slow to process things. After last night and having time to think it through, there are a few things I got out of this.

In the past times I had mini blowups, it would feel good after to get it out. This time, IDK, doesn't feel the same. I regret my judgmental statements. I know it's best he is out of the house and I do believe it's good for him to have that space. It's our only chance and I don't want to come across to him like I feel differently. It's the issue of S that sets me off. It's really hard knowing S doesn't want to stay with H and brings out that mama bear in me. But the situation is what it is.....whether I like it or not....and S needs to spend time with dad. I need to work on the frustration I feel and keep my reactions in check.

I did, however, get a few things out of the conversation. The best being that he is working on himself by reading and therapy. I know MLCr's lie, but I don't get the feeling he did. I am surprised he is doing that so soon, I didn't see that happening for a long time.

Also, when talking about a custody schedule and getting nowhere, I suggested that maybe we should sit down and talk with someone to help us sort that out, like a mediator. He immediately said he doesn't want to sit down with anyone, that he wants us to work this out on our own. That surprised me because he was first pushing at divorce, then mediation, so I figured he would jump at that, to get the ball rolling. He also warned me that in mediation, they would most likely say 50/50 and he knows I don't want that. So he feels going that route would not be a good idea.

So I suppose I can see some positives in the talk. It kills me, his statement that he "thinks people just are not happy when married" Like marriage and kids are just a ball and chain. We know A marriage is what you make it. I hope he can figure that out. but at least, I was not getting the blame game. He even said it wasn't my fault, just marriage in general. That is a huge change.

Also at one point he accused me of never wanting him to have his own life and I replied oh yeah, cuz I am such a B. And he said yeah, and I am a big D. I told him no, actually I don't think that, I know what a good person he is, or at least who he used to be. I guess it's a compliment with a sting?

Time to regroup and keep myself busy. H will be dropping the dog off soon. I will be getting myself and S ready to start the shared custody schedule since it seems H is now ready for that. Also didn't see that happening for a while. H keeps me on my toes! As long as I can prepare myself I should be ok. It's important for all of us that they spend time together.